SMD desoldering tutorial?

[Active8]

On Mon, 05 Jan 2004 06:39:21 GMT, Xenot@pacbell.net said...

nobody@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:MPG.1a6295d9f57f8650989697@news.starband.net...
In article <BC1DEB59966816FB93@192.168.0.>, rdbarone@shaw.ca says...
Gingerly stepping around the current arguments about theft, etc...

Would the device shown on www.usbmicro.com/odn/index.html work in
reverse?
Would an aquarium pump pull enough vacuum to desolder? It would be nice
to
be able to do single-handed desoldering without shelling out hundreds of
dollars.

The low cost pumps don't have a tube as an input. Wouldn't the iron cool
too much with continuous input airflow? Perhaps?

The Desoldering iron is about 20 Watts.

45W per the article. I threw the pakage away, but I'll see if it's
on the iron later.

The airflow from an aquarium pump
is quite limited. With the Steel Wool to distribute the heat and impede the
air flow there is ample power to heat the passing air to the temperature
needed to flow a small volume of solder. In my experience it would be of no
value for anything of significant size, like the tab on a power device.

Without air the temperature will rise to about 800 degrees F. It is not
regulated!

For desoldering there are pumps with a fitting on the input, but I never
tried anything like that.
I made my own hot air soldering units from Quartz tubing and NiChrome heater
wire, but the element is about 20 watts, so the result is nearly the same!

You posted that quartz/NiChrome rig somewhere else recently, no?

--
Best Regards,
Mike

 

[Active8]

On Mon, 05 Jan 2004 06:44:41 GMT, g.ryan@macetech.com said...

The low cost pumps dont have a tube as an input. Wouldn't the iron cool
too much with continous input airflow? Perhaps?

You're probably right.

I'd suggest just attaching the bulb to the end of the tube, and stepping on
it to create a foot-activated vaccum bulb. Probably could devise a more
elegant bellows solution if necessary.


Oh my. A real solder sucker (at least the one I used - the Weller

hot-air station demo I set up didn't touch on desoldering except
for the hot tweezers and hot-air desoldering for IC packs) has a
hole in the handle that sucks air when you're not desoldering. You
mash the foot pedal to get the vacuum running, put iron to joint
and when the solder melts, you put yer finger over der hole to
cause the tip to suck. If you suck to much , the tip cools and
you get a cup of coffee. That's not a reward. The temp doesn't take
that long to come up on a good unit, either. There was a glass tube
inside the tool handle with an s-curved metal (Al, I think) strip
inside to catch the solder and there was a vacuum filter (looked
like something out of a car) at the input to the pump.

Probably the only patentable idea along these lines I've seen of
late is a gun style de-soldering (?) unit. The key idea here is
that it's an improvement over existing designs because the whole
thing is hand-held, and I think there were some claims along the
lines of "improved pump" or something.

DigiKey and or Newark had one type of unit or the other for around
$500 and the Weller hot-air units (Weller rules!) started at around
$1500. Jenny from Newark helped me set up the Weller demo. Jenny
wasn't around last time I called. I think she moved on. Bummer. If
you ever get a Jenny that used to work for Newark, you've got a
good rep.

There's another reason that patenting a cheap home-brew deal isn't
feasible. The reason is that even the cheapest units have temp
control and air-flow rate control. These little things cost money
to manufacture. The Weller hot-air station has a digital temp
readout. You can see the tip temperature change while you work. So
your market will be small companies and hobbyist. You're going to
spend your profits defending your patent, too.

I also doubt that that RS solder sucker, even though it's the best,
cheap, solder-sucker I've used, is going to take much abuse. I can
see that metal tube breaking off where it connects to the head.

It isn't hard to hold the bulb with your thumb while you heat the
joint and then let go, but I think adding a vacuum might be good. I
can't get it to do small pads on multi-layer boards, but with a
small tip, a real sucker does the job. The hole in the RS tip is
too big.

--
Best Regards,
Mike

 

[DarkMatter]

On Mon, 05 Jan 2004 10:56:39 GMT, Active8
<mTHISREMOVEcolasono@earthlink.net,invalid> Gave us:

For one thing, there's an implied copyright on anything original
that you wright, but you can't enforce it until it's registered.
Then you get into other little details which I forget, but theres
at least one decent site out there that covers the major points.

The problem is... in this case, it is NOT original, nor
copyrightable.

 

[Michael A. Terrell]

Active8 wrote:

Probably the only patentable idea along these lines I've seen of
late is a gun style de-soldering (?) unit. The key idea here is
that it's an improvement over existing designs because the whole
thing is hand-held, and I think there were some claims along the
lines of "improved pump" or something.

--
Best Regards,
Mike

Have you ever used one of these? I thought they were clumsy and
heavy. I wouldn't want one, unless I only used it a couple minutes a
day. They seem like a prime candidate for causing Carpal Tunnel
Syndrome. Heavy, repetitious motion, and the vibration from the pump.
--
We now return you to our normally scheduled programming.

Michael A. Terrell
Central Florida

 

[Active8]

On Mon, 05 Jan 2004 14:55:28 GMT, mike.terrell@earthlink.net
said...

Active8 wrote:

Probably the only patentable idea along these lines I've seen of
late is a gun style de-soldering (?) unit. The key idea here is
that it's an improvement over existing designs because the whole
thing is hand-held, and I think there were some claims along the
lines of "improved pump" or something.

--
Best Regards,
Mike

Have you ever used one of these? I thought they were clumsy and
heavy. I wouldn't want one, unless I only used it a couple minutes a
day. They seem like a prime candidate for causing Carpal Tunnel
Syndrome. Heavy, repetitious motion, and the vibration from the pump.

No and you're probably right about the carpal tunnel prob. Chaulk

another one up for the PTO. The claims were just that, claims, and
the problems of course weren't mentioned. I think I got something
about it in the mail. IIRC it was a poor copy. I think it was what,
$400 or so?

I wonder how long it will be before someone files a class action
suit against all and sundry.

It might be handy in the field for occasional use... I've found
that when I'm using a heavy pistol grip thingy like a drill, it
helps to point my thumb upward - "thumbs up". That won't
necessarily prevent the c.t. but it might. I don't get cramped.

I said it was patentable and on the surface, being hand held is an
improvement, but 2 - 4 = -2, -4 being the drawbacks. I usually
jokingly say that I could patent a square wheel, but having a
patent doesn't mean something will work well, if at all.

--
Best Regards,
Mike

 

[Active8]

On Mon, 05 Jan 2004 06:47:26 -0800,
DarkMatter@thebarattheendoftheuniverse.org said...

On Mon, 05 Jan 2004 10:56:39 GMT, Active8
mTHISREMOVEcolasono@earthlink.net,invalid> Gave us:

For one thing, there's an implied copyright on anything original
that you wright,

^^^^^ oh my! I do suck.

pen wright - one skilled in writing with a pen, ok?

but you can't enforce it until it's registered.
Then you get into other little details which I forget, but theres
at least one decent site out there that covers the major points.


The problem is... in this case, it is NOT original, nor
copyrightable.

The wording is so close that if the original were copyrightable,
the copier would have to cease and desist. I think that if I wrote
an article on how I went to the hardware store and cobbled together
a whachamacallit, I'd be covered with an implied copyright and
could register it.

The copyright sites I checked out also had some info on
copyrighting electronic media like software.

Take a web page. Even if the content was reprinted with permission,
say AP wires, the page itself can bear the copyright mark. Layout,
works of art... stuff like that. You can even put copyright marks
on your digital (or emulsion) photos and watermark 'em.

But you can't copyright the 1 pixel image you use for a spacer.
Yes, you can use a single pixel for a variable spacer just by
defining the image size in the tag, it'll resize. You just don't
wan't to do that often 'cause the page will render slowly, so you
make a bigger spacer.
--
Best Regards,
Mike

 

[DaveC]

On Sun, 4 Jan 2004 15:39:59 -0800, Garrett Mace wrote
(in message <av1Kb.15246$VV4.5893@twister.rdc-kc.rr.com&gt:

I had to replace an FPGA on a development board once. I used a $20 heat gun
clamped in a partially-completed CNC machine I was building. It only takes a
few seconds for the solder to melt when the heat gun is on its lowest
setting. I also used the heat gun to solder on the new FPGA, then touched up
a few pins with a soldering iron. Ideally there would be a heat shield to
prevent heating up other components, but in this case it wasn't a problem.
The pins heat up so much faster than the rest of the chip; all you need to
do is keep the internal temperature of the device less than 450 degrees F.

Here's a pic of the ROMs I want to desolder (the big chips in the photo).
Identical set on identical board I want to replace...

http://home.covad.net/~peninsula/ROMpic.jpg

How do these rate on the scale of difficulty? (What are these packages?)

Thanks,
--
DaveC
me@privacy.net
This is an invalid return address
Please reply in the news group

 

[Garrett Mace]

Here's a pic of the ROMs I want to desolder (the big chips in the photo).
Identical set on identical board I want to replace...

http://home.covad.net/~peninsula/ROMpic.jpg

How do these rate on the scale of difficulty? (What are these packages?)

Those would be pretty easy to remove with the hot air gun method. I've
removed hundreds of similar-sized chips from laptop motherboards. However
the tough part is the proximity of those two plastic sockets; on the PCB you
want to keep, you'll need to shield those somehow. Perhaps tape a couple
layers of aluminum foil over them, and only heat the chips until you see the
solder wet up, then quickly turn off the heat gun and flip the chips over
with a dental pick. You would probably want to practice with the board you
don't want to keep, and see if you can keep the plastic sockets from
melting. If you can't, then maybe you should use a Chipquik or hot air
pencil method.

For chips that size, and with only two side with pins, I've removed many by
simply dolloping solder on and continually wiping the tip of the soldering
iron along the row of pins, while keeping upward pressure on that side with
a dental pick. You should be able to flex one side of the chip free from the
board, then do the same thing to the other side. That always used to work
with DIP packages too, but it's actually much easier on these small
surface-mount chips.

 

[Roger Gt]

"Active8" wrote in message

On Mon, 05 Jan 2004 06:39:21 GMT, Xenot@pacbell.net said...
nobody@nowhere.com> wrote in message
rdbarone@shaw.ca says...
Gingerly stepping around the current arguments about theft, etc...
Would the device shown on www.usbmicro.com/odn/index.html work in
reverse?
Would an aquarium pump pull enough vacuum to desolder? It would be
nice
to
be able to do single-handed desoldering without shelling out
hundreds of
dollars.

The low cost pumps don't have a tube as an input. Wouldn't the iron
cool
too much with continuous input airflow? Perhaps?

The Desoldering iron is about 20 Watts.

45W per the article. I threw the pakage away, but I'll see if it's
on the iron later.

The airflow from an aquarium pump
is quite limited. With the Steel Wool to distribute the heat and impede
the
air flow there is ample power to heat the passing air to the temperature
needed to flow a small volume of solder. In my experience it would be
of no
value for anything of significant size, like the tab on a power device.

Without air the temperature will rise to about 800 degrees F. It is not
regulated!

For desoldering there are pumps with a fitting on the input, but I never
tried anything like that.
I made my own hot air soldering units from Quartz tubing and NiChrome
heater
wire, but the element is about 20 watts, so the result is nearly the
same!

You posted that quartz/NiChrome rig somewhere else recently, no?

Right. Also your right, I misspoke, I meant to say that the Desoldering
Iron was 45 Watts, but performed like my unit which was 20 watts.

 

[Sunny]

DaveC wrote:

On Sun, 4 Jan 2004 15:39:59 -0800, Garrett Mace wrote
(in message <av1Kb.15246$VV4.5893@twister.rdc-kc.rr.com&gt:


I had to replace an FPGA on a development board once. I used a $20 heat gun
clamped in a partially-completed CNC machine I was building. It only takes a
few seconds for the solder to melt when the heat gun is on its lowest
setting. I also used the heat gun to solder on the new FPGA, then touched up
a few pins with a soldering iron. Ideally there would be a heat shield to
prevent heating up other components, but in this case it wasn't a problem.
The pins heat up so much faster than the rest of the chip; all you need to
do is keep the internal temperature of the device less than 450 degrees F.


Here's a pic of the ROMs I want to desolder (the big chips in the photo).
Identical set on identical board I want to replace...

http://home.covad.net/~peninsula/ROMpic.jpg

How do these rate on the scale of difficulty? (What are these packages?)

They appear to be 44-pin SOP packages with a gull wing lead pitch of 1mm.

I would rate them as fairly easy as there is good access to the ends of
the devices for introducing the stainless strip, and 1mm pitch leads are
quite resistant to bending and easy to resolder without bridging
(compared to 0.5mm pitch SSOP leads).

I have used the Chipquik-and-stainless-strip method successfully many
times on identical parts. They might also be good candidates for the
Radio Shack desolderer/Aquarium pump hot air gun (I bought the parts
today but haven't assembled and tried it yet).

 

[ampdoc]

Hakko makes a 85W iron for desoldering flat packs. The iron is about $80.00
and all the tips run about 150.00 It is called the mach FP and is on hakko's
site at:
http://www.hakkousa.com/WEB1/Products/Mach-FP/mach-fp.htm
The trick is to tin the tip good and invert the item you are desoldering for
"gravity assist". Ive been using one for sevral years and after practicing
with some old PCB's for about 20 minutes have never lifted any traces or
damaged a device. You can get it form East Coast Transistor
http://www.kenwoodparts.com
--
Jammy Harbin
J & J Electronics, Inc
227 S. 4Th St.
Selmer, TN 38375
731-645-3311
"Garrett Mace" <g.ryan@macetech.com> wrote in message
news:9RjKb.53564$fq1.27241@twister.rdc-kc.rr.com...

Here's a pic of the ROMs I want to desolder (the big chips in the
photo).
Identical set on identical board I want to replace...

http://home.covad.net/~peninsula/ROMpic.jpg

How do these rate on the scale of difficulty? (What are these packages?)


Those would be pretty easy to remove with the hot air gun method. I've
removed hundreds of similar-sized chips from laptop motherboards. However
the tough part is the proximity of those two plastic sockets; on the PCB
you
want to keep, you'll need to shield those somehow. Perhaps tape a couple
layers of aluminum foil over them, and only heat the chips until you see
the
solder wet up, then quickly turn off the heat gun and flip the chips over
with a dental pick. You would probably want to practice with the board you
don't want to keep, and see if you can keep the plastic sockets from
melting. If you can't, then maybe you should use a Chipquik or hot air
pencil method.

For chips that size, and with only two side with pins, I've removed many
by
simply dolloping solder on and continually wiping the tip of the soldering
iron along the row of pins, while keeping upward pressure on that side
with
a dental pick. You should be able to flex one side of the chip free from
the
board, then do the same thing to the other side. That always used to work
with DIP packages too, but it's actually much easier on these small
surface-mount chips.

 

[DarkMatter]

On Mon, 05 Jan 2004 15:26:25 GMT, Active8
<mTHISREMOVEcolasono@earthlink.net,invalid> Gave us:

The wording is so close that if the original were copyrightable,
the copier would have to cease and desist. I think that if I wrote
an article on how I went to the hardware store and cobbled together
a whachamacallit, I'd be covered with an implied copyright and
could register it.

Except that several such products already exist. You could be
slammed by them. Whether you think you could prove no prior knowledge
of their works, or not.

 

[Active8]

On Mon, 05 Jan 2004 17:23:12 -0800,
DarkMatter@thebarattheendoftheuniverse.org said...

On Mon, 05 Jan 2004 15:26:25 GMT, Active8
mTHISREMOVEcolasono@earthlink.net,invalid> Gave us:

The wording is so close that if the original were copyrightable,
the copier would have to cease and desist. I think that if I wrote
an article on how I went to the hardware store and cobbled together
a whachamacallit, I'd be covered with an implied copyright and
could register it.


Except that several such products already exist.

Yup. It's called competition and free enterprise. Each design is
different enough to be considered unique and that's not patent or
copyright infrigement.

You could be
slammed by them. Whether you think you could prove no prior knowledge
of their works, or not.

You don't understand. I'm talking about writing something in my own

words from notes and original thoughts (even if someone else
thought the same thing and wrote it.) It has to be a unique
presentation of the subject. How many math books tell you how to
add two numbers? It's not plagiarism if the author presented it in
his or her own unique way. And those obvious solutions like, "fill
the ice cube tray with water and put it in the freezer." ...
everyone in the world could write that and even if the whole work
were covered by a copyright, that one obvious sentence can be used
over and over.

If I could copyright the "@" symbol I'd be rich.

If( x == 1)
{
printf("Hi, Dark Matter."\n);
}

anyone can write that.

#include <stdio.h>
int main()
{
printf("Hello World"\n);
}

that one's been used to death. Obvious solution on how to output
the words to the console.

We're not talking about a product covered by a Patent. You can't
get in trouble for telling someone how to build a clone of a
product. Releasing exact original plans is different. You can't get
in trouble for just building one for personal use, either.

We're talking about copyrights which cover software, books,
articles, web pages, works of art, photos...

So if I, in my own words, describe how to build a robot... Look at
how many books there are on that subject. Even if it's a lawn
mower, the subject of which more than one article has been written.
Lots of common electronic blocks are used, and sorry, I don't have
to get permission or give credit on a Thevinin equivalent
terminator.

I forget exactly what it's called other than plagiarism and I
forget some of the fine points of what's copyrightable and what
determines infringement, but if it's obvious to a judge or said
judge can be convinced that I just reworded an existing article,
the copyright of which is registered - remember, IIRC an implied
copyright can't be enforced (threats sometimes work, though) - then
the original author has legal recourse.

The best thing the PIQ (plagiarist in question) could have done
would have been to just write up what he did in his own words and I
suspect he may have never even built one except maybe by following
the USB Micro instructions. An unimaginative paint by the numbers
kind of guy.

Look at AoE or other texts. See any credit given for the current
mirror, resistive divider? Nope, but you'll see statements like
"Courtesy of Analog Devices" where reprints are done.

--
Best Regards,
Mike

 

[Daniel L. Belton]

Active8 wrote:

<snip>

There are a lot of people that can steal an idea, slightly alter it, and
claim that they did all of the original work. These people are not worth
half of a good engineer that can create new ideas. Even an engineer that
uses example material - but makes it clear that the material came from
another source - is of more value than someone that just steals.

Frankly I can imagine that this student has a hard drive full of stolen
music and doesn't think anything of it.

You are talking about copyright infringement, not theft. One major
difference is that if you steal physical property, you deprive the
rightful owner of possesion. In copyright infringement, there is no such
deprivation. Also, there are some legally established justifications for
copying copyright-protected materials. That is to say, not every
unauthorized copy of copyrighted material is punishable under law, at
least in the US.


For one thing, there's an implied copyright on anything original
that you wright, but you can't enforce it until it's registered.
Then you get into other little details which I forget, but theres
at least one decent site out there that covers the major points.

You are right about there being an implied copyright, but wrong about it
not being enforcable until it's registered. it is enforcable from the
minute you write it. Now being able to prove that you are the one that
wrote it first gets to be a little harder if you don't register it.

 

[Sunny]

DaveC wrote:

On Sun, 4 Jan 2004 15:39:59 -0800, Garrett Mace wrote
(in message <av1Kb.15246$VV4.5893@twister.rdc-kc.rr.com&gt:


I had to replace an FPGA on a development board once. I used a $20 heat gun
clamped in a partially-completed CNC machine I was building. It only takes a
few seconds for the solder to melt when the heat gun is on its lowest
setting. I also used the heat gun to solder on the new FPGA, then touched up
a few pins with a soldering iron. Ideally there would be a heat shield to
prevent heating up other components, but in this case it wasn't a problem.
The pins heat up so much faster than the rest of the chip; all you need to
do is keep the internal temperature of the device less than 450 degrees F.


Here's a pic of the ROMs I want to desolder (the big chips in the photo).
Identical set on identical board I want to replace...

http://home.covad.net/~peninsula/ROMpic.jpg

How do these rate on the scale of difficulty? (What are these packages?)

They appear to be 44-pin SOP packages with a gull wing lead pitch of 1mm.

I would rate them as fairly easy as there is good access to the ends of
the devices for introducing the stainless strip, and 1mm pitch leads are
quite resistant to bending and easy to resolder without bridging
(compared to 0.5mm pitch SSOP leads).

I have used the Chipquik-and-stainless-strip method successfully many
times on identical parts. They might also be good candidates for the
Radio Shack desolderer/Aquarium pump hot air gun (I bought the parts
today but haven't assembled and tried it yet).

 

[Mat Nieuwenhoven]

On Sun, 4 Jan 2004 2:30:51 -0800, DaveC wrote:

I need to desolder (with no damage to the components) some SMD ROM chips. Is
there a good tutorial somewhere on the 'net about how to go about this?

BTW, I found a great tutorial on technique and equipment (lo-cost, some of it
make-yourself) on the 'net about soldering SMDs:

http://www.wku.edu/~barceed/SolderPage/index.htm

A radioamateur which desolders SMDs a lot told me the following technique:
Take a heat-resistant, insulated wire like that used to wind transformers.
Stick it behind one row of pins until it comes out on the other side, the
wire should lay just behind the pins. Fasten it some way at one side (e.g.
solder it), preferable somewhat in front of the line of the pins. At the
other side, start heating the pins with a soldering iron, while gently
pulling the free end away from the chip so that the wire pushes against the
back of the pins. When the solder melts, the strain on the wire causes it to
lift the pin and prevent resoldering. Move along the row of pins until all
are done. Repeat as required for other sides.

Mat Nieuwenhoven

 

[maxfoo]

On Sun, 04 Jan 2004 22:05:43 GMT, <nobody@nowhere.com> wrote:

In article <7irgvv0mecuc1vkjjk9k978b06oh9no2sp@4ax.com>,
maxfooHeadFromButt@punkass.com says...
So let the guy know he's a plagiarist, his email is contact@nanosistemas.com

You don't think he knows? He copied. It should be the school that should
be emailed.

I emailed the guy, and this was his reply:

To: <maxfoo@punkass.com>
Subject: Fw: SMD desoldering tutorial?
From: "Eduardo Barcellos" <contact@nanosistemas.com>
Date: Sun, 4 Jan 2004 21:06:52 -0600

i am Eduardo Barcellos who wrote the soldering tutorial.
I went to radioshack and saw that desoldering iron and had the idea. If
someone at usbmicro thought of that before, good, and thanks to them for
sharing the idea. But what im gonna do is, I not gonna publish anymore.
Whatever i find i'll keep for myself and my personal friends, so no one
accuse me of plagiarism again. And im taking my webpage offline too. I even
videotapped another way I used to solder smd so I could add to this page
when I get a chance. But you guys just make me think im wasting my time.
please forward this to the newsgroup if you could. Thanks.


Remove "HeadFromButt", before replying by email.

 

[Klaus Vestergaard Kragelu]

"maxfoo" <maxfooHeadFromButt@punkass.com> wrote in message
news:c09lvvccmq4ge6qht822sscuc5vr929gr9@4ax.com...

On Sun, 04 Jan 2004 22:05:43 GMT, <nobody@nowhere.com> wrote:

In article <7irgvv0mecuc1vkjjk9k978b06oh9no2sp@4ax.com>,
maxfooHeadFromButt@punkass.com says...
So let the guy know he's a plagiarist, his email is
contact@nanosistemas.com

You don't think he knows? He copied. It should be the school that should
be emailed.

I emailed the guy, and this was his reply:

To: <maxfoo@punkass.com
Subject: Fw: SMD desoldering tutorial?
From: "Eduardo Barcellos" <contact@nanosistemas.com
Date: Sun, 4 Jan 2004 21:06:52 -0600

i am Eduardo Barcellos who wrote the soldering tutorial.
I went to radioshack and saw that desoldering iron and had the idea. If
someone at usbmicro thought of that before, good, and thanks to them for
sharing the idea. But what im gonna do is, I not gonna publish anymore.
Whatever i find i'll keep for myself and my personal friends, so no one
accuse me of plagiarism again. And im taking my webpage offline too. I
even
videotapped another way I used to solder smd so I could add to this page
when I get a chance. But you guys just make me think im wasting my time.
please forward this to the newsgroup if you could. Thanks.

If he's genuine, it would be a shame to have "offended" him to the point at
which he will erase his page....

Cheers

Klaus

 

[Roger Johansson]

"Klaus Vestergaard Kragelund" <klauskvik@hotmail.com> wrote:

If he's genuine, it would be a shame to have "offended" him to the point at
which he will erase his page....

It happens all the time, overexcited manly minds, net cops and
moralists, scare common people off the web and off newsgroups.

Here is an example from another newsgroup:

"If you were downloading legally you might have mentioned you
subscribe to several music services"

Why on EARTH should Francesca have to say so ? hmmm ?

God damn what is wrong with people these days. Self rightous.com.

Jeez.

Take a break once in a while.

They cannot take a break. They are driven by a culture which produces
workaholics, restless people who are unable to relax.

It is a game of social dominance, the more intense you are the more
respect you gain. Intensive feelings of love, hate, fear, anger, that
is the result of the created mind.

The love they create is like a drug, built on anger and conviction.

It is actually exactly what Francesca said:

As I said your a Fucked up Arsehole

Young boys are driven to be ruthless, rude, wild, angry.
Then they are fucked up by girls who have trained their will power for
many years so they are very convincing, they can make a stupid young
punk very very happy. Centrally stimulated nervous systems.

That is the culture which produces all these fundamentalists, net
cops, purists, alcoholics, moralists, and all kinds of people filled
with anger, bitterness, fear, intensive love, obsessions with sex,
gambling, drugs, violence, etc..
Rude Linux people have overheated brains for the same reasons.

It is a cultural pattern, a set of traditions which have been taught
from generation to generation from the stone age into modern times.

There are social processes, standard procedures for how to train
children, create gender roles, transforming boys to men, procedures
for marriage, etc..

Earlier it was justified by religious ideology, how to create the holy
spirit, how to create eternal love, the holy marriage, etc..

Today the same lifestyle and social procedures are justified by new
ideologies, they talk about social competence, developing
personalities, etc.. but it is the same traditions and gender roles as
in the stone age.


--
Roger J.

(My email address is a spam trap, don't use it)

 

[DarkMatter]

On Tue, 06 Jan 2004 02:19:37 GMT, Active8
<mTHISREMOVEcolasono@earthlink.net,invalid> Gave us:

Yup. It's called competition and free enterprise. Each design is
different enough to be considered unique and that's not patent or
copyright infrigement.

It also renders many of them NON patentable as they are not
different enough as to be a unique idea.

In fact, it means that nearly any version of that particular
product, even a directly copied one, is not any infringement.

There are many circuits in electronics which were designed by one,
yet reside in the public domain. Same thing for some mechanical
devices.

You want a patent? Do not attempt to patent the entire product.
Find some small feature that you have incorporated into it, and patent
only that. THEN a direct copy by an unsuspecting plagiarizer is
prosecutable as patent infringement.