For All the Michael Moore Fans

[John Larkin]

On Sun, 11 Jul 2004 13:15:37 -0700, Jim Thompson
<thegreatone@example.com> wrote:

On Sun, 11 Jul 2004 12:57:39 -0700, John Larkin
jjlarkin@highSNIPlandTHIStechPLEASEnology.com> wrote:

On Sun, 11 Jul 2004 11:49:35 -0700, Jim Thompson
thegreatone@example.com> wrote:

On Sun, 11 Jul 2004 11:42:08 -0700, John Larkin
jjlarkin@highSNIPlandTHIStechPLEASEnology.com> wrote:

On Fri, 9 Jul 2004 22:59:51 -0700, John Miles
jmiles@pop.removethistomailme.net> wrote:

In article <4teoe05eu378qq4kbnphe312pqu9ks9or8@4ax.com>,
jjlarkin@highSNIPlandTHIStechPLEASEnology.com says...

There's no way we're going to change the gun situation in this
country, but if you have teenagers around the house, especially males,
keep the guns locked up.


That didn't seem to be a problem in rural Oklahoma where I grew up. As
the famous tech-support maxim states, "It doesn't seem to happen here.
The problem must be on your end."

-- jm


I'd expect rural Oklahoma to have a low suicide rate per square mile.

John


But every kid has a rifle, just like we did in West Virginia.
Suicides were virtually unheard of, and when they were they were
usually via slashed wrists.

...Jim Thompson


Good grief, just google something like "suicide rate urban rural" for
some data.

First hit is...

http://healthlink.mcw.edu/article/903998694.html

"In rural areas, suicide accounted for 91 percent of all firearm
fatalities (20 of 22). In urban areas, suicide accounted for only 20
percent of all firearm fatalities (39 of 158)."

Now, John! You're playing the "How to Lie with Statistics" bit. From
your own citation the suicide RATE is only slightly higher in rural
areas 16/100,000 versus 13.5/100,000. And note the interesting "91%
of all firearm fatalities". That tells me of a low crime rate.



2nd hit, interesting graph for Canada here:

http://www.cfc-ccaf.gc.ca/en/research/other_docs/factsheets/rural/default.asp

showing small towns with 8x the gunfire suicide rates of large cities.

If I live in rural Canada I might consider suicide myself ;-)



Third hit says...

"Researchers are beginning to further study why rural residents commit
suicide at a higher rate than those in urban areas...and the West
leads the nation..."

and on the same google page,

"In China the suicide rate in rural areas is three times that of urban
areas (Neal, 1998)."


Actually, the idea that small towns and rural areas have less crime,
suicide, family violence, and sexual peversity is pretty much a myth.


John

Throw a little extra "perversity" into the mix.

Well, google that one, too. I've seen the city and the country, and
some very weird stuff happens down on the farm.

Less crime for sure, the other items are "human nature" ;-)

Damn, John, you're starting to pontificate like a liberal :-(

...Jim Thompson

David killed himself mostly because he moved with his mother to a
hellhole small town called Opelousas, Louisiana, where the schools and
the people stifled him. The google search confirms that small towns
and rural areas have at best (say, in Finland) equal suicide rates
compared to urban areas, but for most countries (USA, Canada,
Australia, China... that's just on the first search page) rural rates
are in fact a lot higher. David was a very interesting guy, and I miss
him still, almost 40 years after he died.

This has nothing to do with being liberal.

John

 

[Jim Thompson]

On Sun, 11 Jul 2004 14:06:24 -0700, John Larkin
<jjlarkin@highSNIPlandTHIStechPLEASEnology.com> wrote:

On Sun, 11 Jul 2004 13:15:37 -0700, Jim Thompson
thegreatone@example.com> wrote:

On Sun, 11 Jul 2004 12:57:39 -0700, John Larkin
jjlarkin@highSNIPlandTHIStechPLEASEnology.com> wrote:

[snip]
Actually, the idea that small towns and rural areas have less crime,
suicide, family violence, and sexual peversity is pretty much a myth.


John

Throw a little extra "perversity" into the mix.


Well, google that one, too. I've seen the city and the country, and
some very weird stuff happens down on the farm.

Less crime for sure, the other items are "human nature" ;-)

Damn, John, you're starting to pontificate like a liberal :-(

...Jim Thompson

David killed himself mostly because he moved with his mother to a
hellhole small town called Opelousas, Louisiana, where the schools and
the people stifled him. The google search confirms that small towns
and rural areas have at best (say, in Finland) equal suicide rates
compared to urban areas, but for most countries (USA, Canada,
Australia, China... that's just on the first search page) rural rates
are in fact a lot higher. David was a very interesting guy, and I miss
him still, almost 40 years after he died.

This has nothing to do with being liberal.

John

I can understand why being moved into a small town environment might
be stifling. Even growing up there might give one a feeling of "no
escape".

Personally I fled WV as fast as I could run. For me that was easy, I
had scholarship offers from about every engineering school in the US.
But I had also previously covered my ass by arranging to join the Air
Force if necessary; I was getting out, no matter what.

I even married against my family's wishes. Told them to go f...off
They didn't speak to us until the first grandchild was born. Now
we're fine. But I've always been independent ;-)

But, at no time did I contemplate suicide. Maybe rural families are
harsher disciplinarians, to wit, the kid on Donaldson's ranch who
bumped off his whole family?

But I still don't see 16/100,000 versus 13.5/100,000 as "in fact a lot
higher".

I certainly can understand personal losses, but I tend to get over
them with time. The current one disturbing me is the recent death of
a young (40-ish) restaurateur I knew well, killed in a car accident,
hit by a drunk driver :-(

...Jim Thompson
--
| James E.Thompson, P.E. | mens |
| Analog Innovations, Inc. | et |
| Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus |
| Phoenix, Arizona Voice480)460-2350 | |
| E-mail Address at Website Fax480)460-2142 | Brass Rat |
| http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 |

I love to cook with wine. Sometimes I even put it in the food.

 

[Rich Grise]

on Friday 09 July 2004 05:46 am, Chuck Harris wrote:

I knew 10 people who were pedestrians, killed by automobiles.
I knew 3 people who were killed while riding motorcycles.
I knew more than a dozen who were killed in automobile accidents.
I knew a dozen, killed in household accidents. Mostly falls.
And dozens who died of natural causes, and one killed through
a medical misadventure.

They should have taken up smoking - their chances would have

been better!

;-)
--
Cheers!
Rich

 

[Blair P. Houghton]

Jim Thompson <thegreatone@example.com> wrote:

On Thu, 08 Jul 2004 04:18:39 GMT, Blair P. Houghton <b@p.h> wrote:

[snip]
I'll have to take a look to see if it's idiomatic or
indicting.

In any case, if he made one mistake that all of us would
have made because it was generally reported that way, then
claiming the entire movie is nothing but lies would be
a form of the Fallacy of Composition.

"He'll still sue you if you lie
about him."

Sounds like **you** haven't seen the movie.

Because I've already said in the thread that I haven't.
But not many have given me reason to think I'm actually
wrong in my subjunctive propositions as opposed to wrong
in their eyes.

BTW, I've recently seen Clarke's testimony to Congress on
the incident in question (flights for bin Ladens), and it's
clear because he said it that while it came across his desk
it was proposed by another agency, most likely either the
State Department or the Office of the White House Chief of
Staff.

So like I say. It's a policy issue at least.

But, if someone can find the memo that told Clarke to vet
the plan, it's a Bush call and Clarke's playing politics.

--Blair
"What? Again?"