What could possibly go wrong... ;)

"Traffic and transport infrastructure, ATMs, and environmental
infrastructure get green light to connect to nbn™ access network

NBN Co today announced that operators of traffic signals, automatic
teller machines and a range of other specialised devices can now
connect to select services over the nbn™ access network through their
retail service providers"

https://www.nbnco.com.au/corporate-information/media-centre/media-statements/network-extensions

 

[Dechucka]

On 28/09/2019 8:49 am, Je�us wrote:

"Traffic and transport infrastructure, ATMs, and environmental
infrastructure get green light to connect to nbn™ access network

NBN Co today announced that operators of traffic signals, automatic
teller machines and a range of other specialised devices can now
connect to select services over the nbn™ access network through their
retail service providers"

https://www.nbnco.com.au/corporate-information/media-centre/media-statements/network-extensions

I can't see - buffering, buffering, buffering - any problems. Of course
I don't know anything about the NBN because living 1/2 way between
Sydney and Canberra we are so isolated that we are only offered
satellite. If you've got kids at school or uni + want to run a business
and want to work during the day/peak hours it is useless because the
packs don't give enough data. ADSL rules OK (sometimes)

 

On Sat, 28 Sep 2019 08:56:42 +1000, Dechucka <Dechucka1@hotmail.com>
wrote:

On 28/09/2019 8:49 am, Je?us wrote:
"Traffic and transport infrastructure, ATMs, and environmental
infrastructure get green light to connect to nbn™ access network

NBN Co today announced that operators of traffic signals, automatic
teller machines and a range of other specialised devices can now
connect to select services over the nbn™ access network through their
retail service providers"

https://www.nbnco.com.au/corporate-information/media-centre/media-statements/network-extensions


I can't see - buffering, buffering, buffering - any problems.

Never mind when - not if - security becomes compromised by some bunch
of teenagers or foreign government.

Of course
I don't know anything about the NBN because living 1/2 way between
Sydney and Canberra we are so isolated that we are only offered
satellite.

Yes, we have NBN Skymuster back in Tassie. In truth, it's been quite
reliable. Had it since 2012 (I think). Although I've noticed speeds
and latency quality dropping lately.

If you've got kids at school or uni + want to run a business
and want to work during the day/peak hours it is useless because the
packs don't give enough data. ADSL rules OK (sometimes)

Sadly, that's the truth,

 

[Dechucka]

On 28/09/2019 9:14 am, Je�us wrote:

On Sat, 28 Sep 2019 08:56:42 +1000, Dechucka <Dechucka1@hotmail.com
wrote:

On 28/09/2019 8:49 am, Je?us wrote:
"Traffic and transport infrastructure, ATMs, and environmental
infrastructure get green light to connect to nbn™ access network

NBN Co today announced that operators of traffic signals, automatic
teller machines and a range of other specialised devices can now
connect to select services over the nbn™ access network through their
retail service providers"

https://www.nbnco.com.au/corporate-information/media-centre/media-statements/network-extensions


I can't see - buffering, buffering, buffering - any problems.

Never mind when - not if - security becomes compromised by some bunch
of teenagers or foreign government.

Or criminal gangs, I've watched the Italian Job (both the 1969 one,
British and excellent, and the 2003 version, American and crap) so know
what can happen if one controls the traffic lights

Getta Bloomin' Move On! (The Self Preservation Society)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=92Dqy3YWblQ

 

[Computer Nerd Kev]

In aus.electronics Je?us <j@j.net> wrote:

On Sat, 28 Sep 2019 08:56:42 +1000, Dechucka <Dechucka1@hotmail.com
wrote:
On 28/09/2019 8:49 am, Je?us wrote:
"Traffic and transport infrastructure, ATMs, and environmental
infrastructure get green light to connect to nbn? access network

https://www.nbnco.com.au/corporate-information/media-centre/media-statements/network-extensions

I can't see - buffering, buffering, buffering - any problems.

Never mind when - not if - security becomes compromised by some bunch
of teenagers or foreign government.

Already done in America:
https://www.csoonline.com/article/2466551/hacking-traffic-lights-with-a-laptop-is-easy.html

--
__ __
#_ < |\| |< _#

 

[Dechucka]

On 28/09/2019 10:56 am, news18 wrote:

On Sat, 28 Sep 2019 08:56:42 +1000, Dechucka wrote:

I can't see - buffering, buffering, buffering - any problems. Of course
I don't know anything about the NBN because living 1/2 way between
Sydney and Canberra we are so isolated that we are only offered
satellite.

As we were explaning to recent visitors from SW Wa; "No everyone in the
city did not get FTTH, they have the same crudy FTTN that you have."

You have access to NBN that works somewhat for you? You lucky lucky bastard

If you've got kids at school or uni + want to run a business
and want to work during the day/peak hours it is useless because the
packs don't give enough data.

ADSL rules OK (sometimes)
Yep. I have no current need for a higher service.

I'd love a better service when the kids are doing 'assignments', the
wife is on the Dept of Ed site and I want to watch porn, no no do work
>

 

[news18]

On Sat, 28 Sep 2019 09:23:21 +1000, Dechucka wrote:

Or criminal gangs, I've watched the Italian Job (both the 1969 one,
British and excellent, and the 2003 version, American and crap) so know
what can happen if one controls the traffic lights

Only the dumb and stupid. Why go to all that physical effort when you
can obtain greater returns from digital efforts.

 

[Wotawonderfulworld]

Dechucka <Dechucka1@hotmail.com> wrote in
news:M_GdnaNybZYwDhPAnZ2dnUU7-TnNnZ2d@westnet.com.au:

On 28/09/2019 8:49 am, Je�us wrote:
"Traffic and transport infrastructure, ATMs, and environmental
infrastructure get green light to connect to nbn™ access network

NBN Co today announced that operators of traffic signals, automatic
teller machines and a range of other specialised devices can now
connect to select services over the nbn™ access network through
their retail service providers"

https://www.nbnco.com.au/corporate-information/media-centre/media-stat
ements/network-extensions


I can't see - buffering, buffering, buffering - any problems. Of
course I don't know anything about the NBN because living 1/2 way
between Sydney and Canberra we are so isolated that we are only
offered satellite. If you've got kids at school or uni + want to run a
business and want to work during the day/peak hours it is useless
because the packs don't give enough data. ADSL rules OK (sometimes)

Ah you must be a neighbour. Same problem, I miss the old adsl, all you
could eat for $29.95 pm and it loaded a web page so much quicker than Sky
Muster can, and now i get 80gig for $74,95 a month. OOohh so lucky the NBN
came here.

 

[news18]

On Sat, 28 Sep 2019 08:56:42 +1000, Dechucka wrote:

I can't see - buffering, buffering, buffering - any problems. Of course
I don't know anything about the NBN because living 1/2 way between
Sydney and Canberra we are so isolated that we are only offered
satellite.

As we were explaning to recent visitors from SW Wa; "No everyone in the
city did not get FTTH, they have the same crudy FTTN that you have."

If you've got kids at school or uni + want to run a business
and want to work during the day/peak hours it is useless because the
packs don't give enough data.

ADSL rules OK (sometimes)
Yep. I have no current need for a higher service.

 

[news18]

On Sat, 28 Sep 2019 06:14:41 +0700, Jeßus wrote:

On Sat, 28 Sep 2019 08:56:42 +1000, Dechucka <Dechucka1@hotmail.com
wrote:

I can't see - buffering, buffering, buffering - any problems.

Never mind when - not if - security becomes compromised by some bunch
of teenagers or foreign government.

Old news that.

 

[Ned Latham]

Jeßus wrote:

"Traffic and transport infrastructure, ATMs, and environmental
infrastructure get green light to connect to nbn access network

NBN Co today announced that operators of traffic signals, automatic
teller machines and a range of other specialised devices can now
connect to select services over the nbn access network through their
retail service providers"

https://www.nbnco.com.au/corporate-information/media-centre/
media-statements/network-extensions

What indeed could go wrong.

Kinda depends on what software they're operating. Our banks, govt
depts, shops, supermarkets, travel operators, indeed just about
every enterprise in the nation use Microsoft systems; inherently
unstable, errorprone and insecure. These additions gonna be any
different?

Intruder heaven.

 

[Dechucka]

On 28/09/2019 11:05 am, Wotawonderfulworld wrote:

Dechucka <Dechucka1@hotmail.com> wrote in
news:M_GdnaNybZYwDhPAnZ2dnUU7-TnNnZ2d@westnet.com.au:

On 28/09/2019 8:49 am, Je�us wrote:
"Traffic and transport infrastructure, ATMs, and environmental
infrastructure get green light to connect to nbnâ„¢ access network

NBN Co today announced that operators of traffic signals, automatic
teller machines and a range of other specialised devices can now
connect to select services over the nbnâ„¢ access network through
their retail service providers"

https://www.nbnco.com.au/corporate-information/media-centre/media-stat
ements/network-extensions


I can't see - buffering, buffering, buffering - any problems. Of
course I don't know anything about the NBN because living 1/2 way
between Sydney and Canberra we are so isolated that we are only
offered satellite. If you've got kids at school or uni + want to run a
business and want to work during the day/peak hours it is useless
because the packs don't give enough data. ADSL rules OK (sometimes)


Ah you must be a neighbour. Same problem, I miss the old adsl, all you
could eat for $29.95 pm and it loaded a web page so much quicker than Sky
Muster can, and now i get 80gig for $74,95 a month. OOohh so lucky the NBN
came here.

How much of that is off-peak? There are lots of plans that offer 150 Gb
but when you look at them it is only 30Gb on peak. Even doing research
now most sites are hugely graphics heavy, most of them just pretty
corporate pictures, so it does take more download than it used to.
>

 

[Dechucka]

On 28/09/2019 10:53 am, news18 wrote:

On Sat, 28 Sep 2019 06:14:41 +0700, Jeßus wrote:

On Sat, 28 Sep 2019 08:56:42 +1000, Dechucka <Dechucka1@hotmail.com
wrote:

I can't see - buffering, buffering, buffering - any problems.

Never mind when - not if - security becomes compromised by some bunch
of teenagers or foreign government.

Old news that.

1969

 

[Sylvia Else]

On 28/09/2019 8:49 am, Je�us wrote:

"Traffic and transport infrastructure, ATMs, and environmental
infrastructure get green light to connect to nbn™ access network

NBN Co today announced that operators of traffic signals, automatic
teller machines and a range of other specialised devices can now
connect to select services over the nbn™ access network through their
retail service providers"

https://www.nbnco.com.au/corporate-information/media-centre/media-statements/network-extensions

In theory, this shouldn't present that much of an issue. Take traffic
lights, for example.

The expectation is that the basic rules of operation that ensure that
only one direction gets green, and defines the period that a light stays
yellow/orange, are built into the system hardware/firmware, with the
latter only capable of being modified on site.

With such a design, the most a hacker could achieve would be to change
the phasing, which might be disruptive, but wouldn't be unsafe.

We would never see the kind of thing shown in US TV/movies where a
hacker changes all the lights to green at the same time.

That's the theory.

The first inroad into that security is likely to be the ability to
update firmware remotely. It's convenient for sure, but it has risks.
One would like to assume that the replacement firmware is at least
cryptographically signed, but now mistakes creep in, with either the
signing key being stolen/leaked, or the algorithm itself being found to
be flawed. Or some idiot developer gets the verification wrong or just
fails to implement it, and that doesn't get discovered until a hacker
realises they can install updated firmware with any signature.

I doubt anyone would design the system so that the lights are directly
controlled remotely, because it would very quickly be discovered that
that doesn't work reliably. Depending on the level of incompetence
involved, that might be after some crashes, or just after some traffic jams.

The article mentions train line boom gates. I would be very surprised if
anyone thought it reasonable to control the gates that way. Most likely,
they're just talking about monitoring. The same is true for most other
things on the list.

All that said, I've found that it doesn't matter how low I set my
expectation of technological competence, there will be people in
positions where they can do damage who don't reach that level.

Sylvia.

 

On Sat, 28 Sep 2019 11:13:05 +1000, Dechucka <Dechucka1@hotmail.com>
wrote:

On 28/09/2019 11:05 am, Wotawonderfulworld wrote:

Ah you must be a neighbour. Same problem, I miss the old adsl, all you
could eat for $29.95 pm and it loaded a web page so much quicker than Sky
Muster can, and now i get 80gig for $74,95 a month. OOohh so lucky the NBN
came here.

How much of that is off-peak? There are lots of plans that offer 150 Gb
but when you look at them it is only 30Gb on peak.

Yes, that's the big catch. Plus, years ago they reduced the off-peak
hours by one hour. We have the NBN-SB-60-140 Plan @ 25 Mbps / 5 Mbps
with 60 GB / 140 GB Data Allowance plan for $60.

 

On Sat, 28 Sep 2019 09:23:21 +1000, Dechucka <Dechucka1@hotmail.com>
wrote:

On 28/09/2019 9:14 am, Je?us wrote:
On Sat, 28 Sep 2019 08:56:42 +1000, Dechucka <Dechucka1@hotmail.com
wrote:

On 28/09/2019 8:49 am, Je?us wrote:
"Traffic and transport infrastructure, ATMs, and environmental
infrastructure get green light to connect to nbn™ access network

NBN Co today announced that operators of traffic signals, automatic
teller machines and a range of other specialised devices can now
connect to select services over the nbn™ access network through their
retail service providers"

https://www.nbnco.com.au/corporate-information/media-centre/media-statements/network-extensions


I can't see - buffering, buffering, buffering - any problems.

Never mind when - not if - security becomes compromised by some bunch
of teenagers or foreign government.

Or criminal gangs, I've watched the Italian Job (both the 1969 one,
British and excellent, and the 2003 version, American and crap) so know
what can happen if one controls the traffic lights

Getta Bloomin' Move On! (The Self Preservation Society)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=92Dqy3YWblQ

'video unavailable'

 

On Fri, 27 Sep 2019 23:49:53 +0000 (UTC), not@telling.you.invalid
(Computer Nerd Kev) wrote:

In aus.electronics Je?us <j@j.net> wrote:
On Sat, 28 Sep 2019 08:56:42 +1000, Dechucka <Dechucka1@hotmail.com
wrote:
On 28/09/2019 8:49 am, Je?us wrote:
"Traffic and transport infrastructure, ATMs, and environmental
infrastructure get green light to connect to nbn? access network

https://www.nbnco.com.au/corporate-information/media-centre/media-statements/network-extensions

I can't see - buffering, buffering, buffering - any problems.

Never mind when - not if - security becomes compromised by some bunch
of teenagers or foreign government.

Already done in America:
https://www.csoonline.com/article/2466551/hacking-traffic-lights-with-a-laptop-is-easy.html

I'm not very surprised

 

On Fri, 27 Sep 2019 19:51:11 -0500, Ned Latham
<nedlatham@woden.valhalla.oz> wrote:

Jeßus wrote:

"Traffic and transport infrastructure, ATMs, and environmental
infrastructure get green light to connect to nbn access network

NBN Co today announced that operators of traffic signals, automatic
teller machines and a range of other specialised devices can now
connect to select services over the nbn access network through their
retail service providers"

https://www.nbnco.com.au/corporate-information/media-centre/
media-statements/network-extensions

What indeed could go wrong.

Kinda depends on what software they're operating. Our banks, govt
depts, shops, supermarkets, travel operators, indeed just about
every enterprise in the nation use Microsoft systems; inherently
unstable, errorprone and insecure. These additions gonna be any
different?

Intruder heaven.

Let's not even mention https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stuxnet

 

[Dechucka]

On 28/09/2019 4:38 pm, Je�us wrote:

On Sat, 28 Sep 2019 09:23:21 +1000, Dechucka <Dechucka1@hotmail.com
wrote:

On 28/09/2019 9:14 am, Je?us wrote:
On Sat, 28 Sep 2019 08:56:42 +1000, Dechucka <Dechucka1@hotmail.com
wrote:

On 28/09/2019 8:49 am, Je?us wrote:
"Traffic and transport infrastructure, ATMs, and environmental
infrastructure get green light to connect to nbn™ access network

NBN Co today announced that operators of traffic signals, automatic
teller machines and a range of other specialised devices can now
connect to select services over the nbn™ access network through their
retail service providers"

https://www.nbnco.com.au/corporate-information/media-centre/media-statements/network-extensions


I can't see - buffering, buffering, buffering - any problems.

Never mind when - not if - security becomes compromised by some bunch
of teenagers or foreign government.

Or criminal gangs, I've watched the Italian Job (both the 1969 one,
British and excellent, and the 2003 version, American and crap) so know
what can happen if one controls the traffic lights

Getta Bloomin' Move On! (The Self Preservation Society)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=92Dqy3YWblQ

'video unavailable'

You missed out on a great movie song
>

 

On Sat, 28 Sep 2019 12:31:42 +1000, Sylvia Else <sylvia@email.invalid>
wrote:

On 28/09/2019 8:49 am, Je?us wrote:
"Traffic and transport infrastructure, ATMs, and environmental
infrastructure get green light to connect to nbn™ access network

NBN Co today announced that operators of traffic signals, automatic
teller machines and a range of other specialised devices can now
connect to select services over the nbn™ access network through their
retail service providers"

https://www.nbnco.com.au/corporate-information/media-centre/media-statements/network-extensions


In theory, this shouldn't present that much of an issue. Take traffic
lights, for example.

The expectation is that the basic rules of operation that ensure that
only one direction gets green, and defines the period that a light stays
yellow/orange, are built into the system hardware/firmware, with the
latter only capable of being modified on site.

With such a design, the most a hacker could achieve would be to change
the phasing, which might be disruptive, but wouldn't be unsafe.

We would never see the kind of thing shown in US TV/movies where a
hacker changes all the lights to green at the same time.

That's the theory.

The first inroad into that security is likely to be the ability to
update firmware remotely. It's convenient for sure, but it has risks.
One would like to assume that the replacement firmware is at least
cryptographically signed, but now mistakes creep in, with either the
signing key being stolen/leaked, or the algorithm itself being found to
be flawed. Or some idiot developer gets the verification wrong or just
fails to implement it, and that doesn't get discovered until a hacker
realises they can install updated firmware with any signature.

I doubt anyone would design the system so that the lights are directly
controlled remotely, because it would very quickly be discovered that
that doesn't work reliably. Depending on the level of incompetence
involved, that might be after some crashes, or just after some traffic jams.

The article mentions train line boom gates. I would be very surprised if
anyone thought it reasonable to control the gates that way. Most likely,
they're just talking about monitoring. The same is true for most other
things on the list.

All that said, I've found that it doesn't matter how low I set my
expectation of technological competence, there will be people in
positions where they can do damage who don't reach that level.

Yes, all very true. No accounting for human error and inovation.