Nuisance fastners - winge

[Sylvia Else]

I had occasion to dismantle a cheap pedestal fan the other day (Coles
Home Collection). It hadn't failed, but I wanted to see how it was wired
up (that's another story).

The cover to the button panel was held in place by four screws which
were identical except that two were philips head type, and the other two
had a triangular socket in the head.

I have bits to cope with most things I've encountered, but not those.
What's the point? Are they worried about competition for repairing these
$10 fans?

Do consumers regularly electrocute themselves by taking fans apart
without knowing what they're doing?

Sylvia.

 

[Alan]

On Wed, 09 Feb 2011 22:29:35 +1100, Sylvia Else
<sylvia@not.here.invalid> wrote:

I had occasion to dismantle a cheap pedestal fan the other day (Coles
Home Collection). It hadn't failed, but I wanted to see how it was wired
up (that's another story).

The cover to the button panel was held in place by four screws which
were identical except that two were philips head type, and the other two
had a triangular socket in the head.

I have bits to cope with most things I've encountered, but not those.
What's the point? Are they worried about competition for repairing these
$10 fans?

Do consumers regularly electrocute themselves by taking fans apart
without knowing what they're doing?

Sylvia.
I just used a small flat blade screwdriver to remove them. Got to be

the right size though to jam along one flat of the triangle.


--
Sell your surplus electronic components at
http://ozcomponents.com
Search or browse for that IC, capacitor,
crystal or other component you need.
Or find new components at http://auscomponents.com

 

[Sylvia Else]

On 9/02/2011 11:23 PM, Alan wrote:

On Wed, 09 Feb 2011 22:29:35 +1100, Sylvia Else
sylvia@not.here.invalid> wrote:

I had occasion to dismantle a cheap pedestal fan the other day (Coles
Home Collection). It hadn't failed, but I wanted to see how it was wired
up (that's another story).

The cover to the button panel was held in place by four screws which
were identical except that two were philips head type, and the other two
had a triangular socket in the head.

I have bits to cope with most things I've encountered, but not those.
What's the point? Are they worried about competition for repairing these
$10 fans?

Do consumers regularly electrocute themselves by taking fans apart
without knowing what they're doing?

Sylvia.
I just used a small flat blade screwdriver to remove them. Got to be
the right size though to jam along one flat of the triangle.

Well, I got one of them undone using a tri-wing bit, but stripped the
other attempting to do the same thing. However, I managed to see what I
wanted to see.

<http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/e9/Screw_Head_-_Tri-wing.svg/40px-Screw_Head_-_Tri-wing.svg.png>

Sylvia.

--
Sell your surplus electronic components at
http://ozcomponents.com
Search or browse for that IC, capacitor,
crystal or other component you need.
Or find new components at http://auscomponents.com

 

[fritz]

"Sylvia Else" <sylvia@not.here.invalid> wrote in message news:8rfg0eFnguU1@mid.individual.net...

On 9/02/2011 11:23 PM, Alan wrote:
On Wed, 09 Feb 2011 22:29:35 +1100, Sylvia Else
sylvia@not.here.invalid> wrote:

I had occasion to dismantle a cheap pedestal fan the other day (Coles
Home Collection). It hadn't failed, but I wanted to see how it was wired
up (that's another story).

The cover to the button panel was held in place by four screws which
were identical except that two were philips head type, and the other two
had a triangular socket in the head.

I have bits to cope with most things I've encountered, but not those.
What's the point? Are they worried about competition for repairing these
$10 fans?

Do consumers regularly electrocute themselves by taking fans apart
without knowing what they're doing?

Sylvia.
I just used a small flat blade screwdriver to remove them. Got to be
the right size though to jam along one flat of the triangle.

Well, I got one of them undone using a tri-wing bit, but stripped the other attempting to do the same thing. However, I managed to
see what I wanted to see.

Which was ?
Is there a point to this thread apart from the type of screw you couldn't screw ?

 

[atec77]

On 10/02/2011 2:05 AM, fritz wrote:

Which was ?
Is there a point to this thread apart from the type of screw you couldn't screw ?

The point is stupid is as stupid does (syliva)

the screws are the manufactures way of saying no user serviceable
parts do not open

--
X-No-Archive: Yes

 

[Jeffrey Angus]

On 2/9/2011 5:29 AM, Sylvia Else wrote:

Do consumers regularly electrocute themselves by taking fans apart
without knowing what they're doing?

I'm reminded of an old Rodriguez cartoon in Popular Electronics.

First panel: On a large speaker cabinet. "to prevent shock do not
remove cover"

Second panel: Owner taking out a LOT of screws.

Third panel: Owner on floor clutching chest. Inside of huge cabinet
has 2" transistor radio speaker inside.

Jeff

 

[Michael A. Terrell]

atec77 wrote:

On 10/02/2011 2:05 AM, fritz wrote:


Which was ?
Is there a point to this thread apart from the type of screw you couldn't screw ?

The point is stupid is as stupid does (syliva)
the screws are the manufactures way of saying no user serviceable
parts do not open

It is their lawyer's way of attempting to avoid lawsuits.


--
You can't fix stupid. You can't even put a band-aid on it, because it's
Teflon coated.

 

[kreed]

On Feb 9, 10:35 pm, Sylvia Else <syl...@not.here.invalid> wrote:

On 9/02/2011 11:23 PM, Alan wrote:



On Wed, 09 Feb 2011 22:29:35 +1100, Sylvia Else
syl...@not.here.invalid>  wrote:

I had occasion to dismantle a cheap pedestal fan the other day (Coles
Home Collection). It hadn't failed, but I wanted to see how it was wired
up (that's another story).

The cover to the button panel was held in place by four screws which
were identical except that two were philips head type, and the other two
had a triangular socket in the head.

I have bits to cope with most things I've encountered, but not those.
What's the point? Are they worried about competition for repairing these
$10 fans?

Do consumers regularly electrocute themselves by taking fans apart
without knowing what they're doing?

Sylvia.
I just used a small flat blade screwdriver to remove them. Got to be
the right size though to jam along one flat of the triangle.

Well, I got one of them undone using a tri-wing bit, but stripped the
other attempting to do the same thing. However, I managed to see what I
wanted to see.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/e9/Screw_Head_-...

Sylvia.



--
Sell your surplus electronic components at
http://ozcomponents.com
Search or browse for that IC, capacitor,
crystal or other component you need.
Or find new components athttp://auscomponents.com

And how was it wired up ?

 

[Metro]

"Sylvia Else" <sylvia@not.here.invalid> wrote in message
news:8rfc4qFt5gU1@mid.individual.net...

I had occasion to dismantle a cheap pedestal fan the other day (Coles Home
Collection). It hadn't failed, but I wanted to see how it was wired up
(that's another story).

The cover to the button panel was held in place by four screws which were
identical except that two were philips head type, and the other two had a
triangular socket in the head.

I have bits to cope with most things I've encountered, but not those.
What's the point? Are they worried about competition for repairing these
$10 fans?

Do consumers regularly electrocute themselves by taking fans apart without
knowing what they're doing?

Sylvia.

They are only a tamperproof head of which there are various and easily

available.. Wait until you come across a coffin head screw.I believe the
reason for using them is that some countries prevent the dismantle of an
appliance without the use of a tool or special tool so this way all fields
are covered in one assembly. Did you find out how it worked. They are made
to break. Best way to keep them longer is to keep the Blades clean and
lubricate the bearings NOT with WD40 or the like.

Metro

 

[Sylvia Else]

On 10/02/2011 10:08 AM, kreed wrote:

On Feb 9, 10:35 pm, Sylvia Else<syl...@not.here.invalid> wrote:
On 9/02/2011 11:23 PM, Alan wrote:



On Wed, 09 Feb 2011 22:29:35 +1100, Sylvia Else
syl...@not.here.invalid> wrote:

I had occasion to dismantle a cheap pedestal fan the other day (Coles
Home Collection). It hadn't failed, but I wanted to see how it was wired
up (that's another story).

The cover to the button panel was held in place by four screws which
were identical except that two were philips head type, and the other two
had a triangular socket in the head.

I have bits to cope with most things I've encountered, but not those.
What's the point? Are they worried about competition for repairing these
$10 fans?

Do consumers regularly electrocute themselves by taking fans apart
without knowing what they're doing?

Sylvia.
I just used a small flat blade screwdriver to remove them. Got to be
the right size though to jam along one flat of the triangle.

Well, I got one of them undone using a tri-wing bit, but stripped the
other attempting to do the same thing. However, I managed to see what I
wanted to see.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/e9/Screw_Head_-...

Sylvia.



--
Sell your surplus electronic components at
http://ozcomponents.com
Search or browse for that IC, capacitor,
crystal or other component you need.
Or find new components athttp://auscomponents.com

And how was it wired up ?

In a particular way.

Sylvia.

 

[Sylvia Else]

On 10/02/2011 11:23 AM, Metro wrote:

"Sylvia Else"<sylvia@not.here.invalid> wrote in message
news:8rfc4qFt5gU1@mid.individual.net...
I had occasion to dismantle a cheap pedestal fan the other day (Coles Home
Collection). It hadn't failed, but I wanted to see how it was wired up
(that's another story).

The cover to the button panel was held in place by four screws which were
identical except that two were philips head type, and the other two had a
triangular socket in the head.

I have bits to cope with most things I've encountered, but not those.
What's the point? Are they worried about competition for repairing these
$10 fans?

Do consumers regularly electrocute themselves by taking fans apart without
knowing what they're doing?

Sylvia.

They are only a tamperproof head of which there are various and easily
available.. Wait until you come across a coffin head screw.I believe the
reason for using them is that some countries prevent the dismantle of an
appliance without the use of a tool or special tool so this way all fields
are covered in one assembly. Did you find out how it worked. They are made
to break. Best way to keep them longer is to keep the Blades clean and
lubricate the bearings NOT with WD40 or the like.

As I said, it hadn't broken. I was actually trying to figure out which
wire was which leading to the induction motor. I had in mind making it
run backwards. Aerofoils don't perform as well backwards, but they do
perform. However, on further consideration I realised that the fan
blades would be aerodynamically stalled if the fan ran backwards, with
the result that it would probably not work much at all.

Sylvia.

 

[Sylvia Else]

On 10/02/2011 3:05 AM, fritz wrote:

Which was ?
Is there a point to this thread apart from the type of screw you couldn't screw ?

Not really. The word "winge" in the subject line should have hinted at that.

Sylvia.

 

[ian field]

"Michael A. Terrell" <mike.terrell@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:kImdnUysPJTguc7QnZ2dnUVZ_tGdnZ2d@earthlink.com...

atec77 wrote:

On 10/02/2011 2:05 AM, fritz wrote:


Which was ?
Is there a point to this thread apart from the type of screw you
couldn't screw ?

The point is stupid is as stupid does (syliva)
the screws are the manufactures way of saying no user serviceable
parts do not open


It is their lawyer's way of attempting to avoid lawsuits.

Did it work?

 

[ian field]

"Sylvia Else" <sylvia@not.here.invalid> wrote in message
news:8rgq9dFodeU1@mid.individual.net...

On 10/02/2011 11:23 AM, Metro wrote:
"Sylvia Else"<sylvia@not.here.invalid> wrote in message
news:8rfc4qFt5gU1@mid.individual.net...
I had occasion to dismantle a cheap pedestal fan the other day (Coles
Home
Collection). It hadn't failed, but I wanted to see how it was wired up
(that's another story).

The cover to the button panel was held in place by four screws which
were
identical except that two were philips head type, and the other two had
a
triangular socket in the head.

I have bits to cope with most things I've encountered, but not those.
What's the point? Are they worried about competition for repairing these
$10 fans?

Do consumers regularly electrocute themselves by taking fans apart
without
knowing what they're doing?

Sylvia.

They are only a tamperproof head of which there are various and easily
available.. Wait until you come across a coffin head screw.I believe the
reason for using them is that some countries prevent the dismantle of an
appliance without the use of a tool or special tool so this way all
fields
are covered in one assembly. Did you find out how it worked. They are
made
to break. Best way to keep them longer is to keep the Blades clean and
lubricate the bearings NOT with WD40 or the like.

As I said, it hadn't broken. I was actually trying to figure out which
wire was which leading to the induction motor. I had in mind making it run
backwards. Aerofoils don't perform as well backwards, but they do perform.
However, on further consideration I realised that the fan blades would be
aerodynamically stalled if the fan ran backwards, with the result that it
would probably not work much at all.

If the fan is symetrical - snap off pairs of opposing blades.

Doesn't matter if there's only 6 to start with - some helicopters have
"scissor" tail rotors.

 

[Michael A. Terrell]

ian field wrote:

"Michael A. Terrell" ?mike.terrell@earthlink.net? wrote in message
news:kImdnUysPJTguc7QnZ2dnUVZ_tGdnZ2d@earthlink.com...
?
? atec77 wrote:
??
?? On 10/02/2011 2:05 AM, fritz wrote:
?? ?
?? ?
?? ? Which was ?
?? ? Is there a point to this thread apart from the type of screw you
?? ? couldn't screw ?
?? ?
?? The point is stupid is as stupid does (syliva)
?? the screws are the manufactures way of saying no user serviceable
?? parts do not open
?
?
? It is their lawyer's way of attempting to avoid lawsuits.

Did it work?

Did you sue them?


--
You can't fix stupid. You can't even put a band-aid on it, because it's
Teflon coated.

 

[Sylvia Else]

On 11/02/2011 8:11 AM, ian field wrote:

"Sylvia Else"<sylvia@not.here.invalid> wrote in message
news:8rgq9dFodeU1@mid.individual.net...
On 10/02/2011 11:23 AM, Metro wrote:
"Sylvia Else"<sylvia@not.here.invalid> wrote in message
news:8rfc4qFt5gU1@mid.individual.net...
I had occasion to dismantle a cheap pedestal fan the other day (Coles
Home
Collection). It hadn't failed, but I wanted to see how it was wired up
(that's another story).

The cover to the button panel was held in place by four screws which
were
identical except that two were philips head type, and the other two had
a
triangular socket in the head.

I have bits to cope with most things I've encountered, but not those.
What's the point? Are they worried about competition for repairing these
$10 fans?

Do consumers regularly electrocute themselves by taking fans apart
without
knowing what they're doing?

Sylvia.

They are only a tamperproof head of which there are various and easily
available.. Wait until you come across a coffin head screw.I believe the
reason for using them is that some countries prevent the dismantle of an
appliance without the use of a tool or special tool so this way all
fields
are covered in one assembly. Did you find out how it worked. They are
made
to break. Best way to keep them longer is to keep the Blades clean and
lubricate the bearings NOT with WD40 or the like.

As I said, it hadn't broken. I was actually trying to figure out which
wire was which leading to the induction motor. I had in mind making it run
backwards. Aerofoils don't perform as well backwards, but they do perform.
However, on further consideration I realised that the fan blades would be
aerodynamically stalled if the fan ran backwards, with the result that it
would probably not work much at all.


If the fan is symetrical - snap off pairs of opposing blades.

That's not going to fix the problem of the blades being stalled.

What I would really need to do is fit the one-piece fan blade assembly
on back to front (as well as reversing the motor), but the fan blade
assembly is not designed to be attached the other way around.

Sylvia.

 

[Adrian Tuddenham]

Sylvia Else <sylvia@not.here.invalid> wrote:

What I would really need to do is fit the one-piece fan blade assembly
on back to front (as well as reversing the motor), but the fan blade
assembly is not designed to be attached the other way around.

If it is a shaded-pole induction motor, it will not be possible to run
it in reveres unless you dismantle the whole assembly and put the stator
in the other way around. It would be more effective to get a spare fan
boss and make new blades for it.

(I have made a shaded-pole gramophone motor run backwards, but I had to
completely rebuild it and add extra windings to make it work.)


--
~ Adrian Tuddenham ~
(Remove the ".invalid"s and add ".co.uk" to reply)
www.poppyrecords.co.uk

 

[Sylvia Else]

On 11/02/2011 11:37 PM, Adrian Tuddenham wrote:

Sylvia Else<sylvia@not.here.invalid> wrote:



What I would really need to do is fit the one-piece fan blade assembly
on back to front (as well as reversing the motor), but the fan blade
assembly is not designed to be attached the other way around.

If it is a shaded-pole induction motor, it will not be possible to run
it in reveres unless you dismantle the whole assembly and put the stator
in the other way around. It would be more effective to get a spare fan
boss and make new blades for it.

It's not shaded pole. It has two sets of windings perpendicular to each
other, and a capacitor which I believe is in series with one set of
windings.

Sylvia.

 

[Sylvia Else]

On 11/02/2011 11:56 PM, kreed wrote:

On Feb 11, 9:20 pm, Sylvia Else<syl...@not.here.invalid> wrote:
On 11/02/2011 8:11 AM, ian field wrote:



"Sylvia Else"<syl...@not.here.invalid> wrote in message
news:8rgq9dFodeU1@mid.individual.net...
On 10/02/2011 11:23 AM, Metro wrote:
"Sylvia Else"<syl...@not.here.invalid> wrote in message
news:8rfc4qFt5gU1@mid.individual.net...
I had occasion to dismantle a cheap pedestal fan the other day (Coles
Home
Collection). It hadn't failed, but I wanted to see how it was wired up
(that's another story).

The cover to the button panel was held in place by four screws which
were
identical except that two were philips head type, and the other two had
a
triangular socket in the head.

I have bits to cope with most things I've encountered, but not those.
What's the point? Are they worried about competition for repairing these
$10 fans?

Do consumers regularly electrocute themselves by taking fans apart
without
knowing what they're doing?

Sylvia.

They are only a tamperproof head of which there are various and easily
available.. Wait until you come across a coffin head screw.I believe the
reason for using them is that some countries prevent the dismantle of an
appliance without the use of a tool or special tool so this way all
fields
are covered in one assembly. Did you find out how it worked. They are
made
to break. Best way to keep them longer is to keep the Blades clean and
lubricate the bearings NOT with WD40 or the like.

As I said, it hadn't broken. I was actually trying to figure out which
wire was which leading to the induction motor. I had in mind making it run
backwards. Aerofoils don't perform as well backwards, but they do perform.
However, on further consideration I realised that the fan blades would be
aerodynamically stalled if the fan ran backwards, with the result that it
would probably not work much at all.

If the fan is symetrical - snap off pairs of opposing blades.

That's not going to fix the problem of the blades being stalled.

What I would really need to do is fit the one-piece fan blade assembly
on back to front (as well as reversing the motor), but the fan blade
assembly is not designed to be attached the other way around.

Sylvia.

Might sound silly, but cant the entire fan head (including motor) be
rotated 180 degrees, or do you want the
air intake without the motor in the way ?

The application is to suck cool air in through an open window at night.
During the recent heat wave, it was noticeable that even though the
temperature outside drops at night, the temperature of the house doesn't
drop that much. The problem is lack of air flow.

A conventional pedestal fan blows in such a direction that when it's
placed as near as possible to a window, the fan blades are still quite a
way from the cool air, and so the result is not as effective as it might
be. If I could reverse the direction of flow, then I could also turn
then fan around, so that the blades would be much closer to the window.

I considered simply building a duct, but the cost of materials was
excessive.

I'm thinking of using box fans instead.

Sylvia.

 

[Adrian Tuddenham]

Sylvia Else <sylvia@not.here.invalid> wrote:

On 11/02/2011 11:37 PM, Adrian Tuddenham wrote:
Sylvia Else<sylvia@not.here.invalid> wrote:



What I would really need to do is fit the one-piece fan blade assembly
on back to front (as well as reversing the motor), but the fan blade
assembly is not designed to be attached the other way around.

If it is a shaded-pole induction motor, it will not be possible to run
it in reveres unless you dismantle the whole assembly and put the stator
in the other way around. It would be more effective to get a spare fan
boss and make new blades for it.

It's not shaded pole. It has two sets of windings perpendicular to each
other, and a capacitor which I believe is in series with one set of
windings.

In that case it ought to be reversible - but I would still consider
making a replacement fan if you want a reasonably efficient reversed
airflow..


--
~ Adrian Tuddenham ~
(Remove the ".invalid"s and add ".co.uk" to reply)
www.poppyrecords.co.uk