Solid State Lighting - New Inventors, ABC, 11 July 2007

[Poxy]

Phil Allison wrote:

"Poxy the Fuckwit Piss Head"


** On the contrary - this NG is a not a stinking chat room.

Same goes for nearly all technically oriented NGs.

Moderated chat forums full of fools exist on the internet where you
can have some pathetic little graphic represent you and hide behind
an even more stupid name than " Poxy" ???

For fuck's sake - go join one NOW.

You utterly ridiculous

ARSEHOLE TROLL.

Hmm, you're becoming less coherent and rational as this thread continues.
You seem so incensed with rage that you haven't bothered to correct your
spelling mistake in your tediously re-written subject line.

Reading between the lines of your frantic yet impotent bleating, I'm happy
to accept your admission and leave it at that.

 

[Phil Allison]

"John Tserkezis"

** On the contrary - this NG is a not a stinking chat room.

Same goes for nearly all technically oriented NGs.

Oh, so ALL other non-technical groups ARE "stinking chat rooms" as you
put it?

** Not a logical conclusion.

Moderated chat forums full of fools exist on the internet where you can
have
some pathetic little graphic represent you and hide behind an even more
stupid name than " Poxy" ???

I grew up on BBS's, where your real name was a must.

The internet is different, and the norm is anonymity.

** On technical NGs it is not the norm

- you lying, fucking ASS !!


BTW

Poxy = UK slang for " worthless " .

Tserkezis = Greek slang for fuckwit ??

For fuck's sake - go join one NOW.

You don't like it? YOU go to another group.

** No way.

Poxy pukes and dead head trolls are the ones to go.

.... groups such as aus.legal,

** Could hardly be a more technical topic than the law

- FUCKWIT





.......... Phil

 

[Phil Allison]

"Poxy the Fuckwit Piss Head"


** On the contrary - this NG is a not a stinking chat room.

Same goes for nearly all technically oriented NGs.

Moderated chat forums full of fools exist on the internet where you can have
some pathetic little graphic represent you and hide behind an even more
stupid name than " Poxy" ??

For fuck's sake - go join one NOW.

You utterly ridiculous

ASD FUCKED ARSEHOLE TROLL






........ Phil

 

[kreed]

On Jul 17, 9:44 pm, "David L. Jones" <altz...@gmail.com> wrote:

On Jul 17, 8:14 pm, Franc Zabkar <fzab...@iinternode.on.net> wrote:



On Tue, 17 Jul 2007 17:51:20 +1000, "Mr.T" <MrT@home> put finger to
keyboard and composed:

"John Tserkezis" <j...@techniciansyndrome.org.invalid> wrote in message
news:469b1714$0$10708$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
Of course there is, the LED's can't be 240V surely.

No, of course not. And I don't see the reason you ask this question
unless
you missed the bit in this thread that places them in series - enough to
give
a suitable average current, along with suitable limits for waveform peaks
and
local power grid variations.

So what happens if one of the string fails?

MrT.

You could have several parallel strings. Perhaps LED traffic lights
have this kind of redundancy built in ???

Anyone actually seen one of the new LED traffic lights with a bung LED
yet?
Can't say I've spotted a single one yet.

Dave.

yes, Hervey Bay in QLD has many faulty led traffic lights. Typically
the LEDS fail in groups of about 5 (hard to be precise from ground
level). Failures started happening within weeks of installation
(about 2004-5)

One set of the faulty LEDs flicker annoyingly

 

[John Tserkezis]

Phil Allison wrote:

Oh, so ALL other non-technical groups ARE "stinking chat rooms" as you
put it?

** Not a logical conclusion.

Odd. That's what you implied.

The internet is different, and the norm is anonymity.

** On technical NGs it is not the norm

Ok, so you're the usenet police who controls who has anonymity and who doesn't?

Tserkezis = Greek slang for fuckwit ??

Actually, it was a name for the guerrilla warmongers in Greece some time back.

If that's OK with you, your majesty? We can't claim such high esteem of
having a name that goes back to our Australian convict history like yours.
Say hello to your thieving ancestors for me. No wait, they were pommies as
well, and you have clearly stated that pommies aren't your favourite race.

So you probably hate yourself a great deal I'm guessing?

You don't like it? YOU go to another group.

** No way.
Poxy pukes and dead head trolls are the ones to go.

Oh goodie, then you'll be leaving because you are associated on both counts?

.... groups such as aus.legal,

** Could hardly be a more technical topic than the law

More careful reading notes that you don't really know anything about the
law, and spend more time gasbagging about how everyone is is an arsehole.

Much like right here. From that, one could reason you know nothing at all,
about any subject. Sounds about right too.
--
Linux Registered User # 302622
<http://counter.li.org>
Internet: jt@techniciansyndrome.org

 

[Mr.T]

"John Tserkezis" <jt@techniciansyndrome.org.invalid> wrote in message
news:469cb0ca$0$22253$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...

The only failure mode I've seen with LEDs was O/C. And I don't remember
seeing more than two of those in my career.

I must be unlucky then, I've seen dozens, and far more low intensity.

MrT.

 

[swanny]

David L. Jones wrote:

On Jul 17, 8:14 pm, Franc Zabkar <fzab...@iinternode.on.net> wrote:
On Tue, 17 Jul 2007 17:51:20 +1000, "Mr.T" <MrT@home> put finger to
keyboard and composed:





"John Tserkezis" <j...@techniciansyndrome.org.invalid> wrote in message
news:469b1714$0$10708$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
Of course there is, the LED's can't be 240V surely.
No, of course not. And I don't see the reason you ask this question
unless
you missed the bit in this thread that places them in series - enough to
give
a suitable average current, along with suitable limits for waveform peaks
and
local power grid variations.
So what happens if one of the string fails?
MrT.
You could have several parallel strings. Perhaps LED traffic lights
have this kind of redundancy built in ???

Anyone actually seen one of the new LED traffic lights with a bung LED
yet?
Can't say I've spotted a single one yet.

Dave.

I've seen plenty, not single LEDs or strings, but the whole lamp out. I suspect
it's probably the lamp power supply that died, but it will depend on the
manufacturer as there are several different types of lamps out there in NSW.
These died within a few weeks of service, so it may be systemic.

Can't wait to see what they do when it gets hot in the middle of Summer.

 

[Mauried]

On Thu, 19 Jul 2007 00:02:22 GMT, swanny
<blahgswan3blah@blahbigpondblah.comblah.blahau> wrote:

David L. Jones wrote:
On Jul 17, 8:14 pm, Franc Zabkar <fzab...@iinternode.on.net> wrote:
On Tue, 17 Jul 2007 17:51:20 +1000, "Mr.T" <MrT@home> put finger to
keyboard and composed:





"John Tserkezis" <j...@techniciansyndrome.org.invalid> wrote in message
news:469b1714$0$10708$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
Of course there is, the LED's can't be 240V surely.
No, of course not. And I don't see the reason you ask this question
unless
you missed the bit in this thread that places them in series - enough to
give
a suitable average current, along with suitable limits for waveform peaks
and
local power grid variations.
So what happens if one of the string fails?
MrT.
You could have several parallel strings. Perhaps LED traffic lights
have this kind of redundancy built in ???

Anyone actually seen one of the new LED traffic lights with a bung LED
yet?
Can't say I've spotted a single one yet.

Dave.


I've seen plenty, not single LEDs or strings, but the whole lamp out. I suspect
it's probably the lamp power supply that died, but it will depend on the
manufacturer as there are several different types of lamps out there in NSW.
These died within a few weeks of service, so it may be systemic.

Can't wait to see what they do when it gets hot in the middle of Summer.

Ive seen plenty, entire lamp out.
Mainly goes out in hot weather and has to be repaired.
Seems like a power supply problem.
Lights most affected are the reds.

 

On Mon, 16 Jul 2007 00:41:55 GMT, Dave Goldfinch
<daveg50_8@NotCoolMail.invalid> wrote:

On Sat, 14 Jul 2007 11:07:03 +1000, Franc Zabkar
fzabkar@iinternode.on.net> wrote:

Did anyone see the Solid State Lighting invention on the ABC New
Inventors program last Wednesday?

See http://www.abc.net.au/tv/newinventors/txt/s1969641.htm

... or watch the video:
http://www.abc.net.au/tv/newinventors/video/default.htm?program=newinventors&pres=20070711_2000&story=1

Does the following description sound like anything out of the
ordinary? Surely the idea of using the LEDs themselves to rectify
current is nothing new. In fact I suspect that's how my LED night
light works, ie by using strings of antiparallel diode pairs.

As for the claim that "his LED lights have an ingenious way of
directing the electric current", what does he mean by that?

I seem to recall that he said that his innovation involved
"architectural" changes (redesigned lenses?), and that the LED current
was 415mA. Presumably he is using off-the-shelf LEDs.


Here is an excerpt from the Overview:

===================================================================
"There are some LEDs being used for bulk lighting applications, but
these require rectifiers (to transform the current from AC to DC) as
well as heat sinks and cooling fans to run – not Keith’s lights.

So far, engineers have been scratching their heads as to how the
lights achieve the massive power saving and low heat losses. Keith
will only say that his LED lights have an ingenious way of directing
the electric current – the rest is a secret! (aka snake oil ???)

Keith has also developed an innovative way to change the current from
the mains AC into the DC needed to run an LED. The diode itself is
used to ‘rectify’ the current. By doing this, Keith’s lights save more
power and run much cooler than current lights."
===================================================================

- Franc Zabkar

What really annoys me (apart from that teminally patronising
presenter!) is the readiness of the panel to endorse virtually
anything that appears on the show. To my knowledge, they have never
said "This is a load of %$#@ ! Forget it !!"

In this case, the total absence of any verifiable figures should have
precluded Higgins from the show instead of which he gets the prize for
the evening !

Dave

It would have been more interesting if James Moody were on the panel
that night, some more pertinent questions may have been asked.

- Rob.

 

[Dave Goldfinch]

On Fri, 20 Jul 2007 06:19:10 +1000, r@r.r.com wrote:

On Mon, 16 Jul 2007 00:41:55 GMT, Dave Goldfinch
daveg50_8@NotCoolMail.invalid> wrote:

On Sat, 14 Jul 2007 11:07:03 +1000, Franc Zabkar
fzabkar@iinternode.on.net> wrote:

Did anyone see the Solid State Lighting invention on the ABC New
Inventors program last Wednesday?

See http://www.abc.net.au/tv/newinventors/txt/s1969641.htm

... or watch the video:
http://www.abc.net.au/tv/newinventors/video/default.htm?program=newinventors&pres=20070711_2000&story=1

Does the following description sound like anything out of the
ordinary? Surely the idea of using the LEDs themselves to rectify
current is nothing new. In fact I suspect that's how my LED night
light works, ie by using strings of antiparallel diode pairs.

As for the claim that "his LED lights have an ingenious way of
directing the electric current", what does he mean by that?

I seem to recall that he said that his innovation involved
"architectural" changes (redesigned lenses?), and that the LED current
was 415mA. Presumably he is using off-the-shelf LEDs.


Here is an excerpt from the Overview:

===================================================================
"There are some LEDs being used for bulk lighting applications, but
these require rectifiers (to transform the current from AC to DC) as
well as heat sinks and cooling fans to run – not Keith’s lights.

So far, engineers have been scratching their heads as to how the
lights achieve the massive power saving and low heat losses. Keith
will only say that his LED lights have an ingenious way of directing
the electric current – the rest is a secret! (aka snake oil ???)

Keith has also developed an innovative way to change the current from
the mains AC into the DC needed to run an LED. The diode itself is
used to ‘rectify’ the current. By doing this, Keith’s lights save more
power and run much cooler than current lights."
===================================================================

- Franc Zabkar

What really annoys me (apart from that teminally patronising
presenter!) is the readiness of the panel to endorse virtually
anything that appears on the show. To my knowledge, they have never
said "This is a load of %$#@ ! Forget it !!"

In this case, the total absence of any verifiable figures should have
precluded Higgins from the show instead of which he gets the prize for
the evening !

Dave

It would have been more interesting if James Moody were on the panel
that night, some more pertinent questions may have been asked.

- Rob.

I certainly agree. They seem to be short of people who have half a
clue about electrical or electronic devices - remember that Protex
device ? I don't recall whether it won the evening prize ?

Dave

 

[Ross Herbert]

On Fri, 20 Jul 2007 00:30:00 GMT, Dave Goldfinch
<daveg50_8@NotCoolMail.invalid> wrote:

- remember that Protex
device ? I don't recall whether it won the evening prize ?

Dave

No it didn't win that night (thank goodness). The winner was the Axle
Tow Feeder
http://www.abc.net.au/tv/newinventors/txt/s1356442.htm

 

[Mike]

In article <vc8g935fqgf06stuffr4i60ra2dbd1qjc3@4ax.com>, fzabkar@iinternode.on.net says...

Did anyone see the Solid State Lighting invention on the ABC New
Inventors program last Wednesday?

See http://www.abc.net.au/tv/newinventors/txt/s1969641.htm

... or watch the video:
http://www.abc.net.au/tv/newinventors/video/default.htm?program=newinventors&pres=20070711_2000&story=1

I recall the "inventor" said he was involved in changing the wafer design !

Also did anyone notice the large difference in LED output, some looked
like they had been cooked,

Peak of 415mA is not unusual at the peak of the AC waveform, depending on
how many he had used,

But to call it an invention is just plain wrong, its an engineering
adpatation at best, and not a very good one at that !


--
Regards
Mike
* VK/VL Commodore FuseRails that wont warp or melt with fuse failure indication
and now with auto 10-15 min timer for engine illumination option.
* VN, VP, VR Models with relay holder in progress.
* Twin Tyres to suit most sedans, trikes and motorcycle sidecars
http://niche.iinet.net.au

 

[Franc Zabkar]

On Mon, 16 Jul 2007 21:16:35 +1000, "Poxy" <pox@poxymail.com> put
finger to keyboard and composed:

Franc Zabkar wrote:
On Mon, 16 Jul 2007 16:58:27 +1000, John Tserkezis
jt@techniciansyndrome.org.invalid> put finger to keyboard and
composed:

I still don't see why anyone would buy them though, because dollar
for dollar, halogens win hands down. Only perhaps tree huggers may
buy them.

The latest SC mag has an article on Ostar LED lights that are claimed
to be on par with halogens for light output:
http://www.reuk.co.uk/Osram-Ostar-Lighting-LED.htm

I haven't seen that SC yet, but looking at the specs for that Osram unit one
thing stands out - the CRI (Colour Rendering Index) quoted is 80, which
makes for pretty horrible light compared to the better fluorescents.

Someone else at sci.electronics.repair also commented that his
personal experience of LED colour rendering was less than
satisfactory. However, the inventor who is the subject of this thread
claims that his LED lights don't have this problem.

- Franc Zabkar
--
Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email.

 

[Mr.T]

"John Tserkezis" <jt@techniciansyndrome.org.invalid> wrote in message
news:469b1714$0$10708$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...

Of course there is, the LED's can't be 240V surely.

No, of course not. And I don't see the reason you ask this question
unless
you missed the bit in this thread that places them in series - enough to
give
a suitable average current, along with suitable limits for waveform peaks
and
local power grid variations.

So what happens if one of the string fails?

MrT.

 

[Mr.T]

"David L. Jones" <altzone@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1184582245.833394.52730@i38g2000prf.googlegroups.com...

Any time you need more money for your medication Phil, we'd all be
happy to help you out, just post your PayPal address.

You'd *give* money to Phil???
Cheaper to just ignore him.

MrT.

 

[Mr.T]

"Franc Zabkar" <fzabkar@iinternode.on.net> wrote in message
news:lqun93550miikpt3jl7drj67v79od37e36@4ax.com...

Someone else at sci.electronics.repair also commented that his
personal experience of LED colour rendering was less than
satisfactory. However, the inventor who is the subject of this thread
claims that his LED lights don't have this problem.

But unfortunately provides no evidence for any of his claims so far.

MrT.

 

[Phil Allison]

"Mr.Turd"

So what happens if one of the string fails?

** Depends on the type of failure.

IME - LEDs commonly fail to a low Z or short cct.

Open cct or high Z failures could be mitigated by a zener in parallel with
each LED.




......... Phil

 

[Mr.T]

"Phil Allison Turd"<philallison@tpg.com.au> wrote in message
news:5g3b61F3fkhm7U1@mid.individual.net...

So what happens if one of the string fails?

** Depends on the type of failure.

IME - LEDs commonly fail to a low Z or short cct.

Which may eventually lead to a cascading failure without separate current
limiting.

Open cct or high Z failures could be mitigated by a zener in parallel with
each LED.

Possibly, or they may not bother. We shall have to wait and see if it's
another case of Xmas lights

MrT.

 

[Poxy]

Phil Allison wrote:

"Poxy"


** Make your ( wrong) point or PISS OFF .

"Phil"

** I've already made my point, which was that the Osram Ostar LED units that
were mentioned have notably poor colour rendering. I don't believe this is
incorrect, nor that difficult to comprehend, however if you are having
problems, I'm happy to explain anything you don't understand.

 

[David L. Jones]

On Jul 17, 6:10 pm, "Mr.T" <MrT@home> wrote:

"Phil Allison Turd"<philalli...@tpg.com.au> wrote in message

news:5g3b61F3fkhm7U1@mid.individual.net...



So what happens if one of the string fails?

** Depends on the type of failure.

IME - LEDs commonly fail to a low Z or short cct.

Which may eventually lead to a cascading failure without separate current
limiting.

Open cct or high Z failures could be mitigated by a zener in parallel with
each LED.

Possibly, or they may not bother. We shall have to wait and see if it's
another case of Xmas lights

MrT.

I'm sure his "team of Chinese scientists" have it all figured out... :-
Dave.