Harvey Norman Cable Scam

[Ed ()]

hardly normal have a big pond computer set up in store where the only
thing you can do on it is to sign up for broadband. so i did. i never
bothered to check if the lucky people at some random address got it
connected, and paid the $3000.


"Mr.T" <MrT@home> wrote in message
news:42411a8d$0$967$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
:
: "Martin, VK2UMJ" <vk2umj@yahoo.invalid> wrote in message
: news:4241124d_1@news.iprimus.com.au...
: > I'm sure the fact that you just announced to all customers that they
are
: > dishonest, as well as the sale of a $5k+ TV that they think they
just
: lost,
: > will no doubt ruffle a few feathers!!! Definite fun!!!
:
: Strange way to get your jollies.
: If you think the other customers would care, then you haven't actually
tried
: it, have you?
:
: MrT.
:
:

 

[paul packer]

On Wed, 23 Mar 2005 18:10:00 +1100, "Phil Allison"
<philallison@tpg.com.au> wrote:

"paul packer"


I don't know, Terry. I think Phil's present behaviour probably
justifies shouting.



** So you wanna buy me a beer do you - PP ??

I'm choosy who I drink with and you are way off the list.

In sane circles that's a compliment.

 

[Mike La Pietra]

"Phil Allison" <philallison@tpg.com.au> wrote in message
news:3aalbuF6657d9U1@individual.net...

"Poxy"

I think, though, that there is a difference between the "emperor has no
clothes" type approach seen in the Hi-Fi world, where a customer is
convinced that certain speaker cables sound better, where the only
possible
deception is a relatively poor understanding of the subjectivity of
listening test,


** Sales charlatans gain a person's trust first and then exploit their
naivety - that is how fake demos work. Whether by word, voice tone,
facial expression, body langauge, inference or whatever a deception is
created in the mind of the customer - a sale then follows. That is
basic consumer fraud.


versus a live split-scren video comparison where the
difference is clearly evident to even the most ignorant viewer.


** It's a fake demo - a very blatant one.



I imagine
the ACCC will set me straight as to the likelyhood of any positive action
to
address this kind of scam (ie, little to none).


** The right body in NSW is Fair Trading - you can get your friend to
file a complaint report. The complaint will be referred to the store -
who will simply deny.

Better if your friend HAD bought the Monster Cable, then you demo to him
that it makes no difference when tested correctly - then HE returns the
junk for a full refund with YOU as his witness on a busy Saturday morning.

Heaps of fun.

no! Get him to go back in and claim (after very careful examination) that
the *other* picture looks better! I can see the disdained/crappy look on the
salesman's face now!

Mike

 

[Andrew M]

Folks, some people need an audience. You are providing them one.
If you're using Outlook Express, just do this if you don't want to hear
someone.

'Message'->'block sender'.

Done.

-Andrew M

<abc@123.com> wrote in message
news:mve141h20smb210eckup5roka30e8e5u24@4ax.com...

On Wed, 23 Mar 2005 00:36:59 +1100, "Phil Allison"
philallison@tpg.com.au> wrote:



** Sales charlatans gain a person's trust first and then exploit their
naivety - that is how fake demos work. Whether by word, voice tone,
facial
expression, body langauge, inference or whatever a deception is created in
the mind of the customer - a sale then follows. That is basic consumer
fraud.


PHIL ALLISON LIKES TO POST HELP OCCAISIONALLY TO GAIN YOUR TRUST, BUT
DON'T BE FOOLED, HE IS A PAINFULL TROLL, WHO HURLS ABUSE AT EVERYONE.

** It's a fake demo - a very blatant one.


PHIL ALLISON IS A FAKE WHEN HE PRETENDS TO CARE ABOUT HUMAN BEINGS.
A VERY BLATANT ONE.

** The right body in NSW is Fair Trading - you can get your friend to
file a complaint report. The complaint will be referred to the store -
who
will simply deny.


PHIL KNOWS ALL ABOUT FAIR TRADING...JUST ASK HIM ABOUT QUAD SPEAKERS.

Better if your friend HAD bought the Monster Cable, then you demo to him
that it makes no difference when tested correctly - then HE returns the
junk for a full refund with YOU as his witness on a busy Saturday morning.

Heaps of fun.

A HINT OF WHAT PHIL IS REALLY LIKE. HE LIVES FOR ABUSIVE ARGUMENTS.


............ Phil Allison a vile troll.

 

[Phil Allison]

"paul packer"
"Phil Allison"

I don't know, Terry. I think Phil's present behaviour probably
justifies shouting.


** So you wanna buy me a beer do you - PP ??

I'm choosy who I drink with and you are way off the list.

In sane circles that's a compliment.

** How hysterical - coming form one of the ripest fucking nut cases on
all usenet.

Paul Packer is a geriatric, raving fucking lunatic who bragged about his
child porn collection.

Nuff said ???





................ Phil

 

[TT]

"paul packer" <packer@iprimus.com.au> wrote in message
news:42410ebf.3363796@news.iprimus.com.au...

On Wed, 23 Mar 2005 12:45:55 +0800, "TT"
swat@swat.com.au> wrote:


abc@123.com> wrote in message
news:mve141h20smb210eckup5roka30e8e5u24@4ax.com...
:
Mr/Ms/Mrs abc could you please not **SHOUT ALL THE
TIME**.
It is occasionally needed for emphasis but don't go over
the
top.

Regards TT

I don't know, Terry. I think Phil's present behaviour
probably
justifies shouting.

Was it Mr. Norman Syngent Pole-vaulter from Monty Python
that enjoyed shouting all the time?

TT ;-)

 

[Craig Hart]

Probably just a case of incompetent salesman failing to articulate what he
was actually demonstrating.

component is better than composite, and a component cable costs a few bux
more. end of story.


"Phil Allison" <philallison@tpg.com.au> wrote in message
news:3aalbuF6657d9U1@individual.net...

"Poxy"

I think, though, that there is a difference between the "emperor has no
clothes" type approach seen in the Hi-Fi world, where a customer is
convinced that certain speaker cables sound better, where the only
possible
deception is a relatively poor understanding of the subjectivity of
listening test,


** Sales charlatans gain a person's trust first and then exploit their
naivety - that is how fake demos work. Whether by word, voice tone,
facial
expression, body langauge, inference or whatever a deception is created in
the mind of the customer - a sale then follows. That is basic consumer
fraud.


versus a live split-scren video comparison where the
difference is clearly evident to even the most ignorant viewer.


** It's a fake demo - a very blatant one.



I imagine
the ACCC will set me straight as to the likelyhood of any positive
action
to
address this kind of scam (ie, little to none).


** The right body in NSW is Fair Trading - you can get your friend to
file a complaint report. The complaint will be referred to the store -
who
will simply deny.

Better if your friend HAD bought the Monster Cable, then you demo to him
that it makes no difference when tested correctly - then HE returns the
junk for a full refund with YOU as his witness on a busy Saturday morning.

Heaps of fun.



............ Phil

 

[robert casey]

** Fake demonstrations have been standard practice for sales charlatans for
centuries - door to door vacuum cleaner salesmen had them perfected over
50 years ago. Almost any hi-fi salesman is expert at the art of creating
biased and false demonstrations.

I once had a salesman at a stereo shop try to convince
me that the amplifier that sounded louder when both
amp's volume control set to say 11 o'clock position
was clearly the better one. Sure.... I didn't buy
anything there.

 

[robert casey]

Craig Hart wrote:

Probably just a case of incompetent salesman failing to articulate what he
was actually demonstrating.

component is better than composite, and a component cable costs a few bux
more. end of story.


True, but the component cable need not cost 20 times as much....

 

[KLR]

On Wed, 23 Mar 2005 18:26:39 +1100, "bassett"
<bassett@bassettskennel.com> wrote:

E-Mail Gerry Harvey, and tell him the story, Might get a response,
Then get someone to go back to hardly normal, and as someone said get the
salesman [insist, make a lot of noise] to use Monster cables on both feeds,
and watch him tell you that one of the cables is faulty.
bassett

They aren't interested.

I had a nasty situation about 4 years back where a salesperson sold me
a PDA, then proceeded to pull the display one off the in-store display
(that everyone of the general public had been handling and fiddling
with for days) and put it back in it's box. They refused to even
order in a new boxed unit. For a $1000 sale - Im sure they would have
been happy to get one shipped in overnight, but I was wrong.

I was less than amused - didn't go ahead with the sale, stating that I
"would go to cash converters if I wanted to buy used goods" and
complained in writing to the head office. They more or less replied -
"why did you bother us with this for ? - it's an independent
franchise, take it up with the store itself". Naturally the store did
nothing, and It would appear that they don't really care much about
what their franchisees do, or of the "good name" of the company.

In the end - the (now extinct) chandlers "X-site" bent over backwards
to look after me. They didn't have stock of many PDA's generally, but
got the thing in for me overnight.

(Before anyone comments - there were no other dealers of PDA units
anywhere near where I live at that time.)
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I would imagine that most retailers that engage in this sort of
deceptive act would work on the basis that 99% of their customers will
cop whatever shit is dished out to them, and the profit that they make
out of those sales will much, much more than cover the 1% who actually
demand a refund, do a chargeback, or ultimately take the matter to the
ACCC or small claims court - even if they do win. it would be like a
drop in the ocean.

 

[Franc Zabkar]

On Tue, 22 Mar 2005 12:12:48 GMT, "Poxy" <pox@poxymail.com> put finger
to keyboard and composed:

Subsequently, I worked out that they had hooked up the component output of
the DVD player to one side, and the composite output to the other, and was
then trying to claim that the improved picture was purely due to the Monster
brand cable.

<snip>

Why? The 1m Monster cable costs $270.

Methinks a call to the ACCC is in order.

I visited the horse's mouth to see what they had to say. I don't know
exactly which cable HN was using, but here is Monster Cable's "Z300
Ultra High-Resolution Precision Component Video Cable":

http://www.monstercable.com/productPage.asp?pin=1306

The claimed features are:

Silver coated center conductor for improved frequency response.
High density double shielding for ultimate rejection of interference.
Nitrogen-injected dielectric insulator for maximum signal strength.
Patented 24k gold contact TurbineŽ RCA connectors for superior signal
transfer.

IMO, anyone comtemplating the surrender of a day or two's wages in
exchange for a 1m cable needs medical help. Of course the same could
be said of the people who set the prices. Notice that a 2m cable costs
US$80 more than a 1m cable, but an additional 2m (2m -> 4m) costs only
$30 extra.

PRODUCT DESCRIPTION: MODEL: U.S. RETAIL PRICE:

1 m. length Z300CV-1M $119.95
2 m. length Z300CV-2M $199.95
4 m. length Z300CV-4M $229.95


- Franc Zabkar
--
Please remove one 's' from my address when replying by email.

 

[Richard Waters]

"KLR" <kenreed@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:ng2441tkq9dq9h0dumqqu5faam5179ivup@4ax.com...
| On Wed, 23 Mar 2005 18:26:39 +1100, "bassett"
| <bassett@bassettskennel.com> wrote:
[snip]
|
| I had a nasty situation about 4 years back where a salesperson sold me
| a PDA, then proceeded to pull the display one off the in-store display
| (that everyone of the general public had been handling and fiddling
| with for days) and put it back in it's box. They refused to even
| order in a new boxed unit. For a $1000 sale - Im sure they would have
| been happy to get one shipped in overnight, but I was wrong.
|

....and you have worked in retail electronics, where before?

They are HAVE to give you the FULL warranty (which they would have done!)
and ALL benefits of a new unit - but if that unit was taken from "display"
then they will usually give you a discount for the item... ...and can I
ask - when you "look" at a product, do you treat/use it like its garbage?
98% of the population doesnt either - and if you do, then u deserve them
offering you the display unit...

They may not have been able to order another one: Last in stock & supplier
has changed, or supplier doesnt have any more, the other stores dont have
any that they could order in, the supplier is out of stock - in most
situations like this people wanting to buy ALSO want it NOW - I have
experianced people "blow up" when I offer them the display unit and then
winge like children when I have told them an order will take from 4 to 6
weeks - do you want a new one or what for crying out loud?!?!

There are MANY reasons why they may not have been able to get one - but I
will conceed, there are some LAZY sons of bitches out there "working" in
retail - though I, was not one them!

| I was less than amused - didn't go ahead with the sale, stating that I
| "would go to cash converters if I wanted to buy used goods" and
| complained in writing to the head office. They more or less replied -
| "why did you bother us with this for ? - it's an independent
| franchise, take it up with the store itself". Naturally the store did
| nothing, and It would appear that they don't really care much about
| what their franchisees do, or of the "good name" of the company.
|

I doubt very much that was their response, maybe you added a little "poetic
licence" in there somewhere? But they are 100% RIGHT, you DO have to take
it up with the franchisee of the store, in fact there are usually a
franchisee for furniture, electrical, computers, communications and ever
other different seciton of the store, but thats how Gerry Harvey (and I have
spoken to him many times when working for Domayne!) and his business model
made him money...

Some franchisee's dont give a shit - but I can tell you now, you wouldnt
have EVER spoken to a franchisee about your problem, you may have spoken to
his 2IC or the floor manager - and if you go in their guns blazing and all
riled up... ...think about it on the hald, if someone came to you all mad
and shooting off about something that you knew no details about, what would
you do??? Most people would blow a nasty big lot of it back, but in retail
you CAN'T!!

I doubt whether you have worked in retail such as you are describing, and if
you have, think about it, how would you have delt with it all?!?!

| In the end - the (now extinct) chandlers "X-site" bent over backwards
| to look after me. They didn't have stock of many PDA's generally, but
| got the thing in for me overnight.

Then you got the service in the end, and you found a salesman/woman that was
worth the money they were being paid - vote with ur feet man, if you dont
like the service, try another salesman, or try another store or try a
different brand!

| (Before anyone comments - there were no other dealers of PDA units
| anywhere near where I live at that time.)

Then order online, or ask the local store if they can order them in - I
lived in a small town of 10,100 people on the Mid Nth COast of NSW back in
the '80's and we DIDNT HAVE an electrical store, the closest we had was a
Tandy/Radio Shack store - but I asked VERY NICELY and though they didnt even
carry it as a stock item, they ordered me in and I paid over $600 for a
commodore C64 and accesories!!!

| I would imagine that most retailers that engage in this sort of
| deceptive act would work on the basis that 99% of their customers will
| cop whatever shit is dished out to them, and the profit that they make
| out of those sales will much, much more than cover the 1% who actually
| demand a refund, do a chargeback, or ultimately take the matter to the
| ACCC or small claims court - even if they do win. it would be like a
| drop in the ocean.

It is NOT deceptive - and a good salesman will know his stock levels and
even check and ask if you would like the display model and offer you a
discount... ...if they dont, be polite and ask, if they still dont - WALK,
dont stand their and biatch about it?!?! :-S

AS IF customers "...cop whatever shit is dished out to them..." in fact its
the COMPLETE OPPOSITE, they know MORE about their rights and what they can
and cant get out of shops thanks to "exposes" on A Current Affair and Today
tonight - BUT NONE OF THEM ARE EVER TOLD OF THEIR RESPONSIBILITIES THAT GO
ALONG WITH THOSE RIGHTS!!

Just to finish my rave...

....there should be ONE DAY of the YEAR where sales staff can be as RUDE as
they like to all customers - to take all the crap they take on the chin, day
in and day out, and feed it all back to customers that ONE day of the year
and you know what... ...Ill bet my left nut that NO ONE owuld go shopping
that day, because they KNOW the type of treatment they would get: And yet
sales staff still do their best every day and even go to work every day
KNOWING this is the treatment they will get - and they are one of the lowest
paid workers on the market!!

HERES A CLUE - next time you go shopping, lower your voice, find out the
salespersons name and speak to them nicely, ask them for help and ask them
to be honest... ...Ill bet you will be surprised about the AMAZING change
in their attitude!

--Richard (who got out of sales/customer service/retail after over 8yrs cos
he got sick of "know-it-all" customers that really knew nothing!)

PS -- I wasnt that low a paid salesman tho, I made a tidy profit each week
because I did all the honest stuff and KEPT all my good customers and didnt
waste my time on tire-kickers and wingeing bastards!

 

[Mr.T]

"Richard Waters" <legerdemain@SpAmSuCkSiprimus.com.au> wrote in message
news:4242404c_1@news.iprimus.com.au...

They may not have been able to order another one: Last in stock &
supplier
has changed, or supplier doesnt have any more, the other stores dont have
any that they could order in, the supplier is out of stock - in most
situations like this people wanting to buy ALSO want it NOW - I have
experianced people "blow up" when I offer them the display unit and then
winge like children when I have told them an order will take from 4 to 6
weeks - do you want a new one or what for crying out loud?!?!

Yes, *IF* a choice is given, there should be no argument.

I doubt very much that was their response, maybe you added a little
"poetic
licence" in there somewhere? But they are 100% RIGHT, you DO have to take
it up with the franchisee of the store, in fact there are usually a
franchisee for furniture, electrical, computers, communications and ever
other different seciton of the store, but thats how Gerry Harvey (and I
have
spoken to him many times when working for Domayne!) and his business model
made him money...

Yep, his profit is far more important than customer service.

Some franchisee's dont give a shit - but I can tell you now, you wouldnt
have EVER spoken to a franchisee about your problem, you may have spoken
to
his 2IC or the floor manager - and if you go in their guns blazing and all
riled up... ...think about it on the hald, if someone came to you all
mad
and shooting off about something that you knew no details about, what
would
you do??? Most people would blow a nasty big lot of it back, but in
retail
you CAN'T!!

Unfortunately many do, even when they are in the wrong.

I doubt whether you have worked in retail such as you are describing, and
if
you have, think about it, how would you have delt with it all?!?!

Would have asked if he wanted the demo in the first place!

Then you got the service in the end, and you found a salesman/woman that
was
worth the money they were being paid - vote with ur feet man, if you dont
like the service, try another salesman, or try another store or try a
different brand!

Yep, but it is annoying when you have already gotten to the wrap it up
stage.

It is NOT deceptive - and a good salesman will know his stock levels and
even check and ask if you would like the display model and offer you a
discount... ...if they dont, be polite and ask, if they still dont -
WALK,
dont stand their and biatch about it?!?! :-S

Sometimes it's more complicated than that. Many years ago I put a camera on
layby. When I picked it up, the new camera had been swapped for a demo
model. After speaking to the Dept manager and shop manager, they still
refused a replacement or refund (no more stock) Only after I went to
consumer affairs did I get a refund. I never went in that shop again for
over 10 years, and it was one of Melb's largest dept stores. It isn't any
longer and I'm not surprised.
Why Gerry Harvey has done so well DOES surprise me though.

HERES A CLUE - next time you go shopping, lower your voice, find out the
salespersons name and speak to them nicely, ask them for help and ask them
to be honest... ...Ill bet you will be surprised about the AMAZING
change
in their attitude!

So you should have to ask a salesperson to be honest, and I guess you'll
believe them afterwards

--Richard (who got out of sales/customer service/retail after over 8yrs
cos
he got sick of "know-it-all" customers that really knew nothing!)

Not surprising then that customers are sick of know it all salespeople who
really know nothing.

PS -- I wasnt that low a paid salesman tho, I made a tidy profit each
week
because I did all the honest stuff and KEPT all my good customers and
didnt
waste my time on tire-kickers and wingeing bastards!

I guess consumers are better off now you've gone at least.

MrT.

 

[Martin, VK2UMJ]

"Mr.T" <MrT@home> wrote in message
news:42426d6f$0$5595$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...

"Richard Waters" <legerdemain@SpAmSuCkSiprimus.com.au> wrote in message
news:4242404c_1@news.iprimus.com.au...
They may not have been able to order another one: Last in stock &
supplier
has changed, or supplier doesnt have any more, the other stores dont have
any that they could order in, the supplier is out of stock - in most
situations like this people wanting to buy ALSO want it NOW - I have
experianced people "blow up" when I offer them the display unit and then
winge like children when I have told them an order will take from 4 to 6
weeks - do you want a new one or what for crying out loud?!?!

Yes, *IF* a choice is given, there should be no argument.

I doubt very much that was their response, maybe you added a little
"poetic
licence" in there somewhere? But they are 100% RIGHT, you DO have to
take
it up with the franchisee of the store, in fact there are usually a
franchisee for furniture, electrical, computers, communications and ever
other different seciton of the store, but thats how Gerry Harvey (and I
have
spoken to him many times when working for Domayne!) and his business
model
made him money...

Yep, his profit is far more important than customer service.

Some franchisee's dont give a shit - but I can tell you now, you wouldnt
have EVER spoken to a franchisee about your problem, you may have spoken
to
his 2IC or the floor manager - and if you go in their guns blazing and
all
riled up... ...think about it on the hald, if someone came to you all
mad
and shooting off about something that you knew no details about, what
would
you do??? Most people would blow a nasty big lot of it back, but in
retail
you CAN'T!!

Unfortunately many do, even when they are in the wrong.

I doubt whether you have worked in retail such as you are describing, and
if
you have, think about it, how would you have delt with it all?!?!

Would have asked if he wanted the demo in the first place!

Agree. In my years in retail sales I had many occassions where the only
item left was the demo, so before the customer decided to buy or not to buy
I would make sure they knew that we only had the demo, and that it would
take x weeks to get another, or that they were no longer available - as the
case may be. Then it was up to the customer and no nasty surprises! If
they took the demo model they were always offered something in return -
either a discount, or something extra thrown in, up to them, but all this
was told to them *well* before we got to the "I'll take it" stage!!

If for some reason it did get to that stage and I discovered that we had no
stock left, then I would put it to the customer and ask them what they
wanted to do - *never* just re-pack the demo and presume they would take it
without complaint! It takes but a few extra minutes to go that extra little
distance for a customer, but it can help your reputation immensly. I had
customers that would visit my store, having driven past two or three other
branches of the same store, just because they knew I wouldn't stuff them
around or lead them astray.

Then you got the service in the end, and you found a salesman/woman that
was
worth the money they were being paid - vote with ur feet man, if you dont
like the service, try another salesman, or try another store or try a
different brand!

Yep, but it is annoying when you have already gotten to the wrap it up
stage.

And there is little excuse for this, especially given today's tracking
abilities of the store register/computer. There is no reason that a
salesperson couldn't check stock, or if they suddenly discovered only the
demo left, at the very least ask the customer if that is OK first. You can
get $1000's off a demo car as opposed to a brand new one, but I'm yet to see
a car saleperson drive the demo out the back and then produce it as a brand
new model!!

 

[Poxy]

Franc Zabkar wrote:

On Tue, 22 Mar 2005 12:12:48 GMT, "Poxy" <pox@poxymail.com> put finger
to keyboard and composed:


Subsequently, I worked out that they had hooked up the component
output of the DVD player to one side, and the composite output to
the other, and was then trying to claim that the improved picture
was purely due to the Monster brand cable.

snip

Why? The 1m Monster cable costs $270.

Methinks a call to the ACCC is in order.

I visited the horse's mouth to see what they had to say. I don't know
exactly which cable HN was using, but here is Monster Cable's "Z300
Ultra High-Resolution Precision Component Video Cable":

While I haven't gotten the motivation to do anything particularly effective
yet, I did drop into a different Harvey Normans while I was near this
afternoon. I mooched about the big-screen TV area until a sales guy
sauntered up - I mentioned that a friend had purchased a plasma the other
day and had been shown the image quality of some Monster cables - she had
been very impressed by the difference they made, and I was hoping to see if
the difference was as marked as she had said.

Straight up, the guy said it was a scam, and asked me if I knew the
difference between composite and component. Indicating that I might, he
claimed that the particular split-screen or picture-in-picture demonstration
my friend had seen was in fact promoted as a sales technique by Monster
cables. It just involved showing the composite signal on one side, and
component on the other.

While he went on about the demonstration being misleading, and that they
didn't sell Monster cables out of "principle" (oh the irony - this coming
from a guy in sales) he showed me some "Geko" or something brand - $125 for
1.5m - he said I could have it for $100, which probably meant he was only
making $50 on it...

The guy confirmed their store was different franchise to the one where my
friend had bought her Plasma. What I did find interesting was the claim that
Monster (or the Oz distributor) encouraged this misleading demonstration.

While I'm not that motivated to go hassle some scummy HN franchise who
couldn't give a rat's about sales ethics (or the Trade Practices Act),
giving the king of all snake-oil companies, Monster, a kick in the ribs
holds some attraction - I'm only human after all...

 

[Phil Allison]

"Poxy"

Straight up, the guy said it was a scam, and asked me if I knew the
difference between composite and component. Indicating that I might, he
claimed that the particular split-screen or picture-in-picture
demonstration
my friend had seen was in fact promoted as a sales technique by Monster
cables. It just involved showing the composite signal on one side, and
component on the other.

While he went on about the demonstration being misleading, and that they
didn't sell Monster cables out of "principle".......

** Quote from earlier in this thread:


" Monster is just about the smoothest con ever - a blatant, right in your
face scam.

If a shop even sells Monster Cables - I suggest you simply walk out.

Maybe tell the manager why first - if you have the nerve to. "





.............. Phil

 

[Alan]

TOP POST and SHOUT !!! (sorry, but I do feel pretty strong about this)

CRAP!!!

Phil does not put up with D/Heads or stupid crap.
and he tells you so...!!!
But at the end of all, he does know his shit better than a lot of you know
it alls..!!

so don't poke the bear, unless you want a response, that might piss you off.
as he hold no punches....!!

Allan
<abc@123.com> wrote in message
news:mve141h20smb210eckup5roka30e8e5u24@4ax.com...

On Wed, 23 Mar 2005 00:36:59 +1100, "Phil Allison"
philallison@tpg.com.au> wrote:



** Sales charlatans gain a person's trust first and then exploit their
naivety - that is how fake demos work. Whether by word, voice tone,
facial
expression, body langauge, inference or whatever a deception is created
in
the mind of the customer - a sale then follows. That is basic consumer
fraud.


PHIL ALLISON LIKES TO POST HELP OCCAISIONALLY TO GAIN YOUR TRUST, BUT
DON'T BE FOOLED, HE IS A PAINFULL TROLL, WHO HURLS ABUSE AT EVERYONE.

** It's a fake demo - a very blatant one.


PHIL ALLISON IS A FAKE WHEN HE PRETENDS TO CARE ABOUT HUMAN BEINGS.
A VERY BLATANT ONE.

** The right body in NSW is Fair Trading - you can get your friend to
file a complaint report. The complaint will be referred to the store -
who
will simply deny.


PHIL KNOWS ALL ABOUT FAIR TRADING...JUST ASK HIM ABOUT QUAD SPEAKERS.

Better if your friend HAD bought the Monster Cable, then you demo to him
that it makes no difference when tested correctly - then HE returns
the
junk for a full refund with YOU as his witness on a busy Saturday
morning.

Heaps of fun.

A HINT OF WHAT PHIL IS REALLY LIKE. HE LIVES FOR ABUSIVE ARGUMENTS.


............ Phil Allison a vile troll.

 

[KLR]

On Thu, 24 Mar 2005 15:21:27 +1100, "Richard Waters"
<legerdemain@SpAmSuCkSiprimus.com.au> wrote:

"KLR" <kenreed@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:ng2441tkq9dq9h0dumqqu5faam5179ivup@4ax.com...
| On Wed, 23 Mar 2005 18:26:39 +1100, "bassett"
| <bassett@bassettskennel.com> wrote:
[snip]
|
| I had a nasty situation about 4 years back where a salesperson sold me
| a PDA, then proceeded to pull the display one off the in-store display
| (that everyone of the general public had been handling and fiddling
| with for days) and put it back in it's box. They refused to even
| order in a new boxed unit. For a $1000 sale - Im sure they would have
| been happy to get one shipped in overnight, but I was wrong.
|

...and you have worked in retail electronics, where before?

I havent, and its not relevant.

They are HAVE to give you the FULL warranty (which they would have done!)
and ALL benefits of a new unit - but if that unit was taken from "display"
then they will usually give you a discount for the item... ...and can I
ask - when you "look" at a product, do you treat/use it like its garbage?
98% of the population doesnt either - and if you do, then u deserve them
offering you the display unit...

The PDA's were stuck on a circular display table, on chains -

unsupervised. It was 3-30pm and already there were kids fiddling with
them, drawing on the delicate touch screen - not using the proper
stylus (as it wasnt provided) A couple of them had obvious scratches
and damage and one had a purple mark in the upper corner of the LCD.
I would imagine this was from being pushed on hard.

The warranty isn't worth shit when something has been abused, and at
the best of times with warranty on these items - you are often left
without the item for weeks while its sent off for repair.

Almost any other appliance on display in an electrical store (TV, VCR,
Whitegoods, small appliances) isn't going to be fiddled with anywhere
near as much and not as succeptable to damage, wear and tear as a PDA
will be. I would have no objection to buying such an item (and have
before without question) off the floor, as any damage by "previous
browsers" is likely to be obvious at the time of purchase.

When I'm spending $1000 on a relatively delicate item, I expect a lot

better than this. Specially when I'm paying extra by visiting a store
rather than buying offline - as I wanted to see the item first hand,
and know its going to do exactly what I want it to do. I could have
cost a person such as yourself out of a commission by walking in,
fiddling round, wasting your time and then going and buying offline,
but I didnt intend that at all in this case.

At X-site - they didn't have the range there, but they were locked in

glass display cases - and were demonstrated (and supervised) by the
salesperson to anyone who was interested in buying. In cases like
this - there would be very little chance of damage - unless the thing
had sat there for months in a busy store and was being demonstrated
many times a day. They did order one in for me (i now knew what I
wanted) and it was in store in about 3 days.

They may not have been able to order another one: Last in stock & supplier
has changed, or supplier doesnt have any more, the other stores dont have
any that they could order in, the supplier is out of stock - in most
situations like this people wanting to buy ALSO want it NOW - I have
experianced people "blow up" when I offer them the display unit and then
winge like children when I have told them an order will take from 4 to 6
weeks - do you want a new one or what for crying out loud?!?!

There are MANY reasons why they may not have been able to get one - but I
will conceed, there are some LAZY sons of bitches out there "working" in
retail - though I, was not one them!

This person gave no reason, didnt make any effort - just said "if you

want one you must take this one". There wasn't any discount or
wonderful deal given on it either.

| I was less than amused - didn't go ahead with the sale, stating that I
| "would go to cash converters if I wanted to buy used goods" and
| complained in writing to the head office. They more or less replied -
| "why did you bother us with this for ? - it's an independent
| franchise, take it up with the store itself". Naturally the store did
| nothing, and It would appear that they don't really care much about
| what their franchisees do, or of the "good name" of the company.
|

I doubt very much that was their response, maybe you added a little "poetic
licence" in there somewhere? But they are 100% RIGHT, you DO have to take
it up with the franchisee of the store, in fact there are usually a
franchisee for furniture, electrical, computers, communications and ever
other different seciton of the store, but thats how Gerry Harvey (and I have
spoken to him many times when working for Domayne!) and his business model
made him money...

It was the response. I certainly wasn't nasty to the salesperson at

any point leading up to it - except at the end when I refused the unit
and said I was leaving and buying elsewhere.

I got no satisfaction at store level, and so I went further. the

"couldnt care less" attitude spoke volumes to me.

Some franchisee's dont give a shit - but I can tell you now, you wouldnt
have EVER spoken to a franchisee about your problem, you may have spoken to
his 2IC or the floor manager - and if you go in their guns blazing and all
riled up... ...think about it on the hald, if someone came to you all mad
and shooting off about something that you knew no details about, what would
you do??? Most people would blow a nasty big lot of it back, but in retail
you CAN'T!!

I doubt whether you have worked in retail such as you are describing, and if
you have, think about it, how would you have delt with it all?!?!

Would have offered the customer the option of ordering one in for me,

or a discount on the one that was there. I wouldn't have minded
waiting a couple of days to receive a new one in the box. If neither
of these options were possible - I would at least have explained this
- and why.

| In the end - the (now extinct) chandlers "X-site" bent over backwards
| to look after me. They didn't have stock of many PDA's generally, but
| got the thing in for me overnight.

Then you got the service in the end, and you found a salesman/woman that was
worth the money they were being paid - vote with ur feet man, if you dont
like the service, try another salesman, or try another store or try a
different brand!

That is exactly what I did !

| (Before anyone comments - there were no other dealers of PDA units
| anywhere near where I live at that time.)

Then order online, or ask the local store if they can order them in - I
lived in a small town of 10,100 people on the Mid Nth COast of NSW back in
the '80's and we DIDNT HAVE an electrical store, the closest we had was a
Tandy/Radio Shack store - but I asked VERY NICELY and though they didnt even
carry it as a stock item, they ordered me in and I paid over $600 for a
commodore C64 and accesories!!!

| I would imagine that most retailers that engage in this sort of
| deceptive act would work on the basis that 99% of their customers will
| cop whatever shit is dished out to them, and the profit that they make
| out of those sales will much, much more than cover the 1% who actually
| demand a refund, do a chargeback, or ultimately take the matter to the
| ACCC or small claims court - even if they do win. it would be like a
| drop in the ocean.

It is NOT deceptive - and a good salesman will know his stock levels and
even check and ask if you would like the display model and offer you a
discount... ...if they dont, be polite and ask, if they still dont - WALK,
dont stand their and biatch about it?!?! :-S

I was actually referring to the OP's cable scam more than the PDA in

this statement, sorry I didnt clarify it better. The PDA story simply
was to demonstrate the futility of complaints further up.

AS IF customers "...cop whatever shit is dished out to them..." in fact its
the COMPLETE OPPOSITE, they know MORE about their rights and what they can
and cant get out of shops thanks to "exposes" on A Current Affair and Today
tonight - BUT NONE OF THEM ARE EVER TOLD OF THEIR RESPONSIBILITIES THAT GO
ALONG WITH THOSE RIGHTS!!

True - but for every one of them that gets on ACA - there are hundreds

that do nothing (even if they ever discover they have been scammed).

I would imagine that the "cable scam" would be extremely hard for a
non-technical consumer to even get anywhere with as far as refunds and
such go. Unless you got a group of them who had all been scammed and
were to take a "class action" at any level - it would be the consumers
word against the salespersons.

This was the point I was trying to make.


Just to finish my rave...

...there should be ONE DAY of the YEAR where sales staff can be as RUDE as
they like to all customers - to take all the crap they take on the chin, day
in and day out, and feed it all back to customers that ONE day of the year
and you know what... ...Ill bet my left nut that NO ONE owuld go shopping
that day, because they KNOW the type of treatment they would get: And yet
sales staff still do their best every day and even go to work every day
KNOWING this is the treatment they will get - and they are one of the lowest
paid workers on the market!!



HERES A CLUE - next time you go shopping, lower your voice, find out the
salespersons name and speak to them nicely, ask them for help and ask them
to be honest... ...Ill bet you will be surprised about the AMAZING change
in their attitude!

--Richard (who got out of sales/customer service/retail after over 8yrs cos
he got sick of "know-it-all" customers that really knew nothing!)

PS -- I wasnt that low a paid salesman tho, I made a tidy profit each week
because I did all the honest stuff and KEPT all my good customers and didnt
waste my time on tire-kickers and wingeing bastards!



In that case - why did you just claim to be one of the lowest paid

workers on the market ?

 

[paul packer]

On Thu, 24 Mar 2005 21:34:44 +1000, "Alan" <nospam@hotmail.com> wrote:

TOP POST and SHOUT !!! (sorry, but I do feel pretty strong about this)

CRAP!!!

Phil does not put up with D/Heads or stupid crap.
and he tells you so...!!!
But at the end of all, he does know his shit better than a lot of you know
it alls..!!

so don't poke the bear, unless you want a response, that might piss you off.
as he hold no punches....!!

Clearly a psychiatric hospital somewhere has just installed Net-ready
computers in all their rooms. Pity.

 

[Phil Allison]

"paul packer" ...



** The raving fuckwit above from Tosca Drive, Gorakan NSW collects child
porn by his own admission.


Nuff said ?




............. Phil