OT: Bank Failure

[Jan Panteltje]

On a sunny day (Sun, 21 Jul 2019 23:24:35 -0700 (PDT)) it happened
tabbypurr@gmail.com wrote in
<806ce3cc-4e3b-4488-8759-b6e1cfd5c637@googlegroups.com>:

On Monday, 22 July 2019 04:37:09 UTC+1, Jan Panteltje wrote:

I agree that 'terra forming' is a bit beyond what we currently can do,
or maybe even should do with respect to any life that is there.
But creating large structures on mars where people live inside,
have maybe plants growing, with an earth like atmosphere
is just an engineering problem, and has already been solved.

It's not just an eng problem. Any extraterrestrial colinisation is hugely expensive and results in very poor levels of access to
things we value & take for granted here.

The difference between goat herders in Africa, nomads in the Sahara Desert and us
is from an evolution POV not so much.
You will need supplies shipped on a regular bases, but as (for example) mars colonies grow
bigger equipment is shipped, trade of resources, scientific stations (like a radio telescope
on the backside of the moon), look what is poured into CERN with absolutely no return.
Mining of space objects, nuclear propulsion,
colonization of moons or planets, is all big business.

From the POV of the species it is absolutely essential we spread across space.

Columbus came with just a few men to America, brought back the much wanted gold,
greed works too, mining, there is a company set up that wants to do just that (forgot the details).
Interplanetary trade, interplanetary wars, visa ..
oh well, not much will change.
Crossing the ocean in a plane was an adventure for the daring
now mothers and kids fly between continents all the time
you claim that would be too expensive, but it is not.
I am not for pace tourism in the sense of that crazy thing from Virgin Galactic, but I would sing on
for a space colony on mars, if there was a regular trip, just because of curiosity (not the rover) perhaps.

 

[Bill Sloman]

On Monday, July 22, 2019 at 9:59:15 AM UTC+10, Cursitor Doom wrote:

On Mon, 22 Jul 2019 09:49:42 +1000, Clifford Heath wrote:

The Earth's magnetic field is what keeps our remaining atmosphere being
blown away by the solar wind. Mars has almost no remaining atmosphere
(if it had one) because it has no magnetosphere.

It seems to be beginning to undergo one of its periodic reversals,
according to those who keep track of such things. Certainly I believe
magnetic north's wandering about is picking up pace. Anyone know if
there's a null in the magnetism as the 'pole' crosses the equator and if
so, how long it persists?
Some sources are claiming it's going to be catastrophic. Could be even
worse than the Y2K bug. ;-

Typical Cursitor Doom. He doesn't name the "sources" who claim that it might be catastrophic, and since he considers ZeroHedge to be a reliable source, he's essentially relaying what is probably demented gibbering.

http://www.geomag.bgs.ac.uk/education/reversals.html

points that while the earth typically gets 4 to 5 reversals per million years, we haven't had one for the past 800,000 years. It also points that there's absolutely no evidence to suggest that such a reversal might produce "catastrophic" effects.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

 

On Monday, 22 July 2019 08:13:24 UTC+1, Jan Panteltje wrote:

On a sunny day (Sun, 21 Jul 2019 23:24:35 -0700 (PDT)) it happened
tabbypurr wrote in
806ce3cc-4e3b-4488-8759-b6e1cfd5c637@googlegroups.com>:
On Monday, 22 July 2019 04:37:09 UTC+1, Jan Panteltje wrote:

I agree that 'terra forming' is a bit beyond what we currently can do,
or maybe even should do with respect to any life that is there.
But creating large structures on mars where people live inside,
have maybe plants growing, with an earth like atmosphere
is just an engineering problem, and has already been solved.

It's not just an eng problem. Any extraterrestrial colinisation is hugely expensive and results in very poor levels of access to
things we value & take for granted here.

The difference between goat herders in Africa, nomads in the Sahara Desert and us
is from an evolution POV not so much.
You will need supplies shipped on a regular bases, but as (for example) mars colonies grow
bigger equipment is shipped, trade of resources, scientific stations (like a radio telescope
on the backside of the moon), look what is poured into CERN with absolutely no return.
Mining of space objects, nuclear propulsion,
colonization of moons or planets, is all big business.

From the POV of the species it is absolutely essential we spread across space.

Columbus came with just a few men to America, brought back the much wanted gold,
greed works too, mining, there is a company set up that wants to do just that (forgot the details).
Interplanetary trade, interplanetary wars, visa ..
oh well, not much will change.
Crossing the ocean in a plane was an adventure for the daring
now mothers and kids fly between continents all the time
you claim that would be too expensive, but it is not.

in the end it depends on the resources gained. But there are an awful lot of resources on earth that would be way cheaper to find & retrieve.

I am not for pace tourism in the sense of that crazy thing from Virgin Galactic, but I would sing on
for a space colony on mars, if there was a regular trip, just because of curiosity (not the rover) perhaps.

that much spend takes more than curiosity to justify


NT

 

[Bill Sloman]

On Monday, July 22, 2019 at 5:13:24 PM UTC+10, Jan Panteltje wrote:

On a sunny day (Sun, 21 Jul 2019 23:24:35 -0700 (PDT)) it happened
tabbypurr@gmail.com wrote in
806ce3cc-4e3b-4488-8759-b6e1cfd5c637@googlegroups.com>:

On Monday, 22 July 2019 04:37:09 UTC+1, Jan Panteltje wrote:

I agree that 'terra forming' is a bit beyond what we currently can do,
or maybe even should do with respect to any life that is there.
But creating large structures on mars where people live inside,
have maybe plants growing, with an earth like atmosphere
is just an engineering problem, and has already been solved.

It's not just an eng problem. Any extraterrestrial colinisation is hugely expensive and results in very poor levels of access to
things we value & take for granted here.

The difference between goat herders in Africa, nomads in the Sahara Desert and us is from an evolution POV not so much.

We happen to have been evolving furiously since we started living in cities, but mainly to increase our resistance to infectious diseases. There was recent Finnish study that suggested that we were also evolving better social behaviour.

> You will need supplies shipped on a regular bases, but as (for example) mars colonies grow bigger equipment is shipped, trade of resources, scientific stations (like a radio telescope on the backside of the moon), look what is poured into CERN with absolutely no return.

The money that is being spent at CERN is generating useful scientific data, even if Jan Panteltje doesn't know enough to realise it. It may not look as if it's valuable enough to pay for CERN at the moment, but scientific data has a tendency to look a lot more valuable after you've got around to needing it.

Mining of space objects, nuclear propulsion,
colonization of moons or planets, is all big business.

From the POV of the species it is absolutely essential we spread across space.

Probably not, but exploring new environments and finding new ecological niches to exploit is what evolution is all about.

Human beings have become spectacularly successful as a social mammal, and we are probably going to evolve into a species - or perhaps a bunch of species - that can cooperate even more effectively.

We may need to get into space to get the genetic isolation required to split into a bunch of species.

> Columbus came with just a few men to America, brought back the much wanted gold, greed works too, mining, there is a company set up that wants to do just that (forgot the details).

Or claims to want to do just that. Any start-up needs a plausible story. There are enough suckers around that the story doesn't have to be all that credible.

Interplanetary trade, interplanetary wars, visa ..
oh well, not much will change.
Crossing the ocean in a plane was an adventure for the daring
now mothers and kids fly between continents all the time
you claim that would be too expensive, but it is not.

It is now. Better technology will eventually make it cheaper.

> I am not for space tourism in the sense of that crazy thing from Virgin Galactic, but I would sign on for a space colony on mars, if there was a regular trip, just because of curiosity (not the rover) perhaps.

But could a colony survive even one Jan Panteltje?

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney