OT: We got it up!

[keith]

On Fri, 29 Jul 2005 09:55:34 +0000, Robert Latest wrote:

On 2005-07-28, Jim Thompson <thegreatone@example.com> wrote:
On Thu, 28 Jul 2005 17:10:31 +0100, Pooh Bear
rabbitsfriendsandrelations@hotmail.com> wrote:

Jim Thompson wrote:

On Thu, 28 Jul 2005 07:55:49 -0700, John Larkin
jjlarkin@highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote:

[snip]

No, one could also move earth to a further-out orbit. Turns out that
it's not hard.

John


Oh? Really ?

...Jim Thompson

I confess, I want to hear more about this.

Graham

I believe we are so inextricably gravity-interrelated with the other
planets that meddling would result in a disaster.

Not to say the Democrats won't try it some day, and we'll end up
falling into the sun :-(

I don't care who does it or who screws up at it as long as it's
only the US and not the entire planet that gets flung into a
different orbit. I'll try not to live there when it happens.
^^^^^^^^^^^

That works for me.

--
Keith

 

[keith]

On Fri, 29 Jul 2005 20:07:36 +1000, Clifford Heath wrote:

Rich Grise wrote:
The US is a spacefaring nation once again!

Weell, there's a last time for everything...
Pity they've grounded the fleet indefinitely.

Indefinitely <> Interminably

They're now talking about another flight this year.

--
Keith

 

[Jim Thompson]

On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 02:00:34 +0000 (UTC), kensmith@green.rahul.net
(Ken Smith) wrote:

In article <iirke110s85667njikpdmt41kn9o2k3vbf@4ax.com>,
Jim Thompson <thegreatone@example.com> wrote:
[...]
not a major problem until environmentalists forced the discontinuation
of fluorocarbon(freon)-based foaming agents. NASA used hydrazine
instead, and the tile failures began.

Its not hydrazine. Its CCl2FCH3. The blowing agent isn't really the
problem anyway. Its the solid Dihydrogen Monoxide that seems to be the
real trouble maker.

--

I have an article saved around here somewhere that said it IS
hydrazine. I'll look for it.

Water does indeed get under the new crap foam, freezes as the hydrogen
expands, and pops off foam chunks that sometimes are moving at 700fps.

...Jim Thompson
--
| James E.Thompson, P.E. | mens |
| Analog Innovations, Inc. | et |
| Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus |
| Phoenix, Arizona Voice480)460-2350 | |
| E-mail Address at Website Fax480)460-2142 | Brass Rat |
| http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 |

I love to cook with wine. Sometimes I even put it in the food.

 

[Aubrey McIntosh, Ph.D.]

Richard the Dreaded Libertarian wrote:

On Fri, 29 Jul 2005 15:34:39 -0500, Aubrey McIntosh, Ph.D. wrote:


There is an article at

http://www.legalaffairs.org/issues/July-August-2005/feature_burgess_julaug05.msp

that argues to legally define "terrorists" as "pirates" in order to
bring mature and accepted law to bear.




That's stupid. Terrorists are not pirates, they're ideologues. What
could possess a person to blow themselves up? I heard stories of the
same thing happening in VietNam - they were using children to deliver
explosives, and, yes, blow themselves up along with as many invaders
as they could. "Would you give your life for Your Country?" - Which
side says that?

Back to the point, "terrorists" are just guerillas who are faced with
certain defeat. "Pirates" are simply "privateers." In the days when
"pirates" were glorified, the various kings and queens and princes
and stuff didn't like them operating on the open seas, not paying their
tribute to the kqp&e.

I am much more curious to know what someone thinks who read the article.

 

[John Larkin]

On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 10:19:42 -0400, keith <krw@att.bizzzz> wrote:

On Fri, 29 Jul 2005 20:07:36 +1000, Clifford Heath wrote:

Rich Grise wrote:
The US is a spacefaring nation once again!

Weell, there's a last time for everything...
Pity they've grounded the fleet indefinitely.

Indefinitely <> Interminably

They're now talking about another flight this year.

Yup, they still have three more crews to kill.

John

 

[Ken Smith]

In article <pan.2005.07.30.02.48.21.168781@att.bizzzz>,
keith <krw@att.bizzzz> wrote:
[...]

The solid phase of Hydrogen-Hydroxide is a given, considering that the
SSMEs are cryogenic (we are talkign abough launching from FL here too).
The point is that this didn't seem to be a problem until they changed the
foaming agent to something more politically correct. Bad science is a
stupid reason to kill people.

Was anyone looking for falling foam before the disaster? Maybe there only
seemed to be no problem and luck just ran out after the change was made.

They flew for years with the daft o-ring design without trouble. They are
still using a sectioned solid rocket for political reasons. Utah had to
he their share of the money and that ended up killing people.


--
--
kensmith@rahul.net forging knowledge

 

[Ken Smith]

In article <kk3ne11vr6lsgjb7804cblgh7d0nd466lg@4ax.com>,
Jim Thompson <thegreatone@example.com> wrote:

On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 02:00:34 +0000 (UTC), kensmith@green.rahul.net
(Ken Smith) wrote:
[...]
Its not hydrazine. Its CCl2FCH3. The blowing agent isn't really the

[..]

I have an article saved around here somewhere that said it IS
hydrazine. I'll look for it.

Please do but I suspect its an error:


H H Hydrazine
\ /
N - N
/ \
H H

Water does indeed get under the new crap foam, freezes as the hydrogen
expands, and pops off foam chunks that sometimes are moving at 700fps.

...Jim Thompson
--
| James E.Thompson, P.E. | mens |
| Analog Innovations, Inc. | et |
| Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus |
| Phoenix, Arizona Voice480)460-2350 | |
| E-mail Address at Website Fax480)460-2142 | Brass Rat |
| http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 |

I love to cook with wine. Sometimes I even put it in the food.

--
--
kensmith@rahul.net forging knowledge

 

[Fred Abse]

On Fri, 29 Jul 2005 20:05:38 -0700, John Larkin wrote:

That doesn't compute. The world's biggest imperialist relationship of
modern times, probably of all times, was the British conquest of
India. Ghandi kicked them out, and he was no terrorist.

And then got blown away by a religious fanatic. Nothing new under the sun.


--
"Electricity is of two kinds, positive and negative. The difference
is, I presume, that one comes a little more expensive, but is more
durable; the other is a cheaper thing, but the moths get into it."
(Stephen Leacock)

 

[Fred Abse]

On Fri, 29 Jul 2005 11:04:06 -0700, Jim Thompson wrote:

I don't know if they have an exemption or not, but tile failure was
not a major problem until environmentalists forced the discontinuation
of fluorocarbon(freon)-based foaming agents. NASA used hydrazine
instead, and the tile failures began.

Hydrazine? Isn't that a bit dangerous? ISTR the Germans using it as rocket
plane fuel in WWII, and it dissolving test pilots.

--
"Electricity is of two kinds, positive and negative. The difference
is, I presume, that one comes a little more expensive, but is more
durable; the other is a cheaper thing, but the moths get into it."
(Stephen Leacock)

 

[Fred Abse]

On Fri, 29 Jul 2005 15:39:38 +0000, Richard the Dreaded Libertarian wrote:

Is there anyone here who has been subjected to merciless torture by
bullies?

I'm quite prepared to believe that there are some here with numbers
tattooed on their arms.

Or whose relatives had.

Lest we forget.

--
"Electricity is of two kinds, positive and negative. The difference
is, I presume, that one comes a little more expensive, but is more
durable; the other is a cheaper thing, but the moths get into it."
(Stephen Leacock)

 

[John Larkin]

On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 18:51:52 +0100, Fred Abse
<excretatauris@cerebrumconfus.it> wrote:

On Fri, 29 Jul 2005 20:05:38 -0700, John Larkin wrote:

That doesn't compute. The world's biggest imperialist relationship of
modern times, probably of all times, was the British conquest of
India. Ghandi kicked them out, and he was no terrorist.

And then got blown away by a religious fanatic. Nothing new under the sun.

A radical Muslim, wasn't it? Maybe Rich can explain to us what
terrible thing Ghandi did to deserve being killed.

John

 

[Fred Abse]

On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 11:03:46 -0700, John Larkin wrote:

A radical Muslim, wasn't it?

Hindu. (Nathuram Godse).

--
"Electricity is of two kinds, positive and negative. The difference
is, I presume, that one comes a little more expensive, but is more
durable; the other is a cheaper thing, but the moths get into it."
(Stephen Leacock)

 

[Barry Lennox]

On Fri, 29 Jul 2005 15:34:39 -0500, "Aubrey McIntosh, Ph.D."
<newsposter@spam.vima.austin.tx.us> wrote:

snip

There is an article at

http://www.legalaffairs.org/issues/July-August-2005/feature_burgess_julaug05.msp

that argues to legally define "terrorists" as "pirates" in order to
bring mature and accepted law to bear.

One of the implications is the jurisdiction issue: pirates could be
captured wherever they were found, by anyone who found them.

Now, we just need an electronic pirate locator circuit.

It's an interesting article, especially given the UN's 40 years of
utter uselessness in defining "what is a terrorist" But I guess one
man's terrorist is another's freedom fighter, eg, Nancy Wake, to the
Germans she was a terrorist, to the French and Australians, an
absolute heroine.

What's the practical point though? The Straits of Malacca are crawling
with modern day pirates, and nobody seems to have the balls to go
after them. And if pirates exist in Iran, or Korea, or Saudi Arabia,
who's going to go after them? regardless of their new pirate, or,
"enemy of the human race" status. Some renegades will still protect
them.

Barry Lennox

 

[Richard Henry]

"John Larkin" <jjlarkin@highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote in message
news:m5gne19to1d39cgkquslr3p7esquv1isj9@4ax.com...

On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 18:51:52 +0100, Fred Abse
excretatauris@cerebrumconfus.it> wrote:

On Fri, 29 Jul 2005 20:05:38 -0700, John Larkin wrote:

That doesn't compute. The world's biggest imperialist relationship of
modern times, probably of all times, was the British conquest of
India. Ghandi kicked them out, and he was no terrorist.

And then got blown away by a religious fanatic. Nothing new under the
sun.

A radical Muslim, wasn't it? Maybe Rich can explain to us what
terrible thing Ghandi did to deserve being killed.

Such irony. The assassin was a radical Hindu who was upset that Gandhi was
trying to stop Hindus from killing Moslems.

 

[keith]

On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 18:51:53 +0100, Fred Abse wrote:

On Fri, 29 Jul 2005 11:04:06 -0700, Jim Thompson wrote:

I don't know if they have an exemption or not, but tile failure was
not a major problem until environmentalists forced the discontinuation
of fluorocarbon(freon)-based foaming agents. NASA used hydrazine
instead, and the tile failures began.

Hydrazine? Isn't that a bit dangerous? ISTR the Germans using it as rocket
plane fuel in WWII, and it dissolving test pilots.

I have a drinking buddy that has several scars and has had health
problems from it. ...though it had a different name in the F16 APU.
"Nope, no Hydrazine here."

--
Keith

 

[keith]

On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 09:07:45 -0700, John Larkin wrote:

On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 10:19:42 -0400, keith <krw@att.bizzzz> wrote:

On Fri, 29 Jul 2005 20:07:36 +1000, Clifford Heath wrote:

Rich Grise wrote:
The US is a spacefaring nation once again!

Weell, there's a last time for everything...
Pity they've grounded the fleet indefinitely.

Indefinitely <> Interminably

They're now talking about another flight this year.


Yup, they still have three more crews to kill.

There are more than three crews. There are only three orbiters left,
though. Gotta watch the facts, John. ;-)

--
Keith

 

[John Larkin]

On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 20:38:51 -0400, keith <krw@att.bizzzz> wrote:

On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 09:07:45 -0700, John Larkin wrote:

On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 10:19:42 -0400, keith <krw@att.bizzzz> wrote:

On Fri, 29 Jul 2005 20:07:36 +1000, Clifford Heath wrote:

Rich Grise wrote:
The US is a spacefaring nation once again!

Weell, there's a last time for everything...
Pity they've grounded the fleet indefinitely.

Indefinitely <> Interminably

They're now talking about another flight this year.


Yup, they still have three more crews to kill.

There are more than three crews. There are only three orbiters left,
though. Gotta watch the facts, John. ;-)

The three remaining shuttles can kill three more crews. Right?

John

 

[keith]

On Mon, 01 Aug 2005 12:49:42 -0700, John Larkin wrote:

On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 20:38:51 -0400, keith <krw@att.bizzzz> wrote:

On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 09:07:45 -0700, John Larkin wrote:

On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 10:19:42 -0400, keith <krw@att.bizzzz> wrote:

On Fri, 29 Jul 2005 20:07:36 +1000, Clifford Heath wrote:

Rich Grise wrote:
The US is a spacefaring nation once again!

Weell, there's a last time for everything...
Pity they've grounded the fleet indefinitely.

Indefinitely <> Interminably

They're now talking about another flight this year.


Yup, they still have three more crews to kill.

There are more than three crews. There are only three orbiters left,
though. Gotta watch the facts, John. ;-)


The three remaining shuttles can kill three more crews. Right?

Ok. If that's your goal, throw in a couple of T33s and perhaps a
crappy atmosphere and you can take out a few more.

--
Keith

 

[John Larkin]

On Mon, 01 Aug 2005 22:18:15 -0400, keith <krw@att.bizzzz> wrote:

On Mon, 01 Aug 2005 12:49:42 -0700, John Larkin wrote:

On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 20:38:51 -0400, keith <krw@att.bizzzz> wrote:

On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 09:07:45 -0700, John Larkin wrote:

On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 10:19:42 -0400, keith <krw@att.bizzzz> wrote:

On Fri, 29 Jul 2005 20:07:36 +1000, Clifford Heath wrote:

Rich Grise wrote:
The US is a spacefaring nation once again!

Weell, there's a last time for everything...
Pity they've grounded the fleet indefinitely.

Indefinitely <> Interminably

They're now talking about another flight this year.


Yup, they still have three more crews to kill.

There are more than three crews. There are only three orbiters left,
though. Gotta watch the facts, John. ;-)


The three remaining shuttles can kill three more crews. Right?

Ok. If that's your goal, throw in a couple of T33s and perhaps a
crappy atmosphere and you can take out a few more.

It's not my goal. The silly death traps should be sent to museums,
where they'll be more useful and less dangerous.

John

 

[keith]

On Mon, 01 Aug 2005 20:10:43 -0700, John Larkin wrote:

On Mon, 01 Aug 2005 22:18:15 -0400, keith <krw@att.bizzzz> wrote:

On Mon, 01 Aug 2005 12:49:42 -0700, John Larkin wrote:

On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 20:38:51 -0400, keith <krw@att.bizzzz> wrote:

On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 09:07:45 -0700, John Larkin wrote:

On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 10:19:42 -0400, keith <krw@att.bizzzz> wrote:

On Fri, 29 Jul 2005 20:07:36 +1000, Clifford Heath wrote:

Rich Grise wrote:
The US is a spacefaring nation once again!

Weell, there's a last time for everything...
Pity they've grounded the fleet indefinitely.

Indefinitely <> Interminably

They're now talking about another flight this year.


Yup, they still have three more crews to kill.

There are more than three crews. There are only three orbiters left,
though. Gotta watch the facts, John. ;-)


The three remaining shuttles can kill three more crews. Right?

Ok. If that's your goal, throw in a couple of T33s and perhaps a
crappy atmosphere and you can take out a few more.


It's not my goal.

I was being snide.

The silly death traps should be sent to museums,
where they'll be more useful and less dangerous.

Space is always going to be a dangerous place. Hell, *all* exploration is
dangerous. Mountain climbing is dangerous too. Should it be banned? My
only problem with the current NASA program is ISS. What exactly is its
purpose, other than to justify the Shuttle? Which is "needed" by ISS,
which...

--
Keith