Deadbolt indicator

David Humpherys · Aug 26, 2013

Hi All,

I'm very much a beginner in the electronics area, but I've been playing around with resistors, led's and batteries - so I understand those basics.

Now I want to apply what I've learned!

I want to make a indicator LED light when the deadbolt to my door is locked.
I've made a (ugly) graphic to show what I'm thinking.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1W-vn7UR5Zp9vrNA-jE2Sqf2b7B553QGO7qQP3qor9EY/edit?usp=sharing

The basic idea is that the deadbolt closes the circuit.
What I don't know is how to create and attach the connectors to the door jam.
Is there any circuit pieces like this i could start from?
What do i need to do to make it safe?
Do I need to attach a small plate to the end of the deadbolt to properly close the loop?

Thanks for any help!

David Humpherys · Aug 26, 2013

You would be better off not to let the dead bolt make the connection.
The bolt could push a micro-switch or activate something else that would
close a circuit.

Thanks Tom,
Do you have any recommendations for a micro-switch that would work for this type of thing?

Tom Biasi · Aug 26, 2013

On 8/26/2013 12:36 PM, David Humpherys wrote:

Hi All,

I'm very much a beginner in the electronics area, but I've been playing around with resistors, led's and batteries - so I understand those basics.

Now I want to apply what I've learned!

I want to make a indicator LED light when the deadbolt to my door is locked.
I've made a (ugly) graphic to show what I'm thinking.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1W-vn7UR5Zp9vrNA-jE2Sqf2b7B553QGO7qQP3qor9EY/edit?usp=sharing

The basic idea is that the deadbolt closes the circuit.
What I don't know is how to create and attach the connectors to the door jam.
Is there any circuit pieces like this i could start from?
What do i need to do to make it safe?
Do I need to attach a small plate to the end of the deadbolt to properly close the loop?

Thanks for any help!

You would be better off not to let the dead bolt make the connection.
The bolt could push a micro-switch or activate something else that would
close a circuit.

Tom

David Humpherys · Aug 26, 2013

I get what your saying. Thank you for the mention.
Any idea where I would get this type of material ?
And how would I attach it to the wood without saftey problems?

Totally understand it might not be as good as a production switch.

David Humpherys · Aug 26, 2013

Mess with it. These electromechanical projects always end up being more
mechanical than electrical in the end.

Thanks for the links Tim.
you're right - i need to pull the door trim off and see what sort of space i have to deal with, then figure out what the area of impact would be.

is there some technical jargon that notates at what point the stitch turns on?
In other words, when the bolt connects to the switch and starts pushing, how far does a switch have to push to actually close the loop. Is there a word for that?

Thanks for the help!

David Humpherys · Aug 26, 2013

A magnet glued to the end of the deadbolt, and a Hall sensor in the door
jamb would get my vote.

Thanks Phil - a totally different solution i didn't know existed. and a cheap one at that.

I'd have to find a thin magnet so that it didn't interfere with the door opening-closing. something like this might work.
https://www.sparkfun.com/products/8644

thanks for all the help everyone!!!

Mr. Man-wai Chang · Aug 27, 2013

On 27/08/2013 1:05 AM, Tom Biasi wrote:

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1W-vn7UR5Zp9vrNA-jE2Sqf2b7B553QGO7qQP3qor9EY/edit?usp=sharing
You would be better off not to let the dead bolt make the connection.
The bolt could push a micro-switch or activate something else that would
close a circuit.

You don't really need a switch. You could re-arrange the two pieces of
metal stripes like this:

| Bent stripe
|
\ +-------
/ \ |
| | <-- LOCK
| +--------

When the lock was turned anti-clockwise, the two metal stripes would
touch each other, completing the LED circuit.

--
@~@ Remain silent. Nothing from soldiers and magicians is real!
/ v \ Simplicity is Beauty! May the Force and farces be with you!
/( _ )\ (Fedora 19 i686) Linux 3.10.9-200.fc19.i686
^ ^ 02:30:02 up 1 day 18:31 0 users load average: 0.00 0.02 0.05
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http://www.swd.gov.hk/tc/index/site_pubsvc/page_socsecu/sub_addressesa

Tom Biasi · Aug 27, 2013

On 8/26/2013 1:33 PM, David Humpherys wrote:

You would be better off not to let the dead bolt make the connection.
The bolt could push a micro-switch or activate something else that would
close a circuit.

Thanks Tom,
Do you have any recommendations for a micro-switch that would work for this type of thing?

Look for one with some travel play in the activating, this way you can
make contact and still have room to push some more and not damage the
switch.
Tom

David Humpherys · Aug 27, 2013

One type stays on until the
magnetic field is reversed, the other stays on only while the magnetic
field is present.

Eric, this was going to be my question with any of these sensors.
Hall or Reed - are they binary? If not, how do I dial in the LED to only turn on at a certain point?

I'm very much into the idea of using a true switch vs a make shift one - with either I will learn a practical application. I just got into this whole hobby thru arduino - but when I went to solve my problem, i realized I don't need to use that much tech - a simple circuit will do.

@John - I've looked at a few reed switches online, and it isn't immediatly clear to me how i might situate it within the jam.
https://www.sparkfun.com/products/8644
Could I just run it vertically near the hole where the bolt goes? and if the magnet is too strong or too weak, is there a way to adjust it?

Thanks to you all - these are some great suggestions and I'm learning a bunch.!

Tim Wescott · Aug 27, 2013

On Tue, 27 Aug 2013 02:36:57 +0800, Mr. Man-wai Chang wrote:

On 27/08/2013 1:05 AM, Tom Biasi wrote:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1W-vn7UR5Zp9vrNA-
jE2Sqf2b7B553QGO7qQP3qor9EY/edit?usp=sharing
You would be better off not to let the dead bolt make the connection.
The bolt could push a micro-switch or activate something else that
would close a circuit.

You don't really need a switch. You could re-arrange the two pieces of
metal stripes like this:

| Bent stripe |
\ +-------
/ \ |
| | <-- LOCK | +--------

When the lock was turned anti-clockwise, the two metal stripes would
touch each other, completing the LED circuit.

That would probably work better than asking the deadbolt itself to make
the connection. But what you're doing is making a switch, and probably a
pretty poor one.

If you can find a switch that'll fit, that's better.

--

Tim Wescott
Wescott Design Services
http://www.wescottdesign.com

Tim Wescott · Aug 27, 2013

On Mon, 26 Aug 2013 10:33:24 -0700, David Humpherys wrote:

You would be better off not to let the dead bolt make the connection.
The bolt could push a micro-switch or activate something else that
would close a circuit.

Thanks Tom,
Do you have any recommendations for a micro-switch that would work for
this type of thing?

http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?
productId=2049718&numProdsPerPage=60

http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?
productId=2049719&numProdsPerPage=60

Finding a way to mount the switch is going to be a challenge -- you want
to have a lot of leeway for where the deadbolt ends up, while still
reliably actuating the switch. So an arrangement that either lets the
switch be actuated by the side of the deadbolt as it enters its pocket,
or that has a long spring on the switch, is probably best.

Mess with it. These electromechanical projects always end up being more
mechanical than electrical in the end.

--

Tim Wescott
Wescott Design Services
http://www.wescottdesign.com

Phil Hobbs · Aug 27, 2013

On 08/26/2013 03:58 PM, Tim Wescott wrote:

On Mon, 26 Aug 2013 10:33:24 -0700, David Humpherys wrote:

You would be better off not to let the dead bolt make the connection.
The bolt could push a micro-switch or activate something else that
would close a circuit.

Thanks Tom,
Do you have any recommendations for a micro-switch that would work for
this type of thing?

http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?
productId=2049718&numProdsPerPage=60

http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?
productId=2049719&numProdsPerPage=60

Finding a way to mount the switch is going to be a challenge -- you want
to have a lot of leeway for where the deadbolt ends up, while still
reliably actuating the switch. So an arrangement that either lets the
switch be actuated by the side of the deadbolt as it enters its pocket,
or that has a long spring on the switch, is probably best.

Mess with it. These electromechanical projects always end up being more
mechanical than electrical in the end.

A magnet glued to the end of the deadbolt, and a Hall sensor in the door
jamb would get my vote.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal Consultant
ElectroOptical Innovations LLC
Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics

160 North State Road #203
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

hobbs at electrooptical dot net
http://electrooptical.net

George Herold · Aug 27, 2013

On Monday, August 26, 2013 4:02:55 PM UTC-4, Phil Hobbs wrote:

On 08/26/2013 03:58 PM, Tim Wescott wrote:

On Mon, 26 Aug 2013 10:33:24 -0700, David Humpherys wrote:

You would be better off not to let the dead bolt make the connection.

The bolt could push a micro-switch or activate something else that

would close a circuit.

Thanks Tom,

Do you have any recommendations for a micro-switch that would work for

this type of thing?

http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?

productId=2049718&numProdsPerPage=60

http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?

productId=2049719&numProdsPerPage=60

Finding a way to mount the switch is going to be a challenge -- you want

to have a lot of leeway for where the deadbolt ends up, while still

reliably actuating the switch. So an arrangement that either lets the

switch be actuated by the side of the deadbolt as it enters its pocket,

or that has a long spring on the switch, is probably best.

Mess with it. These electromechanical projects always end up being more

mechanical than electrical in the end.

A magnet glued to the end of the deadbolt, and a Hall sensor in the door

jamb would get my vote.

That was my thought.. well magnet and reed relay.

George H.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

--

Dr Philip C D Hobbs

Principal Consultant

ElectroOptical Innovations LLC

Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics

160 North State Road #203

Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

hobbs at electrooptical dot net

http://electrooptical.net

John Fields · Aug 27, 2013

On Mon, 26 Aug 2013 16:02:55 -0400, Phil Hobbs
<pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:

On 08/26/2013 03:58 PM, Tim Wescott wrote:
On Mon, 26 Aug 2013 10:33:24 -0700, David Humpherys wrote:

You would be better off not to let the dead bolt make the connection.
The bolt could push a micro-switch or activate something else that
would close a circuit.

Thanks Tom,
Do you have any recommendations for a micro-switch that would work for
this type of thing?

http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?
productId=2049718&numProdsPerPage=60

http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?
productId=2049719&numProdsPerPage=60

Finding a way to mount the switch is going to be a challenge -- you want
to have a lot of leeway for where the deadbolt ends up, while still
reliably actuating the switch. So an arrangement that either lets the
switch be actuated by the side of the deadbolt as it enters its pocket,
or that has a long spring on the switch, is probably best.

Mess with it. These electromechanical projects always end up being more
mechanical than electrical in the end.

A magnet glued to the end of the deadbolt, and a Hall sensor in the door
jamb would get my vote.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

---
I'd elect for a reed switch instead of a Hall sensor, which would be
much less expensive and, while the deadbolt was open, require zero
current from the supply.

--
JF

Tom Biasi · Aug 27, 2013

---
I'd elect for a reed switch instead of a Hall sensor, which would be
much less expensive and, while the deadbolt was open, require zero
current from the supply.

Agree, if he going the magnet route. Which I think is a viable solution.
Rat Shack has magnet/switch pairs pretty cheap.

Tom

Phil Hobbs · Aug 27, 2013

On 8/26/2013 5:59 PM, John Fields wrote:

On Mon, 26 Aug 2013 16:02:55 -0400, Phil Hobbs
pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:

On 08/26/2013 03:58 PM, Tim Wescott wrote:
On Mon, 26 Aug 2013 10:33:24 -0700, David Humpherys wrote:

You would be better off not to let the dead bolt make the connection.
The bolt could push a micro-switch or activate something else that
would close a circuit.

Thanks Tom,
Do you have any recommendations for a micro-switch that would work for
this type of thing?

http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?
productId=2049718&numProdsPerPage=60

http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?
productId=2049719&numProdsPerPage=60

Finding a way to mount the switch is going to be a challenge -- you want
to have a lot of leeway for where the deadbolt ends up, while still
reliably actuating the switch. So an arrangement that either lets the
switch be actuated by the side of the deadbolt as it enters its pocket,
or that has a long spring on the switch, is probably best.

Mess with it. These electromechanical projects always end up being more
mechanical than electrical in the end.

A magnet glued to the end of the deadbolt, and a Hall sensor in the door
jamb would get my vote.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

---
I'd elect for a reed switch instead of a Hall sensor, which would be
much less expensive and, while the deadbolt was open, require zero
current from the supply.

That's true, but (a) it's a lot less sensitive, so it would have to be
right up against the magnet, and (b) it's made of glass, so it would be
vulnerable to breakage if somebody slammed the door, or was working on
the hinges, or....

Besides, the OP sounds like he wants to learn some electronics.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal Consultant
ElectroOptical Innovations LLC
Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics

160 North State Road #203
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510 USA
+1 845 480 2058

hobbs at electrooptical dot net
http://electrooptical.net

John Fields · Aug 27, 2013

On Mon, 26 Aug 2013 14:48:27 -0700 (PDT), David Humpherys
<david.humpherys@gmail.com> wrote:

A magnet glued to the end of the deadbolt, and a Hall sensor in the door
jamb would get my vote.

Thanks Phil - a totally different solution i didn't know existed. and a cheap one at that.

I'd have to find a thin magnet so that it didn't interfere with the door opening-closing. something like this might work.
https://www.sparkfun.com/products/8644

thanks for all the help everyone!!!

---
I have an electronic combination lock which, if it's flashing,
indicates that the door to my lab is unlocked, even if it's closed.

When the deadbolt is engaged, the flashing stops.

You may want to consider something like that if the deadbolt is
normally engaged, so that battery life will be extended.

--
JF

John Larkin · Aug 27, 2013

On Mon, 26 Aug 2013 14:41:07 -0700 (PDT), David Humpherys
<david.humpherys@gmail.com> wrote:

I get what your saying. Thank you for the mention.
Any idea where I would get this type of material ?
And how would I attach it to the wood without saftey problems?

Totally understand it might not be as good as a production switch.

How about two springs, parallel. The deadbolt pushes up against both
of them. The springs could be inside drilled holes in the door frame.

_______________________
-----/////////// |
| <-------
-----/////////// |
|_______________________

--

John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc

jlarkin at highlandtechnology dot com
http://www.highlandtechnology.com

Precision electronic instrumentation
Picosecond-resolution Digital Delay and Pulse generators
Custom laser drivers and controllers
Photonics and fiberoptic TTL data links
VME thermocouple, LVDT, synchro acquisition and simulation

John Fields · Aug 27, 2013

On Mon, 26 Aug 2013 18:42:56 -0400, Phil Hobbs
<pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:

On 8/26/2013 5:59 PM, John Fields wrote:
On Mon, 26 Aug 2013 16:02:55 -0400, Phil Hobbs
pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:

On 08/26/2013 03:58 PM, Tim Wescott wrote:
On Mon, 26 Aug 2013 10:33:24 -0700, David Humpherys wrote:

You would be better off not to let the dead bolt make the connection.
The bolt could push a micro-switch or activate something else that
would close a circuit.

Thanks Tom,
Do you have any recommendations for a micro-switch that would work for
this type of thing?

http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?
productId=2049718&numProdsPerPage=60

http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?
productId=2049719&numProdsPerPage=60

Finding a way to mount the switch is going to be a challenge -- you want
to have a lot of leeway for where the deadbolt ends up, while still
reliably actuating the switch. So an arrangement that either lets the
switch be actuated by the side of the deadbolt as it enters its pocket,
or that has a long spring on the switch, is probably best.

Mess with it. These electromechanical projects always end up being more
mechanical than electrical in the end.

A magnet glued to the end of the deadbolt, and a Hall sensor in the door
jamb would get my vote.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

---
I'd elect for a reed switch instead of a Hall sensor, which would be
much less expensive and, while the deadbolt was open, require zero
current from the supply.

That's true, but (a) it's a lot less sensitive, so it would have to be
right up against the magnet,

---
Nope.

Neodymium Boron Iron magnets are insanely strong, and reed switches
easily succumb to their fields, at a distance.
---

and (b) it's made of glass, so it would be
vulnerable to breakage if somebody slammed the door, or was working on
the hinges, or....

---
Nope.

Recessed into the jamb, it would be safe, short of intentional
demolition.
---

>Besides, the OP sounds like he wants to learn some electronics.

---
Then, since this is sci.electronics.basics and you've identified the
need, why not take on the task?

--
JF

Jim Thompson · Aug 27, 2013

On Mon, 26 Aug 2013 15:55:16 -0700, John Larkin
<jlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> wrote:

On Mon, 26 Aug 2013 14:41:07 -0700 (PDT), David Humpherys
david.humpherys@gmail.com> wrote:

I get what your saying. Thank you for the mention.
Any idea where I would get this type of material ?
And how would I attach it to the wood without saftey problems?

Totally understand it might not be as good as a production switch.

How about two springs, parallel. The deadbolt pushes up against both
of them. The springs could be inside drilled holes in the door frame.

_______________________
-----/////////// |
| <-------
-----/////////// |
|_______________________

Deadbolt indicator

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