Electric Cars Require Fewer Jobs to Build

On Saturday, October 5, 2019 at 12:34:30 PM UTC-7, Rick C wrote:

On Friday, October 4, 2019 at 10:38:12 PM UTC-4, Phil Allison wrote:
Rick Cunt Moron wrote:
--------------------


Assuming overnight charging for 8hrs at 3kW is the norm - a figure
oft quoted by EV makers - a householder here would get a bill 3
or 4 times the one they get now.

Please show me this reference.

** FFS it is in nearly every report published for EVs !!

3kW is available a from a single phase outlet here, 8 hour is what people spend sleeping. Faster charging requires 3-phase power which is NOT available for domestic users.

Ok, so you can't find any references to this? What you seem to misunderstand it that EVs don't need to be fully charged if the battery is not fully depleted. As has been pointed out to you the 24 kWh for this specific charging session would be around 100 to 120 miles. So unless you drive your car 100 miles you don't need 24 kWh.

Is that more clear now? It's really very simple electronics if you can stop fuming and swearing and actually listen to something being explained in simple, clear English. Can you do that for once?


** I've never seen anything remotely like this from EV makers.

High time you pulled your head out of you stinking arse.


That would be 24 kWh or approximately 120 miles of range.

** Irrelevant.

LOL! You are just too fucked up to even try to understand that you can't put 10 pounds of shit in a 5 pound bag. IF THE CAR BATTERY DOESN'T NEED 100 KWH OF CHARGE YOU CAN'T PUT 100 KWH IN THE CAR BATTERY.


Folk will want ( maybe forced) to use to use "off peak" power so put their EVs on charge late at night or the early hours.

Many households use more than one car and they all need regular charging.

The total, worst case scenario is EXATLY what I estimated.

Oh, so this is YOUR ESTIMATE? Before you said it is a figure "oft quoted by EV makers". I didn't realize you had gotten into the business.


Inability to get 3-phase connected is the biggest impediment to the sale of EVs here.

Where I lives, the streets are chock full of parked cars at night with no way to get AC power to them.

You a
re so full of SHIT !!

You don't even know what you are replying to. You are just incapable of suppressing your insane rage much of the time.


If charging were continued at peak demand times - the local grid
would collapse with triple the usual load.


There is almost no extra capacity available in domestic AC power supply - easily proved by simply monitoring the supply voltage.

It drops to barely acceptable values ( like 210VAC instead of 240 ) at peak demand times on cold mornings and evenings.

That is a poor way to evaluate anything other than the distribution to your home. Is that the case for EVERYONE???



** No, it is much worse for some and typical of every premises I have lived in for 50 years.

Then according to you, every house you've ever lived in can't add a hot tub or anything else with significant current draw. That is one messed up distribution network.

Try to understand this. A car can be charged on 3 kW very effectively for some 98% of the time (yes, I pulled that number from my ass, but it is based on some experience and many, many discussions with EV owners). 3 kW will top off overnight EVs that have been driven up to 120 miles, give or take. 120 miles is a LOT more than what most people drive in a day, ego, the 98% figure. On the rare occasion of needing a faster charge you would need to visit a DC fast charger which are becoming much more plentiful even if not in your neck of the woods.

Maybe EVs are not for Australia any time soon. But it won't be too much longer that you will be able to drive anywhere you want in the Australian doughnut and find chargers within 30 miles.


Right next to me is a nice home unit with a family of four living there..

It has jut one, 16amp / 240VAC circuit plus an 8amp one for lights.

The owners trip the 16A circuit breaker regularly, despite having gas hot water and gas stove.

I monitor the AC voltage in my unit constantly and it sometimes falls to 205VAC if I run a few loads at peak times - with no loads it rises to 215V.

No-one here could possibly run an EV.

Ok, I get it. Australia is an electrical third world country. So put in a 5 kW solar panel. When you aren't charging your EV you can sell the excess to your neighbor. lol

They probably don't have long enough power cords from home to vehicle. However, if there is a need, there is a way. Using vehicle roof top (around 1 sq. meter) and 40% solar efficiency, you can get 40 to 50 miles per 10 hours sun light. Yes, someone is claiming 40% and possibly higher.

 

[Bill Sloman]

On Sunday, October 6, 2019 at 11:49:55 AM UTC+11, edward...@gmail.com wrote:

On Saturday, October 5, 2019 at 12:34:30 PM UTC-7, Rick C wrote:
On Friday, October 4, 2019 at 10:38:12 PM UTC-4, Phil Allison wrote:
Rick Cunt Moron wrote:
--------------------


Assuming overnight charging for 8hrs at 3kW is the norm - a figure
oft quoted by EV makers - a householder here would get a bill 3
or 4 times the one they get now.

Please show me this reference.

** FFS it is in nearly every report published for EVs !!

3kW is available a from a single phase outlet here, 8 hour is what people spend sleeping. Faster charging requires 3-phase power which is NOT available for domestic users.

Ok, so you can't find any references to this? What you seem to misunderstand it that EVs don't need to be fully charged if the battery is not fully depleted. As has been pointed out to you the 24 kWh for this specific charging session would be around 100 to 120 miles. So unless you drive your car 100 miles you don't need 24 kWh.

Is that more clear now? It's really very simple electronics if you can stop fuming and swearing and actually listen to something being explained in simple, clear English. Can you do that for once?


** I've never seen anything remotely like this from EV makers.

High time you pulled your head out of you stinking arse.


That would be 24 kWh or approximately 120 miles of range.

** Irrelevant.

LOL! You are just too fucked up to even try to understand that you can't put 10 pounds of shit in a 5 pound bag. IF THE CAR BATTERY DOESN'T NEED 100 KWH OF CHARGE YOU CAN'T PUT 100 KWH IN THE CAR BATTERY.


Folk will want ( maybe forced) to use to use "off peak" power so put their EVs on charge late at night or the early hours.

Many households use more than one car and they all need regular charging.

The total, worst case scenario is EXATLY what I estimated.

Oh, so this is YOUR ESTIMATE? Before you said it is a figure "oft quoted by EV makers". I didn't realize you had gotten into the business.


Inability to get 3-phase connected is the biggest impediment to the sale of EVs here.

Where I lives, the streets are chock full of parked cars at night with no way to get AC power to them.

You a
re so full of SHIT !!

You don't even know what you are replying to. You are just incapable of suppressing your insane rage much of the time.


If charging were continued at peak demand times - the local grid
would collapse with triple the usual load.


There is almost no extra capacity available in domestic AC power supply - easily proved by simply monitoring the supply voltage.

It drops to barely acceptable values ( like 210VAC instead of 240 ) at peak demand times on cold mornings and evenings.

That is a poor way to evaluate anything other than the distribution to your home. Is that the case for EVERYONE???



** No, it is much worse for some and typical of every premises I have lived in for 50 years.

Then according to you, every house you've ever lived in can't add a hot tub or anything else with significant current draw. That is one messed up distribution network.

Try to understand this. A car can be charged on 3 kW very effectively for some 98% of the time (yes, I pulled that number from my ass, but it is based on some experience and many, many discussions with EV owners). 3 kW will top off overnight EVs that have been driven up to 120 miles, give or take. 120 miles is a LOT more than what most people drive in a day, ego, the 98% figure. On the rare occasion of needing a faster charge you would need to visit a DC fast charger which are becoming much more plentiful even if not in your neck of the woods.

Maybe EVs are not for Australia any time soon. But it won't be too much longer that you will be able to drive anywhere you want in the Australian doughnut and find chargers within 30 miles.


Right next to me is a nice home unit with a family of four living there.

It has jut one, 16amp / 240VAC circuit plus an 8amp one for lights.

The owners trip the 16A circuit breaker regularly, despite having gas hot water and gas stove.

I monitor the AC voltage in my unit constantly and it sometimes falls to 205VAC if I run a few loads at peak times - with no loads it rises to 215V.

No-one here could possibly run an EV.

Ok, I get it. Australia is an electrical third world country. So put in a 5 kW solar panel. When you aren't charging your EV you can sell the excess to your neighbor. lol

They probably don't have long enough power cords from home to vehicle. However, if there is a need, there is a way. Using vehicle roof top (around 1 sq. meter) and 40% solar efficiency, you can get 40 to 50 miles per 10 hours sun light. Yes, someone is claiming 40% and possibly higher.

There's another way. Inductive charging under each regular parking spot.

You need a receiving coil under each vehicle. It has been done - experimentally - for a couple of buses, and seems to work. Rolling it out in volume would take a while.

In a thoroughly re-worked system, the inductive chargers would also be buried under heavily used roads, and charge cars as they drove along the road.

There would be a signalling system that recognised the car as it drove over each coil, and sent the car owner a (very small) bill for each quantum of charge transferred.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

 

[Bill Sloman]

On Sunday, October 6, 2019 at 7:30:37 AM UTC+11, Rick C wrote:

On Saturday, October 5, 2019 at 4:24:24 AM UTC-4, Bill Sloman wrote:
On Saturday, October 5, 2019 at 1:49:16 PM UTC+10, Phil Allison wrote:

However, the *SAME* cite flatly contradicts your idea it makes sense to go EV in terms of CO2 reduction.

Only if you generate the extra power by burning fossil carbon. We certainly don't have to, and the Australian utilities are investing heavily in wind and solar power, and spending nothing on installing new fossil-carbon fired generating plant, much to the government's disgust, who want them to pander to the mining interests that pay the Liberal Party's electoral expenses.

This article has numerous flaws. The references are out of date and can not be traced. They talk about charging from "the existing mix of non-base-load sources (as nighttime charging likely would)", but wouldn't night time charging be base load?

The references are explicit, and a google search should be able to find the current equivalents.

The talk about "charging from the existing mix of ... sources" reflects pure intellectual laziness. If the move away from gasoline-powered cars is part of a general move away from burning fossil carbon to generate power, the electricity generating system will move away in the same way, as indeed it is doing.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

 

[bitrex]

On 10/5/19 11:34 PM, bitrex wrote:

or can't resolve it for some other reason then it likely gets kicked up
to real human who'll take a closer look and try to get something from
the video. usually though the only legal requirement is a police officer
just has to flip through the images in the file at the end of the day if
each image has all digits clearly visible it all the citation letters
can automatically be stamped "citation reviewed by a police officer."

All the rest of the logistics is handled by a third-party contractor I'm
pretty sure.

 

[bitrex]

On 10/5/19 2:44 PM, Rob wrote:

bitrex <user@example.net> wrote:
The ones around here have extra shit on them besides the camera to snap
license plates. You can easily see when they trigger at night a xenon
flash goes off so they can capture the plate.

Bit old-fashioned, isn't it? Flashing traffic camera's haven't been
seen here for years. They do with the existing lighting and if required
they flash in infrared.

I think it may actually a high intensity array of white LEDs, not a
strobe. People put all sorts of weird crap on the license plates to try
to defeat 'em like IR LEDs or blinking LEDs pointing backwards, and
darkly tinted plate covers, reflective tape, stuff like that. High
intensity visible light flash will defeat any of that low-effort ideas I
believe.

The units in Providence, RI don't just take photos they record about ten
seconds of video too, day or night. they play that back for the whole
court to see if you go to court to contest your citation. There's
usually plenty of ambient light in the areas they're installed to get a
plate from the video too, it's just that the flash and still camera
produce higher-quality image they include with your citation in the
mail. They include the close up of photo the plate and a frame from the
video showing the whole vehicle, with time index on it. that process
from snapping a photo to the citation being printed and mailed can be
almost entirely automated.

If for some reason the still camera and flash can't resolve a clear
image due to some high-quality obscuring system that's triggered by the
flash like maybe this one:

<https://hackaday.com/2012/10/23/traffic-camera-countermeasure/>

or can't resolve it for some other reason then it likely gets kicked up
to real human who'll take a closer look and try to get something from
the video. usually though the only legal requirement is a police officer
just has to flip through the images in the file at the end of the day if
each image has all digits clearly visible it all the citation letters
can automatically be stamped "citation reviewed by a police officer."

 

[Phil Allison]

edward...@gmail.com wrote:

--------------------------

They probably don't have long enough power cords from home to vehicle.

** Childish.

However, if there is a need, there is a way. Using vehicle roof top
(around 1 sq. meter) and 40% solar efficiency, you can get 40 to 50
miles per 10 hours sun light. Yes, someone is claiming 40% and
possibly higher.

** How utterly absurd.

Solar / EV fanatics have no bounds to the insanities they believe and try to foist on others.

Makes spherical chickens seem quite real ...



..... Phil

 

[Phil Allison]

Winfield Hill wrote:

His sparse words make it sound like he owns an EV,
but for some fuckwit reason fails to identify it.
Stupid and infuriating.


I own a Prius Prime plugin, and have discussed it in
detail here on s.e.d. a half-dozen times.

** Not in any thread I have seen.

Absurd of you to call it merely a "car".

Many Prius and other hybrids here in Sydney, but no plug-in versions to be seen.

It's now
one year old, has gone about 6500 miles, mostly all
electric. A hybrid, but has only used 20% of its
2nd tank of gas. My solar roof generates 11MWh per
year, some used to power my car. I plug-in at work
for the rest. What else would you like to know?

** Nothing.

You are clearly a solar /EV raving lunatic.



...... Phil

 

[Phil Allison]

Bill Sloman wrote:

------------------

The logic is spelled out.

** Sorry - it is mad logic from a know nothing nobody.

Which particular bit do you disagree with?

** The method.

"Mad logic from a know nothing nobody" has a fine rhetorical ring,
but absolutely zero content.

** The source is non credible and the logic used false.

You must be fucking desperate to quote garbage like that.

It has no connection with reality.

None that you can see?

** Fuck you.

Full of "spherical chickens in a vacuum " type thinking.

Where?

** Makes too many simplistic assumptions.

None of which you can specify.

** They are implied - but none justified.

Did you not get the BBT joke?

Spherical chickens was a physicists joke long before the
Big Bang Theory program first aired.

** Now, that is a King Size non sequitur.

Am I now debating " Rain Man " ?

However, the *SAME* cite flatly contradicts your idea it makes sense
to go EV in terms of CO2 reduction.

Only if you generate the extra power by burning fossil carbon.

** The case in most places, inc here.

At the moment,

** Yep, that is the context.

** Green Party madness - par excellence.

I now know too many Greens to take one tiny bit of notice
- including Queen Bee communist nut case Lee Riahannon.

I don't think much of Greenpeace

** Huh ?

The Green Party ( aka The Greens ) are not Greenpeace.

Lee Rhiannon is their " Queen Bee ".

I have met her & seen all the mindless Green drones flocking all around her.

Plus the woman is a fucking Communist.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lee_Rhiannon

Peeeeukkkee ....

** The cost is in the new infrastructure needed.

Massive, for SFA CO2 benefit.

Pure insanity.

I suggested a better alternative too.

Nuclear power isn't remotely practical.

** FFS - read the dam thread !!!!!!!!!

I will NOT post things twice for lazy arseholes.

Meanwhile, you haven't explained where you got your tenfold
higher electricity generation requirement.

** No such claim from me.

" So major upgrades to power generation capacity ( like 3 or 4 times now)"

My link says 29% more power generation capacity will be needed.

** Your "link" was a forum post with zero credibility.

You are claiming that going over completely to electric cars would
require us to generate about ten times as much extra power

** How absurdly fucking pedantic.

You probably got your figure from the Lavoisier group,

** Who ???

That is very paranoid thing to claim.

John Larkin posts denialist propaganda here all the time.

** Err - my name is Phil, not John.

I have never posted about "warming" - cos that is all politics, not fact.

The fossil fuel extraction industry is spending a lot on lying propaganda.

** My theory is the Nuclear Industry is behind it - cos they have the most to gain ( Cui Bono ) - I posted about that recently.

I posted my simple reasonings here, all mine, and you ignored it.

"EVs need electric energy, masses of the stuff"

** A true but irrelevant fact.

My "simple reasoning" was posted a few lines later.

Maybe your selective blindness makes it invisible ?

Please do not reply, cos I an damn sick of this nonsense.


....... Phil

 

[Rick C]

On Saturday, October 5, 2019 at 8:49:55 PM UTC-4, edward...@gmail.com wrote:

On Saturday, October 5, 2019 at 12:34:30 PM UTC-7, Rick C wrote:
On Friday, October 4, 2019 at 10:38:12 PM UTC-4, Phil Allison wrote:
Rick Cunt Moron wrote:
--------------------


Assuming overnight charging for 8hrs at 3kW is the norm - a figure
oft quoted by EV makers - a householder here would get a bill 3
or 4 times the one they get now.

Please show me this reference.

** FFS it is in nearly every report published for EVs !!

3kW is available a from a single phase outlet here, 8 hour is what people spend sleeping. Faster charging requires 3-phase power which is NOT available for domestic users.

Ok, so you can't find any references to this? What you seem to misunderstand it that EVs don't need to be fully charged if the battery is not fully depleted. As has been pointed out to you the 24 kWh for this specific charging session would be around 100 to 120 miles. So unless you drive your car 100 miles you don't need 24 kWh.

Is that more clear now? It's really very simple electronics if you can stop fuming and swearing and actually listen to something being explained in simple, clear English. Can you do that for once?


** I've never seen anything remotely like this from EV makers.

High time you pulled your head out of you stinking arse.


That would be 24 kWh or approximately 120 miles of range.

** Irrelevant.

LOL! You are just too fucked up to even try to understand that you can't put 10 pounds of shit in a 5 pound bag. IF THE CAR BATTERY DOESN'T NEED 100 KWH OF CHARGE YOU CAN'T PUT 100 KWH IN THE CAR BATTERY.


Folk will want ( maybe forced) to use to use "off peak" power so put their EVs on charge late at night or the early hours.

Many households use more than one car and they all need regular charging.

The total, worst case scenario is EXATLY what I estimated.

Oh, so this is YOUR ESTIMATE? Before you said it is a figure "oft quoted by EV makers". I didn't realize you had gotten into the business.


Inability to get 3-phase connected is the biggest impediment to the sale of EVs here.

Where I lives, the streets are chock full of parked cars at night with no way to get AC power to them.

You a
re so full of SHIT !!

You don't even know what you are replying to. You are just incapable of suppressing your insane rage much of the time.


If charging were continued at peak demand times - the local grid
would collapse with triple the usual load.


There is almost no extra capacity available in domestic AC power supply - easily proved by simply monitoring the supply voltage.

It drops to barely acceptable values ( like 210VAC instead of 240 ) at peak demand times on cold mornings and evenings.

That is a poor way to evaluate anything other than the distribution to your home. Is that the case for EVERYONE???



** No, it is much worse for some and typical of every premises I have lived in for 50 years.

Then according to you, every house you've ever lived in can't add a hot tub or anything else with significant current draw. That is one messed up distribution network.

Try to understand this. A car can be charged on 3 kW very effectively for some 98% of the time (yes, I pulled that number from my ass, but it is based on some experience and many, many discussions with EV owners). 3 kW will top off overnight EVs that have been driven up to 120 miles, give or take. 120 miles is a LOT more than what most people drive in a day, ego, the 98% figure. On the rare occasion of needing a faster charge you would need to visit a DC fast charger which are becoming much more plentiful even if not in your neck of the woods.

Maybe EVs are not for Australia any time soon. But it won't be too much longer that you will be able to drive anywhere you want in the Australian doughnut and find chargers within 30 miles.


Right next to me is a nice home unit with a family of four living there.

It has jut one, 16amp / 240VAC circuit plus an 8amp one for lights.

The owners trip the 16A circuit breaker regularly, despite having gas hot water and gas stove.

I monitor the AC voltage in my unit constantly and it sometimes falls to 205VAC if I run a few loads at peak times - with no loads it rises to 215V.

No-one here could possibly run an EV.

Ok, I get it. Australia is an electrical third world country. So put in a 5 kW solar panel. When you aren't charging your EV you can sell the excess to your neighbor. lol

They probably don't have long enough power cords from home to vehicle. However, if there is a need, there is a way. Using vehicle roof top (around 1 sq. meter) and 40% solar efficiency, you can get 40 to 50 miles per 10 hours sun light. Yes, someone is claiming 40% and possibly higher.

Are you also parking on a hill with the perfect slope and moving the car to keep the panel perfectly perpendicular to the sun? At least it doesn't require any extra hardware to do that. You just need a bunch of hills with the right orientation.

I can see it now. You drive to work and the car wanders off to join all the other cars in a pasture grazing the sun like turtles that have climbed onto a log to be warmed in the sun. Turtle-mobiles.

This reminds me of a Richard Brautigan poem, "All Watched Over by Machines of Loving Grace". Search on the title if you are interested.

--

Rick C.

++-+ Get 2,000 miles of free Supercharging
++-+ Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209

 

[Rick C]

On Saturday, October 5, 2019 at 11:12:45 PM UTC-4, Bill Sloman wrote:

On Sunday, October 6, 2019 at 7:30:37 AM UTC+11, Rick C wrote:
On Saturday, October 5, 2019 at 4:24:24 AM UTC-4, Bill Sloman wrote:
On Saturday, October 5, 2019 at 1:49:16 PM UTC+10, Phil Allison wrote:

However, the *SAME* cite flatly contradicts your idea it makes sense to go EV in terms of CO2 reduction.

Only if you generate the extra power by burning fossil carbon. We certainly don't have to, and the Australian utilities are investing heavily in wind and solar power, and spending nothing on installing new fossil-carbon fired generating plant, much to the government's disgust, who want them to pander to the mining interests that pay the Liberal Party's electoral expenses.

This article has numerous flaws. The references are out of date and can not be traced. They talk about charging from "the existing mix of non-base-load sources (as nighttime charging likely would)", but wouldn't night time charging be base load?

The references are explicit, and a google search should be able to find the current equivalents.

"Explicit"! Oooohhh, that sounds important. Unfortunately a google search didn't turn up anything useful. The point was to see what the claim was based on, not to start a trip down another rabbit hole.


> The talk about "charging from the existing mix of ... sources" reflects pure intellectual laziness. If the move away from gasoline-powered cars is part of a general move away from burning fossil carbon to generate power, the electricity generating system will move away in the same way, as indeed it is doing.

Sounds great, but it is more useful to actually have said something substantial than to generally wave hands and proclaim we are headed toward goodness. I don't understand what the guy is talking about when he says, "non-base-load sources" since that would be the primary source of power for night time charging, in fact it is what is required to use if the proportion of non-load following generation is to be used. While nuclear can be built to be load following, it has very limited capabilities in that regard, in both the rate and the degree of capacity adjustment. It's really not a good resource to squander given the expense of both the fuel and the facilities. Load following in nuclear reactors does waste fuel and increases the cost of depreciation which is essentially fixed with time and so increases per unit of generation when generation is cut back.

--

Rick C.

+++- Get 2,000 miles of free Supercharging
+++- Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209

 

[Rick C]

On Saturday, October 5, 2019 at 11:17:41 PM UTC-4, Phil Allison wrote:

Winfield Hill wrote:


His sparse words make it sound like he owns an EV,
but for some fuckwit reason fails to identify it.
Stupid and infuriating.


I own a Prius Prime plugin, and have discussed it in
detail here on s.e.d. a half-dozen times.


** Not in any thread I have seen.

Absurd of you to call it merely a "car".

Many Prius and other hybrids here in Sydney, but no plug-in versions to be seen.



It's now
one year old, has gone about 6500 miles, mostly all
electric. A hybrid, but has only used 20% of its
2nd tank of gas. My solar roof generates 11MWh per
year, some used to power my car. I plug-in at work
for the rest. What else would you like to know?


** Nothing.

You are clearly a solar /EV raving lunatic.



..... Phil

LOL The guy answers Phil's question and goes on to describe his experience with the car and Phil is incapable of acknowledging that other than by insulting him.

There are many, many loons in this group, but Phil often takes the cake.

--

Rick C.

++++ Get 2,000 miles of free Supercharging
++++ Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209

 

[Rick C]

On Saturday, October 5, 2019 at 11:19:33 PM UTC-4, Bill Sloman wrote:

On Sunday, October 6, 2019 at 11:49:55 AM UTC+11, edward...@gmail.com wrote:

They probably don't have long enough power cords from home to vehicle. However, if there is a need, there is a way. Using vehicle roof top (around 1 sq. meter) and 40% solar efficiency, you can get 40 to 50 miles per 10 hours sun light. Yes, someone is claiming 40% and possibly higher.

I don't recall who it is, but one company says they will be including solar cells in the roof of their EV. While it is unlikely to provide all the power for an EV, it can help significantly given that it will be charging most days (unless you park indoors). Even adding 30 miles a day would be a good part of many people's daily drive and enable significantly less charging otherwise.

There's another way. Inductive charging under each regular parking spot.

You need a receiving coil under each vehicle. It has been done - experimentally - for a couple of buses, and seems to work. Rolling it out in volume would take a while.

A European company has tested it with taxis and the drivers seem to like it.. They can charge at a number of locations while waiting for a fare. I don't recall the company name, but it has been discussed in this group before and of course the lion's share of the discussion was people trying to prove it wasn't practical/efficient in spite of the fact they were using it and claim better efficiencies than connecting via a cable.


> In a thoroughly re-worked system, the inductive chargers would also be buried under heavily used roads, and charge cars as they drove along the road..

That seems hard to make work in that the alignment has to be very good and would only be accomplished for a very small proportion of the time as the car moves.


> There would be a signalling system that recognised the car as it drove over each coil, and sent the car owner a (very small) bill for each quantum of charge transferred.

Or maybe bury a mechanical cable in the road and let the car be connected in a way that drags the car along.

--

Rick C.

----- Get 2,000 miles of free Supercharging
----- Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209

 

[Phil Allison]

Rick Cunthead is a vile Psychopath

-----------------------------------

His sparse words make it sound like he owns an EV,
but for some fuckwit reason fails to identify it.
Stupid and infuriating.


I own a Prius Prime plugin, and have discussed it in
detail here on s.e.d. a half-dozen times.


** Not in any thread I have seen.

Absurd of you to call it merely a "car".

Many Prius and other hybrids here in Sydney, but no plug-in
versions to be seen.



It's now
one year old, has gone about 6500 miles, mostly all
electric. A hybrid, but has only used 20% of its
2nd tank of gas. My solar roof generates 11MWh per
year, some used to power my car. I plug-in at work
for the rest. What else would you like to know?


** Nothing.

You are clearly a solar /EV raving lunatic.



LOL The guy answers Phil's question

** There was no question from me - it was a complaint, you illiterate moron.

and goes on to describe his experience with the car

** Massive irrelevancy.

I could not give fuck what the scumbag drives.

and Phil is incapable of acknowledging that

** No question, so no need existed - you stinking POS fuckwit.

I have made it very clear I despise smug assholes like Win and Larkin.

They exist only to obfuscate, bullshit and harass.

There are many, many loons in this group,

** And YOU would be right on the top of that list.

Incapable of a single, rational though & devoid of any insight.

One MASSIVE great pile of ASD fucked Yank shit.

BTW:

You do know why Aussies call Americans "Septics" - don't you ?

Look it up.

Then drop fucking dead.



..... Phil

 

[Phil Allison]

Bill Sloman wrote:

--------------------

I own a Prius Prime plugin, and have discussed it in
detail here on s.e.d. a half-dozen times.


** Not in any thread I have seen.

Absurd of you to call it merely a "car".

Many Prius and other hybrids here in Sydney, but no plug-in
versions to be seen.



It's now
one year old, has gone about 6500 miles, mostly all
electric. A hybrid, but has only used 20% of its
2nd tank of gas. My solar roof generates 11MWh per
year, some used to power my car. I plug-in at work
for the rest. What else would you like to know?


** Nothing.

You are clearly a solar /EV raving lunatic.


Win doesn't rave,

** In fact, Win posts raves here all the time.

> unlike certain posters that we know.

** Err - yes, Bill Sloman posts more rambling raves that anyone else.

Countless half cooked pontifications on posts, posters and AGW etc all presented as facts, when they are fucking not.

He's probably not a lunatic either.

** But Win IS however an " EV raving lunatic" .

Clear from his over-enthusiasms here.

FYI to all:

How bloody typical of Slow Bill to pull words and phrases out of all context like that.

Context shifting, done in order to attack a serious post, is a nasty debating cheat. Shame on you Bill. Shame.



..... Phil

 

On Sat, 5 Oct 2019 17:49:51 -0700 (PDT), edward.ming.lee@gmail.com
wrote:

They probably don't have long enough power cords from home to vehicle. However, if there is a need, there is a way. Using vehicle roof top (around 1 sq. meter) and 40% solar efficiency, you can get 40 to 50 miles per 10 hours sun light. Yes, someone is claiming 40% and possibly higher.

While there have been solar races across Australia, the super light
vehicles (tricycles ?) are completely covered with solar cells, the
driver is laying on his stomach to reduce frontal area and hence
reduce air resistance, those are completely impractical for everyday
use.

Those 40 % efficiency claims are from laboratory samples using
multilayer and multispectral panels. One solar cell material uses
red/near infrared, an other converts yellow/green and/or a third layer
uses a material working well for blue/greeen. Such panels would be
expensive. I even doubt that such panels are used even on satellites.

More realistic would be 15 % so 1 m˛ horizontal panel would produce
150 W with the sun in zenith. During noon, the output drops due to
latitude and season, when the sun is in unfavorable angle.

The 10 hour charging period is unrealistic, that would be +/-5 hours
or +/-75 degrees from noon. Due to trigonometry only, the output be 38
W at extremes. Antireflective coating would reduce output even further
at extreme angles.

While parked, actuators could be used to lift one or two edges of the
panel to aim it towards the sun, but at 75 degree offset, the air mass
(AM) losses would reduce output significantly, so 10 hour charging is
not realistic.

While tilting the panels while driving would increase electricity
captured, the added drag due to tilted panels would kill any energy
gains.

With a fixed horizontal 1 m˛ panel, you would be lucky, if you can
collect 1 kWh during a day, which translates to much less than 10
km/day for a regular EV.

 

On Saturday, October 5, 2019 at 10:21:14 PM UTC-7, Rick C wrote:

On Saturday, October 5, 2019 at 11:19:33 PM UTC-4, Bill Sloman wrote:
On Sunday, October 6, 2019 at 11:49:55 AM UTC+11, edward...@gmail.com wrote:

They probably don't have long enough power cords from home to vehicle.. However, if there is a need, there is a way. Using vehicle roof top (around 1 sq. meter) and 40% solar efficiency, you can get 40 to 50 miles per 10 hours sun light. Yes, someone is claiming 40% and possibly higher.

I don't recall who it is, but one company says they will be including solar cells in the roof of their EV. While it is unlikely to provide all the power for an EV, it can help significantly given that it will be charging most days (unless you park indoors). Even adding 30 miles a day would be a good part of many people's daily drive and enable significantly less charging otherwise.

"Sono Motors suggests its car charge up just over 18 miles on a 24% efficient solar cell. If NovaSolix can get to that 90% number, that’s 67 miles of sunlight driving. The average daily miles driven in the USA is about 40 miles per person."

90% is unbelievably high.

 

[Bill Sloman]

On Sunday, October 6, 2019 at 2:17:41 PM UTC+11, Phil Allison wrote:

Winfield Hill wrote:


His sparse words make it sound like he owns an EV,
but for some fuckwit reason fails to identify it.
Stupid and infuriating.


I own a Prius Prime plugin, and have discussed it in
detail here on s.e.d. a half-dozen times.


** Not in any thread I have seen.

Absurd of you to call it merely a "car".

Many Prius and other hybrids here in Sydney, but no plug-in versions to be seen.



It's now
one year old, has gone about 6500 miles, mostly all
electric. A hybrid, but has only used 20% of its
2nd tank of gas. My solar roof generates 11MWh per
year, some used to power my car. I plug-in at work
for the rest. What else would you like to know?


** Nothing.

You are clearly a solar /EV raving lunatic.

Win doesn't rave, unlike certain posters that we know.

He's probably not a lunatic either.

--
Bill sloman, Sydney

 

[Phil Allison]

upsid...@downunder.com wrote:

------------------------------

With a fixed horizontal 1 m² panel, you would be lucky, if you can
collect 1 kWh during a day, which translates to much less than 10
km/day for a regular EV.

** Very game of you to inject a bit of reality into a discussion of PVs and EVs with the resident free energy lunatics.

Likely to get you tarred and feathered, you know.

EVs are like sacred cows to Hindus.



..... Phil

 

[Bill Sloman]

On Sunday, October 6, 2019 at 5:39:22 PM UTC+11, Phil Allison wrote:

upsid...@downunder.com wrote:

------------------------------


With a fixed horizontal 1 m² panel, you would be lucky, if you can
collect 1 kWh during a day, which translates to much less than 10
km/day for a regular EV.


** Very game of you to inject a bit of reality into a discussion of PVs and EVs with the resident free energy lunatics.

Likely to get you tarred and feathered, you know.

EVs are like sacred cows to Hindus.

The solar car race across Australia is real. Putting solar panels on the car is an impractical idea, if not entirely impracticable.

Put a battery in the car, and charge it from a solar farm for the 95% of the day when it is parked, and the whole idea is perfectly practical, as Win has demonstrated - his Prius seems to be of the sort than can have it's battery charged while it is parked, rather than rely on the little petrol engine alone to charge it up. He's bought very little gasoline for the car since he got it.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

 

[Daniel Mandic]

Winfield Hill wrote:

I own a Prius Prime plugin, and have discussed it in
detail here on s.e.d. a half-dozen times. It's now
one year old, has gone about 6500 miles, mostly all
electric. A hybrid, but has only used 20% of its
2nd tank of gas. My solar roof generates 11MWh per
year, some used to power my car. I plug-in at work
for the rest. What else would you like to know?

The Prius Prime plugin is IMHO a VERY well thought out
fuel/electric-car.
It's at the top of my list, if I wanted to buy a passenger car.


--
Daniel Mandic