Power Conversion Electronics

[pg]

I just purchase a Silverstone Power Supply Unit (PSU) for my PC.

I am amaze with the PFC (Power Factor Correction) rating of over 0.96,
which, according to some indicators, means it's 96% efficient. (4%
wastage as heat).

Since it's a new unit I dare not to open up the PSU to see what type
of electronics they are using.

So I post the question here ----

Can anyone tell me what type of Power Conversion Electronic Devices
they use in those high PFC rating PSU?

Thank you all !!!

 

[Ken]

On Sun, 26 Apr 2009 02:20:26 -0700 (PDT), pg <penang@catholic.org>
wrote:

I just purchase a Silverstone Power Supply Unit (PSU) for my PC.

I am amaze with the PFC (Power Factor Correction) rating
of over 0.96, which, according to some indicators,
means it's 96% efficient. (4% wastage as heat).

PFC and efficiency are not the same thing.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Power_factor_correction
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Energy_conversion_efficiency

 

[Sylvia Else]

pg wrote:

I just purchase a Silverstone Power Supply Unit (PSU) for my PC.

I am amaze with the PFC (Power Factor Correction) rating of over 0.96,
which, according to some indicators, means it's 96% efficient. (4%
wastage as heat).

Since it's a new unit I dare not to open up the PSU to see what type
of electronics they are using.

So I post the question here ----

Can anyone tell me what type of Power Conversion Electronic Devices
they use in those high PFC rating PSU?

Thank you all !!!

Something like this, perhaps

http://www.onsemi.com/pub_link/Collateral/NCP1653-D.PDF

Sylvia.

 

[Sylvia Else]

Sylvia Else wrote:

pg wrote:
I just purchase a Silverstone Power Supply Unit (PSU) for my PC.

I am amaze with the PFC (Power Factor Correction) rating of over 0.96,
which, according to some indicators, means it's 96% efficient. (4%
wastage as heat).

Since it's a new unit I dare not to open up the PSU to see what type
of electronics they are using.

So I post the question here ----

Can anyone tell me what type of Power Conversion Electronic Devices
they use in those high PFC rating PSU?

Thank you all !!!

Something like this, perhaps

http://www.onsemi.com/pub_link/Collateral/NCP1653-D.PDF

Sylvia.

Hmm.... I wonder how those would handle an input in the form of a
"modified sine wave", which would more accurately be described as a
modified square wave, as typically produced by cheaper UPSs.

An ordinary PC PS wouldn't notice the difference.

Sylvia.

 

[pg]

On Apr 26, 2:33 am, Ken <ke...@telia.com> wrote:

On Sun, 26 Apr 2009 02:20:26 -0700 (PDT), pg <pen...@catholic.org
wrote:

I just purchase a Silverstone Power Supply Unit (PSU) for my PC.

I am amaze with the PFC (Power Factor Correction) rating
of over 0.96, which, according to some indicators,
means it's 96% efficient. (4% wastage as heat).

PFC and efficiency are not the same thing.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Power_factor_correctionhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Energy_conversion_efficiency

Many thanks for the info !!

 

[david]

On Sun, 26 Apr 2009 02:20:26 -0700, pg rearranged some electrons to say:

I just purchase a Silverstone Power Supply Unit (PSU) for my PC.

I am amaze with the PFC (Power Factor Correction) rating of over 0.96,
which, according to some indicators, means it's 96% efficient. (4%
wastage as heat).

Since it's a new unit I dare not to open up the PSU to see what type of
electronics they are using.

So I post the question here ----

Can anyone tell me what type of Power Conversion Electronic Devices they
use in those high PFC rating PSU?

Thank you all !!!

0.96 power factor does not mean 96% efficient. But, to answer your
question, active power factor correction means that the front end of the
power supply tries to keep the phase between the voltage and current
waveforms as small as possible.

 

[UCLAN]

pg wrote:

I just purchase a Silverstone Power Supply Unit (PSU) for my PC.

I am amaze with the PFC (Power Factor Correction) rating of over 0.96,
which, according to some indicators, means it's 96% efficient. (4%
wastage as heat).

Since it's a new unit I dare not to open up the PSU to see what type
of electronics they are using.

So I post the question here ----

Can anyone tell me what type of Power Conversion Electronic Devices
they use in those high PFC rating PSU?

Please do not confuse Power Factor Correction (PFC) with power supply
efficiency. They are two separate items. PFC can be either active or
passive, but usually alters the highly capacitive input of SMPSs.

Google "PFC".

 

[MooseFET]

On Apr 26, 7:08 am, Sylvia Else <syl...@not.at.this.address> wrote:

Sylvia Else wrote:
pg wrote:
I just purchase a Silverstone Power Supply Unit (PSU) for my PC.

I am amaze with the PFC (Power Factor Correction) rating of over 0.96,
which, according to some indicators, means it's 96% efficient. (4%
wastage as heat).

Since it's a new unit I dare not to open up the PSU to see what type
of electronics they are using.

So I post the question here ----

Can anyone tell me what type of Power Conversion Electronic Devices
they use in those high PFC rating PSU?

Thank you all !!!

Something like this, perhaps

http://www.onsemi.com/pub_link/Collateral/NCP1653-D.PDF

Sylvia.

Hmm.... I wonder how those would handle an input in the form of a
"modified sine wave", which would more accurately be described as a
modified square wave, as typically produced by cheaper UPSs.

An ordinary PC PS wouldn't notice the difference.

Most power factor correction circuit will run on a rounded off square
wave without any trouble. In the short term, they watch the input
voltage and match the current to that. They don't make their own sine
function to match the current to.

Sylvia.

 

[MooseFET]

On Apr 26, 5:32 am, david <n...@nospam.com> wrote:

On Sun, 26 Apr 2009 02:20:26 -0700, pg rearranged some electrons to say:

I just purchase a Silverstone Power Supply Unit (PSU) for my PC.

I am amaze with the PFC (Power Factor Correction) rating of over 0.96,
which, according to some indicators, means it's 96% efficient. (4%
wastage as heat).

Since it's a new unit I dare not to open up the PSU to see what type of
electronics they are using.

So I post the question here ----

Can anyone tell me what type of Power Conversion Electronic Devices they
use in those high PFC rating PSU?

Thank you all !!!

0.96 power factor does not mean 96% efficient.  But, to answer your
question,  active power factor correction means that the front end of the
power supply tries to keep the phase between the voltage and current
waveforms as small as possible.

It also tries not to draw any current at harmonics. It is unfortunate
that one term is now used for two effects but we are stuck with it.

 

[Tim Williams]

On Apr 26, 11:33 am, MooseFET <kensm...@rahul.net> wrote:

It also tries not to draw any current at harmonics.  It is unfortunate
that one term is now used for two effects but we are stuck with it.

Displacement Factor is the fudamental only.

Tim

 

[Nicholas Bodley]

On Sun, 26 Apr 2009 19:39:23 +1000, Sylvia Else wrote:

http://www.onsemi.com/pub_link/Collateral/NCP1653-D.PDF
Sylvia.

Most interesting! I'd been wondering how it's done. Basic circuit is
quite simple. Although I didn't read carefully, it seems that only at the
end did I learn that it can provide 300 VDC to the inverter; wasn't sure
until then whether the complete circuit was for low voltage output.

I'd guess that total component cost is pretty modest.

Regards,
nb

 

[Phil Allison]

"UCLAN"

Please do not confuse Power Factor Correction (PFC) with power supply
efficiency. They are two separate items.

** OK so far.

PFC can be either active or passive,

** Hmmmm...

but usually alters the highly capacitive input of SMPSs.

** TOTAL BOLLOCKS !!!

They are not capacitive, there is no phase angle.

Active PFCs correct WAVEFORM distortion.



....... Phil

 

[John Larkin]

On Mon, 27 Apr 2009 12:22:11 +1000, "Phil Allison"
<philallison@tpg.com.au> wrote:

"UCLAN"

Please do not confuse Power Factor Correction (PFC) with power supply
efficiency. They are two separate items.

** OK so far.

PFC can be either active or passive,

** Hmmmm...

but usually alters the highly capacitive input of SMPSs.


** TOTAL BOLLOCKS !!!

They are not capacitive, there is no phase angle.

Active PFCs correct WAVEFORM distortion.



...... Phil

Take you meds and lie down for a while. What he said was perfectly
reasonable.

John

 

[Phil Allison]

"John Larkin"
"Phil Allison"

"UCLAN"

Please do not confuse Power Factor Correction (PFC) with power supply
efficiency. They are two separate items.

** OK so far.

PFC can be either active or passive,

** Hmmmm...

but usually alters the highly capacitive input of SMPSs.


** TOTAL BOLLOCKS !!!

They are not capacitive, there is no phase angle.

Active PFCs correct WAVEFORM distortion.


Take you meds and lie down for a while.

** Drop dead.

What he said was perfectly reasonable.

** It was totally FALSE , you insane fuckhead.




...... Phil

 

[Sylvia Else]

Phil Allison wrote:

"UCLAN"

Please do not confuse Power Factor Correction (PFC) with power supply
efficiency. They are two separate items.

** OK so far.

PFC can be either active or passive,

** Hmmmm...

but usually alters the highly capacitive input of SMPSs.


** TOTAL BOLLOCKS !!!

They are not capacitive, there is no phase angle.

Active PFCs correct WAVEFORM distortion.

If you take the waveform of the current into a conventional SMPS, and
split it into its harmonics, you'll find that the fundamental leads the
voltage. This because the PS's capacitor is charged during the rising
side of the input waveform.

Looks like a phase angle to me.

By making the current proportional to the voltage, active PFCs both
minimise the waveform distortion, and correct the phase angle.

Sylvia.

 

[Nobody]

On Sun, 26 Apr 2009 02:20:26 -0700, pg wrote:

I just purchase a Silverstone Power Supply Unit (PSU) for my PC.

I am amaze with the PFC (Power Factor Correction) rating of over 0.96,
which, according to some indicators, means it's 96% efficient. (4%
wastage as heat).

As others have already pointed out, 0.96 power factor doesn't mean 96%
efficient.

Power factor does have a slight impact upon efficiency, as a low power
factor increases the energy wasted in the power lines, but this is small
compared to the energy actually used by the supply.

Since it's a new unit I dare not to open up the PSU to see what type
of electronics they are using.

So I post the question here ----

Can anyone tell me what type of Power Conversion Electronic Devices
they use in those high PFC rating PSU?

Active PFC involves using a boost converter whose current draw is
sinusoidal and in phase with the voltage.

For more detail than you probably wanted to know, see:

http://www.onsemi.com/pub_link/Collateral/HBD853-D.PDF

 

[UCLAN]

Phil Allison wrote:

Please do not confuse Power Factor Correction (PFC) with power supply
efficiency. They are two separate items.

** OK so far.

Gee, thanks. [Red flag warning!!!]

PFC can be either active or passive,

** Hmmmm...

Careful, a hint of ignorance is showing.

but usually alters the highly capacitive input of SMPSs.

** TOTAL BOLLOCKS !!!

They are not capacitive, there is no phase angle.

And it's finally out. He's a total loon.

There is a big 400vdc capacitor (or two 200vdc caps in series) just after
input rectifiers on the AC input. Note C5 and C6 on:

http://www.pavouk.org/hw/en_atxps.html

They charge to the peak value of the input
AC voltage, or 1.414 times the RMS value. Since the cap(s) draw their maximum
current when at lowest charge (zero cross-over point), and draw their least
amount of current when charged to their highest point, the current waveform
*leads* the voltage waveform by 90 degrees. [Maximum current is at the same
time as minimum voltage; minimum current is at the same time as maximum voltage.]

 

[pg]

On Apr 26, 8:29 pm, Nobody <nob...@nowhere.com> wrote:

On Sun, 26 Apr 2009 02:20:26 -0700, pg wrote:
I just purchase a Silverstone Power Supply Unit (PSU) for my PC.

I am amaze with the PFC (Power Factor Correction) rating of over 0.96,
which, according to some indicators, means it's 96% efficient. (4%
wastage as heat).

As others have already pointed out, 0.96 power factor doesn't mean 96%
efficient.

Power factor does have a slight impact upon efficiency, as a low power
factor increases the energy wasted in the power lines, but this is small
compared to the energy actually used by the supply.

Since it's a new unit I dare not to open up the PSU to see what type
of electronics they are using.

So I post the question here ----

Can anyone tell me what type of Power Conversion Electronic Devices
they use in those high PFC rating PSU?

Active PFC involves using a boost converter whose current draw is
sinusoidal and in phase with the voltage.

For more detail than you probably wanted to know, see:

       http://www.onsemi.com/pub_link/Collateral/HBD853-D.PDF

Thanks a lot for the link !!

 

[Phil Allison]

"UCLAN" = the Original Monkey's Uncle.

Phil Allison wrote:

Please do not confuse Power Factor Correction (PFC) with power supply
efficiency. They are two separate items.

** OK so far.

Gee, thanks. [Red flag warning!!!]

PFC can be either active or passive,

** Hmmmm...

Careful, a hint of ignorance is showing.

but usually alters the highly capacitive input of SMPSs.

** TOTAL BOLLOCKS !!!

They are not capacitive, there is no phase angle.

And it's finally out. He's a total loon.

** This arrogant IMBECILE is about to get a lesson !!!

There is a big 400vdc capacitor (or two 200vdc caps in series) just after
input rectifiers on the AC input.

** And because they are * AFTER * the rectifiers there is NO cap
reactance or phase angle effects involved.

They charge to the peak value of the input
AC voltage, or 1.414 times the RMS value.

** The caps can only draw current when the diodes are forward biased and
cannot pass any current back to the supply.

Negates all capacitive reactance effects.

Since the cap(s) draw their maximum
current when at lowest charge (zero cross-over point),

** 100% FUCKING WRONG !!!!!!!!!!!

The caps can only draw charging current when the AC supply voltage is
greater than the voltage already on the cap - so ( aside from the very
first cycle ) they charge at AC voltage peaks ONLY !!!!!!!!

and draw their least amount of current when charged to their highest
point,

** Insane CRAP !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Even one moment's intelligent thought shows that simply CANNOT be true.

the current waveform
*leads* the voltage waveform by 90 degrees.

** Absolute BOLLOCKS !!!

Max current draw **coincides** with peak AC voltage - there is ZERO
phase angle.

Time for you to go play with the demented Orang-utans

- DICKHEAD !!




...... Phil

 

[kony]

On Mon, 27 Apr 2009 17:14:51 +1000, "Phil Allison"
<philallison@tpg.com.au> wrote:

"UCLAN" = the Original Monkey's Uncle.

Phil Allison wrote:

Please do not confuse Power Factor Correction (PFC) with power supply
efficiency. They are two separate items.

** OK so far.

Gee, thanks. [Red flag warning!!!]

PFC can be either active or passive,

** Hmmmm...

Careful, a hint of ignorance is showing.

but usually alters the highly capacitive input of SMPSs.

** TOTAL BOLLOCKS !!!

They are not capacitive, there is no phase angle.

And it's finally out. He's a total loon.


** This arrogant IMBECILE is about to get a lesson !!!

Maybe, but you are still a total loon (!!!)

Since the cap(s) draw their maximum
current when at lowest charge (zero cross-over point),


** 100% FUCKING WRONG !!!!!!!!!!!

When one uses this many apostrophies, it is customary to ask
Vanna for a vowel and pay for each. You have not done so,
and so it is detracting from your attempted point.

The caps can only draw charging current when the AC supply voltage is
greater than the voltage already on the cap - so ( aside from the very
first cycle ) they charge at AC voltage peaks ONLY !!!!!!!!

Ok !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Time for you to go play with the demented Orang-utans

Wait, are you saying we now have a petting zoo?

cool!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Which cage are you in, I will stop by and throw you a
peanut. And some lithium.