Toshiba TV29C90 problem; Image fades to black...

[nospam]

In article <PvudnWKlu69xDMDUnZ2dnUVZ_vqdnZ2d@earthlink.com>, Michael A.
Terrell <mike.terrell@earthlink.net> wrote:

What bugs me is that anyone with an iota of technical competence can
in a matter of minutes determine the connectivity of a mini-USB
cable
or a USB charger using only a $10 multimeter.

You're wrong. You can often buy digital multimeters for less than $2
at
Harbor Freight.

only if there's a harbor freight store nearby and if it's on sale.
that's not going to be the case for most people.

They do mail order as well.

but then there are shipping charges, bringing it closer to $10. and
it's actually a $3 meter, not $2.

The gas to drive across town to their store isn't free, either so
what's your point?

as i said originally, not everyone is near a store.

 

[Michael A. Terrell]

nospam wrote:

as i said originally, not everyone is near a store.

OK, so you just want excuses. Have it your way. Don't do anything,
but complain. When I started in electronics in the early '60s almost
everything was mail order from various printed catalogs. 30 days was the
usual wait for anything. Backorders were common, as well as canceled
orders. I mowed lawns and did any other job someone would pay a
teenager to do to buy tools, parts and service data. I taught myself
electronics starting at eight years old, and by the time I was 20 I
tested out of a three year EE school in the US Army.


Now you have electronic order processing and overnight delivery on
lots of parts, yet you bitch because you can't take three steps from
your couch to the store. Parts and equipment are dirt cheap, easy to
find and well documented today. The only 'bargains' in the '60s was
electronic surplus. Mostly worn out or damaged military or industrial
surplus from W.W.II. You had to dig through piles of junk to find
something repairable, and take your chances. Some equipment was so bad
that it was sold by the pound. Even then, it was over an hour drive to
the nearest surplus dealer.


--
http://improve-usenet.org/index.html

aioe.org, Goggle Groups, and Web TV users must request to be white
listed, or I will not see your messages.

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There are two kinds of people on this earth:
The crazy, and the insane.
The first sign of insanity is denying that you're crazy.

 

[msg]

Michael A. Terrell wrote:

<snip>

Parts and equipment are dirt cheap, easy to
find and well documented today. The only 'bargains' in the '60s was
electronic surplus. Mostly worn out or damaged military or industrial
surplus from W.W.II.

My experience is somewhat different; I benefited from large quantities
of nearly new military surplus for decades, which has now dried up; I
also had the benefit of companies willing to provide schematics and
technical documentation (usually at no charge, merely for the asking
in written requests) which is now unheard-of. To me the situation
has become markedly worse.

Michael

 

[krw]

In article <Lr6dneiHCO_lCcDUnZ2dnUVZ_oDinZ2d@earthlink.com>,
mike.terrell@earthlink.net says...>

Chris Malcolm wrote:

In rec.photo.digital Michael A. Terrell <mike.terrell@earthlink.net> wrote:

What's more, for the specific purpose of checking out USB connectivity
and charging you don't even need a good meter, a crap one is perfectly
adequate.


Using even a crappy meter is more than some people can understand, as
well.

Sometimes you need to monitor a half dozen voltages or currents at
once. I'd love to do that with lab grade HP meters, each with a IEEE-488
interface, but they are over $2k each.

I'd rather I never met an IEEE-488 interface. :-( ...one off the
world's most stupid designs.

Some people actually do electronics, while others separate fly shit
from pepper. It isn't difficult to figure ot which category people are
in. I have about a dozen digital meters. The Fluke bench meters are
unrepairable, but the cheap HF meters keep working. Several other
meters are used, for the extended ranges, or special functions.

HF meters aren't repairable, and Flukes keep working. ;-)

I have three (one escaped) Fluke 77s and a bunch of HFs. I keep
the HFs in my tool boxes so they get borrowed. Since I've been
doing this, my Flukes haven't gone missing.

Fifty years ago he would have claimed that the $20 Heathkit VTVM
wasn't as good as the RCA VoltOhmist. that was closer to $100 even
though the circuits were almost identical.

Depends on who built the Heathkit. ;-) They did take a beating,
though there was one resistor in the ohms section...

 

[krw]

In article <qZ-dnXpANojHqcPUnZ2dnUVZ_hmdnZ2d@posted.cpinternet>,
msg@_cybertheque.org_ says...>

Michael A. Terrell wrote:

snip
Parts and equipment are dirt cheap, easy to
find and well documented today. The only 'bargains' in the '60s was
electronic surplus. Mostly worn out or damaged military or industrial
surplus from W.W.II.

My experience is somewhat different; I benefited from large quantities
of nearly new military surplus for decades, which has now dried up; I
also had the benefit of companies willing to provide schematics and
technical documentation (usually at no charge, merely for the asking
in written requests) which is now unheard-of. To me the situation
has become markedly worse.

Yeah, most of it's only available online.

 

[Ken]

Michael A. Terrell wrote:

kjlawren01@earthlink.net wrote:
Thank you for your input....I incourage knowlegable persons to respond
also...

Thank You,
Ken



What an attitude for someone looking for help, and too ignorant to
use the right newsgroups. news:sci.electronics.components was created
to help designers track down OEM parts, not to fix TV sets.

BTW, the words are 'ENCOURAGE' and 'KNOWLEDGEABLE', if you're so hell
bent on 'knowledgeable persons'.

As far as 'knowledgeable', I started working in TV repair 43 years
ago, and worked in electronics repair & manufacturing until a few years
ago. I was also a Radio & TV Broadcast Engineer Keep up the arrogant
attitude, and no one will bother to answer you.

His message may be appearing in several newsgroups. I am viewing it in
sci.electronics.repair and it seems appropriate for that newsgroup.

 

[John Navas]

On Fri, 2 Jan 2009 09:43:47 -0600, krw <krw@att.zzzzzzzzz> wrote in
<MPG.23c7f22be534d32989782@news.individual.net>:

In article <Lr6dneiHCO_lCcDUnZ2dnUVZ_oDinZ2d@earthlink.com>,
mike.terrell@earthlink.net says...

Sometimes you need to monitor a half dozen voltages or currents at
once. I'd love to do that with lab grade HP meters, each with a IEEE-488
interface, but they are over $2k each.

I'd rather I never met an IEEE-488 interface. :-( ...one off the
world's most stupid designs.

Regardless, it's quite workable and useful.

--
Very best wishes for the holiday season and for the coming new year,
John

 

[krw]

In article <egmsl414q1kh30euv2qk4mg3ecni0es328@4ax.com>,
spamfilter1@navasgroup.com says...>

On Fri, 2 Jan 2009 09:43:47 -0600, krw <krw@att.zzzzzzzzz> wrote in
MPG.23c7f22be534d32989782@news.individual.net>:

In article <Lr6dneiHCO_lCcDUnZ2dnUVZ_oDinZ2d@earthlink.com>,
mike.terrell@earthlink.net says...

Sometimes you need to monitor a half dozen voltages or currents at
once. I'd love to do that with lab grade HP meters, each with a IEEE-488
interface, but they are over $2k each.

I'd rather I never met an IEEE-488 interface. :-( ...one off the
world's most stupid designs.

Regardless, it's quite workable and useful.

Useful, yes, when it works. unfortunatelyy its design makes the
workable part problematic. For such modest requirements it's a
*really* bad design, even for the '70s.

 

[John Navas]

On Fri, 2 Jan 2009 12:30:37 -0600, krw <krw@att.zzzzzzzzz> wrote in
<MPG.23c81943a737e503989790@news.individual.net>:

In article <egmsl414q1kh30euv2qk4mg3ecni0es328@4ax.com>,
spamfilter1@navasgroup.com says...
On Fri, 2 Jan 2009 09:43:47 -0600, krw <krw@att.zzzzzzzzz> wrote in
MPG.23c7f22be534d32989782@news.individual.net>:

In article <Lr6dneiHCO_lCcDUnZ2dnUVZ_oDinZ2d@earthlink.com>,
mike.terrell@earthlink.net says...

Sometimes you need to monitor a half dozen voltages or currents at
once. I'd love to do that with lab grade HP meters, each with a IEEE-488
interface, but they are over $2k each.

I'd rather I never met an IEEE-488 interface. :-( ...one off the
world's most stupid designs.

Regardless, it's quite workable and useful.

Useful, yes, when it works. unfortunatelyy its design makes the
workable part problematic. For such modest requirements it's a
*really* bad design, even for the '70s.

That you've had so many problems with it is unfortunate. Perhaps I'm
just lucky, because I've had very few problems with it over the years.

--
Very best wishes for the holiday season and for the coming new year,
John

 

[krw]

In article <cdosl41nt2fiimmatu0tcl0b0hsn3pe48c@4ax.com>,
spamfilter1@navasgroup.com says...>

On Fri, 2 Jan 2009 12:30:37 -0600, krw <krw@att.zzzzzzzzz> wrote in
MPG.23c81943a737e503989790@news.individual.net>:

In article <egmsl414q1kh30euv2qk4mg3ecni0es328@4ax.com>,
spamfilter1@navasgroup.com says...
On Fri, 2 Jan 2009 09:43:47 -0600, krw <krw@att.zzzzzzzzz> wrote in
MPG.23c7f22be534d32989782@news.individual.net>:

In article <Lr6dneiHCO_lCcDUnZ2dnUVZ_oDinZ2d@earthlink.com>,
mike.terrell@earthlink.net says...

Sometimes you need to monitor a half dozen voltages or currents at
once. I'd love to do that with lab grade HP meters, each with a IEEE-488
interface, but they are over $2k each.

I'd rather I never met an IEEE-488 interface. :-( ...one off the
world's most stupid designs.

Regardless, it's quite workable and useful.

Useful, yes, when it works. unfortunatelyy its design makes the
workable part problematic. For such modest requirements it's a
*really* bad design, even for the '70s.

That you've had so many problems with it is unfortunate. Perhaps I'm
just lucky, because I've had very few problems with it over the years.

How many "large" systems (say, 20-30 devices) have you tried to put
together. The connection problems with large numbers of devices
are huge, though I've seen them with only a couple of devices on a
channel, as well. cablingg gets to be a mess (and you'd better have
lots of different lengths on hand to play with).

 

[Franc Zabkar]

On Thu, 01 Jan 2009 23:13:44 -0500, "Michael A. Terrell"
<mike.terrell@earthlink.net> put finger to keyboard and composed:

I have about a dozen digital meters. The Fluke bench meters are
unrepairable, but the cheap HF meters keep working.

I have a Fluke PM97 Scopemeter for which I paid AU$2750. Just about
everything's broken in it. Bad probes, bad batteries (soon after
purchase), bad AC adapter, bad logic board. Even one page of the $100
service manual (the power supply circuit diagram) was missing. For the
past 10 years or so the meter has been sitting in the cupboard. One
day I'll have another go at repairing it, otherwise I'll stomp on it
.... again and again and again ...

- Franc Zabkar
--
Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email.

 

[Michael A. Terrell]

Franc Zabkar wrote:

On Thu, 01 Jan 2009 23:13:44 -0500, "Michael A. Terrell"
mike.terrell@earthlink.net> put finger to keyboard and composed:

I have about a dozen digital meters. The Fluke bench meters are
unrepairable, but the cheap HF meters keep working.

I have a Fluke PM97 Scopemeter for which I paid AU$2750. Just about
everything's broken in it. Bad probes, bad batteries (soon after
purchase), bad AC adapter, bad logic board. Even one page of the $100
service manual (the power supply circuit diagram) was missing. For the
past 10 years or so the meter has been sitting in the cupboard. One
day I'll have another go at repairing it, otherwise I'll stomp on it
... again and again and again ...

Sell it on E-bay as 'May need repaired' ;-)


http://improve-usenet.org/index.html

aioe.org, Goggle Groups, and Web TV users must request to be white
listed, or I will not see your messages.

If you have broadband, your ISP may have a NNTP news server included in
your account: http://www.usenettools.net/ISP.htm


There are two kinds of people on this earth:
The crazy, and the insane.
The first sign of insanity is denying that you're crazy.

 

[Keijo]

Vuona 2007 ilmoitettiin, että sähkön kulutus oli kääntynyt pysyväismuutosta
ennakoivaan laskunsa. Vaikka ydinala vedätteli vielä eetteriin peräti liki
+10% kasvuhaaveitaan oli totuus karu, mutta selkeä -1%. Tämän vuoden alussa
T&T ilmoitteli sitten jo yhä SELKEÄMMIN kiihtyvää sähköntarpeen laskua. Ja
ydinalamme vedätteli valheitaan +10% ennakoinneistaan reaaleista
piittaamatta tietokanaviinsa. TOTUUS heistä lähinnä vitsiä tehden oli
sittten alkukuukausilta jo kaiken kertovaa sähkötarve alas -2%!

Sitten pätkä jatkosta tältä vuodelta 03.06.2008.S.K."Vienti supistui
maaliskuussa runsaasti. Tullihallitus Suomen vienti väheni maaliskuussa
normaalia enemmän. Tullihallituksen mukaan viennin arvo jäi maaliskuussa
hieman yli 5,5 miljaredin. Kun se vuotta aiemmin oli KUUSI PROSENTTIA
ENMMÄN! Vientiä painoivat alas erityisesti metsäteolisuuden ja
sähköteknisten tuotteitten heikko kehitys. STT/HELSINKI!"

Eli ydinalan valheiltan alkaa sähkön lisätarveharhoineen olemaan eväät
totaalisen loppu jo nyt! Merkittävimmät ydinenergiatarvitsijat poistuvat
voimalla sähkömarkkinoilta. Näyttää siltä, että kun puualan ja
metalliteollisuuden kaltaiset häipyvät muille maille lamat allaan ja
talvilämmitystarpeet hiipuvat silmissämme ja bio korvaa loput
ydinsähköstämme kihtyvästi MITÄÄN todellista ydinlisätarvetta ei enää ole
ikinä maassamme. Ei nyt, eikä näillä näytöillä erityisesti jatkossa. Itse
asiassa ydinvoimaloiden jäädessä kylmilleen kiihtyvästi niiden mitä pikaisin
alasajojen aikataulu sopii hyvin EU:n vaatimalta paluultamme takaisin tuonne
1995 sähkönklulutustasoillemme. Ydinherramme saavat siis lakata
valehtelemasta kansalleen ja alkaa lukea maamme REALITEETTEJA!

 

[Peter Hucker]

On Fri, 26 Dec 2008 20:33:36 -0000, Pat Cheney <pcheney@ymail.com> wrote:

On Fri, 26 Dec 2008 11:47:06 -0800, SMS wrote:

They said it was "usb" but they never said it was "proprietary USB".
Does anyone know WHY they didn't say that additional word?

For the same reason that reviews of cell phones don't mention the type
of charging connector. The review sites don't understand that it's a
feature of concern to some buyers. Actually when I buy a cell phone
these days, I won't buy one that uses a proprietary power connector, but
you can't find that information out easily without looking at the phone.

You're so right!

I never buy a cell phone without finding out first if it's mini-usb or not.
Same with headphones and gps navigation units.

One problem I've found with cellphones is Motorola. For some reason,
Motorola USB is "special" USB.

I've found that Motorola chargers work fine with all other phones but
Motorola phones don't work well with the other chargers. But I found a
solution that works so that a single charger charges all my electronics.

This happened with my Blackberry 8700 two years ago and again with my new
Blackberry 9000 this year.

The solution was to buy from a large department store a 550 ma Motorola
mini-usb charger and then to turn around a day later and return it. But, in
the box I put the brand-new 750ma Blackberry mini-USB charger instead of
the Motorola charger.

I would hope EVERYONE would do this. When Motorola gets thousands of
Blackberry or Garmin mini-usb chargers, they'll figure out their error.

Luckily, for the past two years, I've had no problems using the Motorola
charger in all my portable electronics appliances so it's just the Motorola
phone (RAZR) that is the culprit.

I never use the software on my cameras. I take the memory card out and stick it in a universal card reader. Same can apply to phones.


--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

Top Tip. If someone shoves your feet in a fire, quickly put your head in a bucket of iced water. On average, you will be pretty comfortable.

 

[Peter Hucker]

On Sat, 27 Dec 2008 02:11:39 -0000, John Navas <spamfilter1@navasgroup.com> wrote:

On Fri, 26 Dec 2008 12:33:36 -0800, Pat Cheney <pcheney@ymail.com> wrote
in <zeb5l.11062$x%.8576@nlpi070.nbdc.sbc.com>:

I never buy a cell phone without finding out first if it's mini-usb or not.
Same with headphones and gps navigation units.

One problem I've found with cellphones is Motorola. For some reason,
Motorola USB is "special" USB.

I've found that Motorola chargers work fine with all other phones but
Motorola phones don't work well with the other chargers. ...

This is actually just a matter of the wrong cable / connection.

The problem is that not all Standard-A to Mini-B USB cables are the same
-- there are both 5-connection cables and 4-connection cables, and only
proper 5-connector cables will work properly without a Motorola USB
driver. Standard USB has only 4 connections. Mini USB has 5
connections, the extra connection being the device ID pin.

There was absolutely no need to invent more than TWO types of B connector. A big one and a little one.


--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

A foursome was on the last hole, and when the last golfer drove off the tee he hooked into a cow pasture. He advised his friends to play through and he'd meet them at the clubhouse. They followed the plan and waited for their friend.
After a considerable time he appeared disheveled, bloody, and badly beaten up. They all wanted to know what happened.
He explained that he went over to the cow pasture but could not find his ball. He noticed a cow wringing her tail in obvious pain. He went over and lifted her tail and saw a golf ball solidly embedded. It was a yellow Titleist so he knew it was not his. A woman comes out of the bushes apparently searching for her lost golf ball.
The helpful male golfer lifted the cow's tail and asked, "Does this look like yours?" and that was the last thing he could remember.

 

[John Navas]

On Tue, 06 Jan 2009 19:38:46 -0000, "Peter Hucker" <none@spam.com> wrote
in <op.uncouwa54buhsv@fx62.mshome.net>:

On Sat, 27 Dec 2008 02:11:39 -0000, John Navas <spamfilter1@navasgroup.com> wrote:

The problem is that not all Standard-A to Mini-B USB cables are the same
-- there are both 5-connection cables and 4-connection cables, and only
proper 5-connector cables will work properly without a Motorola USB
driver. Standard USB has only 4 connections. Mini USB has 5
connections, the extra connection being the device ID pin.

There was absolutely no need to invent more than TWO types of B connector. A big one and a little one.

Different devices have different requirements. The big one is stronger
and easier to use for devices with sufficient size. The small one is
designed for small devices.

--
Best regards,
John
Panasonic DMC-FZ8, DMC-FZ20, and several others

 

[Peter Hucker]

On Tue, 06 Jan 2009 20:07:17 -0000, John Navas <spamfilter1@navasgroup.com> wrote:

On Tue, 06 Jan 2009 19:38:46 -0000, "Peter Hucker" <none@spam.com> wrote
in <op.uncouwa54buhsv@fx62.mshome.net>:

On Sat, 27 Dec 2008 02:11:39 -0000, John Navas <spamfilter1@navasgroup.com> wrote:

The problem is that not all Standard-A to Mini-B USB cables are the same
-- there are both 5-connection cables and 4-connection cables, and only
proper 5-connector cables will work properly without a Motorola USB
driver. Standard USB has only 4 connections. Mini USB has 5
connections, the extra connection being the device ID pin.

There was absolutely no need to invent more than TWO types of B connector. A big one and a little one.

Different devices have different requirements. The big one is stronger
and easier to use for devices with sufficient size. The small one is
designed for small devices.

Agreed. What I object to is the large number of varieties of the small type.


--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

Mixed emotions are when your mother-in-law drives your new Ferrari off the cliff.

 

[John Navas]

On Tue, 06 Jan 2009 20:14:10 -0000, "Peter Hucker" <none@spam.com> wrote
in <op.uncqhwe74buhsv@fx62.mshome.net>:

On Tue, 06 Jan 2009 20:07:17 -0000, John Navas <spamfilter1@navasgroup.com> wrote:

On Tue, 06 Jan 2009 19:38:46 -0000, "Peter Hucker" <none@spam.com> wrote
in <op.uncouwa54buhsv@fx62.mshome.net>:

On Sat, 27 Dec 2008 02:11:39 -0000, John Navas <spamfilter1@navasgroup.com> wrote:

The problem is that not all Standard-A to Mini-B USB cables are the same
-- there are both 5-connection cables and 4-connection cables, and only
proper 5-connector cables will work properly without a Motorola USB
driver. Standard USB has only 4 connections. Mini USB has 5
connections, the extra connection being the device ID pin.

There was absolutely no need to invent more than TWO types of B connector. A big one and a little one.

Different devices have different requirements. The big one is stronger
and easier to use for devices with sufficient size. The small one is
designed for small devices.

Agreed. What I object to is the large number of varieties of the small type.

There are only two, mini and micro.

--
Best regards,
John
Panasonic DMC-FZ8, DMC-FZ20, and several others

 

[Peter Hucker]

On Tue, 06 Jan 2009 20:15:31 -0000, John Navas <spamfilter1@navasgroup.com> wrote:

On Tue, 06 Jan 2009 20:14:10 -0000, "Peter Hucker" <none@spam.com> wrote
in <op.uncqhwe74buhsv@fx62.mshome.net>:

On Tue, 06 Jan 2009 20:07:17 -0000, John Navas <spamfilter1@navasgroup.com> wrote:

On Tue, 06 Jan 2009 19:38:46 -0000, "Peter Hucker" <none@spam.com> wrote
in <op.uncouwa54buhsv@fx62.mshome.net>:

On Sat, 27 Dec 2008 02:11:39 -0000, John Navas <spamfilter1@navasgroup.com> wrote:

The problem is that not all Standard-A to Mini-B USB cables are the same
-- there are both 5-connection cables and 4-connection cables, and only
proper 5-connector cables will work properly without a Motorola USB
driver. Standard USB has only 4 connections. Mini USB has 5
connections, the extra connection being the device ID pin.

There was absolutely no need to invent more than TWO types of B connector. A big one and a little one.

Different devices have different requirements. The big one is stronger
and easier to use for devices with sufficient size. The small one is
designed for small devices.

Agreed. What I object to is the large number of varieties of the small type.

There are only two, mini and micro.

There are only two standard ones. There are also a couple that only fit certain makes of camera. The only place I've found to get these is to look for a cable designed for that particular camera on ebay.

--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

_.-``````-._
,' `.
___/________________\___
(_o__o__o__o__o__o__o__o_)
=.============,=
/`-.__..__.-'\
OO || OO
OO

 

[John Navas]

On Tue, 06 Jan 2009 20:27:41 -0000, "Peter Hucker" <none@spam.com> wrote
in <op.uncq4fjb4buhsv@fx62.mshome.net>:

On Tue, 06 Jan 2009 20:15:31 -0000, John Navas <spamfilter1@navasgroup.com> wrote:

On Tue, 06 Jan 2009 20:14:10 -0000, "Peter Hucker" <none@spam.com> wrote
in <op.uncqhwe74buhsv@fx62.mshome.net>:

On Tue, 06 Jan 2009 20:07:17 -0000, John Navas <spamfilter1@navasgroup.com> wrote:

On Tue, 06 Jan 2009 19:38:46 -0000, "Peter Hucker" <none@spam.com> wrote
in <op.uncouwa54buhsv@fx62.mshome.net>:

On Sat, 27 Dec 2008 02:11:39 -0000, John Navas <spamfilter1@navasgroup.com> wrote:

The problem is that not all Standard-A to Mini-B USB cables are the same
-- there are both 5-connection cables and 4-connection cables, and only
proper 5-connector cables will work properly without a Motorola USB
driver. Standard USB has only 4 connections. Mini USB has 5
connections, the extra connection being the device ID pin.

There was absolutely no need to invent more than TWO types of B connector. A big one and a little one.

Different devices have different requirements. The big one is stronger
and easier to use for devices with sufficient size. The small one is
designed for small devices.

Agreed. What I object to is the large number of varieties of the small type.

There are only two, mini and micro.

There are only two standard ones.
There are also a couple that only fit certain makes of camera.

That's typically because the camera also has audio-video output that
needs its own connections, and because size and cost are often issues, a
proprietary combo USB-AV connector is used. But the camera usually
comes with the requisite cable, so there's no real issue unless you're
careless enough to lose it.

--
Best regards,
John
Panasonic DMC-FZ8, DMC-FZ20, and several others