Bloody digital!

[Superman]

'King Arthur' on channel 7 is unwatchable! It's constantly pixilating,
although the DVDR says the signal quality and strength is 10! (full
scale) BUT the ads don't pixilate. Now why is that?

--
rgds,

Pete
=====
http://pw352.blogspot.com

"We stopped the boats coming. The facts speak for themselves. People knew where we stood. We didn't try to be all things to all men. Look, our policy worked. There was no need to alter it" - John Howard

"Our journalists are finally noticing the elephant in the room. Rudd has given us grocery watch, fuel watch, a national dept our children will still be paying, an ETS scheme that will further bankrupt the nation without making an iota of difference to global warming. Rudd is all spin and no substance. Even worse, he expects to fool all people all the time." - media comment

"I don't care what you f__kers think!" - The Hon Kevin Rudd MP, Prime Minister of Australia

 

[atec 7 7]

Superman wrote:

'King Arthur' on channel 7 is unwatchable! It's constantly pixilating,
although the DVDR says the signal quality and strength is 10! (full
scale) BUT the ads don't pixilate. Now why is that?

Probably compression particulates > to much compression ?

 

[David Barnett]

"Superman" <"the _man_of_steel"@metropolis.com> wrote in message
news:3nm%m.66150$ze1.18910@news-server.bigpond.net.au...

'King Arthur' on channel 7 is unwatchable! It's constantly pixilating,
although the DVDR says the signal quality and strength is 10! (full scale)
BUT the ads don't pixilate. Now why is that?

I did not watch this movie as I had already seen it on a DVD disc supplied
by my daughter.
I found the movie rather boring.
--
David Barnett

 

[David L. Jones]

Superman" <"the _man_of_steel wrote:

'King Arthur' on channel 7 is unwatchable! It's constantly pixilating,
although the DVDR says the signal quality and strength is 10! (full
scale) BUT the ads don't pixilate. Now why is that?

Too much compression. They can vary the compression at their end to whatever
they want.
The standard def channels like 7 can really suck. Try watching fast moving
sport action on a standard def channel and you'll see it all the time.
The HD channels are much better and will rarely have this problem. So the
rule is to watch the HD version of the channel (70)unless they are
annoyingly displaying a different show on the HD channel. Even if you don't
have a HD capable TV, it's worth getting a HD box just for this.

It's nothing to do with signal strength, digital TV either works or it
doesn't. If the signal strength is too low to image will freeze, not
pixelate.

Dave.

--
---------------------------------------------
Check out my Electronics Engineering Video Blog & Podcast:
http://www.eevblog.com

 

[Superman]

On 2/01/2010 7:14 AM, David Barnett wrote:

"Superman" <"the _man_of_steel"@metropolis.com> wrote in message
news:3nm%m.66150$ze1.18910@news-server.bigpond.net.au...

'King Arthur' on channel 7 is unwatchable! It's constantly
pixilating, although the DVDR says the signal quality and strength is
10! (full scale) BUT the ads don't pixilate. Now why is that?

I did not watch this movie as I had already seen it on a DVD disc
supplied by my daughter.
I found the movie rather boring.

I gave up watching it!

--
rgds,

Pete
=====
http://pw352.blogspot.com

"We stopped the boats coming. The facts speak for themselves. People knew where we stood. We didn't try to be all things to all men. Look, our policy worked. There was no need to alter it" - John Howard

"Our journalists are finally noticing the elephant in the room. Rudd has given us grocery watch, fuel watch, a national dept our children will still be paying, an ETS scheme that will further bankrupt the nation without making an iota of difference to global warming. Rudd is all spin and no substance. Even worse, he expects to fool all people all the time." - media comment

"I don't care what you f__kers think!" - The Hon Kevin Rudd MP, Prime Minister of Australia

 

[Superman]

On 2/01/2010 9:05 AM, David L. Jones wrote:

Superman"<"the _man_of_steel wrote:

'King Arthur' on channel 7 is unwatchable! It's constantly pixilating,
although the DVDR says the signal quality and strength is 10! (full
scale) BUT the ads don't pixilate. Now why is that?

Too much compression. They can vary the compression at their end to whatever
they want.
The standard def channels like 7 can really suck. Try watching fast moving
sport action on a standard def channel and you'll see it all the time.

Are you talking about artefacts? yes, it's pathetic. we have these hi
res panels and have to watch stuff that looks like it's come off youtube!

The HD channels are much better and will rarely have this problem. So the
rule is to watch the HD version of the channel (70)unless they are
annoyingly displaying a different show on the HD channel.

I was watching on 70. sorry, I didn't mention that. It was just
hopeless. but there was a storm and lightning last night. perhaps that
was a major cause. but I don't know how we are expected to watch
transmission like this.

Even if you don't
have a HD capable TV, it's worth getting a HD box just for this.

It's nothing to do with signal strength, digital TV either works or it
doesn't. If the signal strength is too low to image will freeze, not
pixelate.

I tried attenuating the signal to see if that helped but it didn't. I've
heard that too strong a signal can cause pixilation and image break up.

Dave.

--
rgds,

Pete
=====
http://pw352.blogspot.com

"We stopped the boats coming. The facts speak for themselves. People knew where we stood. We didn't try to be all things to all men. Look, our policy worked. There was no need to alter it" - John Howard

"Our journalists are finally noticing the elephant in the room. Rudd has given us grocery watch, fuel watch, a national dept our children will still be paying, an ETS scheme that will further bankrupt the nation without making an iota of difference to global warming. Rudd is all spin and no substance. Even worse, he expects to fool all people all the time." - media comment

"I don't care what you f__kers think!" - The Hon Kevin Rudd MP, Prime Minister of Australia

 

[Rheilly Phoull]

"Superman" <"the _man_of_steel"@metropolis.com> wrote in message
news:_9v%m.66205$ze1.23510@news-server.bigpond.net.au...

On 2/01/2010 9:05 AM, David L. Jones wrote:

Superman"<"the _man_of_steel wrote:

'King Arthur' on channel 7 is unwatchable! It's constantly pixilating,
although the DVDR says the signal quality and strength is 10! (full
scale) BUT the ads don't pixilate. Now why is that?

Too much compression. They can vary the compression at their end to
whatever
they want.
The standard def channels like 7 can really suck. Try watching fast
moving
sport action on a standard def channel and you'll see it all the time.


Are you talking about artefacts? yes, it's pathetic. we have these hi res
panels and have to watch stuff that looks like it's come off youtube!

The HD channels are much better and will rarely have this problem. So the
rule is to watch the HD version of the channel (70)unless they are
annoyingly displaying a different show on the HD channel.

I was watching on 70. sorry, I didn't mention that. It was just hopeless.
but there was a storm and lightning last night. perhaps that was a major
cause. but I don't know how we are expected to watch transmission like
this.

Even if you don't
have a HD capable TV, it's worth getting a HD box just for this.

It's nothing to do with signal strength, digital TV either works or it
doesn't. If the signal strength is too low to image will freeze, not
pixelate.


I tried attenuating the signal to see if that helped but it didn't. I've
heard that too strong a signal can cause pixilation and image break up.

Dave.




--
rgds,

Pete
=====
http://pw352.blogspot.com

I get pissed off with the audio cutting in and out on live sports progs,
what causes that one ??

--
Regards .............. Rheilly P

 

[Superman]

On 2/01/2010 10:41 AM, Rheilly Phoull wrote:

"Superman"<"the _man_of_steel"@metropolis.com> wrote in message
news:_9v%m.66205$ze1.23510@news-server.bigpond.net.au...

On 2/01/2010 9:05 AM, David L. Jones wrote:


Superman"<"the _man_of_steel wrote:


'King Arthur' on channel 7 is unwatchable! It's constantly pixilating,
although the DVDR says the signal quality and strength is 10! (full
scale) BUT the ads don't pixilate. Now why is that?


Too much compression. They can vary the compression at their end to
whatever
they want.
The standard def channels like 7 can really suck. Try watching fast
moving
sport action on a standard def channel and you'll see it all the time.


Are you talking about artefacts? yes, it's pathetic. we have these hi res
panels and have to watch stuff that looks like it's come off youtube!


The HD channels are much better and will rarely have this problem. So the
rule is to watch the HD version of the channel (70)unless they are
annoyingly displaying a different show on the HD channel.

I was watching on 70. sorry, I didn't mention that. It was just hopeless.
but there was a storm and lightning last night. perhaps that was a major
cause. but I don't know how we are expected to watch transmission like
this.

Even if you don't
have a HD capable TV, it's worth getting a HD box just for this.

It's nothing to do with signal strength, digital TV either works or it
doesn't. If the signal strength is too low to image will freeze, not
pixelate.

I tried attenuating the signal to see if that helped but it didn't. I've
heard that too strong a signal can cause pixilation and image break up.

Dave.


I get pissed off with the audio cutting in and out on live sports progs,
what causes that one ??

It's the same cause as the pixilation- interruption of the digital stream

--
rgds,

Pete
=====
http://pw352.blogspot.com

"We stopped the boats coming. The facts speak for themselves. People knew where we stood. We didn't try to be all things to all men. Look, our policy worked. There was no need to alter it" - John Howard

"Our journalists are finally noticing the elephant in the room. Rudd has given us grocery watch, fuel watch, a national dept our children will still be paying, an ETS scheme that will further bankrupt the nation without making an iota of difference to global warming. Rudd is all spin and no substance. Even worse, he expects to fool all people all the time." - media comment

"I don't care what you f__kers think!" - The Hon Kevin Rudd MP, Prime Minister of Australia

 

[DaveS]

On Fri, 01 Jan 2010 13:01:51 GMT, Superman <"the
_man_of_steel"@metropolis.com> wrote:

'King Arthur' on channel 7 is unwatchable! It's constantly pixilating,
although the DVDR says the signal quality and strength is 10! (full
scale) BUT the ads don't pixilate. Now why is that?

Looked okay on my 1989 TV!

 

[Sylvia Else]

Superman wrote:

'King Arthur' on channel 7 is unwatchable! It's constantly pixilating,
although the DVDR says the signal quality and strength is 10! (full
scale) BUT the ads don't pixilate. Now why is that?

Are you using an outdoor antenna?

Sylvia.

 

[Superman]

On 2/01/2010 11:45 AM, Sylvia Else wrote:

Superman wrote:

'King Arthur' on channel 7 is unwatchable! It's constantly
pixilating, although the DVDR says the signal quality and strength is
10! (full scale) BUT the ads don't pixilate. Now why is that?


Are you using an outdoor antenna?

Yes, I have a digital fringe range aerial running into a four way
splitter amplifier. (outer melb metro area location)

And why do the ads not pixilate? There must be some difference in the
nature of the transmission.

Sylvia.

--
rgds,

Pete
=====
http://pw352.blogspot.com

"We stopped the boats coming. The facts speak for themselves. People knew where we stood. We didn't try to be all things to all men. Look, our policy worked. There was no need to alter it" - John Howard

"Our journalists are finally noticing the elephant in the room. Rudd has given us grocery watch, fuel watch, a national dept our children will still be paying, an ETS scheme that will further bankrupt the nation without making an iota of difference to global warming. Rudd is all spin and no substance. Even worse, he expects to fool all people all the time." - media comment

"I don't care what you f__kers think!" - The Hon Kevin Rudd MP, Prime Minister of Australia

 

[Phil Allison]

"Rheilly Phoull"

I get pissed off with the audio cutting in and out on live sports progs,
what causes that one ??

** That was going on a lot at the recent live Golf in Melbourne and Sydney.

The on-course commentators were using back pack portable radio links to the
OB van - which I suspect were not terribly reliable at getting through
obstacles like crowds of people or thick vegetation etc.



...... Phil

 

[Phil Allison]

"Superman"

Yes, I have a digital fringe range aerial running into a four way splitter
amplifier. (outer melb metro area location)


I was watching on 70. sorry, I didn't mention that. It was just hopeless.
but there was a storm and lightning last night. perhaps that was a major
cause.

** ROTFLMAO !!!





.... Phil

 

[Superman]

On 2/01/2010 12:35 PM, Phil Allison wrote:

"Superman"

Yes, I have a digital fringe range aerial running into a four way splitter
amplifier. (outer melb metro area location)


I was watching on 70. sorry, I didn't mention that. It was just hopeless.
but there was a storm and lightning last night. perhaps that was a major
cause.


** ROTFLMAO !!!

I'm glad you're amused. Pity you don't see fit to mention it's cause for
the benefit of our enlightenment.

... Phil

--
rgds,

Pete
=====
http://pw352.blogspot.com

"We stopped the boats coming. The facts speak for themselves. People knew where we stood. We didn't try to be all things to all men. Look, our policy worked. There was no need to alter it" - John Howard

"Our journalists are finally noticing the elephant in the room. Rudd has given us grocery watch, fuel watch, a national dept our children will still be paying, an ETS scheme that will further bankrupt the nation without making an iota of difference to global warming. Rudd is all spin and no substance. Even worse, he expects to fool all people all the time." - media comment

"I don't care what you f__kers think!" - The Hon Kevin Rudd MP, Prime Minister of Australia

 

[Phil Allison]

"Super Stupid man"

Phil Allison

Yes, I have a digital fringe range aerial running into a four way
splitter
amplifier. (outer melb metro area location)

I was watching on 70. sorry, I didn't mention that. It was just
hopeless.
but there was a storm and lightning last night. perhaps that was a major
cause.


** ROTFLMAO !!!


I'm glad you're amused. Pity you don't see fit to mention it's cause for
the benefit of our enlightenment.

** For the benefit of readers living outside VIC.

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/wild-thunderstorms-lash-victoria/story-e6frf7jo-1225815371184




...... Phil

 

[Superman]

On 2/01/2010 11:01 AM, DaveS wrote:

On Fri, 01 Jan 2010 13:01:51 GMT, Superman<"the
_man_of_steel"@metropolis.com> wrote:


'King Arthur' on channel 7 is unwatchable! It's constantly pixilating,
although the DVDR says the signal quality and strength is 10! (full
scale) BUT the ads don't pixilate. Now why is that?

Looked okay on my 1989 TV!

Were you watching thru a STB? HD or SD? and what location?

--
rgds,

Pete
=====
http://pw352.blogspot.com

"We stopped the boats coming. The facts speak for themselves. People knew where we stood. We didn't try to be all things to all men. Look, our policy worked. There was no need to alter it" - John Howard

"Our journalists are finally noticing the elephant in the room. Rudd has given us grocery watch, fuel watch, a national dept our children will still be paying, an ETS scheme that will further bankrupt the nation without making an iota of difference to global warming. Rudd is all spin and no substance. Even worse, he expects to fool all people all the time." - media comment

"I don't care what you f__kers think!" - The Hon Kevin Rudd MP, Prime Minister of Australia

 

[Sylvia Else]

Superman wrote:

On 2/01/2010 11:45 AM, Sylvia Else wrote:

Superman wrote:

'King Arthur' on channel 7 is unwatchable! It's constantly
pixilating, although the DVDR says the signal quality and strength is
10! (full scale) BUT the ads don't pixilate. Now why is that?


Are you using an outdoor antenna?

Yes, I have a digital fringe range aerial running into a four way
splitter amplifier. (outer melb metro area location)

And why do the ads not pixilate? There must be some difference in the
nature of the transmission.

I wonder whether that's really the case. Ads occupy less time then
program material (though, admittedly, only half as much), and you'll
probably not be paying that much attention to them. So if they do
pixalate, you might not notice.

But, assuming the difference is real...

The word "pixilate" is used somewhat loosely. Overcompression can create
the situation where one becomes aware of the boundaries of the 16x16
pixel macroblocks, particularly during pans.

A burst of noise can destroy the data so that a number of macroblocks
show manifestly wrong content.

I wonder which of these effects you're noticing.

The difference between ads and King Arthur may be that ads are not down
converted from HD. It's possible there's an incompatibility between
Seven's encoder, and your decoder.

Unless you're using a PVR to watch live broadcasts on a non-digital TV,
you might find a difference between using the PVR to do so, or using the
PVR to record and then play back, and using the digital TV or STB to
watch the broadcasts.

My own experience of digital TV is that it's pretty stable, with visual
glitches rare (less than one per several hours).

Sylvia.

 

[Superman]

On 2/01/2010 12:52 PM, Phil Allison wrote:

"Super Stupid man"

Phil Allison


Yes, I have a digital fringe range aerial running into a four way
splitter
amplifier. (outer melb metro area location)

I was watching on 70. sorry, I didn't mention that. It was just
hopeless.
but there was a storm and lightning last night. perhaps that was a major
cause.


** ROTFLMAO !!!


I'm glad you're amused. Pity you don't see fit to mention it's cause for our enlightenment.


** For the benefit of readers living outside VIC.

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/wild-thunderstorms-lash-victoria/story-e6frf7jo-1225815371184

So your point is (if you actually have one) is that thunderstorms do
seriously affect digital transmissions, right?

..... Phil

--
rgds,

Pete
=====
http://pw352.blogspot.com

"We stopped the boats coming. The facts speak for themselves. People knew where we stood. We didn't try to be all things to all men. Look, our policy worked. There was no need to alter it" - John Howard

"Our journalists are finally noticing the elephant in the room. Rudd has given us grocery watch, fuel watch, a national dept our children will still be paying, an ETS scheme that will further bankrupt the nation without making an iota of difference to global warming. Rudd is all spin and no substance. Even worse, he expects to fool all people all the time." - media comment

"I don't care what you f__kers think!" - The Hon Kevin Rudd MP, Prime Minister of Australia

 

[Superman]

On 2/01/2010 12:55 PM, Sylvia Else wrote:

Superman wrote:
On 2/01/2010 11:45 AM, Sylvia Else wrote:

Superman wrote:

'King Arthur' on channel 7 is unwatchable! It's constantly
pixilating, although the DVDR says the signal quality and strength
is 10! (full scale) BUT the ads don't pixilate. Now why is that?


Are you using an outdoor antenna?

Yes, I have a digital fringe range aerial running into a four way
splitter amplifier. (outer melb metro area location)

And why do the ads not pixilate? There must be some difference in the
nature of the transmission.

I wonder whether that's really the case. Ads occupy less time then
program material (though, admittedly, only half as much), and you'll
probably not be paying that much attention to them. So if they do
pixalate, you might not notice.

accepted

But, assuming the difference is real...

The word "pixilate" is used somewhat loosely. Overcompression can
create the situation where one becomes aware of the boundaries of the
16x16 pixel macroblocks, particularly during pans.

A burst of noise can destroy the data so that a number of macroblocks
show manifestly wrong content.

I wonder which of these effects you're noticing.

the latter

The difference between ads and King Arthur may be that ads are not
down converted from HD. It's possible there's an incompatibility
between Seven's encoder, and your decoder.

Unless you're using a PVR to watch live broadcasts on a non-digital
TV, you might find a difference between using the PVR to do so, or
using the PVR to record and then play back, and using the digital TV
or STB to watch the broadcasts.

I have the current model Panasonic DVDR and recorded it

My own experience of digital TV is that it's pretty stable, with
visual glitches rare (less than one per several hours).

I think location is relevant in that regard.

Sylvia.

--
rgds,

Pete
=====
http://pw352.blogspot.com

"We stopped the boats coming. The facts speak for themselves. People knew where we stood. We didn't try to be all things to all men. Look, our policy worked. There was no need to alter it" - John Howard

"Our journalists are finally noticing the elephant in the room. Rudd has given us grocery watch, fuel watch, a national dept our children will still be paying, an ETS scheme that will further bankrupt the nation without making an iota of difference to global warming. Rudd is all spin and no substance. Even worse, he expects to fool all people all the time." - media comment

"I don't care what you f__kers think!" - The Hon Kevin Rudd MP, Prime Minister of Australia

 

[Phil Allison]

"Super Stupid man"

Phil Allison


Yes, I have a digital fringe range aerial running into a four way
splitter amplifier. (outer melb metro area location)

I was watching on 70. sorry, I didn't mention that. It was just
hopeless. but there was a storm and lightning last night. perhaps that
was a major cause.


** ROTFLMAO !!!


I'm glad you're amused. Pity you don't see fit to mention it's cause for
our enlightenment.


** For the benefit of readers living outside VIC.

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/wild-thunderstorms-lash-victoria/story-e6frf7jo-1225815371184



So your point is (if you actually have one) is that thunderstorms do
seriously affect digital transmissions, right?

** Errrrrrrr - yes .....




....... Phil