The hidden digital roadblock that\'s keeping green electricity off the U.S. grid...

[Anthony William Sloman]

On Monday, September 11, 2023 at 10:52:15 PM UTC+10, John Larkin wrote:

On Mon, 11 Sep 2023 04:51:19 GMT, Jan Panteltje <al...@comet.invalid> wrote:
On a sunny day (Sun, 10 Sep 2023 10:59:15 -0700) it happened John Larkin <jjla...@highlandtechnology.com> wrote in <vn0sfih7c67lclag8...@4ax.com>:
On Sun, 10 Sep 2023 08:25:51 -0700 (PDT), Fred Bloggs <bloggs.fred...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Sunday, September 10, 2023 at 11:10:38?AM UTC-4, John Larkin wrote:
On Sun, 10 Sep 2023 11:00:16 GMT, Jan Panteltje <al...@comet.invalid> wrote:
On a sunny day (Sun, 10 Sep 2023 02:13:20 -0700 (PDT)) it happened whit3rd <whi...@gmail.com> wrote in <69d0aff2-0b51-4f79...@googlegroups.com>:
On Saturday, September 9, 2023 at 8:15:09?AM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:

<snip>

> Google Street View is interesting. In Russia, China, Germany, basically everywhere you look, there\'s a lot of English signage and American stuff.

John Larkin doesn\'t process the signs that aren\'t in English, and doesn\'t notice then\\m.

> And of course most places have lots of US-style housing and buildings and hotels and SUVs. The American Empire is cultural, not military.

More commercial that cultural. If you want mass-produced junk, American did it first

> Most Germans speak pretty good English. Lots of Russians speak English; few Americans speak German or Russian.

Quite a few Americans speak Spanish. It\'s a much a mater of finding people to practice your language skills on as anything else. My Dutch is much better than my German, French or Russian (and my Russian was never up to much).

I think English signage is illegal in France.
The couple next door are Romanian and Bulgarian and talk to one another in English.

One of chemists I knew as kid was a Norwegian married to a German wife (whom he\'d met when he was part of the occupying army in Germany in the late 1940\'s). The common language was French. Their kid was quadrilingual when he was smal. I\'ve no idea how much of it stayed with him.

I work with a largish Dutch company and all the folks that I\'ve met speak good English. Ditto some French companies.
AfD-Parteichefin Weidel hat im ARD-Sommerinterview die Ampel scharf kritisiert:
Sie stehe zu der Aussage, \"dass diese Regierung idiotisch handelt\".
Die Ampel-Regierung mache \"Politik gegen die Mehrheit der Menschen,
die zurück zur Kernkraft will, die gegen das Verbrennermotor-Verbot ist\".

You know, I agree with that statement!!!

Basically it says that the current German government is against the people who want nuclear power and normal petrol cars.
So whatever way you want to look at it, the dirty US war mongering in Ukraine stirs up ultra right in Germany and the rest of Europe.
As does the climate crap.

A bunch of European countries are supporting Ukraine in this war.

They aren\'t a silly as Jan Panteltje.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

 

[boB]

rOn Sun, 10 Sep 2023 04:23:59 -0700 (PDT), Anthony William Sloman
<bill.sloman@ieee.org> wrote:

On Sunday, September 10, 2023 at 6:18:39?PM UTC+10, boB wrote:
On Sat, 9 Sep 2023 08:39:04 -0700 (PDT), Anthony William Sloman
bill....@ieee.org> wrote:
On Saturday, September 9, 2023 at 9:54:01?PM UTC+10, boB wrote:
On Fri, 8 Sep 2023 21:40:50 -0700 (PDT), Anthony William Sloman
bill....@ieee.org> wrote:
On Saturday, September 9, 2023 at 7:52:34?AM UTC+10, John Larkin wrote:
On Fri, 8 Sep 2023 14:05:31 -0700 (PDT), Fred Bloggs
bloggs.fred...@gmail.com> wrote:

Looks like conversion to renewables is about 10% of what it could be if the big corporate energy concerns applied for temporary rate increases to pay for the build-out. Some of the do, some of them don\'t. A lot of them don\'t want to do this because it entails a detailed audit of their finances. Seems appropriate the people who are using all this energy should pay for the required infrastructure.

https://www.science.org/content/article/hidden-digital-roadblock-keeping-green-electricity-u-s-grid

The scheme about measuring the wind to calculate a new capacity for the line based on the increased heat dissipation effect is garbage.

\"the U.S. goal of eliminating all planet-warming carbon emissions\" is absurd, given that China is building a couple of coal-powered plants per week, and India and Africa will catch up.

The absurdity is all in John Larkin\'s blinkered point of view.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electricity_sector_in_China

China is still building coal-fired power plants, but it is building wind farms and solar farms with a lot more enthusiasm. Thermal power went up by 4.7% from 2019 to 2020, wind power went up by 34.6% and solar power went up by 24.1%., The renewables are starting from a lower base but they added more wind power (71,670 MW.hr) than thermal power (56,370 MW.hr ) and almost as much solar power (48,200 MW.hr),.

India and Africa are doing the same sums, and wind and solar are both cheaper and more modular routes to more electric power.

I shifted boBs reaction down to where he should have posted it.

From Wikipedia...

\"Most of the electricity in China comes from coal, which accounted for
62% of the electricity generation mix in 2021\"

I hope they ARE enthusiastic enough before it is too late ?

From Wikipedia again...
\"China has abundant energy with the world\'s fourth-largest coal
reserves and massive hydroelectric resources.\"

Of course that\'s all from the Wikipedia link that I posted, but ignores the data I pulled from it to make the point that China is moving it electricity generation from coal to renewables. which boB hadn\'t bothered to read.

Why do I still see and sometimes have to still stop for coal trains = here north of Seattle where I know it is going to China ?

Maybe China can\'t dig enough of their own coal ?

If you weren\'t quite so enthusiastic about confirming your own prejudices, you might be able to realise that China is moving it\'s electricity generation away from burning coal. They are aware that burning coal does have unfortunate side effects, and that the electricity you produce that way is more expensive than you get from renewable sources.

I know myself. Maybe you should look into your own prejudices as
well.

China is still buying coal from the US.

You are making the same mistake as John Larkin, and seem equally unwilling to correct your opinions.

I would really love to believe China is doing the right thing, and maybe they really are moving as fast as you or Wikipedia says they are. I hope the data in that article is trustworthy.

Wikipedia does make an effort to get their articles right. National statistics on energy production tend to be pretty reliable. If you don\'t trust that data, do try to find something more reliable.

Yes, I know they try and I also try to help Wikipedia personally when
I see something wrong. But the CCP MAY just have a bit of influence
on the accuracy. No idea how much, but I know Wiki tries, as they
should, to keep it accurate.

China really is making 80% of all the solar cells being manufactured all around the world at the moment, and they had to invest a lot of money in manufacturing at ten times the scale that anybody else had. This did let them halve the unit price and dominate the market, so it was a profitable investment.

And they should keep making cells for cheap while we try to have some
kind of backup at some price of course.

The rest of the world isn\'t going to be able to do without China and
China needs our sales, too. The CCP subsidises these markets which is
fine by me if they do a good job, which it looks like they certainly
do.

I am in the renewable energy business BTW, but these types of facts and figures aren\'t part of my work. I like Chinese but the CCP really tries to hide truth.

The CCP isn\'t candid, but in this area they don\'t seem to have anything to hide. Their don\'t have a lot of spare food production capacity, and climate change could well leave them in famine.

The CCP is trying to hide things from others and their own people. I\"m
sure you must know this ? Don\'t hide your head in the sand, if you
do....

I\'m just done trying to predict the future... I need to retire and then maybe I can pay better attention.

Nobody is asking you to predict the future, but it would be nice if you were more careful about what you say about the present.

God help us all.

Not a policy that works all that well. People that look after themselves and their environment do seem to do better than those who rely on God to do it for therm.

And how well is man doing at all of this ? Pull out all of the stops
while also believing we can make the right changes and both may help.

If you don\'t believe you can help, then why even try ?

 

[Anthony William Sloman]

On Tuesday, September 12, 2023 at 8:20:23 AM UTC+10, boB wrote:

rOn Sun, 10 Sep 2023 04:23:59 -0700 (PDT), Anthony William Sloman
bill....@ieee.org> wrote:
On Sunday, September 10, 2023 at 6:18:39?PM UTC+10, boB wrote:
On Sat, 9 Sep 2023 08:39:04 -0700 (PDT), Anthony William Sloman
bill....@ieee.org> wrote:
On Saturday, September 9, 2023 at 9:54:01?PM UTC+10, boB wrote:
On Fri, 8 Sep 2023 21:40:50 -0700 (PDT), Anthony William Sloman
bill....@ieee.org> wrote:
On Saturday, September 9, 2023 at 7:52:34?AM UTC+10, John Larkin wrote:
On Fri, 8 Sep 2023 14:05:31 -0700 (PDT), Fred Bloggs
bloggs.fred...@gmail.com> wrote:

Looks like conversion to renewables is about 10% of what it could be if the big corporate energy concerns applied for temporary rate increases to pay for the build-out. Some of the do, some of them don\'t. A lot of them don\'t want to do this because it entails a detailed audit of their finances. Seems appropriate the people who are using all this energy should pay for the required infrastructure.

https://www.science.org/content/article/hidden-digital-roadblock-keeping-green-electricity-u-s-grid

The scheme about measuring the wind to calculate a new capacity for the line based on the increased heat dissipation effect is garbage.

\"the U.S. goal of eliminating all planet-warming carbon emissions\" is absurd, given that China is building a couple of coal-powered plants per week, and India and Africa will catch up.

The absurdity is all in John Larkin\'s blinkered point of view.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electricity_sector_in_China

China is still building coal-fired power plants, but it is building wind farms and solar farms with a lot more enthusiasm. Thermal power went up by 4.7% from 2019 to 2020, wind power went up by 34.6% and solar power went up by 24.1%., The renewables are starting from a lower base but they added more wind power (71,670 MW.hr) than thermal power (56,370 MW.hr ) and almost as much solar power (48,200 MW.hr),.

India and Africa are doing the same sums, and wind and solar are both cheaper and more modular routes to more electric power.

I shifted boBs reaction down to where he should have posted it.

From Wikipedia...

\"Most of the electricity in China comes from coal, which accounted for
62% of the electricity generation mix in 2021\"

I hope they ARE enthusiastic enough before it is too late ?

From Wikipedia again...
\"China has abundant energy with the world\'s fourth-largest coal
reserves and massive hydroelectric resources.\"

Of course that\'s all from the Wikipedia link that I posted, but ignores the data I pulled from it to make the point that China is moving it electricity generation from coal to renewables. which boB hadn\'t bothered to read.

Why do I still see and sometimes have to still stop for coal trains = here north of Seattle where I know it is going to China ?

Maybe China can\'t dig enough of their own coal ?

If you weren\'t quite so enthusiastic about confirming your own prejudices, you might be able to realise that China is moving it\'s electricity generation away from burning coal. They are aware that burning coal does have unfortunate side effects, and that the electricity you produce that way is more expensive than you get from renewable sources.

I know myself. Maybe you should look into your own prejudices as well.

I do worry about them, but since they mainly motivate me to find reliable information so I don\'t look like an idiot, they probably aren\'t a problem here.

> China is still buying coal from the US.

And Australia. They do manufacture a lot of stuff and they do have to keep the production lines rolling.

You are making the same mistake as John Larkin, and seem equally unwilling to correct your opinions.

I would really love to believe China is doing the right thing, and maybe they really are moving as fast as you or Wikipedia says they are. I hope the data in that article is trustworthy.

Wikipedia does make an effort to get their articles right. National statistics on energy production tend to be pretty reliable. If you don\'t trust that data, do try to find something more reliable.

Yes, I know they try and I also try to help Wikipedia personally when I see something wrong. But the CCP MAY just have a bit of influence on the accuracy. No idea how much, but I know Wiki tries, as they should, to keep it accurate.

Energy statistics are part of the national economy and the Chinese national economy interacts with the rest of the world on a very large scale.

China really is making 80% of all the solar cells being manufactured all around the world at the moment, and they had to invest a lot of money in manufacturing at ten times the scale that anybody else had. This did let them halve the unit price and dominate the market, so it was a profitable investment.

And they should keep making cells for cheap while we try to have some kind of backup at some price of course.

There\'s nothing to stop anybody else pulling the same trick - if they can put together the mass of capital required. If they spent enough to manufacture on an even larger scale they could undercut the Chineses plants and make them a whole lot less profitable - which is what China did to the German solar cell industry.

> The rest of the world isn\'t going to be able to do without China and China needs our sales, too. The CCP subsidises these markets which is fine by me if they do a good job, which it looks like they certainly do.

The Chinese chose to mass produce a superior solar cell invented at the University of NSW

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martin_Green_(professor)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stuart_Wenham

I am in the renewable energy business BTW, but these types of facts and figures aren\'t part of my work. I like Chinese but the CCP really tries to hide truth.

The CCP isn\'t candid, but in this area they don\'t seem to have anything to hide. Their don\'t have a lot of spare food production capacity, and climate change could well leave them in famine.

The CCP is trying to hide things from others and their own people. I\"m sure you must know this ? Don\'t hide your head in the sand, if you do....

The CCP is a government, and governments always try to hide stuff, and rarely succeed.

I\'m just done trying to predict the future... I need to retire and then maybe I can pay better attention.

Nobody is asking you to predict the future, but it would be nice if you were more careful about what you say about the present.

God help us all.

Not a policy that works all that well. People that look after themselves and their environment do seem to do better than those who rely on God to do it for therm.

And how well is man doing at all of this ? Pull out all of the stops while also believing we can make the right changes and both may help.

If you don\'t believe you can help, then why even try?

I believe that the little I can do can help, even if it is only correcting some silly ideas and the occasional foolish misconception.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

 

[Anthony William Sloman]

On Tuesday, September 12, 2023 at 9:10:30 AM UTC+10, Fred Bloggs wrote:

On Monday, September 11, 2023 at 10:40:24 AM UTC-4, John Larkin wrote:
On Mon, 11 Sep 2023 07:10:15 -0700 (PDT), Fred Bloggs <bloggs.fred...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, September 11, 2023 at 8:52:15?AM UTC-4, John Larkin wrote:
On Mon, 11 Sep 2023 04:51:19 GMT, Jan Panteltje <al...@comet.invalid> wrote:
On a sunny day (Sun, 10 Sep 2023 10:59:15 -0700) it happened John Larkin <jjla...@highlandtechnology.com> wrote in <vn0sfih7c67lclag8...@4ax.com>:
On Sun, 10 Sep 2023 08:25:51 -0700 (PDT), Fred Bloggs <bloggs.fred....@gmail.com> wrote:
On Sunday, September 10, 2023 at 11:10:38?AM UTC-4, John Larkin wrote:
On Sun, 10 Sep 2023 11:00:16 GMT, Jan Panteltje <al...@comet.invalid> wrote:
On a sunny day (Sun, 10 Sep 2023 02:13:20 -0700 (PDT)) it happened whit3rd <whi...@gmail.com> wrote in <69d0aff2-0b51-4f79...@googlegroups.com>:
On Saturday, September 9, 2023 at 8:15:09?AM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:

<snip>

Well, I spent a month in the USSR, including sleeping a time or two in
one of those giant ugly apartment blocks, and lots of people spoke
English. Now, probably more do.

Have you been to Russia?

That \'bunch\' of people were KGB. Every single interface you had was carefully orchestrated. You were being interviewed.

This is John Larkin. They wouldn\'t have bothered.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

 

[boB]

On Mon, 11 Sep 2023 23:47:38 -0700 (PDT), Anthony William Sloman
<bill.sloman@ieee.org> wrote:

On Tuesday, September 12, 2023 at 8:20:23?AM UTC+10, boB wrote:
rOn Sun, 10 Sep 2023 04:23:59 -0700 (PDT), Anthony William Sloman
bill....@ieee.org> wrote:
On Sunday, September 10, 2023 at 6:18:39?PM UTC+10, boB wrote:
On Sat, 9 Sep 2023 08:39:04 -0700 (PDT), Anthony William Sloman
bill....@ieee.org> wrote:
On Saturday, September 9, 2023 at 9:54:01?PM UTC+10, boB wrote:
On Fri, 8 Sep 2023 21:40:50 -0700 (PDT), Anthony William Sloman
bill....@ieee.org> wrote:
On Saturday, September 9, 2023 at 7:52:34?AM UTC+10, John Larkin wrote:
On Fri, 8 Sep 2023 14:05:31 -0700 (PDT), Fred Bloggs
bloggs.fred...@gmail.com> wrote:

Looks like conversion to renewables is about 10% of what it could be if the big corporate energy concerns applied for temporary rate increases to pay for the build-out. Some of the do, some of them don\'t. A lot of them don\'t want to do this because it entails a detailed audit of their finances. Seems appropriate the people who are using all this energy should pay for the required infrastructure.

https://www.science.org/content/article/hidden-digital-roadblock-keeping-green-electricity-u-s-grid

The scheme about measuring the wind to calculate a new capacity for the line based on the increased heat dissipation effect is garbage.

\"the U.S. goal of eliminating all planet-warming carbon emissions\" is absurd, given that China is building a couple of coal-powered plants per week, and India and Africa will catch up.

The absurdity is all in John Larkin\'s blinkered point of view.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electricity_sector_in_China

China is still building coal-fired power plants, but it is building wind farms and solar farms with a lot more enthusiasm. Thermal power went up by 4.7% from 2019 to 2020, wind power went up by 34.6% and solar power went up by 24.1%., The renewables are starting from a lower base but they added more wind power (71,670 MW.hr) than thermal power (56,370 MW.hr ) and almost as much solar power (48,200 MW.hr),.

India and Africa are doing the same sums, and wind and solar are both cheaper and more modular routes to more electric power.

I shifted boBs reaction down to where he should have posted it.

From Wikipedia...

\"Most of the electricity in China comes from coal, which accounted for
62% of the electricity generation mix in 2021\"

I hope they ARE enthusiastic enough before it is too late ?

From Wikipedia again...
\"China has abundant energy with the world\'s fourth-largest coal
reserves and massive hydroelectric resources.\"

Of course that\'s all from the Wikipedia link that I posted, but ignores the data I pulled from it to make the point that China is moving it electricity generation from coal to renewables. which boB hadn\'t bothered to read.

Why do I still see and sometimes have to still stop for coal trains = here north of Seattle where I know it is going to China ?

Maybe China can\'t dig enough of their own coal ?

If you weren\'t quite so enthusiastic about confirming your own prejudices, you might be able to realise that China is moving it\'s electricity generation away from burning coal. They are aware that burning coal does have unfortunate side effects, and that the electricity you produce that way is more expensive than you get from renewable sources.

I know myself. Maybe you should look into your own prejudices as well.

I do worry about them, but since they mainly motivate me to find reliable information so I don\'t look like an idiot, they probably aren\'t a problem here.

China is still buying coal from the US.

And Australia. They do manufacture a lot of stuff and they do have to keep the production lines rolling.

You are making the same mistake as John Larkin, and seem equally unwilling to correct your opinions.

I would really love to believe China is doing the right thing, and maybe they really are moving as fast as you or Wikipedia says they are. I hope the data in that article is trustworthy.

Wikipedia does make an effort to get their articles right. National statistics on energy production tend to be pretty reliable. If you don\'t trust that data, do try to find something more reliable.

Yes, I know they try and I also try to help Wikipedia personally when I see something wrong. But the CCP MAY just have a bit of influence on the accuracy. No idea how much, but I know Wiki tries, as they should, to keep it accurate.

Energy statistics are part of the national economy and the Chinese national economy interacts with the rest of the world on a very large scale.

China really is making 80% of all the solar cells being manufactured all around the world at the moment, and they had to invest a lot of money in manufacturing at ten times the scale that anybody else had. This did let them halve the unit price and dominate the market, so it was a profitable investment.

And they should keep making cells for cheap while we try to have some kind of backup at some price of course.

There\'s nothing to stop anybody else pulling the same trick - if they can put together the mass of capital required. If they spent enough to manufacture on an even larger scale they could undercut the Chineses plants and make them a whole lot less profitable - which is what China did to the German solar cell industry.

The rest of the world isn\'t going to be able to do without China and China needs our sales, too. The CCP subsidises these markets which is fine by me if they do a good job, which it looks like they certainly do.

The Chinese chose to mass produce a superior solar cell invented at the University of NSW

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martin_Green_(professor)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stuart_Wenham

I am in the renewable energy business BTW, but these types of facts and figures aren\'t part of my work. I like Chinese but the CCP really tries to hide truth.

The CCP isn\'t candid, but in this area they don\'t seem to have anything to hide. Their don\'t have a lot of spare food production capacity, and climate change could well leave them in famine.

The CCP is trying to hide things from others and their own people. I\"m sure you must know this ? Don\'t hide your head in the sand, if you do....

The CCP is a government, and governments always try to hide stuff, and rarely succeed.

I\'m just done trying to predict the future... I need to retire and then maybe I can pay better attention.

Nobody is asking you to predict the future, but it would be nice if you were more careful about what you say about the present.

God help us all.

Not a policy that works all that well. People that look after themselves and their environment do seem to do better than those who rely on God to do it for therm.

And how well is man doing at all of this ? Pull out all of the stops while also believing we can make the right changes and both may help.

If you don\'t believe you can help, then why even try?

I believe that the little I can do can help, even if it is only correcting some silly ideas and the occasional foolish misconception.

We\'re all big boys and can (hopefully) make the best decisions towards
the betterment of our world and still believe what we want to believe.

As long as it doesn\'t harm others.

Visualize Whirled Peas

 

[Anthony William Sloman]

On Wednesday, September 13, 2023 at 8:14:48 AM UTC+10, boB wrote:

On Mon, 11 Sep 2023 23:47:38 -0700 (PDT), Anthony William Sloman <bill.....@ieee.org> wrote:
On Tuesday, September 12, 2023 at 8:20:23?AM UTC+10, boB wrote:
On Sun, 10 Sep 2023 04:23:59 -0700 (PDT), Anthony William Sloman <bill.....@ieee.org> wrote:
On Sunday, September 10, 2023 at 6:18:39?PM UTC+10, boB wrote:
On Sat, 9 Sep 2023 08:39:04 -0700 (PDT), Anthony William Sloman <bill....@ieee.org> wrote:
On Saturday, September 9, 2023 at 9:54:01?PM UTC+10, boB wrote:
On Fri, 8 Sep 2023 21:40:50 -0700 (PDT), Anthony William Sloman <bill....@ieee.org> wrote:
On Saturday, September 9, 2023 at 7:52:34?AM UTC+10, John Larkin wrote:
On Fri, 8 Sep 2023 14:05:31 -0700 (PDT), Fred Bloggs <bloggs..fred...@gmail.com> wrote:

<snip>

I believe that the little I can do can help, even if it is only correcting some silly ideas and the occasional foolish misconception.

We\'re all big boys and can (hopefully) make the best decisions towards the betterment of our world and still believe what we want to believe.

Sadly, believing what you want to believe and making good decisions aren\'t necessarily compatible. John Larkin and Flyguy want to believe that anthropogenic global warming is some kind of hoax, which gets in the way of their supporting actions that might slow it down or reverse it.

> As long as it doesn\'t harm others.

Quite a few deluded ideas do harm other people. Look Donald Trump.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

 

[boB]

On Tue, 12 Sep 2023 18:17:03 -0700 (PDT), Anthony William Sloman
<bill.sloman@ieee.org> wrote:

On Wednesday, September 13, 2023 at 8:14:48?AM UTC+10, boB wrote:
On Mon, 11 Sep 2023 23:47:38 -0700 (PDT), Anthony William Sloman <bill....@ieee.org> wrote:
On Tuesday, September 12, 2023 at 8:20:23?AM UTC+10, boB wrote:
On Sun, 10 Sep 2023 04:23:59 -0700 (PDT), Anthony William Sloman <bill....@ieee.org> wrote:
On Sunday, September 10, 2023 at 6:18:39?PM UTC+10, boB wrote:
On Sat, 9 Sep 2023 08:39:04 -0700 (PDT), Anthony William Sloman <bill....@ieee.org> wrote:
On Saturday, September 9, 2023 at 9:54:01?PM UTC+10, boB wrote:
On Fri, 8 Sep 2023 21:40:50 -0700 (PDT), Anthony William Sloman <bill....@ieee.org> wrote:
On Saturday, September 9, 2023 at 7:52:34?AM UTC+10, John Larkin wrote:
On Fri, 8 Sep 2023 14:05:31 -0700 (PDT), Fred Bloggs <bloggs.fred...@gmail.com> wrote:

snip

I believe that the little I can do can help, even if it is only correcting some silly ideas and the occasional foolish misconception.

We\'re all big boys and can (hopefully) make the best decisions towards the betterment of our world and still believe what we want to believe.

Sadly, believing what you want to believe and making good decisions aren\'t necessarily compatible. John Larkin and Flyguy want to believe that anthropogenic global warming is some kind of hoax, which gets in the way of their supporting actions that might slow it down or reverse it.

As long as it doesn\'t harm others.

Quite a few deluded ideas do harm other people. Look Donald Trump.

I\'d rather not.