Driver to drive?

[mike]

On 11/19/2015 1:12 AM, Jan Panteltje wrote:

On a sunny day (Thu, 19 Nov 2015 18:35:09 +1000) it happened "David Eather"
eather@tpg.com.au> wrote in <op.x8b94vrlwei6gd@phenom-pc>:

No I think you exaggerate. I have never seen a *fire cell deliver 1/3 of
the printed capacity - I think it is normally even less!
Seriously to the OP, avoid *fire brands like the plague, apart from the
dodge capacity labels most of them don't last long either. They will
probably be the most expensive batteries you evet buy in terms of total
power delivered and it will let you down when you need it most.

Well, do you actually have one?

I have two identical flashlights.
One has a *fire battery, the other has a cell retrieved from a
very old and very dead
laptop battery pack. The *fire light is dimmer from the outset.
I only use the *fire light when I can't find the other one
and it still gets charged about twice as often.

I bought two brand new, still in the shrink wrap, 4000maH Ultrafires
and a charger for 25-cents at a garage sale.
After using them, I want my quarter back.
And the charger charges two in parallel. If you insert cells with very
different state of charge, sparks ensue. I never left it in that condition,
so I don't know how warm things would get.

Here is mine, now in use for almost 2 years:
http://panteltje.com/pub/ultra_fire_batteries_and_flashlight_IMG_5158.JPG

And watch how well protected these are:
http://panteltje.com/pub/utra_fire_protected_against_almost_everything_IMG_5162.JPG

The flashlight melted at some point, but the batteries are still going strong.

I have not checked the capacity, but it sure did not go out prematurely,
One of these batteries that came with that flashlight has a bit more self-discharge, so I kept the good one in the flashlight,
and the bad one as spare, check the charge every now and then, came with charger too that actually works.

And I have no fear keeping this in my pocket.

And I'm sure it came by plane, how long does a steam boat from China take?


You aussies suffer from hanging upside down, Spero para-noia

ANYTHING can go wrong at any time, your chances of pilot error are bigger than from fire batteries.

;-)

My spell-sker insists aussies is spelled as pussies

 

[Jan Panteltje]

On a sunny day (Thu, 19 Nov 2015 01:46:11 -0800) it happened mike
<ham789@netzero.net> wrote in <n2k5m5$udv$1@dont-email.me>:

I have two identical flashlights.
One has a *fire battery, the other has a cell retrieved from a
very old and very dead
laptop battery pack. The *fire light is dimmer from the outset.
I only use the *fire light when I can't find the other one
and it still gets charged about twice as often.

I bought two brand new, still in the shrink wrap, 4000maH Ultrafires
and a charger for 25-cents at a garage sale.
After using them, I want my quarter back.
And the charger charges two in parallel. If you insert cells with very
different state of charge, sparks ensue. I never left it in that condition,
so I don't know how warm things would get.

Well I really do not know,
2 years ago I posted this here
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!searchin/sci.electronics.design/Re$3A$209V$20Battery$20or$202$20x$20AAA$20with$209V$20Converter|sort:relevance/sci.electronics.design/DbgPnYXfGcY/KndUBmUUj7AJ
(scroll down, it says:
"
here one of my flashlights, with battery out:
http://panteltje.com/pub/Cree_rechargable_flashlight_IMG_4478.JPG
Li-ion, rechargeable, 3.7V 3.2Ah, LED, has several brightness stages,
flashing mode too, came with charger.
I have several smaller Cree ones, those all have Eneloop AAA those,
and will still work a year after charging.
All ebay stuff.
The big Cree has as defect that it melted the plastic around the LED
when I left it on to test how long the battery lasted.
Now the beam looks a bit different...
"
So it delivered a real amount of power for a long time, the flashlight melted,
the batteries are still OK.
Fixed the flashlight, it was not properly assembled....
So far I have no complaints.
Since I took out the spare utra-fire battery just now,
I am recharging it in all by itself in that 2 x charger you mention
and that is still on.
No smoke from that area yet..
It was at 3.85 V, but OK..

Yes, sure I read those stories in the news of people getting burned to death or something using Li-ion or whatever...
There is one in every laptop?
Batteries is a consumable, I have plenty more problems with lead acid, be it sealed or
just normal car batteries, than with these Li-ions or lipos.

It is important that the flashlight works for a reasonable amount of time if you have not used it.
Since I DO use it more often .. I dunno, but this spare battery I am charging now
was still near almost? full, and that was a bad one.

I have eneloops in a smaller LED flashlight, those work OK too,
and are used several times a day, for example for inspection of stuff.

If yer life depends on it, then you need to keep several flashlights maybe with several battery technologies,
a fire maker, drinking water, gun to shoot deer, and of course your cellphone
to call for help.. ;-)

I do not normally buy at flee markets....
ebay is much better.

And that is my experience.

Maybe somebody should measure discharge times....
Maybe somebody has.

Still it may be different for different batches / sources.

 

[Jan Panteltje]

On a sunny day (Thu, 19 Nov 2015 13:45:54 -0000 (UTC)) it happened John Dodo
<always.look@message.header> wrote in <n2kjqh$f6a$2@dont-email.me>:

Someone who claims to be into technology should be able to quote more
than one level. Most of this stuff is a repeat of its prior post.

I post from experience with thrse batteries,
something you do not seem to have and so should shut the f*ck up.

At the most I can see you as an undercover agent for 'brand name' batteries.
BTW 'brand' in Dutch means: FIRE.

Or maybe you also walk with head down there under?

 

[Bill Bowden]

"Adrian Jansen" <adrian@qq.vv.net> wrote in message
news:564d6ac6$0$1596$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com...

On 19/11/2015 1:45 PM, Bill Bowden wrote:
Are these batteries good? Seems cheap for an 8 amp-hour Li-Ion battery.
You
get two for $7.77 plus $2 shipping, or maybe $5 apiece..


http://www.ebay.com/itm/2Pcs-26650-8000mAh-3-7v-Li-ion-Rechargeable-Battery-Cell-For-Electric-Tools-/111819891266?hash=item1a08fc2242:g:AfoAAOSw14xWKZ1t


DESCRIPTION:
Quantity:2
Standard voltage is 3.7V,
the voltage of full charge & empty condition is 4.2v & 2.5v respectively
Particularly suitable for flashlight, electric tools, electric bicycles,
electric vehicles
Capacity: 8000mAh
Voltage: 3.7V
Material: Li-ion
Max Charge voltage: 4.20 Ąŕ 0.05V
Dimension: 67 mm (H)x 26 mm (Dia)
Color:Green

Package included:
2x UltraFire Green 26650 8000mAh Batteries

Chinese mAH are about as well defined as the currency.

It seems that even the better ones quote figures which should be mWH, not
mAH. At 3.7 volts, it makes a difference of a factor 3.7, which seems
about right.

Yes, that seems about right mWH instead of mAH. I went shopping at Fry's
today and couldn't find any LI batteries over 2500mAH and they were 12
bucks each. I did see a new item I hadn't seen before. A 10,000 mAH 'D' NiMh
cell for 10 bucks. It was in a package of 2 for $19.95. But I already have
several 4000 mAH Ni-Cad 'D' cells that still work. I see a lot of used cell
phone batteries at swap meets for $1 each, so I could parallel 2 or 3 to get
a higher capacity.
.. . .






--- news://freenews.netfront.net/ - complaints: news@netfront.net ---

 

[Jan Panteltje]

On a sunny day (Fri, 20 Nov 2015 10:27:43 +1000) it happened "David Eather"
<eather@tpg.com.au> wrote in <op.x8dh8hgnwei6gd@phenom-pc>:

My spell-sker insists aussies is spelled as pussies

Better get that checked - racial vilification is not pretty

Screenshot:
aussies File: ispell.tmp







hello aussies

0: pussies

----
It suggest pussies.
Its a good spell-sjeker ;-)


I'v been reading that site news.au. something a while back,
and really I've been down under, and it is a nice place (mainly outside the city),
but what I get from your news site is that they are severely insane and I have scrapped it of the list of places to go to.

The scientific explanation is that walking upside down may cause it.

Racial? You mean what you did to the Aboriginal?


Was not down under a punishment colony for UK criminals at one time,
they broke free and now rule there?
Got old, old women talk prevails, their politics are US slaved, insane rules.
What you do to fugitives... What you do to people who lived their and contributed to your economy for years
and the deport them for ?nothing? Some leader even stranger than the other?

NOT a good place to go.

 

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Thu, 19 Nov 2015 18:35:09 +1000, "David Eather" <eather@tpg.com.au>
wrote:

No I think you exaggerate. I have never seen a *fire cell deliver 1/3 of
the printed capacity - I think it is normally even less!

1/3 is typical, but it's not all lying on the specs. The battery
capacity (ma-hr) decreases with increased current draw. The batteries
are usually specified at small currents that are hardly anywhere near
where the battery will eventually be used. Typically, I find
discharge curves that look like this:
<http://www.richtek.com/battery-management/img/battery-discharge.png>
For a 2000 ma-hr rated battery, batteries are tested at 0.2C (400 ma)
down to 2.75v and used at maybe 2C (2 amps) in a flashlight. The
higher operating current is going to cause some drop in capacity.

I tend to buy better cells these days, but unfortunately have run into
some counterfeits:
<https://www.google.com/#q=counterfeit+18650+batteries>
Notice that even the awful "fire" type batteries are being faked.

Seriously to the OP, avoid *fire brands like the plague, apart from the
dodge capacity labels most of them don't last long either. They will
probably be the most expensive batteries you evet buy in terms of total
power delivered and it will let you down when you need it most.

Yep. I had to learn that lesson the hard way. All of the "fire"
brand cells were well below rated capacity. For example, I tested an
UltraFire 3000 ma-hr cell at 1C (3A) and got 850 ma-hr:
<http://802.11junk.com/jeffl/LiPo/Ultrafire%20LiPo%203000%20ma-hr%2018650%20test.jpg>
I didn't have time to test it at 0.2C but my guess(tm) is that it
would produce about an 1000 ma-hr capacity. I've seen similar results
with other "fire" brand cells.

Note the improvised battery holder. For high currents, it's
necessary:
<http://802.11junk.com/jeffl/LiPo/Ultrafire%2018650%20test.jpg>

Everyone lies, but that's ok because nobody understands the numbers.

--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

 

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Thu, 19 Nov 2015 09:12:43 GMT, Jan Panteltje
<pNaOnStPeAlMtje@yahoo.com> wrote:

Here is mine, now in use for almost 2 years:
http://panteltje.com/pub/ultra_fire_batteries_and_flashlight_IMG_5158.JPG

Yes, but was it a real or counterfeit UltraFire battery?
<http://www.ultrafire.net/shownews.asp?id=60>
<https://www.google.com/#q=counterfeit+ultrafire>
According to the "real" UltraFire web pile, they didn't make cells
over 3000 ma-hr, making your 3200 ma-hr cell a genuine counterfeit.


--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

 

[Spehro Pefhany]

On Thu, 19 Nov 2015 19:32:33 -0500, legg <legg@nospam.magma.ca> wrote:

On Wed, 18 Nov 2015 19:45:06 -0800, "Bill Bowden"
bperryb@bowdenshobbycircuits.info> wrote:

Are these batteries good? Seems cheap for an 8 amp-hour Li-Ion battery. You
get two for $7.77 plus $2 shipping, or maybe $5 apiece..


http://www.ebay.com/itm/2Pcs-26650-8000mAh-3-7v-Li-ion-Rechargeable-Battery-Cell-For-Electric-Tools-/111819891266?hash=item1a08fc2242:g:AfoAAOSw14xWKZ1t


Some batteries of this brand name are reviewed and dissassembled on
thi website:

http://www.lygte-info.dk/info/indexBatteriesAndChargers UK.html

They don't come off well.
Some samples had evidence of pre-use in other application formats.

RL

I mistakedly bought a couple 18650 Ultraf*re batteries- far less than
marked capacity- I dissected one- it was not a used cell, just poorly
made and significantly lighter than a good one from a reputable
manufacturer.

It's kind of interesting when you open them up- the energy is still in
there, of course, and bits will spark and smoke when you breach the
film separator barrier.



--sp



--
Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany
Amazon link for AoE 3rd Edition: http://tinyurl.com/ntrpwu8
Microchip link for 2015 Masters in Phoenix: http://tinyurl.com/l7g2k48

 

[legg]

On Fri, 20 Nov 2015 12:10:54 -0500, Spehro Pefhany
<speffSNIP@interlogDOTyou.knowwhat> wrote:

On Thu, 19 Nov 2015 19:32:33 -0500, legg <legg@nospam.magma.ca> wrote:

On Wed, 18 Nov 2015 19:45:06 -0800, "Bill Bowden"
bperryb@bowdenshobbycircuits.info> wrote:

Are these batteries good? Seems cheap for an 8 amp-hour Li-Ion battery. You
get two for $7.77 plus $2 shipping, or maybe $5 apiece..


http://www.ebay.com/itm/2Pcs-26650-8000mAh-3-7v-Li-ion-Rechargeable-Battery-Cell-For-Electric-Tools-/111819891266?hash=item1a08fc2242:g:AfoAAOSw14xWKZ1t


Some batteries of this brand name are reviewed and dissassembled on
thi website:

http://www.lygte-info.dk/info/indexBatteriesAndChargers UK.html

They don't come off well.
Some samples had evidence of pre-use in other application formats.

RL

I mistakedly bought a couple 18650 Ultraf*re batteries- far less than
marked capacity- I dissected one- it was not a used cell, just poorly
made and significantly lighter than a good one from a reputable
manufacturer.

It's kind of interesting when you open them up- the energy is still in
there, of course, and bits will spark and smoke when you breach the
film separator barrier.



--sp

It looks like there was once a valid UltraFire source that was either
compromised or cloned up the wazoo. Prices don't look unreasonably low
for some offerings, by chemistry and size but the mAH ratings are off
the wall - might read as WHr - would make more sense.

When the polymer protective layer breaks on an internally protected
cell contact (permanently), there's often energy stored in the dead
cell. The protection method wass unpopular, as the polymer seemed
unpredictable with age and environment, producing premature
opencircuits.

On disassembly, this remenant can result in spontaneous combustion.

I disassembled these things under water, when I had to. Once a useful
source of plated stamped copper mesh. I'm not so sure all that free
lithium is good for you, unless prescribed by local MH Professionals.

RL

 

On Friday, November 20, 2015 at 12:04:25 PM UTC-5, Jeff Liebermann wrote:

On Thu, 19 Nov 2015 09:12:43 GMT, Jan Panteltje
pNaOnStPeAlMtje@yahoo.com> wrote:

Here is mine, now in use for almost 2 years:
http://panteltje.com/pub/ultra_fire_batteries_and_flashlight_IMG_5158.JPG

Yes, but was it a real or counterfeit UltraFire battery?
http://www.ultrafire.net/shownews.asp?id=60
https://www.google.com/#q=counterfeit+ultrafire
According to the "real" UltraFire web pile, they didn't make cells
over 3000 ma-hr, making your 3200 ma-hr cell a genuine counterfeit.

Genuine counterfeits--insist on nothing less!

And why settle for 8Ah? All mine are 80Ah.

Cheers,
James Arthur

 

[Phil Hobbs]

What frequency range?

I use three:

AADE rf LCR
Smart Tweezers
Measurements 59 Megacycle Meter.

I've used all of them in the last two weeks.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

 

[David Eather]

On Fri, 20 Nov 2015 10:27:43 +1000, David Eather <eather@tpg.com.au> wrote:

On Thu, 19 Nov 2015 19:12:43 +1000, Jan Panteltje
pNaOnStPeAlMtje@yahoo.com> wrote:

On a sunny day (Thu, 19 Nov 2015 18:35:09 +1000) it happened "David
Eather"
eather@tpg.com.au> wrote in <op.x8b94vrlwei6gd@phenom-pc>:

No I think you exaggerate. I have never seen a *fire cell deliver 1/3
of
the printed capacity - I think it is normally even less!
Seriously to the OP, avoid *fire brands like the plague, apart from the
dodge capacity labels most of them don't last long either. They will
probably be the most expensive batteries you evet buy in terms of total
power delivered and it will let you down when you need it most.

Well, do you actually have one?

I was stupid enough to buy 3 sets of *fire over the years. One set of 4
NiMh AA's (I know we are talking about LiPo here but this is just for
illustration) had no usable cells. 2 of the batteries charge once or
twice to a few mA/Hrs the others were dead shorts or immediately
rejected by my charger. The other sets (of various types)were better,
but not by much.

Oh, my bad. The really crap set of batteries described above came from BTY
(batteries though you? ha ha)

Here is mine, now in use for almost 2 years:
http://panteltje.com/pub/ultra_fire_batteries_and_flashlight_IMG_5158.JPG

And watch how well protected these are:
http://panteltje.com/pub/utra_fire_protected_against_almost_everything_IMG_5162.JPG

The flashlight melted at some point, but the batteries are still going
strong.

I have not checked the capacity, but it sure did not go out prematurely,
One of these batteries that came with that flashlight has a bit more
self-discharge, so I kept the good one in the flashlight,
and the bad one as spare, check the charge every now and then, came
with charger too that actually works.

And I have no fear keeping this in my pocket.

And I'm sure it came by plane, how long does a steam boat from China
take?


You aussies suffer from hanging upside down, Spero para-noia

ANYTHING can go wrong at any time, your chances of pilot error are
bigger than from fire batteries.

;-)

My spell-sker insists aussies is spelled as pussies

Better get that checked - racial vilification is not pretty

 

[David Eather]

On Fri, 20 Nov 2015 17:48:18 +1000, Jan Panteltje
<pNaOnStPeAlMtje@yahoo.com> wrote:

On a sunny day (Fri, 20 Nov 2015 10:27:43 +1000) it happened "David
Eather"
eather@tpg.com.au> wrote in <op.x8dh8hgnwei6gd@phenom-pc>:

My spell-sker insists aussies is spelled as pussies

Better get that checked - racial vilification is not pretty


Screenshot:
aussies File: ispell.tmp







hello aussies

0: pussies

----
It suggest pussies.
Its a good spell-sjeker ;-)


I'v been reading that site news.au. something a while back,
and really I've been down under, and it is a nice place (mainly outside
the city),
but what I get from your news site is that they are severely insane and
I have scrapped it of the list of places to go to.

Yes or latest political pushes have made our news service and the public
interest crap

The scientific explanation is that walking upside down may cause it.

Racial? You mean what you did to the Aboriginal?

Um, you mean the well intentioned, English and English educated people?
But yes. It remains a screw up of the highest order. Unfortunately it
seems to have few if any solutions

Was not down under a punishment colony for UK criminals at one time,
they broke free and now rule there?

Nope. Was a penal colony, but it was run by colonists (mostly) without
criminal records

Got old, old women talk prevails, their politics are US slaved, insane
rules.
What you do to fugitives... What you do to people who lived their and
contributed to your economy for years
and the deport them for ?nothing? Some leader even stranger than the
other?

NOT a good place to go.

I speak up for asylum seeker rights whenever possible. Not every headline
is the whole truth

 

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Fri, 20 Nov 2015 16:18:32 -0800 (PST), dagmargoodboat@yahoo.com
wrote:

On Friday, November 20, 2015 at 12:04:25 PM UTC-5, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Thu, 19 Nov 2015 09:12:43 GMT, Jan Panteltje
pNaOnStPeAlMtje@yahoo.com> wrote:

Here is mine, now in use for almost 2 years:
http://panteltje.com/pub/ultra_fire_batteries_and_flashlight_IMG_5158.JPG

Yes, but was it a real or counterfeit UltraFire battery?
http://www.ultrafire.net/shownews.asp?id=60
https://www.google.com/#q=counterfeit+ultrafire
According to the "real" UltraFire web pile, they didn't make cells
over 3000 ma-hr, making your 3200 ma-hr cell a genuine counterfeit.

Genuine counterfeits--insist on nothing less!
And why settle for 8Ah? All mine are 80Ah.
Cheers,
James Arthur

All your batteries are belong to us.
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/All_your_base_are_belong_to_us>
You have no chance to survive, make your time.

--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

 

[Klaus Kragelund]

If you are not afraid of building something yourself, the Cypress has a ready to go meter build around the PSoC using lock in amplifier detection method. From what I have glanced at it, it seems pretty good.

Cheers

Klaus

 

[Jan Panteltje]

On a sunny day (Fri, 20 Nov 2015 09:04:58 -0800) it happened Jeff Liebermann
<jeffl@cruzio.com> wrote in <ogku4b1edgtqvjfmqr0aeupne4fd63a4hk@4ax.com>:

On Thu, 19 Nov 2015 09:12:43 GMT, Jan Panteltje
pNaOnStPeAlMtje@yahoo.com> wrote:

Here is mine, now in use for almost 2 years:
http://panteltje.com/pub/ultra_fire_batteries_and_flashlight_IMG_5158.JPG

Yes, but was it a real or counterfeit UltraFire battery?
http://www.ultrafire.net/shownews.asp?id=60
https://www.google.com/#q=counterfeit+ultrafire

Wow, did not know about that site.
Sure, from the spelling on the battery it is clear you are not dealing with a real multinational:
http://panteltje.com/pub/utra_fire_protected_against_almost_everything_IMG_5162.JPG

According to the "real" UltraFire web pile, they didn't make cells
over 3000 ma-hr, making your 3200 ma-hr cell a genuine counterfeit.

But, it gets the work done, if it was made of chewing gum and kept my flashlight working I would be happy too,
even if it had only a picture of Mickey Mouse on it.

I get many things from China that look like 'home made',
for example the 1 Ah lipos with Varta on it, I am still not sure it really _is_ Varta,
but... 300 charge / discharge (90 %) cycles later I see a slight decrease in capacity.
reasonable for a lipo...

Its just a consumable...
Because I did see that decrease, and these need to run 12 hours a day,
(now talking lipo) I bought some of these power packs to test:
http://panteltje.com/pub/high_power_lipos_IMG_5145.JPG
I still have to solder these in...
It is actually these:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/151808064280

These ones have _no_ protection unlike the Varta marked ones, so BIG currents may flow.
So... 25 A discharge? Will see, will likely add a fuse.

 

On Thu, 19 Nov 2015 15:04:46 +1100, Clifford Heath
<no.spam@please.net> wrote:

On 19/11/15 14:45, Bill Bowden wrote:
Are these batteries good? Seems cheap for an 8 amp-hour Li-Ion battery

They lie. The very best 26650 Li-Ion are the Panasonic NCR cells, which
are about 5000mAH. The Ultrafire cells would be typically 1/3 of that,
or 1600mAH. Likewise all the other *fire Chinese brands (TrustFire,
SureFire, CatchOnFire, etc).

I thought that these *Fire names are just nicknames for cells that
catch fire (when abused).

However, some manufacturers seems to be actually using such real brand
names, perhaps honest, but not so good marketing strategy

 

[Clifford Heath]

On 21/11/15 12:41, Phil Hobbs wrote:

What frequency range?
AADE rf LCR

I have an AADE-type one that I built from a kit, pretty happy with it.

However, I still envy my friend's much more versatile and accurate
DE-5000. You can find those on EBay and Aliexpress stores.

Clifford Heath.

 

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Sat, 21 Nov 2015 08:15:30 GMT, Jan Panteltje
<pNaOnStPeAlMtje@yahoo.com> wrote:

According to the "real" UltraFire web pile, they didn't make cells
over 3000 ma-hr, making your 3200 ma-hr cell a genuine counterfeit.

But, it gets the work done, if it was made of chewing gum and kept my flashlight working I would be happy too,
even if it had only a picture of Mickey Mouse on it.

What you are probably buying are 1000 ma-hr 18650 cells marked with
whatever the vendor thinks will sell. The cell is good enough for
most things, but not if you're trying to squeeze every last coulomb
out of the cell, as in quadcopters or flashlights. They're probably
just fine for your instrument experiments, eBikes, and vapo-smog
generators. I'm not sure about the number of charge cycles on these
batteries. It's my understand (possibly wrong) that cell design can
optimize capacity or charge cycles, but not both.

I get many things from China that look like 'home made',
for example the 1 Ah lipos with Varta on it, I am still not sure it really _is_ Varta,
but... 300 charge / discharge (90 %) cycles later I see a slight decrease in capacity.
reasonable for a lipo...

At 90% discharge, you should be killing those batteries. At what
terminal voltage do you stop brutalizing those batteries? See Fig 2:
<http://www.mdpi.com/1996-1073/7/9/5995/htm>
10% would be about 3.50V.

For extra fun, run a frequency scan of your LiIon battery and watch it
age:
<http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/testing_lithium_based_batteries>
I haven't done this but plan to throw together something to do it,
some day, later, maybe...

>Its just a consumable...

Money is also a consumable. Whatever works for you, as long as it
doesn't become a collectable, which is responsible for my mess.

Because I did see that decrease, and these need to run 12 hours a day,
(now talking lipo) I bought some of these power packs to test:
http://panteltje.com/pub/high_power_lipos_IMG_5145.JPG
I still have to solder these in...
It is actually these:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/151808064280

I use similar batteries, mostly those used by the RC community.
<http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__86__85__Batteries_Accessories-Li_Poly_All_brands_.html>
This is my favorite 11.1v battery pack:
<https://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=26472>
Yes, I pay extra for the shrink wrap, power connector, balance
charging connector, but don't want to build battery packs (until I get
spot welder).

These ones have _no_ protection unlike the Varta marked ones, so BIG currents may flow.
So... 25 A discharge? Will see, will likely add a fuse.

The aformentioned favorite 11.1v battery is rated at 25C continuous
discharge:
25 * 2.2A = 55A
with a maximum charge rate of 5C or:
5 * 2.2A = 11A
You might as well use a PCB trace as a fuse. However, you can get
chargers with overcurrent protection:
<http://www.ebay.com/itm/281843079093> 3S, 4-5A
<http://www.ebay.com/itm/181749089393> 3S, 10-15A



--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

 

[Spehro Pefhany]

On Sat, 21 Nov 2015 10:44:27 +0200, the renowned
upsidedown@downunder.com wrote:

On Thu, 19 Nov 2015 15:04:46 +1100, Clifford Heath
no.spam@please.net> wrote:

On 19/11/15 14:45, Bill Bowden wrote:
Are these batteries good? Seems cheap for an 8 amp-hour Li-Ion battery

They lie. The very best 26650 Li-Ion are the Panasonic NCR cells, which
are about 5000mAH. The Ultrafire cells would be typically 1/3 of that,
or 1600mAH. Likewise all the other *fire Chinese brands (TrustFire,
SureFire, CatchOnFire, etc).

I thought that these *Fire names are just nicknames for cells that
catch fire (when abused).

Hopefully *only* when abused.

However, some manufacturers seems to be actually using such real brand
names, perhaps honest, but not so good marketing strategy

It's very difficult to come up with names that don't create unwanted
associations in the mind (of a native speaker). I was helping folks
come up with an English name for a new company last month- the names
that I thought were good were (of course) already taken and most of
the ones they came up with had unpleasant, unfortunate or sexual
connotations that were difficult to explain. Complicated by regulatory
limitations in some markets on what you can call your company, as well
as just simply not being so close as to poach on another's name. There
are companies that do nothing but this: http://www.namelab.com/ , but
doing a thorough job is not cheap. There are surely regional
variations as well as variations from country to country, even those
that nominally use the same language, especially where slang and
association with regional events and entities are involved.

--sp





--
Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany
Amazon link for AoE 3rd Edition: http://tinyurl.com/ntrpwu8
Microchip link for 2015 Masters in Phoenix: http://tinyurl.com/l7g2k48