Buying Greeenland

[bitrex]

On 8/29/19 8:28 PM, John Larkin wrote:

On Thu, 29 Aug 2019 20:04:17 -0400, bitrex <user@example.net> wrote:

On 8/29/19 5:29 PM, John Larkin wrote:

I don't see that. I see a guy who like many of us saw what Trump was from
the very beginning and tried to warn everyone. George Will just isn't
going to sell his soul to the orange clown, as sadly so many others have.
Funny thing, those that have, there is now a huge wake of them, left in
Trump's debris field, as he throws them under the bus. Yet, amazingly
there are plenty more willing to go do a deal with the devil.

It's becoming increasingly obviously that Trump isn't right in the head,
he's becoming more and more erratic, which should be a concern to all.
He's even done a full turn on Fox now, mad that even Fox presents things
that don't make him look good. Like they did a poll that showed him
losing to the Democrats. Trump thinks that it's Fox's job to bury that,
to lie, to make things up that make Trump look good.


What you are saying is that you don't respect the idea of democracy,
that different people have different opinions, and that we vote and
respect the outcome in a civilized manner.

So, flame on.


JL can't distinguish between the concepts of "respect" and "slavish
devotion" but I assure you they are different things.

I didn't vote for Clinton or Obama or Clinton or Trump. I do accept
that a lot of people did, and am willing to live peacefully under the
government that they selected. I can design electronics under Democrat
or Republican presidents. [1]

No slavish devotion, just respect for democracy and other peoples'
opinions.

If there were anything existentially "wrong" with not respecting other
people's opinions then engineers would have nothing to talk about

Individual humans are very different, roughly normally distributed.
It's not productive to divide 300 million people into two warring,
snarling, cursing tribes.


[1] but the corporate tax cut sure helps.

 

[John Larkin]

On Thu, 29 Aug 2019 20:04:17 -0400, bitrex <user@example.net> wrote:

On 8/29/19 5:29 PM, John Larkin wrote:

I don't see that. I see a guy who like many of us saw what Trump was from
the very beginning and tried to warn everyone. George Will just isn't
going to sell his soul to the orange clown, as sadly so many others have.
Funny thing, those that have, there is now a huge wake of them, left in
Trump's debris field, as he throws them under the bus. Yet, amazingly
there are plenty more willing to go do a deal with the devil.

It's becoming increasingly obviously that Trump isn't right in the head,
he's becoming more and more erratic, which should be a concern to all.
He's even done a full turn on Fox now, mad that even Fox presents things
that don't make him look good. Like they did a poll that showed him
losing to the Democrats. Trump thinks that it's Fox's job to bury that,
to lie, to make things up that make Trump look good.


What you are saying is that you don't respect the idea of democracy,
that different people have different opinions, and that we vote and
respect the outcome in a civilized manner.

So, flame on.


JL can't distinguish between the concepts of "respect" and "slavish
devotion" but I assure you they are different things.

I didn't vote for Clinton or Obama or Clinton or Trump. I do accept
that a lot of people did, and am willing to live peacefully under the
government that they selected. I can design electronics under Democrat
or Republican presidents. [1]

No slavish devotion, just respect for democracy and other peoples'
opinions.

Individual humans are very different, roughly normally distributed.
It's not productive to divide 300 million people into two warring,
snarling, cursing tribes.


[1] but the corporate tax cut sure helps.

 

[bitrex]

On 8/29/19 4:19 PM, Michael Terrell wrote:

In some areas of science and engineering, rightness is mathematically
provable. In more complex and chaotic systems, the interesting cases,
it's not, but that doesn't stop people from thinking they are right.
Quite the opposite. Belief becomes tribal when not corrected by
experiment.

I used to really appreciate George Will, but I fear he has become
another victim of Washington institutional capture.

If the Liberals controlled everything for very long, the farmers would be bankrupt. Then the Liberals would have to learn to grow their own food, or die.

this group has a lot of lifelong academics and multi-degreed
white-collar nerds pretending like they're long-suffering down-home Real
America working-class heroes too, that farmers and truck drivers and
auto repair workers would actually like and respect vs. just treat
superficially nice because they've got money.

 

[John Larkin]

On Thu, 29 Aug 2019 23:26:45 +0100, Tom Gardner
<spamjunk@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:

On 29/08/19 22:29, John Larkin wrote:
On Thu, 29 Aug 2019 13:47:26 -0700 (PDT), Whoey Louie
trader4@optonline.net> wrote:

On Thursday, August 29, 2019 at 1:36:47 PM UTC-4, John Larkin wrote:
On Wed, 28 Aug 2019 17:44:54 -0700 (PDT), Whoey Louie
trader4@optonline.net> wrote:

On Wednesday, August 28, 2019 at 7:44:07 PM UTC-4, bitrex wrote:
On 8/28/19 7:31 PM, Whoey Louie wrote:
On Wednesday, August 28, 2019 at 2:09:21 PM UTC-4, bitrex wrote:
On 8/28/19 1:44 PM, Whoey Louie wrote:
On Wednesday, August 28, 2019 at 1:16:59 PM UTC-4, amdx wrote:
That would be great! We could send all asylum seekers there until they
get their court date,
rather then release them into the states never to be seen again. Great
idea Trump. \

Mikek



You get your news via Pony Express or similar? Been in a coma?




trumpets think that if they say "great idea Trump" enough they might get
an invitation at kneeling down and kissing his wrinkly orange butt. What
an honor!

It's simply stunning how Trump hijacked the Republican Party and robbed
it of all it's principles, morality and it's policies. He tells
one lie after another, says stupid or horrible things, and they cheer him
on.

Lol but the Republican party has been 85% cowardly do-as-I-say-not-as-I
do hypocritical I'm-against-"handouts"-for-everybody-but-me racist
slimeballs for 50 years, probably.

Trump didn't "hijack" anything Trump was the guy American Republicans
always wanted for long time.

Maybe so, we;ll see how it ultimately turns out for them. I warned
everyone I could about Trump when there were 15 other candidates that
were decent and sane, but the trumpets had to have Trump. I thought
that when he leveled that vile insult at McCain and they followed up
by disparaging all POWs, 'I prefer the ones that were not captured".
that it would be the end of him. That happened early on in the
primary campaign, right after he announced. If anything, it just
propelled him on. That's when I knew something very strange and very
bad was happening.





It's why he succeeded while Mitt Romney fell flat on his face can you
imagine Mitt ever saying he liked to grab some pussy from time to time?
oooh yeah Mitt, grab me by the pussy Mitt...oh you so sexaaay.

It's why John McCain failed, Republicans think he was a moron for going
to Viet Nam and getting his ass shot down and being a huge
embarrassment, he should have stayed home dodged the draft and
paaaaaaaaartay!


If that's true, it's rather odd that the Republicans picked both of those
men to be their presidential candidate. George Will recently said that
what Trump has done is worse than Nixon. He said Nixon did his dirty deeds
in secret, he hid them and when they were exposed, it brought him down.
Trump does his lying, insulting, vilifying, dividing, openly and brazenly.
And that will be much harder to get over, he's normalized the despicable.



The question to me is, do the Trump haters respect the concept of
citizens electing their leaders, or do they think that they are always
right and the flyover hicks are wrong?

That obviously will differ among all the people who dislike and don't
approve of Trump.



In some areas of science and engineering, rightness is mathematically
provable. In more complex and chaotic systems, the interesting cases,
it's not, but that doesn't stop people from thinking they are right.
Quite the opposite. Belief becomes tribal when not corrected by
experiment.

I used to really appreciate George Will, but I fear he has become
another victim of Washington institutional capture.

I don't see that. I see a guy who like many of us saw what Trump was from
the very beginning and tried to warn everyone. George Will just isn't
going to sell his soul to the orange clown, as sadly so many others have.
Funny thing, those that have, there is now a huge wake of them, left in
Trump's debris field, as he throws them under the bus. Yet, amazingly
there are plenty more willing to go do a deal with the devil.

It's becoming increasingly obviously that Trump isn't right in the head,
he's becoming more and more erratic, which should be a concern to all.
He's even done a full turn on Fox now, mad that even Fox presents things
that don't make him look good. Like they did a poll that showed him
losing to the Democrats. Trump thinks that it's Fox's job to bury that,
to lie, to make things up that make Trump look good.


What you are saying is that you don't respect the idea of democracy,
that different people have different opinions, and that we vote and
respect the outcome in a civilized manner.

That should be a two way street. Once elected, the
office holder should respect the opinions of those
that did not vote for him.

I'm speaking from a country which, until last week,
was a representative democracy, but now is a elected
dictatorship - just like Putin's Russia.

Yes, our PM has just told my elected representative
to fuck off and come back when it is too late to
represent the opinion of those that elected him.

A parlimentary system seems totally chaotic to me.

We have a full-time, four year President until the scheduled instant
that we swear in the next one. And he can't call for early elections
or dissolve Congress or any of that confusing stuff.

The dynamics of the US system seems to settle down to two dominant
parties.

 

[bitrex]

On 8/29/19 4:19 PM, Michael Terrell wrote:

The question to me is, do the Trump haters respect the concept of
citizens electing their leaders, or do they think that they are always
right and the flyover hicks are wrong?

In some areas of science and engineering, rightness is mathematically
provable. In more complex and chaotic systems, the interesting cases,
it's not, but that doesn't stop people from thinking they are right.
Quite the opposite. Belief becomes tribal when not corrected by
experiment.

I used to really appreciate George Will, but I fear he has become
another victim of Washington institutional capture.

If the Liberals controlled everything for very long, the farmers would be bankrupt. Then the Liberals would have to learn to grow their own food, or die.

You've never heard of a liberal who knows how to grow their own food?
The "leftist" small arts college I went to had a whole fuckin' farm
right on campus with livestock pigs goats chickens llamas cows and
everything. How much time on the farm do they require for an electrical
engineering degree?

 

[bitrex]

On 8/29/19 5:29 PM, John Larkin wrote:

I don't see that. I see a guy who like many of us saw what Trump was from
the very beginning and tried to warn everyone. George Will just isn't
going to sell his soul to the orange clown, as sadly so many others have.
Funny thing, those that have, there is now a huge wake of them, left in
Trump's debris field, as he throws them under the bus. Yet, amazingly
there are plenty more willing to go do a deal with the devil.

It's becoming increasingly obviously that Trump isn't right in the head,
he's becoming more and more erratic, which should be a concern to all.
He's even done a full turn on Fox now, mad that even Fox presents things
that don't make him look good. Like they did a poll that showed him
losing to the Democrats. Trump thinks that it's Fox's job to bury that,
to lie, to make things up that make Trump look good.


What you are saying is that you don't respect the idea of democracy,
that different people have different opinions, and that we vote and
respect the outcome in a civilized manner.

So, flame on.

JL can't distinguish between the concepts of "respect" and "slavish
devotion" but I assure you they are different things.

 

[bitrex]

On 8/29/19 5:29 PM, John Larkin wrote:

I don't see that. I see a guy who like many of us saw what Trump was from
the very beginning and tried to warn everyone. George Will just isn't
going to sell his soul to the orange clown, as sadly so many others have.
Funny thing, those that have, there is now a huge wake of them, left in
Trump's debris field, as he throws them under the bus. Yet, amazingly
there are plenty more willing to go do a deal with the devil.

It's becoming increasingly obviously that Trump isn't right in the head,
he's becoming more and more erratic, which should be a concern to all.
He's even done a full turn on Fox now, mad that even Fox presents things
that don't make him look good. Like they did a poll that showed him
losing to the Democrats. Trump thinks that it's Fox's job to bury that,
to lie, to make things up that make Trump look good.


What you are saying is that you don't respect the idea of democracy,
that different people have different opinions, and that we vote and
respect the outcome in a civilized manner.

So, flame on.

I respect the _process_ of democracy, and the _office_ of the Presidency.

Anything or anyone else is case-by-case basis.

 

[Rick C]

On Thursday, August 29, 2019 at 10:24:39 AM UTC-4, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:

On Thu, 29 Aug 2019 07:51:57 +0100, Tom Gardner
spamjunk@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:

On 29/08/19 01:02, John Larkin wrote:
On Wed, 28 Aug 2019 12:17:00 -0500, amdx <nojunk@knology.net> wrote:

That would be great! We could send all asylum seekers there until they
get their court date,
rather then release them into the states never to be seen again. Great
idea Trump. \

Mikek

Why are all these posters getting their panties twisted over things
that they have no influence on, when they could be designing
electronics?

Let's hope *you* don't fall into that trap again!

I'm interested in system dynamics, some social and economic systems
included. But I post about things, and dispute points of fact.

But right now you are just trashing with an off topic post in a thread about Greenland.

The group-killers engage in endless rounds of profanity and lame
insults.

My house guest just sat down at his laptop next to me. He is a serious
microwave and acoustics designer and educator. He won't post to s.e.d.

So? It would be a lot better here if you didn't post all your personal and political crap. It is just so ironic that you complain of off topic posting when you are near the top of the list in that regard.

So why don't you join your friend and stop posting here until you have something worthwhile to post?

--

Rick C.

+ Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
+ Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209

 

[Bill Sloman]

On Friday, August 30, 2019 at 7:29:21 AM UTC+10, John Larkin wrote:

On Thu, 29 Aug 2019 13:47:26 -0700 (PDT), Whoey Louie
trader4@optonline.net> wrote:
On Thursday, August 29, 2019 at 1:36:47 PM UTC-4, John Larkin wrote:
On Wed, 28 Aug 2019 17:44:54 -0700 (PDT), Whoey Louie
trader4@optonline.net> wrote:
On Wednesday, August 28, 2019 at 7:44:07 PM UTC-4, bitrex wrote:
On 8/28/19 7:31 PM, Whoey Louie wrote:
On Wednesday, August 28, 2019 at 2:09:21 PM UTC-4, bitrex wrote:
On 8/28/19 1:44 PM, Whoey Louie wrote:
On Wednesday, August 28, 2019 at 1:16:59 PM UTC-4, amdx wrote:

<snip>

It's becoming increasingly obviously that Trump isn't right in the head,
he's becoming more and more erratic, which should be a concern to all.
He's even done a full turn on Fox now, mad that even Fox presents things
that don't make him look good. Like they did a poll that showed him
losing to the Democrats. Trump thinks that it's Fox's job to bury that,
to lie, to make things up that make Trump look good.

What you are saying is that you don't respect the idea of democracy,
that different people have different opinions, and that we vote and
respect the outcome in a civilized manner.

The proposition that Trump isn't entirely sane has nothing to do with democracy.

The process that got Trump elected over-represented the votes of people in the smaller states, which isn't democratic.

The fact that Trump's eccentricities have become more florid since he came to power hasn't got anything to do with democracy. The outcome was pretty disreputable from the start, and there's nothing civilised about ignoring the increasingly bizarre antic of a dangerous buffoon.

> So, flame on.

John Larkin posts an illogical flame, and complains that the post he was reacting to was a flame. Bitrex's lack of respect for a regrettably disreputable elected president doesn't constitute any kind of flame - John Larkin may not like it but that doesn't make it a flame.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

 

[bitrex]

On 8/29/19 10:17 AM, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:

On Wed, 28 Aug 2019 20:44:39 -0400, bitrex <user@example.net> wrote:

On 8/28/19 8:02 PM, John Larkin wrote:
On Wed, 28 Aug 2019 12:17:00 -0500, amdx <nojunk@knology.net> wrote:

That would be great! We could send all asylum seekers there until they
get their court date,
rather then release them into the states never to be seen again. Great
idea Trump. \

Mikek

Why are all these posters getting their panties twisted over things
that they have no influence on, when they could be designing
electronics?


Yo yo yo, they call me the panty-twister, the pussy-grabber,
I'm an Ohms Law bone-saw tight flow Mister Transistor with tight game
for fly sisters to nab her

And these posters be posers disrespect the solder-slinger soldiers,
but they be Cabbage Patch kid-holders,
Math class dozers,
Face card flop-folders,


Usenet destroyers.

that was September '93 I didn't have a computer yet. or a driver's license

 

[Rick C]

On Thursday, August 29, 2019 at 1:09:41 PM UTC-4, Whoey Louie wrote:

On Thursday, August 29, 2019 at 1:04:14 PM UTC-4, bloggs.fre...@gmail.com wrote:

The so-called "popular vote" is a post election statistic of accident. There is no national popular vote, the general election is comprised of a bunch of individual elections at the state, district and territory level. The idea the idiot won the popular vote is therefore a fraud for several reasons. The first is there was only 60% turn-out in the 2016 election, which means a very high degree of potential variability in results, and the second is the people would have voted far differently if the outcome was to be determined by a national popular vote. It would have been a completely different election iow.



That is a very good point, that the election was conducted under the existing
rules. We don't know what the vote would have been if it was a vote based
on the popular vote and in any close election, obviously that matters.

Why do you think the vote would have been different if the selection had been by popular vote? I suppose the campaigning would have been different. But that simply means instead of focusing on a handful of swing states, the entire country would have been included as "target audiences" rather than the few in the larger states with a close vote.

I know conservatives like to put down anyone they can any time they can. But do you really believe this is the right way to select a President, but concentrating the election on about 10 swing states? Shouldn't everyone in the country have an equally important vote?

To me it's not about losing or winning an election. I believe it is only right to let the entire population have as much say in who is the next President as anyone else in the country. But then, I guess I'm an idealist and too many people have their own interests at stake to allow everyone a fair shake.

--

Rick C.

-- Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
-- Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209

 

[bitrex]

On 8/29/19 10:20 AM, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:

On Wed, 28 Aug 2019 19:51:53 -0500, amdx <nojunk@knology.net> wrote:

On 8/28/2019 7:02 PM, John Larkin wrote:
On Wed, 28 Aug 2019 12:17:00 -0500, amdx <nojunk@knology.net> wrote:

That would be great! We could send all asylum seekers there until they
get their court date,
rather then release them into the states never to be seen again. Great
idea Trump. \

Mikek

Why are all these posters getting their panties twisted over things
that they have no influence on, when they could be designing
electronics?

John, the schematics you post are beautiful with good contrast and all
pertinent information.
I was just having some fun when I put to things in the news together,
then bitrex went ballistic.
Spitting, sputtering and drooling cause he lost the election.

Johm, I wish I had what it takes to design electronics, I don't, so
I'm here trying pick all y'alls brains for info to do any project I'm on.
But I'm having fun, so it's all good.

Mikek

The big, hundred-post threads are idiotic flame wars, and I know
really good people who won't post here because it is as bad and
ritually-mindless as twitter.

I guess all unmoderated public forums have the same fate.

Usenet was a tumbleweed-filled wasteland by the time I found it. I had
to consult the historical archive to find out what had happened. The
ancients had done something. Something horrible.

 

[Rick C]

On Thursday, August 29, 2019 at 5:29:21 PM UTC-4, John Larkin wrote:

On Thu, 29 Aug 2019 13:47:26 -0700 (PDT), Whoey Louie
trader4@optonline.net> wrote:

On Thursday, August 29, 2019 at 1:36:47 PM UTC-4, John Larkin wrote:
On Wed, 28 Aug 2019 17:44:54 -0700 (PDT), Whoey Louie
trader4@optonline.net> wrote:

On Wednesday, August 28, 2019 at 7:44:07 PM UTC-4, bitrex wrote:
On 8/28/19 7:31 PM, Whoey Louie wrote:
On Wednesday, August 28, 2019 at 2:09:21 PM UTC-4, bitrex wrote:
On 8/28/19 1:44 PM, Whoey Louie wrote:
On Wednesday, August 28, 2019 at 1:16:59 PM UTC-4, amdx wrote:
That would be great! We could send all asylum seekers there until they
get their court date,
rather then release them into the states never to be seen again. Great
idea Trump. \

Mikek



You get your news via Pony Express or similar? Been in a coma?




trumpets think that if they say "great idea Trump" enough they might get
an invitation at kneeling down and kissing his wrinkly orange butt. What
an honor!

It's simply stunning how Trump hijacked the Republican Party and robbed
it of all it's principles, morality and it's policies. He tells
one lie after another, says stupid or horrible things, and they cheer him
on.

Lol but the Republican party has been 85% cowardly do-as-I-say-not-as-I
do hypocritical I'm-against-"handouts"-for-everybody-but-me racist
slimeballs for 50 years, probably.

Trump didn't "hijack" anything Trump was the guy American Republicans
always wanted for long time.

Maybe so, we;ll see how it ultimately turns out for them. I warned
everyone I could about Trump when there were 15 other candidates that
were decent and sane, but the trumpets had to have Trump. I thought
that when he leveled that vile insult at McCain and they followed up
by disparaging all POWs, 'I prefer the ones that were not captured".
that it would be the end of him. That happened early on in the
primary campaign, right after he announced. If anything, it just
propelled him on. That's when I knew something very strange and very
bad was happening.





It's why he succeeded while Mitt Romney fell flat on his face can you
imagine Mitt ever saying he liked to grab some pussy from time to time?
oooh yeah Mitt, grab me by the pussy Mitt...oh you so sexaaay.

It's why John McCain failed, Republicans think he was a moron for going
to Viet Nam and getting his ass shot down and being a huge
embarrassment, he should have stayed home dodged the draft and
paaaaaaaaartay!


If that's true, it's rather odd that the Republicans picked both of those
men to be their presidential candidate. George Will recently said that
what Trump has done is worse than Nixon. He said Nixon did his dirty deeds
in secret, he hid them and when they were exposed, it brought him down.
Trump does his lying, insulting, vilifying, dividing, openly and brazenly.
And that will be much harder to get over, he's normalized the despicable.



The question to me is, do the Trump haters respect the concept of
citizens electing their leaders, or do they think that they are always
right and the flyover hicks are wrong?

That obviously will differ among all the people who dislike and don't
approve of Trump.



In some areas of science and engineering, rightness is mathematically
provable. In more complex and chaotic systems, the interesting cases,
it's not, but that doesn't stop people from thinking they are right.
Quite the opposite. Belief becomes tribal when not corrected by
experiment.

I used to really appreciate George Will, but I fear he has become
another victim of Washington institutional capture.

I don't see that. I see a guy who like many of us saw what Trump was from
the very beginning and tried to warn everyone. George Will just isn't
going to sell his soul to the orange clown, as sadly so many others have..
Funny thing, those that have, there is now a huge wake of them, left in
Trump's debris field, as he throws them under the bus. Yet, amazingly
there are plenty more willing to go do a deal with the devil.

It's becoming increasingly obviously that Trump isn't right in the head,
he's becoming more and more erratic, which should be a concern to all.
He's even done a full turn on Fox now, mad that even Fox presents things
that don't make him look good. Like they did a poll that showed him
losing to the Democrats. Trump thinks that it's Fox's job to bury that,
to lie, to make things up that make Trump look good.


What you are saying is that you don't respect the idea of democracy,
that different people have different opinions, and that we vote and
respect the outcome in a civilized manner.

No, that's not what he said. The fact that someone doesn't agree with you doesn't mean they don't respect the process by which we elect people.

I am the guy who doesn't respect the electoral college and am hoping it will be an irrelevance by the next Presidential election. The National Popular Vote Interstate Compact has a chance of being in force by the next election. Of course someone will try to challenge it in court saying it's not right that each state determines how the electors are chosen even though that is exactly how it is done now in accordance with the Constitution.

Article II, Section 1, Clause 2.
"Each State shall appoint, in such Manner as the Legislature thereof may direct, a Number of Electors"

--

Rick C.

-+ Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
-+ Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209

 

[Bill Sloman]

On Friday, August 30, 2019 at 10:18:44 AM UTC+10, John Larkin wrote:

On Thu, 29 Aug 2019 23:26:45 +0100, Tom Gardner
spamjunk@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:

On 29/08/19 22:29, John Larkin wrote:
On Thu, 29 Aug 2019 13:47:26 -0700 (PDT), Whoey Louie
trader4@optonline.net> wrote:

On Thursday, August 29, 2019 at 1:36:47 PM UTC-4, John Larkin wrote:
On Wed, 28 Aug 2019 17:44:54 -0700 (PDT), Whoey Louie
trader4@optonline.net> wrote:

On Wednesday, August 28, 2019 at 7:44:07 PM UTC-4, bitrex wrote:
On 8/28/19 7:31 PM, Whoey Louie wrote:
On Wednesday, August 28, 2019 at 2:09:21 PM UTC-4, bitrex wrote:
On 8/28/19 1:44 PM, Whoey Louie wrote:
On Wednesday, August 28, 2019 at 1:16:59 PM UTC-4, amdx wrote:

<snip>

I'm speaking from a country which, until last week,
was a representative democracy, but now is a elected
dictatorship - just like Putin's Russia.

Yes, our PM has just told my elected representative
to fuck off and come back when it is too late to
represent the opinion of those that elected him.

A parliamentary system seems totally chaotic to me.

Lots of things seem totally chaotic to John Larkin. He does have a problem with the term chaos, for a start.

We have a full-time, four year President until the scheduled instant
that we swear in the next one. And he can't call for early elections
or dissolve Congress or any of that confusing stuff.

You did impeach Nixon, which prompted him to resign. There's nothing magical about four years, and every other advanced industrial country has mechanisms for changing the administration when something has visibly gone wrong.

Flexibility may confuse the simple-minded but reality doesn't organise itself in four year chunks.

The dynamics of the US system seems to settle down to two dominant
parties.

The rich and the very rich. It's a feature of countries that go in for single member electorates - each electoral district is very likely to end up with a representative who is a member of one of the two biggest parties.

Proportional representation gives you multi-party democracy, and coalition governments. I've lived in countries with both systems, and coalition governments seem to work a good deal better.

You should try it. The system you've got was innovative when it was first adopted, but early adopters do need to move on as the technology matures.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

 

[Bill Sloman]

On Friday, August 30, 2019 at 10:28:24 AM UTC+10, John Larkin wrote:

On Thu, 29 Aug 2019 20:04:17 -0400, bitrex <user@example.net> wrote:

On 8/29/19 5:29 PM, John Larkin wrote:

I don't see that. I see a guy who like many of us saw what Trump was from
the very beginning and tried to warn everyone. George Will just isn't
going to sell his soul to the orange clown, as sadly so many others have.
Funny thing, those that have, there is now a huge wake of them, left in
Trump's debris field, as he throws them under the bus. Yet, amazingly
there are plenty more willing to go do a deal with the devil.

It's becoming increasingly obviously that Trump isn't right in the head,
he's becoming more and more erratic, which should be a concern to all..
He's even done a full turn on Fox now, mad that even Fox presents things
that don't make him look good. Like they did a poll that showed him
losing to the Democrats. Trump thinks that it's Fox's job to bury that,
to lie, to make things up that make Trump look good.


What you are saying is that you don't respect the idea of democracy,
that different people have different opinions, and that we vote and
respect the outcome in a civilized manner.

So, flame on.


JL can't distinguish between the concepts of "respect" and "slavish
devotion" but I assure you they are different things.

I didn't vote for Clinton or Obama or Clinton or Trump.

John Larkin doesn't seem to vote at all. Granting his level of political sophistication, this is probably the right choice for him and his electorate.

> I do accept that a lot of people did, and am willing to live peacefully under the government that they selected.

When Trump lost the popular vote by a margin of some three million votes, the proposition that the country as a whole "selected" Trump is a trifle dubious.

It's probably not worth starting a revolution to correct, but a movement for electoral reform does seem overdue.

> I can design electronics under Democrat or Republican presidents. [1]

Bearing in mind that John Larkin's idea of the design process looks more like other people's idea of tinkering with stuff until it more or less works.

Tearing up dubious solutions and starting over is a necessary part of the design process. The fact that that this doesn't happen in Darwinian evolution is one of the reasons for rejecting "intelligent design".

No slavish devotion, just respect for democracy and other peoples'
opinions.

Some peoples' opinions are too ill-founded to deserve any respect. Trader4 does come to mind, but John Larkin's faith in Anthony Watts denialist propaganda is another obvious example.

And, as James Arthur is prone to point out, the US isn't a democracy.

Individual humans are very different, roughly normally distributed.
It's not productive to divide 300 million people into two warring,
snarling, cursing tribes.

That's why proportional representation, multi-party democracy and coalition government is a whole lot better. There's quite a lot of snarling and cursing on the hustings, but inter-party negotiations within a coalition tend to be a lot more civilised and constructive.

> [1] but the corporate tax cut sure helps.

In the short term. Trump isn't a long-term kind of guy, and what he gave with the corporate tax cut, he's taking away with his trade wars.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

 

[bitrex]

On 8/29/19 5:08 PM, Lasse Langwadt Christensen wrote:

torsdag den 29. august 2019 kl. 19.11.47 UTC+2 skrev bloggs.fre...@gmail.com:
On Wednesday, August 28, 2019 at 1:16:59 PM UTC-4, amdx wrote:
That would be great! We could send all asylum seekers there until they
get their court date,
rather then release them into the states never to be seen again. Great
idea Trump. \

Mikek


Greenland is Denmark's Pine Ridge Indian Reservation with 70% of the population, who are mostly Inuit, living in poverty, unemployment and alcoholism. The place is a wasteland and human dump. Of course things may change when the deep snow melts and better roads can be built to allow access to the purported very large reserves of precious metals there. And, as with Alaska, the government will buy off the Indians with some small annual stipend while their land gets permanently trashed.

The aid to Greenland each year from the Danish state is roughly $600million (about $12000 per greenlander)

revenue from natural resources will be shared equally between Denmark and Greenland

Hope it works out better than Denmark's 1940 "revenue-sharing" agreement
with Germany lol

 

[Tom Gardner]

On 30/08/19 01:18, John Larkin wrote:

On Thu, 29 Aug 2019 23:26:45 +0100, Tom Gardner
spamjunk@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:

On 29/08/19 22:29, John Larkin wrote:
On Thu, 29 Aug 2019 13:47:26 -0700 (PDT), Whoey Louie
trader4@optonline.net> wrote:

On Thursday, August 29, 2019 at 1:36:47 PM UTC-4, John Larkin wrote:
On Wed, 28 Aug 2019 17:44:54 -0700 (PDT), Whoey Louie
trader4@optonline.net> wrote:

On Wednesday, August 28, 2019 at 7:44:07 PM UTC-4, bitrex wrote:
On 8/28/19 7:31 PM, Whoey Louie wrote:
On Wednesday, August 28, 2019 at 2:09:21 PM UTC-4, bitrex wrote:
On 8/28/19 1:44 PM, Whoey Louie wrote:
On Wednesday, August 28, 2019 at 1:16:59 PM UTC-4, amdx wrote:
That would be great! We could send all asylum seekers there until they
get their court date,
rather then release them into the states never to be seen again. Great
idea Trump. \

Mikek



You get your news via Pony Express or similar? Been in a coma?




trumpets think that if they say "great idea Trump" enough they might get
an invitation at kneeling down and kissing his wrinkly orange butt. What
an honor!

It's simply stunning how Trump hijacked the Republican Party and robbed
it of all it's principles, morality and it's policies. He tells
one lie after another, says stupid or horrible things, and they cheer him
on.

Lol but the Republican party has been 85% cowardly do-as-I-say-not-as-I
do hypocritical I'm-against-"handouts"-for-everybody-but-me racist
slimeballs for 50 years, probably.

Trump didn't "hijack" anything Trump was the guy American Republicans
always wanted for long time.

Maybe so, we;ll see how it ultimately turns out for them. I warned
everyone I could about Trump when there were 15 other candidates that
were decent and sane, but the trumpets had to have Trump. I thought
that when he leveled that vile insult at McCain and they followed up
by disparaging all POWs, 'I prefer the ones that were not captured".
that it would be the end of him. That happened early on in the
primary campaign, right after he announced. If anything, it just
propelled him on. That's when I knew something very strange and very
bad was happening.





It's why he succeeded while Mitt Romney fell flat on his face can you
imagine Mitt ever saying he liked to grab some pussy from time to time?
oooh yeah Mitt, grab me by the pussy Mitt...oh you so sexaaay.

It's why John McCain failed, Republicans think he was a moron for going
to Viet Nam and getting his ass shot down and being a huge
embarrassment, he should have stayed home dodged the draft and
paaaaaaaaartay!


If that's true, it's rather odd that the Republicans picked both of those
men to be their presidential candidate. George Will recently said that
what Trump has done is worse than Nixon. He said Nixon did his dirty deeds
in secret, he hid them and when they were exposed, it brought him down.
Trump does his lying, insulting, vilifying, dividing, openly and brazenly.
And that will be much harder to get over, he's normalized the despicable.



The question to me is, do the Trump haters respect the concept of
citizens electing their leaders, or do they think that they are always
right and the flyover hicks are wrong?

That obviously will differ among all the people who dislike and don't
approve of Trump.



In some areas of science and engineering, rightness is mathematically
provable. In more complex and chaotic systems, the interesting cases,
it's not, but that doesn't stop people from thinking they are right.
Quite the opposite. Belief becomes tribal when not corrected by
experiment.

I used to really appreciate George Will, but I fear he has become
another victim of Washington institutional capture.

I don't see that. I see a guy who like many of us saw what Trump was from
the very beginning and tried to warn everyone. George Will just isn't
going to sell his soul to the orange clown, as sadly so many others have.
Funny thing, those that have, there is now a huge wake of them, left in
Trump's debris field, as he throws them under the bus. Yet, amazingly
there are plenty more willing to go do a deal with the devil.

It's becoming increasingly obviously that Trump isn't right in the head,
he's becoming more and more erratic, which should be a concern to all.
He's even done a full turn on Fox now, mad that even Fox presents things
that don't make him look good. Like they did a poll that showed him
losing to the Democrats. Trump thinks that it's Fox's job to bury that,
to lie, to make things up that make Trump look good.


What you are saying is that you don't respect the idea of democracy,
that different people have different opinions, and that we vote and
respect the outcome in a civilized manner.

That should be a two way street. Once elected, the
office holder should respect the opinions of those
that did not vote for him.

I'm speaking from a country which, until last week,
was a representative democracy, but now is a elected
dictatorship - just like Putin's Russia.

Yes, our PM has just told my elected representative
to fuck off and come back when it is too late to
represent the opinion of those that elected him.

A parlimentary system seems totally chaotic to me.

No more chaotic than the US system. Different, yes,
but not inherently more chaotic.

We have a full-time, four year President until the scheduled instant
that we swear in the next one. And he can't call for early elections
or dissolve Congress or any of that confusing stuff.

A key component of the current insane outrage is that
in 2011 the idiot Cameron introduced the "fixed term
parliaments act".

Normally when there is such dissention we would have
had a general election to resolve what is the /current/
will of the people and who they want to lead the
country.

Now that's impossible.

The dynamics of the US system seems to settle down to two dominant
parties.

Not entirely. The Rebublicans have their militant insurgency
called the Tea Party.

 

[whit3rd]

On Thursday, August 29, 2019 at 10:36:47 AM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:

> The question to me is, do the Trump haters respect the concept of...

Folk come to respect different things, because we're all individuals. We
have a certain measure of integrity, and cannot be forced into sameness.

In the words of another poster, you may be
"getting their panties twisted over things that they have no influence on"

 

[whit3rd]

On Wednesday, August 28, 2019 at 5:02:20 PM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:

Why are all these posters getting their panties twisted over things
that they have no influence on...

There's international law, the UN declarations of rights, and a variety
of influential countries that have democratic institutions; these
establish a principle of all persons having influence.

Influence is widespread; it's flatulence that (one hopes) is confined to only
a few. I'm not sure what the twisting panties metaphor is intended to convey...