Turntable feedback from nearby speaker

It does not matter if the speaker is in phase or not, it matters what
the phase of the soundwave when it hits the record a little later. "

Of course it does. That is why there is a difference.

In a given installation the way the timing is and the most prevalent feedback frequencies could result in it resonating at say, 3Khz, which is not so hard to deal with. In the opposite phase it may resonate at 65 Hz, which is ALOT harder to deal with.

Been there done that. thisis why I took the opportunity to stick it up Allison's ass, just because. Because he loves to do it to other people.

I am still waiting for the oscillarot with negative instead of positive feedback. I got all the reponse of an Israeli government official when asked about the kill ratio on the Palestinians.

Motherfuckers spout shit out, and then can't even come bvack and say they were wrong with dignity. They hide. Fukum.

Fuck all this. It's too nice a day.

I have PERSONAL EXPERIENCE THAT IT DOES MAKE A DIFFERENCE, and that Turet's Symdrome motherfucker can either come out and say he was wrong or make moreof an ass out of himself trying to insult me, which is impossible because unless I have respect for the insulter, I have no respect for the insult.

 

On Wednesday, December 18, 2013 8:10:39 PM UTC-5, captainvi...@gmail.com wrote:
> I've just gotten finished, (or so I thought) upgrading and servicing all the equipment in my entertainment center. I just replaced my mediocre speakers with a pair of nice 12 inch JBL's that were abandoned in the building we just bought. My turntable is an old Thorens belt drive, supported with a spring arrangement that I thought would absorb any vibration. The turntable is in a cabinet about a foot off the floor and right next to the left channel speaker. If I crank up the volume when listening to a record there is distortion, the severity directly proportional to the increase in volume. At first I wasn't certain about this but you can actually "feel" the vibrations on the turntable base. There are these springs supporting the platter and arm and these springs are "stuffed" with a foam material but this vibration is coming through anyway. I know that one solution is to relocate the speaker however the room is not large enough to do this. I was thinking of putting foam under the speaker which would be easy and perhaps even a soft foam block under the turntable as well but I'm afraid that trying to support and level a turntable supported like this could be a nightmare. Does anyone have any ideas? Thanks, Lenny

I have a question for Phil. As I had mentioned earlier there are soft foam rubber inserts inside the three coil suspension springs on my turntable. You had mentioned to remove these. I am going to try that but haven't had a chance to try this yet, but why did they put that foam in there in the first place? Lenny

 

Why Phil ?

/the spongie things are to keep the coils of the spring from resonating, remember resonance ?

 

BTW, removing the foam is not a good idea.

 

[William Sommerwerck]

wrote in message news:82eef806-249d-47b4-a4b9-ff11770c0c90@googlegroups.com...

> BTW, removing the foam is not a good idea.

Correct. It provides damping.

 

[Phil Allison]

"William Sommerwanker = Fuckwit Idiot "

BTW, removing the foam is not a good idea.

Correct. It provides damping.

** Which is not wanted in this case.

FOAD you stinking moron.

 

[amdx]

On 12/19/2013 9:54 AM, William Sommerwerck wrote:

wrote in message
news:527518ff-54ad-43e6-9915-dfcbec6b014b@googlegroups.com...

The turntable is in a cabinet about a foot off the floor
and right next to the left channel speaker.

I'm reminded of the old joke

Well, if you're going to go there,
He needs some noise cancelling speakers, that cancel
at the turntable.
Mikek

 

[dave]

On 12/25/2013 03:34 PM, Phil Allison wrote:

"William Sommerwanker = Fuckwit Idiot"

BTW, removing the foam is not a good idea.

Correct. It provides damping.


** Which is not wanted in this case.

FOAD you stinking moron.

Why not fly the speakers? If you can't fly the speakers, why not fly the
turntable? What is the construction of the room? Slab? Wood over crawl
space? Is there foot traffic above? Can't fly the turntable. You want
the speakers somewhere other than the same floor as the turntables. Did
you try the "rumble" (infrasonic) filter? Did you try swapping left with
right at the TT preamp?

 

[Phil Allison]

"dave"

Why not fly the speakers?

** IT MAKES NO DIFFERENCE !!




.... Phil

 

[William Sommerwerck]

I have one of the following. In fact I suggested the name to the manufacturer
(or encouraged him to keep the name, I forget which).

http://www.head-fi.org/t/408141/sold-arcici-lead-balloon-turntable-stand-rare

https://www.google.com/search?q=lead+balloon+turntable+stand&rlz=1T4NDKB_enUS510US510&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=u0fBUravDpPjoATFt4LABA&ved=0CFYQsAQ&biw=1607&bih=1060

It sits next to the left-rear speaker, and I have no problems.
(Qualification... My speakers are planar dipoles, and the stand is not far
from the lateral null.)

 

[gregz]

dave <ricketzz@earthlink.net> wrote:

On 12/25/2013 03:34 PM, Phil Allison wrote:

"William Sommerwanker = Fuckwit Idiot"

BTW, removing the foam is not a good idea.

Correct. It provides damping.


** Which is not wanted in this case.

FOAD you stinking moron.





Why not fly the speakers? If you can't fly the speakers, why not fly the
turntable? What is the construction of the room? Slab? Wood over crawl
space? Is there foot traffic above? Can't fly the turntable. You want the
speakers somewhere other than the same floor as the turntables. Did you
try the "rumble" (infrasonic) filter? Did you try swapping left with
right at the TT preamp?

You seem to be assuming mechanical vibration through mass is the problem,
and not the air vibration.

Greg

 

[dave]

On 12/29/2013 03:04 PM, Phil Allison wrote:

"dave"


Why not fly the speakers?

** IT MAKES NO DIFFERENCE !!




... Phil

How many discoteques have you built, Phil?

 

[Phil Allison]

"dave"
Phil Allison wrote:

"dave"


Why not fly the speakers?

** IT MAKES NO DIFFERENCE !!



How many discoteques have you built, Phil?

** I used to build custom disco consoles for a living and designed and
prototyped a disco mixer that went into production.

For a long time, most of my customers were in the disco hire business, now
only few are.

But there is not much similarity between disco and home stereo systems -
which I have huge experience with.

And YOU seem to have no experience or knowledge of either.

So go fuck yourself - cunthead.



..... Phil

 

[Maynard A. Philbrook Jr.]

In article <bief0hFge2aU1@mid.individual.net>, phil_a@tpg.com.au says...

"dave"
Phil Allison wrote:
"dave"


Why not fly the speakers?

** IT MAKES NO DIFFERENCE !!



How many discoteques have you built, Phil?


** I used to build custom disco consoles for a living and designed and
prototyped a disco mixer that went into production.

For a long time, most of my customers were in the disco hire business, now
only few are.

But there is not much similarity between disco and home stereo systems -
which I have huge experience with.

And YOU seem to have no experience or knowledge of either.

So go fuck yourself - cunthead.

Yeah, what Phil says, pubic hair!

Jamie

 

[dave]

On 12/30/2013 03:47 PM, Phil Allison wrote:

"dave"
Phil Allison wrote:
"dave"


Why not fly the speakers?

** IT MAKES NO DIFFERENCE !!



How many discoteques have you built, Phil?


** I used to build custom disco consoles for a living and designed and
prototyped a disco mixer that went into production.

For a long time, most of my customers were in the disco hire business, now
only few are.

But there is not much similarity between disco and home stereo systems -
which I have huge experience with.

And YOU seem to have no experience or knowledge of either.

So go fuck yourself - cunthead.



.... Phil

He says to the man who for years would seek out a living room with a
concrete floor so I can play my vinyl louder.

Decoupling the speaker from the phono cartridge at the natural resonant
frequency of the system is essential. Usually this frequency is lower
than the LF cutoff off the transducer/cabinet making sound so the LF
feedback transmission mode is through objects more solid than air. If
both speakers and TT are on a giant cement slab with great mass, nothing
vibrates except the speaker cones in the air and the stylus.

If the floor is wood over joists the room turns into a giant sounding
board. Vibrations from the speakers easily overcome the damping
mechanism in the turntable and the speaker cones start flapping in
unnatural efforts to reproduce the infrasonic.

I have never turned up the gain enough to make the stylus feedback in
free air; it is almost always a mechanical path. Speaker to floor. Floor
to turntable. Floors also couple to walls, walls to the ceiling; but
there is enough attenuation in this mechanical path to allow the damping
in the turntable base to take care of the residual vibrations.

You can hang the speakers (I have flown many L-100, Century 100, etc.
JBL monitors in just this fashion) or you can hang the turntable (weird,
but very doable and a must in houses where people walking can make the
needle jump.)

In commercial applications too numerous to mention I have left a trail
of weird fixes (and several tons of bagged Redy-Mix concrete) in my wake.

Now, being the "cunt head" that I am, off to go fuck myself. You should too.

 

[Phil Allison]

"dave the fuckwit troll"

** You are a complete fool and a damn liar - dave.

He says to the man who for years would seek out a living room with a
concrete floor so I can play my vinyl louder.

** Lie #1

Rooms with concrete floors can still have BIG problems with TT feedback at
low frequencies.

Decoupling the speaker from the phono cartridge at the natural resonant
frequency of the system is essential. Usually this frequency is lower
than the LF cutoff off the transducer/cabinet making sound so the LF
feedback transmission mode is through objects more solid than air. If both
speakers and TT are on a giant cement slab with great mass, nothing
vibrates except the speaker cones in the air and the stylus.

** Total pack of stupid lies.

If the floor is wood over joists the room turns into a giant sounding
board. Vibrations from the speakers easily overcome the damping mechanism
in the turntable and the speaker cones start flapping in unnatural efforts
to reproduce the infrasonic.

** More stupid lies.

TT feedback is not subsonic, it is audio frequency and is due to sound
pressure induced vibrations in the room's structure.

I have never turned up the gain enough to make the stylus feedback in free
air;

** HUH ???

Not even resting on the record?

it is almost always a mechanical path. Speaker to floor. Floor to
turntable. Floors also couple to walls, walls to the ceiling; but there is
enough attenuation in this mechanical path to allow the damping in the
turntable base to take care of the residual vibrations.

** More total crap.


> You can hang the speakers ....

** Has no effect on TT feedback - you lying asshole.

In commercial applications too numerous to mention I have left a trail of
weird fixes (and several tons of bagged Redy-Mix concrete) in my wake.

** And all along, the only thing that was ever needed was a few coil springs
under the TT. .

Now, being the "cunt head" that I am, off to go fuck myself.

** ROTFL !!

You have been totally FUCKED for the whole of you miserable life - asshole
..

Cos you were a genetic mental retard from birth.



..... Phil

 

[dave]

On 01/01/2014 02:36 PM, Phil Allison wrote:

"dave the fuckwit troll"

** You are a complete fool and a damn liar - dave.

He says to the man who for years would seek out a living room with a
concrete floor so I can play my vinyl louder.

** Lie #1

Rooms with concrete floors can still have BIG problems with TT feedback at
low frequencies.


Decoupling the speaker from the phono cartridge at the natural resonant
frequency of the system is essential. Usually this frequency is lower
than the LF cutoff off the transducer/cabinet making sound so the LF
feedback transmission mode is through objects more solid than air. If both
speakers and TT are on a giant cement slab with great mass, nothing
vibrates except the speaker cones in the air and the stylus.

** Total pack of stupid lies.


If the floor is wood over joists the room turns into a giant sounding
board. Vibrations from the speakers easily overcome the damping mechanism
in the turntable and the speaker cones start flapping in unnatural efforts
to reproduce the infrasonic.

** More stupid lies.

TT feedback is not subsonic, it is audio frequency and is due to sound
pressure induced vibrations in the room's structure.


I have never turned up the gain enough to make the stylus feedback in free
air;

** HUH ???

Not even resting on the record?

Not with a Pair of L-100s

it is almost always a mechanical path. Speaker to floor. Floor to
turntable. Floors also couple to walls, walls to the ceiling; but there is
enough attenuation in this mechanical path to allow the damping in the
turntable base to take care of the residual vibrations.

** More total crap.


You can hang the speakers ....

** Has no effect on TT feedback - you lying asshole.


In commercial applications too numerous to mention I have left a trail of
weird fixes (and several tons of bagged Redy-Mix concrete) in my wake.

** And all along, the only thing that was ever needed was a few coil springs
under the TT. .


Now, being the "cunt head" that I am, off to go fuck myself.


** ROTFL !!

You have been totally FUCKED for the whole of you miserable life - asshole
.

Cos you were a genetic mental retard from birth.



.... Phil

 

[dave]

On 01/01/2014 02:36 PM, Phil Allison wrote:

"dave the fuckwit troll"

** You are a complete fool and a damn liar - dave.

He says to the man who for years would seek out a living room with a
concrete floor so I can play my vinyl louder.

** Lie #1

Rooms with concrete floors can still have BIG problems with TT feedback at
low frequencies.


Decoupling the speaker from the phono cartridge at the natural resonant
frequency of the system is essential. Usually this frequency is lower
than the LF cutoff off the transducer/cabinet making sound so the LF
feedback transmission mode is through objects more solid than air. If both
speakers and TT are on a giant cement slab with great mass, nothing
vibrates except the speaker cones in the air and the stylus.

** Total pack of stupid lies.


If the floor is wood over joists the room turns into a giant sounding
board. Vibrations from the speakers easily overcome the damping mechanism
in the turntable and the speaker cones start flapping in unnatural efforts
to reproduce the infrasonic.

** More stupid lies.

TT feedback is not subsonic, it is audio frequency and is due to sound
pressure induced vibrations in the room's structure.

How does the vibration get from the structure to the cantilever?

I have never turned up the gain enough to make the stylus feedback in free
air;

** HUH ???

Not even resting on the record?

Not with JBL L-100s

it is almost always a mechanical path. Speaker to floor. Floor to
turntable. Floors also couple to walls, walls to the ceiling; but there is
enough attenuation in this mechanical path to allow the damping in the
turntable base to take care of the residual vibrations.

** More total crap.

If you look at attenuation in free air v attenuation of dry building
materials youd see that 99% of energy reaching the plattenspieler is via
solid pathways.

You can hang the speakers ....

** Has no effect on TT feedback - you lying asshole.


In commercial applications too numerous to mention I have left a trail of
weird fixes (and several tons of bagged Redy-Mix concrete) in my wake.

** And all along, the only thing that was ever needed was a few coil springs
under the TT. .

oh do show us..

Now, being the "cunt head" that I am, off to go fuck myself.


** ROTFL !!

You have been totally FUCKED for the whole of you miserable life - asshole
.

Cos you were a genetic mental retard from birth.

I was indeed born autistic. It is a lifelong condition that never gets
better. Thanks for the kind words, as always (X)Your old pal Dave.

 

[Phil Allison]

"dave" <ricketzz@earthlink.net>

** ROTFL !!

You have been totally FUCKED for the whole of you miserable life -
asshole.

Cos you were a genetic mental retard from birth.

I was indeed born autistic.

** Finally you admit it.

That single, totally condemning fact wipes you out.




.... Phil