Strangely marked BUZ Mosfet

  • Thread starter Gareth Magennis
  • Start date
"Gareth Magennis"

Check this out, if just for educational purposes. Quite interesting.

http://www.4qd.co.uk/serv/MOSFETfail.html

** Got nothing WHATSOEVER to do with LATERAL mosfets !!!

These are completely different animals to switching mosfets.

Originally invented by Hitachi and sold in TO3 packs as 2SK ( N ch) and 2SJ
( P ch) numbers as the perfect output devices for audio amplifiers. Power
amp makers in the UK, Australia and NZ pounced on them and for a while in
the mid 1980s, MOSFET amps were the industry standard.

Later, Hitachi supplied plastic pack ( TO3P) versions too - then stopped
making the TO3 devices completely in the late 1980s. There was shock, horror
and nashing of teeth until it was discovered that an obscure semiconductor
maker in Scotland ( of all places) was making very similar lateral devices
to Hitachi ( under licence?) - this was Semelab.

Initially, all Semelab devices had SML part numbers on them, but later this
changed to BUZ part numbers. The exact same devices are also sold under the
Exicon brand and Magnatec. Magnatec also supply dual chip versions of the
same devices - this simply doubles the max current and max power
dissipation ratings.

Hitachi lateral mosfets in plastic packs are now sold under the brand "
Renesas " .

A lateral mosfet will always have the source connected to the case or
heatsink tab, have a threshold voltage of about 0.7 volts, come in P and N
channel versions and be found in audio amplifiers and very little else.

OTOH - switching mosfets have the drain connected to the heatsink tab, are
almost all N channel types ( no genuine P ch compliments exist) have
threshold voltages of 2 to 5 volts and are found mostly in switching PSUs,
motor drives and class D amplifiers.



..... Phil
 
"Meat Plow" <mhywattt@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:pan.2011.04.08.23.25.40@lmao.lol.lol...
On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 00:12:23 +0100, Gareth Magennis wrote:

"Meat Plow" <mhywattt@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:pan.2011.04.08.17.26.17@lmao.lol.lol...
On Fri, 08 Apr 2011 10:17:06 +0100, Gareth Magennis wrote:

Interestingly the customer said that the amp went DC and fried his
speaker - the amp has no relay or DC protection. My little bit or
research so far indicates that dv/dt failure in industrial motor
applications can be down to pulling the power cable off a stalled
motor, zapping the gate/substrate connection in a nanosecond. Might
this also apply to a faulty speaker in this kind of audio amp which
burns short then eventually self disconnects?

I also understand extremely electrically noisy environments can also
induce this failure mode. The customer is daisy chaining this amp
with another one via the FX send, I'm wondering if this has any chance
of being the cause of the failure.

Slaving another amp via the send isn't likely but a failing speaker or
poorly wired/connected load might be the reason.




Check this out, if just for educational purposes. Quite interesting.

http://www.4qd.co.uk/serv/MOSFETfail.html



Gareth.

Mostly pertaining to motor control applications. My experience is limited
to audio applications. Some similarities exist thought. Still a good read
for failure modes.

Isn't a speaker a motor?



Gareth.
 
On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 00:12:23 +0100, Gareth Magennis wrote:

"Meat Plow" <mhywattt@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:pan.2011.04.08.17.26.17@lmao.lol.lol...
On Fri, 08 Apr 2011 10:17:06 +0100, Gareth Magennis wrote:

Interestingly the customer said that the amp went DC and fried his
speaker - the amp has no relay or DC protection. My little bit or
research so far indicates that dv/dt failure in industrial motor
applications can be down to pulling the power cable off a stalled
motor, zapping the gate/substrate connection in a nanosecond. Might
this also apply to a faulty speaker in this kind of audio amp which
burns short then eventually self disconnects?

I also understand extremely electrically noisy environments can also
induce this failure mode. The customer is daisy chaining this amp
with another one via the FX send, I'm wondering if this has any chance
of being the cause of the failure.

Slaving another amp via the send isn't likely but a failing speaker or
poorly wired/connected load might be the reason.




Check this out, if just for educational purposes. Quite interesting.

http://www.4qd.co.uk/serv/MOSFETfail.html



Gareth.
Mostly pertaining to motor control applications. My experience is limited
to audio applications. Some similarities exist thought. Still a good read
for failure modes.



--
Live Fast Die Young, Leave A Pretty Corpse
 
"Gareth Magennis" <sound.service@btconnect.com> wrote in message
news:V4Nnp.3394$9h6.2711@newsfe02.ams2...
"Meat Plow" <mhywattt@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:pan.2011.04.08.23.25.40@lmao.lol.lol...
On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 00:12:23 +0100, Gareth Magennis wrote:

"Meat Plow" <mhywattt@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:pan.2011.04.08.17.26.17@lmao.lol.lol...
On Fri, 08 Apr 2011 10:17:06 +0100, Gareth Magennis wrote:

Interestingly the customer said that the amp went DC and fried his
speaker - the amp has no relay or DC protection. My little bit or
research so far indicates that dv/dt failure in industrial motor
applications can be down to pulling the power cable off a stalled
motor, zapping the gate/substrate connection in a nanosecond. Might
this also apply to a faulty speaker in this kind of audio amp which
burns short then eventually self disconnects?

I also understand extremely electrically noisy environments can also
induce this failure mode. The customer is daisy chaining this amp
with another one via the FX send, I'm wondering if this has any chance
of being the cause of the failure.

Slaving another amp via the send isn't likely but a failing speaker or
poorly wired/connected load might be the reason.




Check this out, if just for educational purposes. Quite interesting.

http://www.4qd.co.uk/serv/MOSFETfail.html



Gareth.

Mostly pertaining to motor control applications. My experience is limited
to audio applications. Some similarities exist thought. Still a good read
for failure modes.




Isn't a speaker a motor?

Maybe the "speech coil" head actuators in old 5&1/4 FH HDDs blur the
distinction a bit.
 
On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 00:43:51 +0100, Gareth Magennis wrote:

"Meat Plow" <mhywattt@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:pan.2011.04.08.23.25.40@lmao.lol.lol...
On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 00:12:23 +0100, Gareth Magennis wrote:

"Meat Plow" <mhywattt@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:pan.2011.04.08.17.26.17@lmao.lol.lol...
On Fri, 08 Apr 2011 10:17:06 +0100, Gareth Magennis wrote:

Interestingly the customer said that the amp went DC and fried his
speaker - the amp has no relay or DC protection. My little bit or
research so far indicates that dv/dt failure in industrial motor
applications can be down to pulling the power cable off a stalled
motor, zapping the gate/substrate connection in a nanosecond. Might
this also apply to a faulty speaker in this kind of audio amp which
burns short then eventually self disconnects?

I also understand extremely electrically noisy environments can also
induce this failure mode. The customer is daisy chaining this amp
with another one via the FX send, I'm wondering if this has any
chance of being the cause of the failure.

Slaving another amp via the send isn't likely but a failing speaker
or poorly wired/connected load might be the reason.




Check this out, if just for educational purposes. Quite interesting.

http://www.4qd.co.uk/serv/MOSFETfail.html



Gareth.

Mostly pertaining to motor control applications. My experience is
limited to audio applications. Some similarities exist thought. Still a
good read for failure modes.




Isn't a speaker a motor?



Gareth.
It can be perceived as a sound motor.



--
Live Fast Die Young, Leave A Pretty Corpse
 
On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 09:42:02 +1000, Phil Allison wrote:


"Gareth Magennis"

Check this out, if just for educational purposes. Quite interesting.

http://www.4qd.co.uk/serv/MOSFETfail.html


** Got nothing WHATSOEVER to do with LATERAL mosfets !!!

These are completely different animals to switching mosfets.

Originally invented by Hitachi and sold in TO3 packs as 2SK ( N ch) and
2SJ ( P ch) numbers as the perfect output devices for audio amplifiers.
Power amp makers in the UK, Australia and NZ pounced on them and for a
while in the mid 1980s, MOSFET amps were the industry standard.
I cried the day Hitachi quit manufacturing the 2SK49 / 2SJ135 pairs. I
have one old SCS 350w/ch power amp that uses them. I acquired it with a
blow channel back in the late 90's. It wasn't easy back then to find
replacements. I imagine it's probably a lot easier these days to find NOS
replacements. Maybe even a sub is made today?



--
Live Fast Die Young, Leave A Pretty Corpse
 
"Phil Allison" <phil_a@tpg.com.au> wrote in message
news:909l0uFrhoU1@mid.individual.net...
"Gareth Magennis"

Isn't a speaker a motor?


** And chaulk an cheese are the same too.

Fuckwit.


... Phil

Oh and there's me thinking a motor is a device that converts electrical
energy into mechanical energy.


Fuckwit.
 
On 4/9/2011 9:06 AM Meat Plow spake thus:

On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 00:43:51 +0100, Gareth Magennis wrote:

"Meat Plow" <mhywattt@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:pan.2011.04.08.23.25.40@lmao.lol.lol...

On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 00:12:23 +0100, Gareth Magennis wrote:

"Meat Plow" <mhywattt@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:pan.2011.04.08.17.26.17@lmao.lol.lol...

On Fri, 08 Apr 2011 10:17:06 +0100, Gareth Magennis wrote:

Interestingly the customer said that the amp went DC and
fried his speaker - the amp has no relay or DC protection.
My little bit or research so far indicates that dv/dt
failure in industrial motor applications can be down to
pulling the power cable off a stalled motor, zapping the
gate/substrate connection in a nanosecond. Might this also
apply to a faulty speaker in this kind of audio amp which
burns short then eventually self disconnects?

I also understand extremely electrically noisy environments
can also induce this failure mode. The customer is daisy
chaining this amp with another one via the FX send, I'm
wondering if this has any chance of being the cause of the
failure.

Slaving another amp via the send isn't likely but a failing
speaker or poorly wired/connected load might be the reason.

Check this out, if just for educational purposes. Quite
interesting.

http://www.4qd.co.uk/serv/MOSFETfail.html

Mostly pertaining to motor control applications. My experience is
limited to audio applications. Some similarities exist thought.
Still a good read for failure modes.

Isn't a speaker a motor?

It can be perceived as a sound motor.
It *is*, in fact, a motor. Which, technically speaking, is anything that
converts electrical energy to mechanical motion. So by this definition,
even solenoids and piezo transducers are motors.

Now, it's not a motor in the conventionally-understood sense--something
that produces rotary motion--but it is, nonetheless, a perfectly good motor.


--
The current state of literacy in our advanced civilization:

yo
wassup
nuttin
wan2 hang
k
where
here
k
l8tr
by

- from Usenet (what's *that*?)
 
On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 13:23:48 -0700, David Nebenzahl wrote:

On 4/9/2011 9:06 AM Meat Plow spake thus:

On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 00:43:51 +0100, Gareth Magennis wrote:

"Meat Plow" <mhywattt@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:pan.2011.04.08.23.25.40@lmao.lol.lol...

On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 00:12:23 +0100, Gareth Magennis wrote:

"Meat Plow" <mhywattt@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:pan.2011.04.08.17.26.17@lmao.lol.lol...

On Fri, 08 Apr 2011 10:17:06 +0100, Gareth Magennis wrote:

Interestingly the customer said that the amp went DC and fried his
speaker - the amp has no relay or DC protection. My little bit or
research so far indicates that dv/dt failure in industrial motor
applications can be down to pulling the power cable off a stalled
motor, zapping the gate/substrate connection in a nanosecond.
Might this also apply to a faulty speaker in this kind of audio
amp which burns short then eventually self disconnects?

I also understand extremely electrically noisy environments can
also induce this failure mode. The customer is daisy chaining
this amp with another one via the FX send, I'm wondering if this
has any chance of being the cause of the failure.

Slaving another amp via the send isn't likely but a failing speaker
or poorly wired/connected load might be the reason.

Check this out, if just for educational purposes. Quite
interesting.

http://www.4qd.co.uk/serv/MOSFETfail.html

Mostly pertaining to motor control applications. My experience is
limited to audio applications. Some similarities exist thought. Still
a good read for failure modes.

Isn't a speaker a motor?

It can be perceived as a sound motor.

It *is*, in fact, a motor. Which, technically speaking, is anything that
converts electrical energy to mechanical motion. So by this definition,
even solenoids and piezo transducers are motors.

Now, it's not a motor in the conventionally-understood sense--something
that produces rotary motion--but it is, nonetheless, a perfectly good
motor.
My reference was to the failure modes of motor speed control mosfets.
They aren't the ideal comparison to the failure modes found in audio
power amps using lateral or bipolar mosfets. None the less the 4QD read
was enlightening.

Lots of things can be considered motors if you think outside the box.
Anything that conveys motion can be considered a motor.


--
Live Fast Die Young, Leave A Pretty Corpse
 
"Meat Plow"
I cried the day Hitachi quit manufacturing the 2SK49 / 2SJ135 pairs. I
have one old SCS 350w/ch power amp that uses them. I acquired it with a
blow channel back in the late 90's. It wasn't easy back then to find
replacements. I imagine it's probably a lot easier these days to find NOS
replacements. Maybe even a sub is made today?

** Finding NOS for those numbers is nigh impossible now.

But the Semelab BUZ900 and BUZ905 lateral mosfets are near identical.

Where devices operate in parallel, best not mix the numbers up -
particularly if there are no source ballast resistors.


..... Phil
 
In article <pan.2011.04.07.18.42.29@lmao.lol.lol>, Meat Plow
<mhywattt@yahoo.com> writes

It's everyone who isn't Phil "fucking insane" Allison.
That's the product of transportation of thieves, rapists and murderers
to van Diemen's land and 200 years of enthusiastic inbreeding since.

--
(\__/)
(='.'=)
(")_(")
 
In article <RaudnfDVDpYleAPQnZ2dnUVZ8ludnZ2d@bt.com>, Gareth Magennis
<sound.service@btconnect.com> writes

Decision is made, I'm not touching this.
Think you're right. Not worth the comeback if it fails again.

--
(\__/)
(='.'=)
(")_(")
 

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