X-box power cords recalled

[Poxy]

KLR wrote:

On Thu, 24 Feb 2005 00:31:04 +1100, "Poxy" <pox@poxymail.com> wrote:

conbo wrote:
In article <1109143167.716213.266680@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>,
"David L. Jones" <altzone@gmail.com> wrote:

David L. Jones wrote:
Microsoft are recalling 14.1 million X-Box power cords!
http://www.xboxworld.com.au/news/leading.php?idNews=893

Dave

I just got my replacement power cord, that was quick!
I was shocked (no pun intended!) when I opened the box. I was
expecting the same lead but instead I got the lead with an large
black box in series. It looks like an ELCB with a reset button,
test button, and an indicator on it.

My wife got the same as you however I got a standard fig 8 power
cord. Her XBox is about a year older than mine, if that helps.

Does the X-Box cord have an earth? I assumed it was an
double-insulated device, for which an ELCB doesn't make a lot of
sense - perhaps the older models are having a low-current circuit
breaker added to the cord?


If it was indeed an ELCB - then it would work effectively to protect
the user if the cord was damaged (on the console side of the ELCB),
conductors were exposed and contact was made with either of the 2
exposed mains conductors to the body.


an ELCB doesnt need an earth connection to work - it only needs
current in excess of its tripping current (35ma for typical home ELCB)
from ONE of its 2 outputs to be flowing to its earth, it then senses
an imbalance between the 2 wires (active and neutral) and then
activates - to shut off the power


It really surprises me that they have gone to this trouble - and
wonder what on earth happened (with the faulty cords) to prompt them
to go to such extreme measures (and MASSIVE expense) with replacement
cords ?

That's my point - I'm aware of how ELCBs work, and assumed it would be
fitted to address some kind of earth fault within the device - fitting one
to protect against inadvertant contact with the conductors seems
extraordinary effort and expense, unless the exposed conductor issue is a
real possibility.

I still think it more likely that it's a low-current circuit breaker
designed to cut out at 2 amps or something.

 

[Ken Taylor]

"Poxy" <pox@poxymail.com> wrote in message
news:384i2fF54s244U1@individual.net...

KLR wrote:
On Thu, 24 Feb 2005 00:31:04 +1100, "Poxy" <pox@poxymail.com> wrote:

conbo wrote:
In article <1109143167.716213.266680@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>,
"David L. Jones" <altzone@gmail.com> wrote:

David L. Jones wrote:
Microsoft are recalling 14.1 million X-Box power cords!
http://www.xboxworld.com.au/news/leading.php?idNews=893

Dave

I just got my replacement power cord, that was quick!
I was shocked (no pun intended!) when I opened the box. I was
expecting the same lead but instead I got the lead with an large
black box in series. It looks like an ELCB with a reset button,
test button, and an indicator on it.

My wife got the same as you however I got a standard fig 8 power
cord. Her XBox is about a year older than mine, if that helps.

Does the X-Box cord have an earth? I assumed it was an
double-insulated device, for which an ELCB doesn't make a lot of
sense - perhaps the older models are having a low-current circuit
breaker added to the cord?


If it was indeed an ELCB - then it would work effectively to protect
the user if the cord was damaged (on the console side of the ELCB),
conductors were exposed and contact was made with either of the 2
exposed mains conductors to the body.


an ELCB doesnt need an earth connection to work - it only needs
current in excess of its tripping current (35ma for typical home ELCB)
from ONE of its 2 outputs to be flowing to its earth, it then senses
an imbalance between the 2 wires (active and neutral) and then
activates - to shut off the power


It really surprises me that they have gone to this trouble - and
wonder what on earth happened (with the faulty cords) to prompt them
to go to such extreme measures (and MASSIVE expense) with replacement
cords ?

That's my point - I'm aware of how ELCBs work, and assumed it would be
fitted to address some kind of earth fault within the device - fitting one
to protect against inadvertant contact with the conductors seems
extraordinary effort and expense, unless the exposed conductor issue is a
real possibility.

I still think it more likely that it's a low-current circuit breaker
designed to cut out at 2 amps or something.



Nokia over here in NZ (not sure if elsewhere as well) did a recall on

similar power cords on ADSL modems a couple of years back. When the plug was
pulled out of the equipment there was a good chance the pins would come out
of the molding, exposing mains. Not a good look.

Ken

 

[KLR]

On Thu, 24 Feb 2005 08:26:41 +1100, "Phil Allison"
<philallison@tpg.com.au> wrote:

"Brian Goldsmith"
"David L. Jones"

No, it doesn't have an earth, it is a stadard 2 pin Fig.8 plug.
As KLR said, it doesn't need an earth pin to work, it can simply detect
the imbalance in the return current.

Dave


***If the Xbox doesnt have an earth pin and is correctly double insulated
how can there possibly be an imbalance in the "return" current.?



** Via the operator's body to ground presumably :-(


BTW

DLJ has not proved the lump in HIS new lead is an RCD.





............. Phil

Would be interesting to see a pic of this device actually


anyone got one ?

 

[David L. Jones]

KLR wrote:

On Thu, 24 Feb 2005 08:26:41 +1100, "Phil Allison"
philallison@tpg.com.au> wrote:


"Brian Goldsmith"
"David L. Jones"

No, it doesn't have an earth, it is a stadard 2 pin Fig.8 plug.
As KLR said, it doesn't need an earth pin to work, it can simply
detect
the imbalance in the return current.

Dave


***If the Xbox doesnt have an earth pin and is correctly double
insulated
how can there possibly be an imbalance in the "return" current.?



** Via the operator's body to ground presumably :-(
BTW

DLJ has not proved the lump in HIS new lead is an RCD.

............. Phil

Would be interesting to see a pic of this device actually
anyone got one ?

I could take a pic and post it but it's not that exciting or
informative. It simply has the two buttons and indicator I described.
I can't get the thing open as I don't have the necessary security
screwdriver.

Dave

 

[David L. Jones]

Brian Goldsmith wrote:

"David L. Jones" <altzone@gmail.com> wrote

No, it doesn't have an earth, it is a stadard 2 pin Fig.8 plug.
As KLR said, it doesn't need an earth pin to work, it can simply
detect
the imbalance in the return current.

Dave


***If the Xbox doesnt have an earth pin and is correctly double
insulated
how can there possibly be an imbalance in the "return" current.?

Brian Goldsmith.

The X-Box catches on fire remember! That's a pretty extreme fault
condition I would think. The case could melt and break down the double
insulation thus allowing a path to earth through some poor hapless 16yo
kid playing Simpsons Road Rage :->
If it was me and I wanted to cover my ass big time and had endless
money behind me I'd probably make it an RCD as well regardless of how
remote the possibility of that fault condition occuring is.

Dave

 

[Phil Allison]

"David L. Jones"

The X-Box catches on fire remember!

** You must be reading a different report to me.



.................. Phil

 

[David L. Jones]

Poxy wrote:

That's my point - I'm aware of how ELCBs work, and assumed it would
be
fitted to address some kind of earth fault within the device -
fitting one
to protect against inadvertant contact with the conductors seems
extraordinary effort and expense, unless the exposed conductor issue
is a
real possibility.

Remember Microsoft have to cover their ass big time on this one.
Whether it costs them $10/unit or $20/unit makes no difference to them,
it's a drop in the ocean for them. They are going to an extrordinary
length and cost anyway, so adding an RCD as well wouldn't be that much
harder.

I still think it more likely that it's a low-current circuit breaker
designed to cut out at 2 amps or something.

It is that at the very least. 610mA is written on the back, so that's
most likely the trip current.

Dave

 

[Brian Goldsmith]

"David L. Jones" wrote

***If the Xbox doesnt have an earth pin and is correctly double
insulated
how can there possibly be an imbalance in the "return" current.?

Brian Goldsmith.

The X-Box catches on fire remember! That's a pretty extreme fault
condition I would think. The case could melt and break down the double
insulation thus allowing a path to earth through some poor hapless 16yo
kid playing Simpsons Road Rage :->
If it was me and I wanted to cover my ass big time and had endless
money behind me I'd probably make it an RCD as well regardless of how
remote the possibility of that fault condition occuring is.


*** Aw,come on Dave!!! The xbox is on fire and melting and the kid is still
playing? He'd be burned to death in the house fire or asphyxiated by the
time the double insulation broke down.

Brian Goldsmith

*** PS. On second thought,there ARE kids out there who would not cease
playing even if their arses caught fire!! BG.

 

[David L. Jones]

Brian Goldsmith wrote:

"David L. Jones" wrote


***If the Xbox doesnt have an earth pin and is correctly double
insulated
how can there possibly be an imbalance in the "return" current.?

Brian Goldsmith.

The X-Box catches on fire remember! That's a pretty extreme fault
condition I would think. The case could melt and break down the
double
insulation thus allowing a path to earth through some poor hapless
16yo
kid playing Simpsons Road Rage :-
If it was me and I wanted to cover my ass big time and had endless
money behind me I'd probably make it an RCD as well regardless of how
remote the possibility of that fault condition occuring is.


*** Aw,come on Dave!!! The xbox is on fire and melting and the kid is
still
playing? He'd be burned to death in the house fire or asphyxiated by
the
time the double insulation broke down.

Brian Goldsmith

*** PS. On second thought,there ARE kids out there who would not
cease
playing even if their arses caught fire!! BG.

Yup, you gotta cater for the lowest common denominator!

Dave

 

[David L. Jones]

KLR wrote:

Would be interesting to see a pic of this device actually
anyone got one ?

Ok, heres the pic:
http://www.alternatezone.com/electronics/images/XboxPowerCord.jpg

Interestingly, when the "Test" button is pressed, the little bi-colour
LED flashed red/green alternately for two seconds before the
electro-mechanical switch kicks in and switches off.
Likewise when you press the Reset button the LED flashed red/green for
two seconds and then stays green.
Some kind of micro in there perhaps?

Dave

 

[David L. Jones]

Phil Allison wrote:

"David L. Jones"


The X-Box catches on fire remember!

** You must be reading a different report to me.

................. Phil

The Xbox web page mentions a fire hazard, as does the booklet which
comes with the unit:
"Your Xbox console may be susceptible to electrical problems that can
cause damage or fire inside the console. Even though the Xbox console
is designed to keep fire from spreading outside the console, Microsoft
recommends that you use the Xbox Protection Cord with your console to
further reduce the risk"

Dave

 

[Phil Allison]

"David L. Jones"

Phil Allison wrote:
"David L. Jones"


The X-Box catches on fire remember!

** You must be reading a different report to me.


The Xbox web page mentions a fire hazard, as does the booklet which
comes with the unit:
"Your Xbox console may be susceptible to electrical problems that can
cause damage or fire inside the console. Even though the Xbox console
is designed to keep fire from spreading outside the console, Microsoft
recommends that you use the Xbox Protection Cord with your console to
further reduce the risk"

** Have MS never heard of fuses and fusible resistors etc to prevent fire
???

What next - a mini foam extinguisher to sit next to every X-Box ??

Utterly bizarre.



.............. Phil

 

[Martin]

"Phil Allison" <philallison@tpg.com.au> wrote in message
news:385gr7F5h4tm5U1@individual.net...

"David L. Jones"
Phil Allison wrote:
"David L. Jones"


The X-Box catches on fire remember!

** You must be reading a different report to me.


The Xbox web page mentions a fire hazard, as does the booklet which
comes with the unit:
"Your Xbox console may be susceptible to electrical problems that can
cause damage or fire inside the console. Even though the Xbox console
is designed to keep fire from spreading outside the console, Microsoft
recommends that you use the Xbox Protection Cord with your console to
further reduce the risk"



** Have MS never heard of fuses and fusible resistors etc to prevent fire
???

What next - a mini foam extinguisher to sit next to every X-Box ??

No, it's class E fire, so powder or CO2 extinguisher probably...

;-)

Utterly bizarre.



............. Phil