A Product Design Invitation

[Al Borowski]

Guy Macon wrote:

Frank Bemelman wrote:


Editting messages is the bloody limit.


...would be, if not for the fact that it isn't true.

I do thank you and Bob Stephens, though. Accusing someone of
editing messages,

Well, you did edit a message to insert a little note at the bottom. Or did

"======================================= MODERATOR'S COMMENT:
If the need is there, someone is going to meet it... "

Appear by itself?

being a Nazi, etc. is an excellent example

of why someone who desires to have a civil discussion might
wish to use a moderated m=newsgroup. The worse you act up the
better getting away from you looks. Thanks!

Have fun in your group. It takes hard work to get the critical mass
needed, and there is a long way to go.



>

 

[Guy Macon]

Al Borowski wrote:

Well, you did edit a message to insert a little note at the bottom.

From Webster's:

EDIT: to alter, adapt, or refine.

APPEND: to add as a supplement or appendix.

I did not and will not alter, adapt, or refine any post.
Adding a moderator's comment as a supplement or appendix
is considered to be acceptable behavior from a moderator.


Examples:



If you post to comp.std.c++, you might see something like this at the
top of your post:

===================================== MODERATOR'S COMMENT:

I'm approving this article, since it and the rest of
the thread grew out of an on-topic discussion, but
this whole thread has drifted very far from C++
standardization.

===================================== END OF MODERATOR'S COMMENT




If you post to comp.dcom.telecom, you might see something like this
at the top of your post:

[TELECOM Digest Editor's Note: Mr. Wilber gets in a discussion with
Jack Decker, moderator of VOIP News. References in the following to
'moderator' are referring to Jack Decker. PAT]




If you post to alt.humor.best-of-usenet, you will see that this
has been added to the bottom of every post:

--
Moderators accept or reject articles based solely on the criteria posted
in the Frequently Asked Questions. Article content is the responsibility
of the submitter. Submit articles to ahbou-sub@duke.edu. To write to the
moderators, send mail to ahbou-mod@duke.edu.




If you post to rec.sport.pro-wrestling.moderated, you might see
something like this at the bottom of your post:

======================================= MODERATOR'S COMMENT:

WCW's booking committee barely has the attention span to book a three-hour
Nitro, let alone a six-month angle.
- Scott.

Scott Keith, moderator rec.sport.pro-wrestling.moderated
and all-knowing keeper of the Pro Wrestling FAQ.
Official Wrestling FAQ URL: http://www.planet.eon.net/~skeith/faq.html
Official Netcop Rant URL: http://www.planet.eon.net/~skeith/ra

 

[Bob Monsen]

Guy Macon wrote:

Bob Monsen wrote:


What I stated is true. Any post cross-posted to your silly little
kingdom can be edited or prohibited by you, regardless of your
protestations to the contrary. You can stop posts to an unmoderated
newsgroup if they have been cross-posted.


Nice bit of revisionism there, Bob. You posted something that was
false and then, when called on it, morphed it into a claim that you
posted something else that is true.

You wrote (direct quote):

"Ah, and when people cross-post to your group, and to these
non-moderated groups, the messages that go to these non-
moderated groups are intercepted, edited, and then allowed
to continue by you."

Note the subtle switch from "are ... edited" (false) into
"can be edited' (true).


I'll not comment further.


Promises, promises.

You really are a piece of work.

If you are so obtuse as to believe that appending a trailer isn't
'editing', then you really have no business moderating anything. You
clearly have the opportunity to edit or prohibit any post that is
crossposted to your little kingdom.

Also, given your propensity for attempting to mislead people by taking
quotes out of context, and then taking the position against this staged
position, I'd suggest that you simply aren't trustworthy enough for this
task. You have no honor.

---
Regards,
Bob Monsen

 

[Roger Johansson]

Bob Monsen wrote:

Also, given your propensity for attempting to mislead people by
taking quotes out of context, and then taking the position against
this staged position, I'd suggest that you simply aren't trustworthy
enough for this task. You have no honor.

He also set a Follow-Up-to dev.null in a message to you, Bob.
If you had replied to that msg your reply would have been thrown in the
waste bin in your own computer, and would never have been published in
the newsgroup. It could have locked up your computer or caused some
strange problem.

Such dirty tricks do we not expect, and especially not from somebody
who thinks he is qualified to be a moderator.

We have to keep an eye on the headers as long as he is around.

If he tries to crosspost messages between his moderated group and free
newsgroups...


--
Roger J.

 

[Mike Monett]

Roger Johansson wrote:

Bob Monsen wrote:

Also, given your propensity for attempting to mislead people by
taking quotes out of context, and then taking the position against
this staged position, I'd suggest that you simply aren't trustworthy
enough for this task. You have no honor.

He also set a Follow-Up-to dev.null in a message to you, Bob.
If you had replied to that msg your reply would have been thrown in the
waste bin in your own computer, and would never have been published in
the newsgroup. It could have locked up your computer or caused some
strange problem.

Actually he did it twice:

http://groups.google.ca/group/sci.electronics.design/msg/1563ff558163159d
http://groups.google.ca/group/sci.electronics.design/msg/a159b2fce71c9b1d

He is also pulling his posts from the google archives, so the evidence will
soon be gone.

http://groups.google.ca/group/sci.electronics.design/msg/1563ff558163159d
http://groups.google.ca/group/sci.electronics.design/msg/40380edd74771777
http://groups.google.ca/group/sci.electronics.design/msg/4f0d2c2f84b7f063
http://groups.google.ca/group/sci.electronics.design/msg/6b9ee194d87e3aa6
http://groups.google.ca/group/sci.electronics.design/msg/972bea16c767cca8
http://groups.google.ca/group/sci.electronics.design/msg/b27b2b24e5ce19a3
http://groups.google.ca/group/sci.electronics.design/msg/bd0fee0cf7a5b354

Such dirty tricks do we not expect, and especially not from somebody
who thinks he is qualified to be a moderator.

We have to keep an eye on the headers as long as he is around.

If he tries to crosspost messages between his moderated group and free
newsgroups...
Roger J.

Mike Monett

 

[Al Borowski]

Richard Henry wrote:

"Guy Macon" <_see.web.page_@_www.guymacon.com_> wrote in message
news:11a192fqmuu6u6e@corp.supernews.com...

and what is "sci.eIectronics.design"? An alternative to dev.null?

"Followup-To: sci.eIectronics.design,misc.misc"

Now thats sneaky. I'll take great pleasure from removing any reference
to this new group from any of my replies. I prefer the endless US
political crap to this kind of thing.

cheers,

Al

 

[Al Borowski]

Well, you did edit a message to insert a little note at the bottom.


From Webster's:

EDIT: to alter, adapt, or refine.

APPEND: to add as a supplement or appendix.

I'd call appending a type of editing.

I did not and will not alter, adapt, or refine any post.
Adding a moderator's comment as a supplement or appendix
is considered to be acceptable behavior from a moderator.

It might be, but that is a separate issue.

 

[Guy Macon]

Roger Johansson wrote:

We have to keep an eye on the headers

You should try taking responsibility for where your posts go rather
than letting other people control you. I believe that XanaNews
makes the newsgroups line fully visible and fully editable. It is
rather foolish to allow the person you are replying to to make the
decisions as to where your reply is posted, and even more foolish
to whine about the consequences of your bad choices.

It could have locked up your computer or caused some strange problem.

Why is it that the folks who do the most flaming are the ones who
always seem to make the technical blunders when they post? Is it
because they are so consumed with flaming that they ave spent a
lifetime being unable to learn?

I challenge you to name a single newsreader that will "lock up your
computer" or "cause some strange problem" because of a followup set
to alt.dev.null.

 

[Guy Macon]

Mike Monett wrote:

(nothing worth quoting)

You are an excellent match for the following description:

"Usenet being what it is, if you participate in newsgroups
at all over a period if time you have the possibility of
attracting your own personal lunatic, who considers any
disagreement a personal affront, and considers it their
duty and obligation to "expose" the person they fixate on.
It's kind of pathetic, but they can't quite seem to figure
out why no one else sees their actions as heroic."
-Richard Ward

 

[Guy Macon]

Guy Macon wrote:

Bob Monsen wrote:

I'll not comment further.

Promises, promises.

It took him 4 hours and 32 minutes to break his promise and comment further.

"In the clearing stands a boxer and a fighter by his trade
And he carries a reminder of every glove that laid him down
Or cut him till he cried out in his anger and his shame
'I am leaving, I am leaving', But the fighter still remains..."

-"The Boxer" by Simon & Garfunkel

 

[Roger Johansson]

Guy Macon wrote:

I challenge you to name a single newsreader that will "lock up your
computer" or "cause some strange problem" because of a followup set
to alt.dev.null.

I clearly remember someone who got problems with his computer or the
newsreader program after being alt.dev.nulled, so to speak. I have seen
that trick being applied a number of times, and sometimes it does not
only cause despair and confusion for the person who tries to reply,
which is probably what you intended.


--
Roger J.

 

[Guy Macon]

Al Borowski wrote:

From Webster's:

EDIT: to alter, adapt, or refine.

APPEND: to add as a supplement or appendix.

I'd call appending a type of editing.

You can call it whatever you choose, but when someone accuses
a newsgroup moderator of editing posts, the average reader
(and the dictionary agrees) would interpret that as meaning
some sort of nefarious altering of the words that person wrote,
not as a standard moderator's comment of the kind that is used
every day without objection in countless moderated newsgroups.

"Q: How many legs does a dog have if you call the tail a leg?
A: Four. Calling a tail a leg doesn't make it a leg."
-Abraham Lincoln

 

[Richard Henry]

"Roger Johansson" <no-email@no.invalid> wrote in message
news:xn0e33axt33gokj006@news.sunsite.dk...

Bob Monsen wrote:

Also, given your propensity for attempting to mislead people by
taking quotes out of context, and then taking the position against
this staged position, I'd suggest that you simply aren't trustworthy
enough for this task. You have no honor.

He also set a Follow-Up-to dev.null in a message to you, Bob.
If you had replied to that msg your reply would have been thrown in the
waste bin in your own computer, and would never have been published in
the newsgroup. It could have locked up your computer or caused some
strange problem.

Such dirty tricks do we not expect, and especially not from somebody
who thinks he is qualified to be a moderator.

We have to keep an eye on the headers as long as he is around.

If he tries to crosspost messages between his moderated group and free
newsgroups...

Maybe we should vote him the moderator of dev.null.

 

[Richard Henry]

"Guy Macon" <_see.web.page_@_www.guymacon.com_> wrote in message
news:11a2q9re3a2hm60@corp.supernews.com...

Roger Johansson wrote:

We have to keep an eye on the headers

You should try taking responsibility for where your posts go rather
than letting other people control you. I believe that XanaNews
makes the newsgroups line fully visible and fully editable. It is
rather foolish to allow the person you are replying to to make the
decisions as to where your reply is posted, and even more foolish
to whine about the consequences of your bad choices.

I have a question: what would you call someone who fiddles with the
headers, and attempts to hide it (as in making up a fictional
sci.eIectronics.design).

The word "trusted moderator" does not come to my mind, for some reason.

It could have locked up your computer or caused some strange problem.

Why is it that the folks who do the most flaming are the ones who
always seem to make the technical blunders when they post? Is it
because they are so consumed with flaming that they ave spent a
lifetime being unable to learn?

Can't help being a technical smart-ass, eh? Like when you publicly "plonk"
someone, but continue reading his posts anyway to see what his reaction was?
Why would anyone post to a moderated group whose moderator acts like you
have done here that last couple of days?

I challenge you to name a single newsreader that will "lock up your
computer" or "cause some strange problem" because of a followup set
to alt.dev.null.

Prove that none will.

 

[Guy Macon]

Richard Henry wrote:

I have a question: what would you call someone who fiddles with the
headers, and attempts to hide it

Someone who is trying to teach you a lesson in being responsible for
where your posts go rather than letting others control where they go?
Someday you will thank me for this valuable lesson.

Speaking of which, why are you allowing your posts to go to
alt.sex.fetish.jello? Is there something you aren't telling us?

I challenge you to name a single newsreader that will "lock up your
computer" or "cause some strange problem" because of a followup set
to alt.dev.null.

Prove that none will.

Classic logical fallacy, shifting the burden of proof by asking
someone to prove a negative.

I assert that posting with the string "rphenry@home.com" in the
from field will will "lock up your computer" or "cause some
strange problem" with some computers. Now prove that it won't.
I also assert that unicorns and Santa Claus exist. Prove that
they don't.

 

[Al Borowski]

Guy Macon wrote:

Al Borowski wrote:

From Webster's:

EDIT: to alter, adapt, or refine.

APPEND: to add as a supplement or appendix.

I'd call appending a type of editing.


You can call it whatever you choose, but when someone accuses
a newsgroup moderator of editing posts, the average reader
(and the dictionary agrees) would interpret that as meaning
some sort of nefarious altering of the words that person wrote,
not as a standard moderator's comment of the kind that is used
every day without objection in countless moderated newsgroups.

I doubt Webster's 1913 dictionary would have editing in the context of
moderated newsgroups.

"EDIT: to alter, adapt, or refine."

So you didn't alter his post? It's bit-for-bit identical to what he
intended to be sent?

"Q: How many legs does a dog have if you call the tail a leg?
A: Four. Calling a tail a leg doesn't make it a leg."
-Abraham Lincoln

A bit of nonsense isn't wisdom purely because a president said it. If
you are calling a tail a leg, then clearly a typical dog has 5 legs (the
4 existing legs + the tail, aka your new leg). But you wouldn't call a
tail a leg because it isn't.

This is just a word game anyway. I have more interesting arguments to
waste my time on.

Al

 

[Guy Macon]

Al Borowski wrote:

I doubt Webster's 1913 dictionary would have editing in the context of
moderated newsgroups.

Good thing I got my definition from the 2005 Merriam-Webster
electronic Dictionary then.

So you didn't alter his post? It's bit-for-bit identical to what he
intended to be sent?

You have never sent a post that was bit-for-bit identical to what
you intended to be sent. Every one of yourv posts has added info
such as

NNTP-Posting-Host: 203.206.231.28

and

X-Trace: 1117878047 per-qv1-newsreader-01.iinet.net.au 31211 203.206.231.28

...so I guess that iinet.net.au is editing all your posts - according to
your rather interesting definition of "edit."

"Q: How many legs does a dog have if you call the tail a leg?
A: Four. Calling a tail a leg doesn't make it a leg."

A bit of nonsense isn't wisdom purely because a president said it. If
you are calling a tail a leg, then clearly a typical dog has 5 legs (the
4 existing legs + the tail, aka your new leg).

Nope. Lincoln was right and you are wrong. Calling a tail a leg
doesn't make it a leg.

I have more interesting arguments to waste my time on.

Promises, promises.

 

[Tony Williams]

In article <11a2u5q74cu4o9e@corp.supernews.com>,
Guy Macon <_see.web.page_@_www.guymacon.com_> wrote:

Speaking of which, why are you allowing your posts to go to
alt.sex.fetish.jello? Is there something you aren't telling us?

You slyly added that newsgroup yourself.
The sequence of headers below shows it.

--------------------------------------------------------
This is the header of a post by RJ, notice the Newsgroups:
and Message-ID: lines.

From: "Roger Johansson" <no-email@no.invalid>
Subject: Re: A Product Design Invitation
Newsgroups: sci.electronics.design
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Message-ID: <xn0e33axt33gokj006@news.sunsite.dk>
--------------------------------------------------------
This is the header of your reply to him, proved by the
last entry in the References: lines..... and then the new
newsgroup that YOU added.

From: Guy Macon <_see.web.page_@_www.guymacon.com_>
Newsgroups: sci.electronics.design,alt.sex.fetish.jello
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Subject: Re: A Product Design Invitation
Date: Sat, 04 Jun 2005 08:38:52 +0000
Organization: <a href="http://www.guymacon.com/">
http://www.guymacon.com/ </a>
Message-ID: &lt;11a2q9re3a2hm60@corp.supernews.com&gt;
References: &lt;119slsn6db8g232@corp.supernews.com&gt;
&lt;34ednS5IMOxfDwLfRVn-ug@comcast.com&gt;
&lt;119vagjg5555ga1@corp.supernews.com&gt;
&lt;n9KdnaRjLaNtNT3fRVn-2w@comcast.com&gt;
&lt;11a1ca8b113dgac@corp.supernews.com&gt;
&lt;w7adncpDrIVmXT3fRVn-2g@comcast.com&gt;
&lt;11a1ma1e5ud9ec@corp.supernews.com&gt;
&lt;2o6dnc7XcPVZnTzfRVn-ig@comcast.com&gt;
&lt;xn0e33axt33gokj006@news.sunsite.dk&gt;
X-No-Archive: yes
X-Complaints-To: abuse@supernews.com
--------------------------------------------------------

--
Tony Williams.

 

[Richard Henry]

"Guy Macon" &lt;_see.web.page_@_www.guymacon.com_&gt; wrote in message
news:11a2u5q74cu4o9e@corp.supernews.com...

Richard Henry wrote:

I have a question: what would you call someone who fiddles with the
headers, and attempts to hide it

Someone who is trying to teach you a lesson in being responsible for
where your posts go rather than letting others control where they go?
Someday you will thank me for this valuable lesson.

Thank you, master.

Speaking of which, why are you allowing your posts to go to
alt.sex.fetish.jello? Is there something you aren't telling us?

You started it. I thought perhaps you have some fans there.

I challenge you to name a single newsreader that will "lock up your
computer" or "cause some strange problem" because of a followup set
to alt.dev.null.

Prove that none will.

Classic logical fallacy, shifting the burden of proof by asking
someone to prove a negative.

I assert that posting with the string "rphenry@home.com" in the
from field will will "lock up your computer" or "cause some
strange problem" with some computers. Now prove that it won't.
I also assert that unicorns and Santa Claus exist. Prove that
they don't.

Since you seem to be the master of logical fallacies, what is that one
called, where you exaggerate a reasonable concern into foolishness?

And you should have asked for three.

 

[Rich The Newsgroup Wacko]

[top-posted just to twist the knife and rub salt in it]

On Fri, 03 Jun 2005 23:44:08 +0000, Guy Macon wrote:
[some shit]
Then I'm top posting:

So, in your little private troll of M. Borowski, why
don't you refrain from polluting sci.electronics.design and
take it to your own little personal newsgroup, You Who Are
So Adamant About Excluding Off Topic Shit?

Jesus Loves You,
Rich

Al Borowski wrote:

Well, you did edit a message to insert a little note at the bottom.

From Webster's:

EDIT: to alter, adapt, or refine.

APPEND: to add as a supplement or appendix.

I did not and will not alter, adapt, or refine any post.
Adding a moderator's comment as a supplement or appendix
is considered to be acceptable behavior from a moderator.


Examples:



If you post to comp.std.c++, you might see something like this at the
top of your post:

===================================== MODERATOR'S COMMENT:

I'm approving this article, since it and the rest of
the thread grew out of an on-topic discussion, but
this whole thread has drifted very far from C++
standardization.

===================================== END OF MODERATOR'S COMMENT




If you post to comp.dcom.telecom, you might see something like this
at the top of your post:

[TELECOM Digest Editor's Note: Mr. Wilber gets in a discussion with
Jack Decker, moderator of VOIP News. References in the following to
'moderator' are referring to Jack Decker. PAT]




If you post to alt.humor.best-of-usenet, you will see that this
has been added to the bottom of every post:

--
Moderators accept or reject articles based solely on the criteria posted
in the Frequently Asked Questions. Article content is the responsibility
of the submitter. Submit articles to ahbou-sub@duke.edu. To write to the
moderators, send mail to ahbou-mod@duke.edu.




If you post to rec.sport.pro-wrestling.moderated, you might see
something like this at the bottom of your post:

======================================= MODERATOR'S COMMENT:

WCW's booking committee barely has the attention span to book a three-hour
Nitro, let alone a six-month angle.
- Scott.

Scott Keith, moderator rec.sport.pro-wrestling.moderated
and all-knowing keeper of the Pro Wrestling FAQ.
Official Wrestling FAQ URL: http://www.planet.eon.net/~skeith/faq.html
Official Netcop Rant URL: http://www.planet.eon.net/~skeith/ra

--
Cheers!
Rich
------
"CONSULTANT: Someone who knowns 101 ways to make love, but can't get a date."