Help with wiring colors on old headphones

[Jamie]

Artemus wrote:

"Patrick" <invalid@invalid.com> wrote in message
news:Xns9EE57F121FAB96AD265@69.16.185.252...

I have some vinatge headphones (Sennheiser HD424) and want to attach a new
plug.

Which color wires are the positive ones?

The colors in one of the leads are red & blue and in the other lead black &
yellow. (No wire is used as screening - there's just two wires in each
lead.)


Wire them up to a mono source and insert a dpdt switch so you can
easily and quickly reverse the phase of one earpiece. Insert a PVC
T coupling between the earpieces. Compare the sound levels coming
from the bottom of the T while flipping the switch. Loudest is in phase.
Art


But!, Are the ears in phase? :~j

Jamie

 

[Phil Allison]

"Tim Wescott"

"If the click seems to come from right inside your head - game over".

What more do you need? Phil's given you a test to see if the phasing is
correct, can you not figure it out, or what to do if the click seems to
come from your right or your left?

** If both ear phones work but are wired out of phase, the AA cell click
test produces a sound that seems to be originating outside the head on both
sides. Mono speech or music sounds much the same.

The effect is far MORE pronounced than with typical stereo speakers in a
room.

The OP demonstrates his a monumental ignorance of headphones, hi-fi sound,
usenet etiquette and common sense.


..... Phil

 

[Phil Allison]

"Meat Plow"


** This trolling asshole is a narcissistic psychopath.

He knows nothing and understands even less.

I want the lunatic jerk kicked right off usenet.

Who will help me ?




..... Phil

 

[Phil Allison]

"David Looser"
Some damn idiot wrote:

It's been instructive to see how many people misunderstood what the
original question was trying to solve and they gave obviously useless, if
not misleading, advice. It's never been the same since Eternal
September.

Actually that's untrue, nobody misunderstood the question or gave useless
or misleading advice. And Phil is quite right, the effect of having the
headphones out of phase with each other is not at all subtle, it is at
least as obvious as it would be with speakers. Just because there is no
phase cancellation in the air doesn't mean that the brain is not
immediately aware of the phase difference heard in the two ears.

** I have come across folk with their hi-fi speakers wired out of phase and
gone un-noticed for months or years. Room acoustics and listening position
being critical to observing the fact. However, stereo headphones wired out
of phase is just the weirdest sound and not tolerated by many for long.

Headphone listening is nothing like listening to stereo speakers or natural
sounds in the environment - the outer ears are no longer involved and moving
one's head has no effect on the sound heard. The stereo effect becomes
extreme and the "sound stage" appears to be inside one's head extending left
and right as well. Plus the who damn thing moves about with your head
movements.



..... Phil

 

[Arfa Daily]

"David Looser" <david.looser@btinternet.com> wrote in message
news:937k8jFp2mU1@mid.individual.net...

"Patrick" <invalid@invalid.com> wrote in message
news:Xns9EE58D9D9D2126AD265@69.16.185.252...
On 13:07 14 May 2011, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

In article <Xns9EE57F121FAB96AD265@69.16.185.252>,
Patrick <invalid@invalid.com> wrote:
I have some vinatge headphones (Sennheiser HD424) and want to attach
a new plug.

Which color wires are the positive ones?

The colors in one of the leads are red & blue and in the other lead
black & yellow. (No wire is used as screening - there's just two
wires in each lead.)

Black and blue are the commons. Not that it would make any difference
if you commoned red and yellow.

You can check for sure by unplugging the leads from each actual
earpiece (red and blue plugs), but be careful to pull on the actual
plug only. The pins are of slightly different sizes.

Hope you have a source of the muffs for these - they crumble to dust
quite quickly.

You must know the headphones well because I had long forgotten the leads
plugged into the earpieces. I didn't realize the mini plugs were keyed
to
go in only one way around. With that info I could have continuity tested
the colored leads to each of the larger pins on the plugs but you saved
me
doing that becauase you have given me the color coding too. Thank you.

You're right about the muffs crumbling. I threw them out. First I'll
see
what the cans sound like now and then decide if it's worth getting new
muffs.

It's been instructive to see how many people misunderstood what the
original question was trying to solve and they gave obviously useless, if
not misleading, advice. It's never been the same since Eternal
September.

Actually that's untrue, nobody misunderstood the question or gave useless
or misleading advice. And Phil is quite right, the effect of having the
headphones out of phase with each other is not at all subtle, it is at
least as obvious as it would be with speakers. Just because there is no
phase cancellation in the air doesn't mean that the brain is not
immediately aware of the phase difference heard in the two ears.

David.

+1

Arfa

 

[who where]

On Sat, 14 May 2011 13:55:16 +0100, Patrick <invalid@invalid.com>
wrote:

On 13:07 14 May 2011, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

(snip)

Hope you have a source of the muffs for these - they crumble to dust
quite quickly.

(snip)

You're right about the muffs crumbling. I threw them out. First I'll see
what the cans sound like now and then decide if it's worth getting new
muffs.

I have Sennheiser HD414's from ~1980. In the last year the muffs have
gone from developing a lasting flat where they rest on a surface, to
literally crumbling.

Sennheiser's national distributor has replacements for $A9 plus
postage. I'm impressed.

 

[Rich Grise]

Patrick wrote:

I have some vinatge headphones (Sennheiser HD424) and want to attach a new
plug.

Which color wires are the positive ones?

The colors in one of the leads are red & blue and in the other lead black
&
yellow. (No wire is used as screening - there's just two wires in each
lead.)

My first guess would be blue+ red- and black+ yellow-, but here's how to
find out. First hook them up, arbitrarily starting with what I said, or
the other way - it's a coin toss. Listen to something in mono. You'll
have to find your own mono source. (finding a mono source is left as an
exercise for the student.)

If the resulting sound comes from the middle of your head, you got
it right. If it sounds like two sources on either side of your head,
you've got the polarity wrong on one side or the other.

I'm getting this from remembering (I think) that in the old 4-wire
phone lines, green was tip and red was ring, and black was tip and yellow
was ring.
--- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tip_and_ring

Hope This Helps!
Rich

 

[Rich Grise]

Patrick wrote:

Your lack of knowledge is made all the more lamentable by the unwarranted
self-assurance with which you conduct yourself.

I believe it's time for you to go fuck yourself.

Thanks for playing!
Rich

 

[Phil Allison]

"Rich Grise"

Patrick wrote:

Your lack of knowledge is made all the more lamentable by the unwarranted
self-assurance with which you conduct yourself.

I believe it's time for you to go fuck yourself.

** That's more like it !!

No kid gloves when dealing with smug, arrogant pricks like Patrick.



..... Phil

 

[mpm]

On May 14, 7:29 am, Patrick <inva...@invalid.com> wrote:

I have some vinatge headphones (Sennheiser HD424) and want to attach a new
plug.

Which color wires are the positive ones?

The colors in one of the leads are red & blue and in the other lead black &
yellow.  (No wire is used as screening - there's just two wires in each
lead.)

Sounds like you got your fix.
(See Usenet really is good for something...)

Still, shoulda bought a pair of AKG K240's.
.....unless you got a huge stash of 8-tracks laying about. !!

-mpm

 

[Phil Allison]

"legg"

Sounds right.

** The OP's headphones are not right until they do.



..... Phil

 

[isw]

In article <51d33d61c0dave@davenoise.co.uk>,
"Dave Plowman (News)" <dave@davenoise.co.uk> wrote:

In article <Xns9EE57F121FAB96AD265@69.16.185.252>,
Patrick <invalid@invalid.com> wrote:
I have some vinatge headphones (Sennheiser HD424) and want to attach a
new plug.

Which color wires are the positive ones?

The colors in one of the leads are red & blue and in the other lead
black & yellow. (No wire is used as screening - there's just two wires
in each lead.)

Black and blue are the commons. Not that it would make any difference if
you commoned red and yellow.

You can check for sure by unplugging the leads from each actual earpiece
(red and blue plugs), but be careful to pull on the actual plug only. The
pins are of slightly different sizes.

Hope you have a source of the muffs for these - they crumble to dust quite
quickly.

I've been making my own for years, out of open-cell foam -- it comes for
free as packaging in all sorts of product boxes.

Isaac

 

[legg]

On Sat, 14 May 2011 22:33:49 +0100, Fleetie
<fleetie@fleetie.demon.co.uk> wrote:

Patrick wrote:
I have some vinatge headphones (Sennheiser HD424) and want to attach a new
plug.

Which color wires are the positive ones?

The colors in one of the leads are red & blue and in the other lead black &
yellow. (No wire is used as screening - there's just two wires in each
lead.)

From my years of tinkering with old stereo headphones as a teenager, I'm
going to confidently guess:

Black - Left Ground/-ve
Yellow - Left +ve

Blue - Right Ground/-ve
Red - Right +ve


Martin

Sounds right.

RL

 

[David Looser]

"Artemus" <bogus@invalid.org> wrote in message
news:iqmtas$49f$1@dont-email.me...

"Patrick" <invalid@invalid.com> wrote in message
news:Xns9EE57F121FAB96AD265@69.16.185.252...
I have some vinatge headphones (Sennheiser HD424) and want to attach a
new
plug.

Which color wires are the positive ones?

The colors in one of the leads are red & blue and in the other lead black
&
yellow. (No wire is used as screening - there's just two wires in each
lead.)

Wire them up to a mono source and insert a dpdt switch so you can
easily and quickly reverse the phase of one earpiece. Insert a PVC
T coupling between the earpieces. Compare the sound levels coming
from the bottom of the T while flipping the switch. Loudest is in phase.
Art

No. Don't mess around with "PVC T-coupling" or any other such nonesense,
just put the headphones on and listen. The effect of having them
out-of-phase is immediate and obvious. And as Phil said that is s far more
reliable method of ensuring correct phasing than assuming that the lead
colour use is consistent.

David.

 

[Phil Allison]

"David Looser"

No. Don't mess around with "PVC T-coupling" or any other such nonesense,
just put the headphones on and listen. The effect of having them
out-of-phase is immediate and obvious. And as Phil said that is s far more
reliable method of ensuring correct phasing than assuming that the lead
colour use is consistent.

** Must be lotsa folks who have never had the dubious pleasure of listening
to out-of-phase signals on stereo phones - cos moulded on plugs and three
wire leads makes doing it even deliberately a bit tricky.

But those who have owned or mucked about with * electrostatic * or *
electret * head phones might well be aware of how it sounds - as there are
four wires to deal with and every chance that at some stage miss-connection
to the amp's speaker terminals will create the issue.

Damn shame these products have all but disappeared or become extraordinarily
expensive.

As a reference for sound quality ( or to hear exactly what is on a
recording) a pair of Stax Electrostatics were in a class of their own.


..... Phil

 

[Phil Allison]

"spamtrap1888"
"Phil Allison"

** I have come across folk with their hi-fi speakers wired out of phase
and
gone un-noticed for months or years. Room acoustics and listening position
being critical to observing the fact. However, stereo headphones wired out
of phase is just the weirdest sound and not tolerated by many for long.

Headphone listening is nothing like listening to stereo speakers or
natural
sounds in the environment - the outer ears are no longer involved and
moving
one's head has no effect on the sound heard. The stereo effect becomes
extreme and the "sound stage" appears to be inside one's head extending
left
and right as well. Plus the who damn thing moves about with your head
movements.

That's why we really should have binaural recordings for headphone
playback. Weren't there stereo-to-pseudo-binaural converters at one
point?


** An Australian company called " Lake Technology " designed and made the
things.

Dolby Labs bought them ( circa 2003) and everything went pear shaped.




..... Phil

 

[Brian Gaff]

Well these leads plug into the ear sockets with little plugs, assuming they
are wired the sam, it should be a simple continuity job.

Most of those phones came with silly din plugs on the end as I recall.

It really does not matter how you do it of course as long as the
transducers are in phase at the end with two leads to earth of the plug.

While on the subject of these open back phones. I have a set of 414s and
need new ear cushions for them. anyone know if they can still be bought?

Brian

--
Brian Gaff....Note, this account does not accept Bcc: email.
graphics are great, but the blind can't hear them
Email: briang1@blueyonder.co.uk
______________________________________________________________________________________________________________


"Patrick" <invalid@invalid.com> wrote in message
news:Xns9EE57F121FAB96AD265@69.16.185.252...

I have some vinatge headphones (Sennheiser HD424) and want to attach a new
plug.

Which color wires are the positive ones?

The colors in one of the leads are red & blue and in the other lead black
&
yellow. (No wire is used as screening - there's just two wires in each
lead.)

 

[Brian Gaff]

I bet you are in teaching... grin

Brian

--
Brian Gaff....Note, this account does not accept Bcc: email.
graphics are great, but the blind can't hear them
Email: briang1@blueyonder.co.uk
______________________________________________________________________________________________________________


"Phil Allison" <phil_a@tpg.com.au> wrote in message
news:93788nFs8nU1@mid.individual.net...

"Patrick"

I have some vinatge headphones (Sennheiser HD424) and want to attach a new
plug.

Which color wires are the positive ones?

The colors in one of the leads are red & blue and in the other lead black
&
yellow. (No wire is used as screening - there's just two wires in each
lead.)


** Stick the damn phones on your fat head and connect pairs of wires to a
AA battery until you hear a click.

Now you have your two pairs of wires.

Wire them to a plug any way around you like and connect the same AA to the
common and both positives at the same time.

If the click seems to comes from right inside your head - game over.

If you need more explanation - you do not deserve it.



..... Phil

 

[William Sommerwerck]

"Phil Allison" <phil_a@tpg.com.au> wrote in message
news:938lcvFfohU1@mid.individual.net...

"Meat Plow"

** This trolling asshole is a narcissistic psychopath.

He knows nothing and understands even less.
I want the lunatic jerk kicked right off usenet.
Who will help me ?

If the "lunatic jerk" you're referring to is yourself... I'd say everyone in
this group.

 

[Phil Allison]

"William Sommerwanker"

"Meat Plow"

** This trolling asshole is a narcissistic psychopath.

He knows nothing and understands even less.
I want the lunatic jerk kicked right off usenet.
Who will help me ?

If the "lunatic jerk" you're referring to is yourself... I'd say everyone
in
this group.

** Ain't it just amazing !!

If you go after ONE troll, the rest of the cunts come in and gang up on
you.

So you gotta take the WHOLE lot on, all at once.

What a bunch of gutless, fascist pricks they are.



..... Phil