Wind turbines used to absorb a power surplus?...

[Commander Kinsey]

An electrician (who I don\'t believe) told me if there\'s too much power on the grid, they use wind turbines as fans to absorb extra power. Is this really true? Aren\'t there plenty of power stations they can just turn down a bit? Take your foot off the gas so to speak?

I was also disturbed to hear from him it costs £700 to install smart meters into each home. And in the UK that comes from green tax. Shouldn\'t that tax be being spent on making more green energy, building new wind farms?

 

[alan_m]

On 18/03/2023 09:39, Commander Kinsey wrote:

I was also disturbed to hear from him it costs £700 to install smart
meters into each home.

Possibly a bit more for both gas and electricity but around the right
ball park figure.

It\'s always been the case that they had to replace non-smart meters
every so often - at one time I think the target was every 10 years. I
had a friend who worked for BG and one of his jobs was to organise
routine meter replacements (long before smart meters). When it became my
turn to have my gas meter replaced I somehow managed to get an
appointment that suited me

And in the UK that comes from green tax.

Shouldn\'t that tax be being spent on making more green energy, building
new wind farms?

Shouldn\'t that tax be scrapped to make our bills cheaper.
It used to be spent on giving us all free CFL light bulbs.

--
mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk

 

[Peeler]

On Sat, 18 Mar 2023 09:39:03 -0000, Birdbrain Macaw (aka \"Commander Kinsey\",
\"James Wilkinson\", \"Steven Wanker\",\"Bruce Farquar\", \"Fred Johnson, etc.),
the pathological resident idiot and attention whore of all the uk ngs,
blathered again:

<FLUSH the subnormal sociopathic trolling attention whore\'s latest
attention-baiting sick bullshit unread again>

--
damduck-egg@yahoo.co.uk about Birdbrain Macaw\'s (now \"Commander Kinsey\" LOL)
trolling:
\"He is a well known attention seeking troll and every reply you
make feeds him.
Starts many threads most of which die quick as on the UK groups anyone
with sense Kill filed him ages ago which is why he now cross posts to
the US groups for a new audience.
This thread was unusual in that it derived and continued without him
to a large extent and his silly questioning is an attempt to get
noticed again.\"
MID: <be195d5jh0hktj054mvfu7ef9ap854mjdb@4ax.com>

--
ItsJoanNotJoann addressing Birdbrain Macaw\'s (now \"Commander Kinsey\" LOL):
\"You\'re an annoying troll and I\'m done with you and your
stupidity.\"
MID: <e39a6a7f-9677-4e78-a866-0590fe5bbc38@googlegroups.com>

--
AndyW addressing Birdbrain:
\"Troll or idiot?...
You have been presented with a viewpoint with information, reasoning,
historical cases, citations and references to back it up and wilfully
ignore all going back to your idea which has no supporting information.\"
MID: <KaToA.263621$g93.262397@fx10.am4>

--
Phil Lee adressing Birdbrain Macaw:
\"You are too stupid to be wasting oxygen.\"
MID: <uv2u4clurscpat3g29l7aksbohsassufe2@4ax.com>

--
Phil Lee describing Birdbrain Macaw:
\"I\'ve never seen such misplaced pride in being a fucking moronic motorist.\"
MID: <j7fb6ct83igfd1g99rmu4gh9vf610ra3jk@4ax.com>

--
Tony944 addressing Birdbrain Macaw:
\"I seen and heard many people but you are on top of list being first class
ass hole jerk. ...You fit under unconditional Idiot and should be put in
mental institution.
MID: <VLCdnYC5HK1Z4S3FnZ2dnUU7-dPNnZ2d@giganews.com>

--
Pelican to Birdbrain Macaw:
\"Ok. I\'m persuaded . You are an idiot.\"
MID: <obru31$nao$3@dont-email.me>

--
DerbyDad03 addressing Birdbrain Macaw (now \"Commander Kinsey\" LOL):
\"Frigging Idiot. Get the hell out of my thread.\"
MID: <4d907253-b3b9-40d4-be4d-b32d453937e0@googlegroups.com>

--
Kerr Mudd-John about Birdbrain Macaw (now \"Commander Kinsey LOL):
\"It\'s like arguing with a demented frog.\"
MID: <op.yy3c02cqmsr2db@dell3100.workgroup>

--
Mr Pounder Esquire about Birdbrain Macaw (now \"Commander Kinsey\" LOL):
\"the piss poor delivery boy with no hot running water, 11 cats and
several parrots living in his hovel.\"
MID: <odqtgc$iug$1@dont-email.me>

--
Rob Morley about Birdbrain:
\"He\'s a perennial idiot\"
MID: <20170519215057.56a1f1d4@Mars>

--
JoeyDee to Birdbrain
\"I apologize for thinking you were a jerk. You\'re just someone with an IQ
lower than your age, and I accept that as a reason for your comments.\"
MID: <0001HW.1EE2D20300E7BECC700004A512CF@news.eternal-september.org>

--
Sam Plusnet about Birdbrain (now \"Commander Kinsey\" LOL):
\"He\'s just desperate to be noticed. Any attention will do, no matter how
negative it may be.\"
MID: <rOmdndd_O7u8iK7EnZ2dnUU78TGdnZ2d@brightview.co.uk>

--
thekmanrocks@gmail.com asking Birdbrain:
\"What, were you dropped on your head as a child?\"
MID: <58ddfad5-d9a5-4031-b91f-1850245a6ed9@googlegroups.com>

--
Christie addressing endlessly driveling Birdbrain Macaw (now \"Commander
Kinsey\" LOL):
\"What are you resurrecting that old post of mine for? It\'s from last
month some time. You\'re like a dog who\'s just dug up an old bone they
hid in the garden until they were ready to have another go at it.\"
MID: <59d8b0db.4113512@news.eternal-september.org>

--
Mr Pounder\'s fitting description of Birdbrain Macaw:
\"You are a well known fool, a tosser, a pillock, a stupid unemployable
sponging failure who will always live alone and will die alone. You will not
be missed.\"
MID: <orree6$on2$1@dont-email.me>

--
Richard to pathetic wanker Hucker:
\"You haven\'t bred?
Only useful thing you\'ve done in your pathetic existence.\"
MID: <orvctf$l5m$1@gioia.aioe.org>

--
clare@snyder.on.ca about Birdbrain (now \"Commander Kinsey\" LOL):
\"\"not the sharpest knife in the drawer\"\'s parents sure made a serious
mistake having him born alive -- A total waste of oxygen, food, space,
and bandwidth.\"
MID: <s5e9uclqpnabtehehg3d792tmll73se0g8@4ax.com>

--
Mr Pounder exposing sociopathic Birdbrain:
\"You will always be a lonely sociopath living in a shithole with no hot
running water with loads of stinking cats and a few parrots.\"
MID: <os5m1i$8m1$1@dont-email.me>

--
francis about Birdbrain (now \"Commander Kinsey\" LOL):
\"He seems to have a reputation as someone of limited intelligence\"
MID: <cf06cdd9-8bb8-469c-800a-0dfa4c2f9ffa@googlegroups.com>

--
Peter Moylan about Birdbrain (now \"Commander Kinsey\" LOL):
\"If people like JWS didn\'t exist, we would have to find some other way to
explain the concept of \"invincible ignorance\".\"
MID: <otofc8$tbg$2@dont-email.me>

--
Lewis about nym-shifting Birdbrain:
\"Typical narcissist troll, thinks his shit is so grand he has the right to
try to force it on everyone
MID: <slrnq16c27.1h4g.g.kreme@jaka.local>

 

[Peeler]

On Sat, 18 Mar 2023 10:49:57 +0000, anal_m, the notorious troll-feeding
senile retard, blathered again:

Possibly a bit more for both gas and electricity but around the right
ball park figure.

And the first troll-feeding senile asshole, anal_m himself, appeared to feed
the abnormal trolling swine again! <BG>

--
Birdbrain (now \"Commander Kinsey\" LOL) baiting the senile assholes in these
groups:
\"Having read the utter bullshit about dying if you fall in a freezing lake
for 15 minutes, I\'ve tried it on many occasions. It takes 30 minutes to
even get chattering teeth, an hour to shiver nicely, and 2 hours to shiver
hard.\"
MID: <op.yvpolqmzjs98qf@red.lan>

 

[The Natural Philosopher]

On 18/03/2023 10:49, alan_m wrote:

On 18/03/2023 09:39, Commander Kinsey wrote:

I was also disturbed to hear from him it costs £700 to install smart
meters into each home.

Possibly a bit more for both gas and electricity but around the right
ball park figure.

It\'s always been the case that they had to replace non-smart meters
every so often - at one time I think the target was every 10 years. I
had a friend who worked for BG and one of his jobs was to organise
routine meter replacements (long before smart meters). When it became my
turn to have my gas meter replaced I somehow managed to get an
appointment that suited me

 And in the UK that comes from green tax.
Shouldn\'t that tax be being spent on making more green energy,
building new wind farms?

Shouldn\'t that tax be scrapped to make our bills cheaper.
It used to be spent on giving us all free CFL light bulbs.

Of course it should be, along with all windmills, solar panels and any
feed in tarriffs.

Your confusion arises from the fact they you think they are working for
you. Government is not your friend, or your servant, It\'s your enemy,
and wants to be your master. Because if it isn\'t it fears you might get
rid of it.


--
\"When one man dies it\'s a tragedy. When thousands die it\'s statistics.\"

Josef Stalin

 

[Sylvia Else]

On 18-Mar-23 8:39 pm, Commander Kinsey wrote:

An electrician (who I don\'t believe) told me if there\'s too much power
on the grid, they use wind turbines as fans to absorb extra power.  Is
this really true?  Aren\'t there plenty of power stations they can just
turn down a bit?  Take your foot off the gas so to speak?

I was also disturbed to hear from him it costs £700 to install smart
meters into each home.  And in the UK that comes from green tax.
Shouldn\'t that tax be being spent on making more green energy, building
new wind farms?

Coal fired power stations cannot change their output rapidly, and can be
willing to pay for the right to generate in preference to reducing output.

So the windfarm notion is not entirely implausible. However, wind
turbines use electronics to match the turbine output to the grid
frequency, and it seems unlikely that it\'s designed to operate in
reverse for the relatively rare occasions that that would be used.

On balance, then, I doubt that using wind turbines as fans is real.

Sylvia.

 

[Frank]

On 3/18/2023 5:39 AM, Commander Kinsey wrote:

An electrician (who I don\'t believe) told me if there\'s too much power
on the grid, they use wind turbines as fans to absorb extra power.  Is
this really true?  Aren\'t there plenty of power stations they can just
turn down a bit?  Take your foot off the gas so to speak?

I was also disturbed to hear from him it costs £700 to install smart
meters into each home.  And in the UK that comes from green tax.
Shouldn\'t that tax be being spent on making more green energy, building
new wind farms?

Does not make any sense. I think it is done with hydroelectric where
water is pumped back up at night when usage is down but what do you do,
pump back wind?

 

[Davey]

On Sat, 18 Mar 2023 07:23:09 -0400
Frank <\"frank \"@frank.net> wrote:

On 3/18/2023 5:39 AM, Commander Kinsey wrote:
An electrician (who I don\'t believe) told me if there\'s too much
power on the grid, they use wind turbines as fans to absorb extra
power.  Is this really true?  Aren\'t there plenty of power stations
they can just turn down a bit?  Take your foot off the gas so to
speak?

I was also disturbed to hear from him it costs £700 to install
smart meters into each home.  And in the UK that comes from green
tax. Shouldn\'t that tax be being spent on making more green energy,
building new wind farms?

Does not make any sense. I think it is done with hydroelectric where
water is pumped back up at night when usage is down but what do you
do, pump back wind?

See:
https://www.energy-storage.news/delivering-pumped-hydro-storage-in-the-uk-after-a-three-decade-interlude/
--
Davey.

 

[SteveW]

On 18/03/2023 11:17, Sylvia Else wrote:

On 18-Mar-23 8:39 pm, Commander Kinsey wrote:
An electrician (who I don\'t believe) told me if there\'s too much power
on the grid, they use wind turbines as fans to absorb extra power.  Is
this really true?  Aren\'t there plenty of power stations they can just
turn down a bit?  Take your foot off the gas so to speak?

I was also disturbed to hear from him it costs £700 to install smart
meters into each home.  And in the UK that comes from green tax.
Shouldn\'t that tax be being spent on making more green energy,
building new wind farms?

Coal fired power stations cannot change their output rapidly, and can be
willing to pay for the right to generate in preference to reducing output.

So the windfarm notion is not entirely implausible. However, wind
turbines use electronics to match the turbine output to the grid
frequency, and it seems unlikely that it\'s designed to operate in
reverse for the relatively rare occasions that that would be used.

On balance, then, I doubt that using wind turbines as fans is real.

That idea has probably come from the use of \"barring gear\". When not in
use, some wind turbines are electrically driven and turn slowly, to
prevent semi-permanent sagging of blades or shafts when left stationary
in one position.

 

[Peeler]

On Sat, 18 Mar 2023 22:17:53 +1100, Sylvia Else, another brain dead,
troll-feeding senile ASSHOLE, blathered:

Coal fired power stations cannot change their output rapidly, and can be
willing to pay for the right to generate in preference to reducing output.

And the second retarded troll-feeding senile ASSHOLE appeared and willingly
fed the attention-starved trolling Scottish swine!

--
Birdbrain (now \"Commander Kinsey\" LOL) baiting the senile assholes in these
groups:

\"However I do like to make fun of people. For example, a professor once
told a secretary off for having a topless male model as the wallpaper on her
computer. So I told her he was a hypocrite, and that he had pictures of
transvestites on his (not as wallpaper, but stored on the hard disk). She
spread that around quite quickly.\"
MID: <op.y4l803yzjs98qf@red.lan>

 

[server]

On Sat, 18 Mar 2023 09:39:03 -0000, \"Commander Kinsey\"
<CK1@nospam.com> wrote:

>An electrician (who I don\'t believe) told me if there\'s too much power on the grid, they use wind turbines as fans to absorb extra power. Is this really true? Aren\'t there plenty of power stations they can just turn down a bit? Take your foot off the gas so to speak?

If there is a risk of overproduction due to wind turbines, simply stop
some wind turbines. Wind turbines must have brakes so that they can be
stopped during a strong storm (about 25 m/s) to avoid damaging the
turbine. Of course greenies will complain about stopping renewable
production, but who cares .

In practice, district heating companies are installing electrically
heated boilers to heat district heating water when there is an
overproduction of wind energy and hence the selectivity price drops
towards zero, thus saving on coal/oil/gas/biofuel during
overproduction.

In areas with mainly cooling loads, wind and solar overproduction can
be used to cool water in advance for air conditioning.

The problem with renewable overproduction is not a big issue, but
underproduction lasting several days is. IMHO oil/gas should be used
to address those periods when renewables are not available, but
greenies object also to this.

 

[Peeler]

On Sat, 18 Mar 2023 07:23:09 -0400, REAL dumb Frankie Boi, the notorious
troll-feeding senile asshole and Trumptard, blathered again:


> Does not make any sense.

NOTHING makes sense with that trolling swine, gay wanker and attention
whore, just like NOTHING makes sense with your notorious troll-feeding, you
troll-feeding senile Trumptard!

--
More details from Birdbrain\'s (now \"Commander Kinsey\" LOL) sociopathic
\"mind\":

\"If I wanted you to stab me with a knife and kill me, you should not
get into trouble for it\".
\"I would kill my sister if I thought I\'d get away with it\".
\"I\'m not what most people think of as human\".
(Courtesy of Mr Pounder)

 

[alan_m]

On 18/03/2023 11:17, Sylvia Else wrote:

> On balance, then, I doubt that using wind turbines as fans is real.

How do you think a wind farm works when there is no wind? For 50% of the
windmills you turn on the fan mode so the rest of them can generate
electricity. It\'s the perfect perpetual motion scheme on a gigantic scale.

--
mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk

 

[Jeff Gaines]

On 18/03/2023 in message <tv467v$2f79h$1@dont-email.me> The Natural
Philosopher wrote:

Shouldn\'t that tax be scrapped to make our bills cheaper.
It used to be spent on giving us all free CFL light bulbs.

Of course it should be, along with all windmills, solar panels and any
feed in tarriffs.

Your confusion arises from the fact they you think they are working for
you. Government is not your friend, or your servant, It\'s your enemy, and
wants to be your master. Because if it isn\'t it fears you might get rid of
it.

Are you an American? It\'s that sort of argument that makes them feel they
need guns to defend themselves from government (and as a penis substitute
of course).

--
Jeff Gaines Dorset UK
Though no-one can go back and make a new start, everyone can start from
now and make a new ending.

 

[Peeler]

On Sat, 18 Mar 2023 13:39:21 +0200, upsidedown@downunder.com, another
mentally challenged troll-feeding senile ASSHOLE, blathered:

If there is a risk of overproduction due to wind turbines, simply stop
some wind turbines.

How about YOU stopping feeding the attention-starved trolling wanker, you
idiotic troll-feeding senile ASSHOLE?

--
More from Birdbrain\'s (now \"Commander Kinsey\" LOL) sociopathic \"mind\":
\"Why do people get upset about getting punched on the nose? It\'s only as bad
as falling off your bike.\"
MID: <op.ymrl1ke48hfnum@red.lan>

 

[Brian Gaff]

I think this highly unlikely. I think turning down is not so easy, since it
is AC, and has to respond to sudden loads. What should happen is that the
loading on most systems will reduce as the generator is easier to turn, but
the frequency remains the same. I do not know what method is used these days
as governors. I\'m sure its probably highly technical and not two weights and
a brake as it used to be on wind up gramophones!
Brian

--

--:
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk
Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
\"Commander Kinsey\" <CK1@nospam.com> wrote in message
newsp.11zw3dfymvhs6z@ryzen.home...
An electrician (who I don\'t believe) told me if there\'s too much power on
the grid, they use wind turbines as fans to absorb extra power. Is this
really true? Aren\'t there plenty of power stations they can just turn down
a bit? Take your foot off the gas so to speak?

I was also disturbed to hear from him it costs £700 to install smart meters
into each home. And in the UK that comes from green tax. Shouldn\'t that
tax be being spent on making more green energy, building new wind farms?

 

[Brian Gaff]

I think when you look at the cost of the meter and the labour costs these
days, then nothing is cheap, that is why even minor prangs of you car can
write it off as its the labour and inflated cost of parts. So many people
buy it and get it fixed instead, probably by a mate at a faction of the
costs the insurance will be charged.
Brian

--

--:
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk
Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
\"The Natural Philosopher\" <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
news:tv467v$2f79h$1@dont-email.me...

On 18/03/2023 10:49, alan_m wrote:
On 18/03/2023 09:39, Commander Kinsey wrote:

I was also disturbed to hear from him it costs £700 to install smart
meters into each home.

Possibly a bit more for both gas and electricity but around the right
ball park figure.

It\'s always been the case that they had to replace non-smart meters every
so often - at one time I think the target was every 10 years. I had a
friend who worked for BG and one of his jobs was to organise routine
meter replacements (long before smart meters). When it became my turn to
have my gas meter replaced I somehow managed to get an appointment that
suited me

And in the UK that comes from green tax.
Shouldn\'t that tax be being spent on making more green energy, building
new wind farms?

Shouldn\'t that tax be scrapped to make our bills cheaper.
It used to be spent on giving us all free CFL light bulbs.

Of course it should be, along with all windmills, solar panels and any
feed in tarriffs.

Your confusion arises from the fact they you think they are working for
you. Government is not your friend, or your servant, It\'s your enemy, and
wants to be your master. Because if it isn\'t it fears you might get rid of
it.


--
\"When one man dies it\'s a tragedy. When thousands die it\'s statistics.\"

Josef Stalin

 

[Carlos E.R.]

On 2023-03-18 12:17, Sylvia Else wrote:

On 18-Mar-23 8:39 pm, Commander Kinsey wrote:
An electrician (who I don\'t believe) told me if there\'s too much power
on the grid, they use wind turbines as fans to absorb extra power.  Is
this really true?  Aren\'t there plenty of power stations they can just
turn down a bit?  Take your foot off the gas so to speak?

I was also disturbed to hear from him it costs £700 to install smart
meters into each home.  And in the UK that comes from green tax.
Shouldn\'t that tax be being spent on making more green energy,
building new wind farms?

Coal fired power stations cannot change their output rapidly, and can be
willing to pay for the right to generate in preference to reducing output.

So the windfarm notion is not entirely implausible. However, wind
turbines use electronics to match the turbine output to the grid
frequency, and it seems unlikely that it\'s designed to operate in
reverse for the relatively rare occasions that that would be used.

Yes, they need a different kind of inverter, way more expensive, to do that.

> On balance, then, I doubt that using wind turbines as fans is real.

On the other hand, any synchronous generator (without electronics) runs
as a motor if the voltage on the output rises (constant speed, though).
I don\'t suppose they like that on hydro places, could do damage.

--
Cheers, Carlos.

 

[micky]

In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 18 Mar 2023 09:39:03 -0000, \"Commander
Kinsey\" <CK1@nospam.com> wrote:

>An electrician (who I don\'t believe) told me if there\'s too much power on the grid, they use wind turbines as fans to absorb extra power. Is this really true?

Sure. YOu know how people with solar cells sell their electricity back
to the power company, when they don\'t need to use it all. In the same
way, when there is too much electricity, it\'s sent to wind turbines, and
they spin backwards and they blow the wind back where it came from. So
that later, it will blow in the first direction again when more
electricity is needed.

Aren\'t there plenty of power stations they can just turn down a bit? Take your foot off the gas so to speak?

I was also disturbed to hear from him it costs £700 to install smart meters into each home. And in the UK that comes from green tax. Shouldn\'t that tax be being spent on making more green energy, building new wind farms?

They don\'t need more wind farms because if too much wind is blown
backwards, the seasons will change.

It takes under an hour to change the meter, maybe under 15 minutes, and
I would guess the cost of a smart meter is under 200 pounds. At least
the marginal cost. In this situation, every cost estimator seems to
come up with a price higher than to be expected. Not sure how they do
it.

Having a smart meter means they no longer have to send meter readers, so
that saves a lot of money in the long run. They can arrange for rolling
black outs if that is ever needed in the UK, and they can do time-of-day
billing, to encourage people to dry their clothes outside of the
electrical rush hour.

 

[Fred Bloggs]

On Saturday, March 18, 2023 at 5:39:12 AM UTC-4, Commander Kinsey wrote:
> An electrician (who I don\'t believe) told me if there\'s too much power on the grid, they use wind turbines as fans to absorb extra power. Is this really true? Aren\'t there plenty of power stations they can just turn down a bit? Take your foot off the gas so to speak?

There\'s no such thing as too much power on the grid, only power fluctuation.. The larger the average power delivery, the greater the chances of larger fluctuations. The technology for wind turbines to absorb momentary excess grid energy, in a way similar to more conventional power generation, is just now in development and demonstration phase of work.

https://www.energy.gov/eere/wind/articles/wind-turbines-can-stabilize-grid

I was also disturbed to hear from him it costs £700 to install smart meters into each home. And in the UK that comes from green tax. Shouldn\'t that tax be being spent on making more green energy, building new wind farms?

Smart meters are big energy savers. For one thing they eliminate the need for the power company to drive around and read them. They are also less of a drag in energy required to power them. There are other more subtle advantages. Add all this up tens of millions of times over and the savings are huge.

https://www.energy.gov/energysaver/electric-meters