OT: effect of US Govt shutting down software accounts

[Winfield Hill]

https://www.theverge.com/2019/10/7/20904030/adobe-venezuela-photoshop-behance-us-sanctions

Adobe is shutting down service for users in Venezuela
in order to comply with a U.S. executive order. This
is not the first time something like this has happened.
It's foolish and short-sighted for the Trump govt. to
behave this way, because it sends the message that if
one places their operational reliance on a U.S. based
supplier, they can be summarily shutoff and damaged,
without recourse; it's safer to use non-U.S. products.


--
Thanks,
- Win

 

[Winfield Hill]

bulegoge@columbus.rr.com wrote...

Would you have felt the same if similar tactics were
used against apparteid SA?

It's basically a terrible policy approach. Consider,
Trump pulled out of the Iran nuclear deal, against
the wishes of most of the rest of the world. Now he
is ramping up punishments to companies, etc., in the
EU if they ignore his Iran edicts. He has activated
a new tool to create mayhem, his favorite activity.


--
Thanks,
- Win

 

[Winfield Hill]

Winfield Hill wrote...

https://www.theverge.com/2019/10/7/20904030/adobe-venezuela-photoshop-behance-us-sanctions

Adobe is shutting down service for users in Venezuela
in order to comply with a U.S. executive order. This
is not the first time something like this has happened.
It's foolish and short-sighted for the Trump govt. to
behave this way, because it sends the message that if
one places their operational reliance on a U.S. based
supplier, they can be summarily shutoff and damaged,
without recourse; it's safer to use non-U.S. products.

A few comments on Slashdot:

Better yet, don't use US products at all. If the US wants
to be xenophobic, controlling dicks, then everyone in the
world should shun them and see how far they get as a
totally isolated nation.

My thoughts exactly. Why would I do business with the US if
some orange cheeto can suddenly interfere and screw me over?

Rent or use digital services from the US at your peril,
definitely not to be trusted. Not the message US
corporations want the US to send out but it is most
definitely the one being broadcast loud and clear.

Absolutely beautiful ammunition to help me dissuade
companies from using American cloud services.

Office 365 is Software-as-a-Service. Microsoft keeps telling
us that Windows 10 is Software-as-a-Service. Is Microsoft
going to shut down Office 365 and Windows 10 for everybody
in Venezuela?


--
Thanks,
- Win

 

Would you have felt the same if similar tactics were used against apparteid SA?

 

On 8 Oct 2019 05:28:57 -0700, Winfield Hill <winfieldhill@yahoo.com>
wrote:

Winfield Hill wrote...

https://www.theverge.com/2019/10/7/20904030/adobe-venezuela-photoshop-behance-us-sanctions

Adobe is shutting down service for users in Venezuela
in order to comply with a U.S. executive order. This
is not the first time something like this has happened.
It's foolish and short-sighted for the Trump govt. to
behave this way, because it sends the message that if
one places their operational reliance on a U.S. based
supplier, they can be summarily shutoff and damaged,
without recourse; it's safer to use non-U.S. products.

A few comments on Slashdot:

Better yet, don't use US products at all. If the US wants
to be xenophobic, controlling dicks, then everyone in the
world should shun them and see how far they get as a
totally isolated nation.

My thoughts exactly. Why would I do business with the US if
some orange cheeto can suddenly interfere and screw me over?

It is nice that someone is the US also notices this situation.

I have tried to avoid being too depending on US products since the
Cold War COCOM years.

During a few recent decades, everything went well, but for two years I
have been again careful and trying to avoid US (and recently UK due to
brexit), products since you do not know which product are export
embargoed next week or suffering from huge duties.

Rent or use digital services from the US at your peril,
definitely not to be trusted. Not the message US
corporations want the US to send out but it is most
definitely the one being broadcast loud and clear.

Absolutely beautiful ammunition to help me dissuade
companies from using American cloud services.

Office 365 is Software-as-a-Service. Microsoft keeps telling
us that Windows 10 is Software-as-a-Service. Is Microsoft
going to shut down Office 365 and Windows 10 for everybody
in Venezuela?

 

So I will infer you think it was ok to apply these pressures to SA. Just checking to see if this is just another "orange man bad" thing

 

[Winfield Hill]

bulegoge@columbus.rr.com wrote...

So I will infer you think it was ok to apply these
pressures to SA. Just checking to see if this is
just another "orange man bad" thing

Well, there's certainly enough bad orange man things
to go around. But I'm against SaS, and not being able
to own critical items, free and clear. Go purchase a
product, should be yours to use without interference,
even if you're a bad guy. I continue to own my Altium
CAD product, even if I stop buying maintenance updates.
I own older copies of Adobe and MS office software, so
I'm free from making their monthly payments. But I am
worried about what's going to happen in the future.


--
Thanks,
- Win

 

[Whoey Louie]

On Tuesday, October 8, 2019 at 8:04:35 AM UTC-4, Winfield Hill wrote:

https://www.theverge.com/2019/10/7/20904030/adobe-venezuela-photoshop-behance-us-sanctions

Adobe is shutting down service for users in Venezuela
in order to comply with a U.S. executive order. This
is not the first time something like this has happened.
It's foolish and short-sighted for the Trump govt. to
behave this way, because it sends the message that if
one places their operational reliance on a U.S. based
supplier, they can be summarily shutoff and damaged,
without recourse; it's safer to use non-U.S. products.


--
Thanks,
- Win

Whatever you think about that, right or wrong, it's trivial compared
to what Trump has done with Iran. Not only has he applied severe
sanctions to Iran, blocking US companies from doing business with them,
but he has also put the full force of the US against any foreign companies
that have any US presence, forcing them to also cease doing business with
Iran, or face US penalties on them. What he's done there, IMO, amounts
to an act of war. That is exactly what the US would consider it if some
foreign power not only cut off trade with us, but used it's power to
force most other companies around the world to cut off trade, against
their will. Imagine the US with 20% unemployment, high inflation,
GDP shrinking 10% a year and what we would do.

 

hatever you think about that, right or wrong, it's trivial compared
to what Trump has done with Iran. Not only has he applied severe
sanctions to Iran, blocking US companies from doing business with them,
but he has also put the full force of the US against any foreign companies
that have any US presence, forcing them to also cease doing business with
Iran, or face US penalties on them. What he's done there, IMO, amounts
to an act of war. That is exactly what the US would consider it if some
foreign power not only cut off trade with us, but used it's power to
force most other companies around the world to cut off trade, against
their will. Imagine the US with 20% unemployment, high inflation,
GDP shrinking 10% a year and what we would do.....


Trump is doing the right thing here. Iran is a rogue state and trump is tired of wars where we shed blood and spend money. This is how you effect needed change without going to war. , Bolton, Romney, Kristol, all of those gop folks are itching to drop bombs

 

[Tom Del Rosso]

Winfield Hill wrote:

bulegoge@columbus.rr.com wrote...

Would you have felt the same if similar tactics were
used against apparteid SA?

It's basically a terrible policy approach. Consider,
Trump pulled out of the Iran nuclear deal, against
the wishes of most of the rest of the world. Now he
is ramping up punishments to companies, etc., in the
EU if they ignore his Iran edicts. He has activated
a new tool to create mayhem, his favorite activity.

The worst kind of mayhem is Russian forces deployed in the middle east
for the first time ever, which began the day after the Iran deal was
signed. That's what happens when you signal retreat.

 

[Tom Del Rosso]

Winfield Hill wrote:

bulegoge@columbus.rr.com wrote...

So I will infer you think it was ok to apply these
pressures to SA. Just checking to see if this is
just another "orange man bad" thing

Well, there's certainly enough bad orange man things
to go around. But I'm against SaS, and not being able
to own critical items, free and clear. Go purchase a
product, should be yours to use without interference,
even if you're a bad guy. I continue to own my Altium
CAD product, even if I stop buying maintenance updates.
I own older copies of Adobe and MS office software, so
I'm free from making their monthly payments. But I am
worried about what's going to happen in the future.

People foolishly prefer subscription deals. They used to buy VCRs and
now they rent DVRs. Setting the VCR clock was such a big challenge.

 

[Winfield Hill]

bulegoge@columbus.rr.com wrote...

Whatever you think about that, right or wrong, it's trivial
compared to what Trump has done with Iran. Not only has ...

Trump is doing the right thing here.

What!? Trump was unhappy the agreement allowed Iran to start
thinking about nuclear weapons on 10 years, despite its taking
away Iran's nuclear material and reinstating inspections, so he
killed the deal, so they can start right away? That's good!?


--
Thanks,
- Win

 

[Tom Del Rosso]

Winfield Hill wrote:

bulegoge@columbus.rr.com wrote...

Whatever you think about that, right or wrong, it's trivial
compared to what Trump has done with Iran. Not only has ...

Trump is doing the right thing here.

What!? Trump was unhappy the agreement allowed Iran to start
thinking about nuclear weapons on 10 years, despite its taking
away Iran's nuclear material and reinstating inspections, so he
killed the deal, so they can start right away? That's good!?

Yes, 10 years goes by pretty fast, and inspections are useless with
countries that have hidden facilities.

 

On Tuesday, October 8, 2019 at 8:04:35 AM UTC-4, Winfield Hill wrote:

https://www.theverge.com/2019/10/7/20904030/adobe-venezuela-photoshop-behance-us-sanctions

Adobe is shutting down service for users in Venezuela
in order to comply with a U.S. executive order. This
is not the first time something like this has happened.
It's foolish and short-sighted for the Trump govt. to
behave this way, because it sends the message that if
one places their operational reliance on a U.S. based
supplier, they can be summarily shutoff and damaged,
without recourse; it's safer to use non-U.S. products.

Ummm- don't let yourself be manipulated by the ultra left wing press and stupid articles almost always written by ridiculously unqualified people. This article was written by a ditz head nerd who doesn't know anything about geopolitics.

Nobody doing business with an American business has to worry about a thing as long as their country has not been officially designated a national security threat to the United States. I mean seriously!

And maybe you missed the part about this new EO being an expansion of EO 13692 issued by Obama. Obama's EO was the typical ineffective fluff that accomplished very little because it went after specific individuals in the Venezuelan government instead of the whole place like it should have. I mean seriously! He probably had to deliberately tone it down to give his Wall Street buddies time to disinvest themselves of Venezuela interests.

From the new EO:
"...in order to take additional steps with respect to the national emergency declared in Executive Order 13692 of March 8, 2015 (Blocking Property and Suspending Entry of Certain Persons Contributing to the Situation in Venezuela), as amended..."
https://www.treasury.gov/resource-center/sanctions/Programs/Documents/13884..pdf

From Obama:
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-venezuela/u-s-declares-venezuela-a-national-security-threat-sanctions-top-officials-iduskbn0m51ns20150310

Screw Adobe.

--
Thanks,
- Win

 

[Cursitor Doom]

On Tue, 08 Oct 2019 07:37:15 -0700, bulegoge wrote:

> Trump is doing the right thing here. Iran is a rogue state

I beg to differ. The Iranians are constantly portrayed as such in the
Western media but that doesn't make it so. Iran has several enemies in
the ME and must be allowed to defend itself just as all its neighbours
are. Stop meddling in Iran's internal politics; foster good relations
with it and they'll be the firm friends with us that they'd really
ideally love to be. You'll exert far more influence as a friend than an
enemy, because intimidation wont work and is frankly totally
counterproductive in this instance.


--
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[Cursitor Doom]

On Tue, 08 Oct 2019 05:04:15 -0700, Winfield Hill wrote:

https://www.theverge.com/2019/10/7/20904030/adobe-venezuela-photoshop-
behance-us-sanctions

Adobe is shutting down service for users in Venezuela in order to
comply with a U.S. executive order. This is not the first time
something like this has happened.
It's foolish and short-sighted for the Trump govt. to behave this way,
because it sends the message that if one places their operational
reliance on a U.S. based supplier, they can be summarily shutoff and
damaged, without recourse; it's safer to use non-U.S. products.

He's doing the same thing will dollar payments via the banking system.
This is having the effect of forcing countries like Iran, Russia, China
et al to set up their own trade currency backed by minerals and gold. The
USD hasn't been backed by anything but faith in it since 1971 so it's not
something that should be used as a weapon; far too risky.



--
This message may be freely reproduced without limit or charge only via
the Usenet protocol. Reproduction in whole or part through other
protocols, whether for profit or not, is conditional upon a charge of
GBP10.00 per reproduction. Publication in this manner via non-Usenet
protocols constitutes acceptance of this condition.

 

[John Robertson]

On 2019/10/08 6:31 a.m., upsidedown@downunder.com wrote:

On 8 Oct 2019 05:28:57 -0700, Winfield Hill <winfieldhill@yahoo.com
wrote:

Winfield Hill wrote...

https://www.theverge.com/2019/10/7/20904030/adobe-venezuela-photoshop-behance-us-sanctions

Adobe is shutting down service for users in Venezuela
in order to comply with a U.S. executive order. This
is not the first time something like this has happened.
It's foolish and short-sighted for the Trump govt. to
behave this way, because it sends the message that if
one places their operational reliance on a U.S. based
supplier, they can be summarily shutoff and damaged,
without recourse; it's safer to use non-U.S. products.

A few comments on Slashdot:

Better yet, don't use US products at all. If the US wants
to be xenophobic, controlling dicks, then everyone in the
world should shun them and see how far they get as a
totally isolated nation.

My thoughts exactly. Why would I do business with the US if
some orange cheeto can suddenly interfere and screw me over?

It is nice that someone is the US also notices this situation.

I have tried to avoid being too depending on US products since the
Cold War COCOM years.

During a few recent decades, everything went well, but for two years I
have been again careful and trying to avoid US (and recently UK due to
brexit), products since you do not know which product are export
embargoed next week or suffering from huge duties.

Well, there are always Chinese or Russian products... (ducking).

John :-#(#

 

[John Robertson]

On 2019/10/08 5:19 a.m., bulegoge@columbus.rr.com wrote:

Would you have felt the same if similar tactics were used against apparteid SA?

Sanctions against South Africa were imposed by the UN. How effective
they were may be open to debate, but the end result was the end of
apartheid.

https://www.sahistory.org.za/article/united-nations-and-apartheid-timeline-1946-1994


John

 

[Whoey Louie]

On Tuesday, October 8, 2019 at 11:20:43 AM UTC-4, Tom Del Rosso wrote:

Winfield Hill wrote:
bulegoge@columbus.rr.com wrote...

Whatever you think about that, right or wrong, it's trivial
compared to what Trump has done with Iran. Not only has ...

Trump is doing the right thing here.

What!? Trump was unhappy the agreement allowed Iran to start
thinking about nuclear weapons on 10 years, despite its taking
away Iran's nuclear material and reinstating inspections, so he
killed the deal, so they can start right away? That's good!?

Yes, 10 years goes by pretty fast, and inspections are useless with
countries that have hidden facilities.

And with the new agreement that Trump says is coming, those inspections
will be super trumptastic and most excellent, right? No hidden facility
issues either? Why would any
country, eg Iran, NK, reach a agreement with the US when they just saw
Trump renege on one the US made just a few years ago?

 

[Whoey Louie]

On Tuesday, October 8, 2019 at 10:37:21 AM UTC-4, bule...@columbus.rr.com wrote:

hatever you think about that, right or wrong, it's trivial compared
to what Trump has done with Iran. Not only has he applied severe
sanctions to Iran, blocking US companies from doing business with them,
but he has also put the full force of the US against any foreign companies
that have any US presence, forcing them to also cease doing business with
Iran, or face US penalties on them. What he's done there, IMO, amounts
to an act of war. That is exactly what the US would consider it if some
foreign power not only cut off trade with us, but used it's power to
force most other companies around the world to cut off trade, against
their will. Imagine the US with 20% unemployment, high inflation,
GDP shrinking 10% a year and what we would do.....


Trump is doing the right thing here. Iran is a rogue state and trump is tired of wars where we shed blood and spend money. This is how you effect needed change without going to war. , Bolton, Romney, Kristol, all of those gop folks are itching to drop bombs

Sure, Iran is going to change into Sweden, through sanctions. Have sanctions
worked in North Korea? We;ve been sanctioning them for decades. The history
of sanctions working is not good. And there is no predictable path here,
Trump is a moron who can't analyze anything, he just acts out impulsively.
What he has started has already resulted in Iran shooting down a $150 mil
US drone, attacking oil tankers, blowing up Saudi oil fields. And Trump
already ordered up an air strike on Iran, then with planes in the air
on their way, he wussed out and changed his mind. He was even so dumb
that he tried to claim that only at that point did he ask about casualties
and when told that 100 Iranians could die, he called it off.

That's another Trump lie. This isn't the Pentagon's first rodeo and it's
99% that with any briefing for a president before airstrikes, they go
through the same drill, the options, the expected results, collateral
damage possibilities, casualties, etc. Trump just wussed out, for whatever
reason, probably saw something on Fox or talked to someone on the phone.
Like, "Ivanka, I'm guess what, I'm going to bomb Iran" and she said,
"Oh no, that's a mistake...."