Telephone scum?

[Rudolf Ladyzhenskii]

Hi, all

I got an interesting phone call today. A lady with strong acsent informed me
that my phone number was chosen to be connected through a company called
"Call Australia" (at least this is what I understood). It is not part of
Telstra and they offer great rates for STD, international and mobiles. And
they said that this offer is only available for registered businesses, so
she proceeded to get my name and ABN (they had company name and address on
their system).
She wanted me to join on spot and I said that I am not going to until I see
something in writing, so shhe promised to send me a fax.

The next thing I know, a male picks up the phone (with strong acsent again)
and tries to put me through automatic verification prrocess (where machine
asks you questions, you answer YES and it is being recorded).

My called ID phone showed that call was from overseas. When asked, this
person told me that they are in Station Stret, West Melbourne and they had
technical difficulties, so call is probably routed through USA.

Anyway, I told him again that I am not signing up for anything, until I have
terms and conditions in writing. He said that I can always cancel the
service -- in writing withing first 10 days or by phone call later. I
repeated my request about paperwork and he finally agreed to fax something
to me and call me later on.

There is nothing on the fax machine as I am writing this message and whole
things smells funny. Does anyone know anything about this sort of things?
Could that be a genuine offer or it is a known scum?

I will let you know if I receive anything from them,

Thanks,
Rudolf

 

[Anthony Fremont]

"Rudolf Ladyzhenskii"

There is nothing on the fax machine as I am writing this message and
whole
things smells funny. Does anyone know anything about this sort of
things?
Could that be a genuine offer or it is a known scum?

Congratulations, you've been slammed. I wouldn't be making any long
distance calls if I were you. When you get your next bill, I hope you
tell us all who your new long distance provider is.

 

[John Tserkezis]

Rudolf Ladyzhenskii wrote:

There is nothing on the fax machine as I am writing this message and whole
things smells funny.

As they say, if it looks like a duck...

As you said, it does smell fishy. Especially when they're happy to "sign"
you up without a written contract.

As far as I'm aware, they technically don't NEED to show you terms and
conditions of the contract unless you ask.

You did ask. (well done) If they don't come up with anything, it's probably
a contract they DON'T want you to see. Now you know why I hang up on these people.

Does anyone know anything about this sort of things?
Could that be a genuine offer or it is a known scum?

Cold calling is one thing I never have, do not, and will never subscribe to.
If I'm interested in something, *I'll* call them, not the other way around.

I will let you know if I receive anything from them,

Will be interesting to see what the fax header says. As far as I'm aware,
fax headers here needs to be intact (needs originating fax/phone number).

If it isn't there, throw it out. Other than issue a warning, I'm not sure if
any australian authorities can do anything about it, since they're obviously
based off-shore.

No telephone conversations are routed overseas when the originating and
destination country is the same one.
It used to be the case that some telephone links were done via satellite, but
those links have long since been made redundant after they started using fibre.
(an easy way to tell is the time delay between conversation replies that
happens with satellites).

Regardless of type of the link, the originator and receiver are never aware
of the nature of the link. ESPECIALLY phone call workers. Not to put them
down, but it doesn't exactly need heavy duty brain power to do that job, they
generally don't know how a phone works let alone how the network is routed.

--
Linux Registered User # 302622 <http://counter.li.org>

 

[Hiding]

"Rudolf Ladyzhenskii" wrote ...

I got an interesting phone call today. A lady with strong acsent informed
me

They call me every month.

that my phone number was chosen to be connected through a company called
"Call Australia" (at least this is what I understood). It is not part of

They told me they were from "Intelicall in Australia". At least that's what
I think they said.

When I said they weren't calling from Australia at all they hung up.

something in writing, so she promised to send me a fax.

They also try to fax my voice line once a month.

Once when I said I didn't have a fax they hung up.

Could that be a genuine offer or it is a known scum?

What do you think?

 

[Rudolf Ladyzhenskii]

I did not sign -- all I did was asking for paperwork..
Beside I use Digiplus (1441) for mobile calls and use someone else, but
Telstra, for long distance (have to dial a number first), so I will not see
any bills. Even if I do, I am not going to pay them.

Rudolf


"Anthony Fremont" <spam@anywhere.com> wrote in message
news:kDvvc.31248$4x2.21454@fe2.texas.rr.com...

"Rudolf Ladyzhenskii"

There is nothing on the fax machine as I am writing this message and
whole
things smells funny. Does anyone know anything about this sort of
things?
Could that be a genuine offer or it is a known scum?

Congratulations, you've been slammed. I wouldn't be making any long
distance calls if I were you. When you get your next bill, I hope you
tell us all who your new long distance provider is.

 

[Phil Allison]

"Rudolf Ladyzhenskii"

I did not sign -- all I did was asking for paperwork..

** They do not need a signature to "churn" you.

Beside I use Digiplus (1441) for mobile calls and use someone else, but
Telstra, for long distance (have to dial a number first), so I will not
see
any bills. Even if I do, I am not going to pay them.

** Bye, bye mobile phone access.




............. Phil

 

[John Tserkezis]

Wing Fong Wong wrote:

Just wondering(and perhaps slightly offtopic but) is the routing infomation
and framing infomation propogated down to the end user, perhaps what I mean is
does the phone itself have to process any infomation during a call?

Currently, the ONLY data you're likely to get down the line is caller ID.
That is supplied by your phone service provider, and then, only if that
information is made available to them.
Originating calls from the few non-cli enabled exchanges that are around
would be one, overseas calls I believe do not have this information also. You
may elect to NOT have your number sent when making calls, and generally, call
centres specifically do this because their originating numbers are generally
not applicable to the purpose of the call. (they will give you other contact
details during their phone call).

Call centres in India are probably double-insualted, in that you're not
likely to know exactly where they are, although sometimes they're very honest
and tell you they are just agents for the company they are calling for.

Or is it that the data is processed at the exchanges and the signal coming down
the phoneline is purely the signal sent from the other end?

That *used* to be the case, where relays and line extenders forcefed a voice
at one end to the other end.

Nowadays, your voice is digitised at your local exchange, (up to a few
kilometres away) and it's fibre from there.

It remains in the data realm till it gets to the destination exchange.
Exactly _how_ it's routed, and who it's routed from remains a mystery to
everyone (and probably owners as it's automated).

CLI information (if enabled) is sent along with your voice along the data
path (again along only those paths that support other than voice data) till it
gets to the destination exchange.

That's where it's converted to analogue again where the destination phone
picks it up (again, up to a few kilometres of cable).

--
Linux Registered User # 302622 <http://counter.li.org>

 

[Bernard Morey]

"Rudolf Ladyzhenskii" <rudolfl@optusnet.com.au> wrote in message
news:40be714d$0$1586$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...

Hi, all

I got an interesting phone call today. A lady with strong acsent informed
me
that my phone number was chosen to be connected through a company called
"Call Australia"

I've had this, too.

The worse thing about these marketing calls from Bombay is the almost
unintelligble accent. They gabble away at the rate of knots - you'd think
they have the brains to use someone who can speak fluent English.

Just tell 'em your monthly phone bill is $45 as they lose interest pretty
fast.

 

[Bernard Morey]

"Hiding" <noone@nowhere.isp.com> wrote in message
news:40be876c$1@funnel.arach.net.au...

They also try to fax my voice line once a month.

Other way round. Fax log show a dozen calls a month with 'no fax detected'.
Best thing is, when the fax rings and there's no fax I know the regular
phone will ring within a minute. I just let the answering machine take it.

 

[Rudolf Ladyzhenskii]

I did not sign -- all I did was asking for paperwork..


** They do not need a signature to "churn" you.

Oh, yes, they do. They need some way of prooving I agreed and I did not give
them any agreement, verbal or written. They use "voice verification" where
you are asked qwuestions and you should clearly answer YES. I did not go
through that and I asked for paperwork before I will agree.

Rudolf

 

[Rudolf Ladyzhenskii]

My phone shows OVERSEAS when call is coming from abroad. When there is no
CLI information, it shows PRIVATE CALLER.
This one was definitely from overseas.

Rudolf

"John Tserkezis" <jt@techniciansyndrome.org.invalid> wrote in message
news:40bea137$0$3037$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...

Wing Fong Wong wrote:

Just wondering(and perhaps slightly offtopic but) is the routing
infomation
and framing infomation propogated down to the end user, perhaps what I
mean is
does the phone itself have to process any infomation during a call?

Currently, the ONLY data you're likely to get down the line is caller
ID.
That is supplied by your phone service provider, and then, only if that
information is made available to them.
Originating calls from the few non-cli enabled exchanges that are around
would be one, overseas calls I believe do not have this information also.
You
may elect to NOT have your number sent when making calls, and generally,
call
centres specifically do this because their originating numbers are
generally
not applicable to the purpose of the call. (they will give you other
contact
details during their phone call).

Call centres in India are probably double-insualted, in that you're not
likely to know exactly where they are, although sometimes they're very
honest
and tell you they are just agents for the company they are calling for.

Or is it that the data is processed at the exchanges and the signal
coming down
the phoneline is purely the signal sent from the other end?

That *used* to be the case, where relays and line extenders forcefed a
voice
at one end to the other end.

Nowadays, your voice is digitised at your local exchange, (up to a few
kilometres away) and it's fibre from there.

It remains in the data realm till it gets to the destination exchange.
Exactly _how_ it's routed, and who it's routed from remains a mystery to
everyone (and probably owners as it's automated).

CLI information (if enabled) is sent along with your voice along the
data
path (again along only those paths that support other than voice data)
till it
gets to the destination exchange.

That's where it's converted to analogue again where the destination
phone
picks it up (again, up to a few kilometres of cable).

--
Linux Registered User # 302622
http://counter.li.org

 

[Wing Fong Wong]

John Tserkezis <jt@techniciansyndrome.org.invalid> wrote:

Regardless of type of the link, the originator and receiver are never aware
of the nature of the link. ESPECIALLY phone call workers. Not to put them
down, but it doesn't exactly need heavy duty brain power to do that job, they
generally don't know how a phone works let alone how the network is routed.

Just wondering(and perhaps slightly offtopic but) is the routing infomation

and framing infomation propogated down to the end user, perhaps what I mean is
does the phone itself have to process any infomation during a call?

Or is it that the data is processed at the exchanges and the signal coming down
the phoneline is purely the signal sent from the other end?
--
Wing Wong.
Webpage: http://wing.ucc.asn.au

 

[Terry Collins]

Rudolf Ladyzhenskii wrote:

I did not sign -- all I did was asking for paperwork..


** They do not need a signature to "churn" you.


Oh, yes, they do.

That doesn't mean that they won't forge it {.
AAPT did that once here.

 

[Phil Allison]

"Rudolf Ladyzhenskii"

I did not sign -- all I did was asking for paperwork..


** They do not need a signature to "churn" you.


Oh, yes, they do.

** They can, they do - and will suffer not for doing so.

They need some way of prooving I agreed and I did not give
them any agreement, verbal or written.

** They can churn you by phone alone.

They use "voice verification" where you are asked qwuestions and you
should clearly answer YES.

** Huh ?? There is no such thing. Plenty of folk have found their
phone accounts churned to companies they have never even heard from.




............ Phil

 

[Richard Freeman]

"Rudolf Ladyzhenskii" <rudolfl@optusnet.com.au> wrote in message
news:40be714d$0$1586$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...

Hi, all

I got an interesting phone call today. A lady with strong acsent informed
me
that my phone number was chosen to be connected through a company called
"Call Australia" (at least this is what I understood). It is not part of
Telstra and they offer great rates for STD, international and mobiles. And
they said that this offer is only available for registered businesses, so
she proceeded to get my name and ABN (they had company name and address on
their system).
She wanted me to join on spot and I said that I am not going to until I
see
something in writing, so shhe promised to send me a fax.

The next thing I know, a male picks up the phone (with strong acsent
again)
and tries to put me through automatic verification prrocess (where machine
asks you questions, you answer YES and it is being recorded).

My called ID phone showed that call was from overseas. When asked, this
person told me that they are in Station Stret, West Melbourne and they had
technical difficulties, so call is probably routed through USA.

Anyway, I told him again that I am not signing up for anything, until I
have
terms and conditions in writing. He said that I can always cancel the
service -- in writing withing first 10 days or by phone call later. I
repeated my request about paperwork and he finally agreed to fax something
to me and call me later on.

There is nothing on the fax machine as I am writing this message and whole
things smells funny. Does anyone know anything about this sort of things?
Could that be a genuine offer or it is a known scum?

I will let you know if I receive anything from them,

I have adopted the habit of simply hanging up on Telephone Spammers there is
usually no point in even saying 'no thanks' as they then just keep trying to
sell .. whatever .. to you and I figure if they are rude enough to ring at
dinner/getting kids in bed time then I can be rude (well less rude than I
usually feel like being) and simply hang up.
The ones I find most insulting are where you are rung up by a machine which
then asks you to hold on while it finds an operator to talk to you ......
F'ing Losers..

 

[Brian Goldsmith]

"Richard Freeman" wrote

I have adopted the habit of simply hanging up on Telephone Spammers
there is
usually no point in even saying 'no thanks' as they then just keep
trying to
sell .. whatever .. to you and I figure if they are rude enough to ring
at
dinner/getting kids in bed time then I can be rude (well less rude than
I
usually feel like being) and simply hang up.F'ing Losers..

**** My standard response after listening politely to find out if the
call is genuine,is " No thanks,not interested!"
And how many times have I then heard, "hang on,you haven't even heard
what I've got to say yet".

Effing losers indeed.

Brian Goldsmith.

 

[atec]

Brian Goldsmith wrote:

"Richard Freeman" wrote

I have adopted the habit of simply hanging up on Telephone Spammers
there is
usually no point in even saying 'no thanks' as they then just keep
trying to
sell .. whatever .. to you and I figure if they are rude enough to ring
at
dinner/getting kids in bed time then I can be rude (well less rude than
I
usually feel like being) and simply hang up.F'ing Losers..

**** My standard response after listening politely to find out if the
call is genuine,is " No thanks,not interested!"
And how many times have I then heard, "hang on,you haven't even heard
what I've got to say yet".

Effing losers indeed.

Brian Goldsmith.
My std response is to apply the rule of loudly blown whistle

--
X-No-Archive: Yes

 

[Rudolf Ladyzhenskii]

Oh, yes right. And they will expect me to pay bills? I am certainly not
going to.

Rudolf

"Phil Allison" <philallison@tpg.com.au> wrote in message
news:2i7u4sFk5d7bU1@uni-berlin.de...

"Rudolf Ladyzhenskii"

I did not sign -- all I did was asking for paperwork..


** They do not need a signature to "churn" you.


Oh, yes, they do.


** They can, they do - and will suffer not for doing so.


They need some way of prooving I agreed and I did not give
them any agreement, verbal or written.


** They can churn you by phone alone.


They use "voice verification" where you are asked qwuestions and you
should clearly answer YES.


** Huh ?? There is no such thing. Plenty of folk have found their
phone accounts churned to companies they have never even heard from.




............ Phil

 

[Franc Zabkar]

On Thu, 3 Jun 2004 16:18:01 +1000, "Phil Allison"
<philallison@tpg.com.au> put finger to keyboard and composed:

"Rudolf Ladyzhenskii"

They need some way of prooving I agreed and I did not give
them any agreement, verbal or written.


** They can churn you by phone alone.


They use "voice verification" where you are asked qwuestions and you
should clearly answer YES.


** Huh ?? There is no such thing.

Wrong. When I switched from Optus to Dingoblue (for my telephone
account), I underwent a lengthy voice verification process.


- Franc Zabkar
--
Please remove one 's' from my address when replying by email.

 

[Phil Allison]

"Franc Zabkar" <fzabkar@optussnet.com.au> m...

** Huh ?? There is no such thing.

Wrong. When I switched from Optus to Dingoblue (for my telephone
account), I underwent a lengthy voice verification process.

** A voice recorded over the phone, especially a digital mobile, is no
legal basis for identification of a person.

So there must be some other reason they do this.




............. Phil