L
Lasse Langwadt Christensen
Guest
onsdag den 15. marts 2023 kl. 21.42.21 UTC+1 skrev Carlos E.R.:
hope you don\'t have hard water
hope you don\'t have hard water
R
Rocky
Guest
On Wednesday, March 15, 2023 at 10:42:21â¯PM UTC+2, Carlos E.R. wrote:
We have solar heated water that can get up to 90°C. The solution is to use a \'tempering valve\' which mixes the hot and cold water so that the outlet temperature is 55°C to 60°C <https://www.google.co.za/search?q=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.takealot.com%2F15mm-solar-tempering-valve%2FPLID71231164>
J
Jasen Betts
Guest
On 2023-03-15, Ricky <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> wrote:
You can install an automatic mixing valve to the tank, or at point of
use.
--
Jasen.
ðºð¦ Слава УкÑаÑнÑ
You can install an automatic mixing valve to the tank, or at point of
use.
--
Jasen.
ðºð¦ Слава УкÑаÑнÑ
R
Ricky
Guest
On Friday, March 17, 2023 at 2:30:43â¯AM UTC-4, Jasen Betts wrote:
Not sure what a mixing value does. Will it prevent overly hot water from coming out the faucet? The ones I\'ve seen have a setting, which can be set to very hot. If someone doesn\'t remember to turn it back, you get scalded.
There are many cases of children and people who are otherwise infirm being scalded by overly hot water. That\'s why, in the US, it is recommended that the hot water tank be set no higher than 130°F (55°C). That\'s a temperature that gives you time to prevent scalding.
The only reason to set a higher temperature in a home hot water heater, is to allow the hot water to last longer. But the same thing can be done with a larger tank, at a lower temperature. A lower temperature saves on heat losses too.
--
Rick C.
-+- Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
-+- Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209
Not sure what a mixing value does. Will it prevent overly hot water from coming out the faucet? The ones I\'ve seen have a setting, which can be set to very hot. If someone doesn\'t remember to turn it back, you get scalded.
There are many cases of children and people who are otherwise infirm being scalded by overly hot water. That\'s why, in the US, it is recommended that the hot water tank be set no higher than 130°F (55°C). That\'s a temperature that gives you time to prevent scalding.
The only reason to set a higher temperature in a home hot water heater, is to allow the hot water to last longer. But the same thing can be done with a larger tank, at a lower temperature. A lower temperature saves on heat losses too.
--
Rick C.
-+- Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
-+- Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209
C
Carlos E.R.
Guest
On 2023-03-15 22:01, Don Y wrote:
I was thinking of this one:
<https://plantasflores.com/cactaceas-suculento/carpobrotus-acinaciformis/>
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carpobrotus_acinaciformis>
Or similar.
....
Yep.
RM? Where? :-?
--
Cheers, Carlos.
On 3/15/2023 1:26 PM, Carlos E.R. wrote:
On 2023-03-15 16:16, Don Y wrote:
On 3/15/2023 4:06 AM, Carlos E.R. wrote:
We take for normal what we have
Sadly, yes. I recall, growing up, it was common to \"sweep the
driveway\"
with a hose (instead of a broom). Someone doing that here would
promptly
be told to stop (by concerned neighbors).
Yes, we should do that here as well. We typically \"mind our own
business\".
Oh, the neighbors would *politely* draw your attention to your waste.
We realize that people who \"aren\'t from around here\" likely don\'t
understand the preoccupation with water; what was normal for you in
the last place you lived is likely not the same, here.
However, someone who repeatedly ignores such \"prompting\" can
just as easily find a uniformed police officer making the
same \"threat\" -- with legal consequences!
Oh, I was just thinking that there are cultural differences. Most
people here would think \"mind your own business\" and say nothing, even
if some/many bitch in private about a neighbour that wastes water.
For other things, yes. Leave your trash cans out at the curb an extra day
and folks will grumble *privately*, but likely not comment.
Water, OTOH, affects each of us. That\'s *my* water you\'re wasting!
There are too many houses with pools (when the beach is meters
away), or have a well kept grass garden.
Thankfully, grass is obsolescent (though still not obsolete). The
diehards who are used to a \"lush green lawn\" move to artificial grass
(why not just PAINT the dirt green??)
There are other plants that keep the lawn green while using little
water. Not all of them allow to walk on it, though.
We have crushed granite as a ground cover. Lots of plantings *in*
the yard but each has a dedicated irrigation line to ensure the
water *just* goes to its roots.
Xeriscaping (low water use landscaping) is common. E.g., we have a
couple of large (15 ft) Texas Mountain Laurels adjacent to the
front door. They are *never* watered. Yet, perpetually green.
(in bloom, presently. very pungent. they smell like grape soda)
https://nativebackyards.com/texas-mountain-laurel-tree/
I was thinking of this one:
<https://plantasflores.com/cactaceas-suculento/carpobrotus-acinaciformis/>
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carpobrotus_acinaciformis>
Or similar.
....
Yep.
RM? Where? :-?
--
Cheers, Carlos.
C
Carlos E.R.
Guest
On 2023-03-17 08:40, Ricky wrote:
I have not heard of any one being scalded here. Maybe we are just
smarter
Oh, we also have smart mixing taps.
And smart flash gas heaters that provide a constant temperature flow, on
demand.
Of course that here houses are smaller. Your country is empty, land is
cheap. And our tanks are put near the ceiling: try to do that with a
heavy tank.
--
Cheers, Carlos.
I have not heard of any one being scalded here. Maybe we are just
smarter
Oh, we also have smart mixing taps.
And smart flash gas heaters that provide a constant temperature flow, on
demand.
Of course that here houses are smaller. Your country is empty, land is
cheap. And our tanks are put near the ceiling: try to do that with a
heavy tank.
--
Cheers, Carlos.
C
Carlos E.R.
Guest
On 2023-03-16 02:19, Lasse Langwadt Christensen wrote:
We do.
--
Cheers, Carlos.
We do.
--
Cheers, Carlos.
D
Don Y
Guest
On 3/17/2023 4:49 AM, Carlos E.R. wrote:
\"Ice plants\". We tried a couple of them. But, they get really stressed
in the summer (or, maybe it was the winter??)
The TX MTN Laurel just keeps chugging along. We have three \"trees\"
(exceedingly tall shrubs?) that line the entrance to the front of
the house. They are arranged in such a way that they trap the air
on the front walkway -- after perfuming it! It is really intoxicating.
They are reasonably prolific seeders. But, the \"volunteers\" are
really hard to transplant; disturbing their roots is the kiss of
death.
On the map you cited. RM### for roadways (?)
\"Ice plants\". We tried a couple of them. But, they get really stressed
in the summer (or, maybe it was the winter??)
The TX MTN Laurel just keeps chugging along. We have three \"trees\"
(exceedingly tall shrubs?) that line the entrance to the front of
the house. They are arranged in such a way that they trap the air
on the front walkway -- after perfuming it! It is really intoxicating.
They are reasonably prolific seeders. But, the \"volunteers\" are
really hard to transplant; disturbing their roots is the kiss of
death.
On the map you cited. RM### for roadways (?)
R
Ricky
Guest
On Friday, March 17, 2023 at 7:59:30â¯AM UTC-4, Carlos E.R. wrote:
No, just more arrogant.
So they don\'t produce 70°C water? That\'s the only thing you\'ve said that is smart.
LOL!!! You are a trip. My pressure tank is on the ceiling! We mostly put hot water heaters in the basement, or under stairs or even in the attic. No one has them in their living rooms.
Again, world 2.5.
--
Rick C.
-++ Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
-++ Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209
On 2023-03-17 08:40, Ricky wrote:
On Friday, March 17, 2023 at 2:30:43â¯AM UTC-4, Jasen Betts wrote:
On 2023-03-15, Ricky <gnuarm.del...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Wednesday, March 15, 2023 at 4:42:21â¯PM UTC-4, Carlos E.R. wrote:
Because a 50 litres tank at 70°C lasts a longer shower than a tank at
50°C, or two people. That\'s how it is done here. You simply mix the hot
water with cold. Me, I set the tank to a hotter temp in winter than in
summer.
So there is not room in your home for a larger tank, so you set the hot water to dangerously hot temperatures to provide longer showers. I seem to recall some comment from you about others being wasteful. Here I thought you were talking about taking shorter showers. But clearly that\'s not the case.
You can install an automatic mixing valve to the tank, or at point of
use.
Not sure what a mixing value does. Will it prevent overly hot water from coming out the faucet? The ones I\'ve seen have a setting, which can be set to very hot. If someone doesn\'t remember to turn it back, you get scalded..
There are many cases of children and people who are otherwise infirm being scalded by overly hot water. That\'s why, in the US, it is recommended that the hot water tank be set no higher than 130°F (55°C). That\'s a temperature that gives you time to prevent scalding.
I have not heard of any one being scalded here. Maybe we are just
smarter
No, just more arrogant.
So they don\'t produce 70°C water? That\'s the only thing you\'ve said that is smart.
LOL!!! You are a trip. My pressure tank is on the ceiling! We mostly put hot water heaters in the basement, or under stairs or even in the attic. No one has them in their living rooms.
Again, world 2.5.
--
Rick C.
-++ Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
-++ Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209
C
Carlos E.R.
Guest
On 2023-03-17 13:42, Don Y wrote:
Ah. \"Región de Murcia\". That is, \"RM-F30\" is a road that is owned and
maintained by the Murcia Region, number \"F30\". Dunno what the F stands
for, maybe avoiding three digit roads. Huh, no, I see \"RM-313\".
Dunno why some in yellow and some in green. Good question. Maybe
\"quality\" of the road, the width. [...] Found it. Black on yellow is
regional (autonomic) third level road. White on green, same but second
level.
Autonomic 1st level roads are \"CL-XXX\", where the X are numbers, black
letters on orange background.
<https://www.cnae.com/blog/index.php/clasificacion-carreteras-tipos-espana/>
\"N-340\" is national road 340.
\"AP-7\" is \"Autopista de Peaje\" number 7, ie, toll highway number 7.
--
Cheers, Carlos.
Ah. \"Región de Murcia\". That is, \"RM-F30\" is a road that is owned and
maintained by the Murcia Region, number \"F30\". Dunno what the F stands
for, maybe avoiding three digit roads. Huh, no, I see \"RM-313\".
Dunno why some in yellow and some in green. Good question. Maybe
\"quality\" of the road, the width. [...] Found it. Black on yellow is
regional (autonomic) third level road. White on green, same but second
level.
Autonomic 1st level roads are \"CL-XXX\", where the X are numbers, black
letters on orange background.
<https://www.cnae.com/blog/index.php/clasificacion-carreteras-tipos-espana/>
\"N-340\" is national road 340.
\"AP-7\" is \"Autopista de Peaje\" number 7, ie, toll highway number 7.
--
Cheers, Carlos.
T
Tabby
Guest
On Friday, 17 March 2023 at 07:40:35 UTC, Ricky wrote:
Dunning Kruger strikes again.
Dunning Kruger strikes again.
C
Carlos E.R.
Guest
On 2023-03-17 22:34, Ricky wrote:
LOL.
Sure they do, if you adjust it so.
We put hot water tanks or heaters near the places where the hot water is
used most. If gas, on the kitchen. If electric, in the main bathroom.
And near the ceiling, so that they don\'t use floor space.
Where it makes sense
--
Cheers, Carlos.
On Friday, March 17, 2023 at 7:59:30â¯AM UTC-4, Carlos E.R. wrote:
On 2023-03-17 08:40, Ricky wrote:
On Friday, March 17, 2023 at 2:30:43â¯AM UTC-4, Jasen Betts wrote:
On 2023-03-15, Ricky <gnuarm.del...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Wednesday, March 15, 2023 at 4:42:21â¯PM UTC-4, Carlos E.R. wrote:
Because a 50 litres tank at 70°C lasts a longer shower than a tank at
50°C, or two people. That\'s how it is done here. You simply mix the hot
water with cold. Me, I set the tank to a hotter temp in winter than in
summer.
So there is not room in your home for a larger tank, so you set the hot water to dangerously hot temperatures to provide longer showers. I seem to recall some comment from you about others being wasteful. Here I thought you were talking about taking shorter showers. But clearly that\'s not the case.
You can install an automatic mixing valve to the tank, or at point of
use.
Not sure what a mixing value does. Will it prevent overly hot water from coming out the faucet? The ones I\'ve seen have a setting, which can be set to very hot. If someone doesn\'t remember to turn it back, you get scalded.
There are many cases of children and people who are otherwise infirm being scalded by overly hot water. That\'s why, in the US, it is recommended that the hot water tank be set no higher than 130°F (55°C). That\'s a temperature that gives you time to prevent scalding.
I have not heard of any one being scalded here. Maybe we are just
smarter
No, just more arrogant.
LOL.
Sure they do, if you adjust it so.
We put hot water tanks or heaters near the places where the hot water is
used most. If gas, on the kitchen. If electric, in the main bathroom.
And near the ceiling, so that they don\'t use floor space.
Where it makes sense
--
Cheers, Carlos.
R
Ricky
Guest
On Friday, March 17, 2023 at 7:05:25â¯PM UTC-4, Carlos E.R. wrote:
At this point, you are just being silly. You live a life style that has to preserve every square foot of space, and squeeze every penny on your electric bill. I talked to someone else in Spain who had similar restrictions from the power company. Many places don\'t have such restrictions. The power company provides 50 kW connections for most homes in the US. That doesn\'t mean you have to use 50 kW. It just means you can have a proper hot water heater that just runs when it needs to, rather than being run at the pleasure of the power company. We have room in our homes to put a hot water heater under stairs or in the back of a closet, without worrying that we are taking up valuable floor space.
I\'m sure you manage to deal with these issues, but life is better when you just don\'t need to worry with it.
I pay $0.12 per kWh, with a $14 a month service charge. I turn off my water heater when I\'m away for a week, but it actually saves very little money, maybe $2 a week, at most.
Life is good when you can have things, and not worry with them being scarce.. I would hate to have to turn my water heater off and on every day. Being on a timer is fine, until the timer gets off track.
Yes, world 2.5.
--
Rick C.
+-- Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
+-- Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209
On 2023-03-17 22:34, Ricky wrote:
On Friday, March 17, 2023 at 7:59:30â¯AM UTC-4, Carlos E.R. wrote:
On 2023-03-17 08:40, Ricky wrote:
On Friday, March 17, 2023 at 2:30:43â¯AM UTC-4, Jasen Betts wrote:
On 2023-03-15, Ricky <gnuarm.del...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Wednesday, March 15, 2023 at 4:42:21â¯PM UTC-4, Carlos E.R. wrote:
Because a 50 litres tank at 70°C lasts a longer shower than a tank at
50°C, or two people. That\'s how it is done here. You simply mix the hot
water with cold. Me, I set the tank to a hotter temp in winter than in
summer.
So there is not room in your home for a larger tank, so you set the hot water to dangerously hot temperatures to provide longer showers. I seem to recall some comment from you about others being wasteful. Here I thought you were talking about taking shorter showers. But clearly that\'s not the case.
You can install an automatic mixing valve to the tank, or at point of
use.
Not sure what a mixing value does. Will it prevent overly hot water from coming out the faucet? The ones I\'ve seen have a setting, which can be set to very hot. If someone doesn\'t remember to turn it back, you get scalded.
There are many cases of children and people who are otherwise infirm being scalded by overly hot water. That\'s why, in the US, it is recommended that the hot water tank be set no higher than 130°F (55°C). That\'s a temperature that gives you time to prevent scalding.
I have not heard of any one being scalded here. Maybe we are just
smarter
No, just more arrogant.
LOL.
Oh, we also have smart mixing taps.
And smart flash gas heaters that provide a constant temperature flow, on
demand.
So they don\'t produce 70°C water? That\'s the only thing you\'ve said that is smart.
Sure they do, if you adjust it so.
The only reason to set a higher temperature in a home hot water heater, is to allow the hot water to last longer. But the same thing can be done with a larger tank, at a lower temperature. A lower temperature saves on heat losses too.
Of course that here houses are smaller. Your country is empty, land is
cheap. And our tanks are put near the ceiling: try to do that with a
heavy tank.
LOL!!! You are a trip. My pressure tank is on the ceiling! We mostly put hot water heaters in the basement, or under stairs or even in the attic. No one has them in their living rooms.
Again, world 2.5.
We put hot water tanks or heaters near the places where the hot water is
used most. If gas, on the kitchen. If electric, in the main bathroom.
And near the ceiling, so that they don\'t use floor space.
Where it makes sense
At this point, you are just being silly. You live a life style that has to preserve every square foot of space, and squeeze every penny on your electric bill. I talked to someone else in Spain who had similar restrictions from the power company. Many places don\'t have such restrictions. The power company provides 50 kW connections for most homes in the US. That doesn\'t mean you have to use 50 kW. It just means you can have a proper hot water heater that just runs when it needs to, rather than being run at the pleasure of the power company. We have room in our homes to put a hot water heater under stairs or in the back of a closet, without worrying that we are taking up valuable floor space.
I\'m sure you manage to deal with these issues, but life is better when you just don\'t need to worry with it.
I pay $0.12 per kWh, with a $14 a month service charge. I turn off my water heater when I\'m away for a week, but it actually saves very little money, maybe $2 a week, at most.
Life is good when you can have things, and not worry with them being scarce.. I would hate to have to turn my water heater off and on every day. Being on a timer is fine, until the timer gets off track.
Yes, world 2.5.
--
Rick C.
+-- Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
+-- Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209
D
Don Y
Guest
On 3/17/2023 3:56 PM, Carlos E.R. wrote:
\"Owned by\" is an interesting way of putting it. That may, also, apply
here. But, we tend to think of it as \"maintained by\".
E.g., there are roads that are maintained by the city, county, state,
federal government -- as well as private roads (e.g., in some subdivisions,
the homeowners are responsible for the maintenance of the roads that
interconnect their homes).
Some roads are \"toll-ways\" (pay for use) but most are open for general use.
Second vs. first vs. third? Does this have anything to do with the
quality of the road, how wide it is (lanes), the type of traffic it
supports, etc.?
Here, that distinction is separate from the road\'s \"ownership\". E.g.,
the city road that my subdivision empties onto is 6 lanes. There are other
city/county roads that may be just two lanes. The interstate (federal)
highway to the next metro center is no larger than the road by my
subdivision -- but, the speed limit, there, will be 65 whereas here it\'s
45 (which means 55) and the road construction will be of a higher quality
(better signage, wider shoulders, smoother/more-durable pavement, etc.
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Numbered_highways_in_the_United_States>
\"Owned by\" is an interesting way of putting it. That may, also, apply
here. But, we tend to think of it as \"maintained by\".
E.g., there are roads that are maintained by the city, county, state,
federal government -- as well as private roads (e.g., in some subdivisions,
the homeowners are responsible for the maintenance of the roads that
interconnect their homes).
Some roads are \"toll-ways\" (pay for use) but most are open for general use.
Second vs. first vs. third? Does this have anything to do with the
quality of the road, how wide it is (lanes), the type of traffic it
supports, etc.?
Here, that distinction is separate from the road\'s \"ownership\". E.g.,
the city road that my subdivision empties onto is 6 lanes. There are other
city/county roads that may be just two lanes. The interstate (federal)
highway to the next metro center is no larger than the road by my
subdivision -- but, the speed limit, there, will be 65 whereas here it\'s
45 (which means 55) and the road construction will be of a higher quality
(better signage, wider shoulders, smoother/more-durable pavement, etc.
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Numbered_highways_in_the_United_States>
T
Tabby
Guest
On Friday, 17 March 2023 at 23:20:24 UTC, Ricky wrote:
Ricky doesn\'t know it or get it but still thinks he\'s always right.
He thinks getting the same result in a dumber less efficient way is better. No amount of explaining educates someone that isn\'t even interested.
On Friday, March 17, 2023 at 7:05:25â¯PM UTC-4, Carlos E.R. wrote:
On 2023-03-17 22:34, Ricky wrote:
On Friday, March 17, 2023 at 7:59:30â¯AM UTC-4, Carlos E.R. wrote:
On 2023-03-17 08:40, Ricky wrote:
On Friday, March 17, 2023 at 2:30:43â¯AM UTC-4, Jasen Betts wrote:
On 2023-03-15, Ricky <gnuarm.del...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Wednesday, March 15, 2023 at 4:42:21â¯PM UTC-4, Carlos E.R. wrote:
Because a 50 litres tank at 70°C lasts a longer shower than a tank at
50°C, or two people. That\'s how it is done here. You simply mix the hot
water with cold. Me, I set the tank to a hotter temp in winter than in
summer.
So there is not room in your home for a larger tank, so you set the hot water to dangerously hot temperatures to provide longer showers. I seem to recall some comment from you about others being wasteful. Here I thought you were talking about taking shorter showers. But clearly that\'s not the case.
You can install an automatic mixing valve to the tank, or at point of
use.
Not sure what a mixing value does. Will it prevent overly hot water from coming out the faucet? The ones I\'ve seen have a setting, which can be set to very hot. If someone doesn\'t remember to turn it back, you get scalded.
There are many cases of children and people who are otherwise infirm being scalded by overly hot water. That\'s why, in the US, it is recommended that the hot water tank be set no higher than 130°F (55°C). That\'s a temperature that gives you time to prevent scalding.
I have not heard of any one being scalded here. Maybe we are just
smarter
No, just more arrogant.
LOL.
Oh, we also have smart mixing taps.
And smart flash gas heaters that provide a constant temperature flow, on
demand.
So they don\'t produce 70°C water? That\'s the only thing you\'ve said that is smart.
Sure they do, if you adjust it so.
The only reason to set a higher temperature in a home hot water heater, is to allow the hot water to last longer. But the same thing can be done with a larger tank, at a lower temperature. A lower temperature saves on heat losses too.
Of course that here houses are smaller. Your country is empty, land is
cheap. And our tanks are put near the ceiling: try to do that with a
heavy tank.
LOL!!! You are a trip. My pressure tank is on the ceiling! We mostly put hot water heaters in the basement, or under stairs or even in the attic.. No one has them in their living rooms.
Again, world 2.5.
We put hot water tanks or heaters near the places where the hot water is
used most. If gas, on the kitchen. If electric, in the main bathroom.
And near the ceiling, so that they don\'t use floor space.
Where it makes sense
At this point, you are just being silly.
Ricky doesn\'t know it or get it but still thinks he\'s always right.
He thinks getting the same result in a dumber less efficient way is better. No amount of explaining educates someone that isn\'t even interested.