Driver to drive?

[Jim Yanik]

zekfrivo@zekfrivolous.com (GregS) wrote in
news:gg4b73$4rg$1@usenet01.srv.cis.pitt.edu:

In article <o09bi41istpllobpvqheb32e8qj7er0r6c@4ax.com>, pol
shooter@home.nl> wrote:
An IR thermometer will not be very accurate on lower as body temps due
to the radiation measured.


An IR is good for above 50 F or 25 C
Calibration is best done close to the temps really measured.
And yes boiling and freezing water is very accurate and the method
with the black body is best.



I noticed that my typical Fluke IR thermometer only works at room
temperature. I took it outside last winter, and after the unit starts
to cool, forget it.

greg

might be a battery problem;their performance often drops with cold temps.
(lithium batts are better)

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net

 

[Archimedes' Lever]

On Thu, 20 Nov 2008 05:57:50 -0800, JosephKK <quiettechblue@yahoo.com>
wrote:

On Fri, 14 Nov 2008 18:52:46 -0800, John Larkin
jjlarkin@highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote:

On Sat, 15 Nov 2008 01:50:45 +0000, IanM <Invalid@totally.invalid
wrote:

ratman wrote:

On Tue, 08 May 2007 14:56:50 GMT, DaveC <me@privacy.net> wrote:


I know this subject of "cheap" and "calibrate" used in the same sentence may
well be anathema to some of you but I need to verify that either my IR temp
gun is accurate or my DMM/thermocouple is, or neither. Accuracy to 2 or 3
degrees F is fine.

I'm looking for suggestions for a simple way to provide some kind of common
temperature "standard" (I use the term loosely, here) I can compare these
against.

Thanks,



I would put money on the therocouple thermometer, for what
it's worth.
Melting ice and condensing steam. For both you are going to need a
small copper or aluminium block painted matte black for the IR temp gun
to read and a hole drilled in the block thats a close fit for the
thermocouple with a little dab of heat transfer grease. Implementation
is your problem, although it can be advantageous to insulate the sides
of the block with expanded polystyrene.


Water and ice have thermal IR emissivity of around 98%, about as black
as things get. So mix crushed ice into cold water in a glass or cup,
preferably a thermos, stir, and aim your IR thermometer straignt down
into that. Or swish a thermocouple around in it. Even yukky tap water,
well stirred with ice, will be within 15 mK of 0C.

The high end, boiling, is a little trickier.

John

Deionized, distilled (chem lab high purity) water really helps in both
cases.

Oh boy... a whole tenth of one degree at either end... max.

 

[Archimedes' Lever]

On Thu, 20 Nov 2008 09:50:39 -0500, Spehro Pefhany
<speffSNIP@interlogDOTyou.knowwhat> wrote:

On Thu, 20 Nov 2008 05:57:50 -0800, JosephKK <quiettechblue@yahoo.com
wrote:

On Fri, 14 Nov 2008 18:52:46 -0800, John Larkin
jjlarkin@highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote:

On Sat, 15 Nov 2008 01:50:45 +0000, IanM <Invalid@totally.invalid
wrote:

ratman wrote:

On Tue, 08 May 2007 14:56:50 GMT, DaveC <me@privacy.net> wrote:


I know this subject of "cheap" and "calibrate" used in the same sentence may
well be anathema to some of you but I need to verify that either my IR temp
gun is accurate or my DMM/thermocouple is, or neither. Accuracy to 2 or 3
degrees F is fine.

I'm looking for suggestions for a simple way to provide some kind of common
temperature "standard" (I use the term loosely, here) I can compare these
against.

Thanks,



I would put money on the therocouple thermometer, for what
it's worth.
Melting ice and condensing steam. For both you are going to need a
small copper or aluminium block painted matte black for the IR temp gun
to read and a hole drilled in the block thats a close fit for the
thermocouple with a little dab of heat transfer grease. Implementation
is your problem, although it can be advantageous to insulate the sides
of the block with expanded polystyrene.


Water and ice have thermal IR emissivity of around 98%, about as black
as things get. So mix crushed ice into cold water in a glass or cup,
preferably a thermos, stir, and aim your IR thermometer straignt down
into that. Or swish a thermocouple around in it. Even yukky tap water,
well stirred with ice, will be within 15 mK of 0C.

The high end, boiling, is a little trickier.

John

Deionized, distilled (chem lab high purity) water really helps in both
cases.

Actually, using particularly sloppy lab practices and tap water helps
more with the boiling point measurement.

Lay it on thick... stir it up good... Haahahah!

 

[Turo Hofmann]

*On suorastaan mielenkintoista huomata muuten miten juuri SUPO:n
poliisivaltuuksia, nettivakoilua, puhelinsalaisuuksia ja urkintalupia yhän
laajemmin erityisesti Holmlundin toimesta lisätään ydinhallinnollemma
merittäin.. .Mutta, mutta???

*Koskaan ei sen tarkemmin sanota MITEN tätä urkintaa ihan OIKEASTI
suoritetaan ja toimeenpannaan sitten näillä perustuslakirikomuksin
konkretisoiden. On tosiaan aika oleellista, että näin estetään kaikin
mahdollisin keinoin ihmisuhreja tajuamasta miten tämä vakoilemisen sähköinen
muoto toteutetaan "katutasolla". Vain kaltaiseni alan ammattilainen
toisaalta osaa hakea niitä systeemiin liittyviä "akilleen kantapäitä"! On
sanomatta selvää, että kannettaviensa akunpoisto ilman, että koneen
fyysiseen toimintaedellytykseen tulee minkäänlaista ongelmaa haittaa
SUPO/NSA porukkojen kaukolukujensa jne. toimia niinpaljon ettei sellaisia
faktoja saa julkituoda! On totta, ettei tällaisia faktoja sallittaisi sitten
suin surmin levittää kansan tietoisuuksiin, esim tänne nettiin.

*Ja koska kivaa vastaanottoa tuntuu piisaavan niin tässä lisää: Eli usein
ihmisillä on harhakäsitys siitä, että kopioimalla saa ID-koodit
häippäsemään. Kopioikaa kaksi perussivua, tai ajakaa printteriin. Siirtäkää
ne päällekkäin. Ja liu-uttakaa tuuman verran. Huomaatte miten molemmissa
kuvien reunoissa on kuin hyttysen paskapisteitä miltei samanlaisesti
sikinsokin. Nykyään ne voi olla myös esim. vain UV_valossa näkyviä
valkoisia!! Joka reunassa ja kuvan keskialueilla tämä sama CIA-koodeksi
loistaa mukanaolollaan. Siinä on siis päivämääriä, maatunuksia, koneen
omistajia ja kopiomääreitä ja vastaavia kokonaistietokirjoja. Näillä sitten
vielä vaikka kymmenkertaisísta kopioinneista kyetään täsmähakemaan koko
kirjamateriaalin reitti salaisista arkistoista flaierreihin asti.. .Eli
rakkaat lukijat muistakaa nyt myös tällaisten faktojen olemassaaolot.
Nykyinen teknikan maailma on täynään tämän tyyppisiä ydinalan
sudenkuoppameriä. Toki näihin on erinäisiä "kiertoreittejä" mutta ne osaavat
kiertää lähinnä aniharvat alan huippuosaajat.. ..!

 

[Jim Thompson]

On Fri, 21 Nov 2008 10:07:33 +0000 (UTC), Turo Hofmann
<turo.hofmann@therese.de> wrote:

[snip]

Toki näihin on erinäisiä "kiertoreittejä" mutta ne osaavat
kiertää lähinnä aniharvat alan huippuosaajat.. ..!

JERK tagged.

...Jim Thompson
--
| James E.Thompson, P.E. | mens |
| Analog Innovations, Inc. | et |
| Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus |
| Phoenix, Arizona 85048 Skype: Contacts Only | |
| Voice480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat |
| E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 |

Liberalism is a persistent vegetative state

 

[Aatu Koskensilta]

RichD <r_delaney2001@yahoo.com> writes:

Good question; what does it mean to understand anything?

Biologically, it means a sequence of neural firings in the cerebral
cortex have occurred, which result in the mental state associated
with "I get it!"

How do you know there is any specific mental state that constitutes
understanding this or that?

I would try to model this in the sense of Kolmogorov complexity,
where the brain constructs a program which generates the same data
as the object to be understood.

Suppose we wish to understand the geography of the United States. What
would it mean for the brain to "construct a program which generates
the same data as the object to be understood"?

--
Aatu Koskensilta (aatu.koskensilta@uta.fi)

"Wovon man nicht sprechen kann, darĂźber muss man schweigen"
- Ludwig Wittgenstein, Tractatus Logico-Philosophicus

 

[Paul Hovnanian P.E.]

Nope. Its not ROT13.

--
Paul Hovnanian mailtoaul@Hovnanian.com
------------------------------------------------------------------
It's a damn poor mind that can only think of one way to spell a word.
-- Andrew Jackson

 

[JosephKK]

On Tue, 18 Nov 2008 17:59:09 GMT, Rich Grise <rich@example.net> wrote:

On Mon, 17 Nov 2008 20:37:18 -0500, Phil Hobbs wrote:
krw wrote:
mart_in_medina@yah00.es says...
On Mon, 17 Nov 2008 19:13:28 GMT, in sci.electronics.design The Pig
Bladder from Uranus <pb@example.net> wrote:

But seriously, how many angels _can_ dance on the head of a pin? >:-

There are several answers. It really depends if the angles are
latching or non-latching

http://www.headofapin.net/

No, the answer to that question is 180. Any more and they fall off the
edge.

Not to spoil anybody's fun, but the original question that the Schoolmen
were debating was whether an angel--a pure spirit--occupied any space.
The question was not whether it was 1 or 180, but whether it was a
finite or infinite number.

Do an infinite number of angels even exist? (they obviously don't take
up any space, being imaginary and all.)

Cheers!
Rich

I only created a few thousand, some other yutz created them by the
millions.

 

[T]

In article <2_Wdnd2k15zKfILUnZ2dnUVZ_uqdnZ2d@posted.localnet>,
robertbaer@localnet.com says...

Jim Thompson wrote:

On Thu, 13 Nov 2008 22:58:51 -0800, Robert Baer
robertbaer@localnet.com> wrote:


Jim Thompson wrote:

On Tue, 11 Nov 2008 23:16:39 -0800, Robert Baer
robertbaer@localnet.com> wrote:



Robert Baer wrote:


Robert Baer wrote:



Prelim specs:
1) Plugs into phone line, phone plugs into the black box.
2) Black box records all possible info concerning incoming calls for
later viewing and evidence gathering.
3) If incoming call is not in (programmable) list, then the caller
hears the 3 magic tones as loud as possible followed by a message
delivered s.l.o.w.l.y. "The number you have dialed is not active" and
(options) immediately hang up, OR forward call WITH CID info to a
provided number (say police non-emergency or FBI).
4) If call is in list, then the connected phone rings (call
"forwarded" to it).
5) Memory allows storage of at least 100 incoming SpamCalls per day,
say minimum of 500 total.
Is there anything like this on the market?
If such a device was designed, what would be the estimated sales price?

The sooner i can get one of these, the better.
Marketeers are driving me nuts.

Hello?
When can i buy even a prototype?


Be patient ;-)

...Jim Thompson

OK.
Be advised that the majority of SPAMcalls "id" as "UUU UNKNOWN
CALLER" or as "PPP PRIVATE CALLER" and the so-called trace (*57) does
not work.


My present land-line phone subscription can be set to block
anonymous/unknown callers. I have to turn it off when my doctor
calls.


So a "blacklist" of unwanted numbers is not all that useful.


A good start is to simply block every "800-number".


Not that i object to such an idea, but the black box should reject /
shunt all calls not on the whitelist.
And a simple message to unwanted callers is not sufficent.
A selection of pre-programmed responses that the user can "piece
together" would seem to be ideal, and definitely should include those 3
magic tones.
"Instant pickup and response" is perfect, especially for those
unidentified callers - using the 3 tones.

BTW, what if the caller siezes the line? (happens sometimes)
Is there any way to ZAP them and recover use of the line?


Reverse potential drops the line.

I've also considered a "pass-key" approach not unlike those "enter
these four letters" web site controls. Have our machine "answer" the
phone and request a 4-number sequence to cause the line to ring.
Solicitors won't take the time.

...Jim Thompson
The "block anonymous/unknown callers" does not work; somehow they got
thru anyway, so i dropped the costly and ineffective service.
"block every 800-number" is not an option provided by Quest, and i am
sure it would be as ineffective.
The "Caller Privacy" option was also useless.

Reversing the line potential to drop the line would be a nice option;
either automatic after the "end" of a "conersation" or with a (red)
pushbutton.

I do not think a "passkey" system is needed or ultimately useful,
because it cannot "zap" a marketeer in such a way as to permenantly
discourage them.
Something more "offensive" like the 3 tones followed by a choosable
message if there is a viable phone number, as well as an *immediate*
pickup on no number with 3 tones and same choices (immediate hangup,
Bronx cheer, etc etc).

When your phone company won't provide the advanced features you want,
spend a few bucks for a half decent PC, some FXO/FXS cards for the
computer and install Asterisk.

 

[Jim Thompson]

On Sat, 22 Nov 2008 14:45:49 -0500, T <kd1s.nospam@cox.nospam.net>
wrote:

In article <2_Wdnd2k15zKfILUnZ2dnUVZ_uqdnZ2d@posted.localnet>,
robertbaer@localnet.com says...
Jim Thompson wrote:

On Thu, 13 Nov 2008 22:58:51 -0800, Robert Baer
robertbaer@localnet.com> wrote:


Jim Thompson wrote:

On Tue, 11 Nov 2008 23:16:39 -0800, Robert Baer
robertbaer@localnet.com> wrote:



Robert Baer wrote:


Robert Baer wrote:



Prelim specs:
1) Plugs into phone line, phone plugs into the black box.
2) Black box records all possible info concerning incoming calls for
later viewing and evidence gathering.
3) If incoming call is not in (programmable) list, then the caller
hears the 3 magic tones as loud as possible followed by a message
delivered s.l.o.w.l.y. "The number you have dialed is not active" and
(options) immediately hang up, OR forward call WITH CID info to a
provided number (say police non-emergency or FBI).
4) If call is in list, then the connected phone rings (call
"forwarded" to it).
5) Memory allows storage of at least 100 incoming SpamCalls per day,
say minimum of 500 total.
Is there anything like this on the market?
If such a device was designed, what would be the estimated sales price?

The sooner i can get one of these, the better.
Marketeers are driving me nuts.

Hello?
When can i buy even a prototype?


Be patient ;-)

...Jim Thompson

OK.
Be advised that the majority of SPAMcalls "id" as "UUU UNKNOWN
CALLER" or as "PPP PRIVATE CALLER" and the so-called trace (*57) does
not work.


My present land-line phone subscription can be set to block
anonymous/unknown callers. I have to turn it off when my doctor
calls.


So a "blacklist" of unwanted numbers is not all that useful.


A good start is to simply block every "800-number".


Not that i object to such an idea, but the black box should reject /
shunt all calls not on the whitelist.
And a simple message to unwanted callers is not sufficent.
A selection of pre-programmed responses that the user can "piece
together" would seem to be ideal, and definitely should include those 3
magic tones.
"Instant pickup and response" is perfect, especially for those
unidentified callers - using the 3 tones.

BTW, what if the caller siezes the line? (happens sometimes)
Is there any way to ZAP them and recover use of the line?


Reverse potential drops the line.

I've also considered a "pass-key" approach not unlike those "enter
these four letters" web site controls. Have our machine "answer" the
phone and request a 4-number sequence to cause the line to ring.
Solicitors won't take the time.

...Jim Thompson
The "block anonymous/unknown callers" does not work; somehow they got
thru anyway, so i dropped the costly and ineffective service.
"block every 800-number" is not an option provided by Quest, and i am
sure it would be as ineffective.
The "Caller Privacy" option was also useless.

Reversing the line potential to drop the line would be a nice option;
either automatic after the "end" of a "conersation" or with a (red)
pushbutton.

I do not think a "passkey" system is needed or ultimately useful,
because it cannot "zap" a marketeer in such a way as to permenantly
discourage them.
Something more "offensive" like the 3 tones followed by a choosable
message if there is a viable phone number, as well as an *immediate*
pickup on no number with 3 tones and same choices (immediate hangup,
Bronx cheer, etc etc).



When your phone company won't provide the advanced features you want,
spend a few bucks for a half decent PC, some FXO/FXS cards for the
computer and install Asterisk.

No.

For an affordable consumer product we need a microprocessor-controlled
system that can talk to most existing telephone sets, # or * key codes
to add/delete to a white-list.

I can see analog ways to block the first ring, yet show the CID on the
telephone set.

But I'm not enough uP savvy to add the controls.

...Jim Thompson
--
| James E.Thompson, P.E. | mens |
| Analog Innovations, Inc. | et |
| Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus |
| Phoenix, Arizona 85048 Skype: Contacts Only | |
| Voice480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat |
| E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 |

I love to cook with wine Sometimes I even put it in the food

 

[JosephKK]

On Sun, 16 Nov 2008 17:33:35 -0800 (PST), RichD
<r_delaney2001@yahoo.com> wrote:

On Nov 16, Tim Smith <reply_in_gr...@mouse-potato.com> wrote:
This raises a question: what does it mean to "understand" a proof?

Good question; what does it mean to understand anything?

Biologically, it means a sequence of neural
firings in the cerebral cortex have occurred,
which result in the mental state associated
with "I get it!"

I would try to model this in the sense of
Kolmogorov complexity, where the brain
constructs a program which generates the same
data as the object to be understood.

Nearly non-sequitur.

 

[Jim Thompson]

On Sat, 22 Nov 2008 15:12:18 -0800, JosephKK <quiettechblue@yahoo.com>
wrote:

On Sun, 16 Nov 2008 17:33:35 -0800 (PST), RichD
r_delaney2001@yahoo.com> wrote:

On Nov 16, Tim Smith <reply_in_gr...@mouse-potato.com> wrote:
This raises a question: what does it mean to "understand" a proof?

Good question; what does it mean to understand anything?

Biologically, it means a sequence of neural
firings in the cerebral cortex have occurred,
which result in the mental state associated
with "I get it!"

I would try to model this in the sense of
Kolmogorov complexity, where the brain
constructs a program which generates the same
data as the object to be understood.

Nearly non-sequitur.

Smokin' ;-)

...Jim Thompson
--
| James E.Thompson, P.E. | mens |
| Analog Innovations, Inc. | et |
| Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus |
| Phoenix, Arizona 85048 Skype: Contacts Only | |
| Voice480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat |
| E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 |

Liberalism is a persistent vegetative state

 

[Robert Baer]

T wrote:

In article <2_Wdnd2k15zKfILUnZ2dnUVZ_uqdnZ2d@posted.localnet>,
robertbaer@localnet.com says...

Jim Thompson wrote:


On Thu, 13 Nov 2008 22:58:51 -0800, Robert Baer
robertbaer@localnet.com> wrote:



Jim Thompson wrote:


On Tue, 11 Nov 2008 23:16:39 -0800, Robert Baer
robertbaer@localnet.com> wrote:




Robert Baer wrote:



Robert Baer wrote:




Prelim specs:
1) Plugs into phone line, phone plugs into the black box.
2) Black box records all possible info concerning incoming calls for
later viewing and evidence gathering.
3) If incoming call is not in (programmable) list, then the caller
hears the 3 magic tones as loud as possible followed by a message
delivered s.l.o.w.l.y. "The number you have dialed is not active" and
(options) immediately hang up, OR forward call WITH CID info to a
provided number (say police non-emergency or FBI).
4) If call is in list, then the connected phone rings (call
"forwarded" to it).
5) Memory allows storage of at least 100 incoming SpamCalls per day,
say minimum of 500 total.
Is there anything like this on the market?
If such a device was designed, what would be the estimated sales price?

The sooner i can get one of these, the better.
Marketeers are driving me nuts.

Hello?
When can i buy even a prototype?


Be patient ;-)

...Jim Thompson

OK.
Be advised that the majority of SPAMcalls "id" as "UUU UNKNOWN
CALLER" or as "PPP PRIVATE CALLER" and the so-called trace (*57) does
not work.


My present land-line phone subscription can be set to block
anonymous/unknown callers. I have to turn it off when my doctor
calls.



So a "blacklist" of unwanted numbers is not all that useful.


A good start is to simply block every "800-number".



Not that i object to such an idea, but the black box should reject /
shunt all calls not on the whitelist.
And a simple message to unwanted callers is not sufficent.
A selection of pre-programmed responses that the user can "piece
together" would seem to be ideal, and definitely should include those 3
magic tones.
"Instant pickup and response" is perfect, especially for those
unidentified callers - using the 3 tones.

BTW, what if the caller siezes the line? (happens sometimes)
Is there any way to ZAP them and recover use of the line?


Reverse potential drops the line.

I've also considered a "pass-key" approach not unlike those "enter
these four letters" web site controls. Have our machine "answer" the
phone and request a 4-number sequence to cause the line to ring.
Solicitors won't take the time.

...Jim Thompson

The "block anonymous/unknown callers" does not work; somehow they got
thru anyway, so i dropped the costly and ineffective service.
"block every 800-number" is not an option provided by Quest, and i am
sure it would be as ineffective.
The "Caller Privacy" option was also useless.

Reversing the line potential to drop the line would be a nice option;
either automatic after the "end" of a "conersation" or with a (red)
pushbutton.

I do not think a "passkey" system is needed or ultimately useful,
because it cannot "zap" a marketeer in such a way as to permenantly
discourage them.
Something more "offensive" like the 3 tones followed by a choosable
message if there is a viable phone number, as well as an *immediate*
pickup on no number with 3 tones and same choices (immediate hangup,
Bronx cheer, etc etc).




When your phone company won't provide the advanced features you want,
spend a few bucks for a half decent PC, some FXO/FXS cards for the
computer and install Asterisk.

....meaning that i am then forced to $pend money for a second computer

*and* the cost of power for 24hr/day running of that system?
Oh yes, and where do i put it??
And lastly, how does a phone get connected to the PC and how does one
use it?

 

[Robert Baer]

Jim Thompson wrote:

On Sat, 22 Nov 2008 14:45:49 -0500, T <kd1s.nospam@cox.nospam.net
wrote:


In article <2_Wdnd2k15zKfILUnZ2dnUVZ_uqdnZ2d@posted.localnet>,
robertbaer@localnet.com says...

Jim Thompson wrote:


On Thu, 13 Nov 2008 22:58:51 -0800, Robert Baer
robertbaer@localnet.com> wrote:



Jim Thompson wrote:


On Tue, 11 Nov 2008 23:16:39 -0800, Robert Baer
robertbaer@localnet.com> wrote:




Robert Baer wrote:



Robert Baer wrote:




Prelim specs:
1) Plugs into phone line, phone plugs into the black box.
2) Black box records all possible info concerning incoming calls for
later viewing and evidence gathering.
3) If incoming call is not in (programmable) list, then the caller
hears the 3 magic tones as loud as possible followed by a message
delivered s.l.o.w.l.y. "The number you have dialed is not active" and
(options) immediately hang up, OR forward call WITH CID info to a
provided number (say police non-emergency or FBI).
4) If call is in list, then the connected phone rings (call
"forwarded" to it).
5) Memory allows storage of at least 100 incoming SpamCalls per day,
say minimum of 500 total.
Is there anything like this on the market?
If such a device was designed, what would be the estimated sales price?

The sooner i can get one of these, the better.
Marketeers are driving me nuts.

Hello?
When can i buy even a prototype?


Be patient ;-)

...Jim Thompson

OK.
Be advised that the majority of SPAMcalls "id" as "UUU UNKNOWN
CALLER" or as "PPP PRIVATE CALLER" and the so-called trace (*57) does
not work.


My present land-line phone subscription can be set to block
anonymous/unknown callers. I have to turn it off when my doctor
calls.



So a "blacklist" of unwanted numbers is not all that useful.


A good start is to simply block every "800-number".



Not that i object to such an idea, but the black box should reject /
shunt all calls not on the whitelist.
And a simple message to unwanted callers is not sufficent.
A selection of pre-programmed responses that the user can "piece
together" would seem to be ideal, and definitely should include those 3
magic tones.
"Instant pickup and response" is perfect, especially for those
unidentified callers - using the 3 tones.

BTW, what if the caller siezes the line? (happens sometimes)
Is there any way to ZAP them and recover use of the line?


Reverse potential drops the line.

I've also considered a "pass-key" approach not unlike those "enter
these four letters" web site controls. Have our machine "answer" the
phone and request a 4-number sequence to cause the line to ring.
Solicitors won't take the time.

...Jim Thompson

The "block anonymous/unknown callers" does not work; somehow they got
thru anyway, so i dropped the costly and ineffective service.
"block every 800-number" is not an option provided by Quest, and i am
sure it would be as ineffective.
The "Caller Privacy" option was also useless.

Reversing the line potential to drop the line would be a nice option;
either automatic after the "end" of a "conersation" or with a (red)
pushbutton.

I do not think a "passkey" system is needed or ultimately useful,
because it cannot "zap" a marketeer in such a way as to permenantly
discourage them.
Something more "offensive" like the 3 tones followed by a choosable
message if there is a viable phone number, as well as an *immediate*
pickup on no number with 3 tones and same choices (immediate hangup,
Bronx cheer, etc etc).



When your phone company won't provide the advanced features you want,
spend a few bucks for a half decent PC, some FXO/FXS cards for the
computer and install Asterisk.


No.

For an affordable consumer product we need a microprocessor-controlled
system that can talk to most existing telephone sets, # or * key codes
to add/delete to a white-list.

I can see analog ways to block the first ring, yet show the CID on the
telephone set.

But I'm not enough uP savvy to add the controls.

...Jim Thompson
I agree on the basic approach.

As far as programming, maybe use ladder logic and the "compiler"
available at http://cq.cx/ladder.pl with a PIC controller?

 

[RichD]

On Nov 21, Aatu Koskensilta <aatu.koskensi...@uta.fi> wrote:

Good question; what does it mean to understand anything?

Biologically, it means a sequence of neural firings in the cerebral
cortex have occurred, which result in the mental state associated
with "I get it!"

How do you know there is any specific mental state that
constitutes understanding this or that?

A 'specific' state? Undoubtedly, there are a large
number of such states.

The brain is a dynamical system. It evolves
through a sequence of states; mental states =
brain states. Some of them correspond to
"I don't get it", others correspond to "I get it".

Get it?

I would try to model this in the sense of Kolmogorov complexity,
where the brain constructs a program which generates the
same data as the object to be understood.

Suppose we wish to understand the geography of the United
States. What would it mean for the brain to "construct a program
which generates the same data as the object to be understood"?

It means you could ask the student to draw
a map of USA, and he responded, correctly.



--
Rich

 

[Jim Thompson]

On Sun, 23 Nov 2008 20:23:41 -0800, Robert Baer
<robertbaer@localnet.com> wrote:

Jim Thompson wrote:

On Sat, 22 Nov 2008 14:45:49 -0500, T <kd1s.nospam@cox.nospam.net
wrote:


In article <2_Wdnd2k15zKfILUnZ2dnUVZ_uqdnZ2d@posted.localnet>,
robertbaer@localnet.com says...

Jim Thompson wrote:


On Thu, 13 Nov 2008 22:58:51 -0800, Robert Baer
robertbaer@localnet.com> wrote:



Jim Thompson wrote:


On Tue, 11 Nov 2008 23:16:39 -0800, Robert Baer
robertbaer@localnet.com> wrote:




Robert Baer wrote:



Robert Baer wrote:




Prelim specs:
1) Plugs into phone line, phone plugs into the black box.
2) Black box records all possible info concerning incoming calls for
later viewing and evidence gathering.
3) If incoming call is not in (programmable) list, then the caller
hears the 3 magic tones as loud as possible followed by a message
delivered s.l.o.w.l.y. "The number you have dialed is not active" and
(options) immediately hang up, OR forward call WITH CID info to a
provided number (say police non-emergency or FBI).
4) If call is in list, then the connected phone rings (call
"forwarded" to it).
5) Memory allows storage of at least 100 incoming SpamCalls per day,
say minimum of 500 total.
Is there anything like this on the market?
If such a device was designed, what would be the estimated sales price?

The sooner i can get one of these, the better.
Marketeers are driving me nuts.

Hello?
When can i buy even a prototype?


Be patient ;-)

...Jim Thompson

OK.
Be advised that the majority of SPAMcalls "id" as "UUU UNKNOWN
CALLER" or as "PPP PRIVATE CALLER" and the so-called trace (*57) does
not work.


My present land-line phone subscription can be set to block
anonymous/unknown callers. I have to turn it off when my doctor
calls.



So a "blacklist" of unwanted numbers is not all that useful.


A good start is to simply block every "800-number".



Not that i object to such an idea, but the black box should reject /
shunt all calls not on the whitelist.
And a simple message to unwanted callers is not sufficent.
A selection of pre-programmed responses that the user can "piece
together" would seem to be ideal, and definitely should include those 3
magic tones.
"Instant pickup and response" is perfect, especially for those
unidentified callers - using the 3 tones.

BTW, what if the caller siezes the line? (happens sometimes)
Is there any way to ZAP them and recover use of the line?


Reverse potential drops the line.

I've also considered a "pass-key" approach not unlike those "enter
these four letters" web site controls. Have our machine "answer" the
phone and request a 4-number sequence to cause the line to ring.
Solicitors won't take the time.

...Jim Thompson

The "block anonymous/unknown callers" does not work; somehow they got
thru anyway, so i dropped the costly and ineffective service.
"block every 800-number" is not an option provided by Quest, and i am
sure it would be as ineffective.
The "Caller Privacy" option was also useless.

Reversing the line potential to drop the line would be a nice option;
either automatic after the "end" of a "conersation" or with a (red)
pushbutton.

I do not think a "passkey" system is needed or ultimately useful,
because it cannot "zap" a marketeer in such a way as to permenantly
discourage them.
Something more "offensive" like the 3 tones followed by a choosable
message if there is a viable phone number, as well as an *immediate*
pickup on no number with 3 tones and same choices (immediate hangup,
Bronx cheer, etc etc).



When your phone company won't provide the advanced features you want,
spend a few bucks for a half decent PC, some FXO/FXS cards for the
computer and install Asterisk.


No.

For an affordable consumer product we need a microprocessor-controlled
system that can talk to most existing telephone sets, # or * key codes
to add/delete to a white-list.

I can see analog ways to block the first ring, yet show the CID on the
telephone set.

But I'm not enough uP savvy to add the controls.

...Jim Thompson
I agree on the basic approach.
As far as programming, maybe use ladder logic and the "compiler"
available at http://cq.cx/ladder.pl with a PIC controller?

It occurred to me just now what message to play, "Please hold, we
value your business"... 30 second pause..."Please hold, we value your
business"... 30 second pause..."Please hold, we value your
business"... ad nauseam ;-)

...Jim Thompson
--
| James E.Thompson, P.E. | mens |
| Analog Innovations, Inc. | et |
| Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus |
| Phoenix, Arizona 85048 Skype: Contacts Only | |
| Voice480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat |
| E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 |

I love to cook with wine Sometimes I even put it in the food

 

[Robert Baer]

Jim Thompson wrote:

On Sun, 23 Nov 2008 20:23:41 -0800, Robert Baer
robertbaer@localnet.com> wrote:


Jim Thompson wrote:


On Sat, 22 Nov 2008 14:45:49 -0500, T <kd1s.nospam@cox.nospam.net
wrote:



In article <2_Wdnd2k15zKfILUnZ2dnUVZ_uqdnZ2d@posted.localnet>,
robertbaer@localnet.com says...


Jim Thompson wrote:



On Thu, 13 Nov 2008 22:58:51 -0800, Robert Baer
robertbaer@localnet.com> wrote:




Jim Thompson wrote:



On Tue, 11 Nov 2008 23:16:39 -0800, Robert Baer
robertbaer@localnet.com> wrote:





Robert Baer wrote:




Robert Baer wrote:





Prelim specs:
1) Plugs into phone line, phone plugs into the black box.
2) Black box records all possible info concerning incoming calls for
later viewing and evidence gathering.
3) If incoming call is not in (programmable) list, then the caller
hears the 3 magic tones as loud as possible followed by a message
delivered s.l.o.w.l.y. "The number you have dialed is not active" and
(options) immediately hang up, OR forward call WITH CID info to a
provided number (say police non-emergency or FBI).
4) If call is in list, then the connected phone rings (call
"forwarded" to it).
5) Memory allows storage of at least 100 incoming SpamCalls per day,
say minimum of 500 total.
Is there anything like this on the market?
If such a device was designed, what would be the estimated sales price?

The sooner i can get one of these, the better.
Marketeers are driving me nuts.

Hello?
When can i buy even a prototype?


Be patient ;-)

...Jim Thompson

OK.
Be advised that the majority of SPAMcalls "id" as "UUU UNKNOWN
CALLER" or as "PPP PRIVATE CALLER" and the so-called trace (*57) does
not work.


My present land-line phone subscription can be set to block
anonymous/unknown callers. I have to turn it off when my doctor
calls.




So a "blacklist" of unwanted numbers is not all that useful.


A good start is to simply block every "800-number".




Not that i object to such an idea, but the black box should reject /
shunt all calls not on the whitelist.
And a simple message to unwanted callers is not sufficent.
A selection of pre-programmed responses that the user can "piece
together" would seem to be ideal, and definitely should include those 3
magic tones.
"Instant pickup and response" is perfect, especially for those
unidentified callers - using the 3 tones.

BTW, what if the caller siezes the line? (happens sometimes)
Is there any way to ZAP them and recover use of the line?


Reverse potential drops the line.

I've also considered a "pass-key" approach not unlike those "enter
these four letters" web site controls. Have our machine "answer" the
phone and request a 4-number sequence to cause the line to ring.
Solicitors won't take the time.

...Jim Thompson

The "block anonymous/unknown callers" does not work; somehow they got
thru anyway, so i dropped the costly and ineffective service.
"block every 800-number" is not an option provided by Quest, and i am
sure it would be as ineffective.
The "Caller Privacy" option was also useless.

Reversing the line potential to drop the line would be a nice option;
either automatic after the "end" of a "conersation" or with a (red)
pushbutton.

I do not think a "passkey" system is needed or ultimately useful,
because it cannot "zap" a marketeer in such a way as to permenantly
discourage them.
Something more "offensive" like the 3 tones followed by a choosable
message if there is a viable phone number, as well as an *immediate*
pickup on no number with 3 tones and same choices (immediate hangup,
Bronx cheer, etc etc).



When your phone company won't provide the advanced features you want,
spend a few bucks for a half decent PC, some FXO/FXS cards for the
computer and install Asterisk.


No.

For an affordable consumer product we need a microprocessor-controlled
system that can talk to most existing telephone sets, # or * key codes
to add/delete to a white-list.

I can see analog ways to block the first ring, yet show the CID on the
telephone set.

But I'm not enough uP savvy to add the controls.

...Jim Thompson

I agree on the basic approach.
As far as programming, maybe use ladder logic and the "compiler"
available at http://cq.cx/ladder.pl with a PIC controller?


It occurred to me just now what message to play, "Please hold, we
value your business"... 30 second pause..."Please hold, we value your
business"... 30 second pause..."Please hold, we value your
business"... ad nauseam ;-)

...Jim Thompson
A good option.

Totally useless against marketeer incoming calls in my case, because
they hangup almost immediately on pickup; that is why i emphasized the
possibility of presenting the 3 magic tones Plus other chooseable
message) the very *instant* the CID pops up.

 

[RFI-EMI-GUY]

krw wrote:
(snip)

I had to show my (unaltered, sealed) birth certificate last week to
get a drivers license.

So? Mine looks like a piece of crumbled trash from 54 years ago. Still
good, yet anyone could have forged it.

Why won't NObama show his to demonstrate he
has one of the qualifications to be President?

He has, you saw it.

Why is the one he
has shown photoshopped?

Do you have proof of this, or did someone tell you it was?

Why do you support someone who may not be
so qualified and evades such simple questions?

He is the most qualified. You are not more qualified.

--
Joe Leikhim K4SAT
"The RFI-EMI-GUY"Š

"Treason doth never prosper: what's the reason?
For if it prosper, none dare call it treason."

"Follow The Money" ;-P

 

[Jim Yanik]

RFI-EMI-GUY <Rhyolite@NETTALLY.COM> wrote in
news:4934a215$0$17061$9a6e19ea@unlimited.newshosting.com:

krw wrote:
(snip)

I had to show my (unaltered, sealed) birth certificate last week to
get a drivers license.

So? Mine looks like a piece of crumbled trash from 54 years ago. Still
good, yet anyone could have forged it.

Why won't NObama show his to demonstrate he
has one of the qualifications to be President?

He has, you saw it.

then what hospital was he born at?
I would think that the hospital would be PROUD to claim that a President
was born there.And it doesn't reveal anything that would threaten his
privacy or identity.

(as if any crook would be dumb enough to try to use Obama's ID....)

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net

 

[Don Klipstein]

In article <Xns9B67EC6B175Ajyanikkuanet@74.209.136.87>, Jim Yanik wrote:

RFI-EMI-GUY <Rhyolite@NETTALLY.COM> wrote in
news:4934a215$0$17061$9a6e19ea@unlimited.newshosting.com:

krw wrote:
(snip)

I had to show my (unaltered, sealed) birth certificate last week to
get a drivers license.

So? Mine looks like a piece of crumbled trash from 54 years ago. Still
good, yet anyone could have forged it.

Why won't NObama show his to demonstrate he
has one of the qualifications to be President?

He has, you saw it.

then what hospital was he born at?
I would think that the hospital would be PROUD to claim that a President
was born there.And it doesn't reveal anything that would threaten his
privacy or identity.

(as if any crook would be dumb enough to try to use Obama's ID....)

I would think that if the hospital violated or even only arguably
violated any state, local or Federal law including any part of HIPPA in
verifying Obama's birth there, then I would expect the swiftboaters to sue
and prosecute (even if by private criminal complaint) to such an extent as
to *at least* cause a very expensive defense burden.

Have any hospitals where any previous US Presidents have been born
bragged about having Presidents born there?

- Don Klipstein (don@misty.com)