WTB: Heathkit ID-4801 EPROM Programmer

[jmfbahciv]

Seebs wrote:

On 2010-10-24, Morten Reistad <first@last.name> wrote:
A WTB heathkit eprom programmer is definatly OK in a.f.c, provided it
is followed by at least 4 articles of thread drift.

For which we are indebted, of course, to our rude friend.

grin> Point. Auld farts learned, early on, to turn bullshit into

useful things. I wonder if that's true for all "new" technology.


/BAH

 

[Charles Richmond]

On 10/24/10 11:01 AM, TXMarsh wrote:

Seems like my post started a firestorm.

While JeffM's response was nothing short of pure rude (which is never
appropriate) he is correct that these are not marketplace forums... my
mistake.

Whether or *not* you got the Heathkit EPROM Programmer, please
tell us: Why do you need *this* particular programmer??? Would
*not* any EPROM programmer work just as well??? Do you have a lot
of Heathkit gear???


--
+----------------------------------------+
| Charles and Francis Richmond |
| |
| plano dot net at aquaporin4 dot com |
+----------------------------------------+

 

[TXMarsh]

On Oct 25, 8:33 pm, Charles Richmond <friz...@tx.rr.com> wrote:

On 10/24/10 11:01 AM, TXMarsh wrote:

Seems like my post started a firestorm.

While JeffM's response was nothing short of pure rude (which is never
appropriate) he is correct that these are not marketplace forums... my
mistake.

Whether or *not* you got the Heathkit EPROM Programmer, please
tell us:  Why do you need *this* particular programmer??? Would
*not* any EPROM programmer work just as well??? Do you have a lot
of Heathkit gear???

Hi Charles,

I'm gonna give it my best shot when the auction closes tomorrow but it
may go too high for me.
What I like about this programmer is that, I believe, it can also
function as an eprom simulator.
I haven't found any other simulators that support the older 2716 and
2732 eproms... heck, it isn't easy finding any simulators these
days.
Of course I can continue the burn, burn, burn and batch erase routine
but being able to quickly try something will have its benefits.
This activity all centers around writing custom code for old 1980
vintage pinball machines that are motorola 6808 based and use
primarily 2716 and 2732 eproms.
One of my test fixtures (which uses custom code on the pinball boards)
can be seen here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0mQYDS9JNWI

Now I'm attempting to take the diagnostics to a more detailed level.

As far as heathkit... I only have a line following robot that I built
when I was a kid... but I remember the stores and I can see myself
getting hooked on collecting heathkit... I'm sure my wife hopes that I
don't!

take care,
Tim

 

[F. Bertolazzi]

TXMarsh:

I haven't found any other simulators that support the older 2716 and
2732 eproms... heck, it isn't easy finding any simulators these
days.

I should have three ROM emulators made by Parallax (the one of the Basic
Stamps) a little less than 20 years ago. But they work on the paralel port
and I don't have the related (clearly DOS) software. If you can find it
I'll be happy to send them to you.

--
Saluti

 

[JW]

On Mon, 25 Oct 2010 21:05:39 -0700 (PDT) TXMarsh <timothymarsh@gmail.com>
wrote in Message id:
<336ca680-99ce-47a8-9643-503a48b157fa@26g2000yqv.googlegroups.com>:

Hi Charles,

I'm gonna give it my best shot when the auction closes tomorrow but it
may go too high for me.
What I like about this programmer is that, I believe, it can also
function as an eprom simulator.
I haven't found any other simulators that support the older 2716 and
2732 eproms... heck, it isn't easy finding any simulators these
days.
Of course I can continue the burn, burn, burn and batch erase routine
but being able to quickly try something will have its benefits.

Why not use EEPROMs? Erase times would be much less.

 

[Mike McGinn]

TXMarsh wrote:

On Oct 25, 8:33 pm, Charles Richmond <friz...@tx.rr.com> wrote:
On 10/24/10 11:01 AM, TXMarsh wrote:

Seems like my post started a firestorm.

While JeffM's response was nothing short of pure rude (which is never
appropriate) he is correct that these are not marketplace forums... my
mistake.

Whether or *not* you got the Heathkit EPROM Programmer, please
tell us: Why do you need *this* particular programmer??? Would
*not* any EPROM programmer work just as well??? Do you have a lot
of Heathkit gear???

Hi Charles,

I'm gonna give it my best shot when the auction closes tomorrow but it
may go too high for me.
What I like about this programmer is that, I believe, it can also
function as an eprom simulator.
I haven't found any other simulators that support the older 2716 and
2732 eproms... heck, it isn't easy finding any simulators these
days.
Of course I can continue the burn, burn, burn and batch erase routine
but being able to quickly try something will have its benefits.
This activity all centers around writing custom code for old 1980
vintage pinball machines that are motorola 6808 based and use
primarily 2716 and 2732 eproms.
One of my test fixtures (which uses custom code on the pinball boards)
can be seen here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0mQYDS9JNWI

Now I'm attempting to take the diagnostics to a more detailed level.

As far as heathkit... I only have a line following robot that I built
when I was a kid... but I remember the stores and I can see myself
getting hooked on collecting heathkit... I'm sure my wife hopes that I
don't!

take care,
Tim

Wow. Something like that would have been great back when I was a twenty year
old pinball repairman, even though we mostly had Bally machines.

--
Mike McGinn FACOCM
You won't look forward to the trip!
No electrons were harmed in sending this message.
** Registered Linux User 377849

 

[Morten Reistad]

In article <18rz7rqn83zwa$.g37jcyrh2778.dlg@40tude.net>,
F. Bertolazzi <TOGLIeset@MAIUSCOLEtdd.it> wrote:

TXMarsh:

I haven't found any other simulators that support the older 2716 and
2732 eproms... heck, it isn't easy finding any simulators these
days.

I built a number of those. 4 x 2116 stacked on top with three pins
bent out, a 74H138 to demux the next bits + enable, a 7404 and a switch
to set rw/ro mode, and a little 6V alkaline battery assebly and a diode
with 0.85V drop to feed it while not connected to power, all assembled
into a DIP cradle.

Plug into base machine, set RW switch, write memory, set switch to ro, unplug,
plug into test object, boot.

I should have three ROM emulators made by Parallax (the one of the Basic
Stamps) a little less than 20 years ago. But they work on the paralel port
and I don't have the related (clearly DOS) software. If you can find it
I'll be happy to send them to you.

I never made drawings, just soldered it together for a commodore PET
project. It got popular, so I had to make copies.

-- mrr

 

[F. Bertolazzi]

Morten Reistad:

I built a number of those. 4 x 2116 stacked on top with three pins
bent out, a 74H138 to demux the next bits + enable, a 7404 and a switch
to set rw/ro mode, and a little 6V alkaline battery assebly and a diode
with 0.85V drop to feed it while not connected to power, all assembled
into a DIP cradle.

In mine the RAM is a single chip in a 24 or 28 pin wide DIP. They have a
flat cable with a DIP connector that plugs into a 27C51 socket, two modular
plugs for the parallel port and for daisy-chaining other emulators, no
battery, diodes or switches, as they are powered by the target and do not
need to be unplugged from either the PC or the target.

I never made drawings, just soldered it together for a commodore PET
project. It got popular, so I had to make copies.

Good!

 

[Ahem A Rivet's Shot]

On Tue, 26 Oct 2010 15:51:23 +0200
Morten Reistad <first@last.name> wrote:

In article <18rz7rqn83zwa$.g37jcyrh2778.dlg@40tude.net>,
F. Bertolazzi <TOGLIeset@MAIUSCOLEtdd.it> wrote:
TXMarsh:

I haven't found any other simulators that support the older 2716 and
2732 eproms... heck, it isn't easy finding any simulators these
days.

I built a number of those. 4 x 2116 stacked on top with three pins
bent out, a 74H138 to demux the next bits + enable, a 7404 and a switch
to set rw/ro mode, and a little 6V alkaline battery assebly and a diode
with 0.85V drop to feed it while not connected to power, all assembled
into a DIP cradle.

These days you could probably add a set of ports to a PC, wire them
to a DIP plug and emulate the EPROM in software complete with the timing
characteristics.

I can't think why you'd want to but ...

--
Steve O'Hara-Smith | Directable Mirror Arrays
C:>WIN | A better way to focus the sun
The computer obeys and wins. | licences available see
You lose and Bill collects. | http://www.sohara.org/

 

[F. Bertolazzi]

Ahem A Rivet's Shot:

These days you could probably add a set of ports to a PC, wire them
to a DIP plug and emulate the EPROM in software complete with the timing
characteristics.

I definitely don't think so. A PC must handle lots of unpredictable
interrupts that will skew the timings. On the other hand, using a parallel
FTDI chip...

--
Saluti

 

[Rich Grise]

On Tue, 26 Oct 2010 16:53:13 +0100, Ahem A Rivet's Shot wrote:

Morten Reistad <first@last.name> wrote:
F. Bertolazzi <TOGLIeset@MAIUSCOLEtdd.it> wrote:
TXMarsh:

I haven't found any other simulators that support the older 2716 and
2732 eproms... heck, it isn't easy finding any simulators these
days.

I built a number of those. 4 x 2116 stacked on top with three pins
bent out, a 74H138 to demux the next bits + enable, a 7404 and a switch
to set rw/ro mode, and a little 6V alkaline battery assebly and a diode
with 0.85V drop to feed it while not connected to power, all assembled
into a DIP cradle.

These days you could probably add a set of ports to a PC, wire them
to a DIP plug and emulate the EPROM in software complete with the timing
characteristics.

Not in Windows, you won't. Maybe DOS, or Linux in single-user mode.

Good Luck!
Rich

 

[Ahem A Rivet's Shot]

On Tue, 26 Oct 2010 11:45:36 -0700
Rich Grise <richgrise@example.net> wrote:

On Tue, 26 Oct 2010 16:53:13 +0100, Ahem A Rivet's Shot wrote:
Morten Reistad <first@last.name> wrote:
F. Bertolazzi <TOGLIeset@MAIUSCOLEtdd.it> wrote:
TXMarsh:

I haven't found any other simulators that support the older 2716 and
2732 eproms... heck, it isn't easy finding any simulators these
days.

I built a number of those. 4 x 2116 stacked on top with three pins
bent out, a 74H138 to demux the next bits + enable, a 7404 and a switch
to set rw/ro mode, and a little 6V alkaline battery assebly and a diode
with 0.85V drop to feed it while not connected to power, all assembled
into a DIP cradle.

These days you could probably add a set of ports to a PC, wire
them to a DIP plug and emulate the EPROM in software complete with the
timing characteristics.

Not in Windows, you won't. Maybe DOS, or Linux in single-user mode.

Without an OS at all was what I had in mind - DOS come close enough
though.

--
Steve O'Hara-Smith | Directable Mirror Arrays
C:>WIN | A better way to focus the sun
The computer obeys and wins. | licences available see
You lose and Bill collects. | http://www.sohara.org/

 

[Ahem A Rivet's Shot]

On Tue, 26 Oct 2010 19:19:29 +0200
"F. Bertolazzi" <TOGLIeset@MAIUSCOLEtdd.it> wrote:

Ahem A Rivet's Shot:

These days you could probably add a set of ports to a PC, wire
them to a DIP plug and emulate the EPROM in software complete with the
timing characteristics.

I definitely don't think so. A PC must handle lots of unpredictable
interrupts that will skew the timings.

They can all be turned off.

On the other hand, using a parallel
FTDI chip...

Sure that'll work.

--
Steve O'Hara-Smith | Directable Mirror Arrays
C:>WIN | A better way to focus the sun
The computer obeys and wins. | licences available see
You lose and Bill collects. | http://www.sohara.org/

 

[Joe Pfeiffer]

Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> writes:

On Tue, 26 Oct 2010 19:19:29 +0200
"F. Bertolazzi" <TOGLIeset@MAIUSCOLEtdd.it> wrote:

Ahem A Rivet's Shot:

These days you could probably add a set of ports to a PC, wire
them to a DIP plug and emulate the EPROM in software complete with the
timing characteristics.

I definitely don't think so. A PC must handle lots of unpredictable
interrupts that will skew the timings.

They can all be turned off.

On the other hand, using a parallel
FTDI chip...

Sure that'll work.

This is definitely a project where the right way to do it would be to
have a little PIC managing low-level timing, and talking to the PC over
USB.
--
As we enjoy great advantages from the inventions of others, we should
be glad of an opportunity to serve others by any invention of ours;
and this we should do freely and generously. (Benjamin Franklin)

 

[F. Bertolazzi]

Joe Pfeiffer:

This is definitely a project where the right way to do it would be to
have a little PIC

Noplis.

--
Saluti

 

[Joe Pfeiffer]

"F. Bertolazzi" <TOGLIeset@MAIUSCOLEtdd.it> writes:

Joe Pfeiffer:

This is definitely a project where the right way to do it would be to
have a little PIC

Noplis.

Sorry? (I'm afraid I only read English)
--
As we enjoy great advantages from the inventions of others, we should
be glad of an opportunity to serve others by any invention of ours;
and this we should do freely and generously. (Benjamin Franklin)

 

[F. Bertolazzi]

Joe Pfeiffer:

"F. Bertolazzi" <TOGLIeset@MAIUSCOLEtdd.it> writes:

Joe Pfeiffer:

This is definitely a project where the right way to do it would be to
have a little PIC

Noplis.

Sorry? (I'm afraid I only read English)

"No, please".

If you are used to PIC's demented assembly, you should have been able to
decipher it easily.

--
Saluti

 

[TXMarsh]

Well my bid of $125 fell short. The unit sold for $130. I guess 1986
technology is still in broad demand!
Probably for the best... I think you are all correct that I should be
able to build one of these... add one more project to the list! : )
Tim

 

[Joe Pfeiffer]

"F. Bertolazzi" <TOGLIeset@MAIUSCOLEtdd.it> writes:

Joe Pfeiffer:

"F. Bertolazzi" <TOGLIeset@MAIUSCOLEtdd.it> writes:

Joe Pfeiffer:

This is definitely a project where the right way to do it would be to
have a little PIC

Noplis.

Sorry? (I'm afraid I only read English)

"No, please".

I suppose it would sound lame to say that occurred to me, but I figured
it must have been a real word....

If you are used to PIC's demented assembly, you should have been able to
decipher it easily.

Their instruction set is certainly weird, but their processors are so
perfectly suited to tasks like this...
--
As we enjoy great advantages from the inventions of others, we should
be glad of an opportunity to serve others by any invention of ours;
and this we should do freely and generously. (Benjamin Franklin)

 

[F. Bertolazzi]

Joe Pfeiffer:

Their instruction set is certainly weird, but their processors are so
perfectly suited to tasks like this...

Have you ever taken a look at Atmel's AVRs?
Since I did, no more PICs.

--
Saluti