Yamaha cassette deck eating tapes

[Mark Modrall]

Hi...

I bought a Yamaha KX-E300 last October and in the last couple of
months it has started sporadically eating tapes. I've taken it to one
of their service centers and they say that they haven't been able to see
anything wrong. As we use it to play books on tape, it can get quite
expensive to replace when it chomps a tape out of the middle of a book.

The service center says they can't fix anything if they can't
reproduce it, and Yamaha says they won't do anything if the service
center doesn't declare the unit unfixable. The first time I called
someone postulated that the tensioning was off. The second time they
said maybe I wasn't keeping the heads clean (I was).

I told the rep at Yamaha that it's going to cost me $60 (or a third
of the player cost) to replace the books on tape that have gotten eaten,
and his response was that it was stupid of me to keep using the unit for
things that were that expensive to replace. But, of course, he wouldn't
authorize replacing the unit unless the service center declared it a
loss - something of a catch-22.

His other suggestion was to keep the tape in there next time it
happens and return it to the service center. Basically - go eat another
book on tape and then call us again.

Anyone have an idea what I can look for? Or what brand might make a
nice replacement?

Thanks
mark

--
Put the .net on the .cod to send email

 

[Sofie]

Mark Modrall:
Could be, among other things, faulty supply and/or take-up tensions, worn
pinch roller, worn capstan bearings, etc.
These kinds of intermittent problems can be a real problem to get a handle
on..... like the man said, if they can't reproduce the problem they can't
fix it.
--
Best Regards,
Daniel Sofie
Electronics Supply & Repair
-----------------------



"Mark Modrall" <mmodrall@verizon.cod> wrote in message
news:mmodrall-B59FFF.06313316032004@news.verizon.net...

Hi...

I bought a Yamaha KX-E300 last October and in the last couple of
months it has started sporadically eating tapes. I've taken it to one
of their service centers and they say that they haven't been able to see
anything wrong. As we use it to play books on tape, it can get quite
expensive to replace when it chomps a tape out of the middle of a book.

The service center says they can't fix anything if they can't
reproduce it, and Yamaha says they won't do anything if the service
center doesn't declare the unit unfixable. The first time I called
someone postulated that the tensioning was off. The second time they
said maybe I wasn't keeping the heads clean (I was).

I told the rep at Yamaha that it's going to cost me $60 (or a third
of the player cost) to replace the books on tape that have gotten eaten,
and his response was that it was stupid of me to keep using the unit for
things that were that expensive to replace. But, of course, he wouldn't
authorize replacing the unit unless the service center declared it a
loss - something of a catch-22.

His other suggestion was to keep the tape in there next time it
happens and return it to the service center. Basically - go eat another
book on tape and then call us again.

Anyone have an idea what I can look for? Or what brand might make a
nice replacement?

Thanks
mark

--
Put the .net on the .cod to send email

 

[Deke]

"Sofie" <sofie@olypen.com> wrote in message
news:105e60365jce816@corp.supernews.com...

Mark Modrall:
Could be, among other things, faulty supply and/or take-up tensions, worn
pinch roller, worn capstan bearings, etc.
These kinds of intermittent problems can be a real problem to get a handle
on..... like the man said, if they can't reproduce the problem they
can't
fix it.
--
Best Regards,
Daniel Sofie
Electronics Supply & Repair
-----------------------

And in addition, like rental VHS tapes, the tapes themselves may be hammered
to begin with.
I suggest you fast forward to the end, then rewind the tape before you try
to play it. This will do two things.
First, by listening to the tape as you fast forward it, you should be able
to hear any dings in the tape as they pass over the guide posts.
Second, it will make sure the tape tension in the tape shell will suit your
machine.
I'm still using a Yamaha K-700 (circa 1982) with optical reverse, and its
NEVER eaten a tape.
And its on its second set of motors and heads.

Deke

 

[Jerry Greenberg]

A number of common things that can cause these problems are:

Pinch roller pressure not correct.
Belt slipping.
Idler wheel slipping.
Dirt buildup on the capston shaft.
Capston motor not spinning properly.
Takeup reel is not turning properly.
One of the tape guieds are not aligned right, or slipping out of
place.
Power supply outputs may be unstable.

The above are the basic things to check in the standard tape deck.

If you are using such expensive tapes, it would be suggested to
purchase a very high end deck, rather than low cost consumer type. The
lower end decks tend to be more troublesome, and can be less stable in
their design. It seems that the deck you have does not have any safety
features to prevent this type of thing from happening. The higher end
decks have sensors that will put the deck in to a full stop if the
tape torque is more than a few grams off tollerance. The beginning of
a tape tangling would make the machine halt, rather than keep going
until the tape is all eaten.

Jerry Greenberg
http://www.zoom-one.com

--




Mark Modrall <mmodrall@verizon.cod> wrote in message news:<mmodrall-B59FFF.06313316032004@news.verizon.net>...

Hi...

I bought a Yamaha KX-E300 last October and in the last couple of
months it has started sporadically eating tapes. I've taken it to one
of their service centers and they say that they haven't been able to see
anything wrong. As we use it to play books on tape, it can get quite
expensive to replace when it chomps a tape out of the middle of a book.

The service center says they can't fix anything if they can't
reproduce it, and Yamaha says they won't do anything if the service
center doesn't declare the unit unfixable. The first time I called
someone postulated that the tensioning was off. The second time they
said maybe I wasn't keeping the heads clean (I was).

I told the rep at Yamaha that it's going to cost me $60 (or a third
of the player cost) to replace the books on tape that have gotten eaten,
and his response was that it was stupid of me to keep using the unit for
things that were that expensive to replace. But, of course, he wouldn't
authorize replacing the unit unless the service center declared it a
loss - something of a catch-22.

His other suggestion was to keep the tape in there next time it
happens and return it to the service center. Basically - go eat another
book on tape and then call us again.

Anyone have an idea what I can look for? Or what brand might make a
nice replacement?

Thanks
mark

 

[Mark D. Zacharias]

You needn't let it eat another book-on-tape. Any cassette would do - maybe
the cheaper the better for the purpose of this discussion.
As near as I can tell, this is a current model. Your servicer may not be
pursuing a fix a aggresively as they could be.

Mark Z.

(Authorized Yamaha servicer - Wichita, KS. USA)



--
Please reply only to Group. I regret this is necessary. Viruses and spam
have rendered my regular e-mail address useless.


"Mark Modrall" <mmodrall@verizon.cod> wrote in message
news:mmodrall-B59FFF.06313316032004@news.verizon.net...

Hi...

I bought a Yamaha KX-E300 last October and in the last couple of
months it has started sporadically eating tapes. I've taken it to one
of their service centers and they say that they haven't been able to see
anything wrong. As we use it to play books on tape, it can get quite
expensive to replace when it chomps a tape out of the middle of a book.

The service center says they can't fix anything if they can't
reproduce it, and Yamaha says they won't do anything if the service
center doesn't declare the unit unfixable. The first time I called
someone postulated that the tensioning was off. The second time they
said maybe I wasn't keeping the heads clean (I was).

I told the rep at Yamaha that it's going to cost me $60 (or a third
of the player cost) to replace the books on tape that have gotten eaten,
and his response was that it was stupid of me to keep using the unit for
things that were that expensive to replace. But, of course, he wouldn't
authorize replacing the unit unless the service center declared it a
loss - something of a catch-22.

His other suggestion was to keep the tape in there next time it
happens and return it to the service center. Basically - go eat another
book on tape and then call us again.

Anyone have an idea what I can look for? Or what brand might make a
nice replacement?

Thanks
mark

--
Put the .net on the .cod to send email

 

[Mark Modrall]

Thanks for all of the responses... What I've been told is that the
repair center has been testing it basically by playing a tape in a loop
for a long time. And the Yamaha rep says I should consider myself lucky
that they continued testing it after they gave up the first time (most
centers would give more than a working day to testing, he says).

Are there any meters or scoes they could use to test the following
without just playing a tape over and over again?

On the cost thing, if there was a way to replace single tapes out of a
book on tape, it wouldn't be that expensive, but losing a few chapters
out of the middle of a book does kill the enjoyment and the only way I
know of to replace one eaten tape is to repurchase the whole book,
unfortunately.

One of the tapes had indeed been quite well used and even though the 21
year old Nak that this deck was replacing never ate any tapes, i could
understand this one might. What convinced me to take the deck in for
servicing was that it also ate a brand-new tape which seemed unfair.

So what are the better brands these days? Nakamichi got out of the
business; who's taken up the mantle?

Thanks
-mark


In article <460a833b.0403160926.4e334eb8@posting.google.com>,
jerryg50@hotmail.com (Jerry Greenberg) wrote:

A number of common things that can cause these problems are:

Pinch roller pressure not correct.
Belt slipping.
Idler wheel slipping.
Dirt buildup on the capston shaft.
Capston motor not spinning properly.
Takeup reel is not turning properly.
One of the tape guieds are not aligned right, or slipping out of
place.
Power supply outputs may be unstable.

The above are the basic things to check in the standard tape deck.

If you are using such expensive tapes, it would be suggested to
purchase a very high end deck, rather than low cost consumer type. The
lower end decks tend to be more troublesome, and can be less stable in
their design. It seems that the deck you have does not have any safety
features to prevent this type of thing from happening. The higher end
decks have sensors that will put the deck in to a full stop if the
tape torque is more than a few grams off tollerance. The beginning of
a tape tangling would make the machine halt, rather than keep going
until the tape is all eaten.

--
Put the .net on the .cod to send email

 

[Ken Ashcroft]

My wife plays audio books on tape on fairly medium priced machines. She
has mangled a few tapes, which I have managed to splice, but it is the
transport which is usually the problem. Cotton buds and isopropyl
alcohol applied to the contact surfaces which touch the tape is the key.
Dry it after, of course.
In message <mmodrall-B59FFF.06313316032004@news.verizon.net>, Mark
Modrall <mmodrall@verizon.cod> writes

Hi...

I bought a Yamaha KX-E300 last October and in the last couple of
months it has started sporadically eating tapes. I've taken it to one
of their service centers and they say that they haven't been able to see
anything wrong. As we use it to play books on tape, it can get quite
expensive to replace when it chomps a tape out of the middle of a book.

The service center says they can't fix anything if they can't
reproduce it, and Yamaha says they won't do anything if the service
center doesn't declare the unit unfixable. The first time I called
someone postulated that the tensioning was off. The second time they
said maybe I wasn't keeping the heads clean (I was).

I told the rep at Yamaha that it's going to cost me $60 (or a third
of the player cost) to replace the books on tape that have gotten eaten,
and his response was that it was stupid of me to keep using the unit for
things that were that expensive to replace. But, of course, he wouldn't
authorize replacing the unit unless the service center declared it a
loss - something of a catch-22.

His other suggestion was to keep the tape in there next time it
happens and return it to the service center. Basically - go eat another
book on tape and then call us again.

Anyone have an idea what I can look for? Or what brand might make a
nice replacement?

Thanks
mark

--
Ken Ashcroft

 

[Mark D. Zacharias]

I would hope you took the eaten tape in with the unit. The tech examining
this tape may have bee able to guess from a physical examination what caused
the problem.
For example, if there were a longitudinal crease in the tape, one could
reasonably assume it sloughed off the capstan/pinch roller while playing.
It's not unreasonable for the tech to replace all affected parts just on
general principles, ESPECIALLY if the piece is under warranty.
I would replace the capstan/flywheel, pinch roller, and any back-tension
device, such as a soft-brake.
Yamaha tech support would have NO problem with this approach.

End of problem.


Mark Z.

--
Please reply only to Group. I regret this is necessary. Viruses and spam
have rendered my regular e-mail address useless.


"Mark Modrall" <mmodrall@verizon.cod> wrote in message
news:mmodrall-108D5A.06513017032004@news.verizon.net...

Thanks for all of the responses... What I've been told is that the
repair center has been testing it basically by playing a tape in a loop
for a long time. And the Yamaha rep says I should consider myself lucky
that they continued testing it after they gave up the first time (most
centers would give more than a working day to testing, he says).

Are there any meters or scoes they could use to test the following
without just playing a tape over and over again?

On the cost thing, if there was a way to replace single tapes out of a
book on tape, it wouldn't be that expensive, but losing a few chapters
out of the middle of a book does kill the enjoyment and the only way I
know of to replace one eaten tape is to repurchase the whole book,
unfortunately.

One of the tapes had indeed been quite well used and even though the 21
year old Nak that this deck was replacing never ate any tapes, i could
understand this one might. What convinced me to take the deck in for
servicing was that it also ate a brand-new tape which seemed unfair.

So what are the better brands these days? Nakamichi got out of the
business; who's taken up the mantle?

Thanks
-mark


In article <460a833b.0403160926.4e334eb8@posting.google.com>,
jerryg50@hotmail.com (Jerry Greenberg) wrote:

A number of common things that can cause these problems are:

Pinch roller pressure not correct.
Belt slipping.
Idler wheel slipping.
Dirt buildup on the capston shaft.
Capston motor not spinning properly.
Takeup reel is not turning properly.
One of the tape guieds are not aligned right, or slipping out of
place.
Power supply outputs may be unstable.

The above are the basic things to check in the standard tape deck.

If you are using such expensive tapes, it would be suggested to
purchase a very high end deck, rather than low cost consumer type. The
lower end decks tend to be more troublesome, and can be less stable in
their design. It seems that the deck you have does not have any safety
features to prevent this type of thing from happening. The higher end
decks have sensors that will put the deck in to a full stop if the
tape torque is more than a few grams off tollerance. The beginning of
a tape tangling would make the machine halt, rather than keep going
until the tape is all eaten.

--
Put the .net on the .cod to send email

 

[Mark Modrall]

Actually, I asked both the service center and the Yamaha rep and they
*both* said no, don't bring in the tapes; they won't help anything. And
both the service center and the Yamaha rep said they won't replace even
a rubber belt without reproducing the problem... (So much for pleasing
the customer)... The unit still is under warrantee which they both
acknowledge but they both say "well, unless it eats the tape right under
our nose there's nothing we can do."

The tapes look like they've been wadded up. There's no longitudinal
crease, rather bunches of creases going every which way. The unit has
auto reverse and both times it has happened on the return play. The
unit also has a flat, extendible tray for loading/unloading. When the
tape is mangled, it's also been stuck around one of the rollers when you
push for the tray to open (causing it all to trail out of the
cartridge). My wife didn't get what was going on one morning, and the
tape snapped when she pulled it out of the tray. Both other times, I
have taken the lid off and gotten the tape out of the unit.

All of this has been told to both the Yamaha rep and the service
center, and they both insist that the only way they will do anything is
if they have it eat a tape right in front of them. And the Yamaha rep
even said I should consider myself lucky that the service center spent
more than a couple of hours trying to reproduce the problem.

The yamaha rep said that I could try to take it to another service
center, but they're few and far between in my area. The closest one is
about 30 miles away; the other two are each 50+ miles away. The only
other choice he offered was to ship it to them and pay for the shipping
each way.

Thanks
-mark


In article <c39ifb$231u6k$1@ID-180484.news.uni-berlin.de>,
"Mark D. Zacharias" <mzacharias@yis.us> wrote:

I would hope you took the eaten tape in with the unit. The tech examining
this tape may have bee able to guess from a physical examination what caused
the problem.
For example, if there were a longitudinal crease in the tape, one could
reasonably assume it sloughed off the capstan/pinch roller while playing.
It's not unreasonable for the tech to replace all affected parts just on
general principles, ESPECIALLY if the piece is under warranty.
I would replace the capstan/flywheel, pinch roller, and any back-tension
device, such as a soft-brake.
Yamaha tech support would have NO problem with this approach.

End of problem.

--
Put the .net on the .cod to send email

 

[Asimov]

"Mark D. Zacharias" bravely wrote to "All" (16 Mar 04 20:39:01)
--- on the heady topic of "Re: Yamaha cassette deck eating tapes"

MDZ> From: "Mark D. Zacharias" <mzacharias@yis.us>

MDZ> You needn't let it eat another book-on-tape. Any cassette would do -
MDZ> maybe the cheaper the better for the purpose of this discussion.
MDZ> As near as I can tell, this is a current model. Your servicer may not
MDZ> be pursuing a fix a aggresively as they could be.

MDZ> Mark Z.

MDZ> (Authorized Yamaha servicer - Wichita, KS. USA)

As an AYS perhaps you know that some machines can only work with tapes
smaller than C-90 reliably. Perhaps the audio books are C-120 or more.
The owner's manual should state if there is a tape size limitation.

.... [] <- Please write your complaint legibly in that box.

 

[ron doctors]

It is probably a defective assembly. I have had plenty of success
fixing tape decks etc and mostly it is connected to a rubber part,
belt, rollers etc. However since this is a new unit, it probably
either a poor design or most likely was incorrectly assembled at the
beginning. I would INSIST that you get a competely new unit. You have
the right to expect this. It might take some yelling at the place you
bought it or even Yamaha themselves but YOU WILL BE SUCESSFUL!! Just
keep hounding them. I have had a tape deck not work right from the
box.!
Please persevere so that we can all get the service we deserve.
Thank you.


Mark Modrall <mmodrall@verizon.cod> wrote in message news:<mmodrall-B59FFF.06313316032004@news.verizon.net>...

Hi...

I bought a Yamaha KX-E300 last October and in the last couple of
months it has started sporadically eating tapes. I've taken it to one
of their service centers and they say that they haven't been able to see
anything wrong. As we use it to play books on tape, it can get quite
expensive to replace when it chomps a tape out of the middle of a book.

The service center says they can't fix anything if they can't
reproduce it, and Yamaha says they won't do anything if the service
center doesn't declare the unit unfixable. The first time I called
someone postulated that the tensioning was off. The second time they
said maybe I wasn't keeping the heads clean (I was).

I told the rep at Yamaha that it's going to cost me $60 (or a third
of the player cost) to replace the books on tape that have gotten eaten,
and his response was that it was stupid of me to keep using the unit for
things that were that expensive to replace. But, of course, he wouldn't
authorize replacing the unit unless the service center declared it a
loss - something of a catch-22.

His other suggestion was to keep the tape in there next time it
happens and return it to the service center. Basically - go eat another
book on tape and then call us again.

Anyone have an idea what I can look for? Or what brand might make a
nice replacement?

Thanks
mark

 

[Mark Modrall]

Well, i've been a bit perplexed... The service center says "well,
Yamaha won't let us just fix anything on spec. We have to reproduce the
problem before we can fix anything." Ummm... Okay... So I call Yamaha
and *they* say they can't do anything unless the service center writes
the unit off as irreparable. Neat little circle of deniability.

When I said that was unacceptable, that I was going to have to sink 1/3
of the cost of the unit in replacing the books it ate and I can't keep
playing tapes with it at that rate, he said that it was my fault for
playing things that were so expensive in it. When I said that I wanted
a new unit, he said only if the service center writes it off. When I
said they could lose me as a customer, he said, basically, "good".

As for their email customer support, I've never gotten a response to any
of the emails.

Unfortunately, I bought the unit mail-order from J&R; I don't know how
helpful they might be in exerting any influence, but I'll give it a try.

Thanks
-mark



In article <590a927d.0403171330.520ee136@posting.google.com>,
rdoctors@cox.net (ron doctors) wrote:

It is probably a defective assembly. I have had plenty of success
fixing tape decks etc and mostly it is connected to a rubber part,
belt, rollers etc. However since this is a new unit, it probably
either a poor design or most likely was incorrectly assembled at the
beginning. I would INSIST that you get a competely new unit. You have
the right to expect this. It might take some yelling at the place you
bought it or even Yamaha themselves but YOU WILL BE SUCESSFUL!! Just
keep hounding them. I have had a tape deck not work right from the
box.!
Please persevere so that we can all get the service we deserve.
Thank you.

--
Put the .net on the .cod to send email

 

[Mark Modrall]

In article <MSGID_1=3a167=2f133.0_40586142@fidonet.org>,
"Asimov" <Asimov@-removethis-bbs.juxtaposition.dynip.com> wrote:

"Mark D. Zacharias" bravely wrote to "All" (16 Mar 04 20:39:01)
--- on the heady topic of "Re: Yamaha cassette deck eating tapes"

MDZ> (Authorized Yamaha servicer - Wichita, KS. USA)

As an AYS perhaps you know that some machines can only work with tapes
smaller than C-90 reliably. Perhaps the audio books are C-120 or more.
The owner's manual should state if there is a tape size limitation.

I'll check the manual; that's a good idea. The audio book tapes are
mostly around c-120. Bummer if the deck just says it doesn't handle
those tapes.

Thanks
-mark

--
Put the .net on the .cod to send email

 

[Mark D. Zacharias]

Provided J&R is an authorized dealer, and the piece is reasonably within the
warranty, by which I mean not more than a couple weeks past the one-year
limit, I believe I can repair it for you. I know the Yamaha tech people, and
they will stand behind me if I want to replace the parts, or even an entire
deck assembly, if available, under warranty.

I'll need a copy of your purchase receipt, any paperwork you may have from
prior repair attempts, a written problem description from you INCLUDING your
daytime phone number, along with an example of an eaten tape, and the piece
packed properly for shipment (original packaging if possible), sent freight
prepaid to our shop in Wichita, KS.

I will try to copy to you directly, and I can give you the shipping address
etc.

Our phone number in Wichita is:

316-686-8324

Otherwise I may be contacted through the Group - I don't give out a real
e-mail address here, spam and viruses have gotten out of hand!

Mark Z.


--
Please reply only to Group. I regret this is necessary. Viruses and spam
have rendered my regular e-mail address useless.


"Mark Modrall" <mmodrall@verizon.cod> wrote in message
news:mmodrall-318114.19542617032004@news.verizon.net...

Well, i've been a bit perplexed... The service center says "well,
Yamaha won't let us just fix anything on spec. We have to reproduce the
problem before we can fix anything." Ummm... Okay... So I call Yamaha
and *they* say they can't do anything unless the service center writes
the unit off as irreparable. Neat little circle of deniability.

When I said that was unacceptable, that I was going to have to sink 1/3
of the cost of the unit in replacing the books it ate and I can't keep
playing tapes with it at that rate, he said that it was my fault for
playing things that were so expensive in it. When I said that I wanted
a new unit, he said only if the service center writes it off. When I
said they could lose me as a customer, he said, basically, "good".

As for their email customer support, I've never gotten a response to any
of the emails.

Unfortunately, I bought the unit mail-order from J&R; I don't know how
helpful they might be in exerting any influence, but I'll give it a try.

Thanks
-mark



In article <590a927d.0403171330.520ee136@posting.google.com>,
rdoctors@cox.net (ron doctors) wrote:

It is probably a defective assembly. I have had plenty of success
fixing tape decks etc and mostly it is connected to a rubber part,
belt, rollers etc. However since this is a new unit, it probably
either a poor design or most likely was incorrectly assembled at the
beginning. I would INSIST that you get a competely new unit. You have
the right to expect this. It might take some yelling at the place you
bought it or even Yamaha themselves but YOU WILL BE SUCESSFUL!! Just
keep hounding them. I have had a tape deck not work right from the
box.!
Please persevere so that we can all get the service we deserve.
Thank you.


--
Put the .net on the .cod to send email

 

[Richard Steinfeld]

"Mark Modrall" <mmodrall@verizon.cod> wrote in message
news:mmodrall-297297.19562217032004@news.verizon.net...
| In article <MSGID_1=3a167=2f133.0_40586142@fidonet.org>,
| "Asimov" <Asimov@-removethis-bbs.juxtaposition.dynip.com>
wrote:
|
| > "Mark D. Zacharias" bravely wrote to "All" (16 Mar 04
20:39:01)
| > --- on the heady topic of "Re: Yamaha cassette deck eating
tapes"
| >
| > MDZ> (Authorized Yamaha servicer - Wichita, KS. USA)
| >
| > As an AYS perhaps you know that some machines can only work
with tapes
| > smaller than C-90 reliably. Perhaps the audio books are C-120
or more.
| > The owner's manual should state if there is a tape size
limitation.
| >
|
| I'll check the manual; that's a good idea. The audio book
tapes are
| mostly around c-120. Bummer if the deck just says it doesn't
handle
| those tapes.
|

I have been dissappointed with the quality of Yamaha audio
products. During the early-mid 80s, I was amazed that I could
pick up a tuner or amplifier and bend it easily in my hands. I
have a "good" R-8 receiver and a cassette deck whose year I don't
know and model I don't recall.

My impression of the receiver is that it sounds good, but is a
bit on the flimsy side when the lid is removed. The cassette deck
sounds very good, but it is extremely hard to repair -- insane to
get at things. I'd describe the board as "Sanyo quality," or
lower. It must have been a low-end unit because the cables are
hard-wired! Meter movements have no housings and when the device
is opened, look out for those needles (shame on you, too, SONY).
The transport impresses me as a repair shop nightmare. Cords are
just too short, requiring judicious yanking just so to get it out
enough to even see anything. There are obstructions over
obstructions. Design is not like anything I've ever seen; seems
intended to go together in a certain sequence and to hell with
you if you need to fix it (not unique among consumer brands!).
Despite sounding good, mine is hard on tapes with excessive
clutch torque -- there's no way to adjust it: "My way or the
highway." Amazingly, it passed my "C-120 test" OK, but I wouldn't
keep it up.

Yamaha isn't unique in cheapening the goods like this, only a few
steps behind SONY in the race toward the bottom.

So, I'll use it occasionally, but if there's any further trouble,
it's the garbage can for it. I'm not inclined to buy anything
from this company, same as you.

I have had good luck in general with many modern tape products
for playing C-120s. However, they do get funky with use, maybe
around the 50th play or so. I use them only for recording
hour-long radio programs and regard them as eventually
disposable.

One must be especially careful of products that are reviewed, as,
"Performs as well as products twice its price." There's a reason
for that, a reason that's known by all-too-well to every
repairman reading this post! It seems that there is a certain
industry that specializes in designing products to impress
magazine reviewers with the most cheaped-down high-performance
junk imaginable.

Richard

 

[Leonard Caillouet]

Yamaha, like everyone else makes some equipment that is less than
impressive. The R-8 was one of the low points in their receiver line. The
current receiver products are mostly top-grade, relatively speaking. The
current cassette decks are typical of most of the newer decks and are very
poorly constructed.

As a company overall, Yamaha supports dealers and customers better than most
others. In the case of the OP the problem is likely an intermittent that as
Mark pointed out, the servicer is not pursuing adequately. I have had
Yamaha replace units that were out of warranty and had repeated or
intermittent problems, but they do insist that the dealer and/or servicer
confirm a problem. That is reasonable, but the servicer has to make a real
effort to do so. The problem with Yamaha in this case is partly that they
pay very little for warranty repairs (typical of most manufacturers), and
that they seem to assume that just because a shop has all of the test
equipment that they require, that the shop is an effective service option.
Most of the time they are, some times they are not.

Leonard

"Richard Steinfeld" <rgsteinBUTREMOVETHIS@sonic.net> wrote in message
news:hh87c.944$Fo4.9327@typhoon.sonic.net...

"Mark Modrall" <mmodrall@verizon.cod> wrote in message
news:mmodrall-297297.19562217032004@news.verizon.net...
| In article <MSGID_1=3a167=2f133.0_40586142@fidonet.org>,
| "Asimov" <Asimov@-removethis-bbs.juxtaposition.dynip.com
wrote:
|
| > "Mark D. Zacharias" bravely wrote to "All" (16 Mar 04
20:39:01)
| > --- on the heady topic of "Re: Yamaha cassette deck eating
tapes"
|
| > MDZ> (Authorized Yamaha servicer - Wichita, KS. USA)
|
| > As an AYS perhaps you know that some machines can only work
with tapes
| > smaller than C-90 reliably. Perhaps the audio books are C-120
or more.
| > The owner's manual should state if there is a tape size
limitation.
|
|
| I'll check the manual; that's a good idea. The audio book
tapes are
| mostly around c-120. Bummer if the deck just says it doesn't
handle
| those tapes.
|

I have been dissappointed with the quality of Yamaha audio
products. During the early-mid 80s, I was amazed that I could
pick up a tuner or amplifier and bend it easily in my hands. I
have a "good" R-8 receiver and a cassette deck whose year I don't
know and model I don't recall.

My impression of the receiver is that it sounds good, but is a
bit on the flimsy side when the lid is removed. The cassette deck
sounds very good, but it is extremely hard to repair -- insane to
get at things. I'd describe the board as "Sanyo quality," or
lower. It must have been a low-end unit because the cables are
hard-wired! Meter movements have no housings and when the device
is opened, look out for those needles (shame on you, too, SONY).
The transport impresses me as a repair shop nightmare. Cords are
just too short, requiring judicious yanking just so to get it out
enough to even see anything. There are obstructions over
obstructions. Design is not like anything I've ever seen; seems
intended to go together in a certain sequence and to hell with
you if you need to fix it (not unique among consumer brands!).
Despite sounding good, mine is hard on tapes with excessive
clutch torque -- there's no way to adjust it: "My way or the
highway." Amazingly, it passed my "C-120 test" OK, but I wouldn't
keep it up.

Yamaha isn't unique in cheapening the goods like this, only a few
steps behind SONY in the race toward the bottom.

So, I'll use it occasionally, but if there's any further trouble,
it's the garbage can for it. I'm not inclined to buy anything
from this company, same as you.

I have had good luck in general with many modern tape products
for playing C-120s. However, they do get funky with use, maybe
around the 50th play or so. I use them only for recording
hour-long radio programs and regard them as eventually
disposable.

One must be especially careful of products that are reviewed, as,
"Performs as well as products twice its price." There's a reason
for that, a reason that's known by all-too-well to every
repairman reading this post! It seems that there is a certain
industry that specializes in designing products to impress
magazine reviewers with the most cheaped-down high-performance
junk imaginable.

Richard

 

[Richard Steinfeld]

Leonard Caillouet wrote:
| Yamaha, like everyone else makes some equipment that is less
| than impressive. The R-8 was one of the low points in their
| receiver line. The current receiver products are mostly
| top-grade, relatively speaking. The current cassette decks
| are typical of most of the newer decks and are very poorly
| constructed.
|

Thanks for your input, Leonard.

My R-8 receiver has lost its memory. I'm trying to determine
whether to have the memory cap/battery replaced, use it as a
power amplifier only with a separate control preamp, or what?
When you say, "low point," what do you mean? Is it construction,
parts, sound? I've not been able to come up with much information
about this product so I'd appreciate knowing more.

My training is as a musician; I've been a musical instrument
service technician and worked in audio, so my desire in
reproduction is for 20-20 accuracy without going off the deep
audiophile end.

I bought the receiver from my late circuit technician, Paul
Margen, of Berkeley, California. Paul passed away a few months
ago. He was a person of high ideals and generosity: he will be
missed by many.

Richard

 

[Mark D. Zacharias]

Leonard,

If you're authorized Yamaha, you should know that they'll approve up to
twice the posted labor amount with just a phone call to Alan or Jim at tech
support.


Mark Z.



--
Please reply only to Group. I regret this is necessary. Viruses and spam
have rendered my regular e-mail address useless.


"Leonard Caillouet" <no@no.com> wrote in message
news:6vg7c.12866$1e1.10983@lakeread06...

Yamaha, like everyone else makes some equipment that is less than
impressive. The R-8 was one of the low points in their receiver line.
The
current receiver products are mostly top-grade, relatively speaking. The
current cassette decks are typical of most of the newer decks and are very
poorly constructed.

As a company overall, Yamaha supports dealers and customers better than
most
others. In the case of the OP the problem is likely an intermittent that
as
Mark pointed out, the servicer is not pursuing adequately. I have had
Yamaha replace units that were out of warranty and had repeated or
intermittent problems, but they do insist that the dealer and/or servicer
confirm a problem. That is reasonable, but the servicer has to make a
real
effort to do so. The problem with Yamaha in this case is partly that they
pay very little for warranty repairs (typical of most manufacturers), and
that they seem to assume that just because a shop has all of the test
equipment that they require, that the shop is an effective service option.
Most of the time they are, some times they are not.

Leonard

"Richard Steinfeld" <rgsteinBUTREMOVETHIS@sonic.net> wrote in message
news:hh87c.944$Fo4.9327@typhoon.sonic.net...

"Mark Modrall" <mmodrall@verizon.cod> wrote in message
news:mmodrall-297297.19562217032004@news.verizon.net...
| In article <MSGID_1=3a167=2f133.0_40586142@fidonet.org>,
| "Asimov" <Asimov@-removethis-bbs.juxtaposition.dynip.com
wrote:
|
| > "Mark D. Zacharias" bravely wrote to "All" (16 Mar 04
20:39:01)
| > --- on the heady topic of "Re: Yamaha cassette deck eating
tapes"
|
| > MDZ> (Authorized Yamaha servicer - Wichita, KS. USA)
|
| > As an AYS perhaps you know that some machines can only work
with tapes
| > smaller than C-90 reliably. Perhaps the audio books are C-120
or more.
| > The owner's manual should state if there is a tape size
limitation.
|
|
| I'll check the manual; that's a good idea. The audio book
tapes are
| mostly around c-120. Bummer if the deck just says it doesn't
handle
| those tapes.
|

I have been dissappointed with the quality of Yamaha audio
products. During the early-mid 80s, I was amazed that I could
pick up a tuner or amplifier and bend it easily in my hands. I
have a "good" R-8 receiver and a cassette deck whose year I don't
know and model I don't recall.

My impression of the receiver is that it sounds good, but is a
bit on the flimsy side when the lid is removed. The cassette deck
sounds very good, but it is extremely hard to repair -- insane to
get at things. I'd describe the board as "Sanyo quality," or
lower. It must have been a low-end unit because the cables are
hard-wired! Meter movements have no housings and when the device
is opened, look out for those needles (shame on you, too, SONY).
The transport impresses me as a repair shop nightmare. Cords are
just too short, requiring judicious yanking just so to get it out
enough to even see anything. There are obstructions over
obstructions. Design is not like anything I've ever seen; seems
intended to go together in a certain sequence and to hell with
you if you need to fix it (not unique among consumer brands!).
Despite sounding good, mine is hard on tapes with excessive
clutch torque -- there's no way to adjust it: "My way or the
highway." Amazingly, it passed my "C-120 test" OK, but I wouldn't
keep it up.

Yamaha isn't unique in cheapening the goods like this, only a few
steps behind SONY in the race toward the bottom.

So, I'll use it occasionally, but if there's any further trouble,
it's the garbage can for it. I'm not inclined to buy anything
from this company, same as you.

I have had good luck in general with many modern tape products
for playing C-120s. However, they do get funky with use, maybe
around the 50th play or so. I use them only for recording
hour-long radio programs and regard them as eventually
disposable.

One must be especially careful of products that are reviewed, as,
"Performs as well as products twice its price." There's a reason
for that, a reason that's known by all-too-well to every
repairman reading this post! It seems that there is a certain
industry that specializes in designing products to impress
magazine reviewers with the most cheaped-down high-performance
junk imaginable.

Richard

 

[Leonard Caillouet]

"Mark D. Zacharias" <mzacharias@yis.us> wrote in message
news:c3p89t$2afes1$1@ID-180484.news.uni-berlin.de...

Leonard,

If you're authorized Yamaha, you should know that they'll approve up to
twice the posted labor amount with just a phone call to Alan or Jim at
tech
support.


Mark Z.

Mark,

We are not Yamaha authorized for service. We are a dealer and service most
brands and are ASCs for several, but never wanted to invest in the $3000 FM
generator Yamaha wanted us to buy. I get so few Yamaha pieces back under
warranty that it would never pay. Maybe 30 years ago...

I am not surprised. Yamaha gives great support relative to other companies.
I have spoken to both Alan and Jim many times and they are high on my list
among manufacturers tech reps. Even at twice the rate, however, I suspect
that many shops would look the other way on an intermittent. I respect your
willingness to help the guy. We send most of our Yamaha warranty work to
United Radio or Space Age Electronics. If you are interested we might be
able to send some your way. What kind of load and turnaround do you have?

Leonard

 

[Mark D. Zacharias]

Well, I wasn't soliciting for a bunch more warranty work; UR is good and
they are able to do a higher volume than we are. I'm the only audio - dvd -
vcr guy here. If you had a particular piece you wanted us to help with, then
sure.

Mark Z.

--
Please reply only to Group. I regret this is necessary. Viruses and spam
have rendered my regular e-mail address useless.


"Leonard Caillouet" <no@no.com> wrote in message
news:2AX7c.949$pM1.355@lakeread06...

"Mark D. Zacharias" <mzacharias@yis.us> wrote in message
news:c3p89t$2afes1$1@ID-180484.news.uni-berlin.de...
Leonard,

If you're authorized Yamaha, you should know that they'll approve up to
twice the posted labor amount with just a phone call to Alan or Jim at
tech
support.


Mark Z.

Mark,

We are not Yamaha authorized for service. We are a dealer and service
most
brands and are ASCs for several, but never wanted to invest in the $3000
FM
generator Yamaha wanted us to buy. I get so few Yamaha pieces back under
warranty that it would never pay. Maybe 30 years ago...

I am not surprised. Yamaha gives great support relative to other
companies.
I have spoken to both Alan and Jim many times and they are high on my list
among manufacturers tech reps. Even at twice the rate, however, I suspect
that many shops would look the other way on an intermittent. I respect
your
willingness to help the guy. We send most of our Yamaha warranty work to
United Radio or Space Age Electronics. If you are interested we might be
able to send some your way. What kind of load and turnaround do you have?

Leonard