Toshiba TV29C90 problem; Image fades to black...

[Tony Hwang]

The Daring Dufas wrote:

On 12/21/2013 1:59 AM, Danny D'Amico wrote:
On Mon, 16 Dec 2013 06:53:35 -0700, Tony Hwang wrote:

Do you work fpor Ubiquiti? Nothing new you are doing there.

Naah. I *wish* I worked for Ubiquiti though, as I really like that they
make equipment that is *powerful* and easy to use!

I'm really salivating now over the UniFy access point wifi extender:

http://www.rakuten.com/prod/microcom-unifi-long-range-access-point/246806871.html?listingId=263046258


A friend and I installed one at a neighbor's house today, and
the WiFi range was FANTASTIC! It went to every single room in the house!

We even turned off the SSID from the Netgear home broadband router,
because
it was no longer needed, except to be used simply as a wired switch
for the
access point and desktop computer.

You mean you turned the radio off? SSID can be hidden or broadcast.
I never heard turning off SSID>
Unify is pretty new models. Another DIY source is Mikrotek which may
cost less.

I bought these for a customer to connect two buildings because the labor
to run an outdoor aerial cable was more than installing the wireless
link. ^_^

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B002K683V0/ref=oh_details_o08_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1


http://preview.tinyurl.com/m22nu7u

TDD

 

[Danny D'Amico]

On Sat, 21 Dec 2013 08:00:33 -0700, Tony Hwang wrote:

You mean you turned the radio off? SSID can be hidden or broadcast.
I never heard turning off SSID
Unify is pretty new models. Another DIY source is Mikrotek which may
cost less.

We used the Unify $100 6 Watt (yes, 6 Watt!) access point (they call it
Long Range). It gave 5 bars to all the Apple equipment for the first time
ever, in that house, anywhere they wanted it.

Turned out, we moved it, so, now they changed the router setup to have
both the SSID from the router being the same as the SSID from the access
point.

That the access point overpowers the signal of the router (which is on
a different non-overlapping channel) doesn't seem to adversely affect
them.

 

[Tony Hwang]

Danny D'Amico wrote:

On Sat, 21 Dec 2013 08:00:33 -0700, Tony Hwang wrote:


You mean you turned the radio off? SSID can be hidden or broadcast.
I never heard turning off SSID
Unify is pretty new models. Another DIY source is Mikrotek which may
cost less.

We used the Unify $100 6 Watt (yes, 6 Watt!) access point (they call it
Long Range). It gave 5 bars to all the Apple equipment for the first time
ever, in that house, anywhere they wanted it.

Turned out, we moved it, soHow, now they changed the router setup to have
both the SSID from the router being the same as the SSID from the access
point.

That the access point overpowers the signal of the router (which is on
a different non-overlapping channel) doesn't seem to adversely affect
them.

Hi,
Do you use inSSIDer pro version or even free version? I think having
same SSID is not good. Won't it create confusion when connecting?

 

[dave]

On 12/21/2013 09:37 PM, Tony Hwang wrote:

Danny D'Amico wrote:
On Sat, 21 Dec 2013 08:00:33 -0700, Tony Hwang wrote:


You mean you turned the radio off? SSID can be hidden or broadcast.
I never heard turning off SSID
Unify is pretty new models. Another DIY source is Mikrotek which may
cost less.

We used the Unify $100 6 Watt (yes, 6 Watt!) access point (they call it
Long Range). It gave 5 bars to all the Apple equipment for the first time
ever, in that house, anywhere they wanted it.

Turned out, we moved it, soHow, now they changed the router setup to have
both the SSID from the router being the same as the SSID from the access
point.

That the access point overpowers the signal of the router (which is on
a different non-overlapping channel) doesn't seem to adversely affect
them.

Hi,
Do you use inSSIDer pro version or even free version? I think having
same SSID is not good. Won't it create confusion when connecting?

Maybe we should broadcast something so people don't land on a used
channel. 6 Watts spread spectrum? Maybe. Unifi?

 

[Danny D'Amico]

On Sat, 21 Dec 2013 22:37:03 -0700, Tony Hwang wrote:

Do you use inSSIDer pro version or even free version? I think having
same SSID is not good. Won't it create confusion when connecting?

Hi Tony,

So far they haven't reported any problems.

The Unifi AP-LR was set up at a neighbor's home, so, I don't have
a scan for it (that scan above is from my home, because I was looking
for a distant WiFi channel 9 interference source that was showing up
in a spectrum analysis run from my rooftop radio):
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7310/11427413806_21e93b109b_o.jpg

What I like about the Ubiquiti equipment is sheer POWER! Those
access points are 6 Watts! Compare that to the puny 1/10th of a
Watt of your typical home broadband router.

And, these access points mount like a C02 detector, either on
the wall or on the ceiling, and, they don't need anything but
an Ethernet cable connected to them (as the power supply is
at the other end of the Ethernet cable).

So, for extending WiFi range at home, I am learning all I can about
these things, since they seem to be the right price and power and
they seem to kick consumer equipment's butt!

As for the Android tools to track WiFi access points and SSIDs,
I have InSSIDer freeware on my Android phone and on the laptop.
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7364/11445566476_38a0cdf3b1_o.gif

On Android, I also use WiFi Analyzer, which, I like better than
InSSIDer. There's also "WiFi Signal Strength", which gives tabular
reports.

Unfortunately, I don't seem to have the technical expertise to get
WiFi Stumbler (aks Kismet, I think) & pcap capture working to tell
me useful information yet inside those packets grabbed over the air,
so, that's my next WiFi project when I get around to it.

 

[Danny D'Amico]

On Sun, 22 Dec 2013 05:39:51 -0800, dave wrote:

Maybe we should broadcast something so people don't land on a used
channel. 6 Watts spread spectrum? Maybe. Unifi?

6 Watts only goes so far ...

The houses out here are on 40-acre zoning, so, if you have 79 acres,
you can only build one house. Even though it's Silicon Valley, it's
way up in the mountains above, so, the 6 Watts "shouldn't" be a problem
for this neighbor (who is on over 25 acres and her neighbors are similarly
far apart).

As for those 6 Watts ...

I know that *my* rooftop radio has a 28dBm transmit power plus a 24dBi
antenna gain, which gives me an EIRP of 52dBm, which is a whopping
158 Watts!

So, we're all radiating out here ...

In fact, most of my neighbors have the same equipment as I have, and,
even with all that power bouncing around, my spectrum analysis scans
show signals which all seem to be in the low 10% usage range...
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7310/11427413806_21e93b109b_o.jpg

I'm not sure what that really means to someone who knows what they
are doing, but, I *think* it means that our bands are not crowded,
although it would be nice to see what other people get for % Usage.

 

[Char Jackson]

On Sat, 21 Dec 2013 22:37:03 -0700, Tony Hwang <dragon40@shaw.ca> wrote:

>I think having same SSID is not good. Won't it create confusion when connecting?

There are pros and cons to both arguments: using the same SSID on multiple
AP's (on different channels, of course), versus using different SSID's.

When I set up systems for other people, I use the same SSID much more often
than not because it reduces confusion. Most of the people I deal with are
50-90 years old, so having a single SSID to remember is easier for them.
Mobility, as in roaming, is usually not a consideration because they tell me
they always use their laptop in THIS room and they always use their tablet
in THAT room, etc.

 

[Danny D'Amico]

On Sun, 22 Dec 2013 13:44:52 -0600, Char Jackson wrote:

When I set up systems for other people, I use the same SSID much more often
than not because it reduces confusion.

Makes sense. These people are like that also. Apple users.

 

[DevilsPGD]

In the last episode of <vUutu.7824$VG.4535@fx12.iad>, Tony Hwang
<dragon40@shaw.ca> said:

Do you use inSSIDer pro version or even free version? I think having
same SSID is not good. Won't it create confusion when connecting?

If the underlying networks are bridged, this is a supported
configuration and it allows client machines to move between the access
points seamlessly.

If the networks are not bridged, this will cause IP conflicts and other
problems.

--
I walked into a bar the other day and ordered a double.
The bartender brought out a guy who looked just like me.

 

[The Daring Dufas]

On 12/23/2013 6:23 PM, DevilsPGD wrote:

In the last episode of <vUutu.7824$VG.4535@fx12.iad>, Tony Hwang
dragon40@shaw.ca> said:

Do you use inSSIDer pro version or even free version? I think having
same SSID is not good. Won't it create confusion when connecting?

If the underlying networks are bridged, this is a supported
configuration and it allows client machines to move between the access
points seamlessly.

If the networks are not bridged, this will cause IP conflicts and other
problems.

I call it dueling routers. ^_^

TDD

 

[Michael A. Terrell]

The Daring Dufas wrote:

I call it dueling routers. ^_^

As opposed to dualing routers? ;-)


--
Anyone wanting to run for any political office in the US should have to
have a DD214, and a honorable discharge.

 

On Tue, 24 Dec 2013 12:41:31 -0500, "Michael A. Terrell"
<mike.terrell@earthlink.net> wrote:

The Daring Dufas wrote:

I call it dueling routers. ^_^


As opposed to dualing routers? ;-)

I have five but they just make sawdust.

 

[The Daring Dufas]

On 12/24/2013 11:41 AM, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

The Daring Dufas wrote:

I call it dueling routers. ^_^


As opposed to dualing routers? ;-)

Or the dualism of routers. ^_^

TDD

 

[Danny D.]

On Wed, 25 Dec 2013 10:11:28 -0800, Jeff Liebermann wrote:

Everyone seems to have different definitions of what constitutes
"carrier class" or "professional" wireless hardware. For me, it's
quite simple. Will it do SNMP and can it be monitored and managed
with 3rd party tools?

Interesting. I've got SNMP on all the Ubiquit radios, and,
I've never used it.

Although, that was precisely your point!

 

[Danny D.]

On Wed, 25 Dec 2013 10:27:49 -0800, Jeff Liebermann wrote:

There's nothing wrong with using the same SSID on multiple access
points. It's a good idea to have put each AP on a different RF
channel, so that they don't interfere with each other.

Hi Jeff,
That's what we did. We used ch 1 & 6 so as not to overlap.

I'm really starting to like these access points, although,
the "controller" software is a pain.

For example, we tried to set up a second access point at
another site, and the first access point setup kept getting
in the way.

Had we known, we would have just wiped out the controller
software on our PC, before starting.

If they just put a web server on these Unify access points,
it would make it easier for the consumer. But, other than
the lousy controller software setup (which, in effect, is
merely a login shell for the access point), these Ubiquiti
Unify long-range access points are nice for consumer use.

 

[Danny D.]

On Wed, 25 Dec 2013 10:27:49 -0800, Jeff Liebermann wrote:

You have to manually disconnect from the first access
point, before the client radio will try to find a
better connection.

This is interesting.

I haven't set this up at my own home, so, I'm only
going off what the neighbors are saying, so, we'll
keep this caveat in mind.

However ... just guessing ... it would seem to me
that, if we use the same SSID, that the STRONGEST
should win, and, if one disconnects, it *should*
(logically anyway) switch seamlessly over to the
stronger signal as the person roams the home.

I'll need more data from the neighbors to confirm
or discount that theory though ...

 

[Danny D.]

On Wed, 25 Dec 2013 10:27:49 -0800, Jeff Liebermann wrote:

If you really want seamless roaming between access points, you'll need
a device that supports 802.11r and layer 3 (IP) roaming, which
maintain the same IP address and connection as you switch between
AP's:
https://meraki.cisco.com/technologies/seamless-mobility
For Ubiquity, you'll need a Zero Handoff Roaming (UniFi 3.0) device:
http://windowspbx.blogspot.com/2013/04/ubiquiti-unifi-now-supports-zero.html
http://dl.ubnt.com/datasheets/unifi/UBNT_DS_Zero_Handoff_Roaming.pdf
http://community.ubnt.com/t5/UniFi-Frequently-Asked-Questions/UniFi-What-is-Zero-Handoff/ta-p/412719

Hi Jeff,

That was very useful information!
Thanks for digging it up.
You're a godsend.

As I said, I don't personally have the access point,
as I had helped a friend set it up for a neighbor.

So, I can't log into it at the moment, although he
has the controller software, so, he can probably
log into the neighbor's access point from the web.

Unfortunately, he's on vacation, so I can't ask him
which version he set up the neighbor on, but, it seems
that the latest versions of Ubuiquit Unify software
do have the Zero-Handoff Roaming software included.

 

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Sat, 21 Dec 2013 10:04:13 +0000 (UTC), Danny D'Amico
<danny@is.invalid> wrote:

So, my key contention, which is not intuitive, is that the pro equipment
is actually just about the same price as the consumer equipment, but, it's
vastly more powerful.

Everyone seems to have different definitions of what constitutes
"carrier class" or "professional" wireless hardware. For me, it's
quite simple. Will it do SNMP and can it be monitored and managed
with 3rd party tools?
<http://wiki.ubnt.com/SNMP_and_MRTG_Monitoring>
I think you'll find that SNMP support will make a good dividing line
between consumer and pro. The average home user doesn't need SNMP
even if it's provided. I need it to keep a mess of access points and
routers alive and provide reports and pretty graphs to keep the
customer happy. ISP's need SNMP to allow a diverse collection of
dissimilar hardware to be monitored and managed with a single software
tool:
<http://www.techrepublic.com/blog/five-apps/five-free-network-monitoring-tools/>


--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

 

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Sat, 21 Dec 2013 22:37:03 -0700, Tony Hwang <dragon40@shaw.ca>
wrote:

I think having
same SSID is not good. Won't it create confusion when connecting?

There's nothing wrong with using the same SSID on multiple access
points. It's a good idea to have put each AP on a different RF
channel, so that they don't interfere with each other.

The problem is that most users expect seamless roaming between access
points, and that's not going to happen. Instead, the wireless client
initially picks the strongest/best signal, and connects to that access
point. If the signal level changes, like you're walking around the
house, the wireless client continues to use the first access point,
even though a strong/better signal is available. You have to manually
disconnect from the first access point, before the client radio will
try to find a better connection. By using different SSID's, you can
manually select which of your access points to use. However, if you
have a large system, with dozens of access points, individual SSID's
is not particularly user friendly.

If you really want seamless roaming between access points, you'll need
a device that supports 802.11r and layer 3 (IP) roaming, which
maintain the same IP address and connection as you switch between
AP's:
<https://meraki.cisco.com/technologies/seamless-mobility>
For Ubiquity, you'll need a Zero Handoff Roaming (UniFi 3.0) device:
<http://windowspbx.blogspot.com/2013/04/ubiquiti-unifi-now-supports-zero.html>
<http://dl.ubnt.com/datasheets/unifi/UBNT_DS_Zero_Handoff_Roaming.pdf>
<http://community.ubnt.com/t5/UniFi-Frequently-Asked-Questions/UniFi-What-is-Zero-Handoff/ta-p/412719>

--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

 

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Wed, 25 Dec 2013 20:51:35 +0000 (UTC), "Danny D."
<dannyd@nowhere.com> wrote:

On Wed, 25 Dec 2013 10:27:49 -0800, Jeff Liebermann wrote:

You have to manually disconnect from the first access
point, before the client radio will try to find a
better connection.

This is interesting.

Everything I write is interesting. Sometimes, it's even accurate.

However ... just guessing ... it would seem to me
that, if we use the same SSID, that the STRONGEST
should win, and, if one disconnects, it *should*
(logically anyway) switch seamlessly over to the
stronger signal as the person roams the home.

<http://www.intel.com/support/wireless/wlan/sb/cs-015906.htm>
Fat chance. That's the way it should work. Instead, what happens is
that the client will remain connected to the initial access point, no
matter how weak or disgusting a signal it offers. Even if turn off
the client device, it will try to reconnect to the same initial access
point, even if there's a stronger/better signal with the same SSID
evailable. Even if you intentionally disconnect, the client will
retain the MAC address of the initial access point. When you try to
reconnect, it will try that MAC address first.

Intel seems to have gotten the clue and offers a setting as to how
"aggressive" the client will act in retaining a connection:
<http://www.intel.com/support/wireless/wlan/sb/CS-030101.htm>
It's not a total solution, but does work rather well on my various
laptops.


--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558