[OT] Bush blames others for high oil prices

James Beck · May 20, 2004

In article <20040519194048.19889.00001691@mb-m10.aol.com>,
rolavine@aol.com says...

Got to love the way this man takes responsibilty for things. His only response
to the high gas prices is asking congress to pass an energy bill based on some
ideas he submitted in 2001, during the height of the screwing that ENRON was
'republican enabled' to give this country.

Just remember that all of the DOT Bombs and cooked books were a result
of the false economy of the stock market created by an artificially
depressed interest rate perpetrated during the Clinton-Gore years.
Greenspan should be shot as a traitor. It isn't genius to cut interest
rates everytime the stock market took a dip. All it has accomplished is
making it unviable to put money anywhere other than the stock market if
you expect a return.

Jim

John Larkin · May 20, 2004

On Thu, 20 May 2004 04:28:26 GMT, Scott Stephens <scottxs@comcast.net>
wrote:

There are a billion Chinese who want
cars, another billion in India, and a few more bil around the world
who want to be middle-class, and that means having heat and
electricity and transportation.

Is their desire, even their need, an obligation on me, my talent, time,
or treasure?

It certainly should be. As a practical matter, it sure is. The Saudis
and the Russians sell oil to the high bidder.

Would they know what to do with gas, oil, electricity or
engines without an American to sell them the appliance, teach them how
to use and maintain it?

That's funny. The Chinese now sell *us* the appliances.

John

So Joe American responds by buying a
deliberately hideous 6000 pound SUV and uses it to run to the 7-11 to
buy beer and chips and TV dinners that will kill him.

Your damn right. My ancestors profited from their desire to get ahead,
their greed. As long as prestige and greed is motivated by the desire to
enjoy life, rather than the desire to be envied by ones neighbor for
social dominance, greed is a damn good thing.

Maybe if the Chinese and others were more free to be greedy, rather than
feeling constrained to be no happier than their most miserable neighbor,
lest the local communist party member punish them for shaming their
inferiors by their superiority, they would be leading the west. They had
the printing press, gunpowder, compass, and other inventions. They were
too oppressed and stagnant to capitalize on them.

So who is being stupid?

Humans that measure themselves against their neighbor, rather than their
potential.

I hope gas hits $8 a gallon soon. That would get a lot of ugly metal
off the road.

If it does, your poor pathetic peasants will be feeding maggots before
us fat, greedy Americans run out of TV dinners and Michael Jackson CD's.

John Larkin · May 20, 2004

On Wed, 19 May 2004 22:13:17 -0700, Julie <julie@nospam.com> wrote:

Rolavine wrote:

Got to love the way this man takes responsibilty for things. His only response
to the high gas prices is asking congress to pass an energy bill based on some
ideas he submitted in 2001, during the height of the screwing that ENRON was
'republican enabled' to give this country.

As of this moment all major oil companies are announcing record profits.
Nothing has happened to the supply of oil, and the industry is using the excuse
of a lack of refining capacity, a situation that this industry created for
itself.

We need a federal government strong enough to go head to head with
corporations. The one we got now is in the pocket of big oil, and Bush's
unspoken advice to the general public is, "Bend over and squeel like pigs".
Youknow for a cost of 10K$ per head the citizens should expect a bit more from
their government.

Rocky

This topic, regardless of the OT prefix, is definitely OFF TOPIC in this forum.

Please take this discussion offline or to the proper forum where it will be
welcome.

Thank you.

OK, Julie, bring up some really interesting electronic design topic,
and we'll discuss the hell out of it.

I'm trying to figure out how to put a 200 ps, 200 volt gaussian pulse
into 2 ohms. Got any advice?

John

Jim Thompson · May 20, 2004

On Wed, 19 May 2004 22:13:17 -0700, Julie <julie@nospam.com> wrote:

[snip]

This topic, regardless of the OT prefix, is definitely OFF TOPIC in this forum.

Please take this discussion offline or to the proper forum where it will be
welcome.

Thank you.

480)460-2350 | |
| E-mail Address at Website Fax

John Larkin · May 20, 2004

On Thu, 20 May 2004 14:45:18 GMT, James Beck
<jim@reallykillersystems.com> wrote:

In article <20040519194048.19889.00001691@mb-m10.aol.com>,
rolavine@aol.com says...
Got to love the way this man takes responsibilty for things. His only response
to the high gas prices is asking congress to pass an energy bill based on some
ideas he submitted in 2001, during the height of the screwing that ENRON was
'republican enabled' to give this country.

Just remember that all of the DOT Bombs and cooked books were a result
of the false economy of the stock market created by an artificially
depressed interest rate perpetrated during the Clinton-Gore years.

Market bubbles are a recurring fact of history. What Clinton and
Greenspan failed to do was to warn everybody that it *was* a bubble.
Bill preferred to just take credit for it; if fact, he still does.

Greenspan should be shot as a traitor. It isn't genius to cut interest
rates everytime the stock market took a dip. All it has accomplished is
making it unviable to put money anywhere other than the stock market if
you expect a return.

Interest rates would have had to be 300% to keep people away from
PETS.COM and Webvan and Enron. Too many people are thrilled by the
gamble, too.

Read "Extraordinary Popular Delusions and the Madness of Crowds." All
this was old news in 1841.

John

Scott Stephens · May 20, 2004

John Larkin wrote:

On Thu, 20 May 2004 04:28:26 GMT, Scott Stephens <scottxs@comcast.net
wrote:

There are a billion Chinese who want

cars, another billion in India, and a few more bil around the world
who want to be middle-class, and that means having heat and
electricity and transportation.

Is their desire, even their need, an obligation on me, my talent, time,
or treasure?

It certainly should be. As a practical matter, it sure is. The Saudis
and the Russians sell oil to the high bidder.

I don't follow. Your first argument seem to imply you thought the
Chinese, and developing world in general, was entitled to some kind of
poverty-subsidy, like they Kyoto Accords would give them, under the
deluded guise of preventing the fictitious Global Warming.

I'm not complaining about higher energy costs due to Chinese
competition, although I don't see how they are much less worthy of
economic sanctions against their evil political regime than Iraq.

I'm complaining about such American foolishness as "boutique fuel", and
other environmental nonsense that is an artificial tariff on American
fuel, by the Boleshevic-Globalist-Socialist-Enviro-Nazis.

Would they know what to do with gas, oil, electricity or
engines without an American to sell them the appliance, teach them how
to use and maintain it?

That's funny. The Chinese now sell *us* the appliances.

Very true. Again, I thought you were talking about alms for the poor.
America has sold and exported to the Chinese much of our manufacturing
base. They make the appliances we have sold them the machinery,
computers, software and know-how to make. Its no wonder. Duh!

--
Scott

**********************************

DIY Piezo-Gyro, PCB Drill Bot & More Soon!

http://home.comcast.net/~scottxs/

**********************************

Scott Stephens · May 20, 2004

Spehro Pefhany wrote:

Whoah! It's not 1975 anymore. You need to revise your ideas about
China. It's not all grey and blue Mao jackets and bicycles anymore.

I am aware. My points are:

1. Excusing mis-management by comparing it to worse mis-management is
sick, stupid and crazy. But very common among stupid, dumb-down,
brainwashed peasants.

2. The relative poverty of my neighbor is not an obligation for me to
supply charity by working for them. If I am stingy when I could easily
be generous, shame on me. But if I give money to communists that oppress
peasants, murder dissidents and sell their body organs, when much of
their problems are due to mis-management, shame on me too.

3. The west isn't ahead of the east because its peasants complacently
excused their misery to the misery of their neighbors. No, European
peasants fled, many ending up in America, where they could live and work
for themselves, rather than their princes and governments.

China may well out-do us. There are some things to be said about the
ability of dictatorships and oppressive governments to get things done.

But do you find more Chinese fleeing to America, or more Americans
fleeing to China?

I want the cheapest gas I can enjoy, not the most expense gas I will
tolerate. And to the extent the fed-thugs have intervened in the market
at tax-payer expense, to the extent Prince Shrub parties with the Saudi
royal family and the Bin Ladden's, to the extent I blame fed-thugs when
the price of fuel goes up.

--
Scott

**********************************

DIY Piezo-Gyro, PCB Drill Bot & More Soon!

http://home.comcast.net/~scottxs/

**********************************

Jim Thompson · May 20, 2004

On Thu, 20 May 2004 08:00:02 -0700, John Larkin
<jjlarkin@highlandSNIPtechTHISnologyPLEASE.com> wrote:

[snip]

This topic, regardless of the OT prefix, is definitely OFF TOPIC in this forum.

Please take this discussion offline or to the proper forum where it will be
welcome.

Thank you.

OK, Julie, bring up some really interesting electronic design topic,
and we'll discuss the hell out of it.

I'm trying to figure out how to put a 200 ps, 200 volt gaussian pulse
into 2 ohms. Got any advice?

John

480)460-2350 | |
| E-mail Address at Website Fax

James Beck · May 20, 2004

In article <c8jpa0doidjo5fppoonagg32sjurv55re2@4ax.com>,
jjlarkin@highlandSNIPtechTHISnologyPLEASE.com says...

On Thu, 20 May 2004 14:45:18 GMT, James Beck
jim@reallykillersystems.com> wrote:

In article <20040519194048.19889.00001691@mb-m10.aol.com>,
rolavine@aol.com says...
Got to love the way this man takes responsibilty for things. His only response
to the high gas prices is asking congress to pass an energy bill based on some
ideas he submitted in 2001, during the height of the screwing that ENRON was
'republican enabled' to give this country.

Just remember that all of the DOT Bombs and cooked books were a result
of the false economy of the stock market created by an artificially
depressed interest rate perpetrated during the Clinton-Gore years.

Market bubbles are a recurring fact of history. What Clinton and
Greenspan failed to do was to warn everybody that it *was* a bubble.
Bill preferred to just take credit for it; if fact, he still does.
Yes, but this was a government manufactured bubble.

Greenspan should be shot as a traitor. It isn't genius to cut interest
rates everytime the stock market took a dip. All it has accomplished is
making it unviable to put money anywhere other than the stock market if
you expect a return.

Interest rates would have had to be 300% to keep people away from
PETS.COM and Webvan and Enron. Too many people are thrilled by the
gamble, too.
Especially when their nice and safe savings account is netting 1% due to

Greenspan cutting interest rates EVERYTIME the stock market took a dip.
The stock market would not have been so over inflated had the interest
rates not been so low. Simple as that.

Read "Extraordinary Popular Delusions and the Madness of Crowds." All
this was old news in 1841.

John

John Devereux · May 20, 2004

John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandSNIPtechTHISnologyPLEASE.com> writes:

OK, Julie, bring up some really interesting electronic design topic,
and we'll discuss the hell out of it.

This question is Off Topic for an Off Topic Thread. Then again I guess
that makes it on topic. But then it would be off-topic again. Hmmm.

I'm trying to figure out how to put a 200 ps, 200 volt gaussian pulse
into 2 ohms. Got any advice?

Avalanche breakdown? Followed by some clever pulse forming network I
expect

--

John Devereux

Winfield Hill · May 20, 2004

John Larkin wrote...

I'm trying to figure out how to put a 200 ps, 200 volt
gaussian pulse into 2 ohms. Got any advice?

A 2ps 200V pulse into 2 ohms? That's easy, use ohms law.
Make a 100A 2ps gaussian pulse and you'll be all set.

Thanks,
- Win

(email: use hill_at_rowland-dot-org for now)

John Larkin · May 20, 2004

On Thu, 20 May 2004 15:46:02 GMT, James Beck
<jim@reallykillersystems.com> wrote:

Market bubbles are a recurring fact of history. What Clinton and
Greenspan failed to do was to warn everybody that it *was* a bubble.
Bill preferred to just take credit for it; if fact, he still does.

Yes, but this was a government manufactured bubble.

Only in the sense that the government invented the Internet, and that
the market regulators should have come down hard on the corrupt
brokerage industry (which would have taken more political will than
could be found inside the entire beltway.)

Read "Extraordinary Popular Delusions and the Madness of Crowds."
Panics and bubbles and fashion are the results of collective behavior,
and seldom any-in-particular's fault.

John

Spehro Pefhany · May 20, 2004

On Thu, 20 May 2004 15:30:46 GMT, the renowned Scott Stephens
<scottxs@comcast.net> wrote:

Very true. Again, I thought you were talking about alms for the poor.
America has sold and exported to the Chinese much of our manufacturing
base. They make the appliances we have sold them the machinery,
computers, software and know-how to make. Its no wonder. Duh!

Not even "sold" the know-how etc. It was sort of given (as investment)
in exchange for access to their rapidly growing market and cheap labor
(to keep shareholders happy). And much of the machinery, parts and
materials is domestic or comes from Japan, Taiwan and Europe- I know a
guy who's sold literally hundreds of the huge multi-spindle Excellon
style PCB CNC drilling rigs to China (made in Germany, he's based in
Taipei). The PCBs may end up in Happy Meal LCD games, but there is
very little non-Asian content that I can see in such products other
than the brand names.

Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany
--
"it's the network..." "The Journey is the reward"
speff@interlog.com Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com
Embedded software/hardware/analog Info for designers: http://www.speff.com

Rolavine · May 20, 2004

Bush blames others for high oil prices
From: James Beck jim@reallykillersystems.com
Date: 5/20/2004 7:45 AM Pacific Daylight Time
Message-id: <MPG.1b168e8fa34cd2af98998b@news.east.earthlink.net

In article <20040519194048.19889.00001691@mb-m10.aol.com>,
rolavine@aol.com says...
Got to love the way this man takes responsibilty for things. His only
response
to the high gas prices is asking congress to pass an energy bill based on
some
ideas he submitted in 2001, during the height of the screwing that ENRON
was
'republican enabled' to give this country.

Just remember that all of the DOT Bombs and cooked books were a result
of the false economy of the stock market created by an artificially
depressed interest rate perpetrated during the Clinton-Gore years.
Greenspan should be shot as a traitor. It isn't genius to cut interest
rates everytime the stock market took a dip. All it has accomplished is
making it unviable to put money anywhere other than the stock market if
you expect a return.

The Fed did that because there was not a lot of inflation, that is their
mantra! It was not a conspiracy, the Clinton-Gore Years had genuine economic
growth. Now you say the economic conditions that existed were the reason that
corporate crooks took advantage of the system. Crooks don't need any other
excuse but greed, there has never been a time when cooking books did not have
value.

Rocky

Rocky

Jim Thompson · May 20, 2004

On 20 May 2004 09:33:12 -0700, Winfield Hill
<Winfield_member@newsguy.com> wrote:

John Larkin wrote...

I'm trying to figure out how to put a 200 ps, 200 volt
gaussian pulse into 2 ohms. Got any advice?

A 2ps 200V pulse into 2 ohms? That's easy, use ohms law.
Make a 100A 2ps gaussian pulse and you'll be all set.

Thanks,
- Win

(email: use hill_at_rowland-dot-org for now)

ROTFLMAO!

(Shouldn't the "[OT]" have been removed from this post? It is, after
all, an electronics *design* problem

480)460-2350 | |
| E-mail Address at Website Fax

John Larkin · May 20, 2004

On 20 May 2004 09:33:12 -0700, Winfield Hill
<Winfield_member@newsguy.com> wrote:

John Larkin wrote...

I'm trying to figure out how to put a 200 ps, 200 volt
gaussian pulse into 2 ohms. Got any advice?

A 2ps 200V pulse into 2 ohms? That's easy, use ohms law.
Make a 100A 2ps gaussian pulse and you'll be all set.

That was 200 ps Win. Even I'm not crazy enough to try for 2!

We might go for 400 volts into 8 ohms, and use a tapered line, but
that's kinda bulky for the gadget we have in mind. A shock line would
be fun, but most diodes are fully depleted at pretty low voltages.

But today, I'm still working on this 30 KHz amplifier...

John

Jim Thompson · May 20, 2004

On Thu, 20 May 2004 10:05:49 -0700, John Larkin
<jjlarkin@highSNIPlandTHIStechPLEASEnology.com> wrote:

On 20 May 2004 09:33:12 -0700, Winfield Hill
Winfield_member@newsguy.com> wrote:

John Larkin wrote...

I'm trying to figure out how to put a 200 ps, 200 volt
gaussian pulse into 2 ohms. Got any advice?

A 2ps 200V pulse into 2 ohms? That's easy, use ohms law.
Make a 100A 2ps gaussian pulse and you'll be all set.

That was 200 ps Win. Even I'm not crazy enough to try for 2!

We might go for 400 volts into 8 ohms, and use a tapered line, but
that's kinda bulky for the gadget we have in mind. A shock line would
be fun, but most diodes are fully depleted at pretty low voltages.

But today, I'm still working on this 30 KHz amplifier...

John

480)460-2350 | |
| E-mail Address at Website Fax

Winfield Hill · May 20, 2004

John Larkin wrote...

Winfield Hill wrote:

John Larkin wrote...

I'm trying to figure out how to put a 200 ps, 200 volt
gaussian pulse into 2 ohms. Got any advice?

A 2ps 200V pulse into 2 ohms? That's easy, use ohms law.
Make a 100A 2ps gaussian pulse and you'll be all set.

That was 200ps Win. Even I'm not crazy enough to try for 2!

Right. Details, details. I gave you half of it, you have
to do the other half! :&gt

Thanks,
- Win

(email: use hill_at_rowland-dot-org for now)

Rolavine · May 20, 2004

From: rolavine@aol.com (Rolavine)

snip

OK, that wasn't good enough so here are a few facts, the % of tax in gasoline
prices are 76% in the UK, 74% in France, and 73% in Germany, while the
percentage of tax in the US is 29%.

Here is my source for this information.
http://www.gaspricewatch.com/gastaxes.asp

This is why a comparison to gas prices in Europe is a meaningless gesture
within this context.

If you don't mind I'd like to take this a step further. It is very hard to talk
about the tax burden of citizens of different countries. However from
information at this site:

http://answers.google.com/answers/threadview?id=332116

it seems the average wage earner in each country in 2001 paid, 30% in taxes in
the US, 29.7% in the UK, 48.2% in France, and 50.7% in Germany. I think all of
the European countries get some form of socialized medicine thrown is, so not
such a bad deal at all.

Of course, this simplistic measurement fails to take into consideration
differences in the average wage, but it does include gas taxes. So, my claim is
that even though Europeans pay very high gas taxes, their overall rate of
taxation is not out of line with what we pay in the US, even though we have
lower gas taxes. This is simply saying US governments get their money in other
ways.

So, once again, I don't see anything wrong with expecting our President to try
and do something about gas prices, or even start an investigation into why the
prices are going up?

Instead we get, I don't have time to find the exact quote ' If congress had
passed my 2001 energy bill we would not be in this situation today'.

Wow, is this guy our President or the king of the spoiled brats?

By the way it should come as no surprise to anyone that Bush's 100 point energy
proposal (not a bill at all) included huge giveaways to oil corporations. It
was too foul for even our sell out congress to pass it.

Rocky

Richard Henry · May 20, 2004

"Rich Grise" <null@example.net> wrote in message
news:AC6rc.8326$r6.8185@nwrddc03.gnilink.net...

What would it take to splice a gene into something like blue-green algae,
to make it produce something like heptane/octane?

Do you know of a gene on any existing organism that can produce
heptane/octane?

[OT] Bush blames others for high oil prices

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