Apple have stolen my ipad. Yes, this story now has an ending

[3899jk]

"Lewis" <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote in message
news:slrnni87sg.1aha.g.kreme@amelia.local...

In message <5723505f$0$8251$c3e8da3$cc4fe22d@news.astraweb.com
F Murtz <haggisz@hotmail.com> wrote:
Lewis wrote:
In message <5722c425$0$28830$c3e8da3$88b277c5@news.astraweb.com
F Murtz <haggisz@hotmail.com> wrote:
Lewis wrote:
In message <572144fe$0$4506$c3e8da3$b280bf18@news.astraweb.com
F Murtz <haggisz@hotmail.com> wrote:
Lewis wrote:
In message <doasl3FqgdgU1@mid.individual.net
3899jk <3899jk@gmail.com> wrote:


"Lewis" <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote in message
news:slrnni0dai.ktn.g.kreme@amelia.local...
In message <57200db8$0$4557$c3e8da3$b280bf18@news.astraweb.com
F Murtz <haggisz@hotmail.com> wrote:
Don McKenzie wrote:

for the people that want to keep changing the facts on my
receipts, to
suit their own version of the story:

http://www.dontronics.com/apple.htm

Cheers Don...


Glad it is working, it was a forgone conclusion that Apple would
have to
fix it,

Not at all. No where on the planet is there a law that compels
Apple to
unlock a device without proof of ownership.

Wrong.
https://www.accc.gov.au/consumers/consumer-rights-guarantees/consumer-guarantees

Where does it say Apple has to unlock a device that someone has
forgotten their password for?
it is unlocked not withstanding all your crap, QED

Oh right, NO WHERE.

Neither "password" nor "unlock" appears anywhere on that page.

it is unlocked not withstanding all your crap, QED
Says absolutely NOTHING about proof of ownership.

Says absolutely nothing about unlocking or bypassing passwords.
it is unlocked not withstanding all your crap, QED

It is unlocked because the owner was able to provide a valid receipt
with a serial number, and for no other reason.

He would not have needed the serial no

He *DID* need a valid receipt with a serial number. His original receipt
was rejected and he was told he had to provide another one. Despite all
your blustering, it was not until after this second receipt was
submitted that Apple did anything, and even then they did not unlock the
previous iCloud account, they simply removed the activation lock on the
iPad so he could set it up with a new account.


He does NOT need a receipt with a serial number on it, he WOULD need to
produce the serial number however.

He *DID* need a receipt with a serial number.

Legally, he doesn’t in this country.

> Try again.

No need.

 

[nospam]

In article <dongvbFcpanU1@mid.individual.net>, Rod Speed
<rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote:

Red herring, The case in question, there's no 'rando' calling.

apple doesn't know that until they can verify proper ownership.

Which was staring them in the face as soon as they knew which Apple ID
was involved.

and when apple sent a verification email, it went unverified because he
couldn't access it.

Doesn't need to be verified, it had Don's company name in it.

that's easily faked, and if it was really his company's email, he would
be able to verify it by responding to a verification email, which he
could not do.

that tells apple it really *isn't* his apple id, so apple asked for
other proof.

he failed to provide *every* type of proof they asked for, up until he
found an invoice with the serial number.

he did not know the password to the email account either (which was
likely the same password for both).

It wasn't. He'd been using it fine until the iOS upgrade stupidly demanded
the Apple ID that has originally been used to setup the ipad.

all he needed was to enter in the password, which is what millions of
people did. no big deal.

he forgot the password, so he paid the price.

very simple.

again, the only people that apple's policies will piss off are those
who steal stuff, and i'll add, somehow benefit if only indirectly.

providing a receipt is not a big deal for a legitimate owner.

Wrong, as always. Plenty lose the receipt and very few of those
who have a receipt for an idevice that is bought used ever have
a receipt with a serial number on it. And legally that isnt required.

those people remember their passwords.

if someone forgets their password *and* can't answer the security
questions *and* can't verify the email address on file *and* has no
invoice that shows it's legitimately theirs, then apple isn't going to
release it.

that's *exactly* the situation that activation lock is designed to
block.

 

[Rod Speed]

nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote

Rod Speed <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote

Red herring, The case in question, there's no 'rando' calling.

apple doesn't know that until they can verify proper ownership.

Wrong in Don's case, the Apple ID had his company name in it.

completely meaningless and easily faked. anyone can create
any apple id they want or claim they own any existing apple id.

Yes, but no thief can know that that was done when the device
was setup initially, when the thief steals the ipad years later, so
it is evidence that it can't have been done by a thief of the ipad.

> that's why apple sends a verification email to the email on file,

Which they must have, because Don did use that Apple ID to
setup the ipad initially.

> which a legitimate owner can easily respond.

No need to do that years later.

> don failed that step,

Doesn't matter, he clearly did that when he setup the ipad initially.

> along with failing every other verification step.

Another bare faced lie with the receipt that was provided THREE times.

> that leaves providing a valid invoice with the device's serial number.

Which they initially rejected until Apple got
someone with even half a clue onto the job.

> once he provided that, apple released it.

Another bare faced lie.

> very simple.

Complete pack of lies in fact.

 

[Rod Speed]

nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote

Rod Speed <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote

He *DID* need a valid receipt with a serial number.

No, he did not *need* that.

yes he did need that or some other evidence that it was legitimately
his.

He always had that, the Apple ID that was used
to setup the ipad contains his company name.

easily faked.

No point in doing that years before the ipad needs to be reset.

And a receipt with the serial number it is even easier to fake.

Keep desperately attempting to bullshit and lie your way out of
your predicament and fooling absolutely no one at all, as always.

 

[3899jk]

"Lewis" <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote in message
news:slrnnid794.1oa3.g.kreme@amelia.local...

In message <doni9mFd14mU1@mid.individual.net
3899jk <3899jk@gmail.com> wrote:


"Lewis" <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote in message
news:slrnni87sg.1aha.g.kreme@amelia.local...
In message <5723505f$0$8251$c3e8da3$cc4fe22d@news.astraweb.com
F Murtz <haggisz@hotmail.com> wrote:
Lewis wrote:
In message <5722c425$0$28830$c3e8da3$88b277c5@news.astraweb.com
F Murtz <haggisz@hotmail.com> wrote:
Lewis wrote:
In message <572144fe$0$4506$c3e8da3$b280bf18@news.astraweb.com
F Murtz <haggisz@hotmail.com> wrote:
Lewis wrote:
In message <doasl3FqgdgU1@mid.individual.net
3899jk <3899jk@gmail.com> wrote:


"Lewis" <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote in message
news:slrnni0dai.ktn.g.kreme@amelia.local...
In message <57200db8$0$4557$c3e8da3$b280bf18@news.astraweb.com
F Murtz <haggisz@hotmail.com> wrote:
Don McKenzie wrote:

for the people that want to keep changing the facts on my
receipts, to
suit their own version of the story:

http://www.dontronics.com/apple.htm

Cheers Don...


Glad it is working, it was a forgone conclusion that Apple
would
have to
fix it,

Not at all. No where on the planet is there a law that compels
Apple to
unlock a device without proof of ownership.

Wrong.
https://www.accc.gov.au/consumers/consumer-rights-guarantees/consumer-guarantees

Where does it say Apple has to unlock a device that someone has
forgotten their password for?
it is unlocked not withstanding all your crap, QED

Oh right, NO WHERE.

Neither "password" nor "unlock" appears anywhere on that page.

it is unlocked not withstanding all your crap, QED
Says absolutely NOTHING about proof of ownership.

Says absolutely nothing about unlocking or bypassing passwords.
it is unlocked not withstanding all your crap, QED

It is unlocked because the owner was able to provide a valid receipt
with a serial number, and for no other reason.

He would not have needed the serial no

He *DID* need a valid receipt with a serial number. His original
receipt
was rejected and he was told he had to provide another one. Despite
all
your blustering, it was not until after this second receipt was
submitted that Apple did anything, and even then they did not unlock
the
previous iCloud account, they simply removed the activation lock on
the
iPad so he could set it up with a new account.


He does NOT need a receipt with a serial number on it, he WOULD need
to
produce the serial number however.

He *DID* need a receipt with a serial number.

Legally, he doesn’t in this country.

Despite all your blustering, you've produced not a shred
of proof to this absurd and ridiculous statement. Not one.

YOU made the pig ignorant claim that that is legally required
in this country.

YOU get to provide the proof of that.

THAT'S how it works.

The fact is that until he provide Apple with a valid
receipt with the serial number, Apple did nothing.

The original receipt had a serial number on it, Apple rejected that.

Once he provided the valid receipt, they
removed the activation lock on the iPad.

Once someone with even half a clue got to deal
with the problem, Apple did whatever needed to
be done so that Don could use that ipad again.

> NB: they did NOT unlock the iCloud account.

You don’t know what they did.

 

[Rod Speed]

nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote

Rod Speed <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote

Red herring, The case in question, there's no 'rando' calling.

apple doesn't know that until they can verify proper ownership.

Which was staring them in the face as soon
as they knew which Apple ID was involved.

and when apple sent a verification email, it
went unverified because he couldn't access it.

Doesn't need to be verified, it had Don's company name in it.

that's easily faked,

Not possible for a thief to do that YEARS after done initialised it.

> and if it was really his company's email,

No one ever said it was.

he would be able to verify it by responding
to a verification email, which he could not do.

that tells apple it really *isn't* his apple id,

Like hell it does. ALL it tells anyone that he no longer
has the password to that account and Apple can see how
long it has been since that account has been used too.

> so apple asked for other proof.

Which is even easier to fake.

he failed to provide *every* type of proof they asked
for, up until he found an invoice with the serial number.

Which is even easier to fake by a thief, so that proves nothing at all.

he did not know the password to the email account
either (which was likely the same password for both).

It wasn't. He'd been using it fine until the iOS upgrade stupidly
demanded
the Apple ID that has originally been used to setup the ipad.

all he needed was to enter in the password,
which is what millions of people did. no big deal.

And plenty couldn't do that, which is why Apple fixed that fuckup.

> he forgot the password, so he paid the price.

He paid no price, he got what he was always legally entitled to.

> very simple.

Complete pack of lies from you, as always.

again, the only people that apple's policies will piss off are those
who steal stuff, and i'll add, somehow benefit if only indirectly.

providing a receipt is not a big deal for a legitimate owner.

Wrong, as always. Plenty lose the receipt and very few of those
who have a receipt for an idevice that is bought used ever have
a receipt with a serial number on it. And legally that isnt required.

those people remember their passwords.

Plenty of them don't.

if someone forgets their password *and* can't answer the security
questions *and* can't verify the email address on file *and* has no
invoice that shows it's legitimately theirs, then apple isn't going to
release it.

Completely trivial to fake an invoice with the serial number on it.

Even you could manage that if someone was actually stupid
enough to lend you a seeing eye dog and a white cane.

> that's *exactly* the situation that activation lock is designed to block.

Pity anyone can fake a receipt with a serial number on it.

 

[3899jk]

"Lewis" <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote in message
news:slrnnidiah.1p8t.g.kreme@amelia.local...

In message <dono8oFe175U1@mid.individual.net
3899jk <3899jk@gmail.com> wrote:


"Lewis" <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote in message
news:slrnnid794.1oa3.g.kreme@amelia.local...
In message <doni9mFd14mU1@mid.individual.net
3899jk <3899jk@gmail.com> wrote:


"Lewis" <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote in message
news:slrnni87sg.1aha.g.kreme@amelia.local...
In message <5723505f$0$8251$c3e8da3$cc4fe22d@news.astraweb.com
F Murtz <haggisz@hotmail.com> wrote:
Lewis wrote:
In message <5722c425$0$28830$c3e8da3$88b277c5@news.astraweb.com
F Murtz <haggisz@hotmail.com> wrote:
Lewis wrote:
In message <572144fe$0$4506$c3e8da3$b280bf18@news.astraweb.com
F Murtz <haggisz@hotmail.com> wrote:
Lewis wrote:
In message <doasl3FqgdgU1@mid.individual.net
3899jk <3899jk@gmail.com> wrote:


"Lewis" <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote in message
news:slrnni0dai.ktn.g.kreme@amelia.local...
In message
57200db8$0$4557$c3e8da3$b280bf18@news.astraweb.com
F Murtz <haggisz@hotmail.com> wrote:
Don McKenzie wrote:

for the people that want to keep changing the facts on my
receipts, to
suit their own version of the story:

http://www.dontronics.com/apple.htm

Cheers Don...


Glad it is working, it was a forgone conclusion that Apple
would
have to
fix it,

Not at all. No where on the planet is there a law that compels
Apple to
unlock a device without proof of ownership.

Wrong.
https://www.accc.gov.au/consumers/consumer-rights-guarantees/consumer-guarantees

Where does it say Apple has to unlock a device that someone has
forgotten their password for?
it is unlocked not withstanding all your crap, QED

Oh right, NO WHERE.

Neither "password" nor "unlock" appears anywhere on that page.

it is unlocked not withstanding all your crap, QED
Says absolutely NOTHING about proof of ownership.

Says absolutely nothing about unlocking or bypassing passwords.
it is unlocked not withstanding all your crap, QED

It is unlocked because the owner was able to provide a valid
receipt
with a serial number, and for no other reason.

He would not have needed the serial no

He *DID* need a valid receipt with a serial number. His original
receipt
was rejected and he was told he had to provide another one. Despite
all
your blustering, it was not until after this second receipt was
submitted that Apple did anything, and even then they did not unlock
the
previous iCloud account, they simply removed the activation lock on
the
iPad so he could set it up with a new account.


He does NOT need a receipt with a serial number on it, he WOULD need
to
produce the serial number however.

He *DID* need a receipt with a serial number.

Legally, he doesn’t in this country.

Despite all your blustering, you've produced not a shred
of proof to this absurd and ridiculous statement. Not one.

YOU made the pig ignorant claim that that is legally required
in this country.

No. I said that Apple requires proof of ownership to unlock an account.
You claimed that some law in your country compels Apple to unlock
devices without proof of ownership.

I never said that.

The fact is that until he provide Apple with a valid
receipt with the serial number, Apple did nothing.

The original receipt had a serial number on it, Apple rejected that.

A hand-printed serial number is not proof of ownership.

Neither is one with a machine printed serial number either,
trivially easy to print your own.

Once he provided the valid receipt, they
removed the activation lock on the iPad.

Once someone with even half a clue got to deal
with the problem, Apple did whatever needed to
be done so that Don could use that ipad again.

No, once Don provide proof of ownership.

Apple always had proof that Don owns that ipad, the
Apple ID he used to set it up contains Don's company
name and since that setup was done years ago, Don
can't be a thief who is trying to claim he owns that
ipad now.

 

[Lewis]

In message <dood0lFhlscU1@mid.individual.net>
3899jk <3899jk@gmail.com> wrote:

"Lewis" <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote in message
news:slrnnidiah.1p8t.g.kreme@amelia.local...
In message <dono8oFe175U1@mid.individual.net
3899jk <3899jk@gmail.com> wrote:


"Lewis" <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote in message
news:slrnnid794.1oa3.g.kreme@amelia.local...
In message <doni9mFd14mU1@mid.individual.net
3899jk <3899jk@gmail.com> wrote:


"Lewis" <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote in message
news:slrnni87sg.1aha.g.kreme@amelia.local...
In message <5723505f$0$8251$c3e8da3$cc4fe22d@news.astraweb.com
F Murtz <haggisz@hotmail.com> wrote:
Lewis wrote:
In message <5722c425$0$28830$c3e8da3$88b277c5@news.astraweb.com
F Murtz <haggisz@hotmail.com> wrote:
Lewis wrote:
In message <572144fe$0$4506$c3e8da3$b280bf18@news.astraweb.com
F Murtz <haggisz@hotmail.com> wrote:
Lewis wrote:
In message <doasl3FqgdgU1@mid.individual.net
3899jk <3899jk@gmail.com> wrote:


"Lewis" <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote in message
news:slrnni0dai.ktn.g.kreme@amelia.local...
In message
57200db8$0$4557$c3e8da3$b280bf18@news.astraweb.com
F Murtz <haggisz@hotmail.com> wrote:
Don McKenzie wrote:

for the people that want to keep changing the facts on my
receipts, to
suit their own version of the story:

http://www.dontronics.com/apple.htm

Cheers Don...


Glad it is working, it was a forgone conclusion that Apple
would
have to
fix it,

Not at all. No where on the planet is there a law that compels
Apple to
unlock a device without proof of ownership.

Wrong.
https://www.accc.gov.au/consumers/consumer-rights-guarantees/consumer-guarantees

Where does it say Apple has to unlock a device that someone has
forgotten their password for?
it is unlocked not withstanding all your crap, QED

Oh right, NO WHERE.

Neither "password" nor "unlock" appears anywhere on that page.

it is unlocked not withstanding all your crap, QED
Says absolutely NOTHING about proof of ownership.

Says absolutely nothing about unlocking or bypassing passwords.
it is unlocked not withstanding all your crap, QED

It is unlocked because the owner was able to provide a valid
receipt
with a serial number, and for no other reason.

He would not have needed the serial no

He *DID* need a valid receipt with a serial number. His original
receipt
was rejected and he was told he had to provide another one. Despite
all
your blustering, it was not until after this second receipt was
submitted that Apple did anything, and even then they did not unlock
the
previous iCloud account, they simply removed the activation lock on
the
iPad so he could set it up with a new account.


He does NOT need a receipt with a serial number on it, he WOULD need
to
produce the serial number however.

He *DID* need a receipt with a serial number.

Legally, he doesn’t in this country.

Despite all your blustering, you've produced not a shred
of proof to this absurd and ridiculous statement. Not one.

YOU made the pig ignorant claim that that is legally required
in this country.

No. I said that Apple requires proof of ownership to unlock an account.
You claimed that some law in your country compels Apple to unlock
devices without proof of ownership.

I never said that.

You are a lying sack of shit. It's right there IN THE MESSAGE YOU
QUOTED:

Me:

Not at all. Nowhere on the planet is there a law that compels Apple
to unlock a device without proof of ownership.

You:

Wrong.
https://www.accc.gov.au/consumers/consumer-rights-guarantees/consumer-guarantees

Fucking worthless troll.

--
And, btw, my face cannot go blue because I have no face, I am not like that...
--Dorayme, in a fit of nonsensical drivel

 

[nospam]

In article <donnsvFdvdmU1@mid.individual.net>, Rod Speed
<rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote:

Red herring, The case in question, there's no 'rando' calling.

apple doesn't know that until they can verify proper ownership.

Wrong in Don's case, the Apple ID had his company name in it.

completely meaningless and easily faked. anyone can create
any apple id they want or claim they own any existing apple id.

Yes, but no thief can know that that was done when the device
was setup initially, when the thief steals the ipad years later, so
it is evidence that it can't have been done by a thief of the ipad.

thieves can find out all sorts of stuff about the original owner.

that's why apple sends a verification email to the email on file,

Which they must have, because Don did use that Apple ID to
setup the ipad initially.

he did not know the password to the email account, so he could not
verify it.

that's why apple wanted a receipt.

 

[3899jk]

"Lewis" <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote in message
news:slrnnielrm.1rlr.g.kreme@amelia.local...

In message <dood0lFhlscU1@mid.individual.net
3899jk <3899jk@gmail.com> wrote:
"Lewis" <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote in message
news:slrnnidiah.1p8t.g.kreme@amelia.local...
In message <dono8oFe175U1@mid.individual.net
3899jk <3899jk@gmail.com> wrote:


"Lewis" <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote in message
news:slrnnid794.1oa3.g.kreme@amelia.local...
In message <doni9mFd14mU1@mid.individual.net
3899jk <3899jk@gmail.com> wrote:


"Lewis" <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote in message
news:slrnni87sg.1aha.g.kreme@amelia.local...
In message <5723505f$0$8251$c3e8da3$cc4fe22d@news.astraweb.com
F Murtz <haggisz@hotmail.com> wrote:
Lewis wrote:
In message <5722c425$0$28830$c3e8da3$88b277c5@news.astraweb.com
F Murtz <haggisz@hotmail.com> wrote:
Lewis wrote:
In message <572144fe$0$4506$c3e8da3$b280bf18@news.astraweb.com
F Murtz <haggisz@hotmail.com> wrote:
Lewis wrote:
In message <doasl3FqgdgU1@mid.individual.net
3899jk <3899jk@gmail.com> wrote:


"Lewis" <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote in message
news:slrnni0dai.ktn.g.kreme@amelia.local...
In message
57200db8$0$4557$c3e8da3$b280bf18@news.astraweb.com
F Murtz <haggisz@hotmail.com> wrote:
Don McKenzie wrote:

for the people that want to keep changing the facts on my
receipts, to
suit their own version of the story:

http://www.dontronics.com/apple.htm

Cheers Don...


Glad it is working, it was a forgone conclusion that Apple
would
have to
fix it,

Not at all. No where on the planet is there a law that
compels
Apple to
unlock a device without proof of ownership.

Wrong.
https://www.accc.gov.au/consumers/consumer-rights-guarantees/consumer-guarantees

Where does it say Apple has to unlock a device that someone
has
forgotten their password for?
it is unlocked not withstanding all your crap, QED

Oh right, NO WHERE.

Neither "password" nor "unlock" appears anywhere on that page.

it is unlocked not withstanding all your crap, QED
Says absolutely NOTHING about proof of ownership.

Says absolutely nothing about unlocking or bypassing
passwords.
it is unlocked not withstanding all your crap, QED

It is unlocked because the owner was able to provide a valid
receipt
with a serial number, and for no other reason.

He would not have needed the serial no

He *DID* need a valid receipt with a serial number. His original
receipt
was rejected and he was told he had to provide another one.
Despite
all
your blustering, it was not until after this second receipt was
submitted that Apple did anything, and even then they did not
unlock
the
previous iCloud account, they simply removed the activation lock
on
the
iPad so he could set it up with a new account.


He does NOT need a receipt with a serial number on it, he WOULD
need
to
produce the serial number however.

He *DID* need a receipt with a serial number.

Legally, he doesn’t in this country.

Despite all your blustering, you've produced not a shred
of proof to this absurd and ridiculous statement. Not one.

YOU made the pig ignorant claim that that is legally required
in this country.

No. I said that Apple requires proof of ownership to unlock an account.
You claimed that some law in your country compels Apple to unlock
devices without proof of ownership.

I never said that.

You are a lying sack of shit. It's right there IN THE MESSAGE YOU
QUOTED:

Me:
Not at all. Nowhere on the planet is there a law that compels Apple
to unlock a device without proof of ownership.

You:
Wrong.
https://www.accc.gov.au/consumers/consumer-rights-guarantees/consumer-guarantees

Fucking worthless troll.

That is saying something quite different, that there
is no mention of proof of ownership there, as I said
after the bit you quoted and have now flagrantly
dishonestly left out of the quoting.

 

[Rod Speed]

nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote

Rod Speed <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote

Red herring, The case in question, there's no 'rando' calling.

apple doesn't know that until they can verify proper ownership.

Wrong in Don's case, the Apple ID had his company name in it.

completely meaningless and easily faked. anyone can create
any apple id they want or claim they own any existing apple id.

Yes, but no thief can know that that was done when the device
was setup initially, when the thief steals the ipad years later, so
it is evidence that it can't have been done by a thief of the ipad.

thieves can find out all sorts of stuff about the original owner.

But finding out Don's company name YEARS after he has used it
in the Apple ID to setup an ipad he bought YEARS ago is completely
useless for a thief who wants to steal Don's ipad and then ring
Apple claiming to be Don and get Apple to reset that ipad so
the thief can use it.

And it is completely trivial for Apple to call Don on one
of his company contact numbers and check if it really is
Don that is calling them now to get the ipad reset.

that's why apple sends a verification email to the email on file,

Which they must have, because Don did use that Apple ID to
setup the ipad initially.

he did not know the password to the email account, so he could not verify
it.

No point in verifying it, its got his company name in it.

> that's why apple wanted a receipt.

Which is in fact trivially easy to fake with a serial number printed on it
so that proves absolutely nothing about who the owner of that ipad is.

 

[Don McKenzie]

At this point, can I ask a serious question, and get a sensible answer?

Is there anyone that has an iPad serial on a receipt, and can prove it by posting a masked version (for your own
security), similar to what I have done? See: http://www.dontronics.com/apple.htm

There is so much emphasis on there being a serial number on the receipt.
It must be false, because there is no serial number on it!!!
I had to really push hard to get a serial number on my iPad receipt after 3.5 years, and just wondering what the normal
procedure is.

I have sold electronic items since 1964, and never put a serial number on a receipt for hardware. I have in recent years
for software, as it often ties in with a web delivered product, but never for hardware.

Cheers Don...



--
Don McKenzie

Dontronics will be launching a new Shopping Cart. We are hoping to migrate
across to this site on Sunday May 15th (all things going to plan!)
It will be located at the following link: https://www.shop-dontronics.com/

Existing site - http://www.dontronics-shop.com

 

[nospam]

In article <dopkabFprshU1@mid.individual.net>, Rod Speed
<rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote:

Red herring, The case in question, there's no 'rando' calling.

apple doesn't know that until they can verify proper ownership.

Wrong in Don's case, the Apple ID had his company name in it.

completely meaningless and easily faked. anyone can create
any apple id they want or claim they own any existing apple id.

Yes, but no thief can know that that was done when the device
was setup initially, when the thief steals the ipad years later, so
it is evidence that it can't have been done by a thief of the ipad.

thieves can find out all sorts of stuff about the original owner.

But finding out Don's company name YEARS after he has used it
in the Apple ID to setup an ipad he bought YEARS ago is completely
useless for a thief who wants to steal Don's ipad and then ring
Apple claiming to be Don and get Apple to reset that ipad so
the thief can use it.

And it is completely trivial for Apple to call Don on one
of his company contact numbers and check if it really is
Don that is calling them now to get the ipad reset.

all he needs to do is reply to the verification email. he couldn't, so
the next step is an invoice.

apple is not going to release a device that's activation locked with
just a phone call. that's *way* too easy to fake.

 

[nospam]

In article <dopmn1FqclvU1@mid.individual.net>, Don McKenzie <5V@2.5A>
wrote:

> At this point, can I ask a serious question, and get a sensible answer?

you've been given sensible answers. you just don't like them because it
means admitting fault. you'd rather blame others.

Is there anyone that has an iPad serial on a receipt, and can prove it by
posting a masked version (for your own
security), similar to what I have done? See:
http://www.dontronics.com/apple.htm

receipts either contain a serial number and/or it can be looked up via
the order number.

just because the store from which you bought it failed to do that
doesn't mean other sellers don't. next time, buy from a different
store, or better yet, don't forget your passwords.

 

[Rod Speed]

Don McKenzie <5V@2.5A> wrote

> At this point, can I ask a serious question, and get a sensible answer?

Yes, just ignore the fools that keep desperately
claiming that Apple never fucks anything up.

Is there anyone that has an iPad serial on a receipt, and can prove it by
posting a masked version (for your own security), similar to what I have
done? See: http://www.dontronics.com/apple.htm

None of mine have. But then I'm not actually stupid
enough to buy stuff from Apple authorised resellers
because of the ripoff prices they charge, not even
with stuff as basic as a lightning cable.

There is so much emphasis on there being a serial number on the receipt.
It must be false, because there is no serial number on it!!!

And they are so fucking stupid that they don’t even realise
that it is completely trivial to fake one that has, and are so
fucking stupid that they can't bring themselves to admit
that sweet fuck all idevices bought used would ever have
a receipt with a serial number on it.

I had to really push hard to get a serial number on my iPad receipt after
3.5 years, and just wondering what the normal procedure is.

That most sellers don’t have the serial number on their receipts.

Apple authorised resellers may well do, but even Apple
realises that lots of stuff is bought from other than Apple
authorised resellers and that it is in fact illegal in many
jurisdictions for Apple to require that their stuff can only
be bought from Apple authorised resellers.

I have sold electronic items since 1964, and never put a serial number on
a receipt for hardware.

I can't remember the last time I ever got
a receipt that had a serial number on it.
No idevice ever has had one.

I have in recent years for software, as it often ties in with a web
delivered product, but never for hardware.

 

[Rod Speed]

nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote

Rod Speed <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote

Red herring, The case in question, there's no 'rando' calling.

apple doesn't know that until they can verify proper ownership.

Wrong in Don's case, the Apple ID had his company name in it.

completely meaningless and easily faked. anyone can create
any apple id they want or claim they own any existing apple id.

Yes, but no thief can know that that was done when the device
was setup initially, when the thief steals the ipad years later, so
it is evidence that it can't have been done by a thief of the ipad.

thieves can find out all sorts of stuff about the original owner.

But finding out Don's company name YEARS after he has used it
in the Apple ID to setup an ipad he bought YEARS ago is completely
useless for a thief who wants to steal Don's ipad and then ring
Apple claiming to be Don and get Apple to reset that ipad so
the thief can use it.

And it is completely trivial for Apple to call Don on one
of his company contact numbers and check if it really is
Don that is calling them now to get the ipad reset.

all he needs to do is reply to the verification email.

All Apple needs to do is to send that to one of the other
Apple IDs that Apple can see Don has used recently, not
to one that was only ever used to setup that particular
ipad all those years ago and was never used again.

> he couldn't, so the next step is an invoice.

He always had that invoice. And an invoice is even easier to
fake than anything else, so proves nothing about ownership.

Unlike sending the verification email to an Apple ID that
Apple can see has been used much more recently on that
ipad than the one that was used to set it up all those year
ago and has never been used since that time.

apple is not going to release a device that's activation
locked with just a phone call. that's *way* too easy to fake.

Yes, but an invoice with the serial number on it is even easier
to fake. A response to a verification email sent to one of the
Apple IDs that Apple can see has been used on that ipad
recently isnt.

Keep furiously digging, you'll be out in China any day now.

Say hello to Xi Jinping from us, or Kim Jung Un if you fuck
up your hole digging as spectacularly as you have fucked
up your desperate attempt to bullshit and lie your way out
of your predicament, as always,

 

[David Empson]

Don McKenzie <5V@2.5A> wrote:

At this point, can I ask a serious question, and get a sensible answer?

Is there anyone that has an iPad serial on a receipt, and can prove it by
posting a masked version (for your own security), similar to what I have
done? See: http://www.dontronics.com/apple.htm

My Apple products bought from Apple's online store do NOT have serial
numbers on the invoice/receipt.

Digging through my archives, I found the receipts for two Apple products
bought from authorised resellers. The iPad 2 I bought in March 2011 has
a serial number printed on its receipt (thermal printed, now almost
illegible, but the digits I can read match the record I kept in my
database of serial numbers). The MacBook Pro I bought in April 2010
(from a different reseller) does NOT have a serial number on the
receipt.

Other identifying information such as the invoice number allows tracking
the order in the records of Apple or the reseller. I expect there are
internal records of the serial number of the device which was sold.

For a sale through an authorised Apple reseller, there will be
sufficient documentation that Apple supplied that deice to the reseller,
and the reseller's invoice identifies the purchaser, so a matching
invoice/receipt from the purchaser (with the invoice number) proves the
device hasn't been stolen.

In your case, the purchase was NOT from an authorised Apple reseller, so
Apple has no way to track the sale of that iPad: they would have a
record of where it was originally sold, and possibly who it was sold to,
but that doesn't match up with your purchase from Becextech, because
Apple has no business dealings with that company and no record of
selling your iPad to them. It is likely that the iPad was originally
sold by Apple in a different country, then resold to you by Becextech in
Australia.

As far as Apple was concerned, your iPad was either a second hand
purchase, or potentially stolen then on-sold to you by a grey market
reseller.

Normally, if an iPad is purchased second hand, the original owner would
have gone through the "erase all content and settings" mechanism to
remove their personal data from the device. If the device was linked to
"Find my iPhone", this requires the password of the original owner's
Apple ID, and once that is entered, the device is deregistered from
"Find my iPhone". It then has no attachment to the original owner's
Apple ID, and the new owner can set it up as a new iPad.

If an iPad is stolen with "Find my iPhone" activated, then the thief (or
recipient of stolen goods) can't remove the Find my iPhone link without
guessing the password for the original owner's Apple ID.

The fact that you couldn't remember the password for the Apple ID which
was used to activate the iPad (and didn't have any other way to prove
you owned that account) was presumably a red flag which pushed Apple
support staff down the "stolen iPad" line of reasoning.

> There is so much emphasis on there being a serial number on the receipt.

Only because the purchase was not from an authorised reseller. All you
had was a receipt that said this company Apple didn't know about had
sold you an iPad. Apple had no way to link that sale to your iPad.

It must be false, because there is no serial number on it!!! I had to
really push hard to get a serial number on my iPad receipt after 3.5
years, and just wondering what the normal procedure is.

The normal procedure is not to forget your Apple ID password, and if you
do, use other methods such as security questions or email recovery to
reset the password.

If all that fails, you need to be able to provide sufficient evidence
that you own the device, before Apple will release the activation lock.

In this case, you didn't have sufficient evidence of ownership because
the purchase was from an unauthorised reseller.

Once Becextech produced a document saying they sold an iPad to you with
the same serial number as your iPad, Apple probably changed their mind
and decided there was sufficient evidence it was a legitimate purchase,
even if they still had no records indicating how that iPad got to
Becextech. (The fact that the second invoice indicated the company was
based in Hong Kong rather than Australia might have been a factor,
especially if Apple had sold the iPad in Hong Kong.)

That was sufficient for Apple to release the activation lock on the
device (but not unlock the Apple ID, as you still hadn't established
proof that it was yours).

I have sold electronic items since 1964, and never put a serial number on
a receipt for hardware. I have in recent years for software, as it often
ties in with a web delivered product, but never for hardware.

Do you at least keep records of serial numbers of hardware products
sold, with sufficient documentation to link it to the purchaser?

--
David Empson
dempson@actrix.gen.nz

 

[nospam]

In article <dopqqdFr7rrU1@mid.individual.net>, Rod Speed
<rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote:

All Apple needs to do is to send that to one of the other
Apple IDs that Apple can see Don has used recently, not
to one that was only ever used to setup that particular
ipad all those years ago and was never used again.

the other apple ids aren't relevant.

the apple id that locked the ipad is the only one that matters.

he doesn't remember the password to the apple id nor can he verify
email sent to it, so some *other* verification will be required, which
is an invoice.

and that's exactly what happened.

he couldn't, so the next step is an invoice.

He always had that invoice. And an invoice is even easier to
fake than anything else, so proves nothing about ownership.

nonsense.

a forged invoice is trivial to detect.

print up whatever you want, but once they cross-reference it with the
seller, it'll be clear it's a forgery and then you'll be in a lot more
trouble than you already are.

as i said before, the only people who find the verification process to
be a problem are those who benefit from stolen devices.

honest people simply provide the necessary information and the problem
is resolved. or they don't forget their passwords in the first place.

 

[nospam]

In article <1mmo010.8enzumhjkozkN%dempson@actrix.gen.nz>, David Empson
<dempson@actrix.gen.nz> wrote:

Other identifying information such as the invoice number allows tracking
the order in the records of Apple or the reseller. I expect there are
internal records of the serial number of the device which was sold.

there definitely is.

For a sale through an authorised Apple reseller, there will be
sufficient documentation that Apple supplied that deice to the reseller,
and the reseller's invoice identifies the purchaser, so a matching
invoice/receipt from the purchaser (with the invoice number) proves the
device hasn't been stolen.

yep

In your case, the purchase was NOT from an authorised Apple reseller, so
Apple has no way to track the sale of that iPad: they would have a
record of where it was originally sold, and possibly who it was sold to,
but that doesn't match up with your purchase from Becextech, because
Apple has no business dealings with that company and no record of
selling your iPad to them. It is likely that the iPad was originally
sold by Apple in a different country, then resold to you by Becextech in
Australia.

As far as Apple was concerned, your iPad was either a second hand
purchase, or potentially stolen then on-sold to you by a grey market
reseller.

Normally, if an iPad is purchased second hand, the original owner would
have gone through the "erase all content and settings" mechanism to
remove their personal data from the device. If the device was linked to
"Find my iPhone", this requires the password of the original owner's
Apple ID, and once that is entered, the device is deregistered from
"Find my iPhone". It then has no attachment to the original owner's
Apple ID, and the new owner can set it up as a new iPad.

If an iPad is stolen with "Find my iPhone" activated, then the thief (or
recipient of stolen goods) can't remove the Find my iPhone link without
guessing the password for the original owner's Apple ID.

The fact that you couldn't remember the password for the Apple ID which
was used to activate the iPad (and didn't have any other way to prove
you owned that account) was presumably a red flag which pushed Apple
support staff down the "stolen iPad" line of reasoning.

exactly.

 

[Lewis]

In message <dopmn1FqclvU1@mid.individual.net>
Don McKenzie <5V@2.5A> wrote:

At this point, can I ask a serious question, and get a sensible answer?

Is there anyone that has an iPad serial on a receipt, and can prove it
by posting a masked version (for your own security), similar to what I
have done? See: http://www.dontronics.com/apple.htm

Every receipt I have from Apple (going back to 2001 in my email). Here is
one:

<https://www.dropbox.com/s/t74vfqnsv2sp1ru/Screenshot%202016-05-02%2020.19.26.png?dl=0>

There is so much emphasis on there being a serial number on the
receipt. It must be false, because there is no serial number on it!!!
I had to really push hard to get a serial number on my iPad receipt
after 3.5 years, and just wondering what the normal procedure is.

Had you bought your iPad from an authorized reseller Apple would have
had a record of the ipad being sent to an authorized seller and a record
of it being sold.

I have sold electronic items since 1964, and never put a serial number
on a receipt for hardware.

Ever computer, iPad, iPhone, Hard Drive, router, and other serialized
items has had a receipt with the serial number for... oh, the last
twenty years at least.





--
Everybody hates a tourist, especially one who thinks it's all such
laugh. Yeah, and the chip stains and grease will come out in the bath.
You will never understand how it feels to live your life with no meaning
or control, and with nowhere left to go. You are amazed that the exist,
and they burn so bright whilst you can only wonder why.