Red Alert on Green Bulbs

[Horry]

On Mon, 19 Jan 2009 15:59:45 -0800, kreed wrote:

On Jan 19, 9:27 pm, Sylvia Else <syl...@not.at.this.address> wrote:
Davo wrote:
Normal fluorescent tubes have always had mercury in them. If you look
closely you can even see a tiny bead of mercury rolling around
inside. I don't see why people are getting so excited about it when
we've had them for years already.

Indeed, and was there a great panic whenever we broke clinical
thermometers, or mercury thermometers at school?

Sylvia.

I can remember in high school, they actually had a container of mercury
in science class,
and the kids would put their hands in it to "feel" what it was like.
Very interesting substance.

And when was the last time you saw any of those kids?

Over 10 years? There's a reason for that. Most of them are now dead, or
have undergone mutations so horrific they're ashamed to leave their homes.

 

[Fran]

On Jan 20, 3:43 pm, "Rod Speed" <rod.speed....@gmail.com> wrote:

Fran wrote

Phil Allison <philalli...@tpg.com.au> wrote
"Fran is a FUCKING LIAR" "
Really? How is that different from a celibate liar?

Less fucking involved, stupid.

And that's a good thing or not? How is it relevant here? Were the
Celibate Rifles any good? If they'd been "Slutty Rifles" would that
have been better?

The fact of the matter is that unlike incandescent bulbs, CFL bulbs
are typically made of a polymer, which is feasible because they
don't heat up. That's why they tend not to break if they are
knocked or fall onto carpet, and if they do they don't shatter.
** Complete bollocks.
The u-tube or spiral part is made of GLASS -
Plexiglass ...

Wrong, just glass.

That's not clear.

just like a normal fluoro lamp.
Moreover, the amount of mercury in them is tiny
and bonded to the surface od the polymer.
** BOLLOCKS !!
3 to 5 mg. Some manufacturers are going to 1 mg. Unless the
bulb is in operation at the time it breaks, the mercury is not in
gaseous form but attached to the side of the tube, near the base.

Wrong, as always.

Look at a diagram, Rod. Check it out in "How Stuff Works", for
example.

While the lamp is in use, operation depends on
extremely poisonous mercury vapour filling the tube !!
It would be extremely poisonous if one were chronically exposed to it,

Wrong, as always. Dentists who were didnt get any problems from it.

Didn't they use gloves?

but of course, exposure will, at worst, be brief. If the lamp
breaks when it is not in operation, (eg bumped out of the
fitting) then the risk is from physical contact with the skin.

Wrong, as always.

Not according to the EPA ...

If it is operating, then once should open a window, leave the room,
and close the door. Thirty minutes later, it will have dissipated.

Pig ignorant lie.

Again this is the advice of the EPA ...

You seem fairly relaxed though about the mercury emissions

Because they are harmless in the levels you see with a broken CFL.

That was my point

(and the other emissions) associated with generating the energy
needed to operate incandescents via burning of coal -- which
accounts for about 80% to 90% of Australia's energy load..

Yep, they're nothing to worry about.

Apparently so ...

The chance of accidently ingesting some after a breakage is utterly trivial.
** BOLLOCKS.
You WILL breath in the vapour if you break a tube
while handling it - even more so it has just been on.
Not at all if it has not just been on.

Wrong, as always.

No, correct as usual.

If it has just been on, then see above.
I've been using CFLs (and a long fluoro in the kitchen)
for several years now. Total breakages: zero.

Irrelevant to whether broken one are anything to worry about.

But relevant to the extent of practical risk. If they hardly ever get
broken, then the hazard, whatever it is, is trivial.

Personally, I'd simply put on one of those disposable gloves,
pick up all visible pieces, and put them into a plastic bag.
The glass shards will cut the gloves and YOU.
Nope, because it is essentially a polymer.

Wrong, as always. Its real glass.

Why would they use real glass?

Of course, even plastics can cut you so one should handle with care.

The tube aint plastic.

It feels like plastic.

Then poisonous heavy metal phosphors as well as mercury will get into your blood.
And the boogie man will get you too ...
I imagine if the biosphere could speak it would. Pumping mercury and
radioactive actinides and FPM into the air and the water via the
emissions of coal fired power plants is far worse,
** MASSIVE LIE.
Note: Unrefuted claim

YOU made the stupid claim.

The claim is documented in the answer to Sylvia below.

YOU get to substantiate the stupid claim.

THATS how it works.

Been there, done that.

Disposal of several MILLION CFLs per year in regular
household waste dumps is a VERY serious mercury
hazard to the local environment and hence humans.

Wrong, as always.

** NO REPLY
No, it isn't. It's a fraction of the mercury that would have been
released into the open air by coal fired power plants producing
the extra energy to run the incandescents and to produce the
much more short lived incandescents in the first place.

Utterly mangled all over again.

Again, see the response to F Murtz above. In part:

||||
The irony of CFLs is that they actually reduce overall mercury
emissions in the long run. Despite recent improvements in the
industry's technology, the burning of coal to produce electricity
emits roughly 0.023 milligrams of mercury per kilowatt-hour. Over a
year, then, using a 26-watt CFL in the average American home (where
half of the electricity comes from coal) will result in the emission
of 0.66 milligrams of mercury. For 100-watt incandescent bulbs, which
produce the identical amount of light, the figure is 2.52 milligrams.
||||

Of course, there should be a system in place to ensure return of CFLs
to HAZMAT disposal -- a deposit and return to retailer system for in
tact bulbs would be a good exercise in environmental stewardship.

Complete waste of time.

Oh it would be excellent

YOU are one RABID GREEN NAZI NUT CASE !!
You are Barnaby Joyce and I claim my prize.

You dont qualify.

Someone ought to stick a knife up you. And twist it.
This is the second post in sequence in which you've endorsed murder.

You're lying now.

The record says otherwise

Whether you mean it or not, you are clearly disturbed. Seek help.

He's always been beyond any help.

I should note though that the desire to murder dissenters was very much a Nazi thing.

Just another of your pathetic little drug crazed fantasys.

Consult the history books, Rod

Fran

 

[F Murtz]

Fran wrote:

On Jan 20, 4:16 pm, F Murtz <hagg...@hotmail.com> wrote:
snip


While the lamp is in use, operation depends on
extremely poisonous mercury vapour filling the tube !!
It would be extremely poisonous if one were chronically exposed to it,
Wrong, as always. Dentists who were didnt get any problems from it.
Didn't they use gloves?
touching metallic mercury is not the problem. It is the salts and gases
of mercury that are.How many people are walking around with a mouthful
of it.

Amalgam capsules are sealed to sequester from contact with saliva,
IIRC

Whatever is an "amalgam capsule" and how are they sealed?

A discussion of the issue in dentistry is here:

http://www.ericdavisdental.com/manufacturersnotes.htm#Fallacies


|||

http://www.curezone.com/dental/mercury_symptoms.asp

Title :

Update: mercury poisoning associated with beauty cream--Arizona,
California, New Mexico, and Texas, 1996.

Source :

MMWR Morb Mortal Wkly Rep, 45(29):633-5 1996 Jul 26

Abstract :

During September 1995-May 1996, the Texas Department of Health (TDH),
the New Mexico Department of Health (NMDH), and the San Diego County
(California) Health Department investigated three cases of mercury
poisoning associated with the use of a mercury-containing beauty cream
produced in Mexico. The ongoing investigation has found this product
in shops and flea markets in the United States located near the U.S.-
Mexico border, and a U.S. distributor has been identified in Los
Angeles. The cream, marketed as "Crema de Belleza--Manning" for skin
cleansing and prevention of acne, listed "calomel" (mercurous chloride
[Hg2Cl2]) as an ingredient and contained 6% to 10% mercury by weight.
This report presents findings of a continuing investigation by these
health departments, the Arizona Dept of Health Services (ADHS),
California State Department of Health Services (CSDHS), the Food and
Drug Administration (FDA), and CDC.


|||

|||
Definition of mercury poisoning
Mercury poisoning occurs when a person has ingested, inhaled, or had
skin or eye contact with the toxic (poisonous) heavy metal mercury and
suffers damage to his/her nervous system and other systems of the
body.

http://wewantorganicfood.com/2007/07/29/what-is-mercury-poisoning/
|||

|||
Toxicity: Readily absorbed via respiratory tract (elemental mercury
vapor, mercury compound dusts), intact skin, and G.I. tract. Spilled
and heated elemental mercury is particularly hazardous.
http://www.hbci.com/~wenonah/hydro/hg.htm
|||

PS when a dentist drills if there were no water there might be some
fumes but even so how many dentists die from mercury poisoning


Not many if any. Dental surgeries tend to be large and fairly well
ventilated and the amounts involved are minute.

Fran

 

[Horry]

On Tue, 20 Jan 2009, 3:19 pm, F Murtz wrote:

Horry wrote:
On Mon, 19 Jan 2009 15:59:45 -0800, kreed wrote:

On Jan 19, 9:27 pm, Sylvia Else <syl...@not.at.this.address> wrote:
Davo wrote:
Normal fluorescent tubes have always had mercury in them. If you
look
closely you can even see a tiny bead of mercury rolling around
inside. I don't see why people are getting so excited about it when
we've had them for years already.
Indeed, and was there a great panic whenever we broke clinical
thermometers, or mercury thermometers at school?

Sylvia.
I can remember in high school, they actually had a container of
mercury
in science class,
and the kids would put their hands in it to "feel" what it was like.
Very interesting substance.

And when was the last time you saw any of those kids?

Over 10 years? There's a reason for that. Most of them are now
dead, or
have undergone mutations so horrific they're ashamed to leave their
homes.

Most people over the age of fourty have a mouth full of it how come I
don't see many mutants and how come any one over 50 is still alive

There's a difference between putting your hands on something and having a
mouth full of it. For example, most men hold themselves while urinating,
but regularly having a "mouth full of cock" has been medically proven to
increase the risk to Human Papillomavirus (HPV).

Comparing hands to mouths is like comparing apples to oranges.

As for the mutants, I've clearly stated that they're ashamed to leave
their homes.

 

[Fran]

On Jan 20, 4:16 pm, F Murtz <hagg...@hotmail.com> wrote:
<snip>

While the lamp is in use, operation depends on
extremely poisonous mercury vapour filling the tube !!
It would be extremely poisonous if one were chronically exposed to it,
Wrong, as always. Dentists who were didnt get any problems from it.

Didn't they use gloves?

touching metallic mercury is not the problem. It is the salts and gases
of mercury that are.How many people are walking around with a mouthful
of it.

Amalgam capsules are sealed to sequester from contact with saliva,
IIRC

A discussion of the issue in dentistry is here:

http://www.ericdavisdental.com/manufacturersnotes.htm#Fallacies


|||

http://www.curezone.com/dental/mercury_symptoms.asp

Title :

Update: mercury poisoning associated with beauty cream--Arizona,
California, New Mexico, and Texas, 1996.

Source :

MMWR Morb Mortal Wkly Rep, 45(29):633-5 1996 Jul 26

Abstract :

During September 1995-May 1996, the Texas Department of Health (TDH),
the New Mexico Department of Health (NMDH), and the San Diego County
(California) Health Department investigated three cases of mercury
poisoning associated with the use of a mercury-containing beauty cream
produced in Mexico. The ongoing investigation has found this product
in shops and flea markets in the United States located near the U.S.-
Mexico border, and a U.S. distributor has been identified in Los
Angeles. The cream, marketed as "Crema de Belleza--Manning" for skin
cleansing and prevention of acne, listed "calomel" (mercurous chloride
[Hg2Cl2]) as an ingredient and contained 6% to 10% mercury by weight.
This report presents findings of a continuing investigation by these
health departments, the Arizona Dept of Health Services (ADHS),
California State Department of Health Services (CSDHS), the Food and
Drug Administration (FDA), and CDC.


|||

|||
Definition of mercury poisoning
Mercury poisoning occurs when a person has ingested, inhaled, or had
skin or eye contact with the toxic (poisonous) heavy metal mercury and
suffers damage to his/her nervous system and other systems of the
body.

http://wewantorganicfood.com/2007/07/29/what-is-mercury-poisoning/
|||

|||
Toxicity: Readily absorbed via respiratory tract (elemental mercury
vapor, mercury compound dusts), intact skin, and G.I. tract. Spilled
and heated elemental mercury is particularly hazardous.
http://www.hbci.com/~wenonah/hydro/hg.htm
|||

PS when a dentist drills if there were no water there might be some
fumes but even so how many dentists die from mercury poisoning

Not many if any. Dental surgeries tend to be large and fairly well
ventilated and the amounts involved are minute.

Fran

 

[fran]

On Jan 20, 5:12 pm, F Murtz <hagg...@hotmail.com> wrote:

Fran wrote:
On Jan 20, 4:16 pm, F Murtz <hagg...@hotmail.com> wrote:
snip

While the lamp is in use, operation depends on
extremely poisonous mercury vapour filling the tube !!
It would be extremely poisonous if one were chronically exposed to it,
Wrong, as always. Dentists who were didnt get any problems from it.
Didn't they use gloves?
touching metallic mercury is not the problem. It is the salts and gases
of mercury that are.How many people are walking around with a mouthful
of it.

Amalgam capsules are sealed to sequester from contact with saliva,
IIRC

Whatever is an "amalgam capsule" and how are they sealed?

Truthfully, I'm not sure. I asked about safety of amalgam fillings
some years ago at a dental visit and this is what he told me -- hence
the "IIRC".

Fran

 

[F Murtz]

fran wrote:

On Jan 20, 5:12 pm, F Murtz <hagg...@hotmail.com> wrote:
Fran wrote:
On Jan 20, 4:16 pm, F Murtz <hagg...@hotmail.com> wrote:
snip
While the lamp is in use, operation depends on
extremely poisonous mercury vapour filling the tube !!
It would be extremely poisonous if one were chronically exposed to it,
Wrong, as always. Dentists who were didnt get any problems from it.
Didn't they use gloves?
touching metallic mercury is not the problem. It is the salts and gases
of mercury that are.How many people are walking around with a mouthful
of it.
Amalgam capsules are sealed to sequester from contact with saliva,
IIRC
Whatever is an "amalgam capsule" and how are they sealed?


Truthfully, I'm not sure. I asked about safety of amalgam fillings
some years ago at a dental visit and this is what he told me -- hence
the "IIRC".

Fran
amalgam for teeth used to be a mixture of mercury silver copper tin and

zinc and "capsules are sealed to sequester" is just a load of gobbldegook.

 

[Rod Speed]

Fran wrote

Rod Speed <rod.speed....@gmail.com> wrote
Fran wrote
Phil Allison <philalli...@tpg.com.au> wrote

"Fran is a FUCKING LIAR" "

Really? How is that different from a celibate liar?

Less fucking involved, stupid.

And that's a good thing or not?

Who cares ?

How is it relevant here?

Who cares ?

Were the Celibate Rifles any good?

Who cares ?

If they'd been "Slutty Rifles" would that have been better?

Who cares ?

The fact of the matter is that unlike incandescent bulbs, CFL bulbs
are typically made of a polymer, which is feasible because they
don't heat up. That's why they tend not to break if they are
knocked or fall onto carpet, and if they do they don't shatter.

** Complete bollocks.

The u-tube or spiral part is made of GLASS -

Plexiglass ...

Wrong, just glass.

That's not clear.

Corse it is. Try breaking one and see.

You're confusing CFLs that do have a plastic dome over the glass tube with normal CFLs that just have the glass tube.

just like a normal fluoro lamp.
Moreover, the amount of mercury in them is tiny
and bonded to the surface od the polymer.

** BOLLOCKS !!

3 to 5 mg. Some manufacturers are going to 1 mg. Unless the
bulb is in operation at the time it breaks, the mercury is not in
gaseous form but attached to the side of the tube, near the base.

Wrong, as always.

Look at a diagram, Rod.

Doesnt make it gospel, stupid.

Check it out in "How Stuff Works", for example.

Break one, and then get a VERY large towel for your face.

While the lamp is in use, operation depends on
extremely poisonous mercury vapour filling the tube !!

It would be extremely poisonous if one were chronically exposed to it,

Wrong, as always. Dentists who were didnt get any problems from it.

Didn't they use gloves?

Nope, that was a quite recent thing due to HIV/AIDS.

but of course, exposure will, at worst, be brief. If the lamp
breaks when it is not in operation, (eg bumped out of the
fitting) then the risk is from physical contact with the skin.

Wrong, as always.

Not according to the EPA ...

Those fools have never ever had a fucking clue.

Have fun explaining all those dentists...

If it is operating, then once should open a window, leave the room,
and close the door. Thirty minutes later, it will have dissipated.

Pig ignorant lie.

Again this is the advice of the EPA ...

Those fools have never ever had a fucking clue.

Have fun explaining all those dentists...

You seem fairly relaxed though about the mercury emissions

Because they are harmless in the levels you see with a broken CFL.

That was my point

Irrelevant to that bit of yours.

(and the other emissions) associated with generating the energy
needed to operate incandescents via burning of coal -- which
accounts for about 80% to 90% of Australia's energy load..

Yep, they're nothing to worry about.

Apparently so ...

Absolutely certainly so, in spite of what the EPA fools claim.

The chance of accidently ingesting some after a breakage is
utterly trivial. ** BOLLOCKS.
You WILL breath in the vapour if you break a tube
while handling it - even more so it has just been on.

Not at all if it has not just been on.

Wrong, as always.

No, correct as usual.

You never ever get a damned thing right, ever.

If it has just been on, then see above.
I've been using CFLs (and a long fluoro in the kitchen)
for several years now. Total breakages: zero.

Irrelevant to whether broken one are anything to worry about.

But relevant to the extent of practical risk.

Wrong, as always.

If they hardly ever get broken, then the hazard, whatever it is, is trivial.

Pity we happened to be discussing what some fools claim should be done when they are broken.

Personally, I'd simply put on one of those disposable gloves,
pick up all visible pieces, and put them into a plastic bag.
The glass shards will cut the gloves and YOU.

Nope, because it is essentially a polymer.

Wrong, as always. Its real glass.

Why would they use real glass?

Because it works better than plastic.

Of course, even plastics can cut you so one should handle with care.

The tube aint plastic.

It feels like plastic.

Break one and then find the largest towel you can find for your face.

Then poisonous heavy metal phosphors as well as mercury will get into your blood.

And the boogie man will get you too ...

I imagine if the biosphere could speak it would. Pumping mercury
and radioactive actinides and FPM into the air and the water via the
emissions of coal fired power plants is far worse,

** MASSIVE LIE.

Note: Unrefuted claim

YOU made the stupid claim.

The claim is documented in the answer to Sylvia below.

Just because some fool claims it doesnt make it gospel.

YOU get to substantiate the stupid claim.

THATS how it works.

Been there, done that.

You're lying, as always.

Disposal of several MILLION CFLs per year in regular
household waste dumps is a VERY serious mercury
hazard to the local environment and hence humans.

Wrong, as always.

** NO REPLY

No, it isn't. It's a fraction of the mercury that would have been
released into the open air by coal fired power plants producing
the extra energy to run the incandescents and to produce the
much more short lived incandescents in the first place.

Utterly mangled all over again.

Again, see the response to F Murtz above.

Completely useless, as always.

In part:


The irony of CFLs is that they actually reduce overall mercury
emissions in the long run. Despite recent improvements in the
industry's technology, the burning of coal to produce electricity
emits roughly 0.023 milligrams of mercury per kilowatt-hour. Over a
year, then, using a 26-watt CFL in the average American home (where
half of the electricity comes from coal) will result in the emission
of 0.66 milligrams of mercury. For 100-watt incandescent bulbs, which
produce the identical amount of light, the figure is 2.52 milligrams.

Irrelevant when even someone as stupid as you should have noticed
that not too many power stations actually discharge into people's houses.

Of course, there should be a system in place to ensure return of CFLs
to HAZMAT disposal -- a deposit and return to retailer system for in
tact bulbs would be a good exercise in environmental stewardship.

Complete waste of time.

Oh it would be excellent

Only for fools like you who never have had a fucking clue.

YOU are one RABID GREEN NAZI NUT CASE !!

You are Barnaby Joyce and I claim my prize.

You dont qualify.

Someone ought to stick a knife up you. And twist it.

This is the second post in sequence in which you've endorsed murder.

You're lying now.

The record says otherwise

You're lying, again.

Whether you mean it or not, you are clearly disturbed. Seek help.

He always been beyond any help.

I should note though that the desire to murder dissenters was very much a Nazi thing.

Just another of your pathetic little drug crazed fantasys.

Consult the history books, Rod

They dont say anything like that, liar.

 

[Rod Speed]

Fran wrote:

On Jan 20, 4:16 pm, F Murtz <hagg...@hotmail.com> wrote:
snip


While the lamp is in use, operation depends on
extremely poisonous mercury vapour filling the tube !!
It would be extremely poisonous if one were chronically exposed
to it,
Wrong, as always. Dentists who were didnt get any problems from it.

Didn't they use gloves?

touching metallic mercury is not the problem. It is the salts and
gases of mercury that are.How many people are walking around with a
mouthful of it.

Amalgam capsules are sealed to sequester from contact with saliva, IIRC

Wrong, as always.

A discussion of the issue in dentistry is here:

http://www.ericdavisdental.com/manufacturersnotes.htm#Fallacies

Irrelevant to what has been done for centurys without any problem.

http://www.curezone.com/dental/mercury_symptoms.asp

Title :

Update: mercury poisoning associated with beauty cream--Arizona,
California, New Mexico, and Texas, 1996.

Irrelevant to dentistry.

Source :

MMWR Morb Mortal Wkly Rep, 45(29):633-5 1996 Jul 26

Abstract :

During September 1995-May 1996, the Texas Department of Health (TDH),
the New Mexico Department of Health (NMDH), and the San Diego County
(California) Health Department investigated three cases of mercury
poisoning associated with the use of a mercury-containing beauty cream
produced in Mexico. The ongoing investigation has found this product
in shops and flea markets in the United States located near the U.S.-
Mexico border, and a U.S. distributor has been identified in Los
Angeles. The cream, marketed as "Crema de Belleza--Manning" for skin
cleansing and prevention of acne, listed "calomel" (mercurous chloride
[Hg2Cl2]) as an ingredient and contained 6% to 10% mercury by weight.
This report presents findings of a continuing investigation by these
health departments, the Arizona Dept of Health Services (ADHS),
California State Department of Health Services (CSDHS), the Food and
Drug Administration (FDA), and CDC.




Definition of mercury poisoning
Mercury poisoning occurs when a person has ingested, inhaled, or had
skin or eye contact with the toxic (poisonous) heavy metal mercury and
suffers damage to his/her nervous system and other systems of the body.

http://wewantorganicfood.com/2007/07/29/what-is-mercury-poisoning/

Irrelevant to dentistry for centurys.

Toxicity: Readily absorbed via respiratory tract (elemental mercury
vapor, mercury compound dusts), intact skin, and G.I. tract. Spilled
and heated elemental mercury is particularly hazardous.
http://www.hbci.com/~wenonah/hydro/hg.htm

Irrelevant to dentistry for centurys.

PS when a dentist drills if there were no water there might be some
fumes but even so how many dentists die from mercury poisoning

Not many if any. Dental surgeries tend to be large and fairly well ventilated

Plenty of them werent in the past.

and the amounts involved are minute.

Pig ignorant lie.

 

[Rod Speed]

fran wrote:

On Jan 20, 5:12 pm, F Murtz <hagg...@hotmail.com> wrote:
Fran wrote:
On Jan 20, 4:16 pm, F Murtz <hagg...@hotmail.com> wrote:
snip

While the lamp is in use, operation depends on
extremely poisonous mercury vapour filling the tube !!
It would be extremely poisonous if one were chronically exposed
to it,
Wrong, as always. Dentists who were didnt get any problems from
it.
Didn't they use gloves?
touching metallic mercury is not the problem. It is the salts and
gases of mercury that are.How many people are walking around with
a mouthful of it.

Amalgam capsules are sealed to sequester from contact with saliva,
IIRC

Whatever is an "amalgam capsule" and how are they sealed?


Truthfully, I'm not sure. I asked about safety of amalgam fillings some
years ago at a dental visit and this is what he told me -- hence the "IIRC".

Just the line of bullshit they run to fools like you who are too stupid to check it for yourself.

 

[Rod Speed]

Don McKenzie wrote:

Rod Speed wrote:

Its illegal to thing before you post.

Exemption:
depends how post you are, and what the thong is.

Bare faced lie.

 

[John Whorfin]

Fran wrote:

Were the Celibate Rifles any good?

No.

 

[Eeyore]

Phil Allison wrote:

"Fran"
The fact of the matter is that unlike incandescent bulbs, CFL bulbs
are typically made of a polymer, which is feasible because they don't
heat up. That's why they tend not to break if they are knocked or fall
onto carpet, and if they do they don't shatter.

** Complete bollocks.

The u-tube or spiral part is made of GLASS -

just like a normal fluoro lamp.

Indeed. I had one fracture in my hand as I was trying to refit it into a loose
lampholder. Luckily I didn't get cut.

Graham

 

[Mr.T]

"Fran" <Fran.Beta@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:be759e77-6571-45b3-8b14-2d1d54308445@p23g2000prp.googlegroups.com...

It's even more stupid to think the most intelligent people actually want
to
become politicians, or to control other peoples lives.
Many do object to having morons control their lives however.

Well they can't be all that bothered because if they were they'd make
it their business to prevent it, or manipulate some not quite so brain
dead uneducated moronic person into office and give them riding
instructions.

Yes it's a pity you think those with a modicum of intelligence should have
to spend their lives fighting "brain dead" politicians too.
Would you actually prefer a world where all scientists for example went into
politics instead? I'd hate to live in that world!
Unfortunately they are not so capable at propaganda and are adverse to the
corruption necessary to succeed in politics in any case.

Barry Jones probably did as well in politics as anybody with high
intelligence has ever done in this country, and he had little real
influence, even as president of the ALP. The game is stacked against them by
those morons already in power, and will remain so.

MrT.

 

[Eeyore]

Fran wrote:

kreed <kenreed1...@gmail.com> wrote:

I imagine if the biosphere could speak it would. Pumping mercury and
radioactive actinides and FPM into the air and the water via the
emissions of coal fired power plants is far worse, especially for
everyone living in the footprint of said plants. If the writer of this
story weren't such an ignorant moron, that tyhought would have
occurred to him. The again, perhaps it did occur to him but he takes
the view "why let reason interfere with a cheap shot at
environmentalism?"

Most environmentalism of the "man made carbon global warming" AGW
sort, is just bullshit.
Its about power, control and tax revenue raising, typical of the brain
dead, uneducated moronic society that the west has become.
Its the modern version of "flat earth" theory.

But the Earth is COOLING and Sea Level is FALLING !

Not exactly AGW to me !

Graham

 

[Fran]

On Jan 21, 10:45 am, "Mr.T" <MrT@home> wrote:

"Fran" <Fran.B...@gmail.com> wrote in message

news:be759e77-6571-45b3-8b14-2d1d54308445@p23g2000prp.googlegroups.com...

It's even more stupid to think the most intelligent people actually want
to
become politicians, or to control other peoples lives.
Many do object to having morons control their lives however.
Well they can't be all that bothered because if they were they'd make
it their business to prevent it, or manipulate some not quite so brain
dead uneducated moronic person into office and give them riding
instructions.

Yes it's a pity you think those with a modicum of intelligence should have
to spend their lives fighting "brain dead" politicians too.

Well unless they are relaxed about being controlled by brain-dead
uneducated morons, what choice do they have? Of course if people who
are not brain dead uneducated morons are relaxed about being
controlled by them, perhaps we can infer that control by such people
isn't such a bad thing and is something all people, whether "brain
dead uneducated morons" or not should accept.

Would you actually prefer a world where all scientists for example went into
politics instead? I'd hate to live in that world!

Well yes, but then I don't believe that most people or even most
politicians are "brain dead uneducated morons". If I did believe it
I'd see scientists getting involved in politics as a lesser evil
imposed by unfortunate circumstance.

Unfortunately they are not so capable at propaganda and are adverse

[averse]

to the corruption necessary to succeed in politics in any case.

Well it's not unfortunate in your opinion since in your opinion you'd
"hate to live in that world".

Barry Jones probably did as well in politics as anybody with high
intelligence has ever done in this country, and he had little real
influence, even as president of the ALP. The game is stacked against them by
those morons already in power, and will remain so.

If morons can stack the game to keep non-morons out, then they aren't
morons. Nasty? Yes. Venal? Maybe. Moronic? Nope. QED

Fran

 

[Mr.T]

"Fran" <Fran.Beta@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:5e5c884a-14a9-4d3d-aa8b-7339fb349bb1@r15g2000prh.googlegroups.com...

Yes it's a pity you think those with a modicum of intelligence should
have
to spend their lives fighting "brain dead" politicians too.

Well unless they are relaxed about being controlled by brain-dead
uneducated morons, what choice do they have?

Put up with it, or risk going to jail starting a revolution perhaps?

Of course if people who
are not brain dead uneducated morons are relaxed about being
controlled by them,

So if one doesn't wish to become a politcician or start a revolution, it
automatically means you are "relaxed" about having your life controlled by a
stupid politician.
In fact I think it's the morons who only see things in terms of black &
white!

Would you actually prefer a world where all scientists for example went
into
politics instead? I'd hate to live in that world!

Well yes, but then I don't believe that most people or even most
politicians are "brain dead uneducated morons".

Not a term I coined, but not too far from the truth either.
Maybe "corrupt, greedy, illogical egomaniacs" would be MY definition.

If I did believe it
I'd see scientists getting involved in politics as a lesser evil
imposed by unfortunate circumstance.

No more computers and internet then, or almost any technology we currently
take for granted.

If morons can stack the game to keep non-morons out, then they aren't
morons. Nasty? Yes. Venal? Maybe. Moronic? Nope. QED

As I said, it wasn't my definition. But shit-house rats don't have to be all
that smart either, just cunning.
Maybe that's *your* idea of smart though.

MrT.

 

[Fran]

On Jan 21, 7:23 pm, "Mr.T" <MrT@home> wrote:

"Fran" <Fran.B...@gmail.com> wrote in message

news:5e5c884a-14a9-4d3d-aa8b-7339fb349bb1@r15g2000prh.googlegroups.com...

Yes it's a pity you think those with a modicum of intelligence should
have
to spend their lives fighting "brain dead" politicians too.
Well unless they are relaxed about being controlled by brain-dead
uneducated morons, what choice do they have?

Put up with it, or risk going to jail starting a revolution perhaps?

You don't see any other options? Really?

Of course if people who
are not brain dead uneducated morons are relaxed about being
controlled by them,

So if one doesn't wish to become a politician or start a revolution, it
automatically means you are "relaxed" about having your life controlled by a
stupid politician.

Fallacy: False dichotomy

The two aren't the only options.

In fact I think it's the morons who only see things in terms of black &
white!

This is where I point out that you conjured a false dichotomy and
invite you to show why you aren't hoist by your own petard.

Would you actually prefer a world where all scientists for example went
into
politics instead? I'd hate to live in that world!
Well yes, but then I don't believe that most people or even most
politicians are "brain dead uneducated morons".

Not a term I coined, but not too far from the truth either.

Really? Let's assume Mr Allison's description came from the viscera
rather than his head and it was no more than an extravagant piece of
rhetoric. What he really meant to say was that politicians and the
mass of the public were naive and undereducated. That's also not true.

Maybe "corrupt, greedy, illogical egomaniacs" would be MY definition.

And that's not like it either. You've substituted an entirely new
description.

If I did believe it
I'd see scientists getting involved in politics as a lesser evil
imposed by unfortunate circumstance.

No more computers and internet then, or almost any technology we currently
take for granted.

The price you pay for social failure.

If morons can stack the game to keep non-morons out, then they aren't
morons. Nasty? Yes. Venal? Maybe. Moronic? Nope. QED

As I said, it wasn't my definition. But shit-house rats don't have to be all
that smart either, just cunning.

Being cunning requires empathy -- the capacity to understand the
perspectives of others and the flaws that drive their preferences, the
resources that arfe ready to hand and what one can realistically
achieve with them.

Maybe that's *your* idea of smart though.

It's most people's idea of smart, which is a long way from honest.

The problem is that the terms "moron", "brain dead" and "uneducated"
are adduced as moral judgements because perceived lack of intelligence
and erudition is often seen as some sort of moral failure or statement
of diminished humanity. This is of course, utterly specious.

Fran

 

[Rod Speed]

Mr.T wrote

Fran <Fran.Beta@gmail.com> wrote

Yes it's a pity you think those with a modicum of intelligence should
have to spend their lives fighting "brain dead" politicians too.

Well unless they are relaxed about being controlled by
brain-dead uneducated morons, what choice do they have?

Put up with it, or risk going to jail starting a revolution perhaps?

Or just ensure that no politician gets any say what so ever on anything you do.

Of course if people who are not brain dead uneducated
morons are relaxed about being controlled by them,

So if one doesn't wish to become a politcician or start a revolution, it automatically
means you are "relaxed" about having your life controlled by a stupid politician.

No politician controls mine.

In fact I think it's the morons who only see things in terms of black & white!

Corse you dont do anything like that yourself, eh ?

Would you actually prefer a world where all scientists for
example went into politics instead? I'd hate to live in that world!

Well yes, but then I don't believe that most people or
even most politicians are "brain dead uneducated morons".

Not a term I coined, but not too far from the truth either.

Nothing like the truth, actually.

Maybe "corrupt, greedy, illogical egomaniacs" would be MY definition.

Corse thats nothing like black and white, eh ?

If I did believe it I'd see scientists getting involved in politics
as a lesser evil imposed by unfortunate circumstance.

No more computers and internet then, or almost
any technology we currently take for granted.

Mindlessly silly. That stuff happens regardless.

And hardly any of it is done by scientists anyway.

If morons can stack the game to keep non-morons out, then they
aren't morons. Nasty? Yes. Venal? Maybe. Moronic? Nope. QED

As I said, it wasn't my definition. But shit-house rats
don't have to be all that smart either, just cunning.

Corse thats nothing like black and white, eh ?

Maybe that's *your* idea of smart though.

Corse thats nothing like black and white, eh ?

 

[Eeyore]

Fran wrote:

The fact of the matter is that unlike incandescent bulbs, CFL bulbs
are typically made of a polymer, which is feasible because they don't
heat up. That's why they tend not to break if they are knocked or fall
onto carpet, and if they do they don't shatter.

Utter RUBBISH. I though you had more sense.

This only applies to EXPENSIVE CFLs that have a covering 'bulb' over the tube.
This also reduces their efficiency.

Note that the efficiency of CFLs is commonly misrepresented as FIVE times that of
incandescents. It is no such thing. The comparison is being made with Softone
(tm) bulbs instead of good old GLS types that most of us use. Compared to GLS,
CFL is only at best 4 x as efficient. Add the polymer outer and probably only 3 x
as good.

Defects are slow 'warm-up' time especially in cold conditions and short life
under short duration on/off conditions like the light in the loo or dunny if you
prefer.

Yes. I use them but intelligently. No-one should be FORCED to use them and the
general public don't understand they can't be dimmed either. This has already led
to several house fires. Luckily no-one has been killed by a CFL yet AFAIK but it
will only take time.

An Orwellian step too far IMHO.

Graham