Aldi Ł59 petrol generator and television

[Michael A. Terrell]

Arfa Daily wrote:

Rod Speed wrote:

You have no idea that they did fail by overvoltage.

You don't know what the fuck you are talking about you stupid arsewipe.

Don't waste your time with this troll.

<https://www.google.com/search?num=100&hl=en&safe=active&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla%3Aen-US%3Aofficial&q=%22rod+speed%22+troll&oq=%22rod+speed%22+troll&gs_l=serp.3..0i30j0i8i30.7123.8598.0.11649.2.2.0.0.0.0.92.162.2.2.0...0.0...1c.Us4JMvoBRrQ>

 

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Fri, 13 Jul 2012 12:08:36 +1000, "Rod Speed"
<rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote:

Load one at 400VA and look at the waveform. It's fairly ugly.

And you don't get that with the generator being discussed.

An unbalanced load isn't required, which only creates even order
(asymmetric) distortion. A single phase generator will happily create
odd order (symmetrical) distortion without an unbalanced generator
load. For example:
<http://www2.electronicproducts.com/Generators_UPSs_match_or_bridge_to_nowhere-article-fapo_Falcon_mar2009-html.aspx>
Scroll down to the oscilloscope photograph. Note the noise and
distortion. This is fairly typical of cheapo small geneators with
mechanical regulators. I've seen worse.

Speaking of worse, not the oscilloscope photos:
<http://www.screenlightandgrip.com/html/emailnewsletter_generators.html>
<http://www.jkovach.net/projects/powerquality/>
<http://www.bwpowertools.com/channels/246_v.aspx>

It's this garbage waveform that causes switching power supplies to
complain and UPS power supplies to refuse to run on generator power.

Incidentally, if you plan to look at the waveforms produced by a
gasoline generator with an oscillosope, use two scope probes and
differential inputs. One probe connects to each side of the power
line. The two probe grounds go to the generator frame ground. The
scope input selector is set to A-B. That will remove any common mode
noise on the display, and provide some protection against accidentally
getting the oscilloscope case at line potential.


--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

 

[John Rumm]

On 13/07/2012 02:23, Arfa Daily wrote:

"Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:a69943FbkaU1@mid.individual.net...
Arfa Daily <arfa.daily@ntlworld.com> wrote

Repeating again, I don't see any evidence of an overvoltage problem
in the multitude of switchers that cross my bench.

I like switchers.

But you are an utter ass.

Of course. But I'm still right.

It is very common for the cheapo Chinese switchers used in items like
DVD players, to fail in this way.

You have no idea that they did fail by overvoltage.



You don't know what the fuck you are talking about you stupid arsewipe.

Its wodney, you know that is always his starting point!


--
Cheers,

John.

/=================================================================\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\=================================================================/

 

[Rod Speed]

Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com> wrote

Rod Speed <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote

Load one at 400VA and look at the waveform. It's fairly ugly.

And you don't get that with the generator being discussed.

An unbalanced load isn't required, which only creates
even order (asymmetric) distortion. A single phase
generator will happily create odd order (symmetrical)
distortion without an unbalanced generator load.

But you don't get anything like the amount of distortion
you were going on about, so it isnt a problem with an SMPS
being powered from that particular generator being discussed.

For example:
http://www2.electronicproducts.com/Generators_UPSs_match_or_bridge_to_nowhere-article-fapo_Falcon_mar2009-html.aspx
Scroll down to the oscilloscope photograph. Note the noise and
distortion.

No SMPS will have a problem with that.

This is fairly typical of cheapo small geneators
with mechanical regulators. I've seen worse.

You don't know that the generator
being discussed is anything like that.

Speaking of worse, not the oscilloscope photos:
http://www.screenlightandgrip.com/html/emailnewsletter_generators.html
http://www.jkovach.net/projects/powerquality/
http://www.bwpowertools.com/channels/246_v.aspx

It's this garbage waveform that causes switching power supplies to
complain

You don't know that the generator being discussed will produce that result.

and UPS power supplies to refuse to run on generator power.

One of those wasn't even being discussed.

Incidentally, if you plan to look at the waveforms produced by a
gasoline generator with an oscillosope, use two scope probes and
differential inputs. One probe connects to each side of the power
line. The two probe grounds go to the generator frame ground.
The scope input selector is set to A-B. That will remove any common
mode noise on the display, and provide some protection against
accidentally getting the oscilloscope case at line potential.

No news to me.

 

[Tim Streater]

In article <a69sgsF700U1@mid.individual.net>,
"Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote:

[not much]

Why are your posts so content-free?

--
Tim

"That excessive bail ought not to be required, nor excessive fines imposed,
nor cruel and unusual punishments inflicted" -- Bill of Rights 1689

 

[The Natural Philosopher]

Tim Streater wrote:

In article <a69sgsF700U1@mid.individual.net>,
"Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote:

[not much]

Why are your posts so content-free?

empty vessels....

--
To people who know nothing, anything is possible.
To people who know too much, it is a sad fact
that they know how little is really possible -
and how hard it is to achieve it.

 

[Jim Yanik]

gregz <zekor@comcast.net> wrote in
news:1511051433363816740.916103zekor-comcast.net@news.eternal-september.o
rg:

Jim Yanik <jyanik@abuse.gov> wrote:
Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com> wrote in
news:d2rtv7p2m3r8d33g205er5vr0s3mnmgkkp@4ax.com:

On Thu, 12 Jul 2012 09:39:16 -0500, Jim Yanik <jyanik@abuse.gov
wrote:

Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com> wrote in
news:0b4rv7ldi6f6o6bqb82n3n9t934mgrpv6s@4ax.com:
I guess going camping with a TV is ok, as long as one leaves the
screaming kids, barking dogs, ATV's, motorcycles, and boom box at
home.

in today's digital ATSC TV world(USA),reception may not be possible
out in the boonies. better to buy a portable DVD player with LCD
screen.

You're behind the times a little. These daze, campers have
satellite receivers and dishes. OTA TV reception in the middle of
nowhere tends to be lousy.

yeah,I've seen RVs with satellite dishes...

The main purpose of the generator is not to run the TV. It's to
keep the 12V fridge alive. The generator usually has a 12v charger
output, which keeps the battery up, which runs the 12v fridge. For
those with really cheap generators, add an external battery charger.
Few campers have 12v chargers for their laptops, so there's another
reason to run the generator. Solar panels as chargers are also
common, but are rarely large enough to replace a generator.

It's been a very long time since I've gone tent camping. When I
last did that, we went past a "wilderness" trailer camp, which is
distinguished from a regular trailer camp site by the lack of
hookups. We could hear the multiple generators running for miles
away. As we approached the trailer camp site, we could hear a
cacophany of full blast television audio from some campers. We
begged some supplies, loaded up with drinkable water, and got as far
away from that nightmare as possible, which was not a trivial
exercise in the dark.

Leave the generator and TV at home.


will an 800 WATT generator keep a fridge going?
an 800 watt generator might not run the TV and the satellite
receiver[humor]....considering that 800 watts is maximum
output(surge?),and you can realistically expect only 400 watts from
it,continuous.

I agree that TV,stereo,etc,is inappropriate for camping.
Camping is about ESCAPING all that stuff,enjoying nature,bugs and
all. Laptops on a camping trip? sheesh,why not just pitch a tent in
your backyard?
then you can run an extension cord from your house to run all your
stuff.

My 90's fridge only draws 200 watts, but 1500 watts in defrost. My
little generator will run my 5k btu air conditioner, but it running
the generator hard and uses a lot of gas, small tank.

Greg

your fridge may draw it's 200 watts once the compressor motor is
running,but on startup,it draws a lot more.

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
localnet
dot com

 

[Jim Yanik]

Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> wrote in news:timstreater-
D0D737.11282613072012@news.individual.net:

In article <a69sgsF700U1@mid.individual.net>,
"Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote:

[not much]

Why are your posts so content-free?

why does anyone respond to them?
this is what killfiles are for.

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
localnet
dot com

 

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Fri, 13 Jul 2012 16:11:35 +1000, "Rod Speed"
<rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote:

Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com> wrote
Rod Speed <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote

Load one at 400VA and look at the waveform. It's fairly ugly.

And you don't get that with the generator being discussed.

An unbalanced load isn't required, which only creates
even order (asymmetric) distortion. A single phase
generator will happily create odd order (symmetrical)
distortion without an unbalanced generator load.

But you don't get anything like the amount of distortion
you were going on about, so it isnt a problem with an SMPS
being powered from that particular generator being discussed.

The oscilloscope photos in the URL's mentioned show the output
waveforms with and without loads. As I indicated, and you apparently
missed, it is NOT necessary to have an unbalanced load on the
generator in order to produce a distorted waveform. Also, it's a fair
assumption that this 800 watt generator is going to be powering more
than one device while camping. Besides the TV, there might be some
lamps, a laptop charger, satellite TV receiver, smartphone charger,
inkjet printer, and all the conveniences of portable modern living. In
general, the generator waveforms become more distorted with increased
load.

For example:
http://www2.electronicproducts.com/Generators_UPSs_match_or_bridge_to_nowhere-article-fapo_Falcon_mar2009-html.aspx
Scroll down to the oscilloscope photograph. Note the noise and
distortion.

No SMPS will have a problem with that.

As I previously suggested, some substantiation would be helpful. If
you had impeccable credentials, were a recognized authority, had
previously demonstrated expertise in this area, and perhaps were a
Nobel Prize recipient, I might accept your unsubstantiated judgments
without question. However, lacking those requirements, and being
apparently only able to produce one-line erroneous statements of
negligible value, you do not qualify. Please explain why numerous
articles on generator to UPS compatibility should be ignored.

In the past odd 20 years, I've run emergency generator versus
switching power supply problems many times. My favorite was while
working with computahs at a medical billing office. Someone dragged
in a Genrac 8kw(?) generator and wired it to a transfer box. It was a
professionally done installation by a licensed electrician. I
stupidly suggested we do a dry run with the building on full power,
and was immediately assigned the task. The day arrived, the big
switch was thrown, the generator started immediately, and about 30
assorted UPS backup power supplies beeped a few times, and shut down
in self defense. That powered down all the servers and network
hardware, which effectively shut down the network.

On the APC SmartUPS line (as opposed to the BackUPS line), there is a
switch to reduce the sensitivity to input waveform distortion. We
went around flipping switches and rebooting servers (after a 30
minutes file system check). When everything was back up and running,
the power was again switched off, and again all the UPS's shut down.

I drove to my palatial office and back with an oscilloscope to look at
the waveform. Even without a load, it looked something like this:
<http://www.electronicproducts.com/images2/fapo_Falcon01_mar2009.gif>
When I added all the non-computer loads to the Genrac generator, the
waveform became asymmetrical, because the load was not balanced
between the two phases. My clamp-on ammeter showed about 10A on one
leg and 7A on the other. It didn't take much to cause problems.

After about 8 power fail simulations, we were never able to bring
everything back up gracefully on generator power. It wasn't just the
UPS's that were having issues. The DVR for the security camera
systems refused to run. The wall warts for powering some Netgear
switches blew up and had to be replaced. Several CRT monitors acted
strangely and refused to produce a stable display. The Lucent phone
system would go into protection mode intermittently.

After the exercise was over, I elected to restore two of the servers
from backup tapes, because I didn't want to take the chance that all
the power thrashing had caused any data corruption. That took most of
the night. When business resumed on Monday, it was soon discovered
that the one server that I did NOT restore, had some minor data
corruption.

There was no way the office was going to run on this 6kw(?) generator.
The generator was removed, permits arranged, and a rather monstrous
and expensive 25kw diesel generator was installed. Attached to the
power leads was a large box full of low pass filter components to
remove spikes. I didn't need to look at the waveforms as it ran the
various UPS devices and switching power supplies perfectly.

You don't know that the generator
being discussed is anything like that.

You don't know what I know.

No news to me.

True. You haven't learned anything. I judge people by their
willingness and abilities to learn. You fail both criteria.

A while ago, I attempted to classify various usenet personality types.
<http://802.11junk.com/jeffl/crud/genesis.txt>
At the time, I hadn't even considered a classification suitable for
your style. You post useless and erroneous comments, and then wait
for those with some understanding of the topic to correct your
misinformation. The more attention you attract, the more useless
comments you produce, resulting in a positive feedback mechanism. I
suspect that your primary purpose is to attract corrective attention,
rather than answer the questions or debate the validity of the
proposed explanations. Had you demonstrated some understanding of the
topic by asking some intelligent questions, I might consider
continuing, but as it stands, I have no interest in entertaining you
or cleaning up your mess. Good day.

--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

 

[The Natural Philosopher]

Jeff Liebermann wrote:

If
you had impeccable credentials, were a recognized authority, had
previously demonstrated expertise in this area, and perhaps were a
Nobel Prize recipient,

Er Jeff, this is Rod Speed, ultimate Internet idiot par excellence you
are addressing.

Don't waste our bandwidth,.


--
To people who know nothing, anything is possible.
To people who know too much, it is a sad fact
that they know how little is really possible -
and how hard it is to achieve it.

 

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Fri, 13 Jul 2012 09:54:49 -0500, Jim Yanik <jyanik@abuse.gov>
wrote:

why does anyone respond to them?
this is what killfiles are for.

Curiosity. I'm somewhat of an amateur psychologist. I like to see
what motivates people and how they think. That's difficult to do with
only one-line pontifications so I primed the pump with some content to
see if some intelligence might gush forth from the depths. Apparently
not. So, with my curiousity thus satisfied, I now return to the
mundane tasks of fixing things, tilting at windmills, and raising the
dead.


--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

 

[Rod Speed]

Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com> wrote

Rod Speed <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote
Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com> wrote
Rod Speed <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote

Load one at 400VA and look at the waveform. It's fairly ugly.

And you don't get that with the generator being discussed.

An unbalanced load isn't required, which only creates
even order (asymmetric) distortion. A single phase
generator will happily create odd order (symmetrical)
distortion without an unbalanced generator load.

But you don't get anything like the amount of distortion
you were going on about, so it isnt a problem with an SMPS
being powered from that particular generator being discussed.

The oscilloscope photos in the URL's mentioned
show the output waveforms with and without loads.

Yes, but you don't in fact get anything like the distortion
that you were going on about with unbalanced loads on
2 phase generators which aren't even relevant to the
particular generator and load being discussed.

As I indicated, and you apparently missed, it is
NOT necessary to have an unbalanced load on the
generator in order to produce a distorted waveform.

Didn't miss anything. The distortion actually seen with the
particular generator and load being discussed is nothing
like enough to be a problem with a well designed SMPS.

Also, it's a fair assumption that this 800 watt generator is
going to be powering more than one device while camping.

Yes, but that's not necessarily much of a load.

Besides the TV, there might be some lamps, a laptop
charger, satellite TV receiver, smartphone charger, inkjet
printer, and all the conveniences of portable modern living.

None of which are much of a load.

In general, the generator waveforms become more distorted with increased
load.

Duh. But even with all of those you listed, it
won't be a problem for a well designed SMPS.

For example:
http://www2.electronicproducts.com/Generators_UPSs_match_or_bridge_to_nowhere-article-fapo_Falcon_mar2009-html.aspx
Scroll down to the oscilloscope photograph. Note the noise and
distortion.

No SMPS will have a problem with that.

As I previously suggested, some substantiation would be helpful.

You didn't provide any of that yourself until I rubbed your nose
in the fact that you never provided any yourself on your claim
about how SMPSs fail.

If you had impeccable credentials, were a recognized authority,
had previously demonstrated expertise in this area, and perhaps
were a Nobel Prize recipient, I might accept your unsubstantiated
judgments without question. However, lacking those requirements,
and being apparently only able to produce one-line erroneous
statements of negligible value, you do not qualify.

You in spades with your claim about how SMPSs fail.

Please explain why numerous articles on generator
to UPS compatibility should be ignored.

Because we arent discussing UPSs, we are discussing TVs instead.

In the past odd 20 years, I've run emergency generator versus
switching power supply problems many times. My favorite was while
working with computahs at a medical billing office. Someone dragged
in a Genrac 8kw(?) generator and wired it to a transfer box. It was a
professionally done installation by a licensed electrician. I
stupidly suggested we do a dry run with the building on full power,
and was immediately assigned the task. The day arrived, the big
switch was thrown, the generator started immediately, and about 30
assorted UPS backup power supplies beeped a few times, and shut
down in self defense. That powered down all the servers and
network hardware, which effectively shut down the network.

Completely and utterly irrelevant to what was being discussed,
that PARTICULAR generator mentioned in the subject and a TV.

On the APC SmartUPS line (as opposed to the BackUPS line), there
is a switch to reduce the sensitivity to input waveform distortion.
We went around flipping switches and rebooting servers (after a 30
minutes file system check). When everything was back up and running,
the power was again switched off, and again all the UPS's shut down.

Completely and utterly irrelevant to what was being discussed,
that PARTICULAR generator mentioned in the subject and a TV.

I drove to my palatial office and back with an oscilloscope to look at
the waveform. Even without a load, it looked something like this:
http://www.electronicproducts.com/images2/fapo_Falcon01_mar2009.gif
When I added all the non-computer loads to the Genrac generator, the
waveform became asymmetrical, because the load was not balanced
between the two phases. My clamp-on ammeter showed about 10A on one
leg and 7A on the other. It didn't take much to cause problems.

After about 8 power fail simulations, we were never able to bring
everything back up gracefully on generator power. It wasn't just the
UPS's that were having issues. The DVR for the security camera
systems refused to run. The wall warts for powering some Netgear
switches blew up and had to be replaced. Several CRT monitors acted
strangely and refused to produce a stable display. The Lucent phone
system would go into protection mode intermittently.

After the exercise was over, I elected to restore two of the servers
from backup tapes, because I didn't want to take the chance that all
the power thrashing had caused any data corruption. That took most of
the night. When business resumed on Monday, it was soon discovered
that the one server that I did NOT restore, had some minor data
corruption.

There was no way the office was going to run on this 6kw(?) generator.
The generator was removed, permits arranged, and a rather monstrous
and expensive 25kw diesel generator was installed. Attached to the
power leads was a large box full of low pass filter components to
remove spikes. I didn't need to look at the waveforms as it ran the
various UPS devices and switching power supplies perfectly.

All completely and utterly irrelevant to what was being discussed,
that PARTICULAR generator mentioned in the subject and a TV.

You don't know that the generator
being discussed is anything like that.

You don't know what I know.

I do know that you were rabbiting on about
two phase generators and UPSs that have
NOTHING to do with what the OP asked about.

No news to me.

True. You haven't learned anything.

Yep, none of the irrelevant shit you posted is any news to me.

I judge people by their willingness and abilities to learn.

No one give a flying red fuck how you stupidly 'judge' people.

Particularly when you keep raving on about about situations that
have NOTHING to do with what was actually being discussed.

You fail both criteria.

Everyone can see for themselves that you are lying.

<reams of your puerile attempts at insults that any 2 year
old could leave for dead flushed where they belong>

 

[John Rumm]

On 13/07/2012 17:36, Jeff Liebermann wrote:

On Fri, 13 Jul 2012 16:11:35 +1000, "Rod Speed"
rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote:

No SMPS will have a problem with that.

As I previously suggested, some substantiation would be helpful. If
you had impeccable credentials, were a recognized authority, had
previously demonstrated expertise in this area, and perhaps were a
Nobel Prize recipient, I might accept your unsubstantiated judgments
without question. However, lacking those requirements, and being
apparently only able to produce one-line erroneous statements of
negligible value, you do not qualify. Please explain why numerous
articles on generator to UPS compatibility should be ignored.

Alas you are wasting effort arguing with woddles - the most clue
resistant poster uk.d-i-y has known...

While the evidence would suggest otherwise, logic suggests that he can't
actually be totally stupid, because to be so consistently wrong on every
single one of the many topics he is willing to submit his opinion, must
actually take some considerable effort. Most clueless twonks actually
get the right answer by accident sometimes.


--
Cheers,

John.

/=================================================================\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\=================================================================/

 

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Fri, 13 Jul 2012 23:14:52 +0000 (UTC), gregz <zekor@comcast.net>
wrote:

Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com> wrote:
On Fri, 13 Jul 2012 12:08:36 +1000, "Rod Speed"
rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote:


Incidentally, if you plan to look at the waveforms produced by a
gasoline generator with an oscillosope, use two scope probes and
differential inputs. One probe connects to each side of the power
line. The two probe grounds go to the generator frame ground. The
scope input selector is set to A-B. That will remove any common mode
noise on the display, and provide some protection against accidentally
getting the oscilloscope case at line potential.

Sounds like I have have to do a test with my two generators. One small
single out. One double output, 240 max. Get back later.
Greg

I have 3 generators, none of which work. I dragged them home with the
intention of repairing them, and never found the time. Although I
didn't do this, you could add 10K resistors between the 10:1 probe
tips and the AC line connections, without trashing the waveform.

Good luck and please be careful.

Eaton's PSEC - Harmonics
<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PoZQsGJ3WjY> (5 min)
The first few minutes show waveforms comparing a linear load (light
bulb) and a non-linear load (switcher). Note the comments on
overheating and harmonics.


--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

 

[gregz]

Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com> wrote:

On Fri, 13 Jul 2012 12:08:36 +1000, "Rod Speed"
rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote:


Incidentally, if you plan to look at the waveforms produced by a
gasoline generator with an oscillosope, use two scope probes and
differential inputs. One probe connects to each side of the power
line. The two probe grounds go to the generator frame ground. The
scope input selector is set to A-B. That will remove any common mode
noise on the display, and provide some protection against accidentally
getting the oscilloscope case at line potential.

Sounds like I have have to do a test with my two generators. One small
single out. One double output, 240 max. Get back later.

Greg

 

[gregz]

Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com> wrote:

On Fri, 13 Jul 2012 23:14:52 +0000 (UTC), gregz <zekor@comcast.net
wrote:

Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com> wrote:
On Fri, 13 Jul 2012 12:08:36 +1000, "Rod Speed"
rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote:


Incidentally, if you plan to look at the waveforms produced by a
gasoline generator with an oscillosope, use two scope probes and
differential inputs. One probe connects to each side of the power
line. The two probe grounds go to the generator frame ground. The
scope input selector is set to A-B. That will remove any common mode
noise on the display, and provide some protection against accidentally
getting the oscilloscope case at line potential.

Sounds like I have have to do a test with my two generators. One small
single out. One double output, 240 max. Get back later.
Greg

I have 3 generators, none of which work. I dragged them home with the
intention of repairing them, and never found the time. Although I
didn't do this, you could add 10K resistors between the 10:1 probe
tips and the AC line connections, without trashing the waveform.

Good luck and please be careful.

Eaton's PSEC - Harmonics
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PoZQsGJ3WjY> (5 min)
The first few minutes show waveforms comparing a linear load (light
bulb) and a non-linear load (switcher). Note the comments on
overheating and harmonics.

I'm thinking I have X10 probes, but thanks. I would rather use a two
channel batter scope, but I don't have one. Then again, 8 bit resolution
crap.

Greg

 

[Dave Plowman (News)]

In article <ju1ffc$rid$2@reader1.panix.com>,
Cydrome Leader <presence@MUNGEpanix.com> wrote:

I can't imagine a 2 stroke aldi generator would even last long enough to
destroy any electronics. the thing must last about 2-3 minutes tops
before seizing, assuming it even starts out of the box.

That'll be why they give a three year warranty? Instant money back -
provided you have the receipt. Wish others did as well.

--
*If only you'd use your powers for good instead of evil.

Dave Plowman dave@davenoise.co.uk London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

 

[Cydrome Leader]

In sci.electronics.repair Arfa Daily <arfa.daily@ntlworld.com> wrote:

"Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:a668p2FqpoU1@mid.individual.net...


"Arfa Daily" <arfa.daily@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
news:AbhLr.750174$4v3.303421@fx08.am4...


"Martin Brown" <|||newspam|||@nezumi.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
news:qEcLr.48899$iI7.13731@newsfe03.iad...
On 11/07/2012 10:37, D. T. Green wrote:
On just buying a 800 watt 'two' stroke petrol generator from Aldi, we
have
heard from someone who says that he has got one; and that his is
running
very roughly, and is really noisy.

Also it says in the instructions that it is *not* suitable for
connecting to
televisions or other sensitive electronic equipment.

Likely it is not just acoustically noisy but electronically noisy too
and the ignition system radio emissions will cause snow on a portable
TV. It might be so rough and ready electrically either voltage or
frequency wise that it could fail or wreck some old sets completely. I'd
expect most modern switched mode PSUs to cope with almost anything but
then you are taking a risk since the maker says it is unsuitable.



I would have said the exact opposite of that. Linear supplies with a nice
big chunk of L in the way, are pretty much unconcerned about such nasties
as spikes, whereas switchers will fail if you just look at them wrongly
on a day with a Y in it ...

Like hell they do.

However, that said, I would agree with everyone else that using this with
modern electronic equipment would not be a good idea.

That's just plain wrong with modern switch mode power supplys.


I repair hundreds of the things, and irrespective of the topology of any
individual design, most work by the skin of their teeth. Left alone, in
general, today's generation are fairly reliable, but in my experience,
subject them to the slightest abuse, and they fail - often catastrophically

Arfa

I can't imagine a 2 stroke aldi generator would even last long enough to
destroy any electronics. the thing must last about 2-3 minutes tops before
seizing, assuming it even starts out of the box.

 

[Cydrome Leader]

In sci.electronics.repair "Dave Plowman (News)" <dave@davenoise.co.uk> wrote:

In article <ju1ffc$rid$2@reader1.panix.com>,
Cydrome Leader <presence@MUNGEpanix.com> wrote:
I can't imagine a 2 stroke aldi generator would even last long enough to
destroy any electronics. the thing must last about 2-3 minutes tops
before seizing, assuming it even starts out of the box.

That'll be why they give a three year warranty? Instant money back -
provided you have the receipt. Wish others did as well.

it could be a 100 year warranty. There's no way such a generator isn't
complete trash and won't have the endurance of a birthday cake candle.

 

[Jamie]

Cydrome Leader wrote:

In sci.electronics.repair Arfa Daily <arfa.daily@ntlworld.com> wrote:


"Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:a668p2FqpoU1@mid.individual.net...


"Arfa Daily" <arfa.daily@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
news:AbhLr.750174$4v3.303421@fx08.am4...


"Martin Brown" <|||newspam|||@nezumi.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
news:qEcLr.48899$iI7.13731@newsfe03.iad...

On 11/07/2012 10:37, D. T. Green wrote:

On just buying a 800 watt 'two' stroke petrol generator from Aldi, we
have
heard from someone who says that he has got one; and that his is
running
very roughly, and is really noisy.

Also it says in the instructions that it is *not* suitable for
connecting to
televisions or other sensitive electronic equipment.

Likely it is not just acoustically noisy but electronically noisy too
and the ignition system radio emissions will cause snow on a portable
TV. It might be so rough and ready electrically either voltage or
frequency wise that it could fail or wreck some old sets completely. I'd
expect most modern switched mode PSUs to cope with almost anything but
then you are taking a risk since the maker says it is unsuitable.



I would have said the exact opposite of that. Linear supplies with a nice
big chunk of L in the way, are pretty much unconcerned about such nasties
as spikes, whereas switchers will fail if you just look at them wrongly
on a day with a Y in it ...

Like hell they do.


However, that said, I would agree with everyone else that using this with
modern electronic equipment would not be a good idea.

That's just plain wrong with modern switch mode power supplys.


I repair hundreds of the things, and irrespective of the topology of any
individual design, most work by the skin of their teeth. Left alone, in
general, today's generation are fairly reliable, but in my experience,
subject them to the slightest abuse, and they fail - often catastrophically

Arfa


I can't imagine a 2 stroke aldi generator would even last long enough to
destroy any electronics. the thing must last about 2-3 minutes tops before
seizing, assuming it even starts out of the box.


We have a local iced cream truck that rides around through the park at

various parts of the day. It has one of those hanging on the back,
operating the freezer I presume. It seems to work for them just fine,
sounds funny though

Jamie