Designing The Perfect Coil?

[Chiron]

On Mon, 23 Apr 2012 21:37:11 -0700, Ron Hubbard wrote:

<snip>

And he didn't understand the science behind what he did - he just did
it, somehow...

Hey, that's the way a lot of new discoveries went. Very few people ever
had a theory and then set out to prove it could work.

AFAIK, that's how all discoveries are made. If they prove something,
it's not a discovery; they're just confirming something they already
thought of. Only the surprises would be discoveries - things they never
expected.

But yeah, most of the time it seems like someone stumbles onto something,
and then others - guys with math and such - try to figure out a theory to
explain it. Which is fine - everyone's got a place in the process.

<snip>

Nobody really knows how gravity works let alone a theory for anti-
gravity...

That's for sure. We can describe what it does pretty well, but not
exactly how it does it. And there's no strong evidence that there has to
be any such thing as anti-gravity, even though that would seem to make
sense in some ways.

But just for the sake of argument, let's say that the Haisch/Rhueda/
Puthoff view of gravity & inertia is correct: that those forces are
byproducts of the zero-point field or the way the ZPF interacts with
matter.

My aching head! What zero-point field? There's supposed to be some sort

of "zero-point" energy, which isn't at zero. It's the lowest energy
level, but somewhat above zero. Is that what they mean? I haven't seen
anything about Haisch, Rhueda, and Puthoff, so I don't know anything
about their views.

My theory is that Huchinson's force field blocks off the ZPF so that
both gravity & inertia are effectively cut off. But as somebody onc
said, the ZPF holds matter together and with no ZPF, matter begins to
break apart. And unfortunately, that's what w see when the Huchison

I think that might explain why Hutchison's stuff tends to self-destruct.
He applies the field, it levitates or moves, and then maybe catches fire
or disintegrates or something. Very suggestive.

field is on. If you cancel inertia, you can have star travel-- but not a
good thing if you ship falls apart. And let's say just for the hell of

Well, at least all your molecules will get there. Can't have everything,
I guess...

descriptions, the field generators weren't all that complicated: a fw RF
sources and a whopping big magnetic coil. Stripping away so much
extraneous shit, those are the fundamental similarities between
Hutchison effect (HE) and the Philadelphia experiment (PE). If there's a
major difference, it's in the amount of power used in the PE; Hutchinson
uses so little power that it often took six days of field saturation for
an item to lift itself or demonstrate some other effect. but the PE used
kilowatts of power and got virtually an instantaneous effect,

The PE didn't turn out so well, either. All the molecules remained, but
they got kind of mixed up, killing some of the crew. Assuming it ever
happened - it sounds kind of way out there for it to have remained more
or less a secret for so long (an official secret, anyway; obviously, it's
not a *complete* secret).

<snip>

If I had the money, I'd see if there were different ways to get the RF
filds to interact such as maybe a field whre two wavs cancel each out
and mix that with an alternating magnetic field and see what happens. Of
cours, using enough powr to test a small area, say fifteen to twenty
watts.

I suggest also trying it on small living things, too, like the neighbor's

chihuahua, before trying it on yourself.

About all I can manage is to piddle around with relatively small coils
and stuff, maybe some op-amps and oscillators and other things that
aren't too complicated.  It's not much, but it keeps me out of trouble.


snip
to do a few preliminary expriements. I know Hutchison has a truck-load
of equipment, but how much of it actually did anything to contribute to
the HE? maybe it's like coca leaves where only a small part is active
cocaine and the rest is inert materials.

Um... how do you know so much about the coca plant? Just kidding...

"If we all worked on the assumption that what is accepted as true is
really true, there would be little hope of advance."

-- Orville Wright —

Great quote!



--
I've found my niche. If you're wondering why I'm not there, there was
this little hole in the bottom ...
-- John Croll

 

[Ron Hubbard]

And he didn't understand the science behind what he did - he just did
it, somehow...

Hey, that's the way a lot of new discoveries went. Very few people ever
had a theory and then set out to prove it could work.

AFAIK, that's how all discoveries are made.  If they prove something,
it's not a discovery; they're just confirming something they already
thought of.  Only the surprises would be discoveries - things they never
expected.

But yeah, most of the time it seems like someone stumbles onto something,
and then others - guys with math and such - try to figure out a theory to
explain it.  Which is fine - everyone's got a place in the process.

FYI, 80 per cent of all the scientists are living today although damn
few are doing any kind of original work.

But just for the sake of argument, let's say that the Haisch/Rhueda/
Puthoff view of gravity & inertia is correct: that those forces are
byproducts of the zero-point field or the way the ZPF interacts with
matter.

My aching head!  What zero-point field?  There's supposed to be some sort
of "zero-point" energy, which isn't at zero.  It's the lowest energy
level, but somewhat above zero.  Is that what they mean?  I haven't seen
anything about Haisch, Rhueda, and Puthoff, so I don't know anything
about their views.

After the Big Bang there was a tremendous amount of radiation left
over, the zero-point field. Ever watch Stargate SG-1 or Stargate
Atlantis where they get massive amounts of power from "zed modules?"
Those get energy from the ZPF-- according to researchers, there's
enough energy in an "empty" tea cup to vaoprize an ocean if released
all at once. Aside from free energy, according to the theories of
Bernhard Haisch / Alfonso Rueda / Harold Puthoff it is the energy from
the ZPF that produces drag on the electrically charged particles in
matter thus creating inertia. We obviously know how inertia behaves
but we don't know why-- but it seems to me Hutchison's xperiments
proves the HRP theory nicely.

Even uber-skeptic Arthur C. Clarke thought that if inertia was indeed
a form of electromagnetic drag, then that drag could be
[theoretically] "jammed" to neutralize inertia. He called such a drive
a SHARP drive for Sakharov, Haisch, Rueda and Puthoff in his 1997
book, "3001: The Final Odyssey.

My theory is that Huchinson's force field blocks off the ZPF so that
both gravity & inertia are effectively cut off. But as somebody onc
said, the ZPF holds matter together and with no ZPF, matter begins to
break apart. And unfortunately, that's what w see when the Huchison

I think that might explain why Hutchison's stuff tends to self-destruct.
He applies the field, it levitates or moves, and then maybe catches fire
or disintegrates or something.  Very suggestive.

Almost exactly the things reported of the Philadelphia Experiment. So
far nobody has become invisible or walked through any walls but the
were spontaeous fires, and the other reported effects.

The PE didn't turn out so well, either.  All the molecules remained, but
they got kind of mixed up, killing some of the crew.  Assuming it ever
happened - it sounds kind of way out there for it to have remained more
or less a secret for so long (an official secret, anyway; obviously, it's
not a *complete* secret).

Hmmmm, yeah... Supposedly a schizophrenic nutcase by the name of
Carlos Allende made up the whole thing, but it wasn't so outrageous
that a bunch of people from the ONR had a limited number of copies of
Morris K. Jessup's book made and paassed around for analysis. They
might not have been able to confirm the experiment (and if it was a
black ops sort of thing, that's no surprise) but they never *denied*
that it happened. curiously, all the people who say it was an urban
legnd or a practical joke on Allende's part, were skeptics but not
until they were aske about it so many times did the Navy say it didn't
happen-- but they never said it couldn't have happened; a big
difference.

snip>> If I had the money, I'd see if there were different ways to get the RF
filds to interact such as maybe a field whre two wavs cancel each out
and mix that with an alternating magnetic field and see what happens. Of
cours, using enough powr to test a small area, say fifteen to twenty
watts.

I suggest also trying it on small living things, too, like the neighbor's
chihuahua, before trying it on yourself.

hutchison was caught in th field on a couple of occasions and he
described it as being very painful and he thought he was coming apart.
Maybe he was....

About all I can manage is to piddle around with relatively small coils
and stuff, maybe some op-amps and oscillators and other things that
aren't too complicated.  It's not much, but it keeps me out of trouble.

snip
to do a few preliminary expriements. I know Hutchison has a truck-load
of equipment, but how much of it actually did anything to contribute to
the HE? maybe it's like coca leaves where only a small part is active
cocaine and the rest is inert materials.

Um... how do you know so much about the coca plant?  Just kidding...

As George Takei once said on the Big Bang Theory when asked how he
knew about wooing a girl he said, "I read..!"

"If we all worked on the assumption that what is accepted as true is
really true, there would be little hope of advance."

--  Orville Wright —

Great quote!

LOL. Well, I try to have one for very occasional heh heh.


Ron


_________________________

"Some success, some failure; but either way the gnawing hunger to know
is never sated, and the road to the Unknown continues to be dark and
strange."

–– Control Voice (The Outer Limits) ––

 

[Chiron]

On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 21:38:16 -0700, Ron Hubbard wrote:

Even uber-skeptic Arthur C. Clarke thought that if inertia was indeed a
form of electromagnetic drag, then that drag could be [theoretically]
"jammed" to neutralize inertia. He called such a drive a SHARP drive for
Sakharov, Haisch, Rueda and Puthoff in his 1997 book, "3001: The Final
Odyssey.

you know, that guy was way ahead of his time - simply amazing some of his
stuff...

It would be very interesting to be able to neutralize inertia. That
would allow sudden changes in direction, as often reported in UFO
sightings - changes that would have turned living things into paste if
the inertia weren't somehow neutralized. But would neutralizing inertia
be the same as neutralizing mass?

Who knows? Maybe what we call "science fiction" will turn come to pass
(some of it, anyway). After all, we've got the "death ray" (lasers)
already. Some dilithium crystals, antimatter drive, FTL stuff...

A few years ago (OK, more like 30) people would barely even mention stuff
like this. It was considered too outlandish. Now you've got physicists
like Kip Thorne talking about some of it, and no one gets on his case for
it.
<snip>

Hmmmm, yeah... Supposedly a schizophrenic nutcase by the name of Carlos
Allende made up the whole thing, but it wasn't so outrageous that a
bunch
of people from the ONR had a limited number of copies of Morris K.
Jessup's book made and paassed around for analysis. They might not have
been able to confirm the experiment (and if it was a black ops sort of
thing, that's no surprise) but they never *denied* that it happened.
curiously, all the people who say it was an urban legnd or a practical
joke on Allende's part, were skeptics but not until they were aske about
it so many times did the Navy say it didn't happen-- but they never said
it couldn't have happened; a big difference.

I doubt we'll ever get the whole story about the PE, *especially* if it
was some black ops thing. Since there were fatalities, even if security
issues weren't at stake, the Navy would probably want to keep a lid on it
to prevent lawsuits (or *more* lawsuits, if any have already occurred).

Just because Allende was mentally ill doesn't invalidate his claims
(though of course it throws doubts on them). As I recall (my memory may
be faulty), he was affected by the experiment somehow. Maybe he was a
casualty.

The PE is something to think of, anyway. It sounds like the sort of
thing that the Navy might have tried. Try to make a ship less visible;
use large electromagnets. Whatever. But... of course, you really can't
*rely* on the various descriptions, because of Allende's illness, as well
as there being too much time since the event.

Personally, I think there are still things to be learned about
electromagnetism. I don't quite accept the notion that we've already
found out everything there is to know about it.

--
Neutrinos are into physicists.

 

[Ron Hubbard]

On Apr 25, 3:53 am, Chiron
<chiron613.no.sp...@no.spam.please.gmail.com> wrote:

On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 21:38:16 -0700, Ron Hubbard wrote:
Even uber-skeptic Arthur C. Clarke thought that if inertia was indeed a
form of electromagnetic drag, then that drag could be [theoretically]
"jammed" to neutralize inertia. He called such a drive a SHARP drive for
Sakharov, Haisch, Rueda and Puthoff in his 1997 book, "3001: The Final
Odyssey.

you know, that guy was way ahead of his time - simply amazing some of his
stuff...

LOL. i think you don't read much classical sci-fi. E.E. "Doc" Smith
came up with the idea of the inertialess drive way back in the '30 in
his book Triplanetary and the rest of his Lensmen series. Doc Smith
was way ahead of *his* time; there are a few authors who really had
som degree of psi, who undrstands it, and Smith was one of those few.
Smith, Heinlein, James H. Schmitz, Michael Crichton, Marion Zimmer
Bradley, and maybe Andre Norton as well-- but Arthur C. Clarke is not
in that group. Clarke would say that there is nothing to psionics, no
proof of anything paranormal, and to me people like that are far
behind the times.

My regret was that Smith was living here in Oregon when I was growing
up, but by the time I got into his books as a kid and later began to
really understand inertialess drives, hyperspatial tubes, negative
matter bombs, tractor beams, and most importantly, psionics-- he died
and I never got the chance to write him. Sadly, the story of my life.

It would be very interesting to be able to neutralize inertia.  That
would allow sudden changes in direction, as often reported in UFO
sightings - changes that would have turned living things into paste if
the inertia weren't somehow neutralized.  But would neutralizing inertia
be the same as neutralizing mass?

Okay, I'm a science guy but I don't don't dig into any one thing.
Saying that, this is what I understand: mass is a property of matter--
even when gravity goes down, mass and inertia remain constant. BUT, if
the theory is right and inertia isn't an inherent property of matter
but a sort of EM side-effect, inertia can be neutralized without
affecting mass and here's the kicker: when you neutralize inertia-- go
"free" as Smith would say-- then it's only a temporary thing; once the
field goes off, the affected mass re-acquires it's initial or rest
velocity. This means that say, if an inertialss ship leaves the Earth
with it's particular speed of rotation and travels to a panet around
Rigel and lands, goes inert after landing, thre will be one
spectacular crash because that ship will have the velocity of the
earth as opposed to the planet it's on. In other words, fre
maneuvering can be a tricky and complicated thing because inertia is
never really done away it: it's just temporarily gone and when it
comes back, all of those other things such as mass and velocity also
comes back.

Einstein says ya can't go fasater than light because as speed,
velocity, increases mass also increases until at or near the speed of
light you have infinite mass requiring infinte force to push it. Yeah,
maybe... But if in this case mass is a property of inertia-- or
inertial drag as in the HRP theory-- once inertia is out of the
picture, a free object acquires the velocity of its driving force but
the density of the surrounding medium ultimately determines the speed;
intergalactic travel with no dust could be be faster than inster-
stellar travel where there are dust clouds.


There are some obvious fakes on Youtube but there are a few videos of
UFOs that are truly amazing. But we might be mixing oranges with
apples. While some (if not many) of those things might be inertialess,
some other objects may be extra-dimensional and simply ignore our
physical laws with no technology involved possibly like the thing seen
here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EPeXHIL9FdY

Who knows?  Maybe what we call "science fiction" will turn come to pass
(some of it, anyway).  After all, we've got the "death ray" (lasers)
already.  Some dilithium crystals, antimatter drive, FTL stuff...

I looked at the possibility of the "warp drive" but there's supposed
to be some kind of special material that allows a plasma to generate a
sub-space bubble. According to the Star Trek people, Cochrane had
access to such a material in 2063; not all that far from now. The way
scientists turn their noses at any kind of advanced thinking, it might
be only a matter of sheer luck that such a material might be
discovered. i think there's a better chance of the inertialess drive
than there ever being a warp drive.

But i just had a heart stress test yesterday. While working up to 140
beats on a tread mill, I was thinking "Why don't we have medical
tricorders yet?' We have the mico-miniature computers and tiny video
screens, all that's left to find is a sensor that could read body
temperature, heart beat, and blood elements through skin and in the
kind of environments we see daily. Now *that* would make somebody
money. <g>

A few years ago (OK, more like 30) people would barely even mention stuff
like this.  It was considered too outlandish.  Now you've got physicists
like Kip Thorne talking about some of it, and no one gets on his case for
it.
snip

Well, who would think thy would make cell phones that look lik Trek
communicators within thirty years? Yet the original Lost In Space was
supposed to be set 1997 but we haven't even got a base on the friggin'
moon! Why is that? Sometimes I think our technological advances are as
much politics as it is science & technology.

Hmmmm, yeah...  Supposedly a schizophrenic nutcase by the name of Carlos
Allende made up the whole thing, but it wasn't so outrageous that a
bunch
of people from the ONR had a limited number of copies of Morris K.
Jessup's book made and paassed around for analysis. They might not have
been able to confirm the experiment (and if it was a black ops sort of
thing, that's no surprise) but they never *denied* that it happened.
curiously, all the people who say it was an urban legnd or a practical
joke on Allende's part, were skeptics but not until they were aske about
it so many times did the Navy say it didn't happen-- but they never said
it couldn't have happened; a big difference.

I doubt we'll ever get the whole story about the PE, *especially* if it
was some black ops thing.  Since there were fatalities, even if security
issues weren't at stake, the Navy would probably want to keep a lid on it
to prevent lawsuits (or *more* lawsuits, if any have already occurred).

Just because Allende was mentally ill doesn't invalidate his claims
(though of course it throws doubts on them).  As I recall (my memory may
be faulty), he was affected by the experiment somehow.  Maybe he was a
casualty.

Ahh, that's the thing: I don't think h was ill-- that's a line put out
by some UFO investigator by the name of Gorman, I think. *He* said
that he easily tracked down Allnde and there was no big mystery---
despite the fact that many others said they could never find out where
he was. the way Gorman tells it, Allende wrote all three sides of the
notes in Jssup's book and that the PE never happened; it was all the
rsults of a deranged man. But I think Gorman is full of... little
green apples. ;-)

I had an encounter with something strange back in the '70s and the Air
Force didn't dny it-- they just put my house under surveillance for
the months. Morning, noon, and evening unmarked green helicopters
zipped overhead. Would they admit to it years later, probably not. But
hey, that the nature of the military. Do critics really think the Navy
would say, "Yeah, we did it and things didn't go well. So what?" There
are a lot of mysteries to be explained, but I wouldn't hold my breath
waiting for the military to explain them.

The PE is something to think of, anyway.  It sounds like the sort of
thing that the Navy might have tried.  Try to make a ship less visible;
use large electromagnets.  Whatever.  But... of course, you really can't
*rely* on the various descriptions, because of Allende's illness, as well
as there being too much time since the event.

Personally, I think there are still things to be learned about
electromagnetism.  I don't quite accept the notion that we've already
found out everything there is to know about it.

There's evidence that there was at least one advanced race that is
long gone but knew a lot more than we did. We'll only be able to catch
up when we begin to admit our ignorance. We don't know anything but
mainstream science is too stuffy to make the changes that need to be
made.

Ron


__________________________________

"As a scientist I must be mindful of the past; all too often it has
happened that matters of great value to science were over -looked
because the new phenomenon did not fit the accepted scientific outlook
of the time."

-- Allen J. Hynek --

 

[Chiron]

On Wed, 25 Apr 2012 12:25:27 -0700, Ron Hubbard wrote:

you know, that guy was way ahead of his time - simply amazing some of
his stuff...


LOL. i think you don't read much classical sci-fi. E.E. "Doc" Smith came

Actually, I've read about as much of it as was possible. But Clarke was
a practicing scientist, not just a writer. I don't know what Smith
was... Clarke thought of the communication satellite, decades before it
was ever done. Smart man. Not sure that his SF compares with Smith's,
but overall I like Clarke...

Clarke would say that there is nothing to psionics, no proof of anything
paranormal, and to me people like that are far behind the times.

Really, no one's "ahead" or "behind." In some areas Clarke was highly
advanced. In others, he may not have been - though I don't necessarily
agree that someone who is skeptical about psi is necessarily "behind"
anything.

matter bombs, tractor beams, and most importantly, psionics-- he died
and I never got the chance to write him. Sadly, the story of my life.

Every so often I learn that someone died, who I thought was dead years

ago. I probably should have written a few letters when I was able. Now
it's pretty late - I'm older than most of the SF writers out there...
actually, come to think of it, I'm not sure that's true. I'm not sure
there are many SF writers any more. Maybe what's left are the old guys...

<snip>

the inertia weren't somehow neutralized.  But would neutralizing
inertia be the same as neutralizing mass?


Okay, I'm a science guy but I don't don't dig into any one thing. Saying
that, this is what I understand: mass is a property of matter-- even
when gravity goes down, mass and inertia remain constant. BUT, if the
theory is right and inertia isn't an inherent property of matter but a
sort of EM side-effect, inertia can be neutralized without affecting
mass and here's the kicker: when you neutralize inertia-- go "free" as

To my best understanding, you can't separate mass from inertia. Of
course, if you go ahead and do it, then I'm obviously wrong. But the
math, as I recall it, ties inertia in with the mass.

Oh, yeah, that's right. There are two kinds of mass - gravitational
mass, which is the perceived mass of an object in a gravitational field
(and which varies according to the field), and *inertial mass*. That's
the kind that exists even without a gravitational field. So yeah, the
two are the same, and you're not going to get rid of the inertia without
also getting rid of the mass, unless you somehow manage to completely
rewrite the laws of physics - not even Einstein's laws, but Newton's.

<snip>

Einstein says ya can't go fasater than light because as speed, velocity,
increases mass also increases until at or near the speed of light you
have infinite mass requiring infinte force to push it. Yeah, maybe...
But if in this case mass is a property of inertia-- or inertial drag as
in the HRP theory-- once inertia is out of the picture, a free object

Well, they're going to have to get around this somehow. I'm not even
talking about the FTL problem, but just the fact that when you have mass,
you have inertia. Somehow they're going to have to find a way to either
separate the two, or else do away with the mass. Easier said than done.

Like I keep saying, I hesitate to ever claim something is impossible
because some jerk always goes ahead and does it shortly after I say it.
But in this case, whoever does it has his work cut out for him.

Something tells me that if there *is* a way to neutralize the mass, it
would require an enormous amount of energy - perhaps on the order of the
amount that would be released by the mass itself. Convert the entire
rocket to energy, and it suddenly goes at the speed of light. But of
course, you've vaporized the crew, which is generally considered a Bad
Thing (tm).

acquires the velocity of its driving force but the density of the
surrounding medium ultimately determines the speed; intergalactic travel
with no dust could be be faster than inster- stellar travel where there
are dust clouds.

But it would be really cool to be able to zip on over to a nearby star -

or even a nearby (or distant) galaxy, within a human lifetime.

There are some obvious fakes on Youtube but there are a few videos of
UFOs that are truly amazing. But we might be mixing oranges with apples.
While some (if not many) of those things might be inertialess, some
other objects may be extra-dimensional and simply ignore our physical
laws with no technology involved possibly like the thing seen here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EPeXHIL9FdY

The kid who uploaded that video took a lot of flak about it. You know,
if I ever did see a UFO and get a video of it, I probably wouldn't even
bother telling anyone. No matter what, lots of people would
automatically call me a liar or crazy, even if I had an autographed ray
gun to show them.

You know, UFO's are so varied, it wouldn't surprise me to find that lots

of them (outside the errors and fakes) were secret government weapons
projects and such. Or other earthbound devices. Though of course, if
there *is* any such thing as FTL travel, then there could be aliens up
the wazoo out there.

Who knows?  Maybe what we call "science fiction" will turn come to pass
(some of it, anyway).  After all, we've got the "death ray" (lasers)
already.  Some dilithium crystals, antimatter drive, FTL stuff...

I looked at the possibility of the "warp drive" but there's supposed to
be some kind of special material that allows a plasma to generate a
sub-space bubble. According to the Star Trek people, Cochrane had access
to such a material in 2063; not all that far from now. The way
scientists turn their noses at any kind of advanced thinking, it might
be only a matter of sheer luck that such a material might be discovered.
i think there's a better chance of the inertialess drive than there ever
being a warp drive.

No, scientists don't all really do that. Check out Kip Thorne. Or

Fritjof Capra, for that matter. Even some of the original quantum guys
wrote some very far-out stuff.

But i just had a heart stress test yesterday. While working up to 140
beats on a tread mill, I was thinking "Why don't we have medical
tricorders yet?' We have the mico-miniature computers and tiny video
screens, all that's left to find is a sensor that could read body
temperature, heart beat, and blood elements through skin and in the kind
of environments we see daily. Now *that* would make somebody money. <g

They do. They've got infrared thermometers that measure surface

temperature (though they stick it in the ear because it's less affected
by air cooling). They've got all kinds of remote monitoring stuff. I
guess they just haven't bothered to miniaturize the stuff, but they
really could do most of it.

A few years ago (OK, more like 30) people would barely even mention
stuff like this.  It was considered too outlandish.  Now you've got
physicists like Kip Thorne talking about some of it, and no one gets on
his case for it.
snip

Well, who would think thy would make cell phones that look lik Trek
communicators within thirty years? Yet the original Lost In Space was
supposed to be set 1997 but we haven't even got a base on the friggin'
moon! Why is that? Sometimes I think our technological advances are as
much politics as it is science & technology.

Our technological advances are entirely political. I don't want to sound

cynical (I don't know why not - I *am* cynical), but never believe what
you're told. Space exploration was about showing up the Soviets, who
launched Sputnik before we had a satellite, and freaked us out. It's
about money and greed and arrogance, and not about science. Oh, true -
the *scientists* often are motivated by a desire to learn, but they're
not the ones paying for everything. The guys with the money -
politicians - don't have a clue. All they care about is votes and
appearances. We don't have to show up the Soviets any more. Now we have
to go kill some Muslims, so we're spending all our money on weapons.

were aske about it so many times did the Navy say it didn't happen--
but they never said it couldn't have happened; a big difference.


Just because Allende was mentally ill doesn't invalidate his claims
(though of course it throws doubts on them).  As I recall (my memory
may be faulty), he was affected by the experiment somehow.  Maybe he
was a casualty.


Ahh, that's the thing: I don't think h was ill-- that's a line put out
by some UFO investigator by the name of Gorman, I think. *He* said that
he easily tracked down Allnde and there was no big mystery--- despite
the fact that many others said they could never find out where he was.

Oh... ya know, I never even thought of that. Sure, say the witness is
disturbed, already you've damaged his credibility...

the way Gorman tells it, Allende wrote all three sides of the notes in
Jssup's book and that the PE never happened; it was all the rsults of a
deranged man. But I think Gorman is full of... little green apples. ;-)

Gorman? I don't even recognize that name. I'll Google it - the PE was

one of those events I researched fairly carefully, back when I used dead
trees.

I had an encounter with something strange back in the '70s and the Air
Force didn't dny it-- they just put my house under surveillance for the
months. Morning, noon, and evening unmarked green helicopters zipped
overhead. Would they admit to it years later, probably not. But hey,
that the nature of the military. Do critics really think the Navy would
say, "Yeah, we did it and things didn't go well. So what?" There are a
lot of mysteries to be explained, but I wouldn't hold my breath waiting
for the military to explain them.

The military has exposed the civilian population to bacteria and LSD in

experiments; and they've done way more than that to their own soldiers.
They're not shy about experimenting with people.

Personally, I think there are still things to be learned about
electromagnetism.  I don't quite accept the notion that we've already
found out everything there is to know about it.

There's evidence that there was at least one advanced race that is long
gone but knew a lot more than we did. We'll only be able to catch up

I don't know. I'm not sure the race was so *advanced*, as it may have
been us having made progress we forgot about eventually. For example,
there are the "Baghdad Batteries," which appear to be actual electric
batteries from thousands of years ago. There's no particular reason why
humans couldn't have made the discovery back then; two dissimilar metals,
some sort of acid or other chemical to get a reaction going... maybe they
used it for electro-plating jewelry or something. Or for their iPods.
But over time, we forgot about it, until Volta rediscovered the effect.

when we begin to admit our ignorance. We don't know anything but
mainstream science is too stuffy to make the changes that need to be
made.

Try not to scapegoat science. It is what it is; it does what it's
supposed to do. Some things just aren't within their ability to examine,
yet. I know you think it's all because the scientists are old,
unadventurous farts, but that's simply not true. You get some, sure, but
guys like Sagan would have *loved* to find Martians on Mars, or aliens,
or wormholes, etc. Lots of scientists are like that; but they simply
don't have the tools to examine things that are so far beyond the edge.
Not yet, anyway. Some day, perhaps...

Anyway, seriously the problem isn't so much with the scientists, but with
the people who fund them. Big Science requires Big Bucks, and very few
groups have it. Governments, some universities, and corporations.
Governments want weapons, mostly, or at least something that will make
the voters (or the masses) happy. Better crops, cheaper energy, etc.
Corporations want a profit - it's got to pay, and fairly soon.
Universities may be willing to wait for results, but they don't really
have all that much money, and they still have to keep their alumni
happy. You try telling any of these guys - governments, corporations, or
universities - that you want to investigate psi, and you'll need a few
hundred thousand to do it. Or you want to investigate anti-gravity, and
need millions.

Most of the experimenting is going to have to be Little Science, and it's
up to guys like you and me to do it. Not that we have a clue what we're
doing, but that never stopped anyone.

Until the 20th Century, most scientific progress was made by solo
workers, at their own expense. Most of those scientists, as you
mentioned, didn't have any idea what they were doing. They were
experimenting, learning how things worked. After they made their
discoveries, others came up with theories, some of which worked, some of
which didn't.

Anyway it's past my bedtime, and if I don't get my sleep I get cranky.
Be well, and good night.

--
"When people are least sure, they are often most dogmatic."
-- John Kenneth Galbraith

 

[Ron Hubbard]

On Apr 25, 8:38 pm, Chiron
<chiron613.no.sp...@no.spam.please.gmail.com> wrote:

On Wed, 25 Apr 2012 12:25:27 -0700, Ron Hubbard wrote:

you know, that guy was way ahead of his time - simply amazing some of
his stuff...

LOL. i think you don't read much classical sci-fi. E.E. "Doc" Smith came

Actually, I've read about as much of it as was possible.  But Clarke was
a practicing scientist, not just a writer.  I don't know what Smith
was...

Nothing much. He only had a couple of degrees in chemical
engineering... Nothing to write home about. ;-)



Clarke thought of the communication satellite, decades before it

was ever done.  Smart man.  Not sure that his SF compares with Smith's,
but overall I like Clarke...

I only liked 2001 and that was due to the parts contributed by Kubric
as much as Clarke's original story, which by the way had the monoliths
floating by Saturn instead of Jupiter. A slight but distinctive
difference. There was some rason why Satirn couldn't be used in the
film, but it just sems *right* that Jupiter with the great red spot
should be where the monoliths were hangoing out IMHO.

Clarke would say that there is nothing to psionics, no proof of anything
paranormal, and to me people like that are far behind the times.

Really, no one's "ahead" or "behind."  In some areas Clarke was highly
advanced.  In others, he may not have been - though I don't necessarily
agree that someone who is skeptical about psi is necessarily "behind"
anything.

Only when they make a concerted effort to dny or suppress it. It's
truly amazing how many followers Randi has.

matter bombs, tractor beams, and most importantly, psionics-- he died
and I never got the chance to write him. Sadly, the story of my life.

Every so often I learn that someone died, who I thought was dead years
ago.  I probably should have written a few letters when I was able.  Now
it's pretty late - I'm older than most of the SF writers out there...
actually, come to think of it, I'm not sure that's true.  I'm not sure
there are many SF writers any more.  Maybe what's left are the old guys....

I don't care about the new people: I don't read the stuff--- well,
except for maybe a new 4400 story. But the greats are gone; Doc Smith,
Heinlein, Asimov, Norton, Sturgeon-- the people who had made the
foundations of sci-fi today. There wouldn't be Star Trek, Babylon 5,
Star Wars etc if it wasn't for the likes of Doc Smith-- especially for
Smith.

the inertia weren't somehow neutralized.  But would neutralizing
inertia be the same as neutralizing mass?

Okay, I'm a science guy but I don't don't dig into any one thing. Saying
that, this is what I understand: mass is a property of matter-- even
when gravity goes down, mass and inertia remain constant. BUT, if the
theory is right and inertia isn't an inherent property of matter but a
sort of EM side-effect, inertia can be neutralized without affecting
mass and here's the kicker: when you neutralize inertia-- go "free" as

To my best understanding, you can't separate mass from inertia.  Of
course, if you go ahead and do it, then I'm obviously wrong.  But the
math, as I recall it, ties inertia in with the mass.

Maybe... But according to the HRP theory, you have an ntirely
differernt dynamic involved.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stochastic_electrodynamics

Oh, yeah, that's right.  There are two kinds of mass - gravitational
mass, which is the perceived mass of an object in a gravitational field
(and which varies according to the field), and *inertial mass*.  That's
the kind that exists even without a gravitational field.  So yeah, the
two are the same, and you're not going to get rid of the inertia without
also getting rid of the mass, unless you somehow manage to completely
rewrite the laws of physics - not even Einstein's laws, but Newton's.

Not rewrite them, just expand upon them. just because that ass- uh,
just because Einstein came along doesn't mean Newtonian physics no
longer work. And if somebody ever reliably utilizes the Huchison
effect, Einstenian physics will go out the air lock to join Newton's.

Einstein says ya can't go fasater than light because as speed, velocity,
increases mass also increases until at or near the speed of light you
have infinite mass requiring infinte force to push it. Yeah, maybe...
But if in this case mass is a property of inertia-- or inertial drag as
in the HRP theory-- once inertia is out of the picture, a free object

Well, they're going to have to get around this somehow.  I'm not even
talking about the FTL problem, but just the fact that when you have mass,
you have inertia.  Somehow they're going to have to find a way to either
separate the two, or else do away with the mass.  Easier said than done..

Seems like it was very easily done: ever see the video where a file
flies up and hits Hutchinson? I think the current paradigm on
gravity, mass, and inertia is badly fucked, but hey, nobody ever
listens to me-- even whn I'm right 90 per cent of the time.

Like I keep saying, I hesitate to ever claim something is impossible
because some jerk always goes ahead and does it shortly after I say it.
But in this case, whoever does it has his work cut out for him.

Something tells me that if there *is* a way to neutralize the mass, it
would require an enormous amount of energy - perhaps on the order of the
amount that would be released by the mass itself.  Convert the entire
rocket to energy, and it suddenly goes at the speed of light.  But of
course, you've vaporized the crew, which is generally considered a Bad
Thing (tm).

acquires the velocity of its driving force but the density of the
surrounding medium ultimately determines the speed; intergalactic travel
with no dust could be be faster than inster- stellar travel where there
are dust clouds.

But it would be really cool to be able to zip on over to a nearby star -
or even a nearby (or distant) galaxy, within a human lifetime.

Ever read Heinlein's book, 'Tunnel In The Sky? The accidental
discovery of the jump gate gave a crowded planet much needed breathing
space. With seven billion and rising each decade, me might need a few
extra planets to colonize.

There are some obvious fakes on Youtube but there are a few videos of
UFOs that are truly amazing. But we might be mixing oranges with apples..
While some (if not many) of those things might be inertialess, some
other objects may be extra-dimensional and simply ignore our physical
laws with no technology involved possibly like the thing seen here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EPeXHIL9FdY

The kid who uploaded that video took a lot of flak about it.  You know,
if I ever did see a UFO and get a video of it, I probably wouldn't even
bother telling anyone.  No matter what, lots of people would
automatically call me a liar or crazy, even if I had an autographed ray
gun to show them.

Oddly enough, thirty years ago you might not have been believed even
if you had some good clear photos.

You know, UFO's are so varied, it wouldn't surprise me to find that lots
of them (outside the errors and fakes) were secret government weapons
projects and such.  Or other earthbound devices.  Though of course, if
there *is* any such thing as FTL travel, then there could be aliens up
the wazoo out there.

Varied? Since 1897 there have been dirigibles, foo fighters, ghost
rockets, sphere's, triangles, cubes, discs, cigar shapes, as well as
phantom planes and objects moving under the oceans. There have been
objects less than four feet in diameter and other objects over 2,000
feet long. Som have moved like greased lightning while others simply
vanished. some have been visible to the naked eye while others were
visible only to radar. And therein lies the problem: there is no
conformity, nothing to draw any kind of valid concolusions from.
Well, actually ww can conclude that UFOs are potentially dangerous and
don't seem to want to be our friends.... <g>

But i just had a heart stress test yesterday. While working up to 140
beats on a tread mill, I was thinking "Why don't we have medical
tricorders yet?' We have the mico-miniature computers and tiny video
screens, all that's left to find is a sensor that could read body
temperature, heart beat, and blood elements through skin and in the kind
of environments we see daily. Now *that* would make somebody money. <g

They do.  They've got infrared thermometers that measure surface
temperature (though they stick it in the ear because it's less affected
by air cooling).  They've got all kinds of remote monitoring stuff.  I
guess they just haven't bothered to miniaturize the stuff, but they
really could do most of it.

I mean a non-contact way of getting information. If not for medical
purposes, the military and law enforcement people would love a way to
determine if three dozen people were hiding in a building or a jungle
from a mile away-- or even a half mile. The problem is what do you use
for that sensor beam: ultrasound? Radio waves? Microwaves? What we
have now doesn't work too well for that really useful tricorder.

were aske about it so many times did the Navy say it didn't happen--
but they never said it couldn't have happened; a big difference.

Just because Allende was mentally ill doesn't invalidate his claims
(though of course it throws doubts on them).  As I recall (my memory
may be faulty), he was affected by the experiment somehow.  Maybe he
was a casualty.

Ahh, that's the thing: I don't think h was ill-- that's a line put out
by some UFO investigator by the name of Gorman, I think. *He* said that
he easily tracked down Allnde and there was no big mystery--- despite
the fact that many others said they could never find out where he was.

Oh... ya know, I never even thought of that.  Sure, say the witness is
disturbed, already you've damaged his credibility...

the way Gorman tells it, Allende wrote all three sides of the notes in
Jssup's book and that the PE never happened; it was all the rsults of a
deranged man. But I think Gorman is full of... little green apples. ;-)

Gorman?  I don't even recognize that name.  I'll Google it - the PE was
one of those events I researched fairly carefully, back when I used dead
trees.

Funny how I even remembered his name but i got the spelling slightly
wrong; it should be Robert A. Goerman. Although others such as my
main man John A. Keel also thought Allende was a nutcase. And he might
very well have been, but it's possible that some experience or
external factor made him that way. But wouldn't it be ironic if the PE
had never happened but Hutchison created in the lab what somebody
imagined over forty years before? I don't believe in coincidence and
all my instincts tell me something is wrong with the idea that the PE
is nothing but a hoax.

Ron


___________________________

“We are all brothers under the skin - and I, for one, would be willing
to skin humanity to prove it.”

–– Ayn Rand ––

 

[Ron Hubbard]

On Apr 25, 8:38 pm, Chiron
<chiron613.no.sp...@no.spam.please.gmail.com> wrote:

On Wed, 25 Apr 2012 12:25:27 -0700, Ron Hubbard wrote:

you know, that guy was way ahead of his time - simply amazing some of
his stuff...

LOL. i think you don't read much classical sci-fi. E.E. "Doc" Smith came

Actually, I've read about as much of it as was possible.  But Clarke was
a practicing scientist, not just a writer.  I don't know what Smith
was... Clarke thought of the communication satellite, decades before it
was ever done.  Smart man.  Not sure that his SF compares with Smith's,
but overall I like Clarke...

Clarke would say that there is nothing to psionics, no proof of anything
paranormal, and to me people like that are far behind the times.

Really, no one's "ahead" or "behind."  In some areas Clarke was highly
advanced.  In others, he may not have been - though I don't necessarily
agree that someone who is skeptical about psi is necessarily "behind"
anything.

matter bombs, tractor beams, and most importantly, psionics-- he died
and I never got the chance to write him. Sadly, the story of my life.

Every so often I learn that someone died, who I thought was dead years
ago.  I probably should have written a few letters when I was able.  Now
it's pretty late - I'm older than most of the SF writers out there...
actually, come to think of it, I'm not sure that's true.  I'm not sure
there are many SF writers any more.  Maybe what's left are the old guys....

snip



the inertia weren't somehow neutralized.  But would neutralizing
inertia be the same as neutralizing mass?

Okay, I'm a science guy but I don't don't dig into any one thing. Saying
that, this is what I understand: mass is a property of matter-- even
when gravity goes down, mass and inertia remain constant. BUT, if the
theory is right and inertia isn't an inherent property of matter but a
sort of EM side-effect, inertia can be neutralized without affecting
mass and here's the kicker: when you neutralize inertia-- go "free" as

To my best understanding, you can't separate mass from inertia.  Of
course, if you go ahead and do it, then I'm obviously wrong.  But the
math, as I recall it, ties inertia in with the mass.

Oh, yeah, that's right.  There are two kinds of mass - gravitational
mass, which is the perceived mass of an object in a gravitational field
(and which varies according to the field), and *inertial mass*.  That's
the kind that exists even without a gravitational field.  So yeah, the
two are the same, and you're not going to get rid of the inertia without
also getting rid of the mass, unless you somehow manage to completely
rewrite the laws of physics - not even Einstein's laws, but Newton's.

snip



Einstein says ya can't go fasater than light because as speed, velocity,
increases mass also increases until at or near the speed of light you
have infinite mass requiring infinte force to push it. Yeah, maybe...
But if in this case mass is a property of inertia-- or inertial drag as
in the HRP theory-- once inertia is out of the picture, a free object

Well, they're going to have to get around this somehow.  I'm not even
talking about the FTL problem, but just the fact that when you have mass,
you have inertia.  Somehow they're going to have to find a way to either
separate the two, or else do away with the mass.  Easier said than done..

Like I keep saying, I hesitate to ever claim something is impossible
because some jerk always goes ahead and does it shortly after I say it.
But in this case, whoever does it has his work cut out for him.

Something tells me that if there *is* a way to neutralize the mass, it
would require an enormous amount of energy - perhaps on the order of the
amount that would be released by the mass itself.  Convert the entire
rocket to energy, and it suddenly goes at the speed of light.  But of
course, you've vaporized the crew, which is generally considered a Bad
Thing (tm).

acquires the velocity of its driving force but the density of the
surrounding medium ultimately determines the speed; intergalactic travel
with no dust could be be faster than inster- stellar travel where there
are dust clouds.

But it would be really cool to be able to zip on over to a nearby star -
or even a nearby (or distant) galaxy, within a human lifetime.



There are some obvious fakes on Youtube but there are a few videos of
UFOs that are truly amazing. But we might be mixing oranges with apples..
While some (if not many) of those things might be inertialess, some
other objects may be extra-dimensional and simply ignore our physical
laws with no technology involved possibly like the thing seen here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EPeXHIL9FdY

The kid who uploaded that video took a lot of flak about it.  You know,
if I ever did see a UFO and get a video of it, I probably wouldn't even
bother telling anyone.  No matter what, lots of people would
automatically call me a liar or crazy, even if I had an autographed ray
gun to show them.

You know, UFO's are so varied, it wouldn't surprise me to find that lots
of them (outside the errors and fakes) were secret government weapons
projects and such.  Or other earthbound devices.  Though of course, if
there *is* any such thing as FTL travel, then there could be aliens up
the wazoo out there.

Who knows?  Maybe what we call "science fiction" will turn come to pass
(some of it, anyway).  After all, we've got the "death ray" (lasers)
already.  Some dilithium crystals, antimatter drive, FTL stuff...

I looked at the possibility of the "warp drive" but there's supposed to
be some kind of special material that allows a plasma to generate a
sub-space bubble. According to the Star Trek people, Cochrane had access
to such a material in 2063; not all that far from now. The way
scientists turn their noses at any kind of advanced thinking, it might
be only a matter of sheer luck that such a material might be discovered..
i think there's a better chance of the inertialess drive than there ever
being a warp drive.

No, scientists don't all really do that.  Check out Kip Thorne.  Or
Fritjof Capra, for that matter.  Even some of the original quantum guys
wrote some very far-out stuff.

Always keep in mind this bit of repartee from the Doctor Who episode,
Shada:


DOCTOR [OC]: Where are we?
PARSONS: I don't know.
DOCTOR: Neither do I.
PARSONS: And I don't believe that we travelled hundreds of light
years.
DOCTOR: Why not?
PARSONS: You cannot travel faster than light. Einstein.
DOCTOR: What? Do you understand Einstein?
PARSONS: Yes.
DOCTOR: What? And quantum theory?
PARSONS: Yes.
DOCTOR: What? And Planck?
PARSONS: Yes.
DOCTOR: What? And Newton?
PARSONS: Yes.
DOCTOR: What? And Schoenberg?
PARSONS: Of course.
DOCTOR: You've got a lot to unlearn. Ah.
(The Doctor spots the letters IASS ASD on a plaque on the wall.)
DOCTOR: Institute for Advanced Science Studies.
PARSONS: ASD Advanced State of Decay?


Written by the late great Douglas Adams (who I met once-- one cool
guy), he had a valid point beneath the banter. <g>

Ron



_________________________

"From my heart and from my hand
Why don't people understand
My intentions..."

— Oingo Boingo (Weird Science) —

 

[Ron Hubbard]

On Apr 24, 6:10 pm, Chiron
<chiron613.no.sp...@no.spam.please.gmail.com> wrote:

On Mon, 23 Apr 2012 21:37:11 -0700, Ron Hubbard wrote:

snip

And he didn't understand the science behind what he did - he just did
it, somehow...

Hey, that's the way a lot of new discoveries went. Very few people ever
had a theory and then set out to prove it could work.

AFAIK, that's how all discoveries are made.  If they prove something,
it's not a discovery; they're just confirming something they already
thought of.  Only the surprises would be discoveries - things they never
expected.

But yeah, most of the time it seems like someone stumbles onto something,
and then others - guys with math and such - try to figure out a theory to
explain it.  Which is fine - everyone's got a place in the process.

Besids other things I have ADD and math bores me to tears; but I did
understand this:

http://www.hpcc-space.de/publications/documents/aiaa2004-3700-a4.pdf

Ron


___________________

“In the beginning was the rhythm, but I had forgotten and I was
waiting for the word.”

–– Ray Manzarek ––

 

[Chiron]

On Sun, 29 Apr 2012 13:50:15 -0700, Ron Hubbard wrote:

Besids other things I have ADD and math bores me to tears; but I did
understand this:

http://www.hpcc-space.de/publications/documents/aiaa2004-3700-a4.pdf

Ron

I dunno... I've forgotten everything I knew about diffeq's. It would
take me a long time to review that stuff - it's not easy. I'm not
convinced it would be worth it. I don't think there's any way for me to
understand it without the math.

So if you are bored with math, how did you manage to handle the diffeq's?

BTW, I apparently had some sort of undiagnosed ADD. About a year ago I
was placed on Ritalin for something unrelated; suddenly I found that I
was able to concentrate, to focus... completely unexpected result.

--
Well, I'm INVISIBLE AGAIN ... I might as well pay a visit to the LADIES
ROOM ...

 

[Ron Hubbard]

On Apr 29, 3:56 pm, Chiron
<chiron613.no.sp...@no.spam.please.gmail.com> wrote:

On Sun, 29 Apr 2012 13:50:15 -0700, Ron Hubbard wrote:
Besids other things I have ADD and math bores me to tears; but I did
understand this:

http://www.hpcc-space.de/publications/documents/aiaa2004-3700-a4.pdf

Ron

I dunno... I've forgotten everything I knew about diffeq's.  It would
take me a long time to review that stuff - it's not easy.  I'm not
convinced it would be worth it.  I don't think there's any way for me to
understand it without the math.

So if you are bored with math, how did you manage to handle the diffeq's?

I didn't need the math to understand the basic principles involved. If
anything, math was the only reasaon I never went in fully for
engineering even though MIT wanted me after I graduated from high
school. I kinda regretted that... But you don't need calculus to
knock together a radio or sonic screwdriver-- one can be a synthesist
and get comfortably through life in electronics, engineering, and
physics without mathematics.

BTW, I apparently had some sort of undiagnosed ADD.  About a year ago I
was placed on Ritalin for something unrelated; suddenly I found that I
was able to concentrate, to focus... completely unexpected result.

Ah, there's the rub: ADD is a problem caused by excessive theta--
according to current theory-- but theta is the trigger for at least
85 per cent of the known psi gifts. Ritalin is basically a theta
suppressant; while it might not bother those few functional telepaths
and the seers, both clairvoyant & precognitive, ritalin would cripple
at least 2/3rds of my talents. That's a problem a lot of people have
who are either highly creative, highly psychic, or both: whether to
have clarity or to keep that muddle of thoughts caused by theta but
ends up in artistic genius or like Tesla, intellectual genius, or an
assortment of wild talents. Sometimes it's a bitch, but I would rather
keep the muddle and all the bizarre crap that goes with being a psi
than to be... well... normal. The neurologists don't know what all of
that "anomalous theta" does, but I do.


Ron


__________________________

"Strange and bizarre things happen to you with alarming frequency. You
are the one with whom demons will stop and chat. Magic items with
disturbing properties will find their way to you. The only talking dog
on 20th-century Earth will come to you with his problems. Dimensional
gates sealed for centuries will crack open just so that you can be
bathed in the energies released... or perhaps the entities on the
other side will invite you to tea. Nothing lethal will happen to you,
at least not immediately, and occasionally some weirdness will be
beneficial. But most of the time it will be terribly, terribly
inconvenient."

— "Weirdness Magnet" disadvantage from GURPS —

 

[Chiron]

On Mon, 30 Apr 2012 12:05:43 -0700, Ron Hubbard wrote:

On Apr 29, 3:56 pm, Chiron
chiron613.no.sp...@no.spam.please.gmail.com> wrote:
On Sun, 29 Apr 2012 13:50:15 -0700, Ron Hubbard wrote:
Besids other things I have ADD and math bores me to tears; but I did
understand this:

http://www.hpcc-space.de/publications/documents/aiaa2004-3700-a4.pdf

Ron

I dunno... I've forgotten everything I knew about diffeq's.  It would
take me a long time to review that stuff - it's not easy.  I'm not
convinced it would be worth it.  I don't think there's any way for me
to understand it without the math.

So if you are bored with math, how did you manage to handle the
diffeq's?

I didn't need the math to understand the basic principles involved. If
anything, math was the only reasaon I never went in fully for
engineering even though MIT wanted me after I graduated from high
school. I kinda regretted that... But you don't need calculus to knock
together a radio or sonic screwdriver-- one can be a synthesist and get
comfortably through life in electronics, engineering, and physics
without mathematics.

Well, I guess that depends on what you mean by a synthesist. Is that the
same (or similar) to an experimenter? If so, yes, you're right - you can
build stuff without the math. If you're in completely unknown territory,
there *is* no math yet. But of course, without the math, you won't be
able to share your discoveries with any scientists unless it's something
so utterly unexpected and obvious that it grabs their attention.
Otherwise you just wind up one more voice on the Internet from someone
who has discovered anti-gravity, FTL travel, free energy, or whatever.
Nothing wrong with that, but the problem is, how can anyone tell the real
discoverers from the self-deluded people?

BTW, I apparently had some sort of undiagnosed ADD.  About a year ago I
was placed on Ritalin for something unrelated; suddenly I found that I
was able to concentrate, to focus... completely unexpected result.

Ah, there's the rub: ADD is a problem caused by excessive theta--
according to current theory-- but theta is the trigger for at least 85
per cent of the known psi gifts. Ritalin is basically a theta
suppressant; while it might not bother those few functional telepaths
and the seers, both clairvoyant & precognitive, ritalin would cripple at
least 2/3rds of my talents. That's a problem a lot of people have who
are either highly creative, highly psychic, or both: whether to have
clarity or to keep that muddle of thoughts caused by theta but ends up
in artistic genius or like Tesla, intellectual genius, or an assortment
of wild talents. Sometimes it's a bitch, but I would rather keep the
muddle and all the bizarre crap that goes with being a psi than to be...
well... normal. The neurologists don't know what all of that "anomalous
theta" does, but I do.

I never had much psi talent; a little bit, but nothing remarkable. I

*did* have some peculiar talents; probably something like what used to be
called the "idiot-savant," where you have some excess talent while being
deficient elsewhere. So I have trouble telling left from right; but in
compensation, I can amuse all my friends by talking backwards - "seeing"
and "reading" sentences backwords. .sdrawkcab klat nac I And so on...
And for some reason I have a really tenacious memory for numbers, but not
for reality. So I can remember bank account numbers from 30 years ago,
but not what I did yesterday. I guess what I did yesterday wasn't as
interesting as 30-year-old account numbers.

The Ritalin hasn't stopped any of this. Not that it would have been a
huge loss if it had - these "talents" are not as useful as they might
seem. No one gives a shit that I can remember 30-year-old account
numbers, and talking backwards amuses them for about five minutes, after
which I've used up all my tricks.

— "Weirdness Magnet" disadvantage from GURPS —

What is/are "GURPS"?



--
Logic is the chastity belt of the mind!

 

[Jasen Betts]

On 2012-04-30, Chiron <chiron613.no.spam> wrote:

On Mon, 30 Apr 2012 12:05:43 -0700, Ron Hubbard wrote:

— "Weirdness Magnet" disadvantage from GURPS —

What is/are "GURPS"?

A role playing system http://lmgtfy.com/?q=gurps

--
⚂⚃ 100% natural

--- Posted via news://freenews.netfront.net/ - Complaints to news@netfront.net ---

 

[Ron Hubbard]

wanted me after I graduated from high

school. I kinda regretted that... But you don't need calculus to knock
together a radio or sonic screwdriver-- one can be a synthesist and get
comfortably through life in electronics, engineering, and physics
without mathematics.

Well, I guess that depends on what you mean by a synthesist. Is that the
same (or similar) to an experimenter?

Synthesists are those rare people who can see and understand a
priciple and combine it with another, totally unrelated one, to get a
new idea or system. A lot of things are obvious after the fact but few
people are truly visionary.

If so, yes, you're right - you can

build stuff without the math. If you're in completely unknown territory,
there *is* no math yet. But of course, without the math, you won't be
able to share your discoveries with any scientists unless it's something
so utterly unexpected and obvious that it grabs their attention.

Yeah... Everybody wants my sonic scewdriver plans.

Otherwise you just wind up one more voice on the Internet from someone
who has discovered anti-gravity, FTL travel, free energy, or whatever.
Nothing wrong with that, but the problem is, how can anyone tell the real
discoverers from the self-deluded people?

Somehow I don't think Zefram Cochrane wroye many theories on warp
mechanics; most likely he just built the damn thing-- showing all the
dipshit scientists of his time that FTL travel was possible. Once it
was a done deed, all his plans and theories were available. that's
the way an engineer would do it; I doubt if Cochrane was a physicist.

of wild talents. Sometimes it's a bitch, but I would rather keep the
muddle and all the bizarre crap that goes with being a psi than to be...
well... normal. The neurologists don't know what all of that "anomalous
theta" does, but I do.

I never had much psi talent; a little bit, but nothing remarkable. I
*did* have some peculiar talents; probably something like what used to be
called the "idiot-savant," where you have some excess talent while being
deficient elsewhere. So I have trouble telling left from right; but in
compensation, I can amuse all my friends by talking backwards -

That's intresting: I've always had to stop and really think hard about
my left and right, too. But I have always been ambidextrous and almost
as able to write left-handed as right-handed.

The Ritalin hasn't stopped any of this. Not that it would have been a
huge loss if it had - these "talents" are not as useful as they might
seem. No one gives a shit that I can remember 30-year-old account
numbers, and talking backwards amuses them for about five minutes, after
which I've used up all my tricks.

I think you're kinda mixing apples and oranges a bit. There is a
dinstinction between being left-brained and right-brained; how each
side controls certain skills such as mathematics on one side and
language on another. I have always been extremely well with languages,
having learned college-level French, German, italian, Japanese, and
some Spanish & very little Russian. As for math, i always suckd and
had trouble gtting 2 plus 2 together to get five-- uh, four.Altthough
my tachrs bitched about it, what I couldn't do in my head I could do
on a calculator; hell, I could build a calculator with my yes closed
if I had to. I got an extremely high SAT score but I know it wasn't in
math; and being math deficient doesn' make an 140 IQ any weaker-- I
just have different strengths. Or to put it another way, I'm only
mathematically stupid.

-- "Weirdness Magnet" disadvantage from GURPS --

What is/are "GURPS"?

--
Logic is the chastity belt of the mind!- Hide quoted text -

The fourth Doctor was fond of mis-quoting Ketterling's law about
logic: ''Logic is an organized way of going wrong with confidence." or
as the Doctor would say, "Logic is the science of being wrong with
certainty." Indeed... Although as I get older, I like the Vulcan idea
of Kohlinar-- the purging of all emotions in favor of cold logic. I've
become a lot more hot-headed than I used to be and it's not a good
trait. So many trekies hav thought out an awful lot of stuff; pity,
none of it was how to do real Kohhlinar and get rid of pesky emotions,

Ron



______________________

"He has a range of awareness that startles you, but it belongs to him
by right, because it belongs to the world he lives in. If there were
enough like him, the world would be a very safe place to live in,
without becoming too dull to be worth living in. "

-- Raymond Chandler, The Simple Art of Murder --

 

[Ron Hubbard]

On May 1, 12:52 am, Ron Hubbard <or...@centurylink.net> wrote:

wanted me after I graduated from high

school. I kinda regretted that...  But you don't need calculus to knock
together a radio or sonic screwdriver-- one can be a synthesist and get
comfortably through life in electronics, engineering, and physics
without mathematics.

Well, I guess that depends on what you mean by a synthesist.  Is that the
same (or similar) to an experimenter?

Synthesists are those rare people who can see and understand a
priciple and combine it with another, totally unrelated one, to get a
new idea or system. A lot of things are obvious after the fact but few
people are truly visionary.

  If so, yes, you're right - you can

build stuff without the math.  If you're in completely unknown territory,
there *is* no math yet.  But of course, without the math, you won't be
able to share your discoveries with any scientists unless it's something
so utterly unexpected and obvious that it grabs their attention.

Yeah... Everybody wants my sonic scewdriver plans.

Otherwise you just wind up one more voice on the Internet from someone
who has discovered anti-gravity, FTL travel, free energy, or whatever.
Nothing wrong with that, but the problem is, how can anyone tell the real
discoverers from the self-deluded people?

Somehow I don't think Zefram Cochrane wroye many theories on warp
mechanics; most likely he just built the damn thing-- showing all the
dipshit scientists of his time that FTL travel was possible. Once it
was a done deed, all his plans and theories were available.  that's
the way an engineer would do it; I doubt if Cochrane was a physicist.

of wild talents. Sometimes it's a bitch, but I would rather keep the
muddle and all the bizarre crap that goes with being a psi than to be....
well... normal. The neurologists don't know what all of that "anomalous
theta" does, but I do.

I never had much psi talent; a little bit, but nothing remarkable.  I
*did* have some peculiar talents; probably something like what used to be
called the "idiot-savant," where you have some excess talent while being
deficient elsewhere.  So I have trouble telling left from right; but in
compensation, I can amuse all my friends by talking backwards -

That's intresting: I've always had to stop and really think hard about
my left and right, too. But I have always been ambidextrous and almost
as able to write left-handed as right-handed.

The Ritalin hasn't stopped any of this.  Not that it would have been a
huge loss if it had - these "talents" are not as useful as they might
seem.  No one gives a shit that I can remember 30-year-old account
numbers, and talking backwards amuses them for about five minutes, after
which I've used up all my tricks.

I think you're kinda mixing apples and oranges a bit. There is a
dinstinction between being left-brained and right-brained; how each
side controls certain skills such as mathematics on one side and
language on another. I have always been extremely well with languages,
having learned college-level French, German, italian, Japanese, and
some Spanish & very little Russian. As for math, i always suckd and
had trouble gtting 2 plus 2 together to get five-- uh, four.Altthough
my tachrs bitched about it, what I couldn't do in my head I could do
on a calculator; hell, I could build a calculator with my yes closed
if I had to. I got an extremely high SAT score but I know it wasn't in
math; and being math deficient doesn' make an 140 IQ any weaker-- I
just have different strengths. Or to put it another way, I'm only
mathematically stupid.  

LOL, i forgot the other side of my point: left-brain/right-brain
matters are one thing, but ritalun has nothing to do with that:
ritalin is suppossed to reduce excessive theta and behaves in some
ways like a stimulant. And in fact there's often an underground market
in schools where kids who take ritalin sell it to those who don't
becase the stimulant action helps non-ADD kids take tests, as well as
gives a bit of a high.

The biofeedback people generally frown on theta and think there's
something evil about it, but thirty minutes in 5 Hz theta is qual to 8
hours of deep sleep, many artists and creative people get thir
inspiration from theta, and 85 per cent of all the psi abilities are
theta-- telepathy (receiving, 6 Hz) and astral/mental projection; PK
and all of it's sub-gifts like telekinesis, cryokiniesis,
psychopyresis, etc-- teleportation, namapathy (psychic healing), et
al. most psis would rather lose an arm thanto have an ability blocked
let alone go through the the psychological differences caused by a
drug like ritalin. Ironically, there are no known psi enhancers--
well, none that are exactly safe-- but a lot of psi suppressants.
Life's so unfair, heh heh.....


Ron

______________________

"Some success, some failure; but either way the gnawing hunger to know
is never sated, and the road to the Unknown continues to be dark and
strange."

–– Control Voice (The Outer Limits) ––