OT: If Ukraine and Russia make peace, who keeps the Russian occupied land?...

[The Natural Philosopher]

On 11/09/2023 12:21, SteveW wrote:

On 10/09/2023 22:43, Cursitor Doom wrote:
On Sun, 10 Sep 2023 14:23:47 -0700, T <T@invalid.invalid> wrote:

On 9/10/23 13:44, Commander Kinsey wrote:
If Ukraine and Russia make peace, who keeps the Russian occupied land?

Who do you think?  Why is it that this kind
of propaganda is now being pushed?  And
why are you assisting the propaganda?

What propaganda is that? Even Henry Kissinger said there\'d have to be
some Ukraine territory given up for a peace deal and he said it some
time ago, too.

They already gave up Crimea the last time Russia invaded. That is more
than enough. They can\'t keep giving up land each time Russia invades -
it becomes a no-loss scenario for Russia then.

Russia has publicly stated it wants the USSR back, the whole eastern
bloc. Poland, Hungary, Latvia, Estonia, Lithuania, Montenegro, Hungary,
Romania, Albania, Bulgaria, Czech Republic, Slovakia, Slovenia, Serbia,
Bosnia. Herzegovina. East Germany . And it wouldn\'t mind Finland either.

Peace would consist in letting them have it. All of it.

Americans may find that an acceptable price. Not many Europeans do: They
have the T shirts.




--
There’s a mighty big difference between good, sound reasons and reasons
that sound good.

Burton Hillis (William Vaughn, American columnist)

 

[The Natural Philosopher]

On 11/09/2023 12:13, Colin Bignell wrote:

On 11/09/2023 03:36, rbowman wrote:
On Sun, 10 Sep 2023 15:59:56 -0700, T wrote:

On 9/10/23 15:45, Commander Kinsey wrote:
They can fight to the end for all I care, as long
as they stop taking our taxes without our permission
  to arm them.

And the next time you Brits want us to send our children to die to
protect you from the repercussions of some stupid thing you pull,
I remember your words.

Had the US sat out WWI arguably WWII would not have happened. Britain
took
a dog in the manger approach as the united Germany threatened to
become an
economic competitor. France joined in because they were still butt hurt
after trying to put on their big boy pants in 1870 and getting their
asses
kicked.

Had the US sat out WWII

That might have been difficult to do, given that Germany declared war on
the USA after their allies, Japan, attacked Pearl Harbour.

R bowman is geopolitically and historically beyond ignorant.

--
There’s a mighty big difference between good, sound reasons and reasons
that sound good.

Burton Hillis (William Vaughn, American columnist)

 

[Custos Custodum]

On 11 Sep 2023 06:51:12 GMT, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:

On Mon, 11 Sep 2023 04:36:33 +0100, Commander Kinsey wrote:

In the further adventures of Boris and Natashya they headed to Kiev
with the goof gas gun.

Glad to see you spelt it right.

It is Kiev and the Ukraine. Oder auf Deutsch

\"Weil der Luftraum über der Ukraine nach wie vor gesperrt ist, war
Baerbock in der Nacht wie bei hochrangigen Politikerinnenbesuchen üblich
im Sonderzug von Polen aus in die Hauptstadt Kiew gefahren.\"

Der Ukraine und Kiew.

https://www.zeit.de/politik/ausland/ukraine-krieg-russland-newsblog-live

The Germans do get creative with the comedians name: Wolodymyr Selenskyj

The W substitution is obvious but I don\'t know about the terminal \'j\'.

It\'s just one of the problems faced when romanising other alphabets.
In Cyrillic, Zelensky\'s name ends in two almost identical vowels. The
second has an accent to indicate that it is shorter than the first. In
English, \"Zelenskyy\" isn\'t technically correct but there isn\'t really
any other way to show it. I\'m not sure that German has managed any
better.

 

[The Natural Philosopher]

On 11/09/2023 13:56, John Larkin wrote:

On Mon, 11 Sep 2023 14:24:49 +0200, Peeler <trolltrap@valid.invalid
wrote:

On Mon, 11 Sep 2023 21:47:49 +1000, Xeno, another brainless, troll-feeding,
senile Australian idiot, blathered:


Ukraine will be unlikely to agree to any peace deal whilst ever any of
Ukraine territory remains occupied by Russia and that includes territory
illegally annexed in 2014.

WTF has all this sick shit got to do with the three ngs you sick idiotic
troll-feeding senile assholes keep crossposting it to?

It\'s easy to post about. Electronics is hard.

Apropos of that I just got an email from a chinese pcb fab place to
query where my top copper file was?

I told then it was a single sided board...

Apparently these are not things people use much these days

--
Those who want slavery should have the grace to name it by its proper
name. They must face the full meaning of that which they are advocating
or condoning; the full, exact, specific meaning of collectivism, of its
logical implications, of the principles upon which it is based, and of
the ultimate consequences to which these principles will lead. They must
face it, then decide whether this is what they want or not.

Ayn Rand.

 

[The Natural Philosopher]

On 11/09/2023 14:11, Custos Custodum wrote:

\"Zelenskyy\" isn\'t technically correct but there isn\'t really
any other way to show it. I\'m not sure that German has managed any
better.

Zelenskyi?

Or very anglicised, \"Zelenskiey\".

--
Those who want slavery should have the grace to name it by its proper
name. They must face the full meaning of that which they are advocating
or condoning; the full, exact, specific meaning of collectivism, of its
logical implications, of the principles upon which it is based, and of
the ultimate consequences to which these principles will lead. They must
face it, then decide whether this is what they want or not.

Ayn Rand.

 

[Cursitor Doom]

On 11 Sep 2023 02:46:48 GMT, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:

On Sun, 10 Sep 2023 23:42:30 +0100, Commander Kinsey wrote:

On Sun, 10 Sep 2023 22:46:41 +0100, Colin Bignell
cpb@bignellremovethis.me.uk> wrote:

On 10/09/2023 21:44, Commander Kinsey wrote:
If Ukraine and Russia make peace, who keeps the Russian occupied land?

You would need to read the terms of the peace treaty to know that and
it doesn\'t exist yet.

Surely they know what\'s planned to go in it? The BBC is already saying
the Ukraine doesn\'t like what\'s in it - to do with not sanctioning
Russia anymore.

Supposedly peace was going to break out before Boris visited and nixxed
the deal.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UUWJWRn5m6E

In the further adventures of Boris and Natashya they headed to Kiev with
the goof gas gun.

Curious that Boris met with Zelensky *after* he\'d been removed as PM.
He was *supposed* to be an ordinary back bencher again, representing
the interests of his constituents. What was the purpose of that visit?
What did they discuss? We were never told.

 

[Cursitor Doom]

On Mon, 11 Sep 2023 21:47:49 +1000, Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au>
wrote:

On 11/9/2023 6:44 am, Commander Kinsey wrote:
If Ukraine and Russia make peace, who keeps the Russian occupied land?

Ukraine will be unlikely to agree to any peace deal whilst ever any of
Ukraine territory remains occupied by Russia and that includes territory
illegally annexed in 2014.

Whatever. It\'s none of our business. Let them slug it out with Russia
on their own.

 

[Custos Custodum]

On Mon, 11 Sep 2023 14:16:40 +0100, The Natural Philosopher
<tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:

On 11/09/2023 14:11, Custos Custodum wrote:
\"Zelenskyy\" isn\'t technically correct but there isn\'t really
any other way to show it. I\'m not sure that German has managed any
better.

Zelenskyi?

It\'s a possibility. However, in RP English the letter \"i\" is rarely if
ever pronounced as \"ee\". (Bracing myself for a flood of
counterexamples.)

Or very anglicised, \"Zelenskiey\".

 

[Anthony William Sloman]

On Monday, September 11, 2023 at 11:40:50 PM UTC+10, Cursitor Doom wrote:

On Mon, 11 Sep 2023 21:47:49 +1000, Xeno <xeno...@optusnet.com.au
wrote:
On 11/9/2023 6:44 am, Commander Kinsey wrote:
If Ukraine and Russia make peace, who keeps the Russian occupied land?

Ukraine will be unlikely to agree to any peace deal whilst ever any of
Ukraine territory remains occupied by Russia and that includes territory
illegally annexed in 2014.

Whatever. It\'s none of our business.

It might not be any of yours, right now, but letting Putin get away with slicing bits of the Ukraine might encourage him to move on to nearer neighbours of yours, and fill up your back yard with even more irritating refugees.

> Let them slug it out with Russia on their own.

Always an easy choice, until you find that you are slugging it out with them on your own because they\'ve conquered everybody else.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

 

[Xeno]

On 11/9/2023 11:40 pm, Cursitor Doom wrote:

On Mon, 11 Sep 2023 21:47:49 +1000, Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au
wrote:

On 11/9/2023 6:44 am, Commander Kinsey wrote:
If Ukraine and Russia make peace, who keeps the Russian occupied land?

Ukraine will be unlikely to agree to any peace deal whilst ever any of
Ukraine territory remains occupied by Russia and that includes territory
illegally annexed in 2014.

Whatever. It\'s none of our business. Let them slug it out with Russia
on their own.

Ukraine is a target *on the way* to more targets.

--
Xeno


Nothing astonishes Noddy so much as common sense and plain dealing.
(with apologies to Ralph Waldo Emerson)

 

[John Larkin]

On Mon, 11 Sep 2023 14:14:32 +0100, The Natural Philosopher
<tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:

On 11/09/2023 13:56, John Larkin wrote:
On Mon, 11 Sep 2023 14:24:49 +0200, Peeler <trolltrap@valid.invalid
wrote:

On Mon, 11 Sep 2023 21:47:49 +1000, Xeno, another brainless, troll-feeding,
senile Australian idiot, blathered:


Ukraine will be unlikely to agree to any peace deal whilst ever any of
Ukraine territory remains occupied by Russia and that includes territory
illegally annexed in 2014.

WTF has all this sick shit got to do with the three ngs you sick idiotic
troll-feeding senile assholes keep crossposting it to?

It\'s easy to post about. Electronics is hard.

Apropos of that I just got an email from a chinese pcb fab place to
query where my top copper file was?

I told then it was a single sided board...

Apparently these are not things people use much these days

No. Plated holes with pads on both sides are nice. The ole-fashioned
single-side boards tended to peel pads.

We do mostly 4-layer boards, even for test prototypes. Ground and
power planes are great.

Has anyone used the Digikey pc boards?

 

[The Natural Philosopher]

On 11/09/2023 14:40, Cursitor Doom wrote:

On Mon, 11 Sep 2023 21:47:49 +1000, Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au
wrote:

On 11/9/2023 6:44 am, Commander Kinsey wrote:
If Ukraine and Russia make peace, who keeps the Russian occupied land?

Ukraine will be unlikely to agree to any peace deal whilst ever any of
Ukraine territory remains occupied by Russia and that includes territory
illegally annexed in 2014.

Whatever. It\'s none of our business. Let them slug it out with Russia
on their own.

It is *entirely* our business. Anyone who says it is not is either
lying on behalf of the Kremlin or is a bigger fool than anyone has realised.

And they are slugging it out, but we are supplying the boxing gloves and
the doc Martens


--
It’s easier to fool people than to convince them that they have been fooled.
Mark Twain

 

[Anthony William Sloman]

On Monday, September 11, 2023 at 10:56:59 PM UTC+10, John Larkin wrote:

On Mon, 11 Sep 2023 14:24:49 +0200, Peeler <trol...@valid.invalid
wrote:
On Mon, 11 Sep 2023 21:47:49 +1000, Xeno, another brainless, troll-feeding,
senile Australian idiot, blathered:


Ukraine will be unlikely to agree to any peace deal whilst ever any of
Ukraine territory remains occupied by Russia and that includes territory
illegally annexed in 2014.

WTF has all this sick shit got to do with the three ngs you sick idiotic
troll-feeding senile assholes keep crossposting it to?

It\'s easy to post about. Electronics is hard.

I never found it all that difficult. Finding something useful to say about it is more difficult, and John Larkin can\'t do that at all.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

 

[The Natural Philosopher]

On 11/09/2023 15:29, John Larkin wrote:

On Mon, 11 Sep 2023 14:14:32 +0100, The Natural Philosopher
tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:

On 11/09/2023 13:56, John Larkin wrote:
On Mon, 11 Sep 2023 14:24:49 +0200, Peeler <trolltrap@valid.invalid
wrote:

On Mon, 11 Sep 2023 21:47:49 +1000, Xeno, another brainless, troll-feeding,
senile Australian idiot, blathered:


Ukraine will be unlikely to agree to any peace deal whilst ever any of
Ukraine territory remains occupied by Russia and that includes territory
illegally annexed in 2014.

WTF has all this sick shit got to do with the three ngs you sick idiotic
troll-feeding senile assholes keep crossposting it to?

It\'s easy to post about. Electronics is hard.

Apropos of that I just got an email from a chinese pcb fab place to
query where my top copper file was?

I told then it was a single sided board...

Apparently these are not things people use much these days

No. Plated holes with pads on both sides are nice. The ole-fashioned
single-side boards tended to peel pads.

All boards peel pads

We do mostly 4-layer boards, even for test prototypes. Ground and
power planes are great.

If you have any speed in your circuitry perhaps. Not for what is
essentially DC.

Has anyone used the Digikey pc boards?

No idea what those are.

--
\"A point of view can be a dangerous luxury when substituted for insight
and understanding\".

Marshall McLuhan

 

[Anthony William Sloman]

On Monday, September 11, 2023 at 11:37:00 PM UTC+10, Cursitor Doom wrote:

On 11 Sep 2023 02:46:48 GMT, rbowman <bow...@montana.com> wrote:

On Sun, 10 Sep 2023 23:42:30 +0100, Commander Kinsey wrote:

On Sun, 10 Sep 2023 22:46:41 +0100, Colin Bignell
c...@bignellremovethis.me.uk> wrote:

On 10/09/2023 21:44, Commander Kinsey wrote:
If Ukraine and Russia make peace, who keeps the Russian occupied land?

You would need to read the terms of the peace treaty to know that and
it doesn\'t exist yet.

Surely they know what\'s planned to go in it? The BBC is already saying
the Ukraine doesn\'t like what\'s in it - to do with not sanctioning
Russia anymore.

Supposedly peace was going to break out before Boris visited and nixxed
the deal.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UUWJWRn5m6E

In the further adventures of Boris and Natashya they headed to Kiev with
the goof gas gun.
Curious that Boris met with Zelensky *after* he\'d been removed as PM.
He was *supposed* to be an ordinary back bencher again, representing
the interests of his constituents. What was the purpose of that visit?
What did they discuss? We were never told.

They both wanted to get their faces in the newspapers. Boris woudn\'t have had anything useful to say. but Zelinsky wouldn\'t have cared.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

 

[Cursitor Doom]

On Mon, 11 Sep 2023 15:39:27 +0100, The Natural Philosopher
<tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:

On 11/09/2023 14:40, Cursitor Doom wrote:
On Mon, 11 Sep 2023 21:47:49 +1000, Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au
wrote:

On 11/9/2023 6:44 am, Commander Kinsey wrote:
If Ukraine and Russia make peace, who keeps the Russian occupied land?

Ukraine will be unlikely to agree to any peace deal whilst ever any of
Ukraine territory remains occupied by Russia and that includes territory
illegally annexed in 2014.

Whatever. It\'s none of our business. Let them slug it out with Russia
on their own.

It is *entirely* our business. Anyone who says it is not is either
lying on behalf of the Kremlin or is a bigger fool than anyone has realised.

Or perhaps knows better than you, as in the present matter.

And they are slugging it out, but we are supplying the boxing gloves and
the doc Martens

I don\'t want those foreign conflicts to cause Western taxpayers a
single penny piece. Let the fuckers go at it for all I care.

 

[Cursitor Doom]

On Mon, 11 Sep 2023 07:16:30 -0700 (PDT), Anthony William Sloman
<bill.sloman@ieee.org> wrote:

On Monday, September 11, 2023 at 11:40:50?PM UTC+10, Cursitor Doom wrote:
On Mon, 11 Sep 2023 21:47:49 +1000, Xeno <xeno...@optusnet.com.au
wrote:
On 11/9/2023 6:44 am, Commander Kinsey wrote:
If Ukraine and Russia make peace, who keeps the Russian occupied land?

Ukraine will be unlikely to agree to any peace deal whilst ever any of
Ukraine territory remains occupied by Russia and that includes territory
illegally annexed in 2014.

Whatever. It\'s none of our business.

It might not be any of yours, right now, but letting Putin get away with slicing bits of the Ukraine might encourage him to move on to nearer neighbours of yours, and fill up your back yard with even more irritating refugees.

Let them slug it out with Russia on their own.

Always an easy choice, until you find that you are slugging it out with them on your own because they\'ve conquered everybody else.

You do talk a lot of old nonsense, Bill. I\'d stick with electronics if
I were you as it\'s the only thing you know anything about.

 

[The Natural Philosopher]

On 11/09/2023 18:13, Cursitor Doom wrote:

On Mon, 11 Sep 2023 15:39:27 +0100, The Natural Philosopher
tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:

On 11/09/2023 14:40, Cursitor Doom wrote:
On Mon, 11 Sep 2023 21:47:49 +1000, Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au
wrote:

On 11/9/2023 6:44 am, Commander Kinsey wrote:
If Ukraine and Russia make peace, who keeps the Russian occupied land?

Ukraine will be unlikely to agree to any peace deal whilst ever any of
Ukraine territory remains occupied by Russia and that includes territory
illegally annexed in 2014.

Whatever. It\'s none of our business. Let them slug it out with Russia
on their own.

It is *entirely* our business. Anyone who says it is not is either
lying on behalf of the Kremlin or is a bigger fool than anyone has realised.

Or perhaps knows better than you, as in the present matter.

I very much doubt it.

And they are slugging it out, but we are supplying the boxing gloves and
the doc Martens

I don\'t want those foreign conflicts to cause Western taxpayers a
single penny piece. Let the fuckers go at it for all I care.

What you want is pure short sighted stupid selfishness.

You need a decade of living under Russian rule to sort your ideas out.

--
\"The great thing about Glasgow is that if there\'s a nuclear attack it\'ll
look exactly the same afterwards.\"

Billy Connolly

 

[boB]

On Mon, 11 Sep 2023 15:41:21 +0100, The Natural Philosopher
<tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:

On 11/09/2023 15:29, John Larkin wrote:
On Mon, 11 Sep 2023 14:14:32 +0100, The Natural Philosopher
tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:

On 11/09/2023 13:56, John Larkin wrote:
On Mon, 11 Sep 2023 14:24:49 +0200, Peeler <trolltrap@valid.invalid
wrote:

On Mon, 11 Sep 2023 21:47:49 +1000, Xeno, another brainless, troll-feeding,
senile Australian idiot, blathered:


Ukraine will be unlikely to agree to any peace deal whilst ever any of
Ukraine territory remains occupied by Russia and that includes territory
illegally annexed in 2014.

WTF has all this sick shit got to do with the three ngs you sick idiotic
troll-feeding senile assholes keep crossposting it to?

It\'s easy to post about. Electronics is hard.

Apropos of that I just got an email from a chinese pcb fab place to
query where my top copper file was?

I told then it was a single sided board...

Apparently these are not things people use much these days

No. Plated holes with pads on both sides are nice. The ole-fashioned
single-side boards tended to peel pads.


All boards peel pads

Yes ! That is why I always make pads as large as possible, within
reason. I try to anyway.

And traces not so damn thin and close together.

boB

We do mostly 4-layer boards, even for test prototypes. Ground and
power planes are great.

If you have any speed in your circuitry perhaps. Not for what is
essentially DC.

Has anyone used the Digikey pc boards?

No idea what those are.

 

[rbowman]

On Mon, 11 Sep 2023 22:07:27 +1000, Xeno wrote:

On 11/9/2023 4:51 pm, rbowman wrote:
On Mon, 11 Sep 2023 04:36:33 +0100, Commander Kinsey wrote:

In the further adventures of Boris and Natashya they headed to Kiev
with the goof gas gun.

Glad to see you spelt it right.

It is Kiev and the Ukraine. Oder auf Deutsch

\"Weil der Luftraum über der Ukraine nach wie vor gesperrt ist, war
Baerbock in der Nacht wie bei hochrangigen Politikerinnenbesuchen
üblich im Sonderzug von Polen aus in die Hauptstadt Kiew gefahren.\"

Der Ukraine und Kiew.

https://www.zeit.de/politik/ausland/ukraine-krieg-russland-newsblog-
live

The Germans do get creative with the comedians name: Wolodymyr
Selenskyj

The W substitution is obvious but I don\'t know about the terminal \'j\'.

Depends on how you pronounce the J. Think of
the Dutch name \"Jos\" as the
perfect example.

Jah... Y is infrequent in German and in a word like \'typisch\' is more of
a \'u\' sound. For loan words like Handy (cellphone) it\'s pronounced as in
English. I\'ve no idea how \'yj\' geets pronounced. Eeeee-Yah?