where to attach the ESD wrist stap's crocodile clip

B

Buttered

Guest
Hello and happy new year in advance. :)
I have a question here. where would be the suggested spot to attach
the crocodile clip of an Electrostatic discharge (ESD) wrist strap. I
was thinking about attaching the crocodile clip to the exposed metal
of any electrical appliances such as my PC's power supply while its
plug remained on the power receptacle. Would this be working?
 
Buttered wrote:
Hello and happy new year in advance. :)
I have a question here. where would be the suggested spot to attach
the crocodile clip of an Electrostatic discharge (ESD) wrist strap. I
was thinking about attaching the crocodile clip to the exposed metal
of any electrical appliances such as my PC's power supply while its
plug remained on the power receptacle. Would this be working?
Click to expand...

ATX class computers are supposed to be unplugged when you work on
them, because of the +5 VDC power supply. Find another ground, or make a
cord using only the ground pin to plug into an outlet on your
workbench. My workbenches all have metal outlet boxes and covers, so
it's always easy to find a proper ground.

--
Service to my country? Been there, Done that, and I've got my DD214 to
prove it.
Member of DAV #85.

Michael A. Terrell
Central Florida
 
On Dec 31, 6:27 pm, Buttered <buttered.fing...@gmail.com> wrote:
Hello and happy new year in advance. :)
I have a question here. where would be the suggested spot to attach
the crocodile clip of an Electrostatic discharge (ESD) wrist strap. I
was thinking about attaching the crocodile clip to the exposed metal
of any electrical appliances such as my PC's power supply while its
plug remained on the power receptacle. Would this be working?
Click to expand...
That will work, so long as your appliance is always plugged in.
Better to get one of the proper ESD earth plug attachments that plug
into the power point though, then you can connect your mat and wrist
strap etc properly in a more permanent setup.

Dave.
 
In message <47789CC8.9A7D77AD@earthlink.net>, Michael A. Terrell
<mike.terrell@earthlink.net> writes
ATX class computers are supposed to be unplugged when you work on
them, because of the +5 VDC power supply. Find another ground, or make a
cord using only the ground pin to plug into an outlet on your
workbench. My workbenches all have metal outlet boxes and covers, so
it's always easy to find a proper ground.

Switch the socket or PSU off (providing it has a physical switch on it,
Click to expand...
not too many do anymore)? Or does the US not have switched mains
outlets?
--
Clint Sharp
 
Clint Sharp wrote:
In message <47789CC8.9A7D77AD@earthlink.net>, Michael A. Terrell
mike.terrell@earthlink.net> writes
ATX class computers are supposed to be unplugged when you work on
them, because of the +5 VDC power supply. Find another ground, or make a
cord using only the ground pin to plug into an outlet on your
workbench. My workbenches all have metal outlet boxes and covers, so
it's always easy to find a proper ground.

Switch the socket or PSU off (providing it has a physical switch on it,
not too many do anymore)? Or does the US not have switched mains
outlets?
Click to expand...

Rarely. You can use a switched outlet strip, but for a workbench I
prefer a better grounding system. At my last job we ran #8 AWG bare,
solid copper wire (.12949" Dia.), along rows of benches. We bonded them
to the building's ground system, All joints were soldered, and tested
monthly

--
Service to my country? Been there, Done that, and I've got my DD214 to
prove it.
Member of DAV #85.

Michael A. Terrell
Central Florida
 
Michael A. Terrell wrote:

Clint Sharp wrote:

In message <47789CC8.9A7D77AD@earthlink.net>, Michael A. Terrell
mike.terrell@earthlink.net> writes

ATX class computers are supposed to be unplugged when you work on
them, because of the +5 VDC power supply. Find another ground, or make a
cord using only the ground pin to plug into an outlet on your
workbench. My workbenches all have metal outlet boxes and covers, so
it's always easy to find a proper ground.


Switch the socket or PSU off (providing it has a physical switch on it,
not too many do anymore)? Or does the US not have switched mains
outlets?



Rarely. You can use a switched outlet strip, but for a workbench I
prefer a better grounding system. At my last job we ran #8 AWG bare,
solid copper wire (.12949" Dia.), along rows of benches. We bonded them
to the building's ground system, All joints were soldered, and tested
monthly
Click to expand...
Soldering joints is not legal electrical codes. They must be clamped or
use of a legal connecting device like wire nuts, busbar, terminals etc..

Yeah I know, piss off.

--
"I'd rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal lobotomy"

http://webpages.charter.net/jamie_5"
 
On Dec 31 2007, 3:27 pm, Buttered <buttered.fing...@gmail.com> wrote:

Thank you guys for helping. Really appreciate all the infos given.
Have a great new year ahead.
 
Jamie wrote:

Michael A. Terrell wrote:

Clint Sharp wrote:

In message <47789CC8.9A7D77AD@earthlink.net>, Michael A. Terrell
mike.terrell@earthlink.net> writes

ATX class computers are supposed to be unplugged when you work on
them, because of the +5 VDC power supply. Find another ground, or
make a
cord using only the ground pin to plug into an outlet on your
workbench. My workbenches all have metal outlet boxes and covers, so
it's always easy to find a proper ground.
In an emergency, if you are wearing natural fibre and leather shoes, its
Click to expand...
good enough to clip yourself to the *UNGROUNDED* computer (google
equipotential bonding), just *dont* put any parts down anywhere other
than on or inside the case once you have taken them out of their
antistatic bags. OTOH if you are wearing a polyester shellsuit over
nylon, even wrapping yourself in grounded tinfoil probably wont save
your chips . . . (unless the men in white coats take you away before you
get your computer open)
Switch the socket or PSU off (providing it has a physical switch on it,
not too many do anymore)? Or does the US not have switched mains
outlets?




Rarely. You can use a switched outlet strip, but for a workbench I
prefer a better grounding system. At my last job we ran #8 AWG bare,
solid copper wire (.12949" Dia.), along rows of benches. We bonded them
to the building's ground system, All joints were soldered, and tested
monthly


Soldering joints is not legal electrical codes. They must be clamped or
use of a legal connecting device like wire nuts, busbar, terminals etc..

Yeah I know, piss off.

Well its not for electrical supply or safety ground so how does it come
Click to expand...
under the code? Its only for ESD protection ;-)

--
Ian Malcolm. London, ENGLAND. (NEWSGROUP REPLY PREFERRED)
ianm[at]the[dash]malcolms[dot]freeserve[dot]co[dot]uk
[at]=@, [dash]=- & [dot]=. *Warning* HTML & >32K emails --> NUL:
 
Jamie wrote:
Michael A. Terrell wrote:

Clint Sharp wrote:

In message <47789CC8.9A7D77AD@earthlink.net>, Michael A. Terrell
mike.terrell@earthlink.net> writes

ATX class computers are supposed to be unplugged when you work on
them, because of the +5 VDC power supply. Find another ground, or make a
cord using only the ground pin to plug into an outlet on your
workbench. My workbenches all have metal outlet boxes and covers, so
it's always easy to find a proper ground.


Switch the socket or PSU off (providing it has a physical switch on it,
not too many do anymore)? Or does the US not have switched mains
outlets?



Rarely. You can use a switched outlet strip, but for a workbench I
prefer a better grounding system. At my last job we ran #8 AWG bare,
solid copper wire (.12949" Dia.), along rows of benches. We bonded them
to the building's ground system, All joints were soldered, and tested
monthly


Soldering joints is not legal electrical codes. They must be clamped or
use of a legal connecting device like wire nuts, busbar, terminals etc..

Yeah I know, piss off.

--
"I'd rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal lobotomy"
Click to expand...

That lobotomy removed any chance of clear thought on your part,
Jamie. A plant wide ESD abatement system has absolutely NOTHING to do
with the National Electrical Code. It was an entirely seperate system,
with cluster of benches connected to the building's steel skeliton, and
every support column was grounded.

As usual, you sopt nonsense, or ourrright lies to people who din't
know any better.


--
Service to my country? Been there, Done that, and I've got my DD214 to
prove it.
Member of DAV #85.

Michael A. Terrell
Central Florida
 
Michael A. Terrell wrote:

Jamie wrote:

Michael A. Terrell wrote:


Clint Sharp wrote:


In message <47789CC8.9A7D77AD@earthlink.net>, Michael A. Terrell
mike.terrell@earthlink.net> writes


ATX class computers are supposed to be unplugged when you work on
them, because of the +5 VDC power supply. Find another ground, or make a
cord using only the ground pin to plug into an outlet on your
workbench. My workbenches all have metal outlet boxes and covers, so
it's always easy to find a proper ground.


Switch the socket or PSU off (providing it has a physical switch on it,
not too many do anymore)? Or does the US not have switched mains
outlets?



Rarely. You can use a switched outlet strip, but for a workbench I
prefer a better grounding system. At my last job we ran #8 AWG bare,
solid copper wire (.12949" Dia.), along rows of benches. We bonded them
to the building's ground system, All joints were soldered, and tested
monthly


Soldering joints is not legal electrical codes. They must be clamped or
use of a legal connecting device like wire nuts, busbar, terminals etc..

Yeah I know, piss off.

--
"I'd rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal lobotomy"



That lobotomy removed any chance of clear thought on your part,
Jamie. A plant wide ESD abatement system has absolutely NOTHING to do
with the National Electrical Code. It was an entirely seperate system,
with cluster of benches connected to the building's steel skeliton, and
every support column was grounded.

As usual, you sopt nonsense, or ourrright lies to people who din't
know any better.


No, sorry, you are very mistaken...
Click to expand...


You sorry miss guided sole.



--
http://webpages.charter.net/jamie_5"
 
On 1/1/08 12:06 PM, in article 9%wej.35$7D6.6@newsfe05.lga, "Jamie"
<jamie_ka1lpa_not_valid_after_ka1lpa_@charter.net> wrote:

Michael A. Terrell wrote:

Jamie wrote:

Michael A. Terrell wrote:


Clint Sharp wrote:


In message <47789CC8.9A7D77AD@earthlink.net>, Michael A. Terrell
mike.terrell@earthlink.net> writes


ATX class computers are supposed to be unplugged when you work on
them, because of the +5 VDC power supply. Find another ground, or make a
cord using only the ground pin to plug into an outlet on your
workbench. My workbenches all have metal outlet boxes and covers, so
it's always easy to find a proper ground.


Switch the socket or PSU off (providing it has a physical switch on it,
not too many do anymore)? Or does the US not have switched mains
outlets?



Rarely. You can use a switched outlet strip, but for a workbench I
prefer a better grounding system. At my last job we ran #8 AWG bare,
solid copper wire (.12949" Dia.), along rows of benches. We bonded them
to the building's ground system, All joints were soldered, and tested
monthly


Soldering joints is not legal electrical codes. They must be clamped or
use of a legal connecting device like wire nuts, busbar, terminals etc..

Yeah I know, piss off.

--
"I'd rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal lobotomy"



That lobotomy removed any chance of clear thought on your part,
Jamie. A plant wide ESD abatement system has absolutely NOTHING to do
with the National Electrical Code. It was an entirely seperate system,
with cluster of benches connected to the building's steel skeliton, and
every support column was grounded.

As usual, you sopt nonsense, or ourrright lies to people who din't
know any better.


No, sorry, you are very mistaken...
Click to expand...
There you go spouting answers again without knowing anything about the
topic.

ESD is not a topic of the NEC. It isn't there, because it doesn't belong
there.

Don't bother posting a retort without an Article number of the NEC.

You sorry miss guided sole.
Click to expand...
That should be "You sorry misguided sole," unless you were addressing Miss
Guided, whom I do not know.

 
Jamie wrote:
No, sorry, you are very mistaken...
Click to expand...

Only in thinking that there is any hope for you to ever admit to your
vast, and unending ignorance.



You sorry miss guided sole.
Click to expand...


Really? Which foot are you talking about? The right one is always
swollen, from the diabetes, but it isn't really misguided.

You are definitely misguided, but I'm beginning to doubt that you
have a soul.



--
Service to my country? Been there, Done that, and I've got my DD214 to
prove it.
Member of DAV #85.

Michael A. Terrell
Central Florida
 
On Dec 30 2007, 11:27 pm, Buttered <buttered.fing...@gmail.com> wrote:
I have a question here. where would be the suggested spot to attach
the crocodile clip of an Electrostatic discharge (ESD) wrist strap. I
was thinking about attaching the crocodile clip to the exposed metal
of any electrical appliances such as my PC's power supply
Click to expand...
Because the PC might startup while you are working on it, the
usual recommendation (this from Apple) is to make a dummy power
cord that ONLY connects wallplug ground to the power socket, then
clip your ground strap to any grounded chassis part.

What I always did, was to grasp the chassis with my left hand while
I pulled the RAM stick out of the pouch with my right hand and
installed
it.

If it isn't a Macintosh, I understand that power-on is not something
that could happen under time/clock control, you'd have to
bump a switch. Is that still true?
 
Jamie wrote:
Michael A. Terrell wrote:

Clint Sharp wrote:

In message <47789CC8.9A7D77AD@earthlink.net>, Michael A. Terrell
mike.terrell@earthlink.net> writes

ATX class computers are supposed to be unplugged when you work on
them, because of the +5 VDC power supply. Find another ground, or
make a
cord using only the ground pin to plug into an outlet on your
workbench. My workbenches all have metal outlet boxes and covers, so
it's always easy to find a proper ground.


Switch the socket or PSU off (providing it has a physical switch on it,
not too many do anymore)? Or does the US not have switched mains
outlets?




Rarely. You can use a switched outlet strip, but for a workbench I
prefer a better grounding system. At my last job we ran #8 AWG bare,
solid copper wire (.12949" Dia.), along rows of benches. We bonded them
to the building's ground system, All joints were soldered, and tested
monthly


Soldering joints is not legal electrical codes.
Click to expand...
That is not true. Solder can be used:

From 2005 NEC 110.14 (B)
"Conductors shall be spliced or joined with splicing devices
identified for the use or by brazing, welding, or soldering
with a fusible metal or alloy. Soldered splices shall first
be spliced or joined so as to be mechanically and electrically
secure without solder and then be soldered."

There are specific cases where solder is prohibited by
the NEC, but except for those, it is is legal. Did
you have the specific cases in mind?

Ed

They must be clamped or
use of a legal connecting device like wire nuts, busbar, terminals etc..
Click to expand...


Yeah I know, piss off.
Click to expand...
 
On Dec 31 2007, 8:29 pm, Buttered <buttered.fing...@gmail.com> wrote:
Thank you guys for helping. Really appreciate all the infos given.
Have a great new year ahead.
Click to expand...
I don't see where your question was answered. The wrist strap
protects two ways. First, best protection is to discharge your body.
Charges exist between bottom of shoes and your body. Those charges
must be discharged. That means an electrical circuit. Damage occurs
because that discharge circuit is down arm and fingers, through
electronics, down table, into floor, and connected to bottom of
shoes. The wrist strap connects to something so that those charges
are connected to bottom of shoes before touching electronics.

Remember, many of the items you consider non-electrical conductors
are conductors to that static electric discharge current.

Second solution is to charge the electronics to same potential as
your body. Therefore a wrist strap connected to electronics chassis
equalizes voltages. Same is accomplished by touching the chassis
before touching electronics. If the chassis is connected to floor and
bottom of shoes, then while equalizing voltages, body is also
dischargee. Second solution can also do both solutions better. Some
will place a conductive plastic mat beneath the electronics connected
to another mat on floor (beneath shoes). Then the wrist strap
connected to table top conductive plastic makes a best wrist strap
protection.

Point is that wrist strap must do one (or even better, both) of two
solutions.
 
In message
<109ac527-f186-48cd-8e77-dd5dbfcca994@h11g2000prf.googlegroups.com>,
whit3rd <whit3rd@gmail.com> writes
On Dec 30 2007, 11:27 pm, Buttered <buttered.fing...@gmail.com> wrote:
If it isn't a Macintosh, I understand that power-on is not something
that could happen under time/clock control, you'd have to
bump a switch. Is that still true?
No. Not been true for some time, at least under BIOS control if not OS.
Click to expand...
Usually under the power management settings of the BIOS you can set an
on-time on a lot of machines. Excellent fun if you know that the user
has the PC in their bedroom.

--
Clint Sharp
 
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