OT: Wow, compact fluorescent light bulbs already obsolete

[Cursitor Doom]

On Sat, 18 Jan 2020 01:46:57 -0000 (UTC), John Doe
<always.look@message.header> wrote:


>The poster is uninformed.

Not something our Phil gets called much around here! :-D

--

No deal? No problem! :-D

 

[Winfield Hill]

John Doe wrote...

I bought CFL lightbulbs once. Now ... they're gone!
Replaced by LEDs. That was a short-lived technology.

Not so short; History from Wikipedia:

1976: GE engineer, Edward E. Hammer, invents spiral CFL.
1980: Philips model SL, screw-in, integral magnetic ballast.
1985: Osram model EL lamp, including an electronic ballast.
next: development of high-efficacy phosphors...
1995: by Shanghai Xiangshan in China, helical CFLs.
2011: China CFLs were the "dominant technology".
2015: LED prices fell well below US$5 for a basic bulb.
2016: GE, announced phase out of CFL production in the US.
2020: 40 years later, John Doe writes, that was short-lived.


--
Thanks,
- Win

 

[Cursitor Doom]

On 18 Jan 2020 07:10:25 -0800, Winfield Hill <winfieldhill@yahoo.com>
wrote:

Not so short; History from Wikipedia:

1976: GE engineer, Edward E. Hammer, invents spiral CFL.
1980: Philips model SL, screw-in, integral magnetic ballast.
1985: Osram model EL lamp, including an electronic ballast.
next: development of high-efficacy phosphors...
1995: by Shanghai Xiangshan in China, helical CFLs.
2011: China CFLs were the "dominant technology".
2015: LED prices fell well below US$5 for a basic bulb.
2016: GE, announced phase out of CFL production in the US.
2020: 40 years later, John Doe writes, that was short-lived.

Osram. Now there was a company that knew how to make bulbs. The last
generation of household tungsten bulbs, probably made in China, went
"phut" almost as fast as you could change them, but we had an old
Osram bulb in regular use in our house that lasted 30 years and was
still going strong when we moved house!
--

No deal? No problem! :-D

 

[Winfield Hill]

Cursitor Doom wrote...

On 18 Jan 2020 07:10:25 -0800, Winfield Hill wrote:

Not so short; History from Wikipedia:

1976: GE engineer, Edward E. Hammer, invents spiral CFL.
1980: Philips model SL, screw-in, integral magnetic ballast.
1985: Osram model EL lamp, including an electronic ballast.
next: development of high-efficacy phosphors...
1995: by Shanghai Xiangshan in China, helical CFLs.
2011: China CFLs were the "dominant technology".
2015: LED prices fell well below US$5 for a basic bulb.
2016: GE, announced phase out of CFL production in the US.
2020: 40 years later, John Doe writes, that was short-lived.

Osram. Now there was a company that knew how to make bulbs.

They still make superior LED light sources. Yesterday I
pushed our 120W green Osram theatre LED to a peak pulse
current of 360 amps, up from its continuous 20 amp rating.
The competing 100W Luminous theatre LEDs failed at 200A.
Also, it's forward voltage increase was modest; I only had
to raise the RIS-796 pulser's voltage up to 30V, from 24V.


--
Thanks,
- Win

 

[Tom Del Rosso]

Phil Hobbs wrote:

They do save a bit of money, but the amount I spend on electric light
is pretty trivial. LEDs are dramatically better than CFLs, and
almost competitive with incandescents for appearance, except in
Christmas lights. LED Christmas lights are hideous. (There's no
reason you couldn't make the nice diffused colours the same way as
with tungsten, but apparently nobody does.)

And I miss the true randomness of incandescent flashing lights. CPU
controlled flashers make Christmas displays look like advertising signs.
You need heat for that bimetal switch.

 

[Phil Hobbs]

On 2020-01-18 06:10, tabbypurr@gmail.com wrote:

On Saturday, 18 January 2020 01:57:45 UTC, Phil Hobbs wrote:
On 2020-01-17 20:46, John Doe wrote:
Phil Hobbs wrote:
John Doe wrote:

I bought CFL lightbulbs once. Now I need some more, I turn
around and they're gone! Replaced by LED light bulbs. That
was a short-lived technology.

Good riddance. CFLs stink on ice.

The poster is uninformed.


They're dim,

not a bit, they're available from 3w to 100s of watts & many thousand
lumens. There was an issue with mfrs claiming wattage equivalence to
nonstandard filament lamps, but that is not due to any problem with
the CFLs obviously.

....just with the ones you could actually buy and use conveniently. And
they are intrinsically dim--their surface brightness is dramatically
lower than a 100W incandescent's, so very often an equivalently-bright
CFL wouldn't fit the fixture. Lamp harps especially.

slow,

There were 2 types of CFL, general purpose & facilities. The former
were not slow.

The facilities ones aren't CFLs, and the domestic ones really are slow,
especially in cold weather. They take seconds to come up to full
brightness, vs. tens of milliseconds for an incandescent or LED. (The
LED is intrinsically a ~100 ns device, but the power supplies are slower.)

The latter were very slow to warm up, trading that off
for better efficacy, and were never intended for domestic use. I
think the reason facilities lamps occasionally ended up in homes was
the complete failure of mfrs to explain what they were on the pack -
just stating 'facilities' meant nothing to the home buyer.


highly temperature-sensitive,

some were intolerant of small enclosed spaces, most weren't. Depended
on the mercury technology & dose.

It's cold I'm talking about. Those of us who actually save significant
amounts of energy generally do it by turning down the thermostat, which
makes the lights go dim.

fragile,

indeed

not dimmable,

they were but... a) the cheapest ballast types could only be dimmed
with something other than the standard dimmer of the day b) dimmable
ballasted cost more


and produce ugly colours.

nonsense. The vast majority were triphosphor in sane CCTs, but it was
possible to find outliers with excessively high CCT, and occasional
junk products with old halophosphate phosphors.

You must be colour blind.

Other than that, they rock.

They do save a bit of money, but the amount I spend on electric
light is pretty trivial.

they were a move forward in technology, saving more than they cost.

And making it hard to read my book, all to save two cents an hour. No
thanks.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal Consultant
ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics
Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

http://electrooptical.net
http://hobbs-eo.com

 

On Sat, 18 Jan 2020 09:16:48 +0000 (UTC),
DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno@decadence.org wrote:

<about street lights>

The biggest fail I have seen with the "new technology" LED street
lamps are the fact that the total retards are STILL using 65 year old
day/night sensors up on top of the light. KEERIMANY boys! Clock
chips have been around for decades! They could KNOW when it was day
or night. I see units that do not know when to turn on, others that
do not know how to turn off... with the sodiums it was a HUGE waste
of power to sit there and cycle on and off and on and off. Those old
sensors and that entire wait for daylight paradigm is STUPID. We
know better now. These lamps could ALL have 8 hr battery backups for
power outages. They could ALL be controlled by one lamp in the
street's entire string that tells them when to turn on and off. They
could talk by the power line or by radio. This stuff is easy.

A strictly clock based system might work in the tropics, in which the
sun drops below the horizon in 2 minutes and it becomes dark in 24
minutes (civil twilight, sun is 0 to 6 degrees below horizon).
Cloudiness does not significantly alter times when light is needed.

However, consider situation at higher latitudes, in which the sun
slowly approaches the horizon in a shallow angle and remains in the
civil twilight zone for 1-2 hours, cloudiness will significantly
affect when street lights are needed, so a light sensor is the answer.

Of course the system needs a large hysteresis, so that lights are not
turned off until it is sufficiently light in the morning.
Alternatively add a 1-2 hour timeout to prevent premature turning off
the lights in the evening.

 

[Robert Baer]

John Doe wrote:

I bought CFL lightbulbs once. Now I need some more, I turn around and
they're gone! Replaced by LED light bulbs. That was a short-lived
technology.

CFLs were based on a few lies.
Mainly based on "economy" and "efficiency" and "power savings".

CFLs were technically illegal as they used banned mercury.
That was ignored: lie #1 big time.
They take a fair amount of varied electronic components, so "economy"
becomes a lie.
"Power savings" and "efficiency" become untrue in the extended sense,
due to all of the energy poured into the making of those components as
well as the manufacturing of the CFLs.

Incandescents take very little variety of materials to make,and
rather low technology ("simple" comes to mind).

 

[Rick C]

On Saturday, January 18, 2020 at 9:22:42 AM UTC-5, Cursitor Doom wrote:

On Sat, 18 Jan 2020 03:09:14 -0500, Phil Hobbs
pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:

They're hell on astromomers, too.

That's *very* surprising. I was under the impression they're highly
directional. For example in car headlights now they require next to
nothing in the way of reflector bowls. That's why all the newest cars
only have mean lookin' slits where headlamps used to be.

They have reflectors, they are just internal. You don't think LEDs emit light in one direction only do you?

--

Rick C.

+ Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
+ Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209

 

On Saturday, 18 January 2020 16:16:43 UTC, Winfield Hill wrote:

Cursitor Doom wrote...

On 18 Jan 2020 07:10:25 -0800, Winfield Hill wrote:

Not so short; History from Wikipedia:

1976: GE engineer, Edward E. Hammer, invents spiral CFL.
1980: Philips model SL, screw-in, integral magnetic ballast.
1985: Osram model EL lamp, including an electronic ballast.
next: development of high-efficacy phosphors...
1995: by Shanghai Xiangshan in China, helical CFLs.
2011: China CFLs were the "dominant technology".
2015: LED prices fell well below US$5 for a basic bulb.
2016: GE, announced phase out of CFL production in the US.
2020: 40 years later, John Doe writes, that was short-lived.

Osram. Now there was a company that knew how to make bulbs.

They still make superior LED light sources. Yesterday I
pushed our 120W green Osram theatre LED to a peak pulse
current of 360 amps, up from its continuous 20 amp rating.
The competing 100W Luminous theatre LEDs failed at 200A.
Also, it's forward voltage increase was modest; I only had
to raise the RIS-796 pulser's voltage up to 30V, from 24V.

They also make really bad ones. I have a box of failed Osram
LED lamps, almost all of the type that has imitation filaments.
Their warranty replacement requires that one has kept the
purchase receipt. The only reason I bought them was their ready
availability in local shops. The colour quality is poor as they
look very yellow. My favourites at the moment are ENLITE which
have very good colour rendering and seem to be reliable, but
unfortunately they don't seem to make bayonet cap lamps.

John

 

On Sat, 18 Jan 2020 14:22:38 +0000, Cursitor Doom
<curd@notformail.com> wrote:

On Sat, 18 Jan 2020 03:09:14 -0500, Phil Hobbs
pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:

They're hell on astromomers, too.

That's *very* surprising. I was under the impression they're highly
directional. For example in car headlights now they require next to
nothing in the way of reflector bowls. That's why all the newest cars
only have mean lookin' slits where headlamps used to be.

Astronomers suffers from the impurities in the air, such as dust,
vapor and other pollution. Any artificial light radiated directly
towards the sky or reflected from the ground will scatter in the
atmospheric impurities (light pollution), causing air glow which adds
noise to any astronomical pictures and measurements. For this reason,
optical astronomical sites have been moved far away from population
centers.

Avoiding light escaping directly towards the sky helps reducing the
air glow. For humans, the important thing is how much light is
reflected from the street. the reflectivity varies greatly if the
surface is dry, wet or snowy. Ideally the street light output should
be adjusted so that sufficient light is reflected to tho the human
eye. There is no point in running the street rights at full power when
the surface is dry or snowy, but full power is needed when the surface
is wet.

Astronomers also prefers LPS street lamps, since the radiation is
practically monochromatic, so it easy to filter out when taking
pictures or doing measurements.

 

[Phil Hobbs]

On 2020-01-18 09:22, Cursitor Doom wrote:

On Sat, 18 Jan 2020 03:09:14 -0500, Phil Hobbs
pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:

They're hell on astromomers, too.

That's *very* surprising. I was under the impression they're highly
directional. For example in car headlights now they require next to
nothing in the way of reflector bowls. That's why all the newest cars
only have mean lookin' slits where headlamps used to be.

They're pretty directional, but very roughly 1/5 of the light gets
reflected back towards the sky.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal Consultant
ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics
Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

http://electrooptical.net
http://hobbs-eo.com

 

[Phil Hobbs]

On 2020-01-18 11:16, Winfield Hill wrote:

Cursitor Doom wrote...

On 18 Jan 2020 07:10:25 -0800, Winfield Hill wrote:

Not so short; History from Wikipedia:

1976: GE engineer, Edward E. Hammer, invents spiral CFL.
1980: Philips model SL, screw-in, integral magnetic ballast.
1985: Osram model EL lamp, including an electronic ballast.
next: development of high-efficacy phosphors...
1995: by Shanghai Xiangshan in China, helical CFLs.
2011: China CFLs were the "dominant technology".
2015: LED prices fell well below US$5 for a basic bulb.
2016: GE, announced phase out of CFL production in the US.
2020: 40 years later, John Doe writes, that was short-lived.

Osram. Now there was a company that knew how to make bulbs.

They still make superior LED light sources. Yesterday I
pushed our 120W green Osram theatre LED to a peak pulse
current of 360 amps, up from its continuous 20 amp rating.
The competing 100W Luminous theatre LEDs failed at 200A.
Also, it's forward voltage increase was modest; I only had
to raise the RIS-796 pulser's voltage up to 30V, from 24V.

I'd be interested in how the lifetime is affected. Overcurrent causes
dislocations to grow, so that the nonradiative recombination becomes
more and more of a problem.

LEDs run at DC are fairly intolerant of overcurrent.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal Consultant
ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics
Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

http://electrooptical.net
http://hobbs-eo.com

 

[Lasse Langwadt Christense]

lørdag den 18. januar 2020 kl. 20.18.00 UTC+1 skrev jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com:

I wonder how the LED fake Edisons work. They seem to have a bunch of
LEDs encapsulated into long skinny tube shapes. Where is the current
limiting?

there's a pcb with rectifier and constant current driver in the base

https://youtu.be/NffhdAz9pc4 money shot around 10 minutes

 

[Lasse Langwadt Christense]

lørdag den 18. januar 2020 kl. 20.18.00 UTC+1 skrev jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com:

I wonder how the LED fake Edisons work. They seem to have a bunch of
LEDs encapsulated into long skinny tube shapes. Where is the current
limiting?

there's a pcb with rectifier and constant current driver in the base

https://youtu.be/NffhdAz9pc4 money shot around 10 minutes

 

[Phil Hobbs]

On 2020-01-18 14:29, upsidedown@downunder.com wrote:

On Sat, 18 Jan 2020 12:30:47 -0500, Phil Hobbs
pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:

On 2020-01-18 06:10, tabbypurr@gmail.com wrote:
On Saturday, 18 January 2020 01:57:45 UTC, Phil Hobbs wrote:
On 2020-01-17 20:46, John Doe wrote:
clip

highly temperature-sensitive,

some were intolerant of small enclosed spaces, most weren't. Depended
on the mercury technology & dose.

The problem with all kinds of fluorescent lamps is starting at cold
(below -20 C) temperatures. In a closed enclosure, if you manage to
start it, it will take 5-30 minutes, until it has warmed the enclosure
so much that normal operating temperature is reached and full output
available.

It's a lot worse then, but compared with tungsten, it's a serious
problem anywhere below about 50F. Using a CFL as a porch light here in
the Northeast is a non-starter.

It's cold I'm talking about. Those of us who actually save significant
amounts of energy generally do it by turning down the thermostat, which
makes the lights go dim.

Isn't it uncomfortable to live in a house with indoor temperature
below freezing . The light output variation at room temperatures is
small.

Not so small as not to be very noticeable. In the winter, we keep the
thermostat at 63 during the day and 57 at night. CFLs are noticeably
slower and dimmer at night or first thing in the morning.

clip

and produce ugly colours.

nonsense. The vast majority were triphosphor in sane CCTs, but it was
possible to find outliers with excessively high CCT, and occasional
junk products with old halophosphate phosphors.

Most CFL tubes use /7xx or /8xx phosphors. Some manufacturers claim
also /9xx models in their catalogs, but I have not seen any CFLs in
real life in the /9xx range. I use some /965 (CRI=9x 6500 K)
"daylight" tubes but they are full size fluorescent tubes.

Okay, what's the exact significance of that?

You must be colour blind.

Let indirect daylight fall on a white surface. Aim the lamp towards
the same surface to a chive similar illumination. With /965 phosphors
is hard to tell the difference and I have often forgot to switch off
the /965 uplighters in the morning when there are sufficient light
outside . Unfortunately /965 CFLs are extremely rare and
unobtainable as LEDs.

It isn't white surfaces that have the problem, it's coloured ones. The
output of CFLs consists of a weak continuum plus several very bright
emission bands.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal Consultant
ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics
Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

http://electrooptical.net
http://hobbs-eo.com

 

On Sat, 18 Jan 2020 13:19:52 -0500, Phil Hobbs
<pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:

On 2020-01-18 11:16, Winfield Hill wrote:
Cursitor Doom wrote...

On 18 Jan 2020 07:10:25 -0800, Winfield Hill wrote:

Not so short; History from Wikipedia:

1976: GE engineer, Edward E. Hammer, invents spiral CFL.
1980: Philips model SL, screw-in, integral magnetic ballast.
1985: Osram model EL lamp, including an electronic ballast.
next: development of high-efficacy phosphors...
1995: by Shanghai Xiangshan in China, helical CFLs.
2011: China CFLs were the "dominant technology".
2015: LED prices fell well below US$5 for a basic bulb.
2016: GE, announced phase out of CFL production in the US.
2020: 40 years later, John Doe writes, that was short-lived.

Osram. Now there was a company that knew how to make bulbs.

They still make superior LED light sources. Yesterday I
pushed our 120W green Osram theatre LED to a peak pulse
current of 360 amps, up from its continuous 20 amp rating.
The competing 100W Luminous theatre LEDs failed at 200A.
Also, it's forward voltage increase was modest; I only had
to raise the RIS-796 pulser's voltage up to 30V, from 24V.



I'd be interested in how the lifetime is affected. Overcurrent causes
dislocations to grow, so that the nonradiative recombination becomes
more and more of a problem.

LEDs run at DC are fairly intolerant of overcurrent.

The problem with "white" LEDs is the lifetime of the phosphor.
Stressing it too much and the conversion efficiency drops quite fast.
To achieve usable life times of tens of thousand hours, you need to
run the LED at Imax/2 or even Imax/3.

 

On Sat, 18 Jan 2020 12:30:47 -0500, Phil Hobbs
<pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:

On 2020-01-18 06:10, tabbypurr@gmail.com wrote:
On Saturday, 18 January 2020 01:57:45 UTC, Phil Hobbs wrote:
On 2020-01-17 20:46, John Doe wrote:
clip

highly temperature-sensitive,

some were intolerant of small enclosed spaces, most weren't. Depended
on the mercury technology & dose.

The problem with all kinds of fluorescent lamps is starting at cold
(below -20 C) temperatures. In a closed enclosure, if you manage to
start it, it will take 5-30 minutes, until it has warmed the enclosure
so much that normal operating temperature is reached and full output
available.

It's cold I'm talking about. Those of us who actually save significant
amounts of energy generally do it by turning down the thermostat, which
makes the lights go dim.

Isn't it uncomfortable to live in a house with indoor temperature
below freezing . The light output variation at room temperatures is
small.

<clip>

and produce ugly colours.

nonsense. The vast majority were triphosphor in sane CCTs, but it was
possible to find outliers with excessively high CCT, and occasional
junk products with old halophosphate phosphors.

Most CFL tubes use /7xx or /8xx phosphors. Some manufacturers claim
also /9xx models in their catalogs, but I have not seen any CFLs in
real life in the /9xx range. I use some /965 (CRI=9x 6500 K)
"daylight" tubes but they are full size fluorescent tubes.

>You must be colour blind.

Let indirect daylight fall on a white surface. Aim the lamp towards
the same surface to a chive similar illumination. With /965 phosphors
is hard to tell the difference and I have often forgot to switch off
the /965 uplighters in the morning when there are sufficient light
outside . Unfortunately /965 CFLs are extremely rare and
unobtainable as LEDs.

 

On Sat, 18 Jan 2020 10:25:53 -0800 (PST), jrwalliker@gmail.com wrote:

On Saturday, 18 January 2020 16:16:43 UTC, Winfield Hill wrote:
Cursitor Doom wrote...

On 18 Jan 2020 07:10:25 -0800, Winfield Hill wrote:

Not so short; History from Wikipedia:

1976: GE engineer, Edward E. Hammer, invents spiral CFL.
1980: Philips model SL, screw-in, integral magnetic ballast.
1985: Osram model EL lamp, including an electronic ballast.
next: development of high-efficacy phosphors...
1995: by Shanghai Xiangshan in China, helical CFLs.
2011: China CFLs were the "dominant technology".
2015: LED prices fell well below US$5 for a basic bulb.
2016: GE, announced phase out of CFL production in the US.
2020: 40 years later, John Doe writes, that was short-lived.

Osram. Now there was a company that knew how to make bulbs.

They still make superior LED light sources. Yesterday I
pushed our 120W green Osram theatre LED to a peak pulse
current of 360 amps, up from its continuous 20 amp rating.
The competing 100W Luminous theatre LEDs failed at 200A.
Also, it's forward voltage increase was modest; I only had
to raise the RIS-796 pulser's voltage up to 30V, from 24V.

They also make really bad ones. I have a box of failed Osram
LED lamps, almost all of the type that has imitation filaments.
Their warranty replacement requires that one has kept the
purchase receipt. The only reason I bought them was their ready
availability in local shops. The colour quality is poor as they
look very yellow. My favourites at the moment are ENLITE which
have very good colour rendering and seem to be reliable, but
unfortunately they don't seem to make bayonet cap lamps.

John

Sounds like they were the LED imitation "Edison lamps".

True incandescent Edisons (long, zigzag, low temp filaments and clear
glass) are popular in trendy bars and restaurants here.

https://www.amazon.com/DecorStar-Antique-Dimmable-Fixtures-Decorative/dp/B07DXGX7RY/ref=sr_1_1_sspa?keywords=edison+bulb&qid=1579374570&sr=8-1-spons&psc=1&spLa=ZW5jcnlwdGVkUXVhbGlmaWVyPUFQWTdRT01aVVE5M1kmZW5jcnlwdGVkSWQ9QTA2ODA0NzBaVVRNQjJCOEkzQkEmZW5jcnlwdGVkQWRJZD1BMDkyNDE0MjFaRjZDWDI5WVJWVVkmd2lkZ2V0TmFtZT1zcF9hdGYmYWN0aW9uPWNsaWNrUmVkaXJlY3QmZG9Ob3RMb2dDbGljaz10cnVl

4 lumens per watt.



I wonder how the LED fake Edisons work. They seem to have a bunch of
LEDs encapsulated into long skinny tube shapes. Where is the current
limiting?

https://www.amazon.com/Vintage-Equivalent-Protection-Non-Dimmable-Filament/dp/B07MFPRYLW/ref=sr_1_8?keywords=edison+bulb&qid=1579374570&sr=8-8



--

John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc

The cork popped merrily, and Lord Peter rose to his feet.
"Bunter", he said, "I give you a toast. The triumph of Instinct over Reason"

 

[Phil Hobbs]

On 2020-01-18 15:05, upsidedown@downunder.com wrote:

On Sat, 18 Jan 2020 14:41:07 -0500, Phil Hobbs
pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:


and produce ugly colours.

nonsense. The vast majority were triphosphor in sane CCTs, but it was
possible to find outliers with excessively high CCT, and occasional
junk products with old halophosphate phosphors.

Most CFL tubes use /7xx or /8xx phosphors. Some manufacturers claim
also /9xx models in their catalogs, but I have not seen any CFLs in
real life in the /9xx range. I use some /965 (CRI=9x 6500 K)
"daylight" tubes but they are full size fluorescent tubes.

Okay, what's the exact significance of that?

You must be colour blind.

Let indirect daylight fall on a white surface. Aim the lamp towards
the same surface to a chive similar illumination. With /965 phosphors
is hard to tell the difference and I have often forgot to switch off
the /965 uplighters in the morning when there are sufficient light
outside . Unfortunately /965 CFLs are extremely rare and
unobtainable as LEDs.

It isn't white surfaces that have the problem, it's coloured ones. The
output of CFLs consists of a weak continuum plus several very bright
emission bands.

True for /7xx and /7xx phosphors, not for /9xx phosphors (full size or
CFL if available).

The problem with white LEDs is that it radiates a very strong blue
spectral line from the chip itself and a continuum of red and
yellowish colors from the phosphors. Unfortunately you would have to
select 2700 K or below models to limit the blue emission and hence get
a more balanced total spectrums. With better fluorescent tubes 4000 K
looks quite balanced and even /965 (6500 K) looks good, but 4000 K or
6500 K LEDs would look awful.

CFLs have better colour rendering than white LEDs?

Sez you, against the whole world AFAIK. Any actual data?

Cheers

Phil Hobbs