C
Chris Carlen
Guest
R. Steve Walz wrote:
it. You propose killing people. I maintain that as insanity no matter
what. I don't care who is being killed or why. Killing is wrong, and
the wish to kill is insane, as is any logical process that leads to the
conclusion that killing is not wrong to rectify political problems. I
know that I might kill if I have to defend myself, but it isn't my
intention to kill at the first opportunity to defend myself. That is
the difference. It would still be wrong to kill in self defense, albeit
understandable, and forgivable. Then again, everything is forgivable,
even your hatefullness. I hope one day you can discover this, however
improbable. However if you can pull it off, you will know the only
freedom that exists, and the burden of your political religion will be
ended.
it isn't. It isn't me. What I think, my views, my feelings, all of
that isn't me. It is a meaningless and fleeting pattern of phenomena.
You can no more gain control of it than I. But you worship the
intellect and are thus confined to it, whereas I know it's limitations
and can thus use it as a tool when desired, or ignore it when it's
utility has reached its limits. There are other modes of knowledge than
the rational intellect, you know, which isn't really a mode of knowing
at all, just labeling.
Perhaps what I should have said, is that if you assume you have any idea
of what I maintain as a political identity, you will be in err. This
remains the truth, though you will go on assuming because you need to.
I know why this is so. You do not.
understatement. There are other examples. Try reading Christopher
Hitchens "Why Orwell Matters."
Anyway, what you dream of I maintain is exactly what "the several
mewling anti-utopian novelists have posited."
As an architect of utopia, so filled with the eagerness to kill, don't
you see that there is something wrong with this picture? You don't want
to free or help anyone. You just want to be the enslaver yourself but
the positions are all filled, and your damned jealous.
voted for Al Gore? Then again, I'm sure Al Gore is way to much of a
fascist right-wing racist for your liking.
to be a human from Earth. If you know something I don't, please
divulge, as I would be most fascinated to hear about my alien origins.
But now you accuse me of things again. Please tell me exactly what my
crimes are? How is it that I enslave the poor and oppressed racially
disciminated against minority masses, while I pay the rent each month
for my apartment, unable to afford a house because of the inflated
prices conjured by Alan Greenspan and the CEO's of Freddie Mac and
Fannie Mae, to keep the economy floating on borrowed money? How is that
my crime? How is it my crime that the oil companies keep us mired in a
backward energy system in order to enrich themselves, while I work in a
government lab to research and develop cleaner and more efficient energy
sources, as well as working with beaurocrats who are persistenly albeit
in futility attempting to advocate for intelligent energy policies,
while the Bush administration consistently attempts to zero our budgets,
and every budget of any program remotely associated with reducing energy
inefficiency and pollutant emissions from combustion processes. But I
do this work despite having had opportunities to jump ship from public
service into some high-profit bucket of dollars pocketing start up tech
firm, for salaries 50% or more over what I get?
Please do explain exactly what my crimes are. Or perhaps they are only
thought crimes? Since I barely participate in any activity that can
remotely be called "the owners of the means of production," I fall
squarely into the category of workers. Yet you claim that I am guilty
of the crimes of the exploiters. Why? Because I levied a few
criticisms at the ultra-leftists? That makes me a rightist, right? But
I am guilty of only a thought-act, of positing a view. Yet you condemn
me for this view, and are quick to lump me into the group that you are
eager to kill. For having a thought. Oh but that's not it really.
What irks you is that I am not a dumb enough worker to fall for your
phony promises of liberation. It is the crime of seeing you for what
you are, that is why I must be labeled a rightist and destroyed, isn't it?
This is the world you would create, for which you aspire and advocate.
A world of killing people who don't think the party line, which is no
thinking at all. You make the capitalists look like the good guys.
That is what is so sad about the intellectually dishonest left these
days. I was really quite liberal a few years ago, before I started
putting the food on the table. But views like yours make me sick, and
unable to associate with the left. The right is just as grisly in many
ways and so I reject them as well in terms of considering any
possibility of joining their parties, so I know where I stand. But you
just go on assuming what you will. It's all you've got.
Good day!
--
_____________________
Christopher R. Carlen
crobc@earthlink.net
Suse 8.1 Linux 2.4.19
Certainly resisting enslavement is not insane, depending on how one does
it. You propose killing people. I maintain that as insanity no matter
what. I don't care who is being killed or why. Killing is wrong, and
the wish to kill is insane, as is any logical process that leads to the
conclusion that killing is not wrong to rectify political problems. I
know that I might kill if I have to defend myself, but it isn't my
intention to kill at the first opportunity to defend myself. That is
the difference. It would still be wrong to kill in self defense, albeit
understandable, and forgivable. Then again, everything is forgivable,
even your hatefullness. I hope one day you can discover this, however
improbable. However if you can pull it off, you will know the only
freedom that exists, and the burden of your political religion will be
ended.
I don't need to have control of it. I know what it is, and I know what
it isn't. It isn't me. What I think, my views, my feelings, all of
that isn't me. It is a meaningless and fleeting pattern of phenomena.
You can no more gain control of it than I. But you worship the
intellect and are thus confined to it, whereas I know it's limitations
and can thus use it as a tool when desired, or ignore it when it's
utility has reached its limits. There are other modes of knowledge than
the rational intellect, you know, which isn't really a mode of knowing
at all, just labeling.
Perhaps what I should have said, is that if you assume you have any idea
of what I maintain as a political identity, you will be in err. This
remains the truth, though you will go on assuming because you need to.
I know why this is so. You do not.
You are quite incorrect. North Korea makes "1984" look like an
understatement. There are other examples. Try reading Christopher
Hitchens "Why Orwell Matters."
Anyway, what you dream of I maintain is exactly what "the several
mewling anti-utopian novelists have posited."
As an architect of utopia, so filled with the eagerness to kill, don't
you see that there is something wrong with this picture? You don't want
to free or help anyone. You just want to be the enslaver yourself but
the positions are all filled, and your damned jealous.
And so I expect you will argue that I was being a "rightist" when I
voted for Al Gore? Then again, I'm sure Al Gore is way to much of a
fascist right-wing racist for your liking.
You are evading my question. I asked why it is I am a liar for claiming
to be a human from Earth. If you know something I don't, please
divulge, as I would be most fascinated to hear about my alien origins.
But now you accuse me of things again. Please tell me exactly what my
crimes are? How is it that I enslave the poor and oppressed racially
disciminated against minority masses, while I pay the rent each month
for my apartment, unable to afford a house because of the inflated
prices conjured by Alan Greenspan and the CEO's of Freddie Mac and
Fannie Mae, to keep the economy floating on borrowed money? How is that
my crime? How is it my crime that the oil companies keep us mired in a
backward energy system in order to enrich themselves, while I work in a
government lab to research and develop cleaner and more efficient energy
sources, as well as working with beaurocrats who are persistenly albeit
in futility attempting to advocate for intelligent energy policies,
while the Bush administration consistently attempts to zero our budgets,
and every budget of any program remotely associated with reducing energy
inefficiency and pollutant emissions from combustion processes. But I
do this work despite having had opportunities to jump ship from public
service into some high-profit bucket of dollars pocketing start up tech
firm, for salaries 50% or more over what I get?
Please do explain exactly what my crimes are. Or perhaps they are only
thought crimes? Since I barely participate in any activity that can
remotely be called "the owners of the means of production," I fall
squarely into the category of workers. Yet you claim that I am guilty
of the crimes of the exploiters. Why? Because I levied a few
criticisms at the ultra-leftists? That makes me a rightist, right? But
I am guilty of only a thought-act, of positing a view. Yet you condemn
me for this view, and are quick to lump me into the group that you are
eager to kill. For having a thought. Oh but that's not it really.
What irks you is that I am not a dumb enough worker to fall for your
phony promises of liberation. It is the crime of seeing you for what
you are, that is why I must be labeled a rightist and destroyed, isn't it?
This is the world you would create, for which you aspire and advocate.
A world of killing people who don't think the party line, which is no
thinking at all. You make the capitalists look like the good guys.
That is what is so sad about the intellectually dishonest left these
days. I was really quite liberal a few years ago, before I started
putting the food on the table. But views like yours make me sick, and
unable to associate with the left. The right is just as grisly in many
ways and so I reject them as well in terms of considering any
possibility of joining their parties, so I know where I stand. But you
just go on assuming what you will. It's all you've got.
Good day!
--
_____________________
Christopher R. Carlen
crobc@earthlink.net
Suse 8.1 Linux 2.4.19
.