Stalled EV...

[Carlos E.R.]

On 2023-04-29 05:59, Anthony William Sloman wrote:

On Saturday, April 29, 2023 at 9:03:14 AM UTC+10, Ricky wrote:
On Friday, April 28, 2023 at 1:30:27 PM UTC-4, Carlos E.R. wrote:
On 2023-04-28 16:27, Don Y wrote:
On 4/28/2023 5:18 AM, Carlos E.R. wrote:
That information would also be useful for gasoline cars. My country is
hilly, I would like to know the height profile of the proposed paths.

frown> I have found this, recently, *somewhere*. Though I can\'t
recall what I may have been looking for at the time.

That reminds me, that the TomTom never tells me to take a tunnel or
high pass. Says keep left or right instead (\"take the tunnel\" would be
way more useful). It has no information of the height I am at.

Yeah, navigation systems leave a lot to be desired. \"Local knowledge\"
is often keenly missing. They all tell me to head out \"the back way\"
for many of my destinations. But, the back way is (permanently) gated
shut -- as anyone who lives here would know.

The nav system in the car at least lets me add artificial \"keep outs\"
to prevent it from proposing those routes.

OTOH, there are times it tells me I am driving over \"grass\" because
it isn\'t aware of a new road or bridge, etc.

There is a parking lot near me, where it proposes a path right through
the wall of the basement, because it thinks I am at ground level.

I find the routes that say \"go through the traffic light, make a U-turn,
return to the light and then make a LEFT turn\" to be the most puzzling
(this, in stead of just turning RIGHT when you first approach the
intersection???)
Or going an intricate path in an unfamiliar city to find a \"turn left\"
(we drive on the right, remember ;-)) that is explicitly prohibited or
just impossible in the traffic.

I hate when it takes me on a \"TomTom detour\" that saves half a minute on
the map, just to find that I have to cross or join a very busy street,
which takes a minute or two to manage.
Strange. The navigators I use are measuring traffic times, so they take you on paths that don\'t have significant delays like this. When going to my hometown, I prefer to take a more back route. The navigator just looks at the trip times and usually wants me to go the main highway. But when the traffic is bad, it agrees with me and recommends the back route. I guess TomTom doesn\'t actually have real time data to work with. Try Google maps on your phone, or Waze.

Tom Tom does have real time data to work with. I think they get it by monitoring anonymised mobile phone locations as supplied by mobile phone networks. The last time I read the bumf, they talked about averaging one hour chunks over the busy parts of the day.

It is a different contract, that works with their connected gadgets. You
share your data, you get data back. If you opt to not share, then you
also do not get real time data back. In a busy city it works pretty
well. In a village, not that well.

Depending on the particular gadget you buy, the contract is included or not.

But then, if there are few clients in the area, they don\'t have actual
time info for a road.

And mind, I was talking about the detour itself being OK, but the
joining back to the main road, which is a simple spot, is bad. This is
not just a question of timing cars, it is about having raw information
about the quality of a road and the crossings.

Then there is the case that many such detours may be marked in maps for
a speed limit of 90. When you get there, the actual limit is 30. Or it
is indeed 90, but it is full of potholes.


--
Cheers, Carlos.

 

[Flyguy]

On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 1:59:25 PM UTC-7, Fred Bloggs wrote:

On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 11:24:30 AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
The first link is to a story about a tow truck driver towing his first EV.
This EV driver would\'ve been ok if he had a hybrid.
https://ijr.com/californian-learns-brutal-lesson-evs-stranded-truck-hauled/
Here\'s a Consumer Reports article about hybrids.
https://www.consumerreports.org/cars/hybrids-evs/how-do-hybrid-cars-work-a1034181509/
I wouldn\'t want an EV just because they\'re something relatively new. There are bugs to be worked out over time. People won\'t necessarily use them the way designers think they will be.
That was the driver\'s stupidity and not the EV. Of course the right wingnut press loves to jump on a story about a renewable failure. Was the driver so stupid he thought a mile on the flat is the same as mile with a 7% incline? Sounds like it. Google maps could compute the kWh for his exact route with pretty good accuracy if they had that capability. I haven\'t heard anything about it- yet.

Could it be because that car TOLD him it could do it? Is the Rivian SO STUPID it doesn\'t know he is going over a mountain pass? Apparently so.

 

[Flyguy]

On Thursday, April 27, 2023 at 7:33:51 AM UTC-7, Ed Lee wrote:

On Thursday, April 27, 2023 at 5:32:38 AM UTC-7, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 8:30:26 PM UTC-4, Ricky wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 4:59:25 PM UTC-4, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 11:24:30 AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
The first link is to a story about a tow truck driver towing his first EV.
This EV driver would\'ve been ok if he had a hybrid.
https://ijr.com/californian-learns-brutal-lesson-evs-stranded-truck-hauled/
Here\'s a Consumer Reports article about hybrids.
https://www.consumerreports.org/cars/hybrids-evs/how-do-hybrid-cars-work-a1034181509/
I wouldn\'t want an EV just because they\'re something relatively new. There are bugs to be worked out over time. People won\'t necessarily use them the way designers think they will be.
That was the driver\'s stupidity and not the EV. Of course the right wingnut press loves to jump on a story about a renewable failure. Was the driver so stupid he thought a mile on the flat is the same as mile with a 7% incline? Sounds like it. Google maps could compute the kWh for his exact route with pretty good accuracy if they had that capability. I haven\'t heard anything about it- yet.
Google pretty much sucks when it comes to planning a BEV trip. Very inadequate. Tesla, on the other hand, uses the Google map data and does a very good job of it. If you simply want to find chargers, Plugshare is pretty good. ABRP (a better route planner) does a better job than Tesla, in some ways. Tesla only (relatively) recently added waypoints, but still sucks for \"what if\" analysis. ABRP is probably still the best tool over all, but being built into the car is an advantage which is hard to beat.

If Tesla would fix their GD browser, so it doesn\'t crash every five minutes, crashing the display computer with it, you could run ABRP in the car and have the best of both worlds.
I\'m talking about using the exact model of EV to incrementally compute and integrate the kWh expenditure at posted speed along the prospective route from origin to destination, with possible stop offs at recharging stations. These other products, especially Tesla, are complete amateurs compared to what google could do. Maybe they don\'t want to contribute to people squandering energy on joy rides, or something.
For such long trip in EV desert, I would carry a generator. In fact, I have a new (never used) one for years, just for emergency. The problem is that once used, I have to keep using it couple of time per month, to keep it in working order. I wonder if it\'s better to disassembly and clean the gasket after every use.

Oh, the IRONY of it all! You buy an EV to divorce yourself from fossil fuels and you end up carrying both the fuel and an ICE to bail yourself out. You still haven\'t cut the apron strings.

 

[Anthony William Sloman]

On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 11:48:02 AM UTC+10, Flyguy wrote:

On Thursday, April 27, 2023 at 7:33:51 AM UTC-7, Ed Lee wrote:
On Thursday, April 27, 2023 at 5:32:38 AM UTC-7, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 8:30:26 PM UTC-4, Ricky wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 4:59:25 PM UTC-4, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 11:24:30 AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
The first link is to a story about a tow truck driver towing his first EV.
This EV driver would\'ve been ok if he had a hybrid.
https://ijr.com/californian-learns-brutal-lesson-evs-stranded-truck-hauled/
Here\'s a Consumer Reports article about hybrids.
https://www.consumerreports.org/cars/hybrids-evs/how-do-hybrid-cars-work-a1034181509/
I wouldn\'t want an EV just because they\'re something relatively new. There are bugs to be worked out over time. People won\'t necessarily use them the way designers think they will be.
That was the driver\'s stupidity and not the EV. Of course the right wingnut press loves to jump on a story about a renewable failure. Was the driver so stupid he thought a mile on the flat is the same as mile with a 7% incline? Sounds like it. Google maps could compute the kWh for his exact route with pretty good accuracy if they had that capability. I haven\'t heard anything about it- yet.
Google pretty much sucks when it comes to planning a BEV trip. Very inadequate. Tesla, on the other hand, uses the Google map data and does a very good job of it. If you simply want to find chargers, Plugshare is pretty good. ABRP (a better route planner) does a better job than Tesla, in some ways. Tesla only (relatively) recently added waypoints, but still sucks for \"what if\" analysis. ABRP is probably still the best tool over all, but being built into the car is an advantage which is hard to beat.

If Tesla would fix their GD browser, so it doesn\'t crash every five minutes, crashing the display computer with it, you could run ABRP in the car and have the best of both worlds.
I\'m talking about using the exact model of EV to incrementally compute and integrate the kWh expenditure at posted speed along the prospective route from origin to destination, with possible stop offs at recharging stations. These other products, especially Tesla, are complete amateurs compared to what google could do. Maybe they don\'t want to contribute to people squandering energy on joy rides, or something.
For such long trip in EV desert, I would carry a generator. In fact, I have a new (never used) one for years, just for emergency. The problem is that once used, I have to keep using it couple of time per month, to keep it in working order. I wonder if it\'s better to disassembly and clean the gasket after every use.

Oh, the IRONY of it all! You buy an EV to divorce yourself from fossil fuels and you end up carrying both the fuel and an ICE to bail yourself out. You still haven\'t cut the apron strings.

Not a lot of irony in that. Using less fossil carbon is a good thing. Not being able to cut the apron strings all at once is just practical politics.

Climate change denial creeps accuse the greens of wanting to take society back to the stone age so that it can transition to zero CO2 emissions immediately - which would be totally stupid, and kill a lot of people - then pillory everybody who isn\'t that silly as being hypocritical, which may strike them as a great debating tactic, but strikes everybody else as demented idiocy.

And Sewage Sweeper is a seriously demented idiot.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

 

[John Larkin]

On Sun, 30 Apr 2023 18:47:58 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
<soar2morrow@yahoo.com> wrote:

On Thursday, April 27, 2023 at 7:33:51?AM UTC-7, Ed Lee wrote:
On Thursday, April 27, 2023 at 5:32:38?AM UTC-7, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 8:30:26?PM UTC-4, Ricky wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 4:59:25?PM UTC-4, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 11:24:30?AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
The first link is to a story about a tow truck driver towing his first EV.
This EV driver would\'ve been ok if he had a hybrid.
https://ijr.com/californian-learns-brutal-lesson-evs-stranded-truck-hauled/
Here\'s a Consumer Reports article about hybrids.
https://www.consumerreports.org/cars/hybrids-evs/how-do-hybrid-cars-work-a1034181509/
I wouldn\'t want an EV just because they\'re something relatively new. There are bugs to be worked out over time. People won\'t necessarily use them the way designers think they will be.
That was the driver\'s stupidity and not the EV. Of course the right wingnut press loves to jump on a story about a renewable failure. Was the driver so stupid he thought a mile on the flat is the same as mile with a 7% incline? Sounds like it. Google maps could compute the kWh for his exact route with pretty good accuracy if they had that capability. I haven\'t heard anything about it- yet.
Google pretty much sucks when it comes to planning a BEV trip. Very inadequate. Tesla, on the other hand, uses the Google map data and does a very good job of it. If you simply want to find chargers, Plugshare is pretty good. ABRP (a better route planner) does a better job than Tesla, in some ways. Tesla only (relatively) recently added waypoints, but still sucks for \"what if\" analysis. ABRP is probably still the best tool over all, but being built into the car is an advantage which is hard to beat.

If Tesla would fix their GD browser, so it doesn\'t crash every five minutes, crashing the display computer with it, you could run ABRP in the car and have the best of both worlds.
I\'m talking about using the exact model of EV to incrementally compute and integrate the kWh expenditure at posted speed along the prospective route from origin to destination, with possible stop offs at recharging stations. These other products, especially Tesla, are complete amateurs compared to what google could do. Maybe they don\'t want to contribute to people squandering energy on joy rides, or something.
For such long trip in EV desert, I would carry a generator. In fact, I have a new (never used) one for years, just for emergency. The problem is that once used, I have to keep using it couple of time per month, to keep it in working order. I wonder if it\'s better to disassembly and clean the gasket after every use.

Oh, the IRONY of it all! You buy an EV to divorce yourself from fossil fuels and you end up carrying both the fuel and an ICE to bail yourself out. You still haven\'t cut the apron strings.

An EV isn\'t transport, it\'s a hobby.

 

[Ed Lee]

On Sunday, April 30, 2023 at 6:48:02 PM UTC-7, Flyguy wrote:

On Thursday, April 27, 2023 at 7:33:51 AM UTC-7, Ed Lee wrote:
On Thursday, April 27, 2023 at 5:32:38 AM UTC-7, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 8:30:26 PM UTC-4, Ricky wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 4:59:25 PM UTC-4, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 11:24:30 AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
The first link is to a story about a tow truck driver towing his first EV.
This EV driver would\'ve been ok if he had a hybrid.
https://ijr.com/californian-learns-brutal-lesson-evs-stranded-truck-hauled/
Here\'s a Consumer Reports article about hybrids.
https://www.consumerreports.org/cars/hybrids-evs/how-do-hybrid-cars-work-a1034181509/
I wouldn\'t want an EV just because they\'re something relatively new. There are bugs to be worked out over time. People won\'t necessarily use them the way designers think they will be.
That was the driver\'s stupidity and not the EV. Of course the right wingnut press loves to jump on a story about a renewable failure. Was the driver so stupid he thought a mile on the flat is the same as mile with a 7% incline? Sounds like it. Google maps could compute the kWh for his exact route with pretty good accuracy if they had that capability. I haven\'t heard anything about it- yet.
Google pretty much sucks when it comes to planning a BEV trip. Very inadequate. Tesla, on the other hand, uses the Google map data and does a very good job of it. If you simply want to find chargers, Plugshare is pretty good. ABRP (a better route planner) does a better job than Tesla, in some ways. Tesla only (relatively) recently added waypoints, but still sucks for \"what if\" analysis. ABRP is atprobably still the best tool over all, but being built into the car is an advantage which is hard to beat.

If Tesla would fix their GD browser, so it doesn\'t crash every five minutes, crashing the display computer with it, you could run ABRP in the car and have the best of both worlds.
I\'m talking about using the exact model of EV to incrementally compute and integrate the kWh expenditure at posted speed along the prospective route from origin to destination, with possible stop offs at recharging stations. These other products, especially Tesla, are complete amateurs compared to what google could do. Maybe they don\'t want to contribute to people squandering energy on joy rides, or something.
For such long trip in EV desert, I would carry a generator. In fact, I have a new (never used) one for years, just for emergency. The problem is that once used, I have to keep using it couple of time per month, to keep it in working order. I wonder if it\'s better to disassembly and clean the gasket after every use.

Oh, the IRONY of it all! You buy an EV to divorce yourself from fossil fuels and you end up carrying both the fuel and an ICE to bail yourself out. You still haven\'t cut the apron strings.

Not really, i might only use one gallon per year for emergency, that\'s just vapor as compared to other ICE drivers.

On my way south bound pass the LA mountain, i used 11KWhr for 13 miles from 2500ft to 4000ft.
Going north would need around 18KWhr for 30 miles from 2000ft to 4000ft.
I did it last year with 20KWhr battery, but lost around 2KWhr since then.
I picked up another 3KWhr battery, but would need a few days to make 64 connections. It\'s for next time.

Van Nuys Nissan Fast Charger says 30 cents per KWhr, but it won\'t take my Visa or American Express. A nice salesman just came over to chat and punch in his code for a courtesy charge. Well, perhaps it\'s by design, real life Nssian Ad for charging.

 

[Ed Lee]

On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 9:21:21 AM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:

On Sun, 30 Apr 2023 18:47:58 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

On Thursday, April 27, 2023 at 7:33:51?AM UTC-7, Ed Lee wrote:
On Thursday, April 27, 2023 at 5:32:38?AM UTC-7, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 8:30:26?PM UTC-4, Ricky wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 4:59:25?PM UTC-4, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 11:24:30?AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
The first link is to a story about a tow truck driver towing his first EV.
This EV driver would\'ve been ok if he had a hybrid.
https://ijr.com/californian-learns-brutal-lesson-evs-stranded-truck-hauled/
Here\'s a Consumer Reports article about hybrids.
https://www.consumerreports.org/cars/hybrids-evs/how-do-hybrid-cars-work-a1034181509/
I wouldn\'t want an EV just because they\'re something relatively new. There are bugs to be worked out over time. People won\'t necessarily use them the way designers think they will be.
That was the driver\'s stupidity and not the EV. Of course the right wingnut press loves to jump on a story about a renewable failure. Was the driver so stupid he thought a mile on the flat is the same as mile with a 7% incline? Sounds like it. Google maps could compute the kWh for his exact route with pretty good accuracy if they had that capability. I haven\'t heard anything about it- yet.
Google pretty much sucks when it comes to planning a BEV trip. Very inadequate. Tesla, on the other hand, uses the Google map data and does a very good job of it. If you simply want to find chargers, Plugshare is pretty good. ABRP (a better route planner) does a better job than Tesla, in some ways. Tesla only (relatively) recently added waypoints, but still sucks for \"what if\" analysis. ABRP is probably still the best tool over all, but being built into the car is an advantage which is hard to beat.
a
If Tesla would fix their GD browser, so it doesn\'t crash every five minutes, crashing the display computer with it, you could run ABRP in the car and have the best of both worlds.
I\'m talking about using the exact model of EV to incrementally compute and integrate the kWh expenditure at posted speed along the prospective route from origin to destination, with possible stop offs at recharging stations. These other products, especially Tesla, are complete amateurs compared to what google could do. Maybe they don\'t want to contribute to people squandering energy on joy rides, or something.
For such long trip in EV desert, I would carry a generator. In fact, I have a new (never used) one for years, just for emergency. The problem is that once used, I have to keep using it couple of time per month, to keep it in working order. I wonder if it\'s better to disassembly and clean the gasket after every use.

Oh, the IRONY of it all! You buy an EV to divorce yourself from fossil fuels and you end up carrying both the fuel and an ICE to bail yourself out. You still haven\'t cut the apron strings.
An EV isn\'t transport, it\'s a hobby.

Well, it\'s an experience. Take 30 minutes at a Nissan dealer to free charge the Leaf, free half-charge my laptop and chatting on SED, 2 cups of free capucinno and 1free rest room visit. If Tesla dealer can match that, perhaps I\'ll switch. But first, need to find a Tesla dealer.

 

[John Larkin]

On Mon, 1 May 2023 10:46:44 -0700 (PDT), Ed Lee
<edward.ming.lee@gmail.com> wrote:

On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 9:21:21?AM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
On Sun, 30 Apr 2023 18:47:58 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

On Thursday, April 27, 2023 at 7:33:51?AM UTC-7, Ed Lee wrote:
On Thursday, April 27, 2023 at 5:32:38?AM UTC-7, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 8:30:26?PM UTC-4, Ricky wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 4:59:25?PM UTC-4, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 11:24:30?AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
The first link is to a story about a tow truck driver towing his first EV.
This EV driver would\'ve been ok if he had a hybrid.
https://ijr.com/californian-learns-brutal-lesson-evs-stranded-truck-hauled/
Here\'s a Consumer Reports article about hybrids.
https://www.consumerreports.org/cars/hybrids-evs/how-do-hybrid-cars-work-a1034181509/
I wouldn\'t want an EV just because they\'re something relatively new. There are bugs to be worked out over time. People won\'t necessarily use them the way designers think they will be.
That was the driver\'s stupidity and not the EV. Of course the right wingnut press loves to jump on a story about a renewable failure. Was the driver so stupid he thought a mile on the flat is the same as mile with a 7% incline? Sounds like it. Google maps could compute the kWh for his exact route with pretty good accuracy if they had that capability. I haven\'t heard anything about it- yet.
Google pretty much sucks when it comes to planning a BEV trip. Very inadequate. Tesla, on the other hand, uses the Google map data and does a very good job of it. If you simply want to find chargers, Plugshare is pretty good. ABRP (a better route planner) does a better job than Tesla, in some ways. Tesla only (relatively) recently added waypoints, but still sucks for \"what if\" analysis. ABRP is probably still the best tool over all, but being built into the car is an advantage which is hard to beat.
a
If Tesla would fix their GD browser, so it doesn\'t crash every five minutes, crashing the display computer with it, you could run ABRP in the car and have the best of both worlds.
I\'m talking about using the exact model of EV to incrementally compute and integrate the kWh expenditure at posted speed along the prospective route from origin to destination, with possible stop offs at recharging stations. These other products, especially Tesla, are complete amateurs compared to what google could do. Maybe they don\'t want to contribute to people squandering energy on joy rides, or something.
For such long trip in EV desert, I would carry a generator. In fact, I have a new (never used) one for years, just for emergency. The problem is that once used, I have to keep using it couple of time per month, to keep it in working order. I wonder if it\'s better to disassembly and clean the gasket after every use.

Oh, the IRONY of it all! You buy an EV to divorce yourself from fossil fuels and you end up carrying both the fuel and an ICE to bail yourself out. You still haven\'t cut the apron strings.
An EV isn\'t transport, it\'s a hobby.

Well, it\'s an experience. Take 30 minutes at a Nissan dealer to free charge the Leaf, free half-charge my laptop and chatting on SED, 2 cups of free capucinno and 1free rest room visit. If Tesla dealer can match that, perhaps I\'ll switch. But first, need to find a Tesla dealer.

How far do you have to drive to find a dealer? And does the dealer
always have an empty charging stall ready for you, any time of the day
or night?

There\'s more to life than FREE. Some peoples\' time has value too.

 

[Ricky]

On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 1:46:48 PM UTC-4, Ed Lee wrote:

On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 9:21:21 AM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
On Sun, 30 Apr 2023 18:47:58 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

On Thursday, April 27, 2023 at 7:33:51?AM UTC-7, Ed Lee wrote:
On Thursday, April 27, 2023 at 5:32:38?AM UTC-7, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 8:30:26?PM UTC-4, Ricky wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 4:59:25?PM UTC-4, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 11:24:30?AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
The first link is to a story about a tow truck driver towing his first EV.
This EV driver would\'ve been ok if he had a hybrid.
https://ijr.com/californian-learns-brutal-lesson-evs-stranded-truck-hauled/
Here\'s a Consumer Reports article about hybrids.
https://www.consumerreports.org/cars/hybrids-evs/how-do-hybrid-cars-work-a1034181509/
I wouldn\'t want an EV just because they\'re something relatively new. There are bugs to be worked out over time. People won\'t necessarily use them the way designers think they will be.
That was the driver\'s stupidity and not the EV. Of course the right wingnut press loves to jump on a story about a renewable failure. Was the driver so stupid he thought a mile on the flat is the same as mile with a 7% incline? Sounds like it. Google maps could compute the kWh for his exact route with pretty good accuracy if they had that capability. I haven\'t heard anything about it- yet.
Google pretty much sucks when it comes to planning a BEV trip. Very inadequate. Tesla, on the other hand, uses the Google map data and does a very good job of it. If you simply want to find chargers, Plugshare is pretty good. ABRP (a better route planner) does a better job than Tesla, in some ways. Tesla only (relatively) recently added waypoints, but still sucks for \"what if\" analysis. ABRP is probably still the best tool over all, but being built into the car is an advantage which is hard to beat.
a
If Tesla would fix their GD browser, so it doesn\'t crash every five minutes, crashing the display computer with it, you could run ABRP in the car and have the best of both worlds.
I\'m talking about using the exact model of EV to incrementally compute and integrate the kWh expenditure at posted speed along the prospective route from origin to destination, with possible stop offs at recharging stations. These other products, especially Tesla, are complete amateurs compared to what google could do. Maybe they don\'t want to contribute to people squandering energy on joy rides, or something.
For such long trip in EV desert, I would carry a generator. In fact, I have a new (never used) one for years, just for emergency. The problem is that once used, I have to keep using it couple of time per month, to keep it in working order. I wonder if it\'s better to disassembly and clean the gasket after every use.

Oh, the IRONY of it all! You buy an EV to divorce yourself from fossil fuels and you end up carrying both the fuel and an ICE to bail yourself out. You still haven\'t cut the apron strings.
An EV isn\'t transport, it\'s a hobby.
Well, it\'s an experience. Take 30 minutes at a Nissan dealer to free charge the Leaf, free half-charge my laptop and chatting on SED, 2 cups of free capucinno and 1free rest room visit. If Tesla dealer can match that, perhaps I\'ll switch. But first, need to find a Tesla dealer.

How about one of the many Superchargers that will charge the same kWh in a third of the time? They say time is money, but clearly your time is less valuable than a cup of coffee if you are happy spending a half hour to get a cup and 50 miles of driving. Your average speed is probably faster than a walk... well, at least a bit faster.

--

Rick C.

-++- Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
-++- Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209

 

[Ed Lee]

On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 11:39:08 AM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:

On Mon, 1 May 2023 10:46:44 -0700 (PDT), Ed Lee
edward....@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 9:21:21?AM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
On Sun, 30 Apr 2023 18:47:58 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

On Thursday, April 27, 2023 at 7:33:51?AM UTC-7, Ed Lee wrote:
On Thursday, April 27, 2023 at 5:32:38?AM UTC-7, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 8:30:26?PM UTC-4, Ricky wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 4:59:25?PM UTC-4, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 11:24:30?AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
The first link is to a story about a tow truck driver towing his first EV.
This EV driver would\'ve been ok if he had a hybrid.
https://ijr.com/californian-learns-brutal-lesson-evs-stranded-truck-hauled/
Here\'s a Consumer Reports article about hybrids.
https://www.consumerreports.org/cars/hybrids-evs/how-do-hybrid-cars-work-a1034181509/
I wouldn\'t want an EV just because they\'re something relatively new. There are bugs to be worked out over time. People won\'t necessarily use them the way designers think they will be.
That was the driver\'s stupidity and not the EV. Of course the right wingnut press loves to jump on a story about a renewable failure. Was the driver so stupid he thought a mile on the flat is the same as mile with a 7% incline? Sounds like it. Google maps could compute the kWh for his exact route with pretty good accuracy if they had that capability. I haven\'t heard anything about it- yet.
Google pretty much sucks when it comes to planning a BEV trip. Very inadequate. Tesla, on the other hand, uses the Google map data and does a very good job of it. If you simply want to find chargers, Plugshare is pretty good. ABRP (a better route planner) does a better job than Tesla, in some ways. Tesla only (relatively) recently added waypoints, but still sucks for \"what if\" analysis. ABRP is probably still the best tool over all, but being built into the car is an advantage which is hard to beat.
a
If Tesla would fix their GD browser, so it doesn\'t crash every five minutes, crashing the display computer with it, you could run ABRP in the car and have the best of both worlds.
I\'m talking about using the exact model of EV to incrementally compute and integrate the kWh expenditure at posted speed along the prospective route from origin to destination, with possible stop offs at recharging stations. These other products, especially Tesla, are complete amateurs compared to what google could do. Maybe they don\'t want to contribute to people squandering energy on joy rides, or something.
For such long trip in EV desert, I would carry a generator. In fact, I have a new (never used) one for years, just for emergency. The problem is that once used, I have to keep using it couple of time per month, to keep it in working order. I wonder if it\'s better to disassembly and clean the gasket after every use.

Oh, the IRONY of it all! You buy an EV to divorce yourself from fossil fuels and you end up carrying both the fuel and an ICE to bail yourself out. You still haven\'t cut the apron strings.
An EV isn\'t transport, it\'s a hobby.

Well, it\'s an experience. Take 30 minutes at a Nissan dealer to free charge the Leaf, free half-charge my laptop and chatting on SED, 2 cups of free capucinno and 1free rest room visit. If Tesla dealer can match that, perhaps I\'ll switch. But first, need to find a Tesla dealer.
How far do you have to drive to find a dealer? And does the dealer
always have an empty charging stall ready for you, any time of the day
or night?

Between SF & LA, around 3 on my route, no detour. Plus 4 CalTran fast chargers. I know, it\'s not enough, but good when I have to do business close to any one of them. I rent storage spaces close to them; so, it\'s continence when i move things around.

 

[Ed Lee]

On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 12:26:31 PM UTC-7, Ricky wrote:

On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 1:46:48 PM UTC-4, Ed Lee wrote:
On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 9:21:21 AM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
On Sun, 30 Apr 2023 18:47:58 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

On Thursday, April 27, 2023 at 7:33:51?AM UTC-7, Ed Lee wrote:
On Thursday, April 27, 2023 at 5:32:38?AM UTC-7, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 8:30:26?PM UTC-4, Ricky wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 4:59:25?PM UTC-4, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 11:24:30?AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
The first link is to a story about a tow truck driver towing his first EV.
This EV driver would\'ve been ok if he had a hybrid.
https://ijr.com/californian-learns-brutal-lesson-evs-stranded-truck-hauled/
Here\'s a Consumer Reports article about hybrids.
https://www.consumerreports.org/cars/hybrids-evs/how-do-hybrid-cars-work-a1034181509/
I wouldn\'t want an EV just because they\'re something relatively new. There are bugs to be worked out over time. People won\'t necessarily use them the way designers think they will be.
That was the driver\'s stupidity and not the EV. Of course the right wingnut press loves to jump on a story about a renewable failure. Was the driver so stupid he thought a mile on the flat is the same as mile with a 7% incline? Sounds like it. Google maps could compute the kWh for his exact route with pretty good accuracy if they had that capability. I haven\'t heard anything about it- yet.
Google pretty much sucks when it comes to planning a BEV trip. Very inadequate. Tesla, on the other hand, uses the Google map data and does a very good job of it. If you simply want to find chargers, Plugshare is pretty good. ABRP (a better route planner) does a better job than Tesla, in some ways. Tesla only (relatively) recently added waypoints, but still sucks for \"what if\" analysis. ABRP is probably still the best tool over all, but being built into the car is an advantage which is hard to beat.
a
If Tesla would fix their GD browser, so it doesn\'t crash every five minutes, crashing the display computer with it, you could run ABRP in the car and have the best of both worlds.
I\'m talking about using the exact model of EV to incrementally compute and integrate the kWh expenditure at posted speed along the prospective route from origin to destination, with possible stop offs at recharging stations. These other products, especially Tesla, are complete amateurs compared to what google could do. Maybe they don\'t want to contribute to people squandering energy on joy rides, or something.
For such long trip in EV desert, I would carry a generator. In fact, I have a new (never used) one for years, just for emergency. The problem is that once used, I have to keep using it couple of time per month, to keep it in working order. I wonder if it\'s better to disassembly and clean the gasket after every use.

Oh, the IRONY of it all! You buy an EV to divorce yourself from fossil fuels and you end up carrying both the fuel and an ICE to bail yourself out. You still haven\'t cut the apron strings.
An EV isn\'t transport, it\'s a hobby.
Well, it\'s an experience. Take 30 minutes at a Nissan dealer to free charge the Leaf, free half-charge my laptop and chatting on SED, 2 cups of free capucinno and 1free rest room visit. If Tesla dealer can match that, perhaps I\'ll switch. But first, need to find a Tesla dealer.
How about one of the many Superchargers that will charge the same kWh in a third of the time?

Many of them are free, including this one. I think it was free before, after hour, without salesman to punch in.

> They say time is money, but clearly your time is less valuable than a cup of coffee if you are happy spending a half hour to get a cup and 50 miles of driving. Your average speed is probably faster than a walk... well, at least a bit faster.

I only need to do long distance couple of time a year. Very often, i just use the Tracy Nissan several times a day FREE, plus CalTran 30 miles south on I-5.

 

[Ricky]

On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 3:37:40 PM UTC-4, Ed Lee wrote:

On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 12:26:31 PM UTC-7, Ricky wrote:
On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 1:46:48 PM UTC-4, Ed Lee wrote:
On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 9:21:21 AM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
On Sun, 30 Apr 2023 18:47:58 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

On Thursday, April 27, 2023 at 7:33:51?AM UTC-7, Ed Lee wrote:
On Thursday, April 27, 2023 at 5:32:38?AM UTC-7, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 8:30:26?PM UTC-4, Ricky wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 4:59:25?PM UTC-4, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 11:24:30?AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
The first link is to a story about a tow truck driver towing his first EV.
This EV driver would\'ve been ok if he had a hybrid.
https://ijr.com/californian-learns-brutal-lesson-evs-stranded-truck-hauled/
Here\'s a Consumer Reports article about hybrids.
https://www.consumerreports.org/cars/hybrids-evs/how-do-hybrid-cars-work-a1034181509/
I wouldn\'t want an EV just because they\'re something relatively new. There are bugs to be worked out over time. People won\'t necessarily use them the way designers think they will be.
That was the driver\'s stupidity and not the EV. Of course the right wingnut press loves to jump on a story about a renewable failure. Was the driver so stupid he thought a mile on the flat is the same as mile with a 7% incline? Sounds like it. Google maps could compute the kWh for his exact route with pretty good accuracy if they had that capability. I haven\'t heard anything about it- yet.
Google pretty much sucks when it comes to planning a BEV trip. Very inadequate. Tesla, on the other hand, uses the Google map data and does a very good job of it. If you simply want to find chargers, Plugshare is pretty good. ABRP (a better route planner) does a better job than Tesla, in some ways. Tesla only (relatively) recently added waypoints, but still sucks for \"what if\" analysis. ABRP is probably still the best tool over all, but being built into the car is an advantage which is hard to beat.
a
If Tesla would fix their GD browser, so it doesn\'t crash every five minutes, crashing the display computer with it, you could run ABRP in the car and have the best of both worlds.
I\'m talking about using the exact model of EV to incrementally compute and integrate the kWh expenditure at posted speed along the prospective route from origin to destination, with possible stop offs at recharging stations. These other products, especially Tesla, are complete amateurs compared to what google could do. Maybe they don\'t want to contribute to people squandering energy on joy rides, or something.
For such long trip in EV desert, I would carry a generator. In fact, I have a new (never used) one for years, just for emergency. The problem is that once used, I have to keep using it couple of time per month, to keep it in working order. I wonder if it\'s better to disassembly and clean the gasket after every use.

Oh, the IRONY of it all! You buy an EV to divorce yourself from fossil fuels and you end up carrying both the fuel and an ICE to bail yourself out. You still haven\'t cut the apron strings.
An EV isn\'t transport, it\'s a hobby.
Well, it\'s an experience. Take 30 minutes at a Nissan dealer to free charge the Leaf, free half-charge my laptop and chatting on SED, 2 cups of free capucinno and 1free rest room visit. If Tesla dealer can match that, perhaps I\'ll switch. But first, need to find a Tesla dealer.
How about one of the many Superchargers that will charge the same kWh in a third of the time?
Many of them are free, including this one. I think it was free before, after hour, without salesman to punch in.
They say time is money, but clearly your time is less valuable than a cup of coffee if you are happy spending a half hour to get a cup and 50 miles of driving. Your average speed is probably faster than a walk... well, at least a bit faster.
I only need to do long distance couple of time a year. Very often, i just use the Tracy Nissan several times a day FREE, plus CalTran 30 miles south on I-5.

Who cares? I get my Supercharging for free, simply because I bought my car early, when Tesla had promotions, shortly before the model 3 ramp up. Fine, but it\'s not that big of a deal. If my choice was to pay for topping off in 10 or 15 minutes at a Supercharger, or free charging at a level 2 charger, I\'d go for the Supercharging any day of the week. Some people just don\'t have anything better to do than wait for their socks to dry or their cars to charge.

When I talk to people about BEVs, I try to hide the fact that I know of you or anyone like you. But then, there are people who make their own biodiesel and emit french fry smells as they drive.

--

Rick C.

-+++ Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
-+++ Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209

 

[Ed Lee]

On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 12:44:08 PM UTC-7, Ricky wrote:

On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 3:37:40 PM UTC-4, Ed Lee wrote:
On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 12:26:31 PM UTC-7, Ricky wrote:
On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 1:46:48 PM UTC-4, Ed Lee wrote:
On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 9:21:21 AM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
On Sun, 30 Apr 2023 18:47:58 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

On Thursday, April 27, 2023 at 7:33:51?AM UTC-7, Ed Lee wrote:
On Thursday, April 27, 2023 at 5:32:38?AM UTC-7, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 8:30:26?PM UTC-4, Ricky wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 4:59:25?PM UTC-4, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 11:24:30?AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
The first link is to a story about a tow truck driver towing his first EV.
This EV driver would\'ve been ok if he had a hybrid.
https://ijr.com/californian-learns-brutal-lesson-evs-stranded-truck-hauled/
Here\'s a Consumer Reports article about hybrids.
https://www.consumerreports.org/cars/hybrids-evs/how-do-hybrid-cars-work-a1034181509/
I wouldn\'t want an EV just because they\'re something relatively new. There are bugs to be worked out over time. People won\'t necessarily use them the way designers think they will be.
That was the driver\'s stupidity and not the EV. Of course the right wingnut press loves to jump on a story about a renewable failure. Was the driver so stupid he thought a mile on the flat is the same as mile with a 7% incline? Sounds like it. Google maps could compute the kWh for his exact route with pretty good accuracy if they had that capability. I haven\'t heard anything about it- yet.
Google pretty much sucks when it comes to planning a BEV trip. Very inadequate. Tesla, on the other hand, uses the Google map data and does a very good job of it. If you simply want to find chargers, Plugshare is pretty good. ABRP (a better route planner) does a better job than Tesla, in some ways. Tesla only (relatively) recently added waypoints, but still sucks for \"what if\" analysis. ABRP is probably still the best tool over all, but being built into the car is an advantage which is hard to beat.
a
If Tesla would fix their GD browser, so it doesn\'t crash every five minutes, crashing the display computer with it, you could run ABRP in the car and have the best of both worlds.
I\'m talking about using the exact model of EV to incrementally compute and integrate the kWh expenditure at posted speed along the prospective route from origin to destination, with possible stop offs at recharging stations. These other products, especially Tesla, are complete amateurs compared to what google could do. Maybe they don\'t want to contribute to people squandering energy on joy rides, or something.
For such long trip in EV desert, I would carry a generator. In fact, I have a new (never used) one for years, just for emergency. The problem is that once used, I have to keep using it couple of time per month, to keep it in working order. I wonder if it\'s better to disassembly and clean the gasket after every use.

Oh, the IRONY of it all! You buy an EV to divorce yourself from fossil fuels and you end up carrying both the fuel and an ICE to bail yourself out. You still haven\'t cut the apron strings.
An EV isn\'t transport, it\'s a hobby.
Well, it\'s an experience. Take 30 minutes at a Nissan dealer to free charge the Leaf, free half-charge my laptop and chatting on SED, 2 cups of free capucinno and 1free rest room visit. If Tesla dealer can match that, perhaps I\'ll switch. But first, need to find a Tesla dealer.
How about one of the many Superchargers that will charge the same kWh in a third of the time?
Many of them are free, including this one. I think it was free before, after hour, without salesman to punch in.
They say time is money, but clearly your time is less valuable than a cup of coffee if you are happy spending a half hour to get a cup and 50 miles of driving. Your average speed is probably faster than a walk... well, at least a bit faster.
I only need to do long distance couple of time a year. Very often, i just use the Tracy Nissan several times a day FREE, plus CalTran 30 miles south on I-5.
Who cares? I get my Supercharging for free, simply because I bought my car early, when Tesla had promotions, shortly before the model 3 ramp up. Fine, but it\'s not that big of a deal. If my choice was to pay for topping off in 10 or 15 minutes at a Supercharger, or free charging at a level 2 charger, I\'d go for the Supercharging any day of the week. Some people just don\'t have anything better to do than wait for their socks to dry or their cars to charge.

When I talk to people about BEVs, I try to hide the fact that I know of you or anyone like you. But then, there are people who make their own biodiesel and emit french fry smells as they drive.

I know. You are not the typical Tesla driver. Typical Tesla drivers need to pay and they keep clogging up public chargers.

 

[John Larkin]

On Mon, 1 May 2023 12:37:36 -0700 (PDT), Ed Lee
<edward.ming.lee@gmail.com> wrote:

On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 12:26:31?PM UTC-7, Ricky wrote:
On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 1:46:48?PM UTC-4, Ed Lee wrote:
On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 9:21:21?AM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
On Sun, 30 Apr 2023 18:47:58 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

On Thursday, April 27, 2023 at 7:33:51?AM UTC-7, Ed Lee wrote:
On Thursday, April 27, 2023 at 5:32:38?AM UTC-7, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 8:30:26?PM UTC-4, Ricky wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 4:59:25?PM UTC-4, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 11:24:30?AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
The first link is to a story about a tow truck driver towing his first EV.
This EV driver would\'ve been ok if he had a hybrid.
https://ijr.com/californian-learns-brutal-lesson-evs-stranded-truck-hauled/
Here\'s a Consumer Reports article about hybrids.
https://www.consumerreports.org/cars/hybrids-evs/how-do-hybrid-cars-work-a1034181509/
I wouldn\'t want an EV just because they\'re something relatively new. There are bugs to be worked out over time. People won\'t necessarily use them the way designers think they will be.
That was the driver\'s stupidity and not the EV. Of course the right wingnut press loves to jump on a story about a renewable failure. Was the driver so stupid he thought a mile on the flat is the same as mile with a 7% incline? Sounds like it. Google maps could compute the kWh for his exact route with pretty good accuracy if they had that capability. I haven\'t heard anything about it- yet.
Google pretty much sucks when it comes to planning a BEV trip. Very inadequate. Tesla, on the other hand, uses the Google map data and does a very good job of it. If you simply want to find chargers, Plugshare is pretty good. ABRP (a better route planner) does a better job than Tesla, in some ways. Tesla only (relatively) recently added waypoints, but still sucks for \"what if\" analysis. ABRP is probably still the best tool over all, but being built into the car is an advantage which is hard to beat.
a
If Tesla would fix their GD browser, so it doesn\'t crash every five minutes, crashing the display computer with it, you could run ABRP in the car and have the best of both worlds.
I\'m talking about using the exact model of EV to incrementally compute and integrate the kWh expenditure at posted speed along the prospective route from origin to destination, with possible stop offs at recharging stations. These other products, especially Tesla, are complete amateurs compared to what google could do. Maybe they don\'t want to contribute to people squandering energy on joy rides, or something.
For such long trip in EV desert, I would carry a generator. In fact, I have a new (never used) one for years, just for emergency. The problem is that once used, I have to keep using it couple of time per month, to keep it in working order. I wonder if it\'s better to disassembly and clean the gasket after every use.

Oh, the IRONY of it all! You buy an EV to divorce yourself from fossil fuels and you end up carrying both the fuel and an ICE to bail yourself out. You still haven\'t cut the apron strings.
An EV isn\'t transport, it\'s a hobby.
Well, it\'s an experience. Take 30 minutes at a Nissan dealer to free charge the Leaf, free half-charge my laptop and chatting on SED, 2 cups of free capucinno and 1free rest room visit. If Tesla dealer can match that, perhaps I\'ll switch. But first, need to find a Tesla dealer.
How about one of the many Superchargers that will charge the same kWh in a third of the time?

Many of them are free, including this one. I think it was free before, after hour, without salesman to punch in.

They say time is money, but clearly your time is less valuable than a cup of coffee if you are happy spending a half hour to get a cup and 50 miles of driving. Your average speed is probably faster than a walk... well, at least a bit faster.

I only need to do long distance couple of time a year. Very often, i just use the Tracy Nissan several times a day FREE, plus CalTran 30 miles south on I-5.

What is all this FREE, FREE, FREE stuff about?

 

[John Larkin]

On Thu, 27 Apr 2023 08:22:03 -0700 (PDT), Fred Bloggs
<bloggs.fredbloggs.fred@gmail.com> wrote:

On Thursday, April 27, 2023 at 10:52:28?AM UTC-4, Ricky wrote:
On Thursday, April 27, 2023 at 8:32:38?AM UTC-4, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 8:30:26?PM UTC-4, Ricky wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 4:59:25?PM UTC-4, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 11:24:30?AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
The first link is to a story about a tow truck driver towing his first EV.
This EV driver would\'ve been ok if he had a hybrid.
https://ijr.com/californian-learns-brutal-lesson-evs-stranded-truck-hauled/
Here\'s a Consumer Reports article about hybrids.
https://www.consumerreports.org/cars/hybrids-evs/how-do-hybrid-cars-work-a1034181509/
I wouldn\'t want an EV just because they\'re something relatively new. There are bugs to be worked out over time. People won\'t necessarily use them the way designers think they will be.
That was the driver\'s stupidity and not the EV. Of course the right wingnut press loves to jump on a story about a renewable failure. Was the driver so stupid he thought a mile on the flat is the same as mile with a 7% incline? Sounds like it. Google maps could compute the kWh for his exact route with pretty good accuracy if they had that capability. I haven\'t heard anything about it- yet.
Google pretty much sucks when it comes to planning a BEV trip. Very inadequate. Tesla, on the other hand, uses the Google map data and does a very good job of it. If you simply want to find chargers, Plugshare is pretty good. ABRP (a better route planner) does a better job than Tesla, in some ways. Tesla only (relatively) recently added waypoints, but still sucks for \"what if\" analysis. ABRP is probably still the best tool over all, but being built into the car is an advantage which is hard to beat.

If Tesla would fix their GD browser, so it doesn\'t crash every five minutes, crashing the display computer with it, you could run ABRP in the car and have the best of both worlds.
I\'m talking about using the exact model of EV to incrementally compute and integrate the kWh expenditure at posted speed along the prospective route from origin to destination, with possible stop offs at recharging stations. These other products, especially Tesla, are complete amateurs compared to what google could do. Maybe they don\'t want to contribute to people squandering energy on joy rides, or something.
I don\'t know if this is an example of another non-BEV owner complaining about some aspect of BEVs, or if this is just Bloggs\' typical ill-informed posting.

What do you think Tesla is doing that is so inferior? Tesla gets any information they want, from millions of Teslas on the road, on every road, all the time, in different times of the day, different weather conditions, different driving styles. Google just has maps and reports of location.

You simply don\'t realize that Tesla is the juggernaut of information about BEVs, that you think Google *could* be. You are mistaken, Google doesn\'t have access to any internal information from the cars. Well, not until they release their car which everyone knows they have in the works. LOL

In the BEV world, Google is the rank amateur, because, like you, they don\'t own a BEV, or have access to data from anyone else\'s.

Tesla is going to have that kind of data on the Rivian truck? I don\'t think so.

Why are BEVs so ugly?

There is a market for aggressively ugly cars.

 

[Ed Lee]

On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 1:03:54 PM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:

On Mon, 1 May 2023 12:37:36 -0700 (PDT), Ed Lee
edward....@gmail.com> wrote:

On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 12:26:31?PM UTC-7, Ricky wrote:
On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 1:46:48?PM UTC-4, Ed Lee wrote:
On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 9:21:21?AM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
On Sun, 30 Apr 2023 18:47:58 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

On Thursday, April 27, 2023 at 7:33:51?AM UTC-7, Ed Lee wrote:
On Thursday, April 27, 2023 at 5:32:38?AM UTC-7, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 8:30:26?PM UTC-4, Ricky wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 4:59:25?PM UTC-4, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 11:24:30?AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
The first link is to a story about a tow truck driver towing his first EV.
This EV driver would\'ve been ok if he had a hybrid.
https://ijr.com/californian-learns-brutal-lesson-evs-stranded-truck-hauled/
Here\'s a Consumer Reports article about hybrids.
https://www.consumerreports.org/cars/hybrids-evs/how-do-hybrid-cars-work-a1034181509/
I wouldn\'t want an EV just because they\'re something relatively new. There are bugs to be worked out over time. People won\'t necessarily use them the way designers think they will be.
That was the driver\'s stupidity and not the EV. Of course the right wingnut press loves to jump on a story about a renewable failure.. Was the driver so stupid he thought a mile on the flat is the same as mile with a 7% incline? Sounds like it. Google maps could compute the kWh for his exact route with pretty good accuracy if they had that capability. I haven\'t heard anything about it- yet.
Google pretty much sucks when it comes to planning a BEV trip. Very inadequate. Tesla, on the other hand, uses the Google map data and does a very good job of it. If you simply want to find chargers, Plugshare is pretty good. ABRP (a better route planner) does a better job than Tesla, in some ways. Tesla only (relatively) recently added waypoints, but still sucks for \"what if\" analysis. ABRP is probably still the best tool over all, but being built into the car is an advantage which is hard to beat.
a
If Tesla would fix their GD browser, so it doesn\'t crash every five minutes, crashing the display computer with it, you could run ABRP in the car and have the best of both worlds.
I\'m talking about using the exact model of EV to incrementally compute and integrate the kWh expenditure at posted speed along the prospective route from origin to destination, with possible stop offs at recharging stations. These other products, especially Tesla, are complete amateurs compared to what google could do. Maybe they don\'t want to contribute to people squandering energy on joy rides, or something.
For such long trip in EV desert, I would carry a generator. In fact, I have a new (never used) one for years, just for emergency. The problem is that once used, I have to keep using it couple of time per month, to keep it in working order. I wonder if it\'s better to disassembly and clean the gasket after every use.

Oh, the IRONY of it all! You buy an EV to divorce yourself from fossil fuels and you end up carrying both the fuel and an ICE to bail yourself out. You still haven\'t cut the apron strings.
An EV isn\'t transport, it\'s a hobby.
Well, it\'s an experience. Take 30 minutes at a Nissan dealer to free charge the Leaf, free half-charge my laptop and chatting on SED, 2 cups of free capucinno and 1free rest room visit. If Tesla dealer can match that, perhaps I\'ll switch. But first, need to find a Tesla dealer.
How about one of the many Superchargers that will charge the same kWh in a third of the time?

Many of them are free, including this one. I think it was free before, after hour, without salesman to punch in.

They say time is money, but clearly your time is less valuable than a cup of coffee if you are happy spending a half hour to get a cup and 50 miles of driving. Your average speed is probably faster than a walk... well, at least a bit faster.

I only need to do long distance couple of time a year. Very often, i just use the Tracy Nissan several times a day FREE, plus CalTran 30 miles south on I-5.
What is all this FREE, FREE, FREE stuff about?

To make up for the PAY, PAY, PAY chargers. Sometimes, they cost (50 to 60 cents per KWhr) more than gas. Average cost around $30 between SF & LA.

 

[Ed Lee]

On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 1:08:51 PM UTC-7, Ed Lee wrote:

On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 1:03:54 PM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
On Mon, 1 May 2023 12:37:36 -0700 (PDT), Ed Lee
edward....@gmail.com> wrote:

On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 12:26:31?PM UTC-7, Ricky wrote:
On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 1:46:48?PM UTC-4, Ed Lee wrote:
On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 9:21:21?AM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
On Sun, 30 Apr 2023 18:47:58 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

On Thursday, April 27, 2023 at 7:33:51?AM UTC-7, Ed Lee wrote:
On Thursday, April 27, 2023 at 5:32:38?AM UTC-7, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 8:30:26?PM UTC-4, Ricky wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 4:59:25?PM UTC-4, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 11:24:30?AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
The first link is to a story about a tow truck driver towing his first EV.
This EV driver would\'ve been ok if he had a hybrid.
https://ijr.com/californian-learns-brutal-lesson-evs-stranded-truck-hauled/
Here\'s a Consumer Reports article about hybrids.
https://www.consumerreports.org/cars/hybrids-evs/how-do-hybrid-cars-work-a1034181509/
I wouldn\'t want an EV just because they\'re something relatively new. There are bugs to be worked out over time. People won\'t necessarily use them the way designers think they will be.
That was the driver\'s stupidity and not the EV. Of course the right wingnut press loves to jump on a story about a renewable failure. Was the driver so stupid he thought a mile on the flat is the same as mile with a 7% incline? Sounds like it. Google maps could compute the kWh for his exact route with pretty good accuracy if they had that capability. I haven\'t heard anything about it- yet.
Google pretty much sucks when it comes to planning a BEV trip. Very inadequate. Tesla, on the other hand, uses the Google map data and does a very good job of it. If you simply want to find chargers, Plugshare is pretty good. ABRP (a better route planner) does a better job than Tesla, in some ways. Tesla only (relatively) recently added waypoints, but still sucks for \"what if\" analysis. ABRP is probably still the best tool over all, but being built into the car is an advantage which is hard to beat.
a
If Tesla would fix their GD browser, so it doesn\'t crash every five minutes, crashing the display computer with it, you could run ABRP in the car and have the best of both worlds.
I\'m talking about using the exact model of EV to incrementally compute and integrate the kWh expenditure at posted speed along the prospective route from origin to destination, with possible stop offs at recharging stations. These other products, especially Tesla, are complete amateurs compared to what google could do. Maybe they don\'t want to contribute to people squandering energy on joy rides, or something.
For such long trip in EV desert, I would carry a generator. In fact, I have a new (never used) one for years, just for emergency. The problem is that once used, I have to keep using it couple of time per month, to keep it in working order. I wonder if it\'s better to disassembly and clean the gasket after every use.

Oh, the IRONY of it all! You buy an EV to divorce yourself from fossil fuels and you end up carrying both the fuel and an ICE to bail yourself out. You still haven\'t cut the apron strings.
An EV isn\'t transport, it\'s a hobby.
Well, it\'s an experience. Take 30 minutes at a Nissan dealer to free charge the Leaf, free half-charge my laptop and chatting on SED, 2 cups of free capucinno and 1free rest room visit. If Tesla dealer can match that, perhaps I\'ll switch. But first, need to find a Tesla dealer.
How about one of the many Superchargers that will charge the same kWh in a third of the time?

Many of them are free, including this one. I think it was free before, after hour, without salesman to punch in.

They say time is money, but clearly your time is less valuable than a cup of coffee if you are happy spending a half hour to get a cup and 50 miles of driving. Your average speed is probably faster than a walk... well, at least a bit faster.

I only need to do long distance couple of time a year. Very often, i just use the Tracy Nissan several times a day FREE, plus CalTran 30 miles south on I-5.
What is all this FREE, FREE, FREE stuff about?
To make up for the PAY, PAY, PAY chargers. Sometimes, they cost (50 to 60 cents per KWhr) more than gas. Average cost around $30 between SF & LA.

BTW, the up hill is very bad for the battery. It raise temp by 10C to 15C and couple of hours to cool down. Waiting for AAA. How much should I trip AAA driver? I gave $20 to the Good Sam driver because he was complaining about the time/cost to his office.

 

[John Larkin]

On Mon, 1 May 2023 14:53:39 -0700 (PDT), Ed Lee
<edward.ming.lee@gmail.com> wrote:

On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 1:08:51?PM UTC-7, Ed Lee wrote:
On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 1:03:54?PM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
On Mon, 1 May 2023 12:37:36 -0700 (PDT), Ed Lee
edward....@gmail.com> wrote:

On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 12:26:31?PM UTC-7, Ricky wrote:
On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 1:46:48?PM UTC-4, Ed Lee wrote:
On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 9:21:21?AM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
On Sun, 30 Apr 2023 18:47:58 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

On Thursday, April 27, 2023 at 7:33:51?AM UTC-7, Ed Lee wrote:
On Thursday, April 27, 2023 at 5:32:38?AM UTC-7, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 8:30:26?PM UTC-4, Ricky wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 4:59:25?PM UTC-4, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 11:24:30?AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
The first link is to a story about a tow truck driver towing his first EV.
This EV driver would\'ve been ok if he had a hybrid.
https://ijr.com/californian-learns-brutal-lesson-evs-stranded-truck-hauled/
Here\'s a Consumer Reports article about hybrids.
https://www.consumerreports.org/cars/hybrids-evs/how-do-hybrid-cars-work-a1034181509/
I wouldn\'t want an EV just because they\'re something relatively new. There are bugs to be worked out over time. People won\'t necessarily use them the way designers think they will be.
That was the driver\'s stupidity and not the EV. Of course the right wingnut press loves to jump on a story about a renewable failure. Was the driver so stupid he thought a mile on the flat is the same as mile with a 7% incline? Sounds like it. Google maps could compute the kWh for his exact route with pretty good accuracy if they had that capability. I haven\'t heard anything about it- yet.
Google pretty much sucks when it comes to planning a BEV trip. Very inadequate. Tesla, on the other hand, uses the Google map data and does a very good job of it. If you simply want to find chargers, Plugshare is pretty good. ABRP (a better route planner) does a better job than Tesla, in some ways. Tesla only (relatively) recently added waypoints, but still sucks for \"what if\" analysis. ABRP is probably still the best tool over all, but being built into the car is an advantage which is hard to beat.
a
If Tesla would fix their GD browser, so it doesn\'t crash every five minutes, crashing the display computer with it, you could run ABRP in the car and have the best of both worlds.
I\'m talking about using the exact model of EV to incrementally compute and integrate the kWh expenditure at posted speed along the prospective route from origin to destination, with possible stop offs at recharging stations. These other products, especially Tesla, are complete amateurs compared to what google could do. Maybe they don\'t want to contribute to people squandering energy on joy rides, or something.
For such long trip in EV desert, I would carry a generator. In fact, I have a new (never used) one for years, just for emergency. The problem is that once used, I have to keep using it couple of time per month, to keep it in working order. I wonder if it\'s better to disassembly and clean the gasket after every use.

Oh, the IRONY of it all! You buy an EV to divorce yourself from fossil fuels and you end up carrying both the fuel and an ICE to bail yourself out. You still haven\'t cut the apron strings.
An EV isn\'t transport, it\'s a hobby.
Well, it\'s an experience. Take 30 minutes at a Nissan dealer to free charge the Leaf, free half-charge my laptop and chatting on SED, 2 cups of free capucinno and 1free rest room visit. If Tesla dealer can match that, perhaps I\'ll switch. But first, need to find a Tesla dealer.
How about one of the many Superchargers that will charge the same kWh in a third of the time?

Many of them are free, including this one. I think it was free before, after hour, without salesman to punch in.

They say time is money, but clearly your time is less valuable than a cup of coffee if you are happy spending a half hour to get a cup and 50 miles of driving. Your average speed is probably faster than a walk... well, at least a bit faster.

I only need to do long distance couple of time a year. Very often, i just use the Tracy Nissan several times a day FREE, plus CalTran 30 miles south on I-5.
What is all this FREE, FREE, FREE stuff about?
To make up for the PAY, PAY, PAY chargers. Sometimes, they cost (50 to 60 cents per KWhr) more than gas. Average cost around $30 between SF & LA.

BTW, the up hill is very bad for the battery. It raise temp by 10C to 15C and couple of hours to cool down. Waiting for AAA. How much should I trip AAA driver? I gave $20 to the Good Sam driver because he was complaining about the time/cost to his office.

FREE, FREE, FREE

 

[Ed Lee]

On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 3:19:43 PM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:

On Mon, 1 May 2023 14:53:39 -0700 (PDT), Ed Lee
edward....@gmail.com> wrote:

On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 1:08:51?PM UTC-7, Ed Lee wrote:
On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 1:03:54?PM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
On Mon, 1 May 2023 12:37:36 -0700 (PDT), Ed Lee
edward....@gmail.com> wrote:

On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 12:26:31?PM UTC-7, Ricky wrote:
On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 1:46:48?PM UTC-4, Ed Lee wrote:
On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 9:21:21?AM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
On Sun, 30 Apr 2023 18:47:58 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

On Thursday, April 27, 2023 at 7:33:51?AM UTC-7, Ed Lee wrote:
On Thursday, April 27, 2023 at 5:32:38?AM UTC-7, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 8:30:26?PM UTC-4, Ricky wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 4:59:25?PM UTC-4, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 11:24:30?AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
The first link is to a story about a tow truck driver towing his first EV.
This EV driver would\'ve been ok if he had a hybrid..
https://ijr.com/californian-learns-brutal-lesson-evs-stranded-truck-hauled/
Here\'s a Consumer Reports article about hybrids.
https://www.consumerreports.org/cars/hybrids-evs/how-do-hybrid-cars-work-a1034181509/
I wouldn\'t want an EV just because they\'re something relatively new. There are bugs to be worked out over time. People won\'t necessarily use them the way designers think they will be.
That was the driver\'s stupidity and not the EV. Of course the right wingnut press loves to jump on a story about a renewable failure. Was the driver so stupid he thought a mile on the flat is the same as mile with a 7% incline? Sounds like it. Google maps could compute the kWh for his exact route with pretty good accuracy if they had that capability. I haven\'t heard anything about it- yet.
Google pretty much sucks when it comes to planning a BEV trip. Very inadequate. Tesla, on the other hand, uses the Google map data and does a very good job of it. If you simply want to find chargers, Plugshare is pretty good. ABRP (a better route planner) does a better job than Tesla, in some ways. Tesla only (relatively) recently added waypoints, but still sucks for \"what if\" analysis. ABRP is probably still the best tool over all, but being built into the car is an advantage which is hard to beat.
a
If Tesla would fix their GD browser, so it doesn\'t crash every five minutes, crashing the display computer with it, you could run ABRP in the car and have the best of both worlds.
I\'m talking about using the exact model of EV to incrementally compute and integrate the kWh expenditure at posted speed along the prospective route from origin to destination, with possible stop offs at recharging stations. These other products, especially Tesla, are complete amateurs compared to what google could do. Maybe they don\'t want to contribute to people squandering energy on joy rides, or something.
For such long trip in EV desert, I would carry a generator.. In fact, I have a new (never used) one for years, just for emergency. The problem is that once used, I have to keep using it couple of time per month, to keep it in working order. I wonder if it\'s better to disassembly and clean the gasket after every use.

Oh, the IRONY of it all! You buy an EV to divorce yourself from fossil fuels and you end up carrying both the fuel and an ICE to bail yourself out. You still haven\'t cut the apron strings.
An EV isn\'t transport, it\'s a hobby.
Well, it\'s an experience. Take 30 minutes at a Nissan dealer to free charge the Leaf, free half-charge my laptop and chatting on SED, 2 cups of free capucinno and 1free rest room visit. If Tesla dealer can match that, perhaps I\'ll switch. But first, need to find a Tesla dealer.
How about one of the many Superchargers that will charge the same kWh in a third of the time?

Many of them are free, including this one. I think it was free before, after hour, without salesman to punch in.

They say time is money, but clearly your time is less valuable than a cup of coffee if you are happy spending a half hour to get a cup and 50 miles of driving. Your average speed is probably faster than a walk... well, at least a bit faster.

I only need to do long distance couple of time a year. Very often, i just use the Tracy Nissan several times a day FREE, plus CalTran 30 miles south on I-5.
What is all this FREE, FREE, FREE stuff about?
To make up for the PAY, PAY, PAY chargers. Sometimes, they cost (50 to 60 cents per KWhr) more than gas. Average cost around $30 between SF & LA.

BTW, the up hill is very bad for the battery. It raise temp by 10C to 15C and couple of hours to cool down. Waiting for AAA. How much should I trip AAA driver? I gave $20 to the Good Sam driver because he was complaining about the time/cost to his office.
FREE, FREE, FREE

Not for the tow truck driver. Good Sam does not have too many drivers; so the assigned driver had to travel very long distance. AAA should be better..

 

[Ed Lee]

On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 3:23:13 PM UTC-7, Ed Lee wrote:

On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 3:19:43 PM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
On Mon, 1 May 2023 14:53:39 -0700 (PDT), Ed Lee
edward....@gmail.com> wrote:

On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 1:08:51?PM UTC-7, Ed Lee wrote:
On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 1:03:54?PM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
On Mon, 1 May 2023 12:37:36 -0700 (PDT), Ed Lee
edward....@gmail.com> wrote:

On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 12:26:31?PM UTC-7, Ricky wrote:
On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 1:46:48?PM UTC-4, Ed Lee wrote:
On Monday, May 1, 2023 at 9:21:21?AM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
On Sun, 30 Apr 2023 18:47:58 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

On Thursday, April 27, 2023 at 7:33:51?AM UTC-7, Ed Lee wrote:
On Thursday, April 27, 2023 at 5:32:38?AM UTC-7, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 8:30:26?PM UTC-4, Ricky wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 4:59:25?PM UTC-4, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Wednesday, April 26, 2023 at 11:24:30?AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
The first link is to a story about a tow truck driver towing his first EV.
This EV driver would\'ve been ok if he had a hybrid.
https://ijr.com/californian-learns-brutal-lesson-evs-stranded-truck-hauled/
Here\'s a Consumer Reports article about hybrids.
https://www.consumerreports.org/cars/hybrids-evs/how-do-hybrid-cars-work-a1034181509/
I wouldn\'t want an EV just because they\'re something relatively new. There are bugs to be worked out over time. People won\'t necessarily use them the way designers think they will be.
That was the driver\'s stupidity and not the EV. Of course the right wingnut press loves to jump on a story about a renewable failure. Was the driver so stupid he thought a mile on the flat is the same as mile with a 7% incline? Sounds like it. Google maps could compute the kWh for his exact route with pretty good accuracy if they had that capability. I haven\'t heard anything about it- yet.
Google pretty much sucks when it comes to planning a BEV trip. Very inadequate. Tesla, on the other hand, uses the Google map data and does a very good job of it. If you simply want to find chargers, Plugshare is pretty good. ABRP (a better route planner) does a better job than Tesla, in some ways. Tesla only (relatively) recently added waypoints, but still sucks for \"what if\" analysis. ABRP is probably still the best tool over all, but being built into the car is an advantage which is hard to beat.
a
If Tesla would fix their GD browser, so it doesn\'t crash every five minutes, crashing the display computer with it, you could run ABRP in the car and have the best of both worlds.
I\'m talking about using the exact model of EV to incrementally compute and integrate the kWh expenditure at posted speed along the prospective route from origin to destination, with possible stop offs at recharging stations. These other products, especially Tesla, are complete amateurs compared to what google could do. Maybe they don\'t want to contribute to people squandering energy on joy rides, or something.
For such long trip in EV desert, I would carry a generator. In fact, I have a new (never used) one for years, just for emergency. The problem is that once used, I have to keep using it couple of time per month, to keep it in working order. I wonder if it\'s better to disassembly and clean the gasket after every use.

Oh, the IRONY of it all! You buy an EV to divorce yourself from fossil fuels and you end up carrying both the fuel and an ICE to bail yourself out. You still haven\'t cut the apron strings.
An EV isn\'t transport, it\'s a hobby.
Well, it\'s an experience. Take 30 minutes at a Nissan dealer to free charge the Leaf, free half-charge my laptop and chatting on SED, 2 cups of free capucinno and 1free rest room visit. If Tesla dealer can match that, perhaps I\'ll switch. But first, need to find a Tesla dealer.
How about one of the many Superchargers that will charge the same kWh in a third of the time?

Many of them are free, including this one. I think it was free before, after hour, without salesman to punch in.

They say time is money, but clearly your time is less valuable than a cup of coffee if you are happy spending a half hour to get a cup and 50 miles of driving. Your average speed is probably faster than a walk... well, at least a bit faster.

I only need to do long distance couple of time a year. Very often, i just use the Tracy Nissan several times a day FREE, plus CalTran 30 miles south on I-5.
What is all this FREE, FREE, FREE stuff about?
To make up for the PAY, PAY, PAY chargers. Sometimes, they cost (50 to 60 cents per KWhr) more than gas. Average cost around $30 between SF & LA.

BTW, the up hill is very bad for the battery. It raise temp by 10C to 15C and couple of hours to cool down. Waiting for AAA. How much should I trip AAA driver? I gave $20 to the Good Sam driver because he was complaining about the time/cost to his office.
FREE, FREE, FREE

Not for the tow truck driver. Good Sam does not have too many drivers; so the assigned driver had to travel very long distance. AAA should be better..

Tow truck drivers need to eat; so, ok to tip them. Chargers don\'t need to eat, except for the over-paid over-engineers. Charging should be simply, but they are making it over-complicated. Some plug-in-and-charge fast charger never failed, without screens and/or buttons (except for an emergency stop button). Over engineered UI screen fails all the time. I am voting with my dollars and wheels.