switch grounded outlet combo question.

I have a single pole switch outlet combo device in my kitchen. The
switch started to make a loud pop when the light was turned off, not
on. I tried to replace the device and here is what happened. There
are three wires in the box. I know the one hot and the other are
neutral. No ground wire. I wired hot to hot, and the neutrals to the
other two silver and then light brass screw. Powered on and the
switch worked, no plug, unless switch was on. Reversed the two
neutrals and now only outlet works, no switch. What did I do. There
are two screws for the hot, one labeled common and the other unlabeled
and they are both connected by a brass tab. Help. The previous combo
was not grounded, two pronger, 10A. New is grounded 15A.

 

[Chris Lewis]

According to <bigjcw1023@gmail.com>:

I have a single pole switch outlet combo device in my kitchen. The
switch started to make a loud pop when the light was turned off, not
on. I tried to replace the device and here is what happened. There
are three wires in the box. I know the one hot and the other are
neutral. No ground wire. I wired hot to hot, and the neutrals to the
other two silver and then light brass screw. Powered on and the
switch worked, no plug, unless switch was on. Reversed the two
neutrals and now only outlet works, no switch. What did I do. There
are two screws for the hot, one labeled common and the other unlabeled
and they are both connected by a brass tab. Help. The previous combo
was not grounded, two pronger, 10A. New is grounded 15A.

Is this receptacle supposed to have one switched and one unswitched
outlet? If so, there have to be two hots - one on all the time, the
other controlled by the switch. They're both connected to the
"hot" side of the outlet, but you have to break the tab.
--
Chris Lewis,

Age and Treachery will Triumph over Youth and Skill
It's not just anyone who gets a Starship Cruiser class named after them.

 

[Dave]

<bigjcw1023@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:eca903c4-829c-4f46-8d8d-cb773e3edb37@41g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...

I have a single pole switch outlet combo device in my kitchen. The
switch started to make a loud pop when the light was turned off, not
on. I tried to replace the device and here is what happened. There
are three wires in the box. I know the one hot and the other are
neutral. No ground wire. I wired hot to hot, and the neutrals to the
other two silver and then light brass screw. Powered on and the
switch worked, no plug, unless switch was on. Reversed the two
neutrals and now only outlet works, no switch. What did I do. There
are two screws for the hot, one labeled common and the other unlabeled
and they are both connected by a brass tab. Help. The previous combo
was not grounded, two pronger, 10A. New is grounded 15A.

Go hire an electrician before you burn your house down or kill somebody.
Seriously, you don't know what you're doing and you really could do some
damage.

Why, exactly, would there be two neutrals? Hmmm? Maybe, just maybe, only
ONE is a neutral and one is a lead from the light fixture you're wanting to
control.

It sounds like the combo unit is set up so that the switch can control the
outlet. There should be a tab between the top (switch) and outlet (bottom)
on one side. For the switch to control the outlet you would just apply
power to the side opposite the tab, preferably to the switch, then connect
the neutral to the side of the outlet opposite the tab. Switch controls
outlet.

It sounds like you want the outlet on all the time and the switch to control
an (overhead?) light. Wire the hot lead to the side of the unit with the
tab. This applies power to one side of the both the outlet and the switch.
The neutral goes to the other side of the outlet. The wire from the
overhead light goes to the other side of the switch. The switch is inline
on the hot lead to the light, the outlet works all the time.

 

On Nov 19, 4:41 pm, "Dave" <dspear9...@yahoo.com> wrote:

bigjcw1...@gmail.com> wrote in message

news:eca903c4-829c-4f46-8d8d-cb773e3edb37@41g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...

I have a single pole switch outlet combo device in my kitchen. The
switch started to make a loud pop when the light was turned off, not
on. I tried to replace the device and here is what happened. There
are three wires in the box. I know the one hot and the other are
neutral. No ground wire. I wired hot to hot, and the neutrals to the
other two silver and then light brass screw. Powered on and the
switch worked, no plug, unless switch was on. Reversed the two
neutrals and now only outlet works, no switch. What did I do. There
are two screws for the hot, one labeled common and the other unlabeled
and they are both connected by a brass tab. Help. The previous combo
was not grounded, two pronger, 10A. New is grounded 15A.

Go hire an electrician before you burn your house down or kill somebody.
Seriously, you don't know what you're doing and you really could do some
damage.

Why, exactly, would there be two neutrals? Hmmm? Maybe, just maybe, only
ONE is a neutral and one is a lead from the light fixture you're wanting to
control.

It sounds like the combo unit is set up so that the switch can control the
outlet. There should be a tab between the top (switch) and outlet (bottom)
on one side. For the switch to control the outlet you would just apply
power to the side opposite the tab, preferably to the switch, then connect
the neutral to the side of the outlet opposite the tab. Switch controls
outlet.

It sounds like you want the outlet on all the time and the switch to control
an (overhead?) light. Wire the hot lead to the side of the unit with the
tab. This applies power to one side of the both the outlet and the switch.
The neutral goes to the other side of the outlet. The wire from the
overhead light goes to the other side of the switch. The switch is inline
on the hot lead to the light, the outlet works all the time.

Doesnt matter if the hot is on top or bottom, switch outlet
respectively.? The multimeter read hot 120v and the other wire read
85-90v and then neutral. Why is one lower v?

 

[Steve Barker]

again, as you were told before, you don't know what you are doing. That's
why you are getting the 80 some volt reading. (and the fact that you are
using a digital VOM) right?


get someone over there that can do the job before you fry your hand.

s


<bigjcw1023@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1a23a51e-c4a4-485d-9b43-c69cf4f95c07@l22g2000hsc.googlegroups.com...

Doesnt matter if the hot is on top or bottom, switch outlet
respectively.? The multimeter read hot 120v and the other wire read
85-90v and then neutral. Why is one lower v?

 

[James Sweet]

Doesnt matter if the hot is on top or bottom, switch outlet
respectively.? The multimeter read hot 120v and the other wire read
85-90v and then neutral. Why is one lower v?

You really need to get a book on this at least, get an experienced friend to
help, or as someone else suggested, call an electrician. It's hard to give
you a sure answer without looking at how it's wired up, there's more than
one way it may have been done. If uncertain, you really don't want to be
messing with this stuff.

 

[Dennis]

The white wires are not neutrals (a neutral only occurs in a 240 volt
circuit and carries the unbalanced load of the two legs.) And most likely,
one or two of the white wires is what is called a switch leg, that is, it is
actually a ungrounded (or black) wire run to the switch to be "switched".
(But actually it's a "hot" wire in disguise).

As two others have told you, get someone knowledgeable as you could be very
well setting up a shock hazard in your home. It's important that certain
wires be isolated from the metal of the fixtures and appliances, others
intentionally connected to ground, and only someone with experience can tell
the difference.

What if someone were to be seriously shocked while changing a light bulb due
to your inexperience? It's not worth the low cost of being safe.


<bigjcw1023@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:eca903c4-829c-4f46-8d8d-cb773e3edb37@41g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...

I have a single pole switch outlet combo device in my kitchen. The
switch started to make a loud pop when the light was turned off, not
on. I tried to replace the device and here is what happened. There
are three wires in the box. I know the one hot and the other are
neutral. No ground wire. I wired hot to hot, and the neutrals to the
other two silver and then light brass screw. Powered on and the
switch worked, no plug, unless switch was on. Reversed the two
neutrals and now only outlet works, no switch. What did I do. There
are two screws for the hot, one labeled common and the other unlabeled
and they are both connected by a brass tab. Help. The previous combo
was not grounded, two pronger, 10A. New is grounded 15A.

 

[James Sweet]

"Dennis" <webmaster@npcc.net> wrote in message
news:B%p0j.6083$rg1.5080@trndny04...

The white wires are not neutrals (a neutral only occurs in a 240 volt
circuit and carries the unbalanced load of the two legs.) And most likely,
one or two of the white wires is what is called a switch leg, that is, it
is actually a ungrounded (or black) wire run to the switch to be
"switched". (But actually it's a "hot" wire in disguise).

Neutral wires are present in 120V circuits as well, yes neutral and ground
busses are bonded together in the panel, but the white wire is still called
neutral though it carries the full return current. A white wire can be hot
if used in a switch drop or to a 240v appliance receptacle but in that case
there should be a band of black or red tape around it to mark it as such,
though in most houses I've worked on they've skipped that.

Note that this assumes USA, I'm not as knowledgeable about the electrical
codes in other countries.

 

[Dennis]

Neutral wires are present in 120V circuits as well, yes neutral and ground
busses are bonded together in the panel, but the white wire is still
called neutral though it carries the full return current. A white wire can
be hot if used in a switch drop or to a 240v appliance receptacle but in
that case there should be a band of black or red tape around it to mark it
as such, though in most houses I've worked on they've skipped that.

A lot of people refer to the white as a neutral, but offically in the NEC is
referred to as an "identified" conductor.

A neutral is only present in a 240 v or higher branch circuit or feeder. (I
think that's where a lot of confusion comes in as the potential between a
240 volt leg and the neutral is 120 volts, however that's not a branch
circuit in and of itself). Because a neutral carries only an unbalanced
load, it's allowed to be reduced in size from the ungrounded phase
conductors. See 220.61 where the NEC talks about how to calculate the
unbalanced load on a neutral. A grounded white wire in a 120 volt circuit
always carries the full load of the circuit and is sized the same as an
ungrounded conductor.

I pulled this off of Mike Holt's website (read carefully, the 2-wire circuit
in the 2nd para is a standard 120 volt circuit):
Neutral Conductor. The IEEE dictionary defines a neutral conductor as the
conductor with an equal potential difference between it and

the other output conductors of a 3- or 4-wire system. Therefore, a neutral
conductor is the white/gray wire of a 3-wire single-phase

120/240V system, or of a 4-wire three-phase 120/208V or 277/480V system.

Since a neutral conductor must have equal potential between it and all
ungrounded conductors in a 3- or 4-wire system, the white wire

of a 2-wire circuit, and the white wire from a 4-wire three-phase 120/240V
delta-connected system are not neutral conductors-they're

grounded conductors.


Anyway, I believe that the white IS called a neutral in the UK, but not here
in the US (not by the NEC anyways).

 

[Jamie]

Dennis wrote:

Neutral wires are present in 120V circuits as well, yes neutral and ground
busses are bonded together in the panel, but the white wire is still
called neutral though it carries the full return current. A white wire can
be hot if used in a switch drop or to a 240v appliance receptacle but in
that case there should be a band of black or red tape around it to mark it
as such, though in most houses I've worked on they've skipped that.


A lot of people refer to the white as a neutral, but offically in the NEC is
referred to as an "identified" conductor.

A neutral is only present in a 240 v or higher branch circuit or feeder. (I
think that's where a lot of confusion comes in as the potential between a
240 volt leg and the neutral is 120 volts, however that's not a branch
circuit in and of itself). Because a neutral carries only an unbalanced
load, it's allowed to be reduced in size from the ungrounded phase
conductors. See 220.61 where the NEC talks about how to calculate the
unbalanced load on a neutral. A grounded white wire in a 120 volt circuit
always carries the full load of the circuit and is sized the same as an
ungrounded conductor.

I pulled this off of Mike Holt's website (read carefully, the 2-wire circuit
in the 2nd para is a standard 120 volt circuit):
Neutral Conductor. The IEEE dictionary defines a neutral conductor as the
conductor with an equal potential difference between it and

the other output conductors of a 3- or 4-wire system. Therefore, a neutral
conductor is the white/gray wire of a 3-wire single-phase

120/240V system, or of a 4-wire three-phase 120/208V or 277/480V system.

Since a neutral conductor must have equal potential between it and all
ungrounded conductors in a 3- or 4-wire system, the white wire

of a 2-wire circuit, and the white wire from a 4-wire three-phase 120/240V
delta-connected system are not neutral conductors-they're

grounded conductors.


Anyway, I believe that the white IS called a neutral in the UK, but not here
in the US (not by the NEC anyways).


in 120 volt outlet circuits its white.

Even in side of industrial panels for 120 volt control wire the
neutral is white or though, it really does not have to be white in
side of panels but it sure make's life much easier. Gray and yellow
isn't used much any more..

The neutral is always equal in load capacity and length of the high
side.
It's tied to ground only in the service panel where the earth
electrode is bonded near by. THe neutral shall never make an earth
connection else where.

All runs of H/N to each outlet needs to be of equal length. This is
very important especially when it comes to CFCI and arc breakers.



--
"I'm never wrong, once i thought i was, but was mistaken"
Real Programmers Do things like this.
http://webpages.charter.net/jamie_5

 

[Art]

Jamie wrote:

All runs of H/N to each outlet needs to be of equal length. This is
very important especially when it comes to CFCI and arc breakers.

Why do they need to be of equal length? In some cases the hot runs to a
switch and then back to the outlet making it quite a bit longer. In a
completed circuit I can't see how it could matter... ?


--
Art

 

[Chris Lewis]

According to Dennis <webmaster@npcc.net>:

Anyway, I believe that the white IS called a neutral in the UK, but not here
in the US (not by the NEC anyways).

In formal documents such as the NEC, it's referred to as the "grounded"
or "identified" conductor. However, everybody (including electricians)
call it a neutral most of the time.

Check out:

Subject: "grounding" versus "grounded" versus "neutral".

In the electrical wiring FAQ, section 1.
--
Chris Lewis,

Age and Treachery will Triumph over Youth and Skill
It's not just anyone who gets a Starship Cruiser class named after them.

 

[Chris Lewis]

According to Art <Artemis@spamtrap.invalid>:

Jamie wrote:

All runs of H/N to each outlet needs to be of equal length. This is
very important especially when it comes to CFCI and arc breakers.

Why do they need to be of equal length? In some cases the hot runs to a
switch and then back to the outlet making it quite a bit longer. In a
completed circuit I can't see how it could matter... ?

Er, I don't think they "have to be", other than as a logical
consequence of all of the conductors for a given circuit
have to be within the same sheathing (or raceway). Part of
this is ensuring you don't get confused as to which neutral
goes with which hot.

Most of the time that is...

A light fixture with a switch leg has a hot path considerably longer
than the neutral path - twice as long as the switch leg.

This is in contrast to knob and tube where the individual conductors
were run independently of each other. They often got confused
as to which neutral went with which hot.

I don't believe that different H/N lengths make much difference to
GFCI or AFCI, except in extreme and unusual situations. Eg: if you
wrapped the neutral many times around an operating fluorescent
ballast I could see it tripping a GFCI. _Maybe_.
--
Chris Lewis,

Age and Treachery will Triumph over Youth and Skill
It's not just anyone who gets a Starship Cruiser class named after them.

 

[Jamie]

Chris Lewis wrote:

According to Art <Artemis@spamtrap.invalid>:

Jamie wrote:


All runs of H/N to each outlet needs to be of equal length. This is
very important especially when it comes to CFCI and arc breakers.



Why do they need to be of equal length? In some cases the hot runs to a
switch and then back to the outlet making it quite a bit longer. In a
completed circuit I can't see how it could matter... ?


Er, I don't think they "have to be", other than as a logical
consequence of all of the conductors for a given circuit
have to be within the same sheathing (or raceway). Part of
this is ensuring you don't get confused as to which neutral
goes with which hot.

Most of the time that is...

A light fixture with a switch leg has a hot path considerably longer
than the neutral path - twice as long as the switch leg.

This is in contrast to knob and tube where the individual conductors
were run independently of each other. They often got confused
as to which neutral went with which hot.

I don't believe that different H/N lengths make much difference to
GFCI or AFCI, except in extreme and unusual situations. Eg: if you
wrapped the neutral many times around an operating fluorescent
ballast I could see it tripping a GFCI. _Maybe_.
Yes, they have to be.

That is why many people have problems with GFCI outlets false tripping.

CFCI's work on load and phase balancing with respect to the race ways.

A while ago we had our electricians replace all the commonly used
outlets on industrial machines with GFCI's only to fine that many
stations were wedging the reset buttons, having the off shift
electricians put noncompliance outlets back in for some area's

They had me go out and examine a few cases to see what was up. over
the years, outlets were added, separate runs of L1 was feed from the
panel for each to have it's own fuse, sharing the L2 line in various
places which throws the balance way off of course...
Of course, most of the time a little indifference isn't going to matter
I had them install a new 120 outlet service system on the outside of
these machines totally isolated from the inner panels of the machines
with each outlet having it's own L1/L2 and (G) all the way to the
distribution panel.

It was a lot of work for them how ever, in the end, they love it now
because they can now use the outlets for their tools while working on
the machines when the machine is locked out at the buss and panels wide
open.

And of course, lighting has not been allowed to use the same outlet
circuit for some time now so that's not an issue any more.

And on a side note, something I saw one day at our facility...
Make sure the emergency lightly intended for a room is connected to the
lighting circuit of that room and not some main circuit breaker for
emergency lighting for lets say a building etc.

Inspectors love catching that one along with insufficient length of
wire hanging out of switch and outlet boxes when opened for inspection!
Also, when requested to open the boxes, the inspector may follow you
to watch your procedures of how you disconnected the service before
doing so. They love to spot unsafe work practices..



--
"I'm never wrong, once i thought i was, but was mistaken"
Real Programmers Do things like this.
http://webpages.charter.net/jamie_5

 

[Chris Lewis]

According to Jamie <jamie_ka1lpa_not_valid_after_ka1lpa_@charter.net>:

Chris Lewis wrote:

I don't believe that different H/N lengths make much difference to
GFCI or AFCI, except in extreme and unusual situations. Eg: if you
wrapped the neutral many times around an operating fluorescent
ballast I could see it tripping a GFCI. _Maybe_.

Yes, they have to be. [the same length]

That is why many people have problems with GFCI outlets false tripping.

CFCI's work on load and phase balancing with respect to the race ways.

Remember that by definition, a simple two pole device _cannot_ see
"phase differences". There's nothing to compare the phase _to_. All
it can see are instantaneous voltage between the two leads plus
current in the individual leads. You need three conductors (the
ground doesn't count here because a GFCI doesn't care about
the ground) to see "phase".

Yours was an industrial situation (likely very noisy EMI), and not
knowing exactly how these things were wired and what they fed, it's
difficult to tell what was going on. Eg: common ground points on what
was being fed with the equipment and a tiny bit of leakage on the other
leg. Completely isolating both current-carrying leads of the GFCI
(as you ultimately did) from the tool would eliminate much of that,
without having anything to do with individual conductor length.

It could have just been severe EMI on the line side of the GFCI
overwhelming the device or an imbalanced inductive effect.

I really don't think you'd see anything like this in a residential
situation.
--
Chris Lewis,

Age and Treachery will Triumph over Youth and Skill
It's not just anyone who gets a Starship Cruiser class named after them.

 

[Craig M]

Tossing my 2 cents worth in here, in a common switched curcit, the hot and
neutral will be of the same length maybe the difference of the switch
itself, here is how, the romex comes from the breaker at the main panel ,
goes to a switch box on the wall, then another length of romex goes to the
outlet or fixture and is attached to the leads of the fixture or outlet,
back at the switch box, the grounds are wire nutted togetther and a pig-tail
goes to the ground screw on the switch, the whites are wire nutted together
and the blacks go to the switch screws to make the circuit, so for the most
part, the conductors are the same length.
"Chris Lewis" <clewis@nortelnetworks.com> wrote in message
news:13kdrq25hg2dqdf@corp.supernews.com...

According to Dennis <webmaster@npcc.net>:

Anyway, I believe that the white IS called a neutral in the UK, but not
here
in the US (not by the NEC anyways).

In formal documents such as the NEC, it's referred to as the "grounded"
or "identified" conductor. However, everybody (including electricians)
call it a neutral most of the time.

Check out:

Subject: "grounding" versus "grounded" versus "neutral".

In the electrical wiring FAQ, section 1.
--
Chris Lewis,

Age and Treachery will Triumph over Youth and Skill
It's not just anyone who gets a Starship Cruiser class named after them.

 

[Chris Lewis]

According to Craig M <craig_6444@sbcglobal.net>:

Tossing my 2 cents worth in here, in a common switched curcit, the hot and
neutral will be of the same length maybe the difference of the switch
itself, here is how, the romex comes from the breaker at the main panel ,
goes to a switch box on the wall, then another length of romex goes to the
outlet or fixture and is attached to the leads of the fixture or outlet,
back at the switch box, the grounds are wire nutted togetther and a pig-tail
goes to the ground screw on the switch, the whites are wire nutted together
and the blacks go to the switch screws to make the circuit, so for the most
part, the conductors are the same length.

Switches can be wired in two ways:

1) Power goes to switch first, then switched hot and neutral goes
to light fixture. This is what you've described above (in a lot
more words ;-).

2) Power feed goes to the light first. The neutral is attached to the
fixture. Then, the hot feed goes to the switch, and a switched
hot comes back to the fixture. These are called "switch loops",
and what I was referring to earlier.

I prefer to do 1, but 2 is perfectly legal, and I've seen some
books recommending it. It can be somewhat advantageous in
certain circumstances.

In (1) the hot and neutral are the same length. More-or-less.

In (2) the hot is longer than the neutral - by twice the length
of the cable going from the fixture to the switch.
--
Chris Lewis,

Age and Treachery will Triumph over Youth and Skill
It's not just anyone who gets a Starship Cruiser class named after them.

 

[Craig M]

I got wordy for the ones that have never worked with wire, switch, outlet,
and fixtures

"Chris Lewis" <clewis@nortelnetworks.com> wrote in message
news:13km5qsm71en418@corp.supernews.com...

According to Craig M <craig_6444@sbcglobal.net>:
Tossing my 2 cents worth in here, in a common switched curcit, the hot
and
neutral will be of the same length maybe the difference of the switch
itself, here is how, the romex comes from the breaker at the main panel ,
goes to a switch box on the wall, then another length of romex goes to
the
outlet or fixture and is attached to the leads of the fixture or outlet,
back at the switch box, the grounds are wire nutted togetther and a
pig-tail
goes to the ground screw on the switch, the whites are wire nutted
together
and the blacks go to the switch screws to make the circuit, so for the
most
part, the conductors are the same length.

Switches can be wired in two ways:

1) Power goes to switch first, then switched hot and neutral goes
to light fixture. This is what you've described above (in a lot
more words ;-).

2) Power feed goes to the light first. The neutral is attached to the
fixture. Then, the hot feed goes to the switch, and a switched
hot comes back to the fixture. These are called "switch loops",
and what I was referring to earlier.

I prefer to do 1, but 2 is perfectly legal, and I've seen some
books recommending it. It can be somewhat advantageous in
certain circumstances.

In (1) the hot and neutral are the same length. More-or-less.

In (2) the hot is longer than the neutral - by twice the length
of the cable going from the fixture to the switch.
--
Chris Lewis,

Age and Treachery will Triumph over Youth and Skill
It's not just anyone who gets a Starship Cruiser class named after them.

 

[Dennis]

In formal documents such as the NEC, it's referred to as the "grounded"
or "identified" conductor. However, everybody (including electricians)
call it a neutral most of the time.

I know, it's not really a neutral, but most electricians call it one
anyways. (It's why I referenced Mike Holt and the IEEE definition). By
definition, a neutral only carries unbalanced loads, hence the white wire in
a 120 v circuit (which carries full loads) is defined as an identified
conductor, not neutral. You say potato, I say pototo ......

It will catch you on a test though.

 

[JJBDCB]

JJBDCB had written this in response to
http://www.thestuccocompany.com/construction/Re-switch-grounded-outlet-combo-question-11813-.htm
:
Dennis i dont where u get your info but NEC is a private company white is
neutral on 110 in the USA , i take it your not a elecrtian. whit is not
just considered just identified conductor !!!!


World Region, country
or other entity(ies) Live Neutral Protective earth/ground
EU, Australia & South Africa (IEC 60446) brown blue green & yellow
Australia & New Zealand (AS/NZS 3000:2007 3.8.1) brown light blue
green/yellow
United States and Canada black (brass) white (silver) green (green)
Standard wire colours for fixed cable
(In or behind the wall wiring cables)
Region Live Neutral Protective earth/ground
EU (IEC 60446) including UK from 31 March 2004 brown blue green & yellow
Australia and South Africa red black green & yellow (core is usually bare
and should be sleeved at terminations. In Australia the earth core has
been separately insulated with green or green/yellow plastic since about
1980.
United States and Canada black, red, blue(brass) white (silver) green
(green)
or bare copper wire
Note: the colours in this table represent the most common and preferred
standard colours for single phase wiring however others may be in use,
especially in older installations.

Since 1897 the U.S. National Fire Protection Association, a private
nonprofit association formed by insurance companies, has published the
National Electrical Code (NEC). States, counties or cities often include
the NEC in their local building codes by reference along with local
differences. The NEC is modified every three years
JJB
-------------------------------------
Dennis wrote:

Neutral wires are present in 120V circuits as well, yes neutral and
ground
busses are bonded together in the panel, but the white wire is
still
called neutral though it carries the full return current. A white
wire can
be hot if used in a switch drop or to a 240v appliance receptacle
but in
that case there should be a band of black or red tape around it to
mark it
as such, though in most houses I've worked on they've skipped
that.

A lot of people refer to the white as a neutral, but offically in the
NEC is
referred to as an "identified" conductor.

A neutral is only present in a 240 v or higher branch circuit or
feeder. (I
think that's where a lot of confusion comes in as the potential between
a
240 volt leg and the neutral is 120 volts, however that's not a branch
circuit in and of itself). Because a neutral carries only an
unbalanced
load, it's allowed to be reduced in size from the ungrounded phase
conductors. See 220.61 where the NEC talks about how to calculate the
unbalanced load on a neutral. A grounded white wire in a 120 volt
circuit
always carries the full load of the circuit and is sized the same as an

ungrounded conductor.

I pulled this off of Mike Holt's website (read carefully, the 2-wire
circuit
in the 2nd para is a standard 120 volt circuit):
Neutral Conductor. The IEEE dictionary defines a neutral conductor as
the
conductor with an equal potential difference between it and

the other output conductors of a 3- or 4-wire system. Therefore, a
neutral
conductor is the white/gray wire of a 3-wire single-phase

120/240V system, or of a 4-wire three-phase 120/208V or 277/480V
system.

Since a neutral conductor must have equal potential between it and all
ungrounded conductors in a 3- or 4-wire system, the white wire

of a 2-wire circuit, and the white wire from a 4-wire three-phase
120/240V
delta-connected system are not neutral conductors-they're

grounded conductors.

Anyway, I believe that the white IS called a neutral in the UK, but not
here
in the US (not by the NEC anyways).

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