PC reliability

John Robertson <spam@flippers.com> wrote in
news:Yd2dnY9O-Z5s04LDnZ2dnUU7-XXNnZ2d@giganews.com:

On 2020/01/13 11:21 a.m., Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Mon, 13 Jan 2020 08:20:18 -0500, legg <legg@nospam.magma.ca
wrote:

Is it just an impression, or are PC's not crashing as
regularly as they used to?

Correct. PC's are no longer crashing in regular equally space
intervals. Instead, a random number generator has been added to
the crash(delay,random_seed), to produce random crashes instead.
In some operating systems, these random crashes are part of the
update process. The only thing regular about today's PC crashes
is that they occur on the 2nd Tues of the month on Windoze
machines.


I hear that cars made in 1950 were more reliable than cars made in
1910 too. (as in 2020 computers vs 1980 computers - 40 years of
evolution)

Intelligent design? (ducking)

John ;-#)#

It was all those prohibition years... And then the great
depression... that spurred design innovation too. ;-)

 

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Tue, 14 Jan 2020 20:40:20 -0600, amdx <nojunk@knology.net> wrote:

On 1/13/2020 1:25 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Mon, 13 Jan 2020 11:58:22 -0600, amdx <nojunk@knology.net> wrote:

He needs 10 because Turbotax will not work on windows 7 in 2020.
Mikek

Nope:
"Windows 7 Support is Ending"
https://www.intuit.com/support/windows-7-end-of-life/
TurboTax for tax year 2019 and QuickBooks 2020
will install on Windows 7 (Service Pack 1 or later)
PCs.

So it is written, so it must be.

Hmm, I'll blame that on my breakfast buddy, that was the
topic on Monday morning. He was talking about upgrading to 10,
because he uses Turbotax.

It's a common problem and common misconception. I'll worry about it
next year, when it becomes a real problem.

His solution is a dual boot using two separate Hard Drives.
He wants 7 because he has photo printer that only has 7 drivers, and
ham equipment that will only run on 7.

That won't work. If he uses his existing Windoze 7 activation code
for the free upgrade to Windoze 10, the Win 7 license will magically
expire in about 30 days. I'm not sure about the 30 days part, but I
do know that his Win 7 will become deactivated after using Win 10 for
some amount of time. I've never had anyone try it so methinks it's
wise to double check this.

I've been trying to get him to build a new computer, he built one in
2011, and he gave me his parts list and I built exactly the same thing.

Win 10 seems to need better and faster hardware than Win 7. If the
hardware is 9 years old, Win 10 may not have drivers for everything. I
say "may" because, except for video cards and printers, I haven't had
much of a problem with Win 10 upgrades on older equipment.

I think we are on borrowed time, but so far so good. I did need to oil
two Fans this week, that quieted them right down.

The fans will stay quiet for perhaps 3-6 months. Most fans on the
market use some form of bushing. The one's that say "ball bearings"
are usually bushing. There are some magnetic levitation "bearing"
fans (Corsair, CUI, etc), but most are cheap sintered bronze bushings.
When the oil either turns to tar or leaks out, the bushing wears out.
When you re-oil it, you fill the gap between the shaft and bushing
with oil, but it doesn't last because the shaft hole in the bushing is
worn and has enlarged. You can continue oiling it, but the oil won't
stay in the bushing. I suggest you buy a new fan and start over.

--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

 

[Michael Terrell]

On Thursday, January 16, 2020 at 12:25:36 AM UTC-5, Jeff Liebermann wrote:

On Tue, 14 Jan 2020 20:40:20 -0600, amdx <nojunk@knology.net> wrote:

On 1/13/2020 1:25 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Mon, 13 Jan 2020 11:58:22 -0600, amdx <nojunk@knology.net> wrote:

He needs 10 because Turbotax will not work on windows 7 in 2020.
Mikek

Nope:
"Windows 7 Support is Ending"
https://www.intuit.com/support/windows-7-end-of-life/
TurboTax for tax year 2019 and QuickBooks 2020
will install on Windows 7 (Service Pack 1 or later)
PCs.

So it is written, so it must be.

Hmm, I'll blame that on my breakfast buddy, that was the
topic on Monday morning. He was talking about upgrading to 10,
because he uses Turbotax.

It's a common problem and common misconception. I'll worry about it
next year, when it becomes a real problem.

His solution is a dual boot using two separate Hard Drives.
He wants 7 because he has photo printer that only has 7 drivers, and
ham equipment that will only run on 7.

That won't work. If he uses his existing Windoze 7 activation code
for the free upgrade to Windoze 10, the Win 7 license will magically
expire in about 30 days. I'm not sure about the 30 days part, but I
do know that his Win 7 will become deactivated after using Win 10 for
some amount of time. I've never had anyone try it so methinks it's
wise to double check this.

I've been trying to get him to build a new computer, he built one in
2011, and he gave me his parts list and I built exactly the same thing.

Win 10 seems to need better and faster hardware than Win 7. If the
hardware is 9 years old, Win 10 may not have drivers for everything. I
say "may" because, except for video cards and printers, I haven't had
much of a problem with Win 10 upgrades on older equipment.

I think we are on borrowed time, but so far so good. I did need to oil
two Fans this week, that quieted them right down.

The fans will stay quiet for perhaps 3-6 months. Most fans on the
market use some form of bushing. The one's that say "ball bearings"
are usually bushing. There are some magnetic levitation "bearing"
fans (Corsair, CUI, etc), but most are cheap sintered bronze bushings.
When the oil either turns to tar or leaks out, the bushing wears out.
When you re-oil it, you fill the gap between the shaft and bushing
with oil, but it doesn't last because the shaft hole in the bushing is
worn and has enlarged. You can continue oiling it, but the oil won't
stay in the bushing. I suggest you buy a new fan and start over.

Microsoft rebooted my Win 7 Pro, 64 bit stem on the 14th to let me know that it was out of support. It has been problem free for several years. It has crashed three times in two days. Once it locked up. the other two were blue screens.

 

Michael Terrell <terrell.michael.a@gmail.com> wrote in
news:348e9a9b-2b25-4846-8b23-9ecfdc8965ca@googlegroups.com:

Microsoft rebooted my Win 7 Pro, 64 bit stem on the 14th to let me
know that it was out of support. It has been problem free for
several years. It has crashed three times in two days. Once it
locked up. the other two were blue screens.

Win 7 anything is vulnerable. Maybe not MS that has hacked you. I
would not get online with anything these days other than Linux or Win
10 fully updated on both. Or a smartphone, of course.

 

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Wed, 15 Jan 2020 23:45:19 -0800 (PST), Michael Terrell
<terrell.michael.a@gmail.com> wrote:

Microsoft rebooted my Win 7 Pro, 64 bit stem on the 14th to
let me know that it was out of support. It has been problem
free for several years. It has crashed three times in two days.
Once it locked up. the other two were blue screens.

The desktop I'm currently using at home runs Windoze 7. I saw the
"Your Windoze 7 PC is out of support" message on the 14th. No crashes
or problems. Just to be sure, I just ran quick Malwarebytes (free)
and Avast Anti-virus (free) scans. Nothing found.

I can't tell from here what broke your machine, but I suggest that you
scan it with whatever anti-virus program you are using followed by
some kind of anti-malware program scan. If you suspect that you might
have a root-kit installed, look for specialized root kit detectors.
<https://www.malwarebytes.com/antirootkit/>

--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

 

[Michael Terrell]

On Thursday, January 16, 2020 at 3:50:46 AM UTC-5, Jeff Liebermann wrote:

On Wed, 15 Jan 2020 23:45:19 -0800 (PST), Michael Terrell wrote:

Microsoft rebooted my Win 7 Pro, 64 bit stem on the 14th to
let me know that it was out of support. It has been problem
free for several years. It has crashed three times in two days.
Once it locked up. the other two were blue screens.

The desktop I'm currently using at home runs Windoze 7. I saw the
"Your Windoze 7 PC is out of support" message on the 14th. No crashes
or problems. Just to be sure, I just ran quick Malwarebytes (free)
and Avast Anti-virus (free) scans. Nothing found.

I can't tell from here what broke your machine, but I suggest that you
scan it with whatever anti-virus program you are using followed by
some kind of anti-malware program scan. If you suspect that you might
have a root-kit installed, look for specialized root kit detectors.
https://www.malwarebytes.com/antirootkit/

I have run them and found nothing. I was getting ready to build a newer system. I have a quad core 3.0GHz MB with 16GB of RAM and a pair of new 3TB hard drives sitting here. I just haven't felt well enough to rip apart my mess of systems to make room for it. The desk has 5 computers, three 24" monitors and two, four drive NAS boxes. I would tear down the entire mess and rearrange everything to make it neater. It would also eliminate a lot of abandoned cabling.

Thanks to a bad VA doctor, I went without my prescriptions for two months, starting early September. I still have trouble eating, and readjusting to the drugs. I go upto five days at a time, that I simply can't eat. I'm not going to tackle the rebuild, until, and if I ever feel well enough.

Like many others here, it is time to start thinning the herd. My family would just rent a dumpster or leave my workshop unlocked so people would steal what they thought they could pawn.

 

[whit3rd]

On Wednesday, January 15, 2020 at 9:25:36 PM UTC-8, Jeff Liebermann wrote:

The fans will stay quiet for perhaps 3-6 months. Most fans on the
market use some form of bushing. The one's that say "ball bearings"
are usually bushing. There are some magnetic levitation "bearing"
fans (Corsair, CUI, etc), but most are cheap sintered bronze bushings.
When the oil either turns to tar or leaks out, the bushing wears out.
When you re-oil it, you fill the gap between the shaft and bushing
with oil, but it doesn't last because the shaft hole in the bushing is
worn and has enlarged. You can continue oiling it, but the oil won't
stay in the bushing. I suggest you buy a new fan and start over.

I've had good results with Tri-Flow (a lubricant with PTFE microspheres)
at quieting bushing fans; the solids really do fill in the gaps for a long
time. I always peel the label and pry off the seal, don't know if it
works with needle injection.

 

[Robert Baer]

DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno@decadence.org wrote:

Michael Terrell <terrell.michael.a@gmail.com> wrote in
news:348e9a9b-2b25-4846-8b23-9ecfdc8965ca@googlegroups.com:

Microsoft rebooted my Win 7 Pro, 64 bit stem on the 14th to let me
know that it was out of support. It has been problem free for
several years. It has crashed three times in two days. Once it
locked up. the other two were blue screens.


Win 7 anything is vulnerable. Maybe not MS that has hacked you. I
would not get online with anything these days other than Linux or Win
10 fully updated on both. Or a smartphone, of course.

Well, even a Samsung Galaxy J2 balked at entry of password into a
Godaddy account.
So, "of course" is incorrect at best.

 

[Robert Baer]

Michael Terrell wrote:

On Thursday, January 16, 2020 at 12:25:36 AM UTC-5, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Tue, 14 Jan 2020 20:40:20 -0600, amdx <nojunk@knology.net> wrote:

On 1/13/2020 1:25 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Mon, 13 Jan 2020 11:58:22 -0600, amdx <nojunk@knology.net> wrote:

He needs 10 because Turbotax will not work on windows 7 in 2020.
Mikek

Nope:
"Windows 7 Support is Ending"
https://www.intuit.com/support/windows-7-end-of-life/
TurboTax for tax year 2019 and QuickBooks 2020
will install on Windows 7 (Service Pack 1 or later)
PCs.

So it is written, so it must be.

Hmm, I'll blame that on my breakfast buddy, that was the
topic on Monday morning. He was talking about upgrading to 10,
because he uses Turbotax.

It's a common problem and common misconception. I'll worry about it
next year, when it becomes a real problem.

His solution is a dual boot using two separate Hard Drives.
He wants 7 because he has photo printer that only has 7 drivers, and
ham equipment that will only run on 7.

That won't work. If he uses his existing Windoze 7 activation code
for the free upgrade to Windoze 10, the Win 7 license will magically
expire in about 30 days. I'm not sure about the 30 days part, but I
do know that his Win 7 will become deactivated after using Win 10 for
some amount of time. I've never had anyone try it so methinks it's
wise to double check this.

I've been trying to get him to build a new computer, he built one in
2011, and he gave me his parts list and I built exactly the same thing.

Win 10 seems to need better and faster hardware than Win 7. If the
hardware is 9 years old, Win 10 may not have drivers for everything. I
say "may" because, except for video cards and printers, I haven't had
much of a problem with Win 10 upgrades on older equipment.

I think we are on borrowed time, but so far so good. I did need to oil
two Fans this week, that quieted them right down.

The fans will stay quiet for perhaps 3-6 months. Most fans on the
market use some form of bushing. The one's that say "ball bearings"
are usually bushing. There are some magnetic levitation "bearing"
fans (Corsair, CUI, etc), but most are cheap sintered bronze bushings.
When the oil either turns to tar or leaks out, the bushing wears out.
When you re-oil it, you fill the gap between the shaft and bushing
with oil, but it doesn't last because the shaft hole in the bushing is
worn and has enlarged. You can continue oiling it, but the oil won't
stay in the bushing. I suggest you buy a new fan and start over.









Microsoft rebooted my Win 7 Pro, 64 bit stem on the 14th to let me know that it was out of support. It has been problem free for several years. It has crashed three times in two days. Once it locked up. the other two were blue screens.

** from alt.computer ng: **
Robert Baer wrote:

Copied from a posting in sci.electronics.design:

** COPY **
Hmm, I'll blame that on my breakfast buddy, that was the
topic on Monday morning. He was talking about upgrading to 10,
because he uses Turbotax.

It's a common problem and common misconception. I'll worry about it
next year, when it becomes a real problem.

His solution is a dual boot using two separate Hard Drives.
He wants 7 because he has photo printer that only has 7 drivers, and
ham equipment that will only run on 7.

That won't work. If he uses his existing Windoze 7 activation code
for the free upgrade to Windoze 10, the Win 7 license will magically
expire in about 30 days. I'm not sure about the 30 days part, but I
do know that his Win 7 will become deactivated after using Win 10 for
some amount of time. I've never had anyone try it so methinks it's
wise to double check this.

I've been trying to get him to build a new computer, he built one in
2011, and he gave me his parts list and I built exactly the same
thing.

Win 10 seems to need better and faster hardware than Win 7. If the
hardware is 9 years old, Win 10 may not have drivers for everything. I
say "may" because, except for video cards and printers, I haven't had
much of a problem with Win 10 upgrades on older equipment.
** END COPY **

NOTE the funny business happening to Win7 if one "upgrades" to Win10.
And that would happen even if one used a new, separate machine.
M$ strikes again.

1) There is a lot of similarity between the kernel portions
of Vista, Win7, Win8, Win10. In particular, the minimum RAM
needed.

The more modern the OS gets, the more it tends to
"reserve" maybe 10% of performance for its own usage (responsiveness).
This can be overcome by forking twice as many execution threads.
7ZIP compression will run faster on a four core processor, if you
set the thread count to 8, then if you set the thread count to 4.
With thread count 8, the CPU finally runs at 100% in your favor.
This is "oversubscription", because it means two 7ZIP threads "fight"
for time slices on one virtual core, and it helps squeeze out the
bad habits of the OS. On a 6C 12T processor, you set 7ZIP to 24 threads,
so the 12 virtual cores have 2 threads each.

In typical Microsoft fashion, the notion of "kernel optimization"
or "scheduling changes so Ryzen gives its full potential", are
delivered with glacial speed. Which implies it takes a lot of
testing for even the most trivial improvements. Many claims of
kernel or scheduler improvements have appeared over the years,
where we're not really sure whether they happened or not.

2) Each OS has a different set of services. Many of the services
are the same. Windows Defender is different. Windows Defender
in Windows 10 offers realtime AV protection. In Windows 7 it
offered some sort of "spyware protection". Some services place
a load on the system when they operate, or "interfere" with
performance. For example, running hashdeep64.exe may run 7x
slower, because Windows Defender is scanning each file that
hashdeep64 has open for reads. If you own Windows 10 Pro, you
can reach down with GPEDIT32.MSC and turn off Windows Defender
and do your hashdeep64 tree scan in peace and quiet.

In 1909, the control that claims to turn off real time protection
in the GUI, is similar to a "broken light switch". Whereas
the Pro SKU and GPEDIT32.MSC still works.

This may give the impression that more CPU is required.

You can tune W10 so it matches W7 on performance.

You can even BlackViper Windows 10, because you can
BlackViper just about anything.

3) Task Manager is not very effective in emergency conditions.
Windows 10 may tempt you to push the reset button or power
off the computer, when the keyboard/mouse no longer give
control over the computer. Windows XP was the last OS with
"virtuous" computer control (in users favor).

4) The qualifying Windows 7 license *does not* deactivate
when the Digital Entitlement for free Windows 10 is acquired.

You can have Windows 7 in one partition, Windows 10 in a second
partition, and both boot. And both claim they are Genuine.
If your Windows 7 is Retail Boxed, and you move the OS to a
brand new machine, *then* just about anything could happen to
the copy of Windows 10 on the old machine. I don't have
Retail Boxed 7 to test for "license amplification" like that.

*No* OS has deactivated here in all the time I've been testing
multiple OS installations on my two active computers. I have not
tried to "spew" my Win7Pro System Builder all over the house
and make it run everything from one copy. That is *asking* for
trouble. You have the option of using some "activator" of course,
if that is how you run your computer room, and some are doing that.
So if you thought Microsoft had "stolen" your license, you could
fix it with an activator. However, if you're running a dozen
computers off one Retail Boxed Windows 7 product simultaneously,
that's wrong. We can't blame Microsoft for being upset, if that's
what you're doing. Some STEM graduates seem to have poor counting
skills when it comes to license adherence :-/ Then they may make
certain claims on the Interwibble.

5) Windows 10 saw more work done on Hyper-V. It would be all too
simple for Microsoft to leave Hyper-V in the architecture even
when it is not being used. However, I've not seen any indirect
evidence that such a thing is present or causing a problem.
Not every machine has SLAT/EPT, and the desktop version of
Hyper-V makes having that a requirement (so the graphics card
will work better with the various parts of the software stack).
The block diagram for Hyper-V is quite confusing - it's supposed
to be a different class of Hypervisor than previous ones, yet the
block diagram doesn't make it look like the "Host" OS is also
virtualized. That was my main concern with some of the
descriptions I was reading.

6) Using debuggers, I have seen "shit behavior" in the new OS.
It's up to every user of Windows 10 to make observations
and reach their own conclusions about whether
"this is our best OS yet". The desktop graphics system has
a memory garbage collector of some sort, and attempting to double
click an icon and start a program can be delayed until a garbage
collector run completes. On my Test Machine, the time for this
operation is *20 seconds*, and that's the max program launch
latency here. There were some previous versions of the OS where
something else was happening, leading to extremely long (60 second)
start times. Again, this might lead some to conclude a "faster CPU"
is required - they're wrong in fact - a faster CPU does *not*
help when the bad parts of the architecture rail the machine.
Typical architectural holes cause railing of one core, while
the other cores remain dormant until something kernel-like
or close to the metal, is finished.

The "Chrome build behavior" still isn't fixed, and launching
thousands of processes as happens during software compiles of
large projects, still shows egregious behavior.

But if all you do is update your Facebook page, you'll never notice.

This is what happens if you attempt installation of Windows 10
on an old Pentium 4 system. As part of this experiment, this
may have been launched from the DVD, while Windows 7 (unactivated)
was running the system. It was an attempt to verify that the
install assistant does the normal things, on older hardware.
One or two of the very last P4 family processors, are supposed
to be able to pass this test, but I've yet to see a positive report
of such a thing, anywhere. I think this is a P4 1.8GHz at FSB400
with 1GB RAM (no Hyperthreading). This is what happens when you
try to install Windows 10 on year 2002 hardware (the machine has
enough RAM to run Windows 10 or Windows 7, but otherwise doesn't meet the
requirements).

https://i.postimg.cc/2ykKyy6K/dvd-1909-setup-check-no-NX.gif

An SSD for storage is recommended for the boot drive on Win10.
You'll hate yourself, if you continue to use some older hard
drive that reads at 65MB/sec. (That's what the above test
was run on.)

Paul

 

Robert Baer <robertbaer@localnet.com> wrote in
news%cUF.73691$Gh7.33798@fx45.iad:

DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno@decadence.org wrote:
Michael Terrell <terrell.michael.a@gmail.com> wrote in
news:348e9a9b-2b25-4846-8b23-9ecfdc8965ca@googlegroups.com:

Microsoft rebooted my Win 7 Pro, 64 bit stem on the 14th to let
me know that it was out of support. It has been problem free
for several years. It has crashed three times in two days. Once
it locked up. the other two were blue screens.


Win 7 anything is vulnerable. Maybe not MS that has hacked
you. I
would not get online with anything these days other than Linux or
Win 10 fully updated on both. Or a smartphone, of course.

Well, even a Samsung Galaxy J2 balked at entry of password into
a
Godaddy account.
So, "of course" is incorrect at best.

So, you think your phone got hacked?

I think you need to reread what was written.

Otherwise, maybe your phone kept you from being hacked when you
tried to access a shit site. Godaddy to me has alway been a rip off.
We should be able to get domain names without paying some jackass for
it. Doesn't matter how large they have grown. There are a lot of
folks willing to accept being screwed.

 

[Robert Baer]

DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno@decadence.org wrote:

Robert Baer <robertbaer@localnet.com> wrote in
news%cUF.73691$Gh7.33798@fx45.iad:

DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno@decadence.org wrote:
Michael Terrell <terrell.michael.a@gmail.com> wrote in
news:348e9a9b-2b25-4846-8b23-9ecfdc8965ca@googlegroups.com:

Microsoft rebooted my Win 7 Pro, 64 bit stem on the 14th to let
me know that it was out of support. It has been problem free
for several years. It has crashed three times in two days. Once
it locked up. the other two were blue screens.


Win 7 anything is vulnerable. Maybe not MS that has hacked
you. I
would not get online with anything these days other than Linux or
Win 10 fully updated on both. Or a smartphone, of course.

Well, even a Samsung Galaxy J2 balked at entry of password into
a
Godaddy account.
So, "of course" is incorrect at best.

So, you think your phone got hacked?

I think you need to reread what was written.

Otherwise, maybe your phone kept you from being hacked when you
tried to access a shit site. Godaddy to me has alway been a rip off.
We should be able to get domain names without paying some jackass for
it. Doesn't matter how large they have grown. There are a lot of
folks willing to accept being screwed.

Tell us of ANY free source for domain name registration......

 

Robert Baer <robertbaer@localnet.com> wrote in news:fQLVF.52420
$Mc.13345@fx35.iad:

Tell us of ANY free source for domain name registration......

My point exactly. It should never have been this way and we should
never have accepted it as such, and should also NOT continue to accept
it.

It is like y'all like getting screwed around. Half of you idiots put
an idiot in office just so you could get further screwed around.

Good job! NOT!!!

 

[Robert Baer]

DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno@decadence.org wrote:

Robert Baer <robertbaer@localnet.com> wrote in news:fQLVF.52420
$Mc.13345@fx35.iad:

Tell us of ANY free source for domain name registration......


My point exactly. It should never have been this way and we should
never have accepted it as such, and should also NOT continue to accept
it.

It is like y'all like getting screwed around. Half of you idiots put
an idiot in office just so you could get further screwed around.

Good job! NOT!!!

Idiot!
TINSTAFFL!
Ask for a free house, or a free car, or...and a free domain name
registration.
NOT going to happen.

 

[Bill Sloman]

On Wednesday, January 22, 2020 at 6:25:46 PM UTC+11, Robert Baer wrote:

DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno@decadence.org wrote:
Robert Baer <robertbaer@localnet.com> wrote in news:fQLVF.52420
$Mc.13345@fx35.iad:

Tell us of ANY free source for domain name registration......


My point exactly. It should never have been this way and we should
never have accepted it as such, and should also NOT continue to accept
it.

It is like y'all like getting screwed around. Half of you idiots put
an idiot in office just so you could get further screwed around.

Good job! NOT!!!

Idiot!
TINSTAFL!
Ask for a free house, or a free car, or...and a free domain name
registration.
NOT going to happen.

Linux doesn't exist?

The idiot here is Robert Baer. There may be no such thing as a free lunch, but the free market isn't the only way of distributing goods and services, and for some goods and services it's not a particularly satisfactory mechanism.

The US health care system does come to mind.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

 

[whit3rd]

On Wednesday, January 22, 2020 at 3:56:01 AM UTC-8, Bill Sloman wrote:

On Wednesday, January 22, 2020 at 6:25:46 PM UTC+11, Robert Baer wrote:

TINSTAFL!
Ask for a free house, or a free car, or...and a free domain name
registration.
NOT going to happen.

Linux doesn't exist?

The idiot here is Robert Baer. There may be no such thing as a free lunch, but the free market isn't the only way of distributing goods and services...

Yes, obviously another example is birth registration; your personal name and details of birth
are registered for life, without any payment from the individual, because... newborns
aren't ready to pay. Free-to-the-user is the only rule that works.

Domain names, though, are like a trademark, are chosen by someone who CAN pay. Names could
be bought wholesale by speculators if the price tag were too low. Have been bought thus, in fact.

Alas, if you don't have a personal domain name, you also don't have a personal e-mail address,
which is rather inconvenient. Losing a personal e-mail address ought not heppen because of
failure to pay a yearly fee that might be based on all-the-market-will-bear. Nonprofit
registrars are imperfect, but not unworkable.

 

[Clifford Heath]

On 23/1/20 4:43 am, whit3rd wrote:

Alas, if you don't have a personal domain name, you also don't have a personal e-mail address,
which is rather inconvenient. Losing a personal e-mail address ought not heppen because of
failure to pay a yearly fee that might be based on all-the-market-will-bear. Nonprofit
registrars are imperfect, but not unworkable.

Unfortunately even if you have a personal domain, you need to pay
additional fees to get the email backbone to accept messages you send.
Such is the strength of anti-spam/anti-relay technology that this is a
significant barrier (cost) that is met by the major carriers (Google,
FastMail and a number of others).

Gone are the days where any old server just just make outbound SMTP
requests and send email with any confidence that the email will be
accepted and forwarded by the target or the relay servers.



CH

 

[Robert Baer]

Bill Sloman wrote:

On Wednesday, January 22, 2020 at 6:25:46 PM UTC+11, Robert Baer wrote:
DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno@decadence.org wrote:
Robert Baer <robertbaer@localnet.com> wrote in news:fQLVF.52420
$Mc.13345@fx35.iad:

Tell us of ANY free source for domain name registration......


My point exactly. It should never have been this way and we should
never have accepted it as such, and should also NOT continue to accept
it.

It is like y'all like getting screwed around. Half of you idiots put
an idiot in office just so you could get further screwed around.

Good job! NOT!!!

Idiot!
TINSTAFL!
Ask for a free house, or a free car, or...and a free domain name
registration.
NOT going to happen.

Linux doesn't exist?

The idiot here is Robert Baer. There may be no such thing as a free lunch, but the free market isn't the only way of distributing goods and services, and for some goods and services it's not a particularly satisfactory mechanism.

The US health care system does come to mind.

In the first place, i did not even hint about Linux, which is not
exactly free.

The US health care system is expensive: almost everyone pays for it;
taxes at minimum.

 

[Bill Sloman]

On Thursday, January 23, 2020 at 2:57:57 PM UTC+11, Robert Baer wrote:

Bill Sloman wrote:
On Wednesday, January 22, 2020 at 6:25:46 PM UTC+11, Robert Baer wrote:
DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno@decadence.org wrote:
Robert Baer <robertbaer@localnet.com> wrote in news:fQLVF.52420
$Mc.13345@fx35.iad:

Tell us of ANY free source for domain name registration......


My point exactly. It should never have been this way and we should
never have accepted it as such, and should also NOT continue to accept
it.

It is like y'all like getting screwed around. Half of you idiots put
an idiot in office just so you could get further screwed around.

Good job! NOT!!!

Idiot!
TINSTAFL!
Ask for a free house, or a free car, or...and a free domain name
registration.
NOT going to happen.

Linux doesn't exist?

The idiot here is Robert Baer. There may be no such thing as a free lunch, but the free market isn't the only way of distributing goods and services, and for some goods and services it's not a particularly satisfactory mechanism.

The US health care system does come to mind.

In the first place, i did not even hint about Linux, which is not
exactly free.

You don't have to pay to download Linux software. The way it gets paid for is interesting and complicated, but from the user point of view it is a "free lunch".

The US health care system is expensive: almost everyone pays for it;
taxes at minimum.

Costs per head half-again higher than the most expensive health care systems in other countries, health outcomes across the population as a whole distinctly poorer.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Spirit_Level_(book)

talks about the way that less rich people in more unequal societies live shorter lives than their rich counterparts - less equal countries have steeper social gradients. It also goes into the fact that even the rich in the US don't live as long as even the poor in more equal countries.

Too much free market in your health system impairs its performance for everybody, but more so for the poor.

Since the main point of a national health system is to protect the population as a whole from epidemics (though this isn't what keeps them busy for most of the time) the US system is particularly unsatisfactory.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

 

[Sea]

On 01/22/2020 07:57 PM, Robert Baer wrote:

In the first place, i did not even hint about Linux, which is not
exactly free.

What do think is inexact about it? It feels exactly free, along with the
boatload of software that inevitably comes along with it. Your
SeaMonster internet suite is free. A year ago I was getting free coffee
at an evacuation center while a wildfire was burning thru the area. The
free section of craigslist has some numbingly nice stuff. Right now I'm
sitting at a free desk.

 

[Robert Baer]

Sea wrote:

On 01/22/2020 07:57 PM, Robert Baer wrote:

   In the first place, i did not even hint about Linux, which is not
exactly free.

What do think is inexact about it? It feels exactly free, along with the
boatload of software that inevitably comes along with it. Your
SeaMonster internet suite is free. A year ago I was getting free coffee
at an evacuation center while a wildfire was burning thru the area. The
free section of craigslist has some numbingly nice stuff. Right now I'm
sitting at a free desk.
Absolutely NONE of what you mentioned is free.

The Linux OS was not free nor the software you mentioned.
At minimum, you SPENT time and energy for research (distro? version?
etc?), ditto to get (download at minimum) the files; then time and
energy to install.

The SeaMonkey browser may be worse, in that on occasion, one must
check for upgrades and fiddle with that.

And, that cup of coffee cost time and money: the beans had to be
transported from South America, processed, ground, packaged,
cooked/processed into the water (also not free), poured into the (not
free) cup and was handed to you.

Craig's list is not free; costs you time and indirectly money to sign
up for it as well as use it.

Finally, that desk you rave about so much costs the energy to fell
the trees, as well as the engineering time to design the desk, the labor
to cut the wood into appropriate shapes, assemble; then transport to
where it was placed.

NOT a GD thing you mentioned was free - not even your mad raving.