Why does this neon flicker?

[Andy Cowley]

I have a couple of 'flame effect' neon lamps which intentionally
flicker. Can anyone tell me why and what determines the repetion
rate?

I've put a couple of movies of what I'm talking about at

http://zen.uwe.ac.uk/neon/neon.html

Please reply by email as I don't regularly read all the groups
I've sent this to.

best

Andy

andy.cowley@uwe.ac.uk

 

[Jamie]

i am sure some one else can explain that to you better but what its
nothing but an impure mix or neon that is causing it to move the
gas around inside causing the neon gas not to conduct.
you get the same effect when a neon lamp starts reaching its
max operating hours due to break down of the gas from the reaction.
the break down time is some where around 25k hours or operation
by simply creating a mix of the same effect you have it.



Andy Cowley wrote:

I have a couple of 'flame effect' neon lamps which intentionally
flicker. Can anyone tell me why and what determines the repetion
rate?

I've put a couple of movies of what I'm talking about at

http://zen.uwe.ac.uk/neon/neon.html

Please reply by email as I don't regularly read all the groups
I've sent this to.

best

Andy

andy.cowley@uwe.ac.uk

 

[Watson A.Name - \"Watt Su]

"Andy Cowley" <andy.cowley@uwe.ac.uk> wrote in message
news:I4Juvq.6x1@bath.ac.uk...

I have a couple of 'flame effect' neon lamps which intentionally
flicker. Can anyone tell me why and what determines the repetion
rate?

I've put a couple of movies of what I'm talking about at

http://zen.uwe.ac.uk/neon/neon.html

Please reply by email as I don't regularly read all the groups
I've sent this to.

It is considered rude for a poster to ask for email, it shows he is not
willing to come back to read the followups. In which case, most
regulars won't consider it worth a reply.

best
Andy

andy.cowley@uwe.ac.uk

 

[Watson A.Name - \"Watt Su]

"Don Bruder" <dakidd@sonic.net> wrote in message
news:MlZ4d.14976$54.225540@typhoon.sonic.net...

In article <10l8lagm3218031@corp.supernews.com>,
Jamie <jamie_5_not_valid_after_5_Please@charter.net> wrote:

i am sure some one else can explain that to you better but what its
nothing but an impure mix or neon that is causing it to move the
gas around inside causing the neon gas not to conduct.

More likely, it's a small magnet that's "guiding" the discharge. This
may in turn make the gas move in the bulb, but unless it's a god-awful
large bulb, I wouldn't expect that to be a consideration.

you get the same effect when a neon lamp starts reaching its
max operating hours due to break down of the gas from the reaction.

Erm... Care to explain to me how you go about "breaking down" Neon
gas?
Last I knew, Neon is... Neon! It's not a compound, it's an element.
Without "going nuclear", you don't break things down any further than
that. You certainly don't do it in a light bulb, whether it's a Neon
or
something else.

the break down time is some where around 25k hours or operation
by simply creating a mix of the same effect you have it.

Now, it IS possible that the glass (or more accurately, the
glass/metal
interface where the 'trodes come out so that you can hook 'em up)
leaks
something else into the bulb, eventually reaching a point where
there's
too much contamination for the lamp to light up, but I'm having a
*REALLY* hard time swallowing the concept that you can somehow manage
to
achieve something that typically requires a multi-million (or in some
cases, billion) dollar atom smasher to accomplish, using nothing more
than a 25 cent Neon bulb.

Any atom in a plasma gets its electrons stripped out of their orbits.
Now that sure ain't too nice! I can't put my finger on whether to call
that atomic breakdown.

But what he was talking about would be considered a contamination of the
neon gas by other atoms.

--
Don Bruder - dakidd@sonic.net - New Email policy in effect as of Feb.
21, 2004.
Short form: I'm trashing EVERY E-mail that doesn't contain a password
in the
subject unless it comes from a "whitelisted" (pre-approved by me)
address.
See <http://www.sonic.net/~dakidd/main/contact.html> for full details.

 

[Spehro Pefhany]

On Fri, 24 Sep 2004 14:28:38 GMT, the renowned Andy Cowley
<andy.cowley@uwe.ac.uk> wrote:

I have a couple of 'flame effect' neon lamps which intentionally
flicker. Can anyone tell me why and what determines the repetion
rate?

Notice how the plates are spaced wider near the top. Probably a
heating effect in the rarified gases filling the envelope. Similar to
a Jacob's Ladder. Try the bulb upside-down.


Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany
--
"it's the network..." "The Journey is the reward"
speff@interlog.com Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com
Embedded software/hardware/analog Info for designers: http://www.speff.com

 

[Alan 'A.J.' Franzman]

"Andy Cowley" <andy.cowley@uwe.ac.uk> wrote in message
<news:I4pEsE.4zy@bath.ac.uk>:

Don Bruder wrote:
snip
Now, it IS possible that the glass (or more accurately, the glass/metal
interface where the 'trodes come out so that you can hook 'em up) leaks
something else into the bulb, eventually reaching a point where there's
too much contamination for the lamp to light up, but I'm having a
*REALLY* hard time swallowing the concept that you can somehow manage to
achieve something that typically requires a multi-million (or in some
cases, billion) dollar atom smasher to accomplish, using nothing more
than a 25 cent Neon bulb.

You are quite right about neon being an element and not subject to wearing
out. Most of the really old neons I've looked at have died from having the
interior of the envelope plated with electrode material.

Thanks for your reply Don. I've updated the web page.

http://zen.uwe.ac.uk/neon/neon.html

In addition to making the glass smokey or silvered, the sputtering of the
electrodes and "plating out" of the material traps enough of the fill gas to
reduce the pressure. This is why neon bulbs not designed to flicker, often
eventually do.

--
--------------------

Alan "A.J." Franzman

Email: a.j.franzman at verizon dot net

--------------------