RF Circuit Design - Chris Bowick...

[Don Y]

On 11/25/2020 1:38 AM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:

[I prefer phones, tablets and other appliances that use removable
media -- even if I have to dissect the device to get AT that media -- for
storage. And, non-proprietary file formats.]

Yes, that\'s the theory. My reality is that I\'ve misplaced several
micro-SD cards juggling them between devices (phone, camera, adapter,
viewer, PC, laptop, chromebook, Raspberry Pi\'s, etc). Hmmm... I just
found on my desk a SIM card that probably belongs to someone\'s phone.

I install the largest microSD card that each device can support
and then treat it as if it was internal memory. The main difference
being that I can *remove* it, easily, if something goes wonky with
the device.

I actually *should* try cards that are larger than allegedly supported
in the hope that they *might* be supported. A lot of times, I think
folks advertise the largest CURRENTLY AVAILABLE card as their maximum
limit despite the fact that the software/system may actually support larger!

[E.g., I have lots of 32G cards installed when I suspect I could just
as easily use 128G or even larger! Larger means I don\'t have to edit
what I choose to install on a particular card.]

 

[Don Y]

On 11/25/2020 1:41 AM, Steve Wilson wrote:

boB <boB@K7IQ.com> wrote:

On Sun, 22 Nov 2020 17:44:32 -0800, Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com
wrote:

Incidentally, I used to collect technical books from between the start
of WWI and the end of WWII. It\'s not a huge collection, but it does
make interesting reading. Many of the de facto standards used in
today\'s electronics were established during this time. These will be
the last books to be purged from my shelves.

AEK has amassed quite a collection of scanned (hi-res) documents
at bitsavers.org. One of my ToDo items is to forward my collection
of MULTICS documents to him for inclusion in his archive.

[Also, several documents on early speech synthesizers that he appears
to be missing]

Sure would be nice if there were 25 -- or even *35*! -- hours in each day!!!

 

[Tom Gardner]

On 25/11/20 07:33, Jeff Liebermann wrote:

On Wed, 25 Nov 2020 00:10:28 +0000, Cursitor Doom <cd@noreply.com
wrote:
I\'m very happy the stuff I like to goof around with
usually has through-hole components visible to the naked eye. I very
much like that. The last thing I need is some grain of sand-sized chip
that flies away into the universe next door if I so much as breath on
it! I\'m entirely comfortable in my obsolescence. I\'ll cheerfully leave
all the super-fast sub-min stuff to the Larkins of this world.

Well, I tried and methinks that you\'re hopeless.

I tend to judge people by their willingness and ability to learn. What
you\'ve done is essentially announce that you don\'t want to try
anything new and prefer to dabble in what you find comfortable. I
realize that you probably don\'t care, but you just failed my litmus
test.

That\'s pretty much my attitude too; it has stood me
in good stead.

Such \"I don\'t want to learn\" attitudes are usually
not confined to one area of a person\'s life. Based
on CD\'s postings, his attitudes on other topics are
congruent with that.

 

[Don Y]

On 11/25/2020 1:19 AM, Phil Hobbs wrote:

On 11/25/20 2:47 AM, Don Y wrote:
On 11/24/2020 9:21 PM, Phil Hobbs wrote:

Taking an interest in your field means (in part) finding out about current
and expected future developments.

I have to remind myself not to be \"elitist\"; there are folks for
whom work is \"just WORK\"! Were it not for a set of mouths to
feed, they\'d gladly be doing something else.

It isn\'t elitist to say that that somebody who doesn\'t really give a crap
about his job apart from the pay cheque isn\'t worth that much as an
engineer. He might be a great dad, coach baseball, spend all his free time
saying rosaries for the souls in purgatory, and generally be a much better
man than I am, but he\'s not too valuable as an engineer.

Do you expect a physician to \"give a crap\" about HIS job -- apart from
the paycheck? Else he\'s not worth that much as a physician?

What about a dentist? Accountant? Librarian?

What a ridiculous line of questioning. \"Goll-ee, Lou Ann, I don\'t mind if that
doctor fella that\'s taking out my appendix doesn\'t care about his job! He\'s
got those diplomas an\' all!\"

I don\'t assume a doctor is incompetent just because he isn\'t obsessed
with pursuing his chosen vocation 24/7. I don\'t assume a plumber is
incompetent just because *he* isn\'t up on the latest technology available to
locate leaks in concrete slabs.

Plumber? Carpenter?

Ditch-digger?

Now your elitism is really showing. Craftsmen that I know do take an interest
in their own crafts. I imagine that if you suggested to your doctor, dentist,
accountant, or carpenter that they didn\'t need to care about their work, you
might get quite a tart response.

I\'d not select a \"professional\" that wasn\'t \"up\" on his craft.
Despite that, I don\'t expect them to be familiar with the
bleeding edge of it!

Yet, there are countless \"professionals\" that wouldn\'t meet this
criteria -- does that mean the folks that they serve are suffering
from their lack of up-to-date knowledge? Does YOUR PCP know the
details of the various COVID vaccines in sufficient detail to
determine which -- if any -- are applicable to your particular
needs? Wanna bet he\'ll just resort to a one sheet set of guidelines
when/if he makes his \"personalized\" recommendation, to you? What
are the chances that this will be a poor choice in your instance?

My PCP tends to be very knowledgeable. Yet, there have been many times
when I\'ve been met with \"I don\'t know\" as an answer to one of my queries.
SHOULD he have known (\"whatever\")? Or, is it sufficient for him to
\"know enough\" to have a grasp as to what he DOESN\'T know (and can refer
me to a specialist)?

 

[Phil Hobbs]

On 11/25/20 4:34 AM, Don Y wrote:

On 11/25/2020 1:19 AM, Phil Hobbs wrote:
On 11/25/20 2:47 AM, Don Y wrote:
On 11/24/2020 9:21 PM, Phil Hobbs wrote:

Taking an interest in your field means (in part) finding out about
current and expected future developments.

I have to remind myself not to be \"elitist\"; there are folks for
whom work is \"just WORK\"!  Were it not for a set of mouths to
feed, they\'d gladly be doing something else.

It isn\'t elitist to say that that somebody who doesn\'t really give a
crap about his job apart from the pay cheque isn\'t worth that much
as an engineer.  He might be a great dad, coach baseball, spend all
his free time saying rosaries for the souls in purgatory, and
generally be a much better man than I am, but he\'s not too valuable
as an engineer.

Do you expect a physician to \"give a crap\" about HIS job -- apart from
the paycheck?  Else he\'s not worth that much as a physician?

What about a dentist?  Accountant?  Librarian?

What a ridiculous line of questioning.  \"Goll-ee, Lou Ann, I don\'t
mind if that doctor fella that\'s taking out my appendix doesn\'t care
about his job!  He\'s got those diplomas an\' all!\"

I don\'t assume a doctor is incompetent just because he isn\'t obsessed
with pursuing his chosen vocation 24/7.  I don\'t assume a plumber is
incompetent just because *he* isn\'t up on the latest technology
available to
locate leaks in concrete slabs.

Plumber?  Carpenter?

Ditch-digger?

Now your elitism is really showing.  Craftsmen that I know do take an
interest in their own crafts.  I imagine that if you suggested to your
doctor, dentist, accountant, or carpenter that they didn\'t need to
care about their work, you might get quite a tart response.

I\'d not select a \"professional\" that wasn\'t \"up\" on his craft.
Despite that, I don\'t expect them to be familiar with the
bleeding edge of it!

You\'re tryint to move the goal posts again, dude. We were talking about
folks who only worked for the pay cheque. Thanks for playing.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs


--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal Consultant
ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics
Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

http://electrooptical.net
http://hobbs-eo.com

 

[Don Y]

On 11/25/2020 5:52 AM, Phil Hobbs wrote:

On 11/25/20 4:34 AM, Don Y wrote:
On 11/25/2020 1:19 AM, Phil Hobbs wrote:
On 11/25/20 2:47 AM, Don Y wrote:
On 11/24/2020 9:21 PM, Phil Hobbs wrote:

Taking an interest in your field means (in part) finding out about
current and expected future developments.

I have to remind myself not to be \"elitist\"; there are folks for
whom work is \"just WORK\"! Were it not for a set of mouths to
feed, they\'d gladly be doing something else.

It isn\'t elitist to say that that somebody who doesn\'t really give a crap
about his job apart from the pay cheque isn\'t worth that much as an
engineer. He might be a great dad, coach baseball, spend all his free
time saying rosaries for the souls in purgatory, and generally be a much
better man than I am, but he\'s not too valuable as an engineer.

Do you expect a physician to \"give a crap\" about HIS job -- apart from
the paycheck? Else he\'s not worth that much as a physician?

What about a dentist? Accountant? Librarian?

What a ridiculous line of questioning. \"Goll-ee, Lou Ann, I don\'t mind if
that doctor fella that\'s taking out my appendix doesn\'t care about his job!
He\'s got those diplomas an\' all!\"

I don\'t assume a doctor is incompetent just because he isn\'t obsessed
with pursuing his chosen vocation 24/7. I don\'t assume a plumber is
incompetent just because *he* isn\'t up on the latest technology available to
locate leaks in concrete slabs.

Plumber? Carpenter?

Ditch-digger?

Now your elitism is really showing. Craftsmen that I know do take an
interest in their own crafts. I imagine that if you suggested to your
doctor, dentist, accountant, or carpenter that they didn\'t need to care
about their work, you might get quite a tart response.

I\'d not select a \"professional\" that wasn\'t \"up\" on his craft.
Despite that, I don\'t expect them to be familiar with the
bleeding edge of it!

You\'re tryint to move the goal posts again, dude. We were talking about folks
who only worked for the pay cheque. Thanks for playing.

Do you think there are NO doctors, lawyers, carpenters, accountants,
dentists, ditch-diggers who ONLY work for the paycheck? And, thus,
care little about \"taking an interest in [their] field\"? Therefore,
\"not too valuable as an engineer\" (or doctor, lawyer, dentist, etc.)?

I\'d wager many (most?) folks do what they do, year after year, SOLELY
for that paycheck and relish \"quitting time\" as a chance to get away
from their chosen profession. Expecting \"professionals\" to be more
devoted is naive.

 

[server]

On Tue, 24 Nov 2020 23:33:37 -0800, Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com>
wrote:

Plus the parts for those kind of frequencies are
typically tiny SMDs and I don\'t have the eyesight or steady hands for
assembling them.

I\'m 72. The hand is still steady but the eyesight is rapidly
deteriorating. So, I bought some microscopes:
http://www.learnbydestroying.com/jeffl/pics/microscopes/
My guess(tm) is have about $350 invested in *ALL* the microscopes
pictured. The most expensive items were replacement and additional
objective lenses and eyepieces. Something like this would be ideal:
http://www.learnbydestroying.com/jeffl/pics/microscopes/Olympus%20SZ30/index.html#SZ30-01.jpg
You can also get a microscope camera that fits in place of one of the
eyepieces. I bought a cheap one and regret it. Buy one that has a
0.5x lens.

My eyesight has always been bad, and isn\'t improving with age. My
consolation is that the parts are so small now, nobody can work with
them without optical assistance.

The EPC GaN fets are cheap and electrically fabulous, but they are
BGAs, so take some effort to get used to. It\'s worth the effort.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/i1a80vjqivn9cqd/BGA1.jpg?raw=1

https://www.dropbox.com/s/8murps9ixcghcsh/EPC2012_GaN_2.jpg?raw=1

We made our own adapters.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/iwsfcm5jryuoxev/GaN_Boards.JPG?raw=1

EPC has LT Spice models too. The idea here is that if you sim a few
circuits, you\'ll be amazed and simply have to try them in real life.

I\'m very happy the stuff I like to goof around with
usually has through-hole components visible to the naked eye. I very
much like that. The last thing I need is some grain of sand-sized chip
that flies away into the universe next door if I so much as breath on
it! I\'m entirely comfortable in my obsolescence. I\'ll cheerfully leave
all the super-fast sub-min stuff to the Larkins of this world.

Well, I tried and methinks that you\'re hopeless.

I tend to judge people by their willingness and ability to learn. What
you\'ve done is essentially announce that you don\'t want to try
anything new and prefer to dabble in what you find comfortable. I
realize that you probably don\'t care, but you just failed my litmus
test.

One thing about learning something new, or about doing lots of other
things, is just do it. Once you get started, it\'s not so bad.



--

John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc

The best designs are necessarily accidental.

 

[server]

On Wed, 25 Nov 2020 02:04:46 -0500, Phil Hobbs
<pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:

Of course, paper books last a great deal longer than electronic devices.
Most SED denizens may not be expecting to outlast their latest
e-reader gizmo, but it\'s worth mentioning.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

I\'ve taken over finishing and final-tuning the PCB layout of a
10-layer board with about 1000 parts.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/yoy1ql2e5yxrrj7/P505C_L1.jpg?raw=1

OK, I\'m a fogie, but it is so much easier for me to visualize the
power planes if I print them out on paper.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/xem92sr6kqg5aae/P500_Pours_Paper.jpg?raw=1

(my version of \"Windows\")

I add text to each pour region to ID the voltage. That makes it a lot
easier to understand. There are arguably 33 different power rails on
this board.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/j0nqmbslonfa6rf/P505C_L6.jpg?raw=1

I print the schematic too, all 31 pages of it, so I can read it in
bed, or scribble on it.

Paper is amazing technology. I must have 100 colored pencils and pens.






--

John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc

The best designs are necessarily accidental.

 

[Don Y]

On 11/25/2020 8:31 AM, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:

On Tue, 24 Nov 2020 23:33:37 -0800, Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com

I tend to judge people by their willingness and ability to learn. What
you\'ve done is essentially announce that you don\'t want to try
anything new and prefer to dabble in what you find comfortable. I
realize that you probably don\'t care, but you just failed my litmus
test.

One thing about learning something new, or about doing lots of other
things, is just do it. Once you get started, it\'s not so bad.

It doesn\'t have to be \"not so bad\". Nor do you need to *master*
whatever it is you are attempting (to do or learn). The effort
of doing so *teaches* and, unless you\'re a dolt, you come away with
SOMETHING that *may* benefit you in other areas/endeavors.

I dug out a 1200 pound tree stump many years ago. With a shovel.
I removed 7 tons of soil in the process (replacing it with almost
9 tons). It took many months.

But, I discovered all sorts of issues that I wouldn\'t have (hadn\'t!)
anticipated, beforehand (like how do you support the stump while
you are severing the tap roots UNDER it?). And, I managed to improve
my \"process\" (efficiency) considerably during the effort.

I, also, discovered that a more mechanized approach would likely
have cracked the ceramic sewer line that one of the larger roots
had opted to follow (no doubt because the soil was less dense
where that trench had been dug to lay the pipe!).

It\'s not something that I\'d care to repeat! But, folks in the
neighborhood still bring it up, from time to time.

OTOH, I now do my own roof maintenance, *annually* (the norm is
a 5-7 year interval). It\'s not rocket science. And, the \"painting\"
(which the \"professionals\" pitch as the valuable aspect of the
effort) is the easiest -- and least prophylactic! -- part of the job.
The more significant aspect is the yearly inspection and repair
that is possible and practical with a DIY approach.

As a result, our 30 year old roof is still without leaks while
virtually all of the neighbors have had theirs replaced -- at
least once -- in that interval. Because the \"professionals\" are
just interested in being paid for an effort instead of actually
maintaining the structure.

 

[server]

On Wed, 25 Nov 2020 08:26:14 -0700, Don Y
<blockedofcourse@foo.invalid> wrote:

On 11/25/2020 5:52 AM, Phil Hobbs wrote:
On 11/25/20 4:34 AM, Don Y wrote:
On 11/25/2020 1:19 AM, Phil Hobbs wrote:
On 11/25/20 2:47 AM, Don Y wrote:
On 11/24/2020 9:21 PM, Phil Hobbs wrote:

Taking an interest in your field means (in part) finding out about
current and expected future developments.

I have to remind myself not to be \"elitist\"; there are folks for
whom work is \"just WORK\"! Were it not for a set of mouths to
feed, they\'d gladly be doing something else.

It isn\'t elitist to say that that somebody who doesn\'t really give a crap
about his job apart from the pay cheque isn\'t worth that much as an
engineer. He might be a great dad, coach baseball, spend all his free
time saying rosaries for the souls in purgatory, and generally be a much
better man than I am, but he\'s not too valuable as an engineer.

Do you expect a physician to \"give a crap\" about HIS job -- apart from
the paycheck? Else he\'s not worth that much as a physician?

What about a dentist? Accountant? Librarian?

What a ridiculous line of questioning. \"Goll-ee, Lou Ann, I don\'t mind if
that doctor fella that\'s taking out my appendix doesn\'t care about his job!
He\'s got those diplomas an\' all!\"

I don\'t assume a doctor is incompetent just because he isn\'t obsessed
with pursuing his chosen vocation 24/7. I don\'t assume a plumber is
incompetent just because *he* isn\'t up on the latest technology available to
locate leaks in concrete slabs.

Plumber? Carpenter?

Ditch-digger?

Now your elitism is really showing. Craftsmen that I know do take an
interest in their own crafts. I imagine that if you suggested to your
doctor, dentist, accountant, or carpenter that they didn\'t need to care
about their work, you might get quite a tart response.

I\'d not select a \"professional\" that wasn\'t \"up\" on his craft.
Despite that, I don\'t expect them to be familiar with the
bleeding edge of it!

You\'re tryint to move the goal posts again, dude. We were talking about folks
who only worked for the pay cheque. Thanks for playing.

Do you think there are NO doctors, lawyers, carpenters, accountants,
dentists, ditch-diggers who ONLY work for the paycheck? And, thus,
care little about \"taking an interest in [their] field\"? Therefore,
\"not too valuable as an engineer\" (or doctor, lawyer, dentist, etc.)?

I\'d wager many (most?) folks do what they do, year after year, SOLELY
for that paycheck and relish \"quitting time\" as a chance to get away
from their chosen profession. Expecting \"professionals\" to be more
devoted is naive.

There are millions of people today who are suffering from lockdowns
and want to go to work, even if they are being paid to work at home,
or to not work.

A job provides people with structure and purpose and amusement and
social interaction and free coffee and office supplies.






--

John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc

The best designs are necessarily accidental.

 

[Phil Hobbs]

On 11/25/20 2:56 AM, Don Y wrote:

On 11/25/2020 12:04 AM, Phil Hobbs wrote:

Of course, paper books last a great deal longer than electronic
devices.  Most SED denizens may not be expecting to outlast their
latest e-reader gizmo, but it\'s worth mentioning.

I\'ve a colleague who discovered a packrat (or some other sort of rodent)
had managed to chew a portion of the texts that he\'d stored in a shed
(no basements, here).  He only realized this after a leak in that shed\'s
roof managed to soak several boxes of those texts!  :-/

Rubbermaid bins are pretty cheap. I sure wouldn\'t store books in
cardboard boxes in an outbuilding--just the mildew would be an issue.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal Consultant
ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics
Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

http://electrooptical.net
http://hobbs-eo.com

 

[Dave Platt]

In article <7n2srfh6ph1l3cp86qria55ejprlq1goqg@4ax.com>,
Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com> wrote:

That has already happened to me. When I dug out my Kindle DX
Graphite:
http://www.learnbydestroying.com/jeffl/crud/Amazon%20Kindle%20DX
I tried to check if there were any pending messages or file transfers.
It wouldn\'t connect via 3G wireless. At some time in the past, AT&T
ended 3G service for Amazon Whispernet, leaving my Kindle DX
unconnected. Since there\'s no SD card, ethernet or Wi-Fi in the
Kindle DX, it\'s now useless. I checked an all my other Kindles still
work via Wi-Fi.

It would probably be a futile and expensive thing to try, but I\'ll bet
you could find the makings of a 3G base-station/test infrastructure
that could let you create a local 3G access point, and bridge it into
your home Ethernet.

 

[Don Y]

On 11/25/2020 9:39 AM, Phil Hobbs wrote:

On 11/25/20 2:56 AM, Don Y wrote:
On 11/25/2020 12:04 AM, Phil Hobbs wrote:

Of course, paper books last a great deal longer than electronic devices.
Most SED denizens may not be expecting to outlast their latest e-reader
gizmo, but it\'s worth mentioning.

I\'ve a colleague who discovered a packrat (or some other sort of rodent)
had managed to chew a portion of the texts that he\'d stored in a shed
(no basements, here). He only realized this after a leak in that shed\'s
roof managed to soak several boxes of those texts! :-/

Rubbermaid bins are pretty cheap. I sure wouldn\'t store books in cardboard
boxes in an outbuilding--just the mildew would be an issue.

You can\'t stack rubbermaid bins when they are loaded with ~80-120 pounds
of books, each. By contrast, you can pack a nice, \"square\" box
*solid* and effectively turn it into a brick -- which stacks nicely
atop other such bricks. Witness how well photocopier paper stacks.

By contrast, we can\'t stack the rubbermaid bins in which we store our
bedsheets to cover the citrus trees without the bins deforming under
the weight.

 

[Sjouke Burry]

On 25.11.20 16:50, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:

On Wed, 25 Nov 2020 02:04:46 -0500, Phil Hobbs
pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:


Of course, paper books last a great deal longer than electronic devices.
Most SED denizens may not be expecting to outlast their latest
e-reader gizmo, but it\'s worth mentioning.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

I\'ve taken over finishing and final-tuning the PCB layout of a
10-layer board with about 1000 parts.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/yoy1ql2e5yxrrj7/P505C_L1.jpg?raw=1

OK, I\'m a fogie, but it is so much easier for me to visualize the
power planes if I print them out on paper.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/xem92sr6kqg5aae/P500_Pours_Paper.jpg?raw=1

(my version of \"Windows\")

I add text to each pour region to ID the voltage. That makes it a lot
easier to understand. There are arguably 33 different power rails on
this board.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/j0nqmbslonfa6rf/P505C_L6.jpg?raw=1

I print the schematic too, all 31 pages of it, so I can read it in
bed, or scribble on it.

Paper is amazing technology. I must have 100 colored pencils and pens.

You forgot to chew the pencils...

 

[Phil Hobbs]

On 11/25/20 2:20 PM, Don Y wrote:

On 11/25/2020 9:39 AM, Phil Hobbs wrote:
On 11/25/20 2:56 AM, Don Y wrote:
On 11/25/2020 12:04 AM, Phil Hobbs wrote:

Of course, paper books last a great deal longer than electronic
devices. Most SED denizens may not be expecting to outlast their
latest e-reader gizmo, but it\'s worth mentioning.

I\'ve a colleague who discovered a packrat (or some other sort of rodent)
had managed to chew a portion of the texts that he\'d stored in a shed
(no basements, here).  He only realized this after a leak in that shed\'s
roof managed to soak several boxes of those texts!  :-/

Rubbermaid bins are pretty cheap.  I sure wouldn\'t store books in
cardboard boxes in an outbuilding--just the mildew would be an issue.

You can\'t stack rubbermaid bins when they are loaded with ~80-120 pounds
of books, each.

Sure you can, as long as there isn\'t more than 1/4 inch or so of space
between the lid and the top of the books. It does take a bit of care in
packing them

By contrast, you can pack a nice, \"square\" box

*solid* and effectively turn it into a brick -- which stacks nicely
atop other such bricks.  Witness how well photocopier paper stacks.

Books are already bricks, unlike bedsheets.

By contrast, we can\'t stack the rubbermaid bins in which we store our
bedsheets to cover the citrus trees without the bins deforming under
the weight.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal Consultant
ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics
Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

http://electrooptical.net
http://hobbs-eo.com

 

[Phil Hobbs]

On 11/25/20 10:50 AM, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:

On Wed, 25 Nov 2020 02:04:46 -0500, Phil Hobbs
pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:


Of course, paper books last a great deal longer than electronic devices.
Most SED denizens may not be expecting to outlast their latest
e-reader gizmo, but it\'s worth mentioning.

I\'ve taken over finishing and final-tuning the PCB layout of a
10-layer board with about 1000 parts.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/yoy1ql2e5yxrrj7/P505C_L1.jpg?raw=1

OK, I\'m a fogie, but it is so much easier for me to visualize the
power planes if I print them out on paper.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/xem92sr6kqg5aae/P500_Pours_Paper.jpg?raw=1

(my version of \"Windows\")

I add text to each pour region to ID the voltage. That makes it a lot
easier to understand. There are arguably 33 different power rails on
this board.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/j0nqmbslonfa6rf/P505C_L6.jpg?raw=1

I print the schematic too, all 31 pages of it, so I can read it in
bed, or scribble on it.

Your Mo is a very patient woman. (So\'s mine, actually.)

Paper is amazing technology. I must have 100 colored pencils and pens.

I\'m not that far out there--I generally use only five or six colours.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs


--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal Consultant
ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics
Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

http://electrooptical.net
http://hobbs-eo.com

 

[Don Y]

On 11/25/2020 12:56 PM, Phil Hobbs wrote:

On 11/25/20 2:20 PM, Don Y wrote:
On 11/25/2020 9:39 AM, Phil Hobbs wrote:
On 11/25/20 2:56 AM, Don Y wrote:
On 11/25/2020 12:04 AM, Phil Hobbs wrote:

Of course, paper books last a great deal longer than electronic devices.
Most SED denizens may not be expecting to outlast their latest e-reader
gizmo, but it\'s worth mentioning.

I\'ve a colleague who discovered a packrat (or some other sort of rodent)
had managed to chew a portion of the texts that he\'d stored in a shed
(no basements, here). He only realized this after a leak in that shed\'s
roof managed to soak several boxes of those texts! :-/

Rubbermaid bins are pretty cheap. I sure wouldn\'t store books in cardboard
boxes in an outbuilding--just the mildew would be an issue.

You can\'t stack rubbermaid bins when they are loaded with ~80-120 pounds
of books, each.

Sure you can, as long as there isn\'t more than 1/4 inch or so of space between
the lid and the top of the books. It does take a bit of care in packing them

*YOU* may be able to. But *I* find hefting large boxes of that weight range
to be a bit too difficult! Especially if you have to, eventually, shuffle
them around to gain access to a particular box (which will likely NOT be
\"on top\").

When I moved here, my paperback collection came in ~80 boxes just a bit smaller
than a box of photocopier paper. The ~18\" length is just about ideal for
lifting (distance between shoulders). And, the smaller size (wrt the large
rubbermaid tubs) means there\'s less weight involved. Of course, paperbacks
tend to share a common size (in at least two dimensions) so packing is less
of an exercise than trying to fit arbitrary sized text books!

The large plastic containers are just too big -- especially if you need to
fill them completely (to maintain their \"stiffness\" as well as reduce the
volume that they require to store your goods). They\'re great for things
like XMAS ornaments -- which are mostly air!

By contrast, you can pack a nice, \"square\" box
*solid* and effectively turn it into a brick -- which stacks nicely
atop other such bricks. Witness how well photocopier paper stacks.

Books are already bricks, unlike bedsheets.

Bedsheets are *ideal* bricks! They can be tailored to any size/shape
based on how they are folded. And, as they are standardized sizes,
its easy to create multiple instances of a particular finished size
by simply folding each sheet the same way.

And, while they aren\'t inherently rigid, you can \"overpack\" them
into a container so that weight from above compresses them to the
point where they are, effectively, bricks.

But, then you\'re back to big, heavy boxes, again!

As to mildew, water damage, etc. Garages and out-buildings are the ideal
places to store items, here. It is REALLY dry -- unlike the miserable
humidity, fog, drizzle, etc. you encounter up north. Tools left unprotected
don\'t rust (unless left OUT in the rain). By contrast, I\'d typically
coat my tools with machine oil when I lived in less arid places.

Water damage is a problem in the interior of homes -- because there
are so many roof penetrations in a typical home. E.g., we have:
- three soil stack vents (~2\" dia ea)
- two combustion reliefs (~1 sq ft ea)
- evaporative cooler (~2 sq ft ea)
- power/control to evaporative cooler (2\" dia ea)
- one water pipe (for cooler)
- three exhaust vents for bath/kitchen fans (6\" dia ea)
- two exhaust vents for furnace and water heater (4-6\" dia ea)
- two skylights
- six vents for the underside of the roof (~1 sq ft ea)
- three channels for antenna/phone wiring to interior walls (3/4\" dia)

And this is a small house!

Leaks are almost NEVER in places other than the perimeters of these
penetrations (if your roof, itself, leaks, it\'s a sign that you\'ve
ignored it for far too long!). The sun bakes the materials that are
used to seal around them and the materials dry out, crack, separate,
etc. Periodic inspection and a bit of effort makes it relatively
easy to reseal these areas (cut out the old and replace with fresh)

If you don\'t aggressively maintain your roof, you WILL have a leak
in your living space. Most of our neighbors have had such failures
(whether they have flat or peaked roofs, rolled felt or asphalt shingle
or ceramic tile).

[My other half chuckles when she visits many of her friends in their
$1M+ homes during Monsoon -- and finds pails and sauce pans located
around the house to capture water from leaks through the ceiling!]

Note that garages don\'t tend to have any of these penetrations in
the roofs above them.

Nor do outbuildings/sheds.

So, no risk to the items stored in the garage or outbuildings,
from above.

Of course, that assumes you are doing regular maintenance on the
roof and not ignoring it because it\'s out of the way -- like my
friend\'s case. But, he\'s got lots of structures on his sprawling
property so its easy to see how he can lose track of each.

There is the possibility of driven rain entering these spaces at
ground level -- under doors, etc. But, you can guard against that
by placing items on metal channel instead of directly on the floor
(lumber wicks water as well as inviting termites)

A slab under any such storage is essential as anything resting on the
dirt will invite \"critters\" of various types. Drop a 2x4 on the
ground and you\'ll quickly find it covered with a fine layer of
dirt. Disturb the dirt and you\'ll find much of the 2x4 eaten away!

[LEAVES that are left on the ground are similarly coated with dirt!]

And, maintaining a gap between those items and the walls.

[Our local library had stored donated books in an interior storage
room. The boxes were piled against the wall and left to accumulate
for years. When we went through them to clean out the room, we found
the lower boxes\' contents EATEN by termites -- which had exploited a
crack in the slab at the wall to gain protected entry to the cellulose.]

As no one has a basement, here -- and the few attic spaces suffer
from low pitch rooflines -- EVERYONE stores items in their garage
and one or more sheds (actually, we don\'t have a shed but we are
more aggressive in managing our \"surplus\"). Most folks buy
large (2-3 ft long) plastic storage bins and endeavor to stack these
in their garage. They invariably lose their shape as RE-stacking them
neatly becomes a chore, over time.

We have access to \"endless\" supplies of boxes from the local hospital.
So, its easy to find a box that is the right size/shape for our needs.
Then, collect *dozens* of them as the items that were shipped in them
are invariably shipped to the hospital every week/month.

E.g., I have ~180 identical boxes (half the size of a copier paper box)
stacked in the garage for things like \"Hammers\", \"Chisels\", \"extension
cords\", \"CCTV cameras\", \"water filters\", \"VHDCI SCSI cables\", \"CAT5 patch
cords\", \"DVI cables\", \"HDMI cables\", etc.

I have another ~100 identical boxes (shoebox sized) for things like
\"PC2 < 6400\", \"SIMMs\", \"PC3 > 12800\", \"SCSI terminators\", \"memory cards\",
\"SSDs\", \"DVI/DP/VGA/HDMI adapters\", etc.

Putting these things in store-bought plastic boxes -- which typically
have some draft angle that complicates packing them side-by-side -- I\'d
not be able to store half of what I have crammed in there, presently!
Or, would have to toss unrelated items into shared containers just
to economize on volume. (cuz store-bought boxes come in a narrower
range of sizes/shapes than cardboard boxes)

 

[Cursitor Doom]

On Tue, 24 Nov 2020 23:33:37 -0800, Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com>
wrote:

>Well, I tried and methinks that you\'re hopeless.

Jeff, I\'m just not the least bit interested in those aspects of
electronics. I\'m one of the older/est posters here, I\'ll be dead
pretty soon so I want to spend my sunset days doing what I\'m
interested in and enjoy - not something someone else who doesn\'t even
know me thinks I should be doing! :-D

I tend to judge people by their willingness and ability to learn. What
you\'ve done is essentially announce that you don\'t want to try
anything new and prefer to dabble in what you find comfortable. I
realize that you probably don\'t care, but you just failed my litmus
test.

My willingness to learn new things is one of my defining character
traits, Jeff. I *do* have other interests outside of electronics where
I *do* push myself - in an attempt to ward off dementia as much as
anything else! But those suggestions of yours? Sorry not my bag, baby.

 

[Brent Locher]

On Friday, November 27, 2020 at 8:25:25 PM UTC-5, Bill Sloman wrote:

On Saturday, November 28, 2020 at 1:12:50 AM UTC+11, Brent Locher wrote:
On Friday, November 27, 2020 at 12:00:41 AM UTC-5, Bill Sloman wrote:
On Friday, November 27, 2020 at 2:27:54 PM UTC+11, Cursitor Doom wrote:
On Wed, 25 Nov 2020 17:10:23 -0700, Don Y
blocked...@foo.invalid> wrote:
snip
I fully agree. I can\'t imagine
anything worse than just \'vegging out\' in front of the TV all day. If
that isn\'t inviting dementia I don\'t know what is. :-/
Cursitor Doom vegetates in front of the Daily Mail, Russian Today and Zero Hedge.

He\'s not showing any interest in how the world actually works, but rather soaks up a bizarre and over-simplified explanation of how it can be seen to work - if you ignore enough of what is actually going on.

It\'s roughly equivalent to pigging out on true romance novels or TV soap operas. You get to process a bunch of information that makes you feel good, but doesn\'t have much to do with reality.

I still remember when you quit this group because people were not engaged in electronics but rather in flame wars.
You didn\'t get the my motives quite right. I don\'t mind the flame wars, but the level of electronic discussion wasn\'t up to much.
And here you have CD actually talking about electronics and subjects related to them and rather than appreciating that someone you disagree with politically might be a multi-dimensional person - you want (Need to) drag him back into the political flame wars.

> Cursitor Doom has a vilely superficial approach to electronics, as he does to everything else he posts about. His \" I just cannot understand the mentality of those who show no interest in the world and how it works,\" showed a complete absence of any self-comprehension on his part and - as such - it was comical enough to high-light. You may lack a sense of humour.

His \"vile\" approach to electronics is no different than a handicap-30\'s approach to golf. If you are not getting paid to do something and it is a hobby then all that matters is their interest in the subject. He has stated that he does this for enjoyment and that he has never been that good at it. I do not remember him ever pontificating to anyone about how to do ***electronics*** so he is not even leading anyone astray. The guy is 80 years old and still giving some level of thought to this.

When looking at his postings about **electronics** in this group he is a fine contributor.

The political postings are all BS no matter who posts them, For whatever reason, this group requires a mix of electronics and politics to remain alive. I am happy it is alive because I cannot stand moderated public speech venues. And weirdly, even though this group is filled with off topic posts and filled with trolls, at the end of the day , even the worst posters, have a valid interest in electronics.

Yes, I would rather listen to your mostly garbage postings than to have anyone change one word of anything you say before it gets presented. And yes, in spite of your posting coming off mostly as mental masturbation, I do occasionally find value in something you say.

I do write this with some trepidation because after all, you are a man of science reason and objectivity......just saying.
Flattery doesn\'t work on me. I like it as much as anybody else, but it always prompts the reaction \"what are they after\". In this case you were probably fishing for a complacent response - I do strive to be reasonable and objective, but I\'m well aware how often I fail to get there.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

 

[Bill Sloman]

On Saturday, November 28, 2020 at 11:56:03 PM UTC+11, Brent Locher wrote:

On Friday, November 27, 2020 at 8:25:25 PM UTC-5, Bill Sloman wrote:
On Saturday, November 28, 2020 at 1:12:50 AM UTC+11, Brent Locher wrote:
On Friday, November 27, 2020 at 12:00:41 AM UTC-5, Bill Sloman wrote:
On Friday, November 27, 2020 at 2:27:54 PM UTC+11, Cursitor Doom wrote:
On Wed, 25 Nov 2020 17:10:23 -0700, Don Y
blocked...@foo.invalid> wrote:
snip
I fully agree. I can\'t imagine
anything worse than just \'vegging out\' in front of the TV all day.. If
that isn\'t inviting dementia I don\'t know what is. :-/
Cursitor Doom vegetates in front of the Daily Mail, Russian Today and Zero Hedge.

He\'s not showing any interest in how the world actually works, but rather soaks up a bizarre and over-simplified explanation of how it can be seen to work - if you ignore enough of what is actually going on.

It\'s roughly equivalent to pigging out on true romance novels or TV soap operas. You get to process a bunch of information that makes you feel good, but doesn\'t have much to do with reality.

I still remember when you quit this group because people were not engaged in electronics but rather in flame wars.
You didn\'t get the my motives quite right. I don\'t mind the flame wars, but the level of electronic discussion wasn\'t up to much.
And here you have CD actually talking about electronics and subjects related to them and rather than appreciating that someone you disagree with politically might be a multi-dimensional person - you want (Need to) drag him back into the political flame wars.


Cursitor Doom has a vilely superficial approach to electronics, as he does to everything else he posts about. His \" I just cannot understand the mentality of those who show no interest in the world and how it works,\" showed a complete absence of any self-comprehension on his part and - as such - it was comical enough to high-light. You may lack a sense of humour.

His \"vile\" approach to electronics is no different than a handicap-30\'s approach to golf.

Golf is a past-time and a form of entertainment. Electronics can be a serious business - the bits that I worked in certainly were - and getting the details right can make the world a better place (which is not something you can say about golf).

> If you are not getting paid to do something and it is a hobby then all that matters is their interest in the subject. He has stated that he does this for enjoyment and that he has never been that good at it. I do not remember him ever pontificating to anyone about how to do ***electronics*** so he is not even leading anyone astray. The guy is 80 years old and still giving some level of thought to this.

Not enough.

> When looking at his postings about **electronics** in this group he is a fine contributor.

Not one that I value.

> The political postings are all BS no matter who posts them.

Not necessarily. The crowd who think that socialism is just another name for communism are a trifle depressing, but the US media have been peddling that line since 1917, so an appreciable proportion of the US population is heavily brainwashed, to their disadvantage.

> For whatever reason, this group requires a mix of electronics and politics to remain alive. I am happy it is alive because I cannot stand moderated public speech venues. And weirdly, even though this group is filled with off topic posts and filled with trolls, at the end of the day , even the worst posters, have a valid interest in electronics.

The group stands or falls on the quality of the posts. Rubbish politics and self-deceiving electronics both damage it.

> Yes, I would rather listen to your mostly garbage postings than to have anyone change one word of anything you say before it gets presented. And yes, in spite of your posting coming off mostly as mental masturbation, I do occasionally find value in something you say.

I\'m less appreciative of your contributions. I\'m glad that you do find value in some of the stuff I post. I\'m not altogether surprised that some of it goes over your head, or that you comfort yourself with the idea that it wouldn\'t have been helpful even if you were able to follow it.

I do write this with some trepidation because after all, you are a man of science reason and objectivity......just saying.

Flattery doesn\'t work on me. I like it as much as anybody else, but it always prompts the reaction \"what are they after\". In this case you were probably fishing for a complacent response - I do strive to be reasonable and objective, but I\'m well aware how often I fail to get there.

And I see no point in being reasonable or objective about Cursitor Doom - he\'s just a creep.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney