In Europe: The great CFL rip-off.

On Sep 4, 3:43 pm, "Phil Allison" <phi...@tpg.com.au> wrote:
"Trevor Wilson is a LIAR "

**Cite please. I read about a UK reactor's de-commissioning costs which
started out at 46 BILLION Pounds, but have blown out to 73 Billion and are
expected to rise still further.

** Proves the TW lying charlatan get all his  FALSE   info from web forums.

 Hint:

The real figures are in millions, not billions.

.....  Phil


That is typical of Trev. Plenty of bull, ignorance.

Believing in the man made "carbon pollution" scam proves his lunacy
 
Phil Allison wrote:
"David L. Jones"
KR wrote:
On Sep 4, 3:43 pm, "Phil Allison"
"Trevor Wilson"

**Cite please. I read about a UK reactor's de-commissioning costs
which started out at 46 BILLION Pounds, but have blown out to 73
Billion and are expected to rise still further.

** Proves the TW lying charlatan get all his FALSE info from web
forums.

Hint:

The real figures are in millions, not billions.


That is typical of Trev. Plenty of bull, ignorance.

No, his figure is correct.

** Like FUCKING HELL it is.


To de-commission all the current nuclear reactors in the UK will cost


** LEARN TO READ YOU FUCKING MORON !!!!!!!!!!!

" I read about a UK reactor's... "
I did and I pointed that out in my other post, the cost is clearly for all
reactors (20 of them on the list apparently).

One reactor !!!!!!!!!

FUCK HEAD !!!!!!!!!!!!
Foaming at the mouth isn't going to make your claim about it costing
"millions" instead of "billions" correct Phil. Take your meds and calm down
please.
The official UK government cost is estimated at more than $3B per reactor,
and it keeps creeping up. So Trevor is certainly correct that nuclear
cleanup ain't cheap, and certainly more right than you were.

Based on this new found cost realisation (the NDA was only founded around 5
years ago) the UK is apparently having to seriously re-evaluate the decision
that building new nuclear reactors is a good idea.

Dave.

--
---------------------------------------------
Check out my Electronics Engineering Video Blog & Podcast:
http://www.eevblog.com
 
Phil Allison wrote:
"Trevor Wilson is a FUCKING LIAR "

That is typical of Trev. Plenty of bull, ignorance.

Believing in the man made "carbon pollution" scam proves his lunacy

**It's not my "belief".


** The TW charlatan is a mental defective.

But that is no excuse in law for his many CRIMES.



It the fucking science, you idiot.


** TW would not recognise real " science " if it BIT him on the end of his
tiny dick.

Wilson is a NOTORIOUS CRIMINAL LIAR.

The DIRECT BLOODY OPPOSITE of any of his demented claims is far more
likely to be true.





.... Phil





He is off again. Any scientist that does not agree with Trev is not a
real scientist.
 
David L. Jones is a FUCKING LIAR !!!!
"Trevor Wilson "

**Cite please. I read about a UK reactor's de-commissioning costs
which started out at 46 BILLION Pounds, but have blown out to 73
Billion and are expected to rise still further.

** Proves the TW lying charlatan get all his FALSE info from web
forums.

Hint:

The real figures are in millions, not billions.


That is typical of Trev. Plenty of bull, ignorance.

No, his figure is correct.

** Like FUCKING HELL it is you FUCKING LIAR !!



To de-commission all the current nuclear reactors in the UK will cost...

** LEARN TO READ YOU FUCKING AUTISTIC MORON !!!!!!!!!!

TW said:

" I read about a UK reactor's ... "

That is one ONLY reactor !!!

you LYING AUTISTIC FUCKWIT !!




...... Phil
 
"F Murtz" <haggisz@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:4aa104e9$1@dnews.tpgi.com.au...
Phil Allison wrote:
"Trevor Wilson is a FUCKING LIAR "

That is typical of Trev. Plenty of bull, ignorance.

Believing in the man made "carbon pollution" scam proves his lunacy

**It's not my "belief".


** The TW charlatan is a mental defective.

But that is no excuse in law for his many CRIMES.



It the fucking science, you idiot.


** TW would not recognise real " science " if it BIT him on the end of
his tiny dick.

Wilson is a NOTORIOUS CRIMINAL LIAR.

The DIRECT BLOODY OPPOSITE of any of his demented claims is far
more likely to be true.





.... Phil





He is off again. Any scientist that does not agree with Trev is not a real
scientist.
**Nope. Any scientist who disputes the SCIENCE, is not a scientist.


--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au
 
Trevor Wilson wrote:
"F Murtz" <haggisz@hotmail.com> wrote in message

He is off again. Any scientist that does not agree with Trev is not a real
scientist.

**Nope. Any scientist who disputes the SCIENCE, is not a scientist.
Err, isn't this the Vatican Vs Galileo all over again?
We have a committee of non-scientists making a scientific decision.
couple with the fact that "global warmng" has been must include jargon
in every scientific research grant application for at least the last
three decades.
 
"terryc" <newsninespam-spam@woa.com.au> wrote in message
news:h7scvj$36t$1@news.eternal-september.org...
Trevor Wilson wrote:
"F Murtz" <haggisz@hotmail.com> wrote in message

He is off again. Any scientist that does not agree with Trev is not a
real scientist.

**Nope. Any scientist who disputes the SCIENCE, is not a scientist.

Err, isn't this the Vatican Vs Galileo all over again?
**Maybe, except the Vatican (Tony Abbott et al) are wrong and every sane
person on the planet knows it.

We have a committee of non-scientists making a scientific decision.
**That's normal. The problem is that the non-scientists (the politicians)
are ignoring the suggestions of the scientists. That, too, is normal.

couple with the fact that "global warmng" has been must include jargon in
every scientific research grant application for at least the last three
decades.
**Bullshit. Complete and absolute bullshit.


--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au
 
Trevor Wilson wrote:
"terryc" <newsninespam-spam@woa.com.au> wrote in message
news:h7scvj$36t$1@news.eternal-september.org...
Trevor Wilson wrote:
"F Murtz" <haggisz@hotmail.com> wrote in message
He is off again. Any scientist that does not agree with Trev is not a
real scientist.
**Nope. Any scientist who disputes the SCIENCE, is not a scientist.
Err, isn't this the Vatican Vs Galileo all over again?

**Maybe, except the Vatican (Tony Abbott et al) are wrong and every sane
person on the planet knows it.
So every body that disagrees with Trevor and his scientists are now insane.


We have a committee of non-scientists making a scientific decision.

**That's normal. The problem is that the non-scientists (the politicians)
are ignoring the suggestions of the scientists. That, too, is normal.

couple with the fact that "global warmng" has been must include jargon in
every scientific research grant application for at least the last three
decades.

**Bullshit. Complete and absolute bullshit.
 
"F Murtz" <haggisz@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:4aa1eec0@dnews.tpgi.com.au...
Trevor Wilson wrote:
"terryc" <newsninespam-spam@woa.com.au> wrote in message
news:h7scvj$36t$1@news.eternal-september.org...
Trevor Wilson wrote:
"F Murtz" <haggisz@hotmail.com> wrote in message
He is off again. Any scientist that does not agree with Trev is not a
real scientist.
**Nope. Any scientist who disputes the SCIENCE, is not a scientist.
Err, isn't this the Vatican Vs Galileo all over again?

**Maybe, except the Vatican (Tony Abbott et al) are wrong and every sane
person on the planet knows it.

So every body that disagrees with Trevor and his scientists are now
insane.
**Nope. Anyone who disputes the SCIENCE is an idiot, or in the pay of the
fossil fuel lobby. Or a religious nutter, of course. Sheesh! I don't make
the rules. The science is there. It's proven and solid. Guys like Tony
Abbott, John Howard and George W Bush are hardly pillars of scientific
knowledge. Why any sane person would accept their stupidity as truth is
utterly beyond belief.

For fuck's sake, it's high school science. Anyone in Australia (except
Queensland, of course) has studied this stuff and understands it.


--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au
 
Phil Allison wrote:
David L. Jones

"Trevor Wilson "

**Cite please. I read about a UK reactor's de-commissioning costs
which started out at 46 BILLION Pounds, but have blown out to 73
Billion and are expected to rise still further.

** Proves the TW lying charlatan get all his FALSE info from web
forums.

Hint:

The real figures are in millions, not billions.


That is typical of Trev. Plenty of bull, ignorance.

No, his figure is correct.


** Like FUCKING HELL it is you FUCKING LIAR !!
Settle petal.
The figure he mentioned from an article from memory was correct, but he was
mistaken on it being a single plant, no big deal. Easy mistake to make when
you are playing real-time usenet. No reason to dump all over him and get all
childish and abusive.

The figure is "only" UK$3-4B (AU$6-7B) per plant, and that's just the base
estimate. So he was correct that nuclear decommissioning is expensive
business, very expensive.
Do you still want to claim it's only "millions" per plant and not billions?
It's ok to admit you are wrong Phil, really, no one will think less of you.
Try it some time, it might release some of your inner aggression.

Dave.

--
---------------------------------------------
Check out my Electronics Engineering Video Blog & Podcast:
http://www.eevblog.com
 
Trevor Wilson wrote:
"F Murtz" <haggisz@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:4aa1eec0@dnews.tpgi.com.au...
Trevor Wilson wrote:
"terryc" <newsninespam-spam@woa.com.au> wrote in message
news:h7scvj$36t$1@news.eternal-september.org...
Trevor Wilson wrote:
"F Murtz" <haggisz@hotmail.com> wrote in message
He is off again. Any scientist that does not agree with Trev is
not a real scientist.
**Nope. Any scientist who disputes the SCIENCE, is not a
scientist.
Err, isn't this the Vatican Vs Galileo all over again?

**Maybe, except the Vatican (Tony Abbott et al) are wrong and every
sane person on the planet knows it.

So every body that disagrees with Trevor and his scientists are now
insane.

**Nope. Anyone who disputes the SCIENCE is an idiot, or in the pay of
the fossil fuel lobby. Or a religious nutter, of course. Sheesh! I
don't make the rules. The science is there. It's proven and solid.
Err, not really.
No scientific theory or hypothesis can ever really be completely "proven".
It's usually just the best fit for the current data, waiting for one bit of
data to contradict it or a better theory to come along.
Don't the IPCC reports even say it's only "more than likely" (or some term
like that) to be correct, with that meaning 80% probability (I forget the
exact figure) of being correct?

Guys like Tony Abbott, John Howard and George W Bush are hardly
pillars of scientific knowledge.
Now THAT is proven beyond all doubt! :->

For fuck's sake, it's high school science. Anyone in Australia (except
Queensland, of course) has studied this stuff and understands it.
Some of the concepts, yes, the detailed science, no chance. Atmosphereic
science and climate change is far from easy to understand, and even harder
to model at a fairly crude level. That much I've learned from having an
environmental scientist wife, and an atmospheric scientist sister-in-law!

Dave.
--
---------------------------------------------
Check out my Electronics Engineering Video Blog & Podcast:
http://www.eevblog.com
 
"Trevor Wilson" <trevor@SPAMBLOCKrageaudio.com.au> wrote in message
news:7g6qfvF2n5p2kU1@mid.individual.net...
I don't even want to get into the (un)reliability of those 50 Watt
halogens.
--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au

What brand of halogens have you identified as unreliable?

I have a large number of 12v halogen downlights in my house as well as a
couple of CFL's. After 7 years I am yet to replace a halogen globe while I
have had to replace CFL's. One CFL, in the pantry, has been replaced three
times and it is an exposed globe in a bare light fitting and is never on for
long so I don't expect excess heat has contributed to these failures.
Further, this light probably identifies the worst of CFL's as it is turned
on and off regularly but is only ever on for minutes at a time. Cycle the
Phillips regularly and see how long it lasts. Based on experience I don't
believe Phillips' CFL product is much, if any, better than much cheaper
products as I have used Phillips CFL's and had failures.

The only trouble I have had with the halogens is the thermal protection
activating in the transformer. The protection does take 10-15 minutes to
reset and sometimes a lot longer. This issue is resolved by ensuring the
transformers are not covered by insulation material. The insulation material
has been cut around the halogens to ensure they don't overheat, and the
halogens ventilate to the roof cavity by design.
 
"APR".

I have a large number of 12v halogen downlights in my house as well as a
couple of CFL's. After 7 years I am yet to replace a halogen globe
** All running on dimmers - right ?

Makes the energy efficiency VERY poor indeed but extends lamp life.

Halogens running on dimmers have to be the most energy INEFFICIENT
lighting ever invented.


while I have had to replace CFL's.
One CFL, in the pantry, has been replaced three times and it is an exposed
globe in a bare light fitting and is never on for long so I don't expect
excess heat has contributed to these failures.

** Many cheap Chinese made CFLs have quick start circuits that hammer the
filaments when you switch them on - so they don't last long when cycled
often.



The only trouble I have had with the halogens is the thermal protection
activating in the transformer.
** LOL !!

Massive wasted energy up in the roof as well as from the lamps themselves.

Sooner that BAN the stupid things the better.



..... Phil
 
On Sat, 05 Sep 2009 15:11:32 +1000, Trevor Wilson wrote:

"F Murtz" <haggisz@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:4aa1eec0@dnews.tpgi.com.au...
Trevor Wilson wrote:
"terryc" <newsninespam-spam@woa.com.au> wrote in message
news:h7scvj$36t$1@news.eternal-september.org...
Trevor Wilson wrote:
"F Murtz" <haggisz@hotmail.com> wrote in message
He is off again. Any scientist that does not agree with Trev is not
a real scientist.
**Nope. Any scientist who disputes the SCIENCE, is not a scientist.
Err, isn't this the Vatican Vs Galileo all over again?

**Maybe, except the Vatican (Tony Abbott et al) are wrong and every
sane person on the planet knows it.

So every body that disagrees with Trevor and his scientists are now
insane.

**Nope. Anyone who disputes the SCIENCE is an idiot, or in the pay of
the fossil fuel lobby. Or a religious nutter, of course. Sheesh! I don't
make the rules. The science is there. It's proven and solid.
Umm, no science is proven and solid. it is just the best fit at the
moment.

Guys like
Tony Abbott, John Howard and George W Bush are hardly pillars of
scientific knowledge. Why any sane person would accept their stupidity
as truth is utterly beyond belief.
Actually, it was the out burst from Robyn Williams from the ABC that
started me going "wait a minute". As some one who supposedly supported
the scientific method, he was advocating out right censorship.

since then, I've read more and more articles that point out problems n
data fundamental to that report and much of the criticism has been
accepted. so, in some ways the fundamental data is still going scientific
scrutiny.
For fuck's sake, it's high school science. Anyone in Australia (except
Queensland, of course) has studied this stuff and understands it.
That was then. That was all dropped.
 
"Phil Allison" <phil_a@tpg.com.au> wrote in message
news:7gejcdF2pi48jU1@mid.individual.net...
"APR".

The only trouble I have had with the halogens is the thermal protection
activating in the transformer.

** LOL !!

Massive wasted energy up in the roof as well as from the lamps themselves.

Sooner that BAN the stupid things the better.

..... Phil

I don't disagree Phil. The installation of the halogens was a requirement of
my wife at the time, and I was stupid enough to agree to it. The lights are
not on a dimmer, and there are around 70 x 50w 12v halogen downlights in our
home with each light having it's own transformer. I know, STUPID!!!
STUPID!!! STUPID!!!!!

I have not been able to find a led downlight fitting to fit my recepticle in
240v or 12v. I have thought of putting 4 or 5 crees in series to make a
light unit and then paralleling 5 or 6 of these so I could run them off one
12v halogen light transformer, however, even that is very expensive as the
power cree leds are currently around AU$5 to $7 each. It shouldn't be long
before a compatible led insert becomes available as there are heaps of
people in the same situation as me.
 
"APR" <I_Don't_Want@Spam.com> wrote in message
news:4aa211dc$1@dnews.tpgi.com.au...
"Trevor Wilson" <trevor@SPAMBLOCKrageaudio.com.au> wrote in message
news:7g6qfvF2n5p2kU1@mid.individual.net...

I don't even want to get into the (un)reliability of those 50 Watt
halogens.
--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au

What brand of halogens have you identified as unreliable?
**Crompton, but I've tried others.

I have a large number of 12v halogen downlights in my house as well as a
couple of CFL's. After 7 years I am yet to replace a halogen globe while I
have had to replace CFL's. One CFL, in the pantry, has been replaced three
times and it is an exposed globe in a bare light fitting and is never on
for long so I don't expect excess heat has contributed to these failures.
Further, this light probably identifies the worst of CFL's as it is turned
on and off regularly but is only ever on for minutes at a time. Cycle the
Phillips regularly and see how long it lasts. Based on experience I don't
believe Phillips' CFL product is much, if any, better than much cheaper
products as I have used Phillips CFL's and had failures.

The only trouble I have had with the halogens is the thermal protection
activating in the transformer. The protection does take 10-15 minutes to
reset and sometimes a lot longer. This issue is resolved by ensuring the
transformers are not covered by insulation material. The insulation
material has been cut around the halogens to ensure they don't overheat,
and the halogens ventilate to the roof cavity by design.
**First thing I did was to chuck out those iron transformers. Each one
wasted around 15 Watts. The 'electronic transformers' that replaced them are
far more efficient.


--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au
 
On Sat, 05 Sep 2009 16:53:27 +1000, David L. Jones wrote:

Atmosphereic
science and climate change is far from easy to understand, and even
harder to model at a fairly crude level. That much I've learned from
having an environmental scientist wife, and an atmospheric scientist
sister-in-law!
Speaking of that, what gets me is that we try to predict rain or dryness
for the future from data from the Pacific Ocean, when almost all our
weather starts in the Indian Ocean.
 
"Phil Allison" <phil_a@tpg.com.au> wrote in message
news:7gbck0F2onenqU1@mid.individual.net...
"ian field was probed by an alien "

One trick I've found works well with incanscents is to wire a NTC
inrush limiting thermistor in the switch plate, you have to take some
care over the rating - salvaged thermistors from a scrap monitor
rated between 60 - 80W work well with a 100W bulb.


** Classic bullshit story.

The only increased in lifetime obtained is at the EXPENSE of light
output from the reduced running voltage.

Just use a resistor of 50 to 100 ohms an get even more life.


It's not my problem that you're too thick to know what a NTC thermistor
does.


** Yawnnnnnnnnn....

Ian is a obvious congenital mental defective.

IF he ever had an intelligent thought, that thought would die from
loneliness.


As usual, Filthy doesn't have an intelligent answer ...


** All you posted was is STUPID INSULT

- F U C K W I T !!

You got a very clever one back.
I notice you don't make any attempt to refute the observation that you don't
know what a NTC thermistor does.
 
"David L. Jones" <altzone@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:HVnom.209444$zq1.177194@newsfe22.iad...
Trevor Wilson wrote:
"F Murtz" <haggisz@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:4aa1eec0@dnews.tpgi.com.au...
Trevor Wilson wrote:
"terryc" <newsninespam-spam@woa.com.au> wrote in message
news:h7scvj$36t$1@news.eternal-september.org...
Trevor Wilson wrote:
"F Murtz" <haggisz@hotmail.com> wrote in message
He is off again. Any scientist that does not agree with Trev is
not a real scientist.
**Nope. Any scientist who disputes the SCIENCE, is not a
scientist.
Err, isn't this the Vatican Vs Galileo all over again?

**Maybe, except the Vatican (Tony Abbott et al) are wrong and every
sane person on the planet knows it.

So every body that disagrees with Trevor and his scientists are now
insane.

**Nope. Anyone who disputes the SCIENCE is an idiot, or in the pay of
the fossil fuel lobby. Or a religious nutter, of course. Sheesh! I
don't make the rules. The science is there. It's proven and solid.

Err, not really.
No scientific theory or hypothesis can ever really be completely "proven".
It's usually just the best fit for the current data, waiting for one bit
of data to contradict it or a better theory to come along.
Don't the IPCC reports even say it's only "more than likely" (or some term
like that) to be correct, with that meaning 80% probability (I forget the
exact figure) of being correct?
**The IPCC reports do not predict with 100% accuracy what will occur. They
cannot. They provide a range of possible outcomes, if nothing is done.
Entirely reasonable, given the enormous complexity of the system.

Guys like Tony Abbott, John Howard and George W Bush are hardly
pillars of scientific knowledge.

Now THAT is proven beyond all doubt! :-
**And yet, we have people on this group who subscribe to the ramblings of
these people instead of listening to real scientists.

For fuck's sake, it's high school science. Anyone in Australia (except
Queensland, of course) has studied this stuff and understands it.

Some of the concepts, yes, the detailed science, no chance. Atmosphereic
science and climate change is far from easy to understand, and even harder
to model at a fairly crude level. That much I've learned from having an
environmental scientist wife, and an atmospheric scientist sister-in-law!
**Indeed. The PRECISE outcomes of the present warming trend are unknown. The
APPROXIMATE outcomes are known. It is this fact that the anti-science
religious fruitcakes are banging on about. I find that very disturbing
indeed.

We know the trend.
We know that CO2 acts as a GHG.
We know that CO2 and temperatures are inextricably linked.
We should not have to convince the anti-science idiots, religious zealots
and politicians.


--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au
 
Trevor Wilson wrote:

We know the trend.
We know that CO2 acts as a GHG.
We know that CO2 and temperatures are inextricably linked.
We should not have to convince the anti-science idiots, religious
zealots and politicians.
Jeeze!! Will you stop your arrogant audacity of speaking for everyone.
"We" do not necessarily "know" (and/or agree with) all or some of the points
you raise.

--
Dyna

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