Deadbolt indicator

Aug 27, 2013

On Mon, 26 Aug 2013 14:48:27 -0700 (PDT), David Humpherys
<david.humpherys@gmail.com> wrote:

A magnet glued to the end of the deadbolt, and a Hall sensor in the door
jamb would get my vote.

Thanks Phil - a totally different solution i didn't know existed. and a cheap one at that.

I'd have to find a thin magnet so that it didn't interfere with the door opening-closing. something like this might work.
https://www.sparkfun.com/products/8644

thanks for all the help everyone!!!

A source for cheap, small, thin,powerful magnets is that broken set of
earbuds that everyone seems to collect these days. Also, I run across
two types of hall effect switches. One type stays on until the
magnetic field is reversed, the other stays on only while the magnetic
field is present.
Eric

John Fields · Aug 27, 2013

On Mon, 26 Aug 2013 15:55:16 -0700, John Larkin
<jlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> wrote:

On Mon, 26 Aug 2013 14:41:07 -0700 (PDT), David Humpherys
david.humpherys@gmail.com> wrote:

I get what your saying. Thank you for the mention.
Any idea where I would get this type of material ?
And how would I attach it to the wood without saftey problems?

Totally understand it might not be as good as a production switch.

How about two springs, parallel. The deadbolt pushes up against both
of them. The springs could be inside drilled holes in the door frame.

_______________________
-----/////////// |
| <-------
-----/////////// |
|_______________________

---
Don't you mean series?

--
JF

Jim Thompson · Aug 27, 2013

On Mon, 26 Aug 2013 18:14:58 -0500, John Fields
<jfields@austininstruments.com> wrote:

On Mon, 26 Aug 2013 15:55:16 -0700, John Larkin
jlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> wrote:

On Mon, 26 Aug 2013 14:41:07 -0700 (PDT), David Humpherys
david.humpherys@gmail.com> wrote:

I get what your saying. Thank you for the mention.
Any idea where I would get this type of material ?
And how would I attach it to the wood without saftey problems?

Totally understand it might not be as good as a production switch.

How about two springs, parallel. The deadbolt pushes up against both
of them. The springs could be inside drilled holes in the door frame.

_______________________
-----/////////// |
| <-------
-----/////////// |
|_______________________

---
Don't you mean series?

Tom Biasi · Aug 27, 2013

On 8/26/2013 7:17 PM, Jim Thompson wrote:

On Mon, 26 Aug 2013 18:14:58 -0500, John Fields
jfields@austininstruments.com> wrote:

On Mon, 26 Aug 2013 15:55:16 -0700, John Larkin
jlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> wrote:

On Mon, 26 Aug 2013 14:41:07 -0700 (PDT), David Humpherys
david.humpherys@gmail.com> wrote:

I get what your saying. Thank you for the mention.
Any idea where I would get this type of material ?
And how would I attach it to the wood without saftey problems?

Totally understand it might not be as good as a production switch.

How about two springs, parallel. The deadbolt pushes up against both
of them. The springs could be inside drilled holes in the door frame.

_______________________
-----/////////// |
| <-------
-----/////////// |
|_______________________

---
Don't you mean series?

Physically parallel, electrically in series when they contact
deadbolt.

...Jim Thompson

perhaps Jim,
If he wants to "MacGyver" everything. I would like to see him make use
of readily available products but the who am I?

Tom

RobertMacy · Aug 27, 2013

On Mon, 26 Aug 2013 13:02:55 -0700, Phil Hobbs
<pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:

On 08/26/2013 03:58 PM, Tim Wescott wrote:
On Mon, 26 Aug 2013 10:33:24 -0700, David Humpherys wrote:

You would be better off not to let the dead bolt make the connection.
The bolt could push a micro-switch or activate something else that
would close a circuit.

Thanks Tom,
Do you have any recommendations for a micro-switch that would work for
this type of thing?

http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?
productId=2049718&numProdsPerPage=60

http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?
productId=2049719&numProdsPerPage=60

Finding a way to mount the switch is going to be a challenge -- you want
to have a lot of leeway for where the deadbolt ends up, while still
reliably actuating the switch. So an arrangement that either lets the
switch be actuated by the side of the deadbolt as it enters its pocket,
or that has a long spring on the switch, is probably best.

Mess with it. These electromechanical projects always end up being more
mechanical than electrical in the end.

A magnet glued to the end of the deadbolt, and a Hall sensor in the door
jamb would get my vote.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

magnetic security switch is built for this AND looks decent.

Aug 27, 2013

On Mon, 26 Aug 2013 16:18:15 -0700 (PDT), David Humpherys
<david.humpherys@gmail.com> wrote:

One type stays on until the
magnetic field is reversed, the other stays on only while the magnetic
field is present.

Eric, this was going to be my question with any of these sensors.
Hall or Reed - are they binary? If not, how do I dial in the LED to only turn on at a certain point?

I'm very much into the idea of using a true switch vs a make shift one - with either I will learn a practical application. I just got into this whole hobby thru arduino - but when I went to solve my problem, i realized I don't need to use that much tech - a simple circuit will do.

@John - I've looked at a few reed switches online, and it isn't immediatly clear to me how i might situate it within the jam.
https://www.sparkfun.com/products/8644
Could I just run it vertically near the hole where the bolt goes? and if the magnet is too strong or too weak, is there a way to adjust it?

Thanks to you all - these are some great suggestions and I'm learning a bunch.!

The Hall effect device does not have to be a binary device but will
act as a binary device if you buy one that is made to be a switch. You
should look up the Hall Effect on Wikipedia to understand how it works
and how it can be used in devices to do different things, making a
compass for example. A reed switch on the other hand is a binary
device and is called a reed switch not because it was invented by
someone named Reed, but because the mechanical elements inside
resemble the reeds used in a musical instrument. Like those in a
harmonica. Because the moving parts in a reed switch have so little
mass and are so close together the switch can be actuated rapidly. So
with a magnet on a shaft one could be used to provide a signal to a
tachometer.
Eric

Jim Thompson · Aug 27, 2013

On Mon, 26 Aug 2013 20:20:17 -0400, Tom Biasi <tombiasi@optonline.net>
wrote:

On 8/26/2013 7:17 PM, Jim Thompson wrote:
On Mon, 26 Aug 2013 18:14:58 -0500, John Fields
jfields@austininstruments.com> wrote:

On Mon, 26 Aug 2013 15:55:16 -0700, John Larkin
jlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> wrote:

On Mon, 26 Aug 2013 14:41:07 -0700 (PDT), David Humpherys
david.humpherys@gmail.com> wrote:

I get what your saying. Thank you for the mention.
Any idea where I would get this type of material ?
And how would I attach it to the wood without saftey problems?

Totally understand it might not be as good as a production switch.

How about two springs, parallel. The deadbolt pushes up against both
of them. The springs could be inside drilled holes in the door frame.

_______________________
-----/////////// |
| <-------
-----/////////// |
|_______________________

---
Don't you mean series?

Physically parallel, electrically in series when they contact
deadbolt.

...Jim Thompson

perhaps Jim,
If he wants to "MacGyver" everything. I would like to see him make use
of readily available products but the who am I?

Tom

David Humpherys · Aug 27, 2013

I have a tilt-switch gimmick on my garage doors that, by RF, talks to
a display on my desk.

Jim, I'd be interested in knowing what parts you used for this. Garage doors are in the big picture too. Sounds cool.
Once I tackle the actual cicuit I'll need to figure out how I want to get the message to someplace usefull in my house.

Bob Masta · Aug 27, 2013

On Mon, 26 Aug 2013 18:05:03 -0500, John Fields
<jfields@austininstruments.com> wrote:

On Mon, 26 Aug 2013 18:42:56 -0400, Phil Hobbs
pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:

On 8/26/2013 5:59 PM, John Fields wrote:
On Mon, 26 Aug 2013 16:02:55 -0400, Phil Hobbs
pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:

On 08/26/2013 03:58 PM, Tim Wescott wrote:
On Mon, 26 Aug 2013 10:33:24 -0700, David Humpherys wrote:

You would be better off not to let the dead bolt make the connection.
The bolt could push a micro-switch or activate something else that
would close a circuit.

Thanks Tom,
Do you have any recommendations for a micro-switch that would work for
this type of thing?

http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?
productId=2049718&numProdsPerPage=60

http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?
productId=2049719&numProdsPerPage=60

Finding a way to mount the switch is going to be a challenge -- you want
to have a lot of leeway for where the deadbolt ends up, while still
reliably actuating the switch. So an arrangement that either lets the
switch be actuated by the side of the deadbolt as it enters its pocket,
or that has a long spring on the switch, is probably best.

Mess with it. These electromechanical projects always end up being more
mechanical than electrical in the end.

A magnet glued to the end of the deadbolt, and a Hall sensor in the door
jamb would get my vote.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

---
I'd elect for a reed switch instead of a Hall sensor, which would be
much less expensive and, while the deadbolt was open, require zero
current from the supply.

That's true, but (a) it's a lot less sensitive, so it would have to be
right up against the magnet,

---
Nope.

Neodymium Boron Iron magnets are insanely strong, and reed switches
easily succumb to their fields, at a distance.

I don't think you need anything too fancy in the magnet
department. Back in the early '70s when electronic fuel
injection was just getting started, Cadillac (my employer)
used two reed switches mounted on either side of the
distributor shaft to pick up RPM and timing info. Dunno
about the magnets, but I don't think they were anything
special, even back then.

Best regards,

Bob Masta

DAQARTA v7.40
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John Fields · Aug 28, 2013

On Mon, 26 Aug 2013 16:18:15 -0700 (PDT), David Humpherys
<david.humpherys@gmail.com> wrote:

One type stays on until the
magnetic field is reversed, the other stays on only while the magnetic
field is present.

Eric, this was going to be my question with any of these sensors.
Hall or Reed - are they binary? If not, how do I dial in the LED to only turn on at a certain point?

I'm very much into the idea of using a true switch vs a make shift one - with either I will learn a practical application. I just got into this whole hobby thru arduino - but when I went to solve my problem, i realized I don't need to use that much tech - a simple circuit will do.

@John - I've looked at a few reed switches online, and it isn't immediatly clear to me how i might situate it within the jam.

---
The recess in the jamb that the deadbolt goes into is about one inch
in diameter and deep enough for the bolt to fit into without bottoming
out.

What I'd do would be to measure how much room there was between the
end of the deadbolt and the end of the recess, then see if the magnet
and reed switch would fit between the end of the deadbolt and the end
of the recess.

If there wasn't enough room, then I'd deepen the recess enough to get
whatever clearance I needed.

Next, I'd stick - using its own force - a small magnet, something like
this:

http://www.kjmagnetics.com/proddetail.asp?prod=D16

vertically, and centered vertically and horizontally, to the face of
the deadbolt.

I'd prefer for the LED to be on when the deadbolt wasn't engaged, so
I'd use something like this:

http://www.meder.com/fileadmin/meder/pdf/en/Products/OKI_Switches-En/OKI_Switch_ORT551.pdf

Wired like this: (View using a fixed-pitch font)

NC NO
+-[R]-[LED>]-O->| <-O
|+ |- - -[MAGNET]
[BAT] O C
| |
+---------------+

https://www.sparkfun.com/products/8644
Could I just run it vertically near the hole where the bolt goes?

---
I don't understand.
---

>and if the magnet is too strong or too weak, is there a way to adjust it?

---
Yes.

If you install the switch in the way I suggested, and the magnet is
too strong, you can reduce its influence on the switch by rotating the
magnet about its center until you get the sensitivity you want.

Once you find that point it'd be a good idea to immobilize the magnet
- with glue of some kind - so slamming the door wouldn't change its
position.

If it's too weak, then the options break down to either getting a more
sensitive switch or a stronger magnet.
---

>Thanks to you all - these are some great suggestions and I'm learning a bunch.!

---

--
JF

Ian Field · Aug 28, 2013

"David Humpherys" <david.humpherys@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:cc563de4-9401-4694-88b6-c13d3c0e0a1c@googlegroups.com...

You would be better off not to let the dead bolt make the connection.
The bolt could push a micro-switch or activate something else that would
close a circuit.

Thanks Tom,
Do you have any recommendations for a micro-switch that would work for
this type of thing?

There are many types of microswitch - the ones I think are most commonly
found, are the types usually used for the safety interlock on microwave oven
doors. Some versions are the bare microswitch with the little "pip" on one
side towards the end, this type usually has a recess on the same side as the
pip, this is for an optional lever that can come in various lengths - such a
lever might increase your options for making it work.

ABLE1 · Aug 28, 2013

"David Humpherys" <david.humpherys@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:92d59e2e-9b47-4c5e-a97c-8355bce3f151@googlegroups.com...

Hi All,

I'm very much a beginner in the electronics area, but I've been playing
around with resistors, led's and batteries - so I understand those basics.

Now I want to apply what I've learned!

I want to make a indicator LED light when the deadbolt to my door is
locked.
I've made a (ugly) graphic to show what I'm thinking.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1W-vn7UR5Zp9vrNA-jE2Sqf2b7B553QGO7qQP3qor9EY/edit?usp=sharing

The basic idea is that the deadbolt closes the circuit.
What I don't know is how to create and attach the connectors to the door
jam.
Is there any circuit pieces like this i could start from?
What do i need to do to make it safe?
Do I need to attach a small plate to the end of the deadbolt to properly
close the loop?

Thanks for any help!

LOL
Been there, Done that, works great
http://www.grisk.com/roller/pb-2020.html

Mr. Man-wai Chang · Aug 28, 2013

On 27/08/2013 6:55 AM, John Larkin wrote:

How about two springs, parallel. The deadbolt pushes up against both
of them. The springs could be inside drilled holes in the door frame.

I was also thinking about adding a spring to the upper stripe in my
diagram so that it could bounce back better...

Anyway, I have never done this kind of mod.

--
@~@ Remain silent. Nothing from soldiers and magicians is real!
/ v \ Simplicity is Beauty! May the Force and farces be with you!
/( _ )\ (Fedora 19 i686) Linux 3.10.9-200.fc19.i686
^ ^ 19:54:02 up 1:46 0 users load average: 0.00 0.01 0.05
ä¸ĺč˛¸! ä¸čŠé¨! ä¸ć´äş¤! ä¸ćäş¤! ä¸ćĺŤ! ä¸čŞćŽş! čŤčćŽçść´ (CSSA):
http://www.swd.gov.hk/tc/index/site_pubsvc/page_socsecu/sub_addressesa

ABLE1 · Sep 2, 2013

"David Humpherys" <david.humpherys@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:b40f7d31-f627-4d9f-baee-1df9321b7348@googlegroups.com...

Been there, Done that, works great
http://www.grisk.com/roller/pb-2020.html

@ABLE1
Perfect - I think that's exactly what I need.
I took off my trim and I have ~1/2 inch space between the end of the bolt
and the jam. I could always build it up a bit if need be.

Thanks for sharing the link!!

David,

Just be sure to measure, measure, measure. Depth of dead bolt hole,
extension of dead bolt, protrusion of switch adjustment screw. Make sure
all is where it needs to be. Layout on paper at scale to make it easy.

Good luck.

ABLE1

Mr. Man-wai Chang · Sep 4, 2013

On 27/08/2013 12:36 AM, David Humpherys wrote:

Now I want to apply what I've learned!
I want to make a indicator LED light when the deadbolt to my door is locked.
I've made a (ugly) graphic to show what I'm thinking.

BTW, don't turn that design into a IED (bomb)!

--
@~@ Remain silent. Nothing from soldiers and magicians is real!
/ v \ Simplicity is Beauty! May the Force and farces be with you!
/( _ )\ (Fedora 19 i686) Linux 3.10.10-200.fc19.i686
^ ^ 01:33:01 up 2 days 4:27 0 users load average: 0.00 0.01 0.05
ä¸ĺč˛¸! ä¸čŠé¨! ä¸ć´äş¤! ä¸ćäş¤! ä¸ćĺŤ! ä¸čŞćŽş! čŤčćŽçść´ (CSSA):
http://www.swd.gov.hk/tc/index/site_pubsvc/page_socsecu/sub_addressesa

John Fields · Sep 5, 2013

On Thu, 05 Sep 2013 01:39:46 +0800, "Mr. Man-wai Chang"
<toylet.toylet@gmail.com> wrote:

On 27/08/2013 12:36 AM, David Humpherys wrote:
Now I want to apply what I've learned!
I want to make a indicator LED light when the deadbolt to my door is locked.
I've made a (ugly) graphic to show what I'm thinking.

BTW, don't turn that design into a IED (bomb)!

---
The rabbit bares his caried fangs.

--
JF

David Humpherys · Sep 11, 2013

Been there, Done that, works great
http://www.grisk.com/roller/pb-2020.html

@ABLE1:
I picked up those switches - very cool! they will work great.
Now I'm considering more of the installation of this idea and you mentioned you had done it. Curious how you approached it.

I'd like to run the wire upstairs to my kitchen - I have access through some existing wiring. I'm thinking of adding a wall plate and putting the electronics in an electrical box (the kind you use for a switch). Adding the LED to the plate and making connectors with something like this.
http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2103982
Any thoughts? Love to know how you did it.

Also, I'm trying to determine if i should use a battery (and maybe add a push switch to extend the life) - or figure out how to hook it to house power..

This is all new to me and I'm learning a ton.
Appreciate any help.

Jasen Betts · Sep 11, 2013

On 2013-09-11, David Humpherys <david.humpherys@gmail.com> wrote:

Been there, Done that, works great
http://www.grisk.com/roller/pb-2020.html

@ABLE1:
I picked up those switches - very cool! they will work great.
Now I'm considering more of the installation of this idea and you mentioned you had done it. Curious how you approached it.

I'd like to run the wire upstairs to my kitchen - I have access through some existing wiring. I'm thinking of adding a wall plate and putting the electronics in an electrical box (the kind you use for a switch). Adding the LED to the plate and making connectors with something like this.
http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2103982
Any thoughts? Love to know how you did it.

Also, I'm trying to determine if i should use a battery (and maybe add a push switch to extend the life) - or figure out how to hook it to house power.

This is all new to me and I'm learning a ton.
Appreciate any help.

If you've got a powered doorbell you could probably power it off that,
else messing with house power is probably not worth the aditional
complexity it will add, if you don't want to change batteries it's
probably best to re-purpose an old phone charger, or buy something
similar new.

--
ââ 100% natural

--- news://freenews.netfront.net/ - complaints: news@netfront.net ---

Jim Thompson · Sep 11, 2013

On 11 Sep 2013 11:14:10 GMT, Jasen Betts <jasen@xnet.co.nz> wrote:

On 2013-09-11, David Humpherys <david.humpherys@gmail.com> wrote:

Been there, Done that, works great
http://www.grisk.com/roller/pb-2020.html

@ABLE1:
I picked up those switches - very cool! they will work great.
Now I'm considering more of the installation of this idea and you mentioned you had done it. Curious how you approached it.

I'd like to run the wire upstairs to my kitchen - I have access through some existing wiring. I'm thinking of adding a wall plate and putting the electronics in an electrical box (the kind you use for a switch). Adding the LED to the plate and making connectors with something like this.
http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2103982
Any thoughts? Love to know how you did it.

Also, I'm trying to determine if i should use a battery (and maybe add a push switch to extend the life) - or figure out how to hook it to house power.

This is all new to me and I'm learning a ton.
Appreciate any help.

If you've got a powered doorbell you could probably power it off that,
else messing with house power is probably not worth the aditional
complexity it will add, if you don't want to change batteries it's
probably best to re-purpose an old phone charger, or buy something
similar new.

Michael A. Terrell · Sep 11, 2013

John Fields wrote:

I'd elect for a reed switch instead of a Hall sensor, which would be
much less expensive and, while the deadbolt was open, require zero
current from the supply.

You can get a 'door alarm' at a Dollar Tree store for $1 that has a
reed switch, a magnet in a plastic case and three LR44 batteries. It
also has a small piezo sounder.

--
Anyone wanting to run for any political office in the US should have to
have a DD214, and a honorable discharge.

Deadbolt indicator

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