Harvey Norman Cable Scam

P

Poxy

Guest
A friend was at Harvey Normans the other day, purchasing a plasma screen TV.
After they'd negotiated the price - about $4,400 for an LG highish-res
panel, the sales guy then suggested they purchase a special component cable
for hooking up their DVD player to the screen to achieve the best quality
from their new screen.

For demonstration, he switched the panel to split-screen mode showing the
same DVD title playing on each half, but connected by different cables. He
was attempting to imply that the marked difference between the two images
was due to the use of a "Monster" brand component video cable on one input.
My friend gave me a call at the time and explained what the sales guy was
trying to say, and commented that the Monster side had better detail in the
blacks and looked better than the other half. I told her that it sounded
like a scam and hold off for the moment - she could always purchase it at a
later date, as he wasn't offering any great deal on the cable.

Subsequently, I worked out that they had hooked up the component output of
the DVD player to one side, and the composite output to the other, and was
then trying to claim that the improved picture was purely due to the Monster
brand cable.

This strikes me as a blatantly dishonest and misleading demonstration - the
salesman never stated that the difference in quality was largely (if not
entirely) due to the alternative signal format, rather he misrepresented the
comparison with the goal of selling an obscenely overpriced cable of dubious
benefit over a base-quality component cable.

Why? The 1m Monster cable costs $270.

Methinks a call to the ACCC is in order.
 
Perhaps a "test" is in order, send someone else in to get the sales guy to run though
the same pitch, but educate the person who is sent before hand on what each cable
looks like so they can identify it. Preferably a person who seems naive to the world
of hifi.


"Poxy" <pox@poxymail.com> wrote in message
news:4ZT%d.7702$C7.1308@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
A friend was at Harvey Normans the other day, purchasing a plasma screen TV.
After they'd negotiated the price - about $4,400 for an LG highish-res
panel, the sales guy then suggested they purchase a special component cable
for hooking up their DVD player to the screen to achieve the best quality
from their new screen.

For demonstration, he switched the panel to split-screen mode showing the
same DVD title playing on each half, but connected by different cables. He
was attempting to imply that the marked difference between the two images
was due to the use of a "Monster" brand component video cable on one input.
My friend gave me a call at the time and explained what the sales guy was
trying to say, and commented that the Monster side had better detail in the
blacks and looked better than the other half. I told her that it sounded
like a scam and hold off for the moment - she could always purchase it at a
later date, as he wasn't offering any great deal on the cable.

Subsequently, I worked out that they had hooked up the component output of
the DVD player to one side, and the composite output to the other, and was
then trying to claim that the improved picture was purely due to the Monster
brand cable.

This strikes me as a blatantly dishonest and misleading demonstration - the
salesman never stated that the difference in quality was largely (if not
entirely) due to the alternative signal format, rather he misrepresented the
comparison with the goal of selling an obscenely overpriced cable of dubious
benefit over a base-quality component cable.

Why? The 1m Monster cable costs $270.

Methinks a call to the ACCC is in order.
Click to expand...
 
"What The" <meh@meh.com> wrote in message
news:O0U%d.7727$C7.2396@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
Perhaps a "test" is in order, send someone else in to get the sales guy to
run though the same pitch, but educate the person who is sent before hand
on what each cable looks like so they can identify it. Preferably a person
who seems naive to the world of hifi.
Click to expand...
I expect that even if you catch the "salesman" red-handed in a calculated
fraud, that Harvey Norman will deny that they have any legal responsibility
for the unsanctioned excesses of their sub-contract employee.

Outside the law, in the past, this sort of person used to end up with a bit
of a kicking. Today? Quien sabe?
 
"Poxy"
A friend was at Harvey Normans the other day, purchasing a plasma screen
TV.
After they'd negotiated the price - about $4,400 for an LG highish-res
panel, the sales guy then suggested they purchase a special component
cable
for hooking up their DVD player to the screen to achieve the best quality
from their new screen.

For demonstration, he switched the panel to split-screen mode showing the
same DVD title playing on each half, but connected by different cables. He
was attempting to imply that the marked difference between the two images
was due to the use of a "Monster" brand component video cable on one
input.
My friend gave me a call at the time and explained what the sales guy was
trying to say, and commented that the Monster side had better detail in
the
blacks and looked better than the other half. I told her that it sounded
like a scam and hold off for the moment - she could always purchase it at
a
later date, as he wasn't offering any great deal on the cable.

Subsequently, I worked out that they had hooked up the component output of
the DVD player to one side, and the composite output to the other, and was
then trying to claim that the improved picture was purely due to the
Monster
brand cable.

This strikes me as a blatantly dishonest and misleading demonstration -
the
salesman never stated that the difference in quality was largely (if not
entirely) due to the alternative signal format, rather he misrepresented
the
comparison with the goal of selling an obscenely overpriced cable of
dubious
benefit over a base-quality component cable.

Why? The 1m Monster cable costs $270.

Methinks a call to the ACCC is in order.
Click to expand...

** Fake demonstrations have been standard practice for sales charlatans for
centuries - door to door vacuum cleaner salesmen had them perfected over
50 years ago. Almost any hi-fi salesman is expert at the art of creating
biased and false demonstrations.

The resident charlatan on aus.hi-fi is Trevor Wilson - but he is a rank
amateur compared to the reptiles in shiny suits that lurk in the posh,
up-market stores.

Monster is just about the smoothest con ever - a blatant, right in your
face scam.

If a shop even sells Monster Cables - I suggest you simply walk out.

Maybe tell the manager why first - if you have the nerve to.




.......... Phil
 
On Tue, 22 Mar 2005 23:30:24 +1100, "Phil Allison"
<philallison@tpg.com.au> wrote:

"Poxy"
A friend was at Harvey Normans the other day, purchasing a plasma screen
TV.
After they'd negotiated the price - about $4,400 for an LG highish-res
panel, the sales guy then suggested they purchase a special component
cable
for hooking up their DVD player to the screen to achieve the best quality
from their new screen.

For demonstration, he switched the panel to split-screen mode showing the
same DVD title playing on each half, but connected by different cables. He
was attempting to imply that the marked difference between the two images
was due to the use of a "Monster" brand component video cable on one
input.
My friend gave me a call at the time and explained what the sales guy was
trying to say, and commented that the Monster side had better detail in
the
blacks and looked better than the other half. I told her that it sounded
like a scam and hold off for the moment - she could always purchase it at
a
later date, as he wasn't offering any great deal on the cable.

Subsequently, I worked out that they had hooked up the component output of
the DVD player to one side, and the composite output to the other, and was
then trying to claim that the improved picture was purely due to the
Monster
brand cable.

This strikes me as a blatantly dishonest and misleading demonstration -
the
salesman never stated that the difference in quality was largely (if not
entirely) due to the alternative signal format, rather he misrepresented
the
comparison with the goal of selling an obscenely overpriced cable of
dubious
benefit over a base-quality component cable.

Why? The 1m Monster cable costs $270.

Methinks a call to the ACCC is in order.



** Fake demonstrations have been standard practice for sales charlatans for
centuries - door to door vacuum cleaner salesmen had them perfected over
50 years ago. Almost any hi-fi salesman is expert at the art of creating
biased and false demonstrations.

The resident charlatan on aus.hi-fi is Trevor Wilson - but he is a rank
amateur compared to the reptiles in shiny suits that lurk in the posh,
up-market stores.

Monster is just about the smoothest con ever - a blatant, right in your
face scam.

If a shop even sells Monster Cables - I suggest you simply walk out.

Maybe tell the manager why first - if you have the nerve to.




.......... Phil
Click to expand...
That pretty, clear transclucent insulation over those fine tin plated
wire sheilds do look good though. i almost want to buy some thinking
about it.
 
Phil Allison wrote:
"Poxy"
A friend was at Harvey Normans the other day, purchasing a plasma
screen TV.
After they'd negotiated the price - about $4,400 for an LG
highish-res panel, the sales guy then suggested they purchase a
special component cable
for hooking up their DVD player to the screen to achieve the best
quality from their new screen.

For demonstration, he switched the panel to split-screen mode
showing the same DVD title playing on each half, but connected by
different cables. He was attempting to imply that the marked
difference between the two images was due to the use of a "Monster"
brand component video cable on one input.
My friend gave me a call at the time and explained what the sales
guy was trying to say, and commented that the Monster side had
better detail in the
blacks and looked better than the other half. I told her that it
sounded like a scam and hold off for the moment - she could always
purchase it at a
later date, as he wasn't offering any great deal on the cable.

Subsequently, I worked out that they had hooked up the component
output of the DVD player to one side, and the composite output to
the other, and was then trying to claim that the improved picture
was purely due to the Monster
brand cable.

This strikes me as a blatantly dishonest and misleading
demonstration - the
salesman never stated that the difference in quality was largely (if
not entirely) due to the alternative signal format, rather he
misrepresented the
comparison with the goal of selling an obscenely overpriced cable of
dubious
benefit over a base-quality component cable.

Why? The 1m Monster cable costs $270.

Methinks a call to the ACCC is in order.



** Fake demonstrations have been standard practice for sales
charlatans for centuries - door to door vacuum cleaner salesmen had
them perfected over 50 years ago. Almost any hi-fi salesman is
expert at the art of creating biased and false demonstrations.

The resident charlatan on aus.hi-fi is Trevor Wilson - but he is a
rank amateur compared to the reptiles in shiny suits that lurk in the
posh, up-market stores.

Monster is just about the smoothest con ever - a blatant, right in
your face scam.

If a shop even sells Monster Cables - I suggest you simply walk out.
Click to expand...

I think, though, that there is a difference between the "emperor has no
clothes" type approach seen in the Hi-Fi world, where a customer is
convinced that certain speaker cables sound better, where the only possible
deception is a relatively poor understanding of the subjectivity of
listening test, versus a live split-scren video comparison where the
difference is clearly evident to even the most ignorant viewer.

To me, the difference is more like switching between FM radio and a CD, and
claiming the clear difference heard is due to the RCA cables from the CD
player being more expensive than those used to connect the tuner.

Of course, there is nothing new about dodgy salesmen, I'm just a little
fired up because a friend almost got scammed by some lowly spiv. I imagine
the ACCC will set me straight as to the likelyhood of any positive action to
address this kind of scam (ie, little to none).
 
"Poxy"
I think, though, that there is a difference between the "emperor has no
clothes" type approach seen in the Hi-Fi world, where a customer is
convinced that certain speaker cables sound better, where the only
possible
deception is a relatively poor understanding of the subjectivity of
listening test,
Click to expand...

** Sales charlatans gain a person's trust first and then exploit their
naivety - that is how fake demos work. Whether by word, voice tone, facial
expression, body langauge, inference or whatever a deception is created in
the mind of the customer - a sale then follows. That is basic consumer
fraud.


versus a live split-scren video comparison where the
difference is clearly evident to even the most ignorant viewer.
Click to expand...

** It's a fake demo - a very blatant one.



I imagine
the ACCC will set me straight as to the likelyhood of any positive action
to
address this kind of scam (ie, little to none).
Click to expand...

** The right body in NSW is Fair Trading - you can get your friend to
file a complaint report. The complaint will be referred to the store - who
will simply deny.

Better if your friend HAD bought the Monster Cable, then you demo to him
that it makes no difference when tested correctly - then HE returns the
junk for a full refund with YOU as his witness on a busy Saturday morning.

Heaps of fun.



............. Phil
 
On Wed, 23 Mar 2005 00:36:59 +1100, "Phil Allison"
<philallison@tpg.com.au> wrote:


** Sales charlatans gain a person's trust first and then exploit their
naivety - that is how fake demos work. Whether by word, voice tone, facial
expression, body langauge, inference or whatever a deception is created in
the mind of the customer - a sale then follows. That is basic consumer
fraud.
Click to expand...

PHIL ALLISON LIKES TO POST HELP OCCAISIONALLY TO GAIN YOUR TRUST, BUT
DON'T BE FOOLED, HE IS A PAINFULL TROLL, WHO HURLS ABUSE AT EVERYONE.

** It's a fake demo - a very blatant one.
Click to expand...

PHIL ALLISON IS A FAKE WHEN HE PRETENDS TO CARE ABOUT HUMAN BEINGS.
A VERY BLATANT ONE.

** The right body in NSW is Fair Trading - you can get your friend to
file a complaint report. The complaint will be referred to the store - who
will simply deny.
Click to expand...

PHIL KNOWS ALL ABOUT FAIR TRADING...JUST ASK HIM ABOUT QUAD SPEAKERS.

Better if your friend HAD bought the Monster Cable, then you demo to him
that it makes no difference when tested correctly - then HE returns the
junk for a full refund with YOU as his witness on a busy Saturday morning.

Heaps of fun.
Click to expand...
A HINT OF WHAT PHIL IS REALLY LIKE. HE LIVES FOR ABUSIVE ARGUMENTS.


............ Phil Allison a vile troll.
Click to expand...
 
On Wed, 23 Mar 2005 12:24:36 +1100, "Phil Allison"
<philallison@tpg.com.au> wrote:

** The above anonymous, demented usenet menace needs to be dealt with - big
time.
Click to expand...

LOL !! SPOKEN FROM A MANIAC WHO HAS STARTED 5 THREADS IN 2 DAYS!!
In aus.hi-fi ON THE SAME TOPIC !! hurling insults at everyone, when
a 2 minute local phone call in sydney to Peter Stein of ME amplifiers
would have answered his questions..but he would rather not do that.
No Phil Allison prefers to have flaming arguments in an attempt to
embarrass an ME dealer called Trevor Wilson.Even when TW answers his
questions he calls him (and these are phil Allsion's words) "A fucking
liar"...Phil has proven nothing except that he is an idiot...and his
only reply is to try and silence people that might expose his
stupidity and evil vindictiveness to other newsgroups.

But no need to take my word for it, or even Phil Allison's...just go
to aus.hi-fi and see what's been happening there in the last few
days...or ask ANYONE and I mean ANYONE in the newsgroup about Phil's
behaviour....5 threads on the one stupid topic. insane!!

He threatens those who expose him..I could imagine his type at a
crooked Casino..bashing patrons in alleyways.


........... Phil
Click to expand...
 
<abc@123.com> = Criminal, libelling troll



** The above anonymous, demented usenet menace needs to be dealt with - big
time.





............ Phil
 
Poxy wrote:

A friend was at Harvey Normans the other day, purchasing a plasma screen
TV. After they'd negotiated the price - about $4,400 for an LG highish-res
panel, the sales guy then suggested they purchase a special component
cable for hooking up their DVD player to the screen to achieve the best
quality from their new screen.

For demonstration, he switched the panel to split-screen mode showing the
same DVD title playing on each half, but connected by different cables. He
was attempting to imply that the marked difference between the two images
was due to the use of a "Monster" brand component video cable on one
input. My friend gave me a call at the time and explained what the sales
guy was trying to say, and commented that the Monster side had better
detail in the blacks and looked better than the other half. I told her
that it sounded like a scam and hold off for the moment - she could always
purchase it at a later date, as he wasn't offering any great deal on the
cable.

Subsequently, I worked out that they had hooked up the component output of
the DVD player to one side, and the composite output to the other, and was
then trying to claim that the improved picture was purely due to the
Monster brand cable.

This strikes me as a blatantly dishonest and misleading demonstration -
the salesman never stated that the difference in quality was largely (if
not entirely) due to the alternative signal format, rather he
misrepresented the comparison with the goal of selling an obscenely
overpriced cable of dubious benefit over a base-quality component cable.

Why? The 1m Monster cable costs $270.

Methinks a call to the ACCC is in order.
Click to expand...
Go back to the store, ask to see the demo again but the brand of the cables
reversed. The expensive cable should be worse.

Say its all a scam, and do a chargeback on the credit card (say its
fraud/misrepresentation), return the TV. Tell them you will happily go to
court.

gtoomey
 
<abc@123.com> wrote in message
news:mve141h20smb210eckup5roka30e8e5u24@4ax.com...
:
Mr/Ms/Mrs abc could you please not **SHOUT ALL THE TIME**.
It is occasionally needed for emphasis but don't go over the
top.

Regards TT
 
Gregory Toomey wrote:

Go back to the store, ask to see the demo again but the brand of the cables
reversed. The expensive cable should be worse.
Click to expand...
I don't understand what you mean by this.

The cables were different types as well as brands.

Are you saying the sales droid should use a monster brand composite
cable and a generic component cable? That definitely would show the
fallacy of the test, and hence (unless the droid is really stupid -
which is not unknown) he probably wouldn't do it that way.
 
On Wed, 23 Mar 2005 12:45:55 +0800, "TT" <swat@swat.com.au> wrote:

abc@123.com> wrote in message
news:mve141h20smb210eckup5roka30e8e5u24@4ax.com...
:
Mr/Ms/Mrs abc could you please not **SHOUT ALL THE TIME**.
It is occasionally needed for emphasis but don't go over the
top.

Regards TT
Click to expand...
I don't know, Terry. I think Phil's present behaviour probably
justifies shouting.
 
"Gregory Toomey" <nospam@bigpond.com> wrote in message
news:3ac15fF6afalcU1@individual.net...
Poxy wrote:

A friend was at Harvey Normans the other day, purchasing a plasma screen
TV. After they'd negotiated the price - about $4,400 for an LG
highish-res
panel, the sales guy then suggested they purchase a special component
cable for hooking up their DVD player to the screen to achieve the best
quality from their new screen.

For demonstration, he switched the panel to split-screen mode showing the
same DVD title playing on each half, but connected by different cables.
He
was attempting to imply that the marked difference between the two images
was due to the use of a "Monster" brand component video cable on one
input. My friend gave me a call at the time and explained what the sales
guy was trying to say, and commented that the Monster side had better
detail in the blacks and looked better than the other half. I told her
that it sounded like a scam and hold off for the moment - she could
always
purchase it at a later date, as he wasn't offering any great deal on the
cable.

Subsequently, I worked out that they had hooked up the component output
of
the DVD player to one side, and the composite output to the other, and
was
then trying to claim that the improved picture was purely due to the
Monster brand cable.

This strikes me as a blatantly dishonest and misleading demonstration -
the salesman never stated that the difference in quality was largely (if
not entirely) due to the alternative signal format, rather he
misrepresented the comparison with the goal of selling an obscenely
overpriced cable of dubious benefit over a base-quality component cable.

Why? The 1m Monster cable costs $270.

Methinks a call to the ACCC is in order.

Go back to the store, ask to see the demo again but the brand of the
cables
reversed. The expensive cable should be worse.

Say its all a scam, and do a chargeback on the credit card (say its
fraud/misrepresentation), return the TV. Tell them you will happily go to
court.

gtoomey
Click to expand...
I'd be doing the same, or similar! Go to the store and make out you want to
purchase the TV, pick a nice big expensive one! Then when they do the test,
show interest - then grab a different cable and substitute the Monster, or
if possible put the Monster cable on the poorer output, whatever so that it
is clearly evident that the salesman is trying to scam you and is wrong,

Then, talking very loudly, announce to all listening (i.e. customers) about
the scam, how dishonest they are - maybe even complain to the manager - and
promptly tell them you have no intention of dealing with such people and
walk out!

I'm sure the fact that you just announced to all customers that they are
dishonest, as well as the sale of a $5k+ TV that they think they just lost,
will no doubt ruffle a few feathers!!! Definite fun!!!
 
"paul packer"

I don't know, Terry. I think Phil's present behaviour probably
justifies shouting.
Click to expand...


** So you wanna buy me a beer do you - PP ??

I'm choosy who I drink with and you are way off the list.




............ Phil
 
"Martin, VK2UMJ" <vk2umj@yahoo.invalid> wrote in message
news:4241124d_1@news.iprimus.com.au...
I'm sure the fact that you just announced to all customers that they are
dishonest, as well as the sale of a $5k+ TV that they think they just
lost,
will no doubt ruffle a few feathers!!! Definite fun!!!
Click to expand...
Strange way to get your jollies.
If you think the other customers would care, then you haven't actually tried
it, have you?

MrT.
 
E-Mail Gerry Harvey, and tell him the story, Might get a response,
Then get someone to go back to hardly normal, and as someone said get the
salesman [insist, make a lot of noise] to use Monster cables on both feeds,
and watch him tell you that one of the cables is faulty.
bassett

"Gregory Toomey" <nospam@bigpond.com> wrote in message
news:3ac15fF6afalcU1@individual.net...
Poxy wrote:

A friend was at Harvey Normans the other day, purchasing a plasma screen
TV. After they'd negotiated the price - about $4,400 for an LG
highish-res
panel, the sales guy then suggested they purchase a special component
cable for hooking up their DVD player to the screen to achieve the best
quality from their new screen.

For demonstration, he switched the panel to split-screen mode showing the
same DVD title playing on each half, but connected by different cables.
He
was attempting to imply that the marked difference between the two images
was due to the use of a "Monster" brand component video cable on one
input. My friend gave me a call at the time and explained what the sales
guy was trying to say, and commented that the Monster side had better
detail in the blacks and looked better than the other half. I told her
that it sounded like a scam and hold off for the moment - she could
always
purchase it at a later date, as he wasn't offering any great deal on the
cable.

Subsequently, I worked out that they had hooked up the component output
of
the DVD player to one side, and the composite output to the other, and
was
then trying to claim that the improved picture was purely due to the
Monster brand cable.

This strikes me as a blatantly dishonest and misleading demonstration -
the salesman never stated that the difference in quality was largely (if
not entirely) due to the alternative signal format, rather he
misrepresented the comparison with the goal of selling an obscenely
overpriced cable of dubious benefit over a base-quality component cable.

Why? The 1m Monster cable costs $270.

Methinks a call to the ACCC is in order.

Go back to the store, ask to see the demo again but the brand of the
cables
reversed. The expensive cable should be worse.

Say its all a scam, and do a chargeback on the credit card (say its
fraud/misrepresentation), return the TV. Tell them you will happily go to
court.

gtoomey
Click to expand...
 
Phil Allison wrote:
"paul packer"


I don't know, Terry. I think Phil's present behaviour probably
justifies shouting.




** So you wanna buy me a beer do you - PP ??

I'm choosy who I drink with and you are way off the list.




........... Phil


LOL. Nice one.
Click to expand...

Matthew
 
"Phil Allison" <philallison@tpg.com.au> wrote in message
news:3acj2aF6a44lnU1@individual.net...
"paul packer"


I don't know, Terry. I think Phil's present behaviour probably
justifies shouting.



** So you wanna buy me a beer do you - PP ??

I'm choosy who I drink with and you are way off the list.
Click to expand...
You drink alone...
 
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