Personal CD player a Horror

[TT]

"Richard Freeman" <bogoff@nospam.spam> wrote in message
news:343j1uF427h63U1@individual.net...

Of course it does not always follow that a Company that Recalls the most
products is the company with the Lesser quality product. An example is
..........

Regards
Richard Freeman

Mitsubishi Motors in Japan *failed* to recall a very large number of cars
there for brake defects and in the near future you will see some top execs
going to jail over it. The Japs are pretty dark on them at the moment.

Now I would like to raise a major point here. A *recall* is to prevent a
known problem from occurring and is usually a safety issue and a *failure*
is a breakdown in service. A manufacturer that does a *voluntary* recall
IMHO is a quality orientated organisation. If a manufacturer is *forced to
do a recall* by the government for safety reasons IMHO is a bit of a
scumbag.

Regards TT

 

[George Lakey]

QA is as pointed out in the previous thread

"It is not about making or developing a better product it is all about
consistency".

If something is designed to be crap, QA merely ensures it is crap (or
better)but no worse. In RARE occasions, QA can result in an improvement in
quality, however it is very definitely a "RARE" occasion.

Quality (as desribed by Maquarie Dictionary) : "characteristic, property or
attribute. Character with respect to excellence, fineness etc. Grade of
excellence, fine, poor
etc.........................................................................
....

The ISO standards are now highly sought after quals, especially when dealing
with Government contracts. The company, the individuals performing the work
and the QA process being used to assess the work must all adhere to th ISO
rules. In certain spheres it is Company, Personnel, Materiel, Process of
Manufacture (for example) and the QA regime that must adhere to the ISO
rulings.

I am not aware of any Oz audio manufacturer (however, I could be wrong)
building to an ISO prescribed schedule.

Regards,

George.

 

[Richard Freeman]

"TT" <swatter@geo.net.au> wrote in message
news:41dd20bb$0$21877$61ce578d@news.syd.swiftdsl.com.au...

"Richard Freeman" <bogoff@nospam.spam> wrote in message
news:343j1uF427h63U1@individual.net...

Of course it does not always follow that a Company that Recalls the
most
products is the company with the Lesser quality product. An example is
.........

Regards
Richard Freeman



Mitsubishi Motors in Japan *failed* to recall a very large number of cars
there for brake defects and in the near future you will see some top execs
going to jail over it. The Japs are pretty dark on them at the moment.

Now I would like to raise a major point here. A *recall* is to prevent a
known problem from occurring and is usually a safety issue and a *failure*
is a breakdown in service. A manufacturer that does a *voluntary* recall
IMHO is a quality orientated organisation. If a manufacturer is *forced to
do a recall* by the government for safety reasons IMHO is a bit of a
scumbag.

Yes that was essentially the point I was making with Fluke - since no-one
appears to have the clout to force Multimeter manufacturers to recall
product even for potentially dangerous defects the fact that Fluke do in
fact recall their meters indicates that they are more concerned with the
quality of their meters than other manufacturers. In other words the number
of recalls a manufacturer makes is not necessarily inversely proportional to
the quality of their product.

Regards
Richard Freeman

 

[robert casey]

Mitsubishi Motors in Japan *failed* to recall a very large number of cars
there for brake defects and in the near future you will see some top execs
going to jail over it. The Japs are pretty dark on them at the moment.

Seems that they wanted to avoid the embarrassment of doing a
recall, and figured that they could fix the brakes when the
owners brought their cars in for routine maintenance. Problem
is is that not everyone goes to the dealer to have routine
maintenance done....

 

[TT]

"robert casey" <wa2ise@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
news:H8jDd.2349$%e1.622@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...
:
: >
: > Mitsubishi Motors in Japan *failed* to recall a very
large number of cars
: > there for brake defects and in the near future you will
see some top execs
: > going to jail over it. The Japs are pretty dark on them
at the moment.
: >
:
:
: Seems that they wanted to avoid the embarrassment of doing
a
: recall, and figured that they could fix the brakes when
the
: owners brought their cars in for routine maintenance.
Problem
: is is that not everyone goes to the dealer to have routine
: maintenance done....

Killing your customers is frowned on in most societies these
days ;-)

If anyone is interested do a search on "Ralph Nader" and
Ford Pinto
http://www.fordpinto.com/blowup3.htm is a start

The Ford Motor Company actually made a conscious decision to
release a faulty car to the public and allow people to burn
to death in simple rear end accidents!

Regards TT

 

[TT]

"Richard Freeman" <bogoff@nospam.spam> wrote in message
news:345ruuF444aooU1@individual.net...
:
: "TT" <swatter@geo.net.au> wrote in message
: news:41dd20bb$0$21877$61ce578d@news.syd.swiftdsl.com.au...
: >
: > "Richard Freeman" <bogoff@nospam.spam> wrote in message
: > news:343j1uF427h63U1@individual.net...
: >
: > >> Of course it does not always follow that a Company
that Recalls the
: most
: > > products is the company with the Lesser quality
product. An example is
: > .........
: >
: > > Regards
: > > Richard Freeman
: > >
: > >
: >
: > Mitsubishi Motors in Japan *failed* to recall a very
large number of cars
: > there for brake defects and in the near future you will
see some top execs
: > going to jail over it. The Japs are pretty dark on them
at the moment.
: >
: > Now I would like to raise a major point here. A
*recall* is to prevent a
: > known problem from occurring and is usually a safety
issue and a *failure*
: > is a breakdown in service. A manufacturer that does a
*voluntary* recall
: > IMHO is a quality orientated organisation. If a
manufacturer is *forced to
: > do a recall* by the government for safety reasons IMHO
is a bit of a
: > scumbag.
:
: Yes that was essentially the point I was making with
Fluke - since no-one
: appears to have the clout to force Multimeter
manufacturers to recall
: product even for potentially dangerous defects the fact
that Fluke do in
: fact recall their meters indicates that they are more
concerned with the
: quality of their meters than other manufacturers. In other
words the number
: of recalls a manufacturer makes is not necessarily
inversely proportional to
: the quality of their product.
:
: Regards
: Richard Freeman
:
:

That is my belief as well. But there would be a point at
which you would have to say it was not. If your
car/multimeter/amp/knife was recalled weekly for running
modifications to get it to work properly your view would
then seriously change ;-)

The difference would be a good product that needed a slight
tweak to a pile of rubbish that they just can't get to work
as design intended.

BTW read my reply to Robert below reinto

Regards TT

 

[VS]

"Ian Mitchell" <Ian.Mitchell@citec.com.au> writes:

"TT" <swatter@geo.net.au> wrote in message
news:41dbdae5$0$21869$61ce578d@news.syd.swiftdsl.com.au...

There is more to the story. At full throttle it uses 500+lph of fuel and
has a 120l fuel tank so it runs out of fuel in 1/4hr. VW did a computer
simulated race between this and a little "Beep Beep" <1L shit box they
make
from Berlin to Paris on the Autobahns. The little shit box could do
around
120kph and the Bugatti 400kph+ the shit box won by a large margin.
Everytime the Bugatti got wound up to speed it had to stop for fuel and
the
little shitbox made it on a tank full. A bit like the Hare and the
Tortoise
story really.

Must have been using an Apple computer, the distance from Berlin to Paris
is only 879km driving the Bugatti at only a little less than full throttle
would require only 1 fuel stop. At 120kph the sh*t box will take approx 7.5
hrs to complete the journey. At (say) 300kph the Bugatti will do the trip
in approx 3hrs. It doesn't take 4.5hrs to fill a 120ltr tank.

As with all good computer simulator, I am sure they added all the
real-world variables and obstacles to it. Counting for that, the Bugatti
would probably run at full speed for less than a few minutes at a time,
braking like mad most of the time, flashing slow cars overtaking truck
convoys at a few kilometres distance for the slow coaches to move aside
before he's tailgating them.

And then they both get stuck in a traffic jam around <insert any larger
German city>. And this is all before they even get to the German-French
border. Once across the border, the speed limit on the freeway is
130kph. And toll booths, sight unseen on German Autobahns, are about
30-40k apart. ;-)

Leaving Berlin/ arriving to Paris bits left out, but those stretches of
the road certainly don't play in Bugatti's favour.

Now, if they ran a simulated race from let's say, Venice to Naples,
things would be much more interesting. German Autobahns are largely
overrated, thanks to no legal speed limits for large stretches. Italian
Autostrada makes for a much better 'racing ground', provided you do what
Italians generally do: stop for a lunch, a coffee or two, just so that
your time spent between entry and exit toll booths is generally in the
ballpark of 130kph travel time.

Saso

 

[Mr. T]

"TT" <swat@swat.com.au> wrote in message
news:41dde61b$0$21874$61ce578d@news.syd.swiftdsl.com.au...

Killing your customers is frowned on in most societies these
days ;-)

Not at all, the whole arms manufacturing industry is based on killing
people. And of course you want to supply both sides if posible.
Then there is the tobacco industry, the alchohol industry, etc. etc.
We did get rid of a couple like the asbestos industry, but many others have
taken their place.

MrT.

 

[roughplanet]

"TT" <swat@swat.com.au> wrote in message
news:41dde981$0$21877$61ce578d@news.syd.swiftdsl.com.au...

"Richard Freeman" <bogoff@nospam.spam> wrote in message
news:345ruuF444aooU1@individual.net...

"Richard Freeman" <bogoff@nospam.spam> wrote in message
news:343j1uF427h63U1@individual.net...

: > >> Of course it does not always follow that a Company
: > >> that Recalls the most products is the company with the
: > >> Lesser quality product. An example is

: > Mitsubishi Motors in Japan *failed* to recall a very large number of
cars
: > there for brake defects and in the near future you will see some top
: > execs going to jail over it. The Japs are pretty dark on them
: > at the moment.
: > Now I would like to raise a major point here. A *recall* is to prevent
a
: > known problem from occurring and is usually a safety issue and a
: > *failure* is a breakdown in service. A manufacturer that does a
: > *voluntary recall* IMHO is a quality orientated organisation. If a
: > manufacturer is *forced to do a recall* by the government for safety
: > reasons IMHO is a bit of a scumbag.

: Yes that was essentially the point I was making with Fluke - since
no-one
: appears to have the clout to force Multimeter manufacturers to recall
: product even for potentially dangerous defects the fact that Fluke do in
: fact recall their meters indicates that they are more concerned with the
: quality of their meters than other manufacturers. In other words the
: number of recalls a manufacturer makes is not necessarily inversely
: proportional to the quality of their product.

That is my belief as well. But there would be a point at which you would
have to say it was not. If your car/multimeter/amp/knife was recalled
weekly for running modifications to get it to work properly your view
would
then seriously change ;-)
The difference would be a good product that needed a slight tweak to a
pile
of rubbish that they just can't get to work as design intended.
BTW read my reply to Robert below reinto

Many years ago, I was consulting with a company who was a major new car
seller in Melbourne, the principal of which bought himself a new Roller,
despite the fact that he actually hated driving (???).
The car had 26 recalls in the first 12 months, many of which were
unannounced & attended to during normal servicing. But being in the trade,
he was aware of every one of them, and the first chance he got, the Roller
was sold, soon after someone keyed it whilst parked in the MCG Members car
park & the bill for the respray was almost $6000 (in 1973)!
Where does such an example fit in? 26 recalls certainly don't constitute 'a
slight tweak', nor was the Roller 'a pile of rubbish'. I drove it myself a
few times & it was without a doubt the smoothest, quietest car I have ever
been in. But 26 recallable items; sheesh! Even the Holdens the company was
selling managed only 4 recalls in a similar period. A case of the expensive
item not always being the best, and if judged on recalls per 12 month
period, the pits!

ruff

 

[Mr. T]

"roughplanet" <roughplanet@optushome.com.au> wrote in message
news:41de14f7$0$2529$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...

Where does such an example fit in? 26 recalls certainly don't constitute
'a
slight tweak', nor was the Roller 'a pile of rubbish'. I drove it myself a
few times & it was without a doubt the smoothest, quietest car I have ever
been in. But 26 recallable items; sheesh! Even the Holdens the company was
selling managed only 4 recalls in a similar period.

Not surprising, Holden don't recall unless absolutely necessary. They don't
even replace the real lemon's unless forced to.

A case of the expensive
item not always being the best, and if judged on recalls per 12 month
period, the pits!

But a very stupid way to judge quality. What you are saying is the crappier
the service backup provided by a manufacturer the better?

If they go out of business and therefore no recalls at all, does that make
them the best quality by far

MrT.

 

[TT]

"roughplanet" <roughplanet@optushome.com.au> wrote in
message
news:41de14f7$0$2529$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
: "TT" <swat@swat.com.au> wrote in message
: news:41dde981$0$21877$61ce578d@news.syd.swiftdsl.com.au...
:
: "Richard Freeman" <bogoff@nospam.spam> wrote in message
: news:345ruuF444aooU1@individual.net...
:
: "Richard Freeman" <bogoff@nospam.spam> wrote in message
: news:343j1uF427h63U1@individual.net...
:
: > : > >> Of course it does not always follow that a
Company
: > : > >> that Recalls the most products is the company
with the
: > : > >> Lesser quality product. An example is
:
: > : > Mitsubishi Motors in Japan *failed* to recall a very
large number of
: > cars
: > : > there for brake defects and in the near future you
will see some top
: > : > execs going to jail over it. The Japs are pretty
dark on them
: > : > at the moment.
: > : > Now I would like to raise a major point here. A
*recall* is to prevent
: > a
: > : > known problem from occurring and is usually a safety
issue and a
: > : > *failure* is a breakdown in service. A manufacturer
that does a
: > : > *voluntary recall* IMHO is a quality orientated
organisation. If a
: > : > manufacturer is *forced to do a recall* by the
government for safety
: > : > reasons IMHO is a bit of a scumbag.
:
: > : Yes that was essentially the point I was making with
Fluke - since
: > no-one
: > : appears to have the clout to force Multimeter
manufacturers to recall
: > : product even for potentially dangerous defects the
fact that Fluke do in
: > : fact recall their meters indicates that they are more
concerned with the
: > : quality of their meters than other manufacturers. In
other words the
: > : number of recalls a manufacturer makes is not
necessarily inversely
: > : proportional to the quality of their product.
:
: > That is my belief as well. But there would be a point
at which you would
: > have to say it was not. If your
car/multimeter/amp/knife was recalled
: > weekly for running modifications to get it to work
properly your view
: > would
: > then seriously change ;-)
: > The difference would be a good product that needed a
slight tweak to a
: > pile
: > of rubbish that they just can't get to work as design
intended.
: > BTW read my reply to Robert below reinto
:
: Many years ago, I was consulting with a company who was a
major new car
: seller in Melbourne, the principal of which bought himself
a new Roller,
: despite the fact that he actually hated driving (???).
: The car had 26 recalls in the first 12 months, many of
which were
: unannounced & attended to during normal servicing. But
being in the trade,
: he was aware of every one of them, and the first chance he
got, the Roller
: was sold, soon after someone keyed it whilst parked in the
MCG Members car
: park & the bill for the respray was almost $6000 (in
1973)!
: Where does such an example fit in? 26 recalls certainly
don't constitute 'a
: slight tweak', nor was the Roller 'a pile of rubbish'. I
drove it myself a
: few times & it was without a doubt the smoothest, quietest
car I have ever
: been in. But 26 recallable items; sheesh! Even the Holdens
the company was
: selling managed only 4 recalls in a similar period. A case
of the expensive
: item not always being the best, and if judged on recalls
per 12 month
: period, the pits!
:
: ruff
:
Were they actual re-calls or in service fixes? A recall is
a notification sent to the customer asking them to return
the vehicle to address a known fault. Hence it is
"Re-called".

An in service fix/upgrade is when the vehicle is returned
for normal servicing and an upgrade is performed and quite
often the customer does not know about it. These are
usually performed because it may save the car maker money in
warranty claims down the track. e.g I was working for a
Volvo dealer once and we had to remove all LH rear axles to
make sure they had been greased at the factory because some
had been missed. Mitsubishi Oz had a number of Magna 2.6L
engines made with the bottom half of #5 main crankshaft
bearing not fitted on the assembly line.

Regards Terry

 

[dmm]

On 4 Jan 2005 14:54:16 -0800, "Ayn Marx" <mdhjwh@iprimus.com.au> wrote:

V18 & 400KMH ? Where the hell are the roads that could take such a
thing?

Any side street....

 

[TT]

"Mr. T" <mrt@home> wrote in message
news:41de1abf$0$3844$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
:
: "roughplanet" <roughplanet@optushome.com.au> wrote in
message
: news:41de14f7$0$2529$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
: > Where does such an example fit in? 26 recalls certainly
don't constitute
: 'a
: > slight tweak', nor was the Roller 'a pile of rubbish'. I
drove it myself a
: > few times & it was without a doubt the smoothest,
quietest car I have ever
: > been in. But 26 recallable items; sheesh! Even the
Holdens the company was
: > selling managed only 4 recalls in a similar period.
:
: Not surprising, Holden don't recall unless absolutely
necessary. They don't
: even replace the real lemon's unless forced to.
:
: >A case of the expensive
: > item not always being the best, and if judged on recalls
per 12 month
: > period, the pits!
:
: But a very stupid way to judge quality. What you are
saying is the crappier
: the service backup provided by a manufacturer the better?
:
: If they go out of business and therefore no recalls at
all, does that make
: them the best quality by far
:
: MrT.
:
I firstly want to say that I do enjoy (mostly) discussing
things with you and I do find you more intelligent than
most. What I am becoming a little distressed with is your
increasing use of the word "stupid". You have now
levelled this accusation at Ruff now as well. Is this a
personal goal to work your way through the whole group or do
you actually have this superiority complex forming?

Make of this what you will it is not meant to be in anyway
vindictive, I am only pointing out pattern I see forming.

Regards TT

 

[roughplanet]

"Mr. T" <mrt@home> wrote in message
news:41de1abf$0$3844$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...

"roughplanet" <roughplanet@optushome.com.au> wrote in message
news:41de14f7$0$2529$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...

Where does such an example fit in? 26 recalls certainly don't constitute
'a slight tweak', nor was the Roller 'a pile of rubbish'. I drove it
myself a
few times & it was without a doubt the smoothest, quietest car I have
ever
been in. But 26 recallable items; sheesh! Even the Holdens the company
was selling managed only 4 recalls in a similar period.

Not surprising, Holden don't recall unless absolutely necessary. They
don't
even replace the real lemon's unless forced to.

A case of the expensive item not always being the best, and if judged on
recalls per 12 month period, the pits!

But a very stupid way to judge quality.

Not necessarily. Last year, the European 'Lemon of the Year' (VW no less)
was judged by a number of criteria, one of which was the number of factory
recalls. Obviously THESE recalls are serious enough for the company to not
just wait until the car is serviced, as not everyone takes their car to the
dealer from whom they bought it for servicing.

What you are saying is the crappier the service backup provided by a
manufacturer the better?

You seem to have a problem with the English language, or is it that you just
like to argue. Read my post again....all of it this time, and then try
answering the actual question, rather than just taking one point out of
context, and using it to tell me what you thought I said.

Where does such an example fit in? 26 recalls certainly don't constitute
'a
slight tweak', nor was the Roller 'a pile of rubbish'. I drove it myself
a
few times & it was without a doubt the smoothest, quietest car I have
ever >> been in. But 26 recallable items; sheesh! Even the Holdens the
company >> was selling managed only 4 recalls in a similar period. A case
of the
expensive item not always being the best, and if judged on recalls per 12
month period, the pits!

'....and IF judged on recalls per 12 month period' Got it? Next time, please
don't selectively edit my posts, nor try & allude to what you think I am
saying.
I said what I meant, so no need to second guess me, OK?

If they go out of business and therefore no recalls at all, does that make
them the best quality by far

I don't think that such stupidity really warrants an answer, do you?

ruff

 

[Mr. T]

"TT" <swat@swat.com.au> wrote in message
news:41de1c85$0$21872$61ce578d@news.syd.swiftdsl.com.au...

Were they actual re-calls or in service fixes? A recall is
a notification sent to the customer asking them to return
the vehicle to address a known fault. Hence it is
"Re-called".

An in service fix/upgrade is when the vehicle is returned
for normal servicing and an upgrade is performed and quite
often the customer does not know about it. These are
usually performed because it may save the car maker money in
warranty claims down the track. e.g I was working for a
Volvo dealer once and we had to remove all LH rear axles to
make sure they had been greased at the factory because some
had been missed. Mitsubishi Oz had a number of Magna 2.6L
engines made with the bottom half of #5 main crankshaft
bearing not fitted on the assembly line.

A good example of crappy behavior. BOTH should have been recalls. Any
customer not getting his service done by a dealer is screwed. A great way to
keep the dealers happy, but I would not want to buy from a company with such
a crappy attitude to major items. But unfortunately I often do without
knowing until too late :-(
I even got a recall for faulty window winders once though, not quite in the
same league as missing main bearings!

What we need is a web site with such information on who to avoid.
Notgoodenough.org is a start.

MrT.

 

[Mr. T]

"TT" <swat@swat.com.au> wrote in message
news:41de2654$0$21873$61ce578d@news.syd.swiftdsl.com.au...

I firstly want to say that I do enjoy (mostly) discussing
things with you and I do find you more intelligent than
most. What I am becoming a little distressed with is your
increasing use of the word "stupid". You have now
levelled this accusation at Ruff now as well. Is this a
personal goal to work your way through the whole group or do
you actually have this superiority complex forming?

My opinion is that certain actions that have been described were stupid. You
may or may not be totally stupid all the time, but I make no such
accusation!
If you are upset by the context in which I used the term, "a very stupid way
to judge quality", then you are more touchy than you accused me of being.

Make of this what you will it is not meant to be in anyway
vindictive, I am only pointing out pattern I see forming.

Well maybe you should adjust your pattern of "mistaken" behaviour
A smart person learns from his "silly" actions.

MrT.

 

[Mr. T]

"roughplanet" <roughplanet@optushome.com.au> wrote in message
news:41de2c87$0$25526$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...

Not necessarily. Last year, the European 'Lemon of the Year' (VW no less)
was judged by a number of criteria, one of which was the number of factory
recalls. Obviously THESE recalls are serious enough for the company to not
just wait until the car is serviced, as not everyone takes their car to
the
dealer from whom they bought it for servicing.

Exactly, and *I* would want to know if the main bearings were missing!
According to TT, Mitsubishi didn't think so.
This is **MUCH** more reprehensible IMO than recalling for faulty window
winders as happened to me once with Mazda.

You seem to have a problem with the English language, or is it that you
just
like to argue. Read my post again....all of it this time, and then try
answering the actual question, rather than just taking one point out of
context, and using it to tell me what you thought I said.

One of us certainly has a problem with English if you don't think that's one
implication of your argument.
Simply recall nothing no matter how bad, and you think that's better
"quality" than a company recalling minor faults. Is that really what you
mean, or would you like to re-word your whole statement?

'....and IF judged on recalls per 12 month period' Got it? Next time,
please
don't selectively edit my posts, nor try & allude to what you think I am
saying.

I only replied to the ACTUAL words you wrote. They are still NO better. The
whole thread is still on google if you are having trouble.

I said what I meant, so no need to second guess me, OK?

Where is the second guessing? I'm only replying to what you are still
writing. Care to put it in some other way instead?
Number of recalls alone does NOT indicate how serious they are, NOR how
serious faults from other manufacturers are, that are NOT recalled.
Every manufacturer plays a different game. GET IT?

If they go out of business and therefore no recalls at all, does that
make
them the best quality by far

I don't think that such stupidity really warrants an answer, do you?

It's the implication of what YOU wrote, and therefore YOUR stupidity.
(better be careful, TT doesn't like people using that term ;-)

MrT.

 

[paul packer]

On Fri, 7 Jan 2005 09:28:58 +0800, "TT" <swat@swat.com.au> wrote:

The Ford Motor Company actually made a conscious decision to
release a faulty car to the public and allow people to burn
to death in simple rear end accidents!

Regards TT

Well, Corporate America let people keep smoking for several decades. I
guess that's a case of letting people smoulder to death.

 

[paul packer]

On Fri, 7 Jan 2005 14:04:03 +0800, "TT" <swat@swat.com.au> wrote:

I firstly want to say that I do enjoy (mostly) discussing
things with you and I do find you more intelligent than
most. What I am becoming a little distressed with is your
increasing use of the word "stupid". You have now
levelled this accusation at Ruff now as well. Is this a
personal goal to work your way through the whole group or do
you actually have this superiority complex forming?

Make of this what you will it is not meant to be in anyway
vindictive, I am only pointing out pattern I see forming.

Regards TT

Second this. I too find Mr. T a satisfyingly intelligent responder,
but though I haven't yet been called "stupid" I find his rather
dismissive attitude and frequent "so what?" and "who cares?" unworthy
of his intellect. Hey, I've been called arrogant a few times so why
should I mind passing it on?

 

[TT]

"Mr. T" <mrt@home> wrote in message
news:41de4f9d$0$8698$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...

"TT" <swat@swat.com.au> wrote in message
news:41de1c85$0$21872$61ce578d@news.syd.swiftdsl.com.au...
Were they actual re-calls or in service fixes? A recall is
a notification sent to the customer asking them to return
the vehicle to address a known fault. Hence it is
"Re-called".

An in service fix/upgrade is when the vehicle is returned
for normal servicing and an upgrade is performed and quite
often the customer does not know about it. These are
usually performed because it may save the car maker money in
warranty claims down the track. e.g I was working for a
Volvo dealer once and we had to remove all LH rear axles to
make sure they had been greased at the factory because some
had been missed. Mitsubishi Oz had a number of Magna 2.6L
engines made with the bottom half of #5 main crankshaft
bearing not fitted on the assembly line.

A good example of crappy behavior. BOTH should have been recalls. Any
customer not getting his service done by a dealer is screwed. A great way
to
keep the dealers happy, but I would not want to buy from a company with
such
a crappy attitude to major items. But unfortunately I often do without
knowing until too late :-(
I even got a recall for faulty window winders once though, not quite in
the
same league as missing main bearings!

What we need is a web site with such information on who to avoid.
Notgoodenough.org is a start.

MrT.

The Yanks have these

http://www.consumeraffairs.com/recalls/arecalls_auto.htm

http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/problems/recalls//Index.cfm

http://www.autosafety.org/

I could keep going but I would only depress you. I have lost the site but
Congress has a site that has *ALL* service bulletins listed for all cars
sold in the US. This is something that Oz could take onboard.

Regards TT