Kerry or Bush

[John Larkin]

On Tue, 19 Oct 2004 18:45:58 GMT, Rich Grise <rich@example.net> wrote:

On Tue, 19 Oct 2004 14:29:11 +0000, Fred Bloggs wrote:
John Larkin wrote:

I've been suggesting what I thought were interesting questions for
some time about social evolution and system dynamics and historical
forces, and hardly anybody wants to think about what's really
happening, or why;


You're a FUCKING LIAR!- a goddamned pseudo-intellectual fake. You know
absolutely nothing about anything outside your GEEK specialty. Your
presence is nothing but an aggravating and arrogant wise-ass
closet-queen, good-for-nothing ignorant p.o.s. and scum.

Fred, wake up. He's got you right in the palm of his hand, and he's
playing you like a rainbow trout.

Yeah, I guess that's not nice, so I'll quit. I wouldn't want anybody
to have a blowout on my account. Catch and release.

John

 

[Bob Stephens]

On Tue, 19 Oct 2004 14:01:57 -0700, John Larkin wrote:

On Tue, 19 Oct 2004 18:45:58 GMT, Rich Grise <rich@example.net> wrote:

On Tue, 19 Oct 2004 14:29:11 +0000, Fred Bloggs wrote:
John Larkin wrote:

I've been suggesting what I thought were interesting questions for
some time about social evolution and system dynamics and historical
forces, and hardly anybody wants to think about what's really
happening, or why;


You're a FUCKING LIAR!- a goddamned pseudo-intellectual fake. You know
absolutely nothing about anything outside your GEEK specialty. Your
presence is nothing but an aggravating and arrogant wise-ass
closet-queen, good-for-nothing ignorant p.o.s. and scum.

Fred, wake up. He's got you right in the palm of his hand, and he's
playing you like a rainbow trout.


Yeah, I guess that's not nice, so I'll quit. I wouldn't want anybody
to have a blowout on my account. Catch and release.

John

I thought it was catch, *Fillet*, and release...
http://www.lewrockwell.com/fontova/fontova23.html

 

[James Arthur]

On 10/15/04 John Larkin jjlarkin@highlandSNIPtechTHISnologyPLEASE.com wrote:

Speaking of electronics (is that allowed?) I have a nasty problem. I
use an LC oscillator in my delay generators; when we get a trigger, we
start the osc running at 50 MHz and use that to time delays in 20 ns
steps, with a little analog ramp afterwards for the fine (picosecond)
bits. The oscillator is coarse tuned with a ceramic piston cap, and
fine-tuned with a varicap, so we can phase-lock it to a crystal for
long-delay accuracy. The vco pull range is +-2500 PPM, which seemed
good at the time.

But just lately, some, too many, units are losing lock. It appears
that they are humidity sensitive on a very slow (weeks/months) time
scale, with high humidity pulling down the frequency. I did find some
defluxing gunk in some of the piston caps, from the boad cleaning
operation, and that added a nasty positive capacitance-humidity effect
to tha cap. But with clean caps, there's still a problem.

John,
Can you be sure it's the capacitors rather than the inductors
that are changing?

Building a separate oscillator for torture-testing might be instructive.

Alternatively, tacking an extra capacitance onto the tank, measuring
oscillator frequency before & after, then solving the simultaneous
equations would reveal which component is changing, & by how much.

--James Arthur

 

[Winfield Hill]

John Larkin wrote...

Win is a serious disappointment re professionalism.

I'm disappointed to see you say that.


--
Thanks,
- Win

(email: use hill_at_rowland-dotties-org for now)

 

[John Larkin]

On 20 Oct 2004 02:17:29 -0700, bill.sloman@ieee.org (Bill Sloman)
wrote:

John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandSNIPtechTHISnologyPLEASE.com> wrote in message news:<gbl7n018cce850oqt8k9j0d43fhs9json8@4ax.com>...
On 18 Oct 2004 03:14:05 -0700, Winfield Hill
Winfield_member@newsguy.com> wrote:

Bill Sloman wrote...

I've been exercisng massive self-restraint when it comes
to commenting on John S. Dyson's repeated idiocies ...

I'd rather you didn't, join the fray.


Why do they call this a "discussion" group? It's more of a sophomoric
name-calling group lately. That's a shame, as the world is changing
and there are fascinating things going on, things worthy of serious
analysis, and nobody seems interested in much except flinging coarse
insults. I sure hope you guys don't do electronic design this way.

Logical arguement and subtle insults are wasted on John S. Dyson and
his ilk. A coarse insult signifies disagreement in a way that even the
most fatuous right-winger can understand, and any further intellectual
investment is wasted.

A coarse insult says that the writer is coarse; it says nothing about
the target. And it certainly will not be something anyone will
"understand." "Logical argument" is just what's not presented.

I am, I presume, one of the "fatuous right-wingers" on whom your
"intellectual investment is wasted." Fine; save yourself some time.

When I'm doing electronic design I don't waste time elaborating
circuits with refinements that don't give any perceptible performance
advantage, and I'd be surprised if you did.

Of course I do. It's fun, and you learn stuff. I love designing, or at
least thinking about, absurd circuits and mechanisms. Lots of
engineers and programmers feel uncomfortable in the early stages of a
design, when things are undefined and fluid, so they seize on the
first feasible architecture (often not their own!) and get down to the
details of implementing what may well be a bad approach, and they very
deliberately don't look back, no matter what. A lottle loose and silly
thinking on the front end could often lead to a much better result.

If you do want to exercise your intellect on an interesting
geo-political problem, you might like to think about the current price
of oil, and the prospect that we have moved into an era when supply is
beginning to fall behind demand as the Chinese burn more and more of
the stuff. Effectively, all this ought to do is jack up the price to
the point where it is worth extracting oil from tar shales, but a lot
of capital has to invested in extraction plant before the market can
settle down again.

All that is inevitable... not much to discuss, except what we'll do
with all those parked SUVs that nobody can afford to tank up. Use them
to house the homeless? Grow mushrooms? Store unused workout equipment?
But I spend about three times as much on cafe lattes as I do on gas,
because I drive a small car non-insanely, so it's not a personal
concern.


John

 

[Reg Edwards]

When I'm doing electronic design I don't waste time elaborating
circuits with refinements that don't give any perceptible performance
advantage,
-------
Bill Sloman, Nijmegen
===============================

"Redundancy, unless intentional, must be absent. All components must serve a
clearly recognisable purpose."

Extract from Designers' Guidlines in the Equipment Reliability section I
wrote as Chief Standards Engineer 20 years back.

 

[Spehro Pefhany]

On 20 Oct 2004 02:17:29 -0700, the renowned bill.sloman@ieee.org (Bill
Sloman) wrote:

When I'm doing electronic design I don't waste time elaborating
circuits with refinements that don't give any perceptible performance
advantage, and I'd be surprised if you did.

Many of Fred's insults are quite well crafted, and thus entertaining,
if you're not the target. "Maggot swivel-chair operator", for example.
;-)

I propose "lumpenproletariat" as a useful addition.


Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany
--
"it's the network..." "The Journey is the reward"
speff@interlog.com Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com
Embedded software/hardware/analog Info for designers: http://www.speff.com

 

[Rich Grise]

On Wed, 20 Oct 2004 13:12:13 -0400, Spehro Pefhany wrote:

On 20 Oct 2004 02:17:29 -0700, the renowned bill.sloman@ieee.org (Bill
Sloman) wrote:

When I'm doing electronic design I don't waste time elaborating
circuits with refinements that don't give any perceptible performance
advantage, and I'd be surprised if you did.

Many of Fred's insults are quite well crafted, and thus entertaining,
if you're not the target. "Maggot swivel-chair operator", for example.
;-)

I propose "lumpenproletariat" as a useful addition.

Are the proletariat really that much lumpier that the bourgeoisie?

Thanks,
Rich

 

[Rich Grise]

On Wed, 20 Oct 2004 03:41:08 -0700, Winfield Hill wrote:

John Larkin wrote...

Win is a serious disappointment re professionalism.

I'm disappointed to see you say that.

Somehow, hearing Larkin say that kind of stuff isn't the
disappointment to me that it would have been if he hadn't
turned out to be such a dork.

I think Win Hill is a freakin' paragon, meself.

Thanks,
Rich

 

[John Larkin]

On Wed, 20 Oct 2004 21:19:47 GMT, Rich Grise <rich@example.net> wrote:

Are the proletariat really that much lumpier that the bourgeoisie?

Thanks,
Rich

I think the females generally are.

John

 

[Ken Smith]

In article <cl6700$1mhv$1@news.iquest.net>,
John S. Dyson <toor@iquest.net> wrote:
[...]

Remember -- it is Kerry (and his supporters) doing the scare mongering.

When John Dyson starts a statement with word remember, it almost always
indicates that what follows is unsupported. It is a debating tactic where
he attempts to imply that the statement was documented earlier in the
discussion.

--
--
kensmith@rahul.net forging knowledge

 

[John Larkin]

On 21 Oct 2004 03:03:02 GMT, arthurj@aol.comet.net (James Arthur)
wrote:

Are you "my" James Arthur, friend-of-Dan, Altoids-box-oscillator guy?

John

Actually, I prefer "Curiously Strong oscillator guy," but yes,
one and the same.

Cheers,
--James

Long time no see! I hope things are going well. Don't hurry to
answer... little Lizzie (remember little Lizzie?) is a freshperson at
Cornell, so Mo and I are going for the Freshmen Parents/Impoverished
Sponsor weekend. Gotta pack...

I hope all these guys are nice while I'm gone.

John

 

[Fred Bloggs]

Dirk Bruere at Neopax wrote:

Fred Bloggs wrote:



Bill Sloman wrote:

John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandSNIPtechTHISnologyPLEASE.com> wrote in
message news:<gbl7n018cce850oqt8k9j0d43fhs9json8@4ax.com>...

On 18 Oct 2004 03:14:05 -0700, Winfield Hill
Winfield_member@newsguy.com> wrote:


Bill Sloman wrote...

I've been exercisng massive self-restraint when it comes
to commenting on John S. Dyson's repeated idiocies ...



I'd rather you didn't, join the fray.




Why do they call this a "discussion" group? It's more of a sophomoric
name-calling group lately. That's a shame, as the world is changing
and there are fascinating things going on, things worthy of serious
analysis, and nobody seems interested in much except flinging coarse
insults. I sure hope you guys don't do electronic design this way.




Logical arguement and subtle insults are wasted on John S. Dyson and
his ilk. A coarse insult signifies disagreement in a way that even the
most fatuous right-winger can understand, and any further intellectual
investment is wasted.

When I'm doing electronic design I don't waste time elaborating
circuits with refinements that don't give any perceptible performance
advantage, and I'd be surprised if you did.

If you do want to exercise your intellect on an interesting
geo-political problem, you might like to think about the current price
of oil, and the prospect that we have moved into an era when supply is
beginning to fall behind demand as the Chinese burn more and more of
the stuff. Effectively, all this ought to do is jack up the price to
the point where it is worth extracting oil from tar shales, but a lot
of capital has to invested in extraction plant before the market can
settle down again.

-------
Bill Sloman, Nijmegen



Exactly! It's a total waste of time responding to these people with
factual argument. A recent poll in Tennessee showed that over half the
supporters of both parties can't even get 1/5 of their candidate's
platform right. The US is a nation of the most ignorant and
self-serving scum in the world. You just take a look at these
disgusting wannabe professionals on this NG like Larkin, Seim,
Gathright, Durban, Sands, and so on, and what you see are a generation
of the most materialistic "takers" ever to leach off the American
system. People like this are not worth fighting for- don't even come
close to being something anyone should die for- their very large
social stratum has no representation in the military and has not for
about 60 years now. The present crop of scum in Republican leadership
know this, they know there is resentment and disaffection, and their
response runs the gamut from flagrant bribery with huge amounts of
money to outright intimidation and threats of prosecution. The US is
so corrupt that volunteerism and personal sacrifice are completely
dead and gone, it has been this way for 30 years or so now, and
rightfully so- who in their right mind would buy into the "patriotism"
fraud when you look at people like Bush and Cheney and their personal
record. From a moral constitution perspective, America is a rotted
shell of its former self- and this will soon become very well-known as
events maintain their present course.


Modern patriotism - lining their pockets with our lives.

Right- well the DoD is heading for a crisis- the ability to inform the
potential victims of this scam called patriotism is unprecedented. The
vast majority of people in America are self-serving, corrupt filth- this
is what needs to be made well-known. Then let the potential "volunteers"
decide if they should throw their lives away for a SHAM- an outright
SHAM! You just watch what happens if they try to reinstate a draft-
major violent protests and civil disobedience will be the certain
result. The US is heading for an implosion- way too much corruption.

 

[Spehro Pefhany]

On 22 Oct 2004 00:04:38 -0700, the renowned bill.sloman@ieee.org (Bill
Sloman) wrote:

Rich Grise <rich@example.net> wrote in message news:<pan.2004.10.20.21.22.57.168624@example.net>...
On Wed, 20 Oct 2004 13:12:13 -0400, Spehro Pefhany wrote:

On 20 Oct 2004 02:17:29 -0700, the renowned bill.sloman@ieee.org (Bill
Sloman) wrote:

When I'm doing electronic design I don't waste time elaborating
circuits with refinements that don't give any perceptible performance
advantage, and I'd be surprised if you did.

Many of Fred's insults are quite well crafted, and thus entertaining,
if you're not the target. "Maggot swivel-chair operator", for example.
;-)

I propose "lumpenproletariat" as a useful addition.


Are the proletariat really that much lumpier that the bourgeoisie?

"Lumpenproletariat" is an old and traditional insult - probably going
back to Marx (note the German-style stringing-together of a German
adjective and a Latin noun).

In a sense it is redundant, because the original Latin sense also
implied uncultivated/uneducated - people without property wee too poor
to educate their kids.

Lumpenproletariat = ragamuffin-proletariat is apparently a Marxist
term referring to the members of the proletariat incapable of getting
legal work- vagrants, criminals, prostitutes, and the unemployed. They
were considered counter-revolutionary elements.

Roget's II turns up: dreg (often used in plural), rabble, riffraff,
ragtag and bobtail, trash. Slang : scum. Idioms: scum of the earth,
tag and rag, the great unwashed.

It dates from 1924 according to this fun BBC 101 years in 101 words:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/magazine/3755482.stm

It was in Trekkie detox that I first heard the F-word. Some egghead
wizard who'd been pissed off since the Blitzkrieg was caught in an
acid tailspin....


Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany
--
"it's the network..." "The Journey is the reward"
speff@interlog.com Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com
Embedded software/hardware/analog Info for designers: http://www.speff.com

 

[Fred Bloggs]

Spehro Pefhany wrote:

On 22 Oct 2004 00:04:38 -0700, the renowned bill.sloman@ieee.org (Bill
Sloman) wrote:


Rich Grise <rich@example.net> wrote in message news:<pan.2004.10.20.21.22.57.168624@example.net>...

On Wed, 20 Oct 2004 13:12:13 -0400, Spehro Pefhany wrote:


On 20 Oct 2004 02:17:29 -0700, the renowned bill.sloman@ieee.org (Bill
Sloman) wrote:

When I'm doing electronic design I don't waste time elaborating
circuits with refinements that don't give any perceptible performance
advantage, and I'd be surprised if you did.

Many of Fred's insults are quite well crafted, and thus entertaining,
if you're not the target. "Maggot swivel-chair operator", for example.
;-)

I propose "lumpenproletariat" as a useful addition.


Are the proletariat really that much lumpier that the bourgeoisie?

"Lumpenproletariat" is an old and traditional insult - probably going
back to Marx (note the German-style stringing-together of a German
adjective and a Latin noun).

In a sense it is redundant, because the original Latin sense also
implied uncultivated/uneducated - people without property wee too poor
to educate their kids.


Lumpenproletariat = ragamuffin-proletariat is apparently a Marxist
term referring to the members of the proletariat incapable of getting
legal work- vagrants, criminals, prostitutes, and the unemployed. They
were considered counter-revolutionary elements.

Roget's II turns up: dreg (often used in plural), rabble, riffraff,
ragtag and bobtail, trash. Slang : scum. Idioms: scum of the earth,
tag and rag, the great unwashed.

It dates from 1924 according to this fun BBC 101 years in 101 words:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/magazine/3755482.stm

It was in Trekkie detox that I first heard the F-word. Some egghead
wizard who'd been pissed off since the Blitzkrieg was caught in an
acid tailspin....


Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany

The most appropriate descriptor for this Seim character is lumposhit. I
know this kind well- they are delusional- because they are very secure
in their little sinecures with no challenge in the way of producing
anything, their fantasy of being professional decision maker, while
lacking any particular productive skills, becomes an alternative
reality. These people are promoted on the basis of social maneuver and
not legitimate professional merit, and in nearly all cases are woefully
inadequate and untalented personnel, which explains their
overcompensation with being sycophants and pretentious spokespeople. I
am sure the Seim maggot uses the giveaway line " I am proud to work for
IDL" at every opportunity- this is the argot by which they identify each
other. Also, it is almost a certainty that those unfortunate to have to
work with the Seim garbage are in passive sabotage mode and undercut
every single thing the idiot says or does. You might note that there
will be no complaint forthcoming about billions in government waste
spent at cesspools like the PNNL- but try to even cut loose even $100k
for a social program and watch the dogs bark.

 

[Rich Grise]

On Fri, 22 Oct 2004 09:08:50 -0400, Spehro Pefhany wrote:
....

It dates from 1924 according to this fun BBC 101 years in 101 words:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/magazine/3755482.stm

It was in Trekkie detox that I first heard the F-word. Some egghead
wizard who'd been pissed off since the Blitzkrieg was caught in an
acid tailspin....

Mr. Pefhany! I had no idea you had such moxie! ;-)

Cheers!
Rich

 

[Fred Bloggs]

Tom Seim wrote:

The most appropriate descriptor for this Seim character is lumposhit. I
know this kind well- they are delusional- because they are very secure
in their little sinecures with no challenge in the way of producing
anything, their fantasy of being professional decision maker, while
lacking any particular productive skills, becomes an alternative
reality. These people are promoted on the basis of social maneuver and
not legitimate professional merit, and in nearly all cases are woefully
inadequate and untalented personnel, which explains their
overcompensation with being sycophants and pretentious spokespeople. I
am sure the Seim maggot uses the giveaway line " I am proud to work for
IDL" at every opportunity- this is the argot by which they identify each
other. Also, it is almost a certainty that those unfortunate to have to
work with the Seim garbage are in passive sabotage mode and undercut
every single thing the idiot says or does. You might note that there
will be no complaint forthcoming about billions in government waste
spent at cesspools like the PNNL- but try to even cut loose even $100k
for a social program and watch the dogs bark.


FREDFRAUD, VIETNAM VET IMPOSTER - Need I say any more?

yep- not very impressive for a person of such senior stature as
yourself. But then , as I have described with ample support from you,
you are not really a professional- you are para-government employee
parasite paper pusher- you are totally free of the more ordinary
constraints of the professional workplace- you are a work of fiction-
look at yourself- you are good at nothing- you produce nothing- your
resume is a fraud.

 

[Rich Grise]

On Wed, 20 Oct 2004 17:24:16 +0000, John S. Dyson wrote:

John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandSNIPtechTHISnologyPLEASE.com> writes:
On 20 Oct 2004 02:17:29 -0700, bill.sloman@ieee.org (Bill Sloman)
John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandSNIPtechTHISnologyPLEASE.com> wrote in message news:<gbl7n018cce850oqt8k9j0d43fhs9json8@4ax.com>...
On 18 Oct 2004 03:14:05 -0700, Winfield Hill
Bill Sloman wrote...
I've been exercisng massive self-restraint when it comes
to commenting on John S. Dyson's repeated idiocies ...
I'd rather you didn't, join the fray.
Why do they call this a "discussion" group? It's more of a sophomoric
name-calling group lately. That's a shame, as the world is changing
and there are fascinating things going on, things worthy of serious
analysis, and nobody seems interested in much except flinging coarse
insults. I sure hope you guys don't do electronic design this way.
Logical arguement and subtle insults are wasted on John S. Dyson and
his ilk. A coarse insult signifies disagreement in a way that even the
most fatuous right-winger can understand, and any further intellectual
investment is wasted.
A coarse insult says that the writer is coarse; it says nothing about
the target. And it certainly will not be something anyone will
"understand." "Logical argument" is just what's not presented.
Remember -- it is Kerry (and his supporters) doing the scare mongering.
I am just responding to it (the visceral and intrinsic dishonesty of
the American left.) This indictment doesn't apply to all leftists, but
just the American left.

It's not "scare-mongering" to simply report what's taking place.

The George Bush conspiracy is killing and destroying wantonly, with no
end in sight, and apparently without any kind of restraint. This is
a very scary thing to see happening.

If you have your blinders on so tight that you can't see what's going
on here, then that's even scarier - that there are people that would
swallow Bush the way the Germans swept Hitler into office by a landslide.

Oh, "End World Terrorism" sounds all noble and shit, until they get
to the point where you're sponsoring empire-building, death, and
destruction until the planet just can't take any more. It's really
very important that this warmongering be stopped, because it is
entirely contrary to what America was supposed to be about in the
first place. Not to mention that if it goes to what's looking like
its logical conclusion, it will be the end of civilization as we
know it, and maybe human life in general, and possibly the whole
planet.

Don't forget, Georgie Porgie has his finger on The Button. Who
knows? He might decide to hold the whole world hostage! We already
know he's a madman.

Thanks,
Rich

 

[Fred Bloggs]

John Larkin wrote:

On 18 Oct 2004 03:14:05 -0700, Winfield Hill
Winfield_member@newsguy.com> wrote:


Bill Sloman wrote...

I've been exercisng massive self-restraint when it comes
to commenting on John S. Dyson's repeated idiocies ...

I'd rather you didn't, join the fray.



Why do they call this a "discussion" group? It's more of a sophomoric
name-calling group lately. That's a shame, as the world is changing
and there are fascinating things going on, things worthy of serious
analysis, and nobody seems interested in much except flinging coarse
insults. I sure hope you guys don't do electronic design this way.

John

Really? Take a look at your posts; you are an arrogant, aggravating,
hypocrite p.o.s. Go away.

 

[Dirk Bruere at Neopax]

Fred Bloggs wrote:

Bill Sloman wrote:

John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandSNIPtechTHISnologyPLEASE.com> wrote in
message news:<gbl7n018cce850oqt8k9j0d43fhs9json8@4ax.com>...

On 18 Oct 2004 03:14:05 -0700, Winfield Hill
Winfield_member@newsguy.com> wrote:


Bill Sloman wrote...

I've been exercisng massive self-restraint when it comes
to commenting on John S. Dyson's repeated idiocies ...


I'd rather you didn't, join the fray.



Why do they call this a "discussion" group? It's more of a sophomoric
name-calling group lately. That's a shame, as the world is changing
and there are fascinating things going on, things worthy of serious
analysis, and nobody seems interested in much except flinging coarse
insults. I sure hope you guys don't do electronic design this way.



Logical arguement and subtle insults are wasted on John S. Dyson and
his ilk. A coarse insult signifies disagreement in a way that even the
most fatuous right-winger can understand, and any further intellectual
investment is wasted.

When I'm doing electronic design I don't waste time elaborating
circuits with refinements that don't give any perceptible performance
advantage, and I'd be surprised if you did.

If you do want to exercise your intellect on an interesting
geo-political problem, you might like to think about the current price
of oil, and the prospect that we have moved into an era when supply is
beginning to fall behind demand as the Chinese burn more and more of
the stuff. Effectively, all this ought to do is jack up the price to
the point where it is worth extracting oil from tar shales, but a lot
of capital has to invested in extraction plant before the market can
settle down again.

-------
Bill Sloman, Nijmegen


Exactly! It's a total waste of time responding to these people with
factual argument. A recent poll in Tennessee showed that over half the
supporters of both parties can't even get 1/5 of their candidate's
platform right. The US is a nation of the most ignorant and self-serving
scum in the world. You just take a look at these disgusting wannabe
professionals on this NG like Larkin, Seim, Gathright, Durban, Sands,
and so on, and what you see are a generation of the most materialistic
"takers" ever to leach off the American system. People like this are not
worth fighting for- don't even come close to being something anyone
should die for- their very large social stratum has no representation in
the military and has not for about 60 years now. The present crop of
scum in Republican leadership know this, they know there is resentment
and disaffection, and their response runs the gamut from flagrant
bribery with huge amounts of money to outright intimidation and threats
of prosecution. The US is so corrupt that volunteerism and personal
sacrifice are completely dead and gone, it has been this way for 30
years or so now, and rightfully so- who in their right mind would buy
into the "patriotism" fraud when you look at people like Bush and Cheney
and their personal record. From a moral constitution perspective,
America is a rotted shell of its former self- and this will soon become
very well-known as events maintain their present course.

Modern patriotism - lining their pockets with our lives.

--
Dirk

The Consensus:-
The political party for the new millenium
http://www.theconsensus.org