Generators and switch mode power supplies

[Trevor Wilson]

"terryc" <newssevenspam-spam@woa.com.au> wrote in message
news:498a589d$0$96977$c30e37c6@pit-reader.telstra.net...

On Thu, 05 Feb 2009 13:15:12 +1100, Trevor Wilson wrote:


**Indeed. It's amazing how stupid some people can be. I'm clearing 30-odd
cu
Metres of soil and rock from under my house. I'm doing it by hand, or
with
electrically powered tools only. It's bloody hard yakka.

Been there done that when we were younger.
If it requires drainage, make sure that the drainage hose is below the
concrete slab.

**Yep. Already done. Badly, but the previous owner did it. I intend
improving significantly.

A few
smartarses have suggested I should hire a DingoT and get the job done in
a few days. Sheesh! There's no air flow under there and almost no viable
method to push much air through either. I'd be lucky to last 30 mins.

You could probably hire a mine ventilator tube as well. The real problem
is when they ggraze the foundations.

**I think I'll do it by hand. It's good for the soul and feels great to jump
in the pool after a hard day's digging.


--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au

 

[Sylvia Else]

David L. Jones wrote:

On Feb 5, 10:41 am, Sylvia Else <syl...@not.at.this.address> wrote:
Bob Parker wrote:
On 4/02/2009 22:09 Sylvia Else wrote:
Given the parlous state of Australia's power systems, I've been
considering buying a standby generator. One marketing point of some of
the inverter bases models is their suitability for 'sensitive
electronics' with computers given as an example. This appears to be
based on the fact that they'll provide a consistent sinewave output.
But given that computers invariably use switch-mode power supplies,
are they actually going to care what waveform they see - from square
wave thru 'modified sinewave' thru pure sinewave?
Sylvia.
I haven't experienced any power interruptions here in Sydney for
many months so the supply's not exactly parlous where I am.
NSW is in a better condition. The other states show predicted reserve
shortfalls in the coming months.

http://www.nemmco.com.au/data/MToutlook.htm

In some ways, though, reserve shortfalls are not such a huge concern,
because the resulting blackouts get shared around, with no individual
group of cumstomers subject to extened periods without power.

Of greater concern are overloaded transformers. If they fail it can take
quite a long time for supplies to be restored. In periods of hot weather
such events have been known.

So what's the big deal if it *does* happen?
Not the end of the world.
Go for a walk, go shopping, go visit a friend, read a book by torch or
candle light, and countless other things you can do without mains
power.

It's not for you to tell me how I should seek to apply such resouces as
I have to avoid the consequences of power cuts. You may not find them
annoying.

I do.

Sylvia.

 

[Sylvia Else]

David L. Jones wrote:

On Feb 5, 3:45 pm, Sylvia Else <syl...@not.at.this.address> wrote:
David L. Jones wrote:
On Feb 5, 10:41 am, Sylvia Else <syl...@not.at.this.address> wrote:
Bob Parker wrote:
On 4/02/2009 22:09 Sylvia Else wrote:
Given the parlous state of Australia's power systems, I've been
considering buying a standby generator. One marketing point of some of
the inverter bases models is their suitability for 'sensitive
electronics' with computers given as an example. This appears to be
based on the fact that they'll provide a consistent sinewave output.
But given that computers invariably use switch-mode power supplies,
are they actually going to care what waveform they see - from square
wave thru 'modified sinewave' thru pure sinewave?
Sylvia.
I haven't experienced any power interruptions here in Sydney for
many months so the supply's not exactly parlous where I am.
NSW is in a better condition. The other states show predicted reserve
shortfalls in the coming months.
http://www.nemmco.com.au/data/MToutlook.htm
In some ways, though, reserve shortfalls are not such a huge concern,
because the resulting blackouts get shared around, with no individual
group of cumstomers subject to extened periods without power.
Of greater concern are overloaded transformers. If they fail it can take
quite a long time for supplies to be restored. In periods of hot weather
such events have been known.
So what's the big deal if it *does* happen?
Not the end of the world.
Go for a walk, go shopping, go visit a friend, read a book by torch or
candle light, and countless other things you can do without mains
power.
It's not for you to tell me how I should seek to apply such resouces as
I have to avoid the consequences of power cuts. You may not find them
annoying.

I do.

Fair enough.
It might help then if you tell us what things you might need to keep
powered during a black-out.

I asked a very specific question in relation to the tolerance of split
mode power supplies to variations in input waveform. That's all I asked.

Sylvia.

 

[David L. Jones]

On Feb 5, 3:45 pm, Sylvia Else <syl...@not.at.this.address> wrote:

David L. Jones wrote:
On Feb 5, 10:41 am, Sylvia Else <syl...@not.at.this.address> wrote:
Bob Parker wrote:
On 4/02/2009 22:09 Sylvia Else wrote:
Given the parlous state of Australia's power systems, I've been
considering buying a standby generator. One marketing point of some of
the inverter bases models is their suitability for 'sensitive
electronics' with computers given as an example. This appears to be
based on the fact that they'll provide a consistent sinewave output.
But given that computers invariably use switch-mode power supplies,
are they actually going to care what waveform they see - from square
wave thru 'modified sinewave' thru pure sinewave?
Sylvia.
I haven't experienced any power interruptions here in Sydney for
many months so the supply's not exactly parlous where I am.
NSW is in a better condition. The other states show predicted reserve
shortfalls in the coming months.

http://www.nemmco.com.au/data/MToutlook.htm

In some ways, though, reserve shortfalls are not such a huge concern,
because the resulting blackouts get shared around, with no individual
group of cumstomers subject to extened periods without power.

Of greater concern are overloaded transformers. If they fail it can take
quite a long time for supplies to be restored. In periods of hot weather
such events have been known.

So what's the big deal if it *does* happen?
Not the end of the world.
Go for a walk, go shopping, go visit a friend, read a book by torch or
candle light, and countless other things you can do without mains
power.

It's not for you to tell me how I should seek to apply such resouces as
I have to avoid the consequences of power cuts. You may not find them
annoying.

I do.

Fair enough.
It might help then if you tell us what things you might need to keep
powered during a black-out.
You've already mentioned the computer as an example, what else?
How long and frequent are your typical power-outs?
How long do you want a generator to last?
Maybe a UPS solution is better suited to your needs?

Always more than one way to skin a cat. Take your computer for
example, laptops draw much less power than desktops, and can handle
black-outs of several hours no problems. Add a small UPS to keep a
modem and some other stuff going and you are still in business. I was
happily surfing the web and doing work on my phone while I was stuck
in the lift the other week for example.

Dave.

 

[Bob Parker]

On 5/02/2009 16:33 Sylvia Else wrote:

I asked a very specific question in relation to the tolerance of split
mode power supplies to variations in input waveform. That's all I asked.

I'm really thick and also my troll filters have blocked out a lot of
recent discussions.

Can someone please tell me what a 'split mode' power supply is? I'd
never heard the term before, and a Google search mainly brings up the
newsgroup threads where they keep getting talked about.

Thanks.

 

[Bob Parker]

On 5/02/2009 05:25 a t e c 7 7 wrote:

Bob Parker wrote:
On 5/02/2009 00:20 a t e c 7 7 wrote:
Bob Parker wrote:
On 4/02/2009 22:09 Sylvia Else wrote:
you would do well to ignore this poster , stupid is and silly
troll.... asyou will find out .

Huh? I'm not a troll. At least I don't think I am...


saliva is though

plonk

 

[Mark Harriss]

Trevor Wilson wrote:

A few
smartarses have suggested I should hire a DingoT and get the job done in
a few days. Sheesh! There's no air flow under there and almost no viable
method to push much air through either. I'd be lucky to last 30 mins.
You could probably hire a mine ventilator tube as well. The real problem
is when they ggraze the foundations.

**I think I'll do it by hand. It's good for the soul and feels great to jump
in the pool after a hard day's digging.

I once saw an excavator made by Hitachi or someone similar that was made
to drive through a standard 80 cm doorway and was used in Japan mainly
in office blocks where it could ride the elevators. One of those and a
pair of ducted extractor fans would be kind of handy. I've just shifted
30 odd cu M but it was easy sandy stuff outdoors and replaced it with
35 tonnes of cement, and I was glad to hire a guy to excavate for $300.

 

[David L. Jones]

On Feb 5, 7:52 pm, Bob Parker <bobp.deletet...@bluebottle.com> wrote:

On 5/02/2009 16:33 Sylvia Else wrote:

I asked a very specific question in relation to the tolerance of split
mode power supplies to variations in input waveform. That's all I asked.

I'm really thick and also my troll filters have blocked out a lot of
recent discussions.

Can someone please tell me what a 'split mode' power supply is?

I believe it's a typo, she said "switch mode" in her first post.

Dave.

 

[a t e c 7 7]

Bob Parker wrote:

On 5/02/2009 05:25 a t e c 7 7 wrote:
Bob Parker wrote:
On 5/02/2009 00:20 a t e c 7 7 wrote:
Bob Parker wrote:
On 4/02/2009 22:09 Sylvia Else wrote:
you would do well to ignore this poster , stupid is and silly
troll.... asyou will find out .

Huh? I'm not a troll. At least I don't think I am...


saliva is though


plonk




weakling

 

[Bob Parker]

On 5/02/2009 22:17 a t e c 7 7 wrote:

Bob Parker wrote:
On 5/02/2009 05:25 a t e c 7 7 wrote:
Bob Parker wrote:
On 5/02/2009 00:20 a t e c 7 7 wrote:
Bob Parker wrote:
On 4/02/2009 22:09 Sylvia Else wrote:
you would do well to ignore this poster , stupid is and silly
troll.... asyou will find out .

Huh? I'm not a troll. At least I don't think I am...


saliva is though


plonk




weakling

De-plonk.... it took a while to work out what your comment meant and
I suspect you might be correct.

 

[atec 77]

Bob Parker wrote:

On 5/02/2009 22:17 a t e c 7 7 wrote:
Bob Parker wrote:
On 5/02/2009 05:25 a t e c 7 7 wrote:
Bob Parker wrote:
On 5/02/2009 00:20 a t e c 7 7 wrote:
Bob Parker wrote:
On 4/02/2009 22:09 Sylvia Else wrote:
you would do well to ignore this poster , stupid is and silly
troll.... asyou will find out .

Huh? I'm not a troll. At least I don't think I am...


saliva is though


plonk




weakling


De-plonk.... it took a while to work out what your comment meant and
I suspect you might be correct.



She has that effect.

all of us get accused at some stage but saliva is a certainty as you
will see.

What was the question again

 

[Sylvia Else]

David L. Jones wrote:

On Feb 5, 7:52 pm, Bob Parker <bobp.deletet...@bluebottle.com> wrote:
On 5/02/2009 16:33 Sylvia Else wrote:

I asked a very specific question in relation to the tolerance of split
mode power supplies to variations in input waveform. That's all I asked.
I'm really thick and also my troll filters have blocked out a lot of
recent discussions.

Can someone please tell me what a 'split mode' power supply is?

I believe it's a typo, she said "switch mode" in her first post.

Dave.

Though I did use the expression "split mode" in the subject of another
thread. No one commented then, but its's true that it doesn't seem to be
a recognised alternative wording. Put it down to my aging brain cells.

Sylvia.

 

[Trevor Wilson]

"Mark Harriss" <billy@blartco.co.uk> wrote in message
news:cq6dnZEXEsxIIhfUnZ2dnUVZ8rSdnZ2d@westnet.com.au...

Trevor Wilson wrote:
A few
smartarses have suggested I should hire a DingoT and get the job done
in
a few days. Sheesh! There's no air flow under there and almost no
viable
method to push much air through either. I'd be lucky to last 30 mins.
You could probably hire a mine ventilator tube as well. The real problem
is when they ggraze the foundations.

**I think I'll do it by hand. It's good for the soul and feels great to
jump in the pool after a hard day's digging.




I once saw an excavator made by Hitachi or someone similar that was made
to drive through a standard 80 cm doorway and was used in Japan mainly
in office blocks where it could ride the elevators. One of those and a
pair of ducted extractor fans would be kind of handy. I've just shifted
30 odd cu M but it was easy sandy stuff outdoors and replaced it with
35 tonnes of cement, and I was glad to hire a guy to excavate for $300.

**As an old mate, of Italian descent used to say:

"We came, we saw, we concreted."


--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au

 

[Mark Harriss]

Trevor Wilson wrote:

I once saw an excavator made by Hitachi or someone similar that was made
to drive through a standard 80 cm doorway and was used in Japan mainly
in office blocks where it could ride the elevators. One of those and a
pair of ducted extractor fans would be kind of handy. I've just shifted
30 odd cu M but it was easy sandy stuff outdoors and replaced it with
35 tonnes of cement, and I was glad to hire a guy to excavate for $300.

**As an old mate, of Italian descent used to say:

"We came, we saw, we concreted."

There's a big Italian concretor community up this way, that's a very
appropriate saying.

Now all I have to do is get the blockwork up and the three phase
connected.

 

[atec 77]

Mark Harriss wrote:

Trevor Wilson wrote:
I once saw an excavator made by Hitachi or someone similar that was made
to drive through a standard 80 cm doorway and was used in Japan mainly
in office blocks where it could ride the elevators. One of those and a
pair of ducted extractor fans would be kind of handy. I've just shifted
30 odd cu M but it was easy sandy stuff outdoors and replaced it with
35 tonnes of cement, and I was glad to hire a guy to excavate for $300.

**As an old mate, of Italian descent used to say:

"We came, we saw, we concreted."


There's a big Italian concretor community up this way, that's a very
appropriate saying.

Now all I have to do is get the blockwork up and the three phase
connected.

Good luck getting a good cabler this time of year let alone a sparky who

even bothers to show up

 

[terryc]

On Fri, 06 Feb 2009 07:56:56 +1100, Trevor Wilson wrote:

**As an old mate, of Italian descent used to say:

"We came, we saw, we concreted."

An Italian neighbour ws discussing my pruning of the orange trees and gave
me his advice about what to do to help them recover from the heavy pruning
brought on by rampant bug infestation.

It basically involved heavy fertilising with compost then mulching
all withn a foot around the trunk.

After he left I explained to chief gardener that his advice wasn't that
useful. He did is that way because they all grew their citrus, figs, etc
tree in little holes in the concrete wasteland that is usual in italian
backyards. I was just going to stick to putting the mulch around the
drip line about 4' & 5' out from the trunk as suit3ed our trees.

 

[Mark Harriss]

atec 77 wrote:

Good luck getting a good cabler this time of year let alone a sparky who
even bothers to show up

Already sorted, and the labour is free too.

 

[atec 77]

Mark Harriss wrote:

atec 77 wrote:

Good luck getting a good cabler this time of year let alone a sparky
who even bothers to show up

Already sorted, and the labour is free too.
who's sister are you doing ?

 

[rebel]

On 06 Feb 2009 05:17:29 GMT, terryc <newssevenspam-spam@woa.com.au> wrote:

An Italian neighbour ws discussing my pruning of the orange trees and gave
me his advice about what to do to help them recover from the heavy pruning
brought on by rampant bug infestation.

It basically involved heavy fertilising with compost then mulching
all withn a foot around the trunk.

After he left I explained to chief gardener that his advice wasn't that
useful. He did is that way because they all grew their citrus, figs, etc
tree in little holes in the concrete wasteland that is usual in italian
backyards. I was just going to stick to putting the mulch around the
drip line about 4' & 5' out from the trunk as suit3ed our trees.

Best fertiliser for citrus is cats. Dripline is fine.

 

[terryc]

On Fri, 06 Feb 2009 18:30:37 +0800, rebel wrote:

Best fertiliser for citrus is cats. Dripline is fine.

Unfortunately some around here insists they be taken for a humane death.