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You say that, but your defy sense.Take, for example, series mode protectors from Zerosurge,
Brickwall, and Surgex. Good piece of design. However notice
the soft underbelly. There is this little thing called a
safety ground that completely bypasses a series mode
protector. If the building is not 'shunt mode' protected
right at the single point earth ground as described
previously, then a series mode protector is easily bypassed -
ineffective.
What if the lightning hits after the whole house protector? Is there aNot much I can say without many the technical details of
that test. How do we make 'whole house' protection work in
telephone exchanges? One preferred characteristic is the
'whole house' protector mounted directly on the single point
earth ground AND electronics separated by up to 50 meters of
wire. That's right. As much as 150 foot separation.
Important to an effective earth ground / 'whole house'
protector system is a short distance to earth ground AND good
separation between protector and transistors. That 50 meters
is additional impedance that help protect transistors.
After they put out the fire there won't be much left!On Fri, 09 Jul 2004 19:37:57 -0400, w_tom <w_tom1@hotmail.com
wrote:
Not much I can say without many the technical details of
that test. How do we make 'whole house' protection work in
telephone exchanges? One preferred characteristic is the
'whole house' protector mounted directly on the single point
earth ground AND electronics separated by up to 50 meters of
wire. That's right. As much as 150 foot separation.
Important to an effective earth ground / 'whole house'
protector system is a short distance to earth ground AND good
separation between protector and transistors. That 50 meters
is additional impedance that help protect transistors.
What if the lightning hits after the whole house protector? Is there
a
reverse path also?
Tom
On Fri, 09 Jul 2004 19:37:57 -0400, w_tom <w_tom1@hotmail.com> wrote:
Not much I can say without many the technical details of
that test. How do we make 'whole house' protection work in
telephone exchanges? One preferred characteristic is the
'whole house' protector mounted directly on the single point
earth ground AND electronics separated by up to 50 meters of
wire. That's right. As much as 150 foot separation.
Important to an effective earth ground / 'whole house'
protector system is a short distance to earth ground AND good
separation between protector and transistors. That 50 meters
is additional impedance that help protect transistors.
What if the lightning hits after the whole house protector?
Is there a reverse path also?
Tom
Take, for example, series mode protectors from Zerosurge,
Brickwall, and Surgex. Good piece of design. However notice
the soft underbelly. There is this little thing called a
safety ground that completely bypasses a series mode
protector. If the building is not 'shunt mode' protected
right at the single point earth ground as described
previously, then a series mode protector is easily bypassed -
ineffective.
You say that, but your defy sense.
Your local protection will shunt transients to "local"
ground. But "local" ground is ALL your equipment sees.
It doesn't make any difference to me if my "local" ground
even is connected to the "single point ground" back at
the service entrance.
On Fri, 09 Jul 2004 19:37:57 -0400, w_tom <w_tom1@hotmail.com> wrote:
Not much I can say without many the technical details of
that test. How do we make 'whole house' protection work in
telephone exchanges? One preferred characteristic is the
'whole house' protector mounted directly on the single point
earth ground AND electronics separated by up to 50 meters of
wire. That's right. As much as 150 foot separation.
Important to an effective earth ground / 'whole house'
protector system is a short distance to earth ground AND good
separation between protector and transistors. That 50 meters
is additional impedance that help protect transistors.
What if the lightning hits after the whole house protector?
Is there a reverse path also?
Tom
3DUTF-8%26edition%3Dus%26q%3Dpanamax%2Bsurge%26btnG%3DSearchThis is a most informative article, and it echoes what w_tom says:
http://www.ecmweb.com/mag/electric_hit_grounding_home/
So when I call an arbitrary electrician to ask for a grounding survey,
how do I know he's telling me the truth?
Do I have to pay hundreds or thousands of dollars to purchase a ground
tester?
This is for a single family home that I have lived in for about 7 years,
and will probably continue to live in for about 7 more years.
Since I'm having electrical work done, I would also like something like
this: http://scientificsonline.com/product.asp_Q_pn_E_3108400 installed
at my breaker box; it would be nice if it could break down it's info by
each breaker; and it would also be nice if it could tell me how much
current is flowing through my ground connection.
Here are random URLs of info:
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&threadm=0ap7ov4as6j8rj82pd3nv4fhl27dc2adm0%404ax.com&rnum=1&prev=/groups%3Fhl%3Den%26lr%3D%26ie%3DUTF-8%26selm%3D0ap7ov4as6j8rj82pd3nv4fhl27dc2adm0%25404ax.com
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=lang_en&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&threadm=3F0A5E47.FF0175D2%40hotmail.com&rnum=2&prev=/groups%3Fnum%3D100%26hl%3Den%26lr%3Dlang_en%26ie%3DUTF-8%26oe%3DUTF-8%26scoring%3Dd%26as_drrb%3Db%26q%3D%2Bfranklin%2Bgroup%253Aalt.certification.a-plus%2Bauthor%253Aw_tom%26btnG%3DGoogle%2BSearch%26as_mind%3D12%26as_minm%3D5%26as_miny%3D2002%26as_maxd%3D25%26as_maxm%3D8%26as_maxy%3D2003
http://amasci.com/amateur/whygnd.html
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&threadm=3c0bf1a2%241%40news.alcatel.com&rnum=3&prev=/groups%3Fq%3Dground%2Bneutral%2Bhot%26ie%3DUTF-8%26hl%3Den%26btnG%3DGoogle%2BSearch
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&threadm=8gdgt7%24esp%241%40news.efn.org&rnum=1&prev=/groups%3Fq%3Dground%2Bneutral%2Bhot%26ie%3DUTF-8%26hl%3Den%26btnG%3DGoogle%2BSearch
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&threadm=rLpu0fAF53T6EwcJ%40lineone.net&rnum=8&prev=/groups%3Fq%3Dground%2Bneutral%2Bhot%26ie%3DUTF-8%26hl%3Den%26btnG%3DGoogle%2BSearch
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&threadm=w5nsc.34575%24zw.8611%40attbi_s01&rnum=20&prev=/groups%3Fq%3Dground%2Bneutral%2Bhot%26hl%3Den%26lr%3D%26ie%3DUTF-8%26start%3D10%26sa%3DN
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&threadm=U%25046.32481%24bw.2026859%40news.flash.net&rnum=26&prev=/groups%3Fq%3Dground%2Bneutral%2Bhot%26hl%3Den%26lr%3D%26ie%3DUTF-8%26start%3D20%26sa%3DN
Here is a summary of models I have found, and some anecdotes from
Usenet:
MODEL: Panamax Primax
RESELLER: SmartHome.com http://www.smarthome.com/4839.html
JOULES: 2700
AMPS: 60,000
CIRCUIT TYPE: 120/240 1 Phase, 50/60 Hz
RESPONSE TIME: 8x20 microseconds
PRICE: $119.99
WARRANTY: the manufacturer provides a 3-year Connected Major Appliance
Protection Policy up to $10,000 for the repair or replacement of major
household appliances (refrigerator, freezer, oven, range, washer, dryer,
ceiling fan or dishwasher) and a 5-year product warranty.
URLS:
- Press Release:
http://groups.google.com/groups?q=panamax+surge&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&edition=us&selm=01bd5cec%24605a2680%2477003dce%40oemcomputer&rnum=3
- Negative Experiences:
http://groups.google.com/groups?q=panamax+surge&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&edition=us&selm=7nsc8t%24fo1%241%40nnrp1.deja.com&rnum=4
- More Negative Experiences:
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&edition=us&threadm=01bcf42f%24f7de1be0%240100007f%40blyle&rnum=8&prev=/groups%3Fhl%3Den%26lr%3D%26ie%
6ie%3DUTF-8%26edition%3Dus%26q%3Dintermatic%26btnG%3DSearchMODEL: Leviton 51120-1
RESELLER: SmartHome.com http://www.smarthome.com/4860.html
JOULES: 950
AMPS: 50,000
CIRCUIT TYPE:
RESPONSE TIME: "Instantaneous"
PRICE: $189.99
WARRANTY:
URLS:
- Positive Comment:
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&edition=us&threadm=tia8dac62nojbf%40corp.supernews.com&rnum=4&prev=/groups%3Fq%3Dleviton%2Bsurge%26hl%3Den%26lr%3D%26ie%3DUTF-8%26edition%3Dus%26selm%3Dtia8dac62nojbf%2540corp.supernews.com%26rnum%3D4
- Negative Comment:
http://groups.google.com/groups?q=leviton+surge&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&edition=us&selm=4026686F.E9CD70A%40hotmail.com&rnum=3
- Positive Comment:
http://groups.google.com/groups?q=51120+leviton&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&selm=37864104.3D18F1FD%40ibm.net&rnum=2
MODEL: Panamax gpp8005
RESELLER: PowerSystemsDIRECT
http://www.powersystemsdirect.com/Panamax/Service_Entrance_Protector_Whole_House_Surge_Primax_gpp8005_55.php
JOULES: 2,700
AMPS: 60,000
CIRCUIT TYPE: 120/240 1 Phase 50/60Hz
RESPONSE TIME:
PRICE: $99.99
WARRANTY: Connected Equipment Policy Length 3 Years; Connected
Equipment Policy Amount $10,000; Lightning Protection Yes
URLS:
Model description:
MODEL: Intermatic IG1240RC
RESELLER: SmartHomeUSA.com
http://www.smarthomeusa.com/Shop/Lighting/Surge-Suppressors/Item/IG1240RC/
JOULES: 1,200
AMPS: 48,000
CIRCUIT TYPE: 120/240V 60Hz
RESPONSE TIME: Less than 5 nanoseconds
PRICE: $69.95
WARRANTY: $10,000 warrantee
URLS:
- Positive:
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&edition=us&threadm=7ukvpr%24dja%241%40news.mks.com&rnum=2&prev=/groups%3Fq%3Dpanamax%2Bprimax%26hl%3Den%26lr%3D%26ie%3DUTF-8%26edition%3Dus%26selm%3D7ukvpr%2524dja%25241%2540news.mks.com%26rnum%3D2
- Positive:
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&edition=us&threadm=dschneid.367.000B7827%40nicmad.nicolet.com&rnum=2&prev=/groups%3Fhl%3Den%26lr%3D%2
- Positive:
http://groups.google.com/groups?q=intermatic&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&edition=us&selm=37FC7F0A.37E63B3A%40nni.com&rnum=3
- Informational:
http://groups.google.com/groups?q=intermatic+surge&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&edition=us&selm=bdagtd%24paf%40acadia.ee.vill.edu&rnum=2
MODEL: Intermatic PanelGuard IG1300-4T-2C, protects (?) phone-lines and
cable lines too
RESELLER:
JOULES:
AMPS: 48,000
CIRCUIT TYPE: 120/240 single (split) phase, 4 telephone lines, and 2
coax cable lines; ALL MODE PROTECTION (L1-N, L2-N, L1-G, L2-G, N-G,
L1-L2); 150 Volt MOVs (Metal Oxide Varistors) [AC Protection]; 350 Volt
Gas Tube [Telephone Protection]; 90 Volt Gas Tube [Coax Cable /
Satellite Protection]
RESPONSE TIME:
PRICE: IG1300-2T is $152.83 at
http://www.aplussupply.com/intermatic/pg5000/ig1240.htm
WARRANTY: $10,000, 5 year warranty
URLS:
- Non-negative:
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&threadm=38e3ov8gs057mmtgpgq3loqfodtq1odneq%404ax.com&rnum=1&prev=/groups%3Fq%3DIG-1300%26ie%3DUTF-8%26hl%3Den%26btnG%3DGoogle%2BSearch
- Positive:
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&threadm=bdc56s%24q5q%40acadia.ee.vill.edu&rnum=2&prev=/groups%3Fq%3DIG-1300%26ie%3DUTF-8%26hl%3Den%26btnG%3DGoogle%2BSearch
MODEL: Ditek DTK-WH8 Whole House Kit
RESELLER: StayOnline
http://www.stayonline.com/panel_surge_protectors/3233.asp
JOULES: 1050
AMPS: 125,000
CIRCUIT TYPE: 120 / 240 Split Phase ; Suppressed Voltage Rating: 700V
(L-L), 400V (L-G, L-N, N-G)
RESPONSE TIME: Less than 5 nanosecond
PRICE: $149
WARRANTY:
URLS:
MODEL: PolyPhaser IS-PM120-SP
RESELLER: PolyPhaser.com
JOULES:
AMPS: 40,000
CIRCUIT TYPE: 120Vac, 1 Phase, 2 Wires & GND
RESPONSE TIME: ?? Turn-On Time: 25ns ??
PRICE:
WARRANTY:
URLS:
- Positive:
http://groups.google.com/groups?q=leviton+surge&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&edition=us&selm=4026686F.E9CD70A%40hotmail.com&rnum=3
Where I'm going with the question is that 50m/150 feet is a lot ofIf lightning can hit between the 'whole house' protector and
the protected appliance, then the protected appliance should
be considered a different structure from structure protected
by the 'whole house' protector. Or the building needs
lightning rods. In the case of telephone exchanges, that
direct strike just cannot happen. Will appliance be damaged?
A question that can only be answered by "what are the better
paths to earth ground?" or "more information required".
Yes, lightning will go to earth via 'whole house' protector
even if coming from inside the building. That is how a modem,
damaged by incoming AC electric transient, uses the internal
phone line as the outgoing path to earth ground. Telco
installed 'whole house' protector is not earthing a transient
entering on exterior telco wire. It is earthing a transient
coming from the modem located inside the building.
Not exactly sure where you are going with this question.
Tom MacIntyre wrote:
On Fri, 09 Jul 2004 19:37:57 -0400, w_tom <w_tom1@hotmail.com> wrote:
Not much I can say without many the technical details of
that test. How do we make 'whole house' protection work in
telephone exchanges? One preferred characteristic is the
'whole house' protector mounted directly on the single point
earth ground AND electronics separated by up to 50 meters of
wire. That's right. As much as 150 foot separation.
Important to an effective earth ground / 'whole house'
protector system is a short distance to earth ground AND good
separation between protector and transistors. That 50 meters
is additional impedance that help protect transistors.
What if the lightning hits after the whole house protector?
Is there a reverse path also?
Tom
I should clarify, I don't believe those transient suppressorsI don't believe separate TVSS provide any significant protection.
We have tons of test data proving that it is necessary to provide a surge
equilization TVSS at any equipment that is powered from the electrical
system and connected to one, or more, communication systems.
Read this:
http://www.eeel.nist.gov/817/817g/spd-anthology/files/Enlightening.pdf
Chris has misrepresented what was posted. Anything else
installed as part of the protection system is, at best,
supplementary. Until the 'whole house' protector and single
point earth ground is installed, then nothing else can be
effective. Supplementary devices are all but useless without
first earthing the incoming transient. Furthermore, those
supplementary devices that can work adjacent to a computer are
already inside that computer.
Take, for example, series mode protectors from Zerosurge,
Brickwall, and Surgex. Good piece of design. However notice
the soft underbelly. There is this little thing called a
safety ground that completely bypasses a series mode
protector. If the building is not 'shunt mode' protected
right at the single point earth ground as described
previously, then a series mode protector is easily bypassed -
ineffective. Series mode protector is only supplementary and
can be ineffective without the 'whole house' earthed
protection system.
There is no more superior protection than single point earth
ground and 'whole house' protector. Furthermore, the cost of
enhancing that single point earth ground is significantly less
expensive and more effective than plug-in protectors on every
appliance. Provided is the most cost effective and overall
effective solution to hardware transient protection.
The silly suggestion is that lightning hitting a nearby tree
will create some kind of monster electromagnetic field that
will destroy electronics.
provide those numbers. Lightning striking a tree and causing
internal appliance damage is more often a direct strike to the
appliance. Often associated with not using the single point
earth ground.
An example demostrates how a nearby tree can actually
channel a surge into and out of household appliances. 6
campers were sleeping beneath a tree that was struck. 4 were
sleeping perpendicular to the tree and therefore remained
healthy. Two were sleeping pointed towards that tree. They
were seriously hurt because lightning left earth, traveled
down each body, then reentered earth. Those two suffered a
direct strike because they were a path from cloud to earth
borne charges located elsewhere.
Same concept applies to building protection. That lightning
that struck a tree could have found a conductive path through
appliances because house did not use a single point earth
ground. Notice the most important component in a surge
protection 'system'? Single point earth ground.
How do campers avoid a direct strike from the ground?
Again, single point earth ground which means both feet
together - the only point where a human body touched earth.
Is the 'whole house' solution as proposed perfect? Of
course not. Someone here may suffer a rare strike that even
overwhelms that 'whole house' protection. But then we are not
installing perfect protection. We are upgrading near zero
protection to protection that is well over 95% effective - at
very little cost. To have well over 95% effectiveness does
not require zero resistance grounding. Ufer grounding even
enhances that 95+% effective protection. Somehow Chris has
invented values (such as resistance for Ufer grounding - but
he does not even provide the number) that I did not provide
and that does not adversely effect that far more superior
solution. Near zero resistance in an Ufer ground is so
effective that the method is used to keep ammunition from
exploding due to a direct lightning strike.
Telco stations and cell towers, on the other hand, must
never suffer damage even from that most rare and powerful
strike. Therefore they install massive amounts more earthing
just to improve that less than 5%. The bottom line remains.
They too use the 'whole house' protectors with a massive
single point earth ground. They also don't use useless and
grossly overpriced plug-in protectors. The do use a UPS that
also contributes to protection because that UPS is also
properly earthed; not a plug-in type.
The point here being that one can spend tens of times more
money per protected appliance and get virtually no effective
protection from plug-in protectors.
Unfortunately Chris Lewis has mischaracterized my posts. He
still thinks a protector adjacent to the computer and
essentially unearthed will provide some type of protection.
That can only be true in a DC world. Due to wire impedance
and the RF nature of destructive surges, then adjacent plug-in
protectors have no earth grounding. IOW plug-in protectors are
ineffective. Apparently Chris doesn't understand about RF,
rapid transients and slew rates which is why he thinks a
plug-in protector is earthed.
In learning about lightning strikes by actually replacing
the damaged ICs, multiple computers were damaged because a
powered off computer was adjacent to a plug-in surge
protector. That's right. An adjacent surge protector even
contributed to damage of that powered off computer and spread
through the network to damage other computer network cards.
Damage created by a plug-in protector that was too close to
transistors and too far from earth ground.
Any protection that can work adjacent to the computer is
inside the computer. Any surge protector without a less than
10 foot connection to earth ground, well, its manufacturer
does not even claim to protect from that typically destructive
type of surge.
Provided was both the theory AND experimental evidence of
effective protection. Chris Lewis is invited to provide
theory and experimental evidence that explains how a plug-in
protector could possibly protect an adjacent computer. Chris
will have to provide the evidence because that surge protector
manufacturer will not even make that claim. That manufacturer
so fears we might learn about earthing that he does not even
mention earthing. That manufacturer knows this basic fact: a
surge protector is only as effective as its earth ground.
Better to avoid the topic to not harm sales.
Supplementary protectors remain largely ineffective if the
essential 'whole house' and single point earth ground is not
installed.
Chris Lewis wrote:
Don't get me wrong, there's nothing whatsoever wrong with a
whole house surge suppressor. It'll usually do most of the
job just fine on a _line_ strike. Which is probably the
most common.
On the other hand, a lightning strike hitting a tree a few
hundred feet away on the other side of the house from the
panel is not all that uncommon, and a whole-house suppressor
will be much less help. Surge suppression (even with
relatively remote/poor grounding) _local_ to the device
helps more.
tom_w's obsession is that _only_ whole house surge
suppressers work, _only_ whole house surge suppressors
_can_ work, (and dare I say it), work _perfectly_ all
the time, and all other devices are all-out fraud and
completely useless.
He doesn't understand that earth grounds (even UFERs
spec'd well beyond code req'ts) aren't (and often not
even close to) zero resistance.
He doesn't understand about RF (lightning strikes have
LOTs of RF in them), rapid transients and slew rates.
He's living in a DC world.
The real world just isn't quite like that.
Call it a "separately derived ground" that is connected (but not "bonded" toWhat is local ground?
On Sun, 11 Jul 2004 15:01:28 -0400, w_tom <w_tom1@hotmail.com> wrote:
If lightning can hit between the 'whole house' protector and
the protected appliance, then the protected appliance should
be considered a different structure from structure protected
by the 'whole house' protector. Or the building needs
lightning rods. In the case of telephone exchanges, that
direct strike just cannot happen. Will appliance be damaged?
A question that can only be answered by "what are the better
paths to earth ground?" or "more information required".
Yes, lightning will go to earth via 'whole house' protector
even if coming from inside the building. That is how a modem,
damaged by incoming AC electric transient, uses the internal
phone line as the outgoing path to earth ground. Telco
installed 'whole house' protector is not earthing a transient
entering on exterior telco wire. It is earthing a transient
coming from the modem located inside the building.
Not exactly sure where you are going with this question.
Where I'm going with the question is that 50m/150 feet is a
lot of separation, enough that a lightning strike could
easily hit on the bad side of the protector.
Tom
You are providing a great deal of misinformation to this
group, intentionally or not. A close lightning strike can
and WILL cause a large transient that can damage
electronic components. Please refrain from posting
until you have researched the subject thoroughly.
"w_tom" <w_tom1@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:40F192AC.24D151E9@hotmail.com...
What is local ground?
Call it a "separately derived ground" that is connected (but
not "bonded" to your "single point ground" at the service
entrance.
Actually, it could just be a nail pounded into the floor with
a sign than say "GROUND." Your surge protector would still
protect everything being served by it so long as ALL wires
going to the outside world passed through the surge protector.
You continue to parrot the same nonsense without any understandingA nail pounded into the floor and labeled 'ground' would be
effective if destructive surges were normal mode. But
destructive surges are not same as what plug-in protectors
claim to protect from. For protection from the typically
destructive surge, that single point earth ground is
essential. One need not even have a surge protector to have
effective protection. But a single point earth ground is
always essential to that protection.
A small van der graf generator producing a wimpy 50Kv can lightAssumption is that CG lightning is permitted inside a
building. Instead lightning rods and a steel skeleton provide
protection. Others may claim that nearby lighting strikes
will create massive electromagnetically induced surges on that
long (50m) wire between protector and electronics.
Lets see those numbers. What are numbers for a field
induced on those nearby wires?
As noted in another post - how do telco switching centers
install protection? Preferred is a switching computer
electronics separated by up to 50 meters of wire after the
surge protectors. If lightning strikes induced destructive
transients on nearby wires, then telco switching computers
would be often damaged by transients induced on those up to 50
meter cables. Let's see some E-M number for those so
destructive transients induced by nearby lightning strikes.
Back up that claim with some numbers. A typical 18,000 amp
CG strike outside the building and some 30 or 50 meters from
that interior wire. What destructive electrical transient
ends up on electronics end of that up to 50 meter phone wire
inside the building?
sparky wrote:
You are providing a great deal of misinformation to this
group, intentionally or not. A close lightning strike can
and WILL cause a large transient that can damage
electronic components. Please refrain from posting
until you have researched the subject thoroughly.
w_tom <w_tom1@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:<40F25164.293E35A8@hotmail.com>...
Lets see those numbers. What are numbers for a field
induced on those nearby wires?
As noted in another post - how do telco switching centers
install protection? Preferred is a switching computer
electronics separated by up to 50 meters of wire after the
surge protectors. If lightning strikes induced destructive
transients on nearby wires, then telco switching computers
would be often damaged by transients induced on those up to 50
meter cables. Let's see some E-M number for those so
destructive transients induced by nearby lightning strikes.
Back up that claim with some numbers. A typical 18,000 amp
CG strike outside the building and some 30 or 50 meters from
that interior wire. What destructive electrical transient
ends up on electronics end of that up to 50 meter phone wire
inside the building?
sparky wrote:
You are providing a great deal of misinformation to this
group, intentionally or not. A close lightning strike can
and WILL cause a large transient that can damage
electronic components. Please refrain from posting
until you have researched the subject thoroughly.
I see Tom is at it again with the usual wandering posts, more like
ranting and raving actually, on his favorite topic. The common theme
is:
1 - All you need is whole house entrance protection
2 - If anything gets damaged by lightening with that in place, well
it's "human failure", eg you must have done something wrong.
3 - Using plug in surge protectors, either as additional protection,
or for those living in say rental properties or apartments, only makes
things worse and leads to damage.
4 - If anyone reports having seen several pieces of eqpt that were
protected with a plug in protector escape damage, while another
unprotected piece got zapped, that's just dismissed, since he knows
better.
5 - If anyone sees a piece of eqpt with lightening damage on a comm
port, or a telephone line, well, Tom knows lightening so well and it's
so predictable, that the surge came in on the AC service entrance,
went through the whole house, and then chose to exit on the comm or
telephone line on the way out. He knows that's how my Tivo got it,
not from a lightening surge on the phone line.
The best part is how he continues to challenge people like Sparky to
provide scientific data, yet ignores it when they do and never
provides any himself. So, Tom, here it is again for you, straight
from the National Lightning Safety Institute. They clearly discuss
both direct and INDUCED EFFECTS caused by lightning, complete with
discussions of field strength, induced currents, etc. Perhaps it will
actually sink in this time, but I doubt it.
http://www.lightningsafety.com/nlsi_lhm/effect.html
[snip]Get the phone company to correct his mistake (so they will
reeducate the man and so you are not in violation of FCC
regulations). Does your box look like these?
http://www.alarmsuperstore.com/bw/bw%20connectors.htm
http://www.bass-home.com/gotoproduct.cfm?item=91598
Then NID must be earthed. And not earthed to the cable
company wire. The NID must make a connection to the same
earth ground where the cable wire also makes its earthing
connection. Each earthing wire should run separate and then
meet at the single point earth ground.
Any future trouble with phone company installers, then here
is the code: